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mister__joshua
2014-09-26, 01:15 PM
With the reduced number of spell slots full casters get in 5th edition I feel the need to make more effective use of my low level spell slots. Conversely, spell save dc is no longer tied to spell level. With these 2 things in mind I want to compose a list of spells for first and second level that still see good use from level 2 to 20.

I'm on my phone at the moment, so when I'm back on my pc I'll add to the list and edit in any responses into this post.

1st level
Charm person: Hour long no concentration
Shield: reaction +5 to AC
Faerie Fire: give the whole party advantage
Longstrider: Hour-long movement buff that does not require concentration
Sleep: No save Win for low HPs
Mage Armor: +3 AC for armorless characters
Find Familiar: Lots of uses
Bane
Bless
Alarm
Detect Magic
Identify

2nd level
Heat Metal: no save disadvantage
Mirror Image: doesn't require concentration
Misty Step: a bonus action 30ft teleport
Darkvision: Eight hours of darkvision sans concentration.
Enhance Ability: Advantage on dex checks, which includes initiative. Concentration, unfortunately.
Hold Person: Maintains its usefulness, as long as humanoid NPCs are villains. Concentration.
Pass without Trace: +10 to Stealth for the whole party. Requires concentration.
Invisibility: Long duration invisible effect

edge2054
2014-09-26, 01:32 PM
Mirror Image doesn't require concentration. Misty Step is a bonus action 30ft teleport. I've been liking Find Familiar but I'm not sure how well it would hold out at level 20. Guess it would still work well as a scout.

Faerie Fire can give the whole party advantage against the BBEG for 10 rounds but requires concentration. I haven't looked too much at the high level Druid spells to see what it has to compete with but party advantage seems like it would be hard to beat. Of course if the party is smaller or more caster heavy it's less useful.

hymer
2014-09-26, 01:58 PM
Faerie Fire, as mentioned, is a good one to keep up your sleeve. Counter invisibility and no-save debuff in a first level slot, even if it does require concentration.

Longstrider (1): Hour-long movement buff that does not require concentration.
Darkvision (2): Eight hours of darkvision sans concentration.
Enhance Ability (2): Advantage on dex checks, which includes initiative. Concentration, unfortunately.
Hold Person (2): Maintains its usefulness, as long as humanoid NPCs are villains. Concentration.
Pass without Trace (2): +10 to Stealth for the whole party. Requires concentration.

Edit: OP, you may want to make yourself known in this (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?372617-The-META-THREAD-of-useful-things!) thread. This project seems to fit in there.

squashmaster
2014-09-26, 02:04 PM
Never misunderestimate Sleep.

Symphony
2014-09-26, 02:26 PM
Mage Armor is another spell that most Wizards will be casting practically every day, IMO.

Web and Invisibility (for the duration) should still be pretty decent uses.

Graustein
2014-09-26, 03:04 PM
I was going to suggest Minor Illusion, but turns out that's a cantrip, and pretty much all of those scale or remain useful throughout your career :P

Silent Image is highly useful for similar reasons, though; illusions in general are very powerful if you can use them effectively. My sorceress is having a lot of fun with a Disguise Self + Friends combo.

Alarm, Detect Magic and Identify are all useful too, possibly depending on your party makeup.

Also, if you're not a Wizard, each level you get to swap out a known spell for another one, which must be of a level you can cast but not necessarily the same level as the spell you swapped out. If you are a Wizard, you get the opportunity to expand your Spellbook from scrolls and such. Either way, you're not necessarily chained to only the first spells you ever learn.

Ashrym
2014-09-27, 02:25 AM
Faerie Fire, as mentioned, is a good one to keep up your sleeve. Counter invisibility and no-save debuff in a first level slot, even if it does require concentration.

Longstrider (1): Hour-long movement buff that does not require concentration.
Darkvision (2): Eight hours of darkvision sans concentration.
Enhance Ability (2): Advantage on dex checks, which includes initiative. Concentration, unfortunately.
Hold Person (2): Maintains its usefulness, as long as humanoid NPCs are villains. Concentration.
Pass without Trace (2): +10 to Stealth for the whole party. Requires concentration.

Edit: OP, you may want to make yourself known in this (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?372617-The-META-THREAD-of-useful-things!) thread. This project seems to fit in there.

Faerie fire is a good spell but it does have a DEX save. I like the blindness spell because it affects more types of target than hold person and doesn't require concentration.

hymer
2014-09-27, 02:32 AM
Faerie fire is a good spell but it does have a DEX save.

Right, my bad.

Inevitability
2014-09-27, 03:32 AM
Find Familiar is still great at higher levels. You could just put the familiar in your inside pocket and have it Help you every turn. Better for melee characters, but still...

Triclinium
2014-09-27, 07:35 AM
Bane and bless seem pretty effective all the time.

edge2054
2014-09-27, 10:59 AM
Find Familiar is still great at higher levels. You could just put the familiar in your inside pocket and have it Help you every turn. Better for melee characters, but still...

I love Find Familiar but seriously? You know a DM that would let you get away with this?

