Challenge: Use these 4 base classes and still be decent

[Shadowscale]

I got the idea the other day of a sorcerer/favored soul/monk/druid

If anyone feels they could somehow make these 4 classes together I'd love to hear the idea as I don't feel on my own I could get it to work in even the most low of party optimization.

Like it just has to be playable at 20, not all too good or anything like is their any synergy or prc's you get from mixing these things little abilities that synergize together through class abilities or feats.

No multi class penalty of course..

Sorry this is like a really personal idea of mine that I really wanted to build a character to...

[Daishain]

Spellcasting classes tend to combine poorly.

In addition, you are extremely MAD between those four. The only ability score that you would be able to afford to let drop is Intelligence.

Why don't you tell us your character concept? It would likely be easier to find a workable match using PrCs instead of base classes.

[Troacctid]

Sorcerer/Favored Soul has Mystic Theurge, Sorcerer/Monk has Enlightened Fist, Monk/Favored Soul and Monk/Druid have Sacred Fist, and Sorcerer/Druid has Arcane Hierophant. So basically, pick any 2 and you can probably make it work. But you're going to have a hard time squeezing all four of them together outside of gestalt.

[LTwerewolf]

Just do a sorcerer/druid mystic theurge/arcane hierophant. The only thing you really get from monk can be replaced by an item, and between sorcerer and druid you're not missing much from the cleric list (favored soul).

[StoneCipher]

So, are you looking for a caster that can cast any spell here? What's the end goal? Regardless of performance, the build could be dramatically different.

Also, keep in mind, you must be LN for this combination to work, unless your DM is waiving the alignment requirements.

Also, what are your thoughts on race?

[ben-zayb]

A Druid 17/ Favored Soul 1/ Sorcerer 1/ Monk 1 is certainly playable, why do you ask?:smalltongue:

Basically, dip the other two to get their spell list available from magic item consumables. The monk has WIS-to-AC and adds unarmed flurries + iteratives to a natural-weapon-based wild-shape's attack routine.

[Shadowscale]

So, are you looking for a caster that can cast any spell here? What's the end goal? Regardless of performance, the build could be dramatically different.

Also, keep in mind, you must be LN for this combination to work, unless your DM is waiving the alignment requirements.

Also, what are your thoughts on race?

I was also curious what race people thought would be a good idea. I assumed monk 2, but didn't know what to do to fit the other classes in and what hybrid prcs would be best I was thinking a few levels in a couple or few of them?

Would it not be a thing to be able to fit all four base classes in.

Then end goal is for the character to be an arcane/divine natural caster who is at inner peace with the world and a pillar of balance and order at peace with the world who uses their fists to cast nature, dark divine, and arcane spells. Also monk/druid natural weapon wildshape.

[Extra Anchovies]

Sorcerer/Rainbow Servant/Enlightened Fist can get you a sorcerer with a mix of divine and arcane spells known, plus monk abilities. Druid can't fit in there, though.

Alternately, Sorcerer/Druid/Arcane Heirophant with a two-level monk dip, and then finish off the build with Enlightened Fist. Would lose a bunch of casting, but it would work. You could do the same with Sorcerer/Favored Soul/Mystic Theurge/Sacred Fist if you wanted primarily divine casting.

[Extra Anchovies]

I was also curious what race people thought would be a good idea. I assumed monk 2, but didn't know what to do to fit the other classes in and what hybrid prcs would be best I was thinking a few levels in a couple or few of them?

Would it not be a thing to be able to fit all four base classes in.

Then end goal is for the character to be an arcane/divine natural caster who is at inner peace with the world and a pillar of balance and order at peace with the world who uses their fists to cast nature, dark divine, and arcane spells. Also monk/druid natural weapon wildshape.

Would a two-level dip into Totemist for natural weapons, two-level dip into Monk, cleric with nature-oriented domains, and sorcerer maybe work? Having to stick with Druid for five levels just for wild shape would be sub-optimal, because having both druid and favored soul spells may have more spells/day than straight druid or straight favored soul, but they'd still be a lot less powerful. Totemist nets you a pile of natural attacks in two levels, and has a nature-magic vibe to it (just of a different sort).

[Shadowscale]

Sorcerer/Druid/Arcane Heirophant with a two-level monk dip, and then finish off the build with Enlightened Fist. Would lose a bunch of casting, but it would work. You could do the same with Sorcerer/Favored Soul/Mystic Theurge/Sacred Fist

What would these two look like level progression wise? Any good hybrid feats between the classes or just one to maker the concept more powerful?

[Extra Anchovies]

Sorcerer/Druid/Arcane Heirophant with a two-level monk dip, and then finish off the build with Enlightened Fist. Would lose a bunch of casting, but it would work. You could do the same with Sorcerer/Favored Soul/Mystic Theurge/Sacred Fist

What would these two look like level progression wise? Any good hybrid feats between the classes or just one to maker the concept more powerful?

There's the Ascetic Mage feat from Complete Adventurer; it lets sorcerer and monk levels stack when determining the AC bonus (and said bonus also becomes Charisma-based, which is very nice). Also gives you the ability to give up a spell slot as a swift action to get +X to unarmed attack/damage for one round, where X is the slot's level.

