Jumping and Falling Questions

[Easy_Lee]

I'm putting together a character concept and was hoping for a little help concerning jumping and falling. The PHB is a little light on both, but I'm wondering about a few specific things.

What happens when you fall on another creature? Is there a way to make them take the damage?
How many ways can a character increase their jump height? The spell jump and monk's ascendent step are the only two I know.
Just how high is the theoretically highest jump?

Just curious for reasons.

[Eslin]

I'm putting together a character concept and was hoping for a little help concerning jumping and falling. The PHB is a little light on both, but I'm wondering about a few specific things.

What happens when you fall on another creature? Is there a way to make them take the damage?
How many ways can a character increase their jump height? The spell jump and monk's ascendent step are the only two I know.
Just how high is the theoretically highest jump?

Just curious for reasons.

No official rules on falling on another creature, but I'd rule they take the same fall damage you do. Seems to make sense - you're landing on a creature at x m/s, they're getting hit by a creature at x m/s, you should both take the same amount of damage.

I listed it in a thread recently. The level 3 thief rogue ability second story work adds your dex modifier to jump checks. Therefore at present the max height is (3+5+5)x2x3=78 feet.

[The Dolman]

...Therefore at present the max height is (3+5+5)x2x3=78 feet.

Technically you can make an athletics check to jump higher, determined by your DM.

EDIT:
Looking at the BJJ build eh?

[Eslin]

Technically you can make an athletics check to jump higher, determined by your DM.

EDIT:
Looking at the BJJ build eh?

Not sure what a BJJ build is, though from this (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=18291147&postcount=10) thread you can see I've been a fan of grappling and jumping as a foe killing measure.

Athletics checks wise, for some stupid reason they decided not to actually give any actual rules for it, so as-is how athletic you are has nothing to do with how far you can jump. Yeah technically your DM can add to it, but without any guidelines DMs tend you just give you an arbitrary and semi-random amount based on what you rolled. I rolled a 13 and had +12 to my athletics, she rolled a 20 and had +1, DM ruled she went further (note that there are no critical skill checks), and most DMs are like that - without rules you tend to just randomly eyeball it based on the actual roll rather than the total, and you end up with really inconsistent results, mostly as a result of having to keep track of so much at once.

[Easy_Lee]

Well, here's my thought. Let's say someone rolls up a Monk/warlock and takes otherwordly leap invocation at 9. Step of the wind doubles jump distance, jump triples, and the monk slow fall feature reduces distance for falling damage by 5x monk level. A monk with a STR score of 12 can jump 24' in the air with jump and step of the wind up. So, for a 60' fall, slow fall reduces the distance you're falling (for the sake of damage to you) to 30' at monk level 6, just barely higher than you can jump. It can easily be argued you shouldn't take falling damage from a distance you can jump, though that's DM dependent.

Why am I concerned about 60' specifically? Shadow monks can teleport up to 60' from shadow to shadow. Stick a darkness spell 60' up in the air above someone (toss a rock, perhaps), and you can shadow step directly to it, then fall on them and perform an attack. It consumes your bonus and reaction, but the damage may be worth it. You'd get advantage on the attack to do all of that due to shadow step.

Could be really potent on a lightfoot halfling, since they can move through the space of larger creatures and thus wouldn't necessarily fall prone from landing on someone deliberately. Furthermore, they get bonuses to DEX and CHA, can hide while obscured by a larger creature, and could probably shadow step out of the shadow cast by a larger creature. Wouldn't weigh very much, though, so the death from above would have to be a deliberate trick approved by the DM and probably practiced by your character.

What would be better is if you managed to grapple someone and take them through the shadow with you. That might double the damage dealt, since they'd be taking the fall with you on top of them. It's not clear how slow fall works, though, and it might reduce the damage for your target. And you won't be grappling many creatures as a lightfoot halfling. Maybe the DM would let you shove them in, I dunno.

It'd be DM dependent, but could be a potent character anyway. You'd want good scores in DEX and CHA, dumpstat WIS because the only thing we would lose by doing so is stunning blow (and AC, but warlock can fix that). Would want to take the pact of the blade. Get the warlock invocations devil's sight, shadow armor, and lifedrinker to see through your darkness, have unarmored AC of 18, and add both DEX and CHA to attacks. Declare your body (unarmed strike) as your pact weapon and you'd be set.

Obviously there are some things to clear up with the DM, but I think it could be fun. The major downside is it's hard to grapple people as a monk, particularly without a rogue dip for expertise or high strength, but I could see it being situationally useful. The build wouldn't suffer for damage when the fall trick wasn't available, either way.

What do you guys think?

[odigity]

I'm putting together a character concept and was hoping for a little help concerning jumping and falling. The PHB is a little light on both, but I'm wondering about a few specific things.

What happens when you fall on another creature? Is there a way to make them take the damage?
How many ways can a character increase their jump height? The spell jump and monk's ascendent step are the only two I know.
Just how high is the theoretically highest jump?

Just curious for reasons.

Wait... you're going to play Mario in D&D?

