Did V actually specialize?

[Eriol]

In OTOOPCs, there's a definitive proof that V specialized in evocation magic (well, at the least the V CLAIMS that he did). And considering what comments have been made by the Giant, and by the other characters, it is naturally assumed that it's in Evocation, and that V did. Heck V even states a barred school, Conjuration, when talking to Belkar about teleportation (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0340.html).

But don't you need to bar two schools to do that? Below are all of the schools, and at least 1 spell per school that I could think of and link to relatively quickly:

Abjuration: Protection from Arrows (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0240.html)

Conjuration: stated that he can't cast this to Belkar (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0340.html). But he violates this in the prologue of DCF by casting Stinking Cloud, which is clearly Conjuration.

Divination: Detect magic (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0295.html)

Enchantment: Sleep (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0065.html)

Evocation: Fireball (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0020.html) (obvious)

Illusion: Invisibility Sphere (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0088.html)

Necromancy: Doesn't seem to have cast this ever.

Transmutation: Bull's Strength (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0104.html)

So, while in the "canon" it's fully possible that V's two barred schools are conjuration and necromancy, it doesn't fit with DCF's prologue. And V not specializing... well maybe he's just ashamed? Realizes how few conj he casts, and wishes that he HAD specialized, but it's too late now, so now is trying to hide the fact he didn't by just avoiding those spells when he could.

Dun dun DUN!

[The Extinguisher]

He specialized in Evocation, and barred Necromancy and Conjuration.

If he hadn't, he probably would have scribed a teleportation spell in Azure City.

[kpenguin]

V could be diviner (doubtful) and loose only one school.

[Edgehopper]

Re: Stinking Cloud--was it Conjuration back in 3.0 rules? The upgrade to 3.5 happened in strip 1, which would be after the prologue in DCF. Alternately, was there some other difference in the rules of specialization that would explain it?

After 3.5, it seems clear that Axel's right, V's an Evoker barred in Conjuration and Necromancy.

[bluish_wolf]

I already mentioned this, but Evard's Black Tentacles (or whatever V called it) is conjuration (creation)

[factotum]

The spell V actually used was Evan's Spiked Tentacles of Forced Intrusion, and since that spell doesn't actually exist (the Giant made it up for the purposes of a joke) we can't say WHAT school of magic it belongs to.

[Cantrip]

The spell V actually used was Evan's Spiked Tentacles of Forced Intrusion, and since that spell doesn't actually exist (the Giant made it up for the purposes of a joke) we can't say WHAT school of magic it belongs to.

I'd guess it's Illusion (Shadow) as befitting such a creepy spell...

[bluish_wolf]

The spell V actually used was Evan's Spiked Tentacles of Forced Intrusion, and since that spell doesn't actually exist (the Giant made it up for the purposes of a joke) we can't say WHAT school of magic it belongs to.

It wouldn't make any sense that Evard's Black Tentacles is conjuration, but Evan's Spiked Tentacles of Forced Instrusion is evocation, would it?

[Heads_or_Tails]

Why not? They're two seperate spells, and were created by two different spell casters, is there any requirement that two spells that create tentacles be in the same school?

[skinkatlarge]

They might have changed this in 3.5, but aren't there spells with dual schools, that can be used even if one of the two schools is barred?

Or it could just be Transmutation of some appropriate dangly bits into tentacles...

[The Hammer of Thor]

What school of magic does Evan's Spiked Tentacles belong to?
Are the conjured or evocted?
Are they just an illusion?

[Morty]

Spiked Tentacles was a joke spell in one of the early strips, therefore it shouldn't be taken seriously. V's barreed schools are obviously Conjuration and Necromancy.

[Assassinfox]

Watch as V throws us all for a loop by casting animate dead.

[wowy319]

you seemed to have answered your own question. he has cast spells from every school except necromancy and conjuration. ergo, his barred schools are: Necromancy and conjuration. there we go.

[kpenguin]

Necromancy and Conjuration for barred schools? It appears that V has an ineffectual player. Unless, of course, since they started out in 3.0 there is some reason that an Evoker with those two schools banned was plausible.

[silvadel]

Conjuration was of significantly lesser scope in 3.0 than it was in 3.5.

[Solo]

What school of magic does Evan's Spiked Tentacles belong to?
Are the conjured or evocted?
Are they just an illusion?

It belongs to the Perversion school.

[Andvare]

Evan's Spiked Tentacles of Forced Intrusion is certainly not evocation (from a rules POV), as evocation is energy and nothing else. (And it is *Evan's* and not Evard's or whatever http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0020.html)
It would either be a conjuration or an illusion (shadow conjuration) spell. Or, more likely, from the School of Plot, the biggest school of them all, and like Divination, barred from being barred.

[kpenguin]

Conjuration was of significantly lesser scope in 3.0 than it was in 3.5.

