PDA

View Full Version : What abilities should cops and robbers have?



Jeff the Green
2014-09-30, 02:57 AM
Tl;dr: What are some abilities a master thief or detective should have by level 17? Spell effects are fine.

I'm working on a couple of prestige classes that are essentially identical: they're both skill monkeys, and they both get a bit of minor WBLmancy, bonus feats and special abilities chosen from a list, skill mastery, and a bonus to damage. The difference is that one's a thief and the other a detective. The thief gets all the roguish skills, increased precision damage, and abilities that increase their ability to burgle, steal, con, or swindle, while the detective gets many roguish skills plus face and sensory ones, increased non-lethal damage, and abilities that help them find the thieves. I'm having trouble coming up with enough abilities, though. Here's what I have:

Thief:

Retroactively choose to have bought some item.
No penalties to Disguise except for large increases in height and weight, no Spot bonus for being familiar with the person you're impersonating on sight.
Steal improbable things, like underwear or a wielded sword, without the victim noticing.
Stack levels with Spellthief for steal spells.
Bonus Ambush feat.
Hide in Plain Sight, but better.
Immunity to divination and mind affecting, as the Slayer (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/prestigeClasses/slayer.htm) abilities.
Make enemies unable to see your allies and focus on you (i.e. you steal the spotlight).
Charm (i.e. you steal their heart).
Intimidate like a Zhentarim Fighter.
Ignore movement, size, and surface penalties to Hide and Move Silently.


Detective:

Mimic a number of detect x and discern x spells because you're so good at reading people.
Make people underestimate you and thus reveal things they shouldn't.
Bonus to senses based on Knowledge ranks and bonus to Disguise based on Profession ranks.
A cohort who must be absolutely incompetent at being a detective.
Think about things in your study to figure out what's going on, duplicating various divinations as long as you have some evidence.



Obviously, I need more abilities like these, particularly for the detective. I'd much appreciate any ideas that you think are appropriate; you can enter the class at level 8 (it requires two skills with 10 ranks each), it's 10 levels long, and each even level you get one of these abilities.

(Incidentally, I'm naming these after tropes and lines from detective novels/heist films, so if you have an idea for such a name, I'd be doubly appreciative.)

JusticeZero
2014-09-30, 03:03 AM
Well, by level 17, I would expect a thief to be reliably able to steal things from actual gods, to be able to pull off things like "Officer! She stole.. my heart!" *collapses because was being literal*, to steal the armor off of a knight in combat without said knight noticing, and so on - that's about the expected power level for a level 17 character.

Jeff the Green
2014-09-30, 03:13 AM
Well, by level 17, I would expect a thief to be reliably able to steal things from actual gods, to be able to pull off things like "Officer! She stole.. my heart!" *collapses because was being literal*, to steal the armor off of a knight in combat without said knight noticing, and so on - that's about the expected power level for a level 17 character.

Well, stealing things from gods has its own hurdles (specifically, divine salient abilities), but that's the goal. Literal heart-theft could be good, possibly as an improved version of quivering palm. Stealing armor I've already got; it's a DC 40 Sleight of Hand check (not trivial, but certainly doable) and if you beat their Spot check they don't notice it's gone for a number of rounds equal to the difference between your checks even if it's pointed out (they'd have to try to actually use something to notice its absence, which doesn't apply to most armors).

Deox
2014-09-30, 04:00 AM
Cool ideas! Just a few off the top of my head:


"Maverick" - Doesn't play by anyone's rules. Not even his own. Something involving improvisation? Maybe like a deceive item trick like Warlock?
"Hardboiled" - Tough guy. Street smart. Dances a fine line between Black and Gray for morality. Enjoys scotch. Not sure on what to do here.
Good Cop / Bad Cop - Some sort of interrogation bonus?
On The Take - Let's something slide for a portion of the goods/sales.

Sith_Happens
2014-09-30, 04:04 AM
The best detective is almost certainly a Wizard/Divine Oracle/Unseen Seer with Spontaneous Divination.

Deox
2014-09-30, 05:02 AM
Oh, and gloves of object reading!

