Paladin/Monk/Ranger Build?

[Gwazi Magnum]

Are there any cool, fun, good and/or effective builds you can think of that involves at least 2 of these three classes?
Outside classes are also allowed, but at least 2 of the listed 3 need to be involved.

[Red Fel]

Are there any cool, fun, good and/or effective builds you can think of that involves at least 2 of these three classes?
Outside classes are also allowed, but at least 2 of the listed 3 need to be involved.

Paladin + Ranger + Devoted Tracker = the basis for some ubermount shenanigans. Not much more need be said - your animal companion or special mount gains power as if it were both. PrCs that advance it (such as Halfling Outrider) make this even more insane.

[Averis Vol]

Are there any cool, fun, good and/or effective builds you can think of that involves at least 2 of these three classes?
Outside classes are also allowed, but at least 2 of the listed 3 need to be involved.

Maybe invisible fist monk 2/ wildshape ranger 5/ fist of the forest 3/ Master of many forms x ?

Getting all those flurry+ natural full attacks with greater invisibility is pretty solid. wis and con to AC, blink once you hit level 9.....

[Extra Anchovies]

Yeah, ignore this. If you want to see my ugly math, look at Ur-Priest's quote of this post.

[Urpriest]

Oh geez, now that I look at Outrider it looks crazy good for übermounts. Paladin 5/Ranger 4/Beastmaster 1 (for +3 to animal companion)/Halfling Outrider 10 would be nasty. Paladin levels stack with Outrider levels for special mount, so before DT's effects the effective paladin level is 15. Ranger levels stack with Outrider levels for animal companion, so before DT's effects the effective druid level is 11 (if I read Beastmaster right, that is). Apply Devoted Tracker to stack these and you get effective Paladin level of (5 paladin) + (10 outrider paladin advancement) + (10 outrider ranger advancement) + (4 ranger) = 26 and effective Druid level of [ { (4 ranger) + (10 outrider ranger advancement) + (10 outrider paladin advancement) + (5 Paladin) } / 2 ] + (4 beastmaster) = 18. Wow. Pick up, say, a Dire Weasel for maxed-out Paladin mount abilities and (with Natural Bond) maxed-out Druid animal companion abilities :smalleek:

ETA: This depends on translating the Outrider's advancement of both Special Mounts and Animal Companions into giving +2 to both via devoted tracker; does it work this way?

ETA2: Wait! Unearthed Arcana to the rescue! Cleric (with Animal domain) 5/Prestige Ranger 1/Prestige Paladin 2/Halfling Outrider 10/Prestige Ranger +1/Prestige Paladin +1. Base effective druid level 12, base effective paladin level 16, changing to 28 each after Devoted Tracker. The math is a lot simpler, plus you cast as an 8th-level cleric. I want to play this now.

You're misunderstanding. Devoted Tracker doesn't make your Animal Companion levels count as Special Mount levels or vice versa, it just lets you put both sets of bonuses on the same creature.

Edit: Unfortunately Monk/natural attack build is kind of weird, since natural weapons aren't monk weapons so you can't flurry with them, and it's unclear whether that means you can't use your bonus flurry attacks on them (which you shouldn't be able to anyway) or whether they can't be in the same full attack as a flurry (since technically flurry refers to the whole full-round action).

Anyway, Monk/Paladin with the Serenity feat (changes Paladin abilities to Wis) is the basis of the Sir Wisdom the SAD build.

[Extra Anchovies]

You're misunderstanding. Devoted Tracker doesn't make your Animal Companion levels count as Special Mount levels or vice versa, it just lets you put both sets of bonuses on the same creature.

Oh, wow, I'm surprised I misread the feat that horribly. I'm going to slash-and-burn my original post :smallredface:

[Troacctid]

Besides Devoted Tracker, there's also Ascetic Hunter and Ascetic Knight for Monk/Ranger and Monk/Paladin respectively, although no guarantees that either one of them is any good. They exist, anyway.

[gorfnab]

This (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?367850-Birdman-Stunna-or-How-I-Learned-to-Stop-Worrying-and-Punch-Evil-in-the-Face) is a hilariously awesome Monk/Ranger build.

Bard 1/ Paladin 4/ Monk 2/ Paladin 13 - feats: Able Learner, Devoted Performer, Ascetic Knight, and Initiate of Milil

[animewatcha]

Can we get a race that you are gonna be? Sources allowed?

[Gwazi Magnum]

Can we get a race that you are gonna be? Sources allowed?

All sources allowed.

This isn't for a specific character, it's just a thought exercise on how to make them get along so any race works.

[Extra Anchovies]

Now that I've taken another look at Devoted Tracker and understand what it does:

Race: Strongheart Halfling (but see below)

Class: Paladin 5/Beastmaster 1/Wild Plains Outrider 3/Halfling Outrider 10/Beastmaster 1. Gets maximum animal companion benefits and maximum special mount benefits. Take Dragon Steed to make your special mount/animal companion a dragon.

