[Solved]

[FinnDarkblade]

Hey guys, I need some help in figuring out how to increase my character's usefulness. He's a Dark Lesser Tiefling Spellthief 1/Conjuration Domain Wizard 2 with eidetic spellcaster and I'm planning on going into Unseen Seer. The problems I've run into are caused by houseruling. The first problem is that Wizards don't get those 2 new free spells when they level up. The only way I can get new spells is by finding them or researching them in game and research isn't really an option since there's no down time. I didn't even get the starting spells since all our characters started with amnesia. I also don't get the bonus spells from the Domain Wizard variant (I didn't know that when building the character). So at 3rd level the only spell I know is Armor Lock which I got from spending a week researching while we were travelling on a ship. The reason I chose Armor Lock is because of the houserule on sneak attacks that's been causing me problems. Everyone got 2 0-level spells as at-will powers and I chose No-Light as one of them so I could sit in the No-Light area and sneak attack out of it(I can't cover the enemies with it since I'm the only one in the party with Darkvision). The DM decided that this was unrealistic because they'd know I was in the dark area and thus would be able to defend themselves from my attacks. He has allowed for ranged flanking within 30' to get Sneak Attack but that has all the usual flanking problems further exacerbated by 2 levels of Wizard hit die. Any advice you could give on how to work better in combat and increase my spells known would be incredibly helpful.

[Perturbulent]

Sounds like that's a game to just leave. You've effectively had all your class features house-rule'd away. That's not cool. It sounds like your DM is trying to punish you for taking eidetic.
Doesn't sound particularly fun, and if the DM's not informing folks of houserules in advance, that's a bad sign for what's to come.

[Squark]

... Yeah, your DM is being a [insert cuss word of your choice here]. Ask if since you basically have no wizard class features, you can be a sorcerer instead. If he balks at this, walk away from the game.

[Synar]

Hey guys, I need some help in figuring out how to increase my character's usefulness. He's a Dark Lesser Tiefling Spellthief 1/Conjuration Domain Wizard 2 with eidetic spellcaster and I'm planning on going into Unseen Seer. The problems I've run into are caused by houseruling. The first problem is that Wizards don't get those 2 new free spells when they level up. The only way I can get new spells is by finding them or researching them in game and research isn't really an option since there's no down time. I didn't even get the starting spells since all our characters started with amnesia. I also don't get the bonus spells from the Domain Wizard variant (I didn't know that when building the character). So at 3rd level the only spell I know is Armor Lock [Huh euh um what?] which I got from spending a week researching while we were travelling on a ship. The reason I chose Armor Lock is because of the houserule on sneak attacks that's been causing me problems. Everyone got 2 0-level spells as at-will powers and I chose No-Light as one of them so I could sit in the No-Light area and sneak attack out of it(I can't cover the enemies with it since I'm the only one in the party with Darkvision). The DM decided that this was unrealistic because they'd know I was in the dark area and thus would be able to defend themselves from my attacks. He has allowed for ranged flanking within 30' to get Sneak Attack but that has all the usual flanking problems further exacerbated by 2 levels of Wizard hit die. Any advice you could give on how to work better in combat and increase my spells known would be incredibly helpful.

(Emphasis mine.)

Your problem appears to be quite simple. Here is my solution in three simple steps : -Step 1 : Hit your DM on the head with your PHB. Repeatedly.
-Step 2 : Done already? Hit him again.
-Step 3 : Is your DM still alive? If yes, go back to the first step.



Edit:Ninja'd!
But seriously, OOC problems can not and should not be solved ingame, and that is clearly a problem with how your DM run games. Does the other players got hit as much by the the stupid banhammer - to the point of becoming glorified commoners?

[Troacctid]

Those are some pretty unreasonable nerfs. Your character is basically unplayable.

[Elkad]

Carefully controlling what spells are available is a valid way to keep a handle on Wizards.

That said, you should know that up front, and you should get some sort of choice for spells when you level up. Even if it's rolling randomly.

The sneak attack stuff is just borked. He gave you unlimited usage of a cantrip, it ended up overpowered, so he nerfed a core class feature instead.

[ComaVision]

Please congratulate your DM on successfully scaling down the Wizard so it doesn't out-shine the rest of the party.

[Troacctid]

Carefully controlling what spells are available is a valid way to keep a handle on Wizards.

See, I might agree with that normally, but taking away a domain wizard's domain spells is going too far. And the player took eidetic spellcaster, spending actual build resources specifically to avoid having to deal with missing spellbook issues, and the DM took their memory away, basically negating it completely. That's not cool.

[FinnDarkblade]

I don't want to give the impression that he's just a bad DM who ruins games. The previous games have all gone well, it's just this specific campaign that's not working out. If it really just wouldn't work to play the character as-is then I'd also be fine with just talking to the DM. We get along quite well so that shouldn't be a problem. The other players haven't been hit as hard by the houseruling but that's mostly because the only other caster is a bard so he has other class features to use since he can't use spells.

Edit: Oh, and I'm not being punished for choosing eidetic. We started with no memories or equipment so even if I hadn't I'd have no starting spells.