Also, I would recommend Sorcerer/Favored Soul over Sorcerer/Druid, because of the Charisma synergy and the ability to dump Wisdom as long as your Favored Soul spells don't allow saves. If you really want an animal companion, pick up Wild Cohort. Pick nature-related spells for your spells known with both classes.

Sorcerer 1 (with precocious apprentice)/Monk 2/Favored Soul 4/Mystic Theurge 10/Sacred Fist 2/Sorcerer 1 would yield BAB 12, base saves of 10/10/11, 6th-level arcane spells, and 8th-level divine spells. Pump Cha and Dex, and leap around the battlefield casting touch spells.

[Urpriest]

Then end goal is for the character to be an arcane/divine natural caster who is at inner peace with the world and a pillar of balance and order at peace with the world who uses their fists to cast nature, dark divine, and arcane spells. Also monk/druid natural weapon wildshape.

Ok, approaching this from two perspectives:

First, actually combining those four classes...yeah, there's not all that far you can plausibly get with that, aside from using two of the casting classes as dips to get wand access for the third, and using the Monk dip for Wis or Cha to AC and free IUS.

Second, the concept you have outlined here. This one needs to be broken down into its constituent pieces.

Here are the bits I think are reasonably clear from your explanation: you want a character who channels spells through unarmed strikes, and who is able to use wild shape while doing so. (One thing I should clarify: Wild Shape specifically into animals, the broader ability, shapeshifting in general, or something else?)

Here are the bits I need clarification on:

First, what aspects of arcane casting are you interested in? Which aspects of divine casting are you interested in? In both cases, are you interested in the flavor, or in particular spells? The same for "natural" casting.

Second, what do you mean by "dark divine"? Animate Dead and similar?

Edit: Further question: is Charisma synergy important to you? Wisdom synergy? Spontaneous casting?

[nedz]

I take it Gestalt is out ?

This sort of works, though I haven't worked out the feats

Illuminum Monk 2 / Druid 1 / Favoured Soul 1 / Sorcerer 1 / Mystic Theurge 5 / Harper Priest 1 / Fochlucan Lyrist 9
Using the Improved Sigil (Krau) feat to get into MT, which advances Favoured Soul and Sorcerer
Gives Favoured Soul 16 / Sorcerer 15 casting
Monk really hurts here, well no surprise. These two levels could be substituted for a Ring of Evasion giving an extra MT and FL level for 9ths and 8ths instead of 8ths and 7ths.

[Shadowscale]

Ok, approaching this from two perspectives:

First, actually combining those four classes...yeah, there's not all that far you can plausibly get with that, aside from using two of the casting classes as dips to get wand access for the third, and using the Monk dip for Wis or Cha to AC and free IUS.

Second, the concept you have outlined here. This one needs to be broken down into its constituent pieces.

Here are the bits I think are reasonably clear from your explanation: you want a character who channels spells through unarmed strikes, and who is able to use wild shape while doing so. (One thing I should clarify: Wild Shape specifically into animals, the broader ability, shapeshifting in general, or something else?)

Here are the bits I need clarification on:

First, what aspects of arcane casting are you interested in? Which aspects of divine casting are you interested in? In both cases, are you interested in the flavor, or in particular spells? The same for "natural" casting.

Second, what do you mean by "dark divine"? Animate Dead and similar?

Edit: Further question: is Charisma synergy important to you? Wisdom synergy? Spontaneous casting?

I'm interested in arcane and divine's evocation and necromancy spells. I like the idea of being an inborn caster hence the charisma spontaneous casters. I was thinking the two main attributes would be charisma and maybe dexterity as wisdom can be as low as druid spell. level +10

Dark divine meaning spells that are typically associated as either unholy or just evil as I believe true neutral will have no problems casting them. The ability to heal and inflict is nice... Natural casting and monk are meant to go for the whole Nirvana perfection of self sense and all, being at peace with the earth and mastery of self. Using the monk's unarmed damage with animal wildshapes.

Sorry I know I'm being confusing and all over the place.

[Urpriest]

I'm interested in arcane and divine's evocation and necromancy spells. I like the idea of being an inborn caster hence the charisma spontaneous casters. I was thinking the two main attributes would be charisma and maybe dexterity as wisdom can be as low as druid spell. level +10

Dark divine meaning spells that are typically associated as either unholy or just evil as I believe true neutral will have no problems casting them. The ability to heal and inflict is nice... Natural casting and monk are meant to go for the whole Nirvana perfection of self sense and all, being at peace with the earth and mastery of self. Using the monk's unarmed damage with animal wildshapes.

Sorry I know I'm being confusing and all over the place.

Hmm ok...

By evocation, do you specifically mean damaging stuff? Or do you also feel like you need the "good" evocations, like walls of force and contingency and the like?

Since you want an inborn caster I'm going to avoid trained stuff, so no Wizards or Archivists, and probably no Clerics or Druids either. I'm assuming Favored Soul still fits, even though it isn't really "inborn". I'm kind of tempted by Spirit Shaman and Shugenja, but I'm pretty sure both are terrible ideas for this and won't be worthwhile.

