[3.5] Best caster multiclass for a Rogue?

[Isiloki]

Hello there.
A bit of my player background first. I'm a new DnD player and I enjoy playing RPG video games, thus I picture well how my character should live. Anyway, my character right now is a Dwarf Lvl 4, 3 lvl in Rogue and 1 lvl in the Dark Template (Yeah, my DM was niceenough to accept that. My character really is about being sneaky) The flank & spank approach is nice, but I really would like to have something more than that, regardless of what I lose. I don't "big" spells, just enough to have various approach of a fight instead of looking for Hide or Flank.
My stats right now :
12 STR
18 Dext + 2
16 CON
16 INT
8 WIS
8 CHA
I've read the Rogue Handbook (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?156350-3-5-The-Rogue-Handbook-A-Fistful-of-d6) countless times, but I just can't decide. I don't want to dip more than 2 or 3 lvl in a caster class, but just enough to take a small advantage of it.
With my low wisdom, I'm "obliged" to go for an intelligence caster.
What do you think would fit the best with my way of playing?

Thank you

[Svata]

In a word? Beguiler. Normally, bard would be acceptable as well, but your charisma is in the tank.

[Yael]

I'll throw another vote for the Beguiler, their skill kit is kinda the same as rogue, and their spell list works pretty nice with the rogue's role and utility. Pretty difficult with that charisma to focus on social, but it works.

[prufock]

Beguiler works well because it has some good synergistic abilities with a rogue's sneakiness (surprise casting, cloaked casting, stealthy spells, etc). It makes a good build with unseen seer, arcane trickster, spellwarp sniper, and similar classes.

Wizard is also a good bet. It has faster spell progression than the beguiler, and you have a greater selection of spells from which to choose.

[Pilo]

Beguiler, wizard or archivist, if what you want is really a caster.
Beguiler and archivist wont be impeded by the fact you wear an armor, Beguiler cast like sorcerer but it knows its whole list which are quite roguish spells.
Archivists are divine caster based on int and with a spellbook. They can learn spells from any divine spellcaster list.

However, as what you want is other options, and as your constitution is quite good, I recommand you to look at incarnum classes (Totemist or Incarnate) which can give you a few at will power you can change every day from a decent list.

[Isiloki]

I'm happy with your answers because Beguilers is what looked the best to me!
I didn't consider the other choices you mention, I'll have a look and come back here to go further in my reasonning.
(Pardon my english, not my mother language)

[Rebel7284]

I recommend one level of wizard and then going into Unseen Seer (http://dndtools.eu/classes/unseen-seer/). It's a great class that progresses both casting and sneak attack while still having good skills. You can also later go into Arcane Trickster (http://dndtools.eu/classes/arcane-trickster/) if you want.

One thing I like with Unseen Seer is using your advanced learning to pick up the spell Hunter's Eye (http://dndtools.eu/spells/players-handbook-ii--80/hunters-eye--2941/) and boost your sneak attack to very high levels a few times a day when you really need it.

[Fouredged Sword]

Trapsmith. 5 level PRC that grants some REALLY good spells at greatly reduced spell levels. You keep all your rougey skills for the whole PRC, and can dip a level of spellthief to pick up the master spellthief feat so you can cast it all in light armor and the ability to hamstring spellcasters with your sneak attacks.

Haste as a 1st level spell. Arcane sight as a 1st level spell. Gaseous form as a 1st level spell. Clairaudience/Clairvoyance as a 1st level spell.

2nd level spells? Stone shape, arcane eye, Dimension Door!

The third level has the best though, Fabricate and Wall of stone.

Don't overlook the class features though. Carry a sizing crossbow to get the ability to lay a 6d8 damage trap. Not bad for something you can prep ahead of combat without a daily limit. Fabricate yourself enough crossbows that you can it and any alchemy traps you want.

[The Insanity]

Beguiler X/Rogue 0

[gorfnab]

For Rogue spellcaster mixes this handbook has some useful information:
Sneak Attacking Spellcasters Handbook (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=1240)

For builds I usually recommend Rogue or Spellthief 1/ Wizard (Spontaneous Divination ACF) 5/ Unseen Seer 10/ Arcane Trickster 4

[Fouredged Sword]

The poster wants a 2-3 level dip, not a rogue 2 / X build. Trapsmith is the best dip, and easy to qualify for.

[nedz]

Rogue 4 / Beguiler 1 / Unseen Seer 10
or
Rogue 3 / Beguiler 2 / Unseen Seer 10
Gives you 6d6 sneak, Beguiler 11 casting and lots of skill points — at level 15
I prefer more Beguiler and less Rogue myself, YMMV.

[Extra Anchovies]

Rogue 4 / Beguiler 1 / Unseen Seer 10
or
Rogue 3 / Beguiler 2 / Unseen Seer 10
Gives you 6d6 sneak, Beguiler 11 casting and lots of skill points — at level 15

Hm, that's good. After that you could go into Arcane Trickster, using Extra Spell to meet the mage hand prereq. I know it's questionable whether Extra Spell lets you select from outside of your list, but if your DM thinks spending a feat to add one cantrip to your spell list is broken, find a different DM :smalltongue:

Rogue 3/Dark Template 1/Beguiler 2/Unseen Seer 10/Arcane Trickster 4 gets 16th-level beguiler casting and 8d6 sneak attack.