[Elkad]

See, I might agree with that normally, but taking away a domain wizard's domain spells is going too far. And the player took eidetic spellcaster, spending actual build resources specifically to avoid having to deal with missing spellbook issues, and the DM took their memory away, basically negating it completely. That's not cool.

Oh I agree. He should have known up front at a minimum, and I'd never deny domain (or other guaranteed) spells.
He should get the domain spell and a conjuration spell of some sort at a minimum.

[Urpriest]

Talk to the DM about getting spells as treasure. Since he's got a Wizard in the party and he isn't using the automatic spell research that Wizards normally do, he's got to make sure you keep up at a reasonable level, which means more than one spell for a second level character. Ask about what the plans are for spells in terms of treasure, and what the DM's projections are for how many spells he expects you to have. If it's significantly lower than a Sorceror, then ask to switch classes.

Similarly, you should probably ask to lose Eidetic for something else. In general, I would have argued that memory loss wouldn't mean you lose your spells any more than it would mean a Fighter loses their BAB, since it's procedural, not factual knowledge. But it may be too late to make that argument.

[FinnDarkblade]

Talk to the DM about getting spells as treasure. Since he's got a Wizard in the party and he isn't using the automatic spell research that Wizards normally do, he's got to make sure you keep up at a reasonable level, which means more than one spell for a second level character. Ask about what the plans are for spells in terms of treasure, and what the DM's projections are for how many spells he expects you to have. If it's significantly lower than a Sorceror, then ask to switch classes.

Similarly, you should probably ask to lose Eidetic for something else. In general, I would have argued that memory loss wouldn't mean you lose your spells any more than it would mean a Fighter loses their BAB, since it's procedural, not factual knowledge. But it may be too late to make that argument.

I will definitely talk to him about finding spells in-game. Unfortunately, it is too late to switch around the class or eidetic, and even if I could change class my Cha is only a 14.

*Edit* So, in general, my only real option is to talk to the DM about changing some things and there's not much in-game that I can do to help myself out?

[Troacctid]

Your character could take a break from adventuring to research some spells? I mean, you don't have access to your class features, and you're garbage without them, so it wouldn't be out of character to delay adventuring activities until you can get them back.

You're better off talking to your DM about it, though, I think. He probably didn't intend for you to get nerfed so hard.

[Urpriest]

I will definitely talk to him about finding spells in-game. Unfortunately, it is too late to switch around the class or eidetic, and even if I could change class my Cha is only a 14.

*Edit* So, in general, my only real option is to talk to the DM about changing some things and there's not much in-game that I can do to help myself out?

Presumably if the DM let you change your class the DM would also let you switch Cha and Int, unless you're a "roll-in-order" group.

In terms of ways to help yourself out, a Wizard without spells is no Wizard. Unless you can expect to get lots more spells (or have some way to sneak more spells into your spells known, which we have to assume your DM will veto), then there's no point picking up more Wizard levels, or going into Unseen Seer. After all, your DM probably won't give you the Advanced Learning spells from Unseen Seer either. Better to choose another direction for your character, like Daring Outlaw or the like.

Since you can flank at range, you should pretty much always do so. Pick up Rapid Shot, not many other characters get decent mileage out of two attacks at this level.

No Light is another thing you should ask your DM to change, unless you're getting mileage out of it in some other way than your previous trick.

[daremetoidareyo]

Max out diplomacy and convince Other wizards to let you copy their spellbooks

[FinnDarkblade]

So, um, update. I sent my DM a text about my worries about being useless and he'd noticed the problem already and planned to remedy it by having my character find an artifact during the next session that's a spellbook containing all wizard spells in every 3.5 book other than the Book of Vile Darkness. :smalleek: I may now have a problem in the other direction, ie. not overshadowing the party.

[1pwny]

Allow me to explain the situation to you:

Your job is to dig up a patch of concrete.
At first, you only got a plastic spoon.
We recommended ways to help get you a good 'ol jackhammer.
Your DM just called up an orbital missile strike.

Yeah... that was kind of a bit of an overreaction to the problem, giving you access to all spells. :smallsmile:

[FinnDarkblade]

Yeah, pretty much. :smallbiggrin: I did make a gentleman's agreement to stay away from the overpowered stuff though, and I'll still have to decipher the book and find out what the spells actually do so I can't just start going around saying "I AM LIKE UNTO A GOD!". Well, not yet anyways.:smallwink:

[Petrocorus]

I don't want to give the impression that he's just a bad DM who ruins games.
You give the impression that you didn't know all the house rules for that particular campaign before building your PC. A problem of communication?

I wonder if you have encountered another wizard yet?


So, um, update. I sent my DM a text about my worries about being useless and he'd noticed the problem already and planned to remedy it by having my character find an artifact during the next session that's a spellbook containing all wizard spells in every 3.5 book other than the Book of Vile Darkness. :smalleek: I may now have a problem in the other direction, ie. not overshadowing the party.

He goes from one extreme to the other. Has he heard about reasonable "golden mean". He could just let you get scrolls that you could learn.

[FinnDarkblade]

Part of what the problem was was that no one had ever played a Wizard in that group. Everyone in the group before I got there mostly stuck to fighters, paladins, clerics, and rangers so he's never had to deal with having a wizard who has to learn spells. I hope to make this a good experience rather than one that convinces him that wizards should be banned.