Sian
2014-09-30, 05:15 AM
Watch Detective from Masters of the Wild (bit oddball place to find it) should be compulsory for otherwise non-magical police

Jeff the Green
2014-09-30, 04:59 PM
Watch Detective from Masters of the Wild (bit oddball place to find it) should be compulsory for otherwise non-magical police

Ooh, thanks for this. I knew about the pile of suck that is the master inquisitive, but that has a couple abilities I could crib.


"Maverick" - Doesn't play by anyone's rules. Not even his own. Something involving improvisation? Maybe like a deceive item trick like Warlock?

That could be interesting. An adjustment to the UMD DCs to emulate an alignment or class feature might be more in line with the name, but it'd need an additional benefit.


"Hardboiled" - Tough guy. Street smart. Dances a fine line between Black and Gray for morality. Enjoys scotch. Not sure on what to do here.

Something to do with Intimidate, maybe.


Good Cop / Bad Cop - Some sort of interrogation bonus?

Hmm. I could certainly crib the Cooperative Interrogation ability from the Watch Detective, probably with an additional benefit.


On The Take - Let's something slide for a portion of the goods/sales.

Eh, that's probably better handled by a straight up Diplomacy/Intimidate roll.


Oh, and gloves of object reading!

Covered; it's one of the spells you can mimic merely by thinking about it.


The best detective is almost certainly a Wizard/Divine Oracle/Unseen Seer with Spontaneous Divination.

Well, yes. But I'm looking to make a class that can hold its own against that, and am looking for specific abilities it needs.

Sith_Happens
2014-09-30, 05:41 PM
Well, yes. But I'm looking to make a class that can hold its own against that, and am looking for specific abilities it needs.

D'oh, I super-skimmed the OP and didn't notice the part where this is for homebrew purposes.

The Viscount
2014-09-30, 10:10 PM
Justiciar, Bloodhound, and Crimson Scourge have abilities that could easily be refluffed to detective training.

Waker
2014-09-30, 10:46 PM
I can probably make a few suggestions, though I am about to go to sleep, so I won't be quite as descriptive as I might otherwise be.

Thief:
Sensitive- Automatically entitled to a Search roll when passing within X feet of a Trap/Secret Door/Etc.
Calling Card- Cultivated a persona that grants bonuses to Bluff/Diplomacy/Intimidate when interacting with people who recognize you.
Authenticator- Add class level to Appraise checks. Can use appraise to identify magic items made from a valuable material (swords & rings, but not potions & scrolls)
Facade- When disguised, anyone using a divination effect directed at you must still succeed on a Spot check against your Disguise check. A target failing their Spot check receives information back matching your appearance. IE A Thief who was disguised as a Zombie would register as Undead (Detect Undead), Evil (Detect Evil) and Mindless (Detect Thoughts) to any target who failed to penetrate their disguise.

Detective:
Network- You have access to a group of confederates, snitches and so on who can provide you with information, tools and access to locations to find criminals.
Profile- By compiling evidence at a crime scene, testimony from witnesses and rumors, you can construct a mental image of a person you have never seen. By making a Sense Motive check against their CR+ Time since Crime+ Misc, you can determine the approximate appearance, class abilities and alignment of the criminal.
Planning Ahead- When tracking down a criminal, you are always considered to have a readied action against them and can always act in a surprise round.
The Game Is Afoot- When tracking down a criminal, you are an unshakable hunter. Magic and class abilities that a criminal has never prevent you from making the appropriate Search/Survival checks. IE A detective would not be hampered by a Druid's Trackless Step class feature when tracking them. This does not allow the detective to utilize divinatory magic against an otherwise shielded target.
Eureka- You have a sudden flash of brilliance where all the pieces begin to fall into place. You benefit from an effect similar to the Divination spell, leading to to some critical piece of information needed to find a culprit.
Persevere- No matter how many obstacles you face, nothing can stop you. While on the hunt for a criminal, you can ignore the effects of fatigue, exhaustion, sickened... for X hours. X class level, a stat mod or whatever.

There, that should give you a few more ideas to work with.