Then ask your DM if you can roleplay the dragon instead of the halfling, because the former will be a lot more powerful :smallbiggrin:

[Valwyn]

Devoted Tracker was already mentioned, but there's also Ascetic Knight (paladin stacks with monk for unarmed damage, monk stacks with paladin for smite evil damage) and Ascetic Hunter (add half of Favoured Enemy bonus to Stunning Fist DC, ranger stacks with monk for unarmed damage).

I'll let others come up with a possible build (I'm pretty bad at optimizing), but I get the feeling there's some potential there. Level 2 monks can trade Evasion for Invisibility 1/3 rounds, so that could also be fun. Maybe Monk 2/Paladin 4/Ranger 14?

[Red Fel]

Devoted Tracker was already mentioned, but there's also Ascetic Knight (paladin stacks with monk for unarmed damage, monk stacks with paladin for smite evil damage) and Ascetic Hunter (add half of Favoured Enemy bonus to Stunning Fist DC, ranger stacks with monk for unarmed damage).

I'll let others come up with a possible build (I'm pretty bad at optimizing), but I get the feeling there's some potential there. Level 2 monks can trade Evasion for Invisibility 1/3 rounds, so that could also be fun. Maybe Monk 2/Paladin 4/Ranger 14?

The problem is that while there are feats that combine any two of the three, (1) they're not all amazing, and (2) none combine all three. As a result, you'll be taking class levels and three feats, and at least one of your classes will be cutting down on the efficacy of the others. For example, at level 18, a Monk 6/ Ranger 6/ Paladin 6 with Ascetic Hunter, Ascetic Knight, and Devoted Tracker will have the following: +2 to Stunning Fist DC (Ascetic Hunter) 2d8 unarmed damage (Ascetic Hunter + Ascetic Knight) +18 Smite Evil damage (Ascetic Knight + Devoted Tracker) +12 Wild Empathy (Devoted Tracker) Special Mount + Animal Companion (Devoted Tracker)
It sounds like a lot, right? Well, here's the thing - if you had removed any one of the three classes, you could have instead devoted those levels to the other two, and freed up two feats in the process. Let's take an example. Let's say, instead of Monk 6/ Ranger 6/ Paladin 6, you took Monk 9/ Paladin 9. You took only Ascetic Knight, so you have two free feats floating around. Here's what you got from that: +18 Smite damage 2d8 unarmed damage
And, again, you have two free feats. You also have access to 2nd-level Paladin spells, and Monk's additional class features (what little good they are) over three levels. And the only benefits on which you're missing out are the Stunning Fist bonus (which you likely won't use much anyway), the Wild Empathy bonus (which is of no use to you), and the Animal Companion bonus to your Special Mount (which you probably traded away for the Charging Smite ACF). You're gaining a lot, and losing very little.

Is there some potential to mixing all three? Yes. But frankly, you're looking at two incredibly MAD and broken classes, and one moderately sub-par (but easier to optimize) class, and an investment of three precious feats. It's a challenge, to say the least.

[Telonius]

I suppose you could dip two levels of Overwhelming Attack (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#overwhelmingAttack) Monk for Power Attack and Improved Bull Rush. Ranger and Paladin are notoriously feat-intensive, but if you're making a (mainly) charge-focused build it could save you some trouble in qualifying for Shock Trooper.

[Rebel7284]

Ranger 1/Monk 1/Ardent 4/Slayer 10 with Tashalatora

[Red Fel]

Ranger 1/Monk 1/Ardent 4/Slayer 10 with Tashalatora

Assuming you've applied Tashalatora to Slayer (because it only applies to one psionic class), and assuming you also took Ascetic Hunter (because Ranger/Monk), that means you get: +1 Stunning Fist DC against Favored Enemy (Ascetic Hunter) 2d6 unarmed damage (Ascetic Hunter + Tashalatora = Ranger 1 + Monk 1 + Slayer 10 = Monk 12) +2 AC (Tashalatora = Monk 1 + Slayer 10 = Monk 11) Flurry +8/+8/+8/+3 (Tashalatora = Monk 1 + Slayer 10 = Monk 11)
Basically, the sole purpose served by that level of Ranger and Ascetic Hunter appears to be to increase your unarmed damage from 1d10 to 2d6. Replacing the Ranger level with Monk and Ascetic Hunter with Superior Unarmed Strike would be strictly superior: 2d8 unarmed damage (Monk 2(+4) + Slayer 10 = Monk 16) +2 AC (Monk 2 + Slayer 10 = Monk 12) Flurry +9/+9/+9/+4 (Monk 2 + Slayer 10 = Monk 12)

[Gwazi Magnum]

Looking it all over, I'm considering I Smiting & Brawling Ranger build.