By "nature spells" do you mean something specific? You want the general set, spells that interact with plants/animals/etc? Or will something less broad suffice?

So by my reckoning so far, sounds like the goal is damaging spells, Harm and friends, Heal and friends, wild shape, and unarmed strikes.

Question: are you ok with wild shaping into plants instead of animals?

Further edit: could the nature powers be desert-themed?

[Shadowscale]

Hmm ok...

By evocation, do you specifically mean damaging stuff? Or do you also feel like you need the "good" evocations, like walls of force and contingency and the like?

Since you want an inborn caster I'm going to avoid trained stuff, so no Wizards or Archivists, and probably no Clerics or Druids either. I'm assuming Favored Soul still fits, even though it isn't really "inborn". I'm kind of tempted by Spirit Shaman and Shugenja, but I'm pretty sure both are terrible ideas for this and won't be worthwhile.

By "nature spells" do you mean something specific? You want the general set, spells that interact with plants/animals/etc? Or will something less broad suffice?

So by my reckoning so far, sounds like the goal is damaging spells, Harm and friends, Heal and friends, wild shape, and unarmed strikes.

Question: are you ok with wild shaping into plants instead of animals?

Further edit: could the nature powers be desert-themed?
Nature spells being the druid specific type spells like speak with animals, unhindered movement, spells along that line. Druid seemed to be an okay learned caster since theirs no real spontaneous equivalent. Your reckoning is 100% correct. The good evocations would help though. Sorry for being a bother..

[Urpriest]

Nature spells being the druid specific type spells like speak with animals, unhindered movement, spells along that line. Druid seemed to be an okay learned caster since theirs no real spontaneous equivalent. Your reckoning is 100% correct. The good evocations would help though. Sorry for being a bother..

Hmm...

Here's what I'm thinking about, in broad strokes. I'll have to take time later to sort out the details.

Basically, you are a Warforged Favored Soul. You use a trick to qualify for Sand Shaper (such tricks exist) giving you a bunch of nature (specifically desert)-themed spells. You take the Landforged Walker PrC, which lets you wild shape into plants based on your level. You probably can just take Improved Unarmed Strike and Superior Unarmed Strike rather than taking any Monk levels, or use the Monk's Belt if you'd rather.

Congratulations, you're a Cha-based spontaneous caster who wildshapes into a natural creature and mauls face, while being able to channel Heal/Harm and being able to do evocation-y and nature-y stuff via those desert spells. You can also use PrCs that grant domains or the like (Sovereign Speaker might be fun) to learn more evocation-y spells.

[Troacctid]

Generic Spellcaster (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/genericClasses.htm#spellcaster). Cherry-pick your spells from any list. Polymorph spells can stand in for Wildshape. Prestige into Enlightened Fist to get your Monk abilities.

[Rebel7284]

With the given classes, it's very difficult to make a powerful character. However, the class features you want can be obtained in a variety of ways.

- Mulhorandi Divine Minion (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/mb/20050209a) can be used to get wildshape if you are OK with limiting yourself to a few forms. Note that if Level Adjustment Buyoff is allowed, you can eventually pay XP to get rid of the Level Adjustment penalty.
- As people pointed out, Monk's Belt and a few feats can emulate monk quite well. Check out Superior Unarmed Strike (http://dndtools.eu/feats/tome-of-battle-the-book-of-nine-swords--88/superior-unarmed-strike--2844/)
- Shadowcraft Mage (http://dndtools.eu/classes/shadowcraft-mage/) allows you to sacrifice spells from the Silent Image line to cast all Sorcerer/Wizard evocation and the vast majority of conjuration spells. This is typically combined with Heighten Spell feat and often metamagic reducers. Note the adaptation section allows you enter as a member of a cabal if you don't want to be a Gnome.
- Holt Warden (http://dndtools.eu/classes/holt-warden/) gives your character a very nature-loving feel and gives you access to the plant domain. You can also use other prestige classes that add domains to add other nature-centric domains. Contemplative is popular for that.

Also, relevant for Favored Souls is the article here (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/cwc/20070227x) that allows them to choose whether to make Knowledge (arcana) or Knowledge (religion) a class skill. (hint, take religion if you want Contemplative of any of the other divine prestige classes)

So my final advice is this:

Divine Minion of Nephthys Silverbrow Human
Favored Soul 5/Holt Warden 3/Shadowcraft Mage 3/Contemplative 1/Holt Warden +7/X+1

Feats would look something like this:
1. Spell Focus Illusion
Human: Heighten Spell
3. Knowledge Devotion [Add Knowledge (nature)]
6. Improved Unarmed Strike
9. Practical Metamagic
12. Superior Unarmed Strike
15. Earth Sense (or more combat feats)
18. Earth Spell (or more combat feats)

You will probably need to cast Divine Power to fully take advantage of punching.
Also note that my build loses exactly 0 levels of casting progression (well assuming level adjustment buyoff is in play) :D