[Blackhawk748]

While everyone is recommending Unseen Seer (which is very nice i admit) im gonna recommend Daggerspell Mage. Take 2 levels of Beguiler (or Wizard) snag Practiced Spellcaster and you can meet the Prereqs for Caster Level.

Daggerspell mage is full casting and rogue progression sneak attack and it keeps rogue HD and BaB, so thats nice. I recommend this because you get more HP than Unseen Seer so if you get hit you dont turn into a blood cloud, also it feels more like a rogue with spells to me, which i believe is what you wanted.

[Isiloki]

After reading the Trapsmith class, I just can't go for anything else.
It seems really fun to play with, and offers many possibilities without losing too much levels on it. Othe rcaster classes need a lot of investement to become reliable.
Any advice on the most useful spell to take in normal situations? (I didn't see I had to learn them, I'm sad :( )

Edit : Are there any feat that are good to take with a trapsmith?

[Extra Anchovies]

Any advice on the most useful spell to take in normal situations? (I didn't see I had to learn them, I'm sad :( )

Edit : Are there any feat that are good to take with a trapsmith?

1st: Arcane Sight, Haste, Knock, Clairaudience/Clairvoyance
2nd: Arcane Eye, Dimension Door, Stone Shape
3rd: Fabricate, Greater Dispel Magic

Feat: Craft Wand, and then go to town with your cheap wands.

[Oryan77]

I once considered adding a spellcaster class to my Rogue/Swashbuckler PC. I was more interested in just having some nice utility spells, but I didn't want to lose out much on my Rogue abilities and having a few low level spells with a low CL just didn't seem worth losing several levels of Rogue.

So I invested my skill points in UMD instead and bought scrolls. I really liked using UMD in this way. It also allowed me to use divine or arcane spells as I saw fit. I also learned how powerful UMD can be. I highly recommend this approach instead of dipping into a spellcasting class. There are lots of low level scrolls with low CL checks that are still very useful for a Rogue (focus on defense/utitily spells, not offense spells). If you focus on raising UMD as high as you can, you can easily use higher level scrolls at mid levels.

Tier levels won't mean much if you know how to build and play a Rogue. Investing in UMD and scrolls can make a good Rogue build a thing to fear for any Conjuration Wizard or Druid. I had no doubt in my mind that my UMD Rogue could kill our (questionably evil) party Wizard if he tried anything. Even if he used the Astral Projection trick (I get to kill him twice!).

[sideswipe]

i would suggest spellthief with the master spellthief feat. this will allow you to steal spells from enemies, or use the left over spells from your allies at the end of the day for the next day. and you can get spells all the way up to 9th level at the really high levels. but you will never have many and you will not depend on them. since it is a 1 level dip for some spellcasting its what he wants.

spellthief stacks well with an int based rogue. and allows you to use your other 19 levels in whatever rogue stuff you want. i would personally for a new player just have rogue 19/spellthief 1 take the spellthief as your next level and the master spellthief feat as your next feat. not a bad investment for a few spells per day.

[heavyfuel]

Abrupt Jaunt Wizard and go to town. Make sure you don't ban Illusion

This will give 3/day immediate action 10ft teleport which you give you a lot of versatility and also the ability just "nope" enemies. lllusions are also great, especially things like Invisibility and Silence, which, if comboed, will make you practically undetectable. Silent/Minor Image are both great options for a Rogue type.

[sideswipe]

Abrupt Jaunt Wizard and go to town. Make sure you don't ban Illusion

This will give 3/day immediate action 10ft teleport which you give you a lot of versatility and also the ability just "nope" enemies. lllusions are also great, especially things like Invisibility and Silence, which, if comboed, will make you practically undetectable. Silent/Minor Image are both great options for a Rogue type.

if you do take wizard a few levels in i think it is arcane trickster would not go amiss. though i think i am thinking of the wrong prestige class. whats the good one?

[nedz]

After reading the Trapsmith class, I just can't go for anything else.
It seems really fun to play with, and offers many possibilities without losing too much levels on it. Other caster classes need a lot of investment to become reliable.
Any advice on the most useful spell to take in normal situations? (I didn't see I had to learn them, I'm sad :( )

Edit : Are there any feat that are good to take with a trapsmith?

Practised Spellcaster will add 4 to your CL, which might be handy because it will be 5 otherwise.
I'm not sure why Trapsmiths get Greater Dispel Magic ? Seems a bit pointless - Dispel Magic would have sufficed; though the Spellthief/Trapsmith build, with Master Spellthief, would make use of this.

[Ellowryn]

Another interesting sneaky spell prestige class is Ebonmar Infilitrator from Cityscape. Many of the class abilities are very good for sneak thieves, even if you already have some of them from the dark template, but once again its spell list is pretty good.