Effectively: Monk 1/Paladin (Serenity Variant) 2/Ranger 17
Feats: Intuitive Attack, Devoted Tracker & Ascetic Hunter + Other's as needed

Not taking Ascetic Knight (Saving myself a feat) therefore only makes me lose 2 levels of smite evil, and 1 level of unarmed damage.

It also provides:
-Wisdom to AC
-Wisdom to Saving Throws
-Wisdom to Attack Rolls
-Wisdom to Smiting & Lay on Hands
-Brawling at Monk level of 19
-Smiting at Paladin level of 17
-All Ranger Abilities except 5th Favored Enemy

Edit: Also if I chose Strongheart Halfling I can use it to grab Yondalla's Sense for free, providing Wisdom to Initiative as well.
+I can dip 1 level into Shiba Protector, which although feat intensive and does sacrifice a level of smite, unarmed and hide in plain sight would provide Wisdom to both attack rolls and damage.

Alternatively, I could just use Generic Warrior from Unearthed Arcana.
Grab the Monks belt, and progress in Favored Enemy and Smiting in that class.
Simplier and easier, but it makes the build more MAD and lacks Wisdom to Saving Throws or Attack Rolls + Most of the Paladin & Ranger abilities.

[emeraldstreak]

you do want the lvl 20 unarmed for 2d10, then advance it with gr.mighty wallop and INA to 16d8. For two more incarnum feats it can be 24d8.

there are two monk items that stack for 10 lvls but i have to dig which ones exactly. also there are two feats, superior unarmed strike for 4 lvls and carmedine for 2.

best case: get scorpion kama power from MIC approved for all melee monk weapons.

[emeraldstreak]

Edit: Unfortunately Monk/natural attack build is kind of weird, since natural weapons aren't monk weapons so you can't flurry with them, and it's unclear whether that means you can't use your bonus flurry attacks on them (which you shouldn't be able to anyway) or whether they can't be in the same full attack as a flurry (since technically flurry refers to the whole full-round

beast strike might help

[Nihilarian]

Argent Fist from Eberron is a Monk/Paladin PRC.

[Urpriest]

beast strike might help

Yeah, but it still helps a build without flurry more.

[animewatcha]

If we are going for high level of ranger and dragon mag is allowed. You can trade away the first combat style feat for Wis to ac ( almost same wording as monk except you can be in light armor ). The third combat style feat can be traded away for mind blank level 2 or rather you are immune to harmful mind blank stuff. You can still gain morale bonuses and such. If you are willing to be a Skarn or something that can imitate it enough to do its sub-levels ( changeling with racial subtitution ), you can do monk 5 sub level. It switches out the level-based ac bonus for a 'fill it with incarnum and have it count as insight' replacement. The real kicker though is that you can keep your wis to ac, even in armor. This is due to lack of errata and improper wording.

So if we have a skarn ranger 2 / monk 5 / X

We can have wis to ac x 2 in light armor.

-edit- Interesting thing. The ac bonus name is even changed a bit. If you are willing to go unarmored, there might be a case for wis x 3 to ac if you wear monk's belt.

-edit- put in ranger class

[Extra Anchovies]

If we are going for high level of ranger and dragon mag is allowed. You can trade away the first combat style feat for Wis to ac ( almost same wording as monk except you can be in light armor ). The third combat style feat can be traded away for mind blank level 2 or rather you are immune to harmful mind blank stuff. You can still gain morale bonuses and such. If you are willing to be a Skarn or something that can imitate it enough to do its sub-levels ( changeling with racial subtitution ), you can do monk 5 sub level. It switches out the level-based ac bonus for a 'fill it with incarnum and have it count as insight' replacement. The real kicker though is that you can keep your wis to ac, even in armor. This is due to lack of errata and improper wording.

So if we have a skarn 2 / monk 5 / X

We can have wis to ac x 2 in light armor.

@edit- Interesting thing. The ac bonus name is even changed a bit. If you are willing to go unarmored, there might be a case for wis x 3 to ac if you wear monk's belt.

You could also get Wis*3 with two levels in Swordsage. Then two levels of Serenity Paladin for Wis to saves, and a level of Shiba Protector for Wis to attack and damage...

ETA: Adding paladin also makes it a Paladin/Ranger/Monk build, so bonus points for that.

[animewatcha]

Swordsage AC bonus is counted as 'same' as monk/ninja. So no stacking.

[Gwazi Magnum]

I'd rather avoid multiple bonuses to the same stat from wisdom, I feel like having a ton of stats being based on one attribute to be powerful enough as it is. There's no need for it to be doubled or tripled up.

I would like to find this Ranger Alt that gives WIS to AC though.
If I could find that I'd be more than willing to switch to Paladin 2/Ranger 17/Shiba Protector 1 and simply use a weapon.

[animewatcha]

Moon-warded ranger. I think ( could be wrong ) same mag as where oerthed blood material ( expensive, but godly ) is found.