Inevitability
2014-09-27, 03:33 PM
You know a DM that would let you get away with this?

High Optimization is a thing, even in 5e. And to be fair, having advantage on a single attack roll a round isn't that great, especially at higher levels.

edge2054
2014-09-27, 04:12 PM
It's more the providing help from your pocket bit. Like, I just can't imagine that working. I see how RAW it works. The familiar is in your pocket and your 5' away from the target and thus the familiar is 5' from the target too.

But how is it helping you from in your pocket? Moral support I suppose :smallamused:

I like Find Familiar and Help actions are one of the reasons I like it so much. I guess the Owl is just as broken mechanically but at least I can imagine a bird flying around someone's face while I whack it with a sword.

The mouse cheerleader dancing in my pocket going raw raw ree, kick him in the knee, not so much.

Symphony
2014-09-27, 04:51 PM
The mouse cheerleader dancing in my pocket going raw raw ree, kick him in the knee, not so much.

Go for the eyes, Boo!

mister__joshua
2014-09-29, 10:25 AM
Had chance to update the OP with the responses. I added the reasoning too where it was given.


Go for the eyes, Boo!
The whole thread was worth it for that quote. I don't lol often.

MadGrady
2014-09-29, 10:27 AM
One of my players, who is playing a Warlock, has found significant usage in the Witch Bolt spell.

MadGrady
2014-09-29, 10:28 AM
Also, I am totally a DM who would allow Find Familiar. What Wizard shouldn't have a familiar? I see nothing too OP with this spell, especially since Familairs are much less powerful (imo) than previous iterations.

Thomar_of_Uointer
2014-09-29, 11:29 AM
One of my players, who is playing a Warlock, has found significant usage in the Witch Bolt spell.

That's the one that fires every turn, right? Why do warlocks need that? They can refresh slots with a short rest and Eldritch Blast is the best cantrip in the game.

MadGrady
2014-09-29, 11:35 AM
That's the one that fires every turn, right? Why do warlocks need that? They can refresh slots with a short rest and Eldritch Blast is the best cantrip in the game.

Eldritch blast is by far my favorite cantrip, but Witch Bolt (a level 1 spell - which is what this thread was asking for) hits with a d12. Also, once it hits, it is connected to the target, so it fires every turn for guaranteed damage (as long as you made your first attack roll), and the target is still in range and not behind cover. Eldritch blast has to be rolled to hit each time.

Edit for clarification - by no means do I disagree with you, and this same player makes even more use of Eldritch Blast for that very reason. I was just clarifying why I feel Witch Bolt is still good enough to be placed on the list :smallbiggrin:

Cambrian
2014-09-29, 11:52 AM
Also, I am totally a DM who would allow Find Familiar. What Wizard shouldn't have a familiar? I see nothing too OP with this spell, especially since Familairs are much less powerful (imo) than previous iterations.The issue was not find familiar, the issue was the nonsense that from your pocket a familiar can use the help action to grant advantage.

If a player can provide a reasonable method the familiar can assist then I'd allow it, but I doubt it would come up. And any player who would hold up combat trying to come up with such a use surrenders their action after a short delay as the character racks their brain ineffectively.

squashmaster
2014-09-29, 11:57 AM
One of my players, who is playing a Warlock, has found significant usage in the Witch Bolt spell.

Witch Bolt very nice but Hex/EB better. Norly. I'd only use Witch Bolt against a solo big bad or something.

MadGrady
2014-09-29, 12:08 PM
The issue was not find familiar, the issue was the nonsense that from your pocket a familiar can use the help action to grant advantage.

If a player can provide a reasonable method the familiar can assist then I'd allow it, but I doubt it would come up. And any player who would hold up combat trying to come up with such a use surrenders their action after a short delay as the character racks their brain ineffectively.


Ahhh gotcha, my apologies. And completely agree with your suggestions here.



Witch Bolt very nice but Hex/EB better. Norly. I'd only use Witch Bolt against a solo big bad or something.

This is exactly how he has been using it so far :smallsmile:

Lokiare
2014-09-29, 12:20 PM
Flaming Sphere is a nice every round damage spell. It scales damage with slot level and lasts an entire encounter. Combined with a cantrip it makes for a good amount of damage.

Shining Wrath
2014-09-29, 05:31 PM
It's more the providing help from your pocket bit. Like, I just can't imagine that working. I see how RAW it works. The familiar is in your pocket and your 5' away from the target and thus the familiar is 5' from the target too.

But how is it helping you from in your pocket? Moral support I suppose :smallamused:

I like Find Familiar and Help actions are one of the reasons I like it so much. I guess the Owl is just as broken mechanically but at least I can imagine a bird flying around someone's face while I whack it with a sword.

The mouse cheerleader dancing in my pocket going raw raw ree, kick him in the knee, not so much.

The mouse familiar is smart enough to imitate the chest burst scene from Alien using a little raw meat left over from fixing dinner, and that in turn gets the victim to stare at the familiar for a critical fraction of a second.