Perhaps, but an EVOKER?! Perhaps V's player has a lower intelligence score than V her/himself

[Green Bean]

Necromancy and Conjuration for barred schools? It appears that V has an ineffectual player. Unless, of course, since they started out in 3.0 there is some reason that an Evoker with those two schools banned was plausible.

Well, the Giant did say that none of the OotS were particularily optimized. I doubt V was build for ownage.

[skinkatlarge]

Evan's Spiked Tentacles of Forced Intrusion is certainly not evocation (from a rules POV), as evocation is energy and nothing else. (And it is *Evan's* and not Evard's or whatever http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0020.html)
It would either be a conjuration or an illusion (shadow conjuration) spell. Or, more likely, from the School of Plot, the biggest school of them all, and like Divination, barred from being barred.
Maybe Evan, the little-known God of Frat Parties and Low-Brow Humor, made it a Universal spell when the world was created - reasoning that no wizard should be deprived of the chance to cast it.

I still like Transmutation better than Illusion, but the fact remains that there are many ways it could be a non-Conjuration spell. V said that was one of her barred schools, when explaining why she couldn't Teleport (oops/edit: as Eriol pointed out).

[RowlieBowlie]

mmm, the spellcast issue.

Well let's see, yes Vaarsuvius did make notice of a bard school of conjuration. And he did make his comments about specialising.

Yet how can it be that he needs two barred schools? Let's see, is he is indeed and evoker, he can have been one from AD&D 2nd edition rules, which would only bar him from Conjuration, correct?

Well, if he would later on be upgraded to third edition rules it could be that he never chose a second barred school to begin with. this would be what one could call a loophole. True it would not be truely in touch with the game-dynamics, yet how much of the comic really is.

Evan's Spiked Tentacles of Forced Intrusion, seeing as it clearly equals a damaging spell. So for the sake of arguement one could call it a Evocation spell as well. But since there is no desription (or image) of the spell actually in effect this could just be a spell that Vaarsuvius Mentor has thought him when he studied, for all we know this person was called Evan.

Therefore speculating on this particulair topic is as pointless as the use of doileys to come in touch with the cosmical powers.

[BardicLasher]

Spiked Tentacles could easily have been a Shadow Conjuration. Same goes for Stinking Cloud, really.

Also, in On the Origin of PCs, V specifically refers to hirself as an Evoker.

[Solo]

Perhaps, but an EVOKER?! Perhaps V's player has a lower intelligence score than V her/himself

Sometimes, there is nothing that says "I don't like you" better than a fireball to the face...

[BardicLasher]

Sometimes, there is nothing that says "I don't like you" better than a fireball to the face...

I think Lightning Bolt does the job better. Fireball's so impersonal.

[the_tick_rules]

hmm lightning or fire, which way would ya wanna die? decisions decisions.

[RowlieBowlie]

mmm, I was bored at work so I read some old comics.

In the one were they find that amulet and that pit full of 2nd edition monsters, it is clearly stated by Vaarsuvius that he hasn't seen them around for a while, so he was around for the 2nd edition rules, which would make him either a evoker (barred conjuration) or a illusionist (barred necromancy)

Seing as Vaarsuvius announces to have the barred school of conjuration this must be a simple deduction towards an evoker.

Later on when Pompey is found as evil opposite, he is a wizard specialising in conjuration, therefore being an opposite of evocation.
So one more hint

[Fascisticide]

About Evan's spiked tentacles of forced intrusuon, has it ever been statted by anyone on these boards? I'd like to have it for my Munchkin game!

[Grey Watcher]

Maybe V has access to a truly mighty arcane masterpiece of a spell: Transmute Character Sheet.

[Porthos]

After checking a couple places, Stinking Cloud was also Conjuration (Creation) in 3.0.

So it looks like V cheated a tad. :smallamused:

[J.Gellert]

Isn't there a chance that he kept all Conjuration spells he knew prior to the "reshaping of the universal laws" when that became his forbidden school?

Kind of like Red Wizards keep any spells they already knew when extra-specializing.

[Andvare]

Well, there was his Linear Guild counter part which had the 3.0 version of fly, but that was a house rule.

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0049.html

[RowlieBowlie]

Isn't there a chance that he kept all Conjuration spells he knew prior to the "reshaping of the universal laws" when that became his forbidden school?

Kind of like Red Wizards keep any spells they already knew when extra-specializing.

Actually when trying to look back it appears that V's opposite school always has been conjuration. So he probably wouldn't know any to begin with.

So for the sake of it, we can assume that Evan's Spiked Tentacles of Forced intrusion are a shadowspell, therefore Illusion, or an evocation spell, but that would be very odd of course.

[kirbsys]

Maybe, V's player decided to cast those spells without telling the DM that they're not on hirs spell list and that they're banned and the DM didn't notice.