(So, I know the last thing you want is a reduced speed, but it really oughtta be a dwarf...)

[Dark Tira]

Boots of Springing and Striding also triple jump distance although it's not something you can reliably build a character around.

[Foodle]

Wildshape/Polymorph into a Giant Toad or Giant Frog for a high jump of 10ft.

True Polymorph into Bullywug for a high jump of 10ft, a Bulette or Thri-kreen for 15ft or a Bulgara for 20ft.

[Eslin]

Wildshape/Polymorph into a Giant Toad or Giant Frog for a high jump of 10ft.

True Polymorph into Bullywug for a high jump of 10ft, a Bulette or Thri-kreen for 15ft or a Bulgara for 20ft.

What's a Bulgara?

[Yoroichi]

Guys, this needs some ruling.

I don't get how someone in one action can jump 78 feet in the air.

My totem barbarian with his totem path Feature eagle can move at a fly speed with burst. But in order to fly i need to consume my whole move for 35 feet( after increased speed) which is also the maximum of my movement for one turn.

[Eslin]

Guys, this needs some ruling.

I don't get how someone in one action can jump 78 feet in the air.

My totem barbarian with his totem path Feature eagle can move at a fly speed with burst. But in order to fly i need to consume my whole move for 35 feet( after increased speed) which is also the maximum of my movement for one turn.

Ok, so improve that. Pick a non slow race (40 feet), grab the mobile feat (50 feet), have someone cast longstrider on you (1st level spell, lasts an hour, no concentration)(60 feet), use dash as a bonus action (120 feet) and either use your action to attack someone or if you really feel like it, use it to dash again (180 feet).

If you get a party member to cast haste on you and spend that action to dash, you're now going to go 480 feet (520 if you took elf as a race).

[Foodle]

What's a Bulgara?It's a type of demon in the monster manual, looks like a overgrown red ape.

[Eslin]

Oh, a barlgura

[Slipperychicken]

Guys, this needs some ruling.

I don't get how someone in one action can jump 78 feet in the air.


Jumping already costs movement just like running does.



Your movement can include jumping, climbing, and
swimming. These different modes of movement can
be combined with walking, or they can constitute your
entire move. However you’re moving, you deduct the
distance of each part of your move from your speed until
it is used up or until you are done moving.

So yeah, you can do hardcore parkour as long as you have the movement for it.

[Maxilian]

No official rules on falling on another creature, but I'd rule they take the same fall damage you do. Seems to make sense - you're landing on a creature at x m/s, they're getting hit by a creature at x m/s, you should both take the same amount of damage.

I listed it in a thread recently. The level 3 thief rogue ability second story work adds your dex modifier to jump checks. Therefore at present the max height is (3+5+5)x2x3=78 feet.

As far as i know the fall damage of an object is:

for every 200 lb add 1d6 and for every 10 feet add 1d6 (max 20d6), so you would calculate the damage done by having in mind how much does your character weight.

for example:

If you fall on top of a character from the 10 feets, you will take 1d6 (for every 10 feets add another 1d6) but your target will take 1d6 (for every 10 feet) and 1d6 for every 200 lb, so if you character have a weight of 800 lb (a mounted character or someone with the enlarge spell on), you will do a damage of 5d6 (1d6 for the 10 feets and 4d6 for the 800lbs/200lbs).

Note: you can make really cool combos with some spells (combine find steed with enlarge, and not only you will get bigger but also your mount -every spell that you cast only on yourself while you're on a summoned steed by that spell, the mount also gets the buff-, so your weight will be 8 times more + 8 times more the weight of your mount, so you could easily do a 20d6 damage and only take 1d6 (for the 10 feets)

[Easy_Lee]

Is the 200lb rule in the PHB, DMG, or other?

[Maxilian]

Is the 200lb rule in the PHB, DMG, or other?

No, it was an old version rule of falling objects damage (3.5 i think, don't remember right now) but right now there's no info about it, so that's what i use, and i'm pretty sure that's how its going to stay

So... yeah, in the end, the DM is the one with the last word until the the DMG comes out

Note: The PHB have the same falling rule as 3.5 (p.183 PHB) so it will most likely also have the same falling object damage rules...

Here what the PHB says about falling damage:

"At the end of a fall, a creature takes 1d6 bludgeoning damage for every 10 feet it fell, to a maximum of 20d6. The creature lands prone, unless it avoids taking damage from the fall."

[Easy_Lee]

No, it was an old version rule of falling objects damage (3.5 i think, don't remember right now) but right now there's no info about it, so that's what i use, and i'm pretty sure that's how its going to stay

Note: The PHB have the same falling rule as 3.5 (p.183 PHB) so it will most likely also have the same falling object damage rules...

Thanks for the reply. I suspect you're right, though it's possible they'll opt for damage by the size of the falling object since that would be simpler. Either way, a bard with find steed and enlarge may end up being the best jumper. Can't see much room for other builds in this niche unless they come up with a Death From Above feat that relies on DEX or attack rolls.

[Slipperychicken]

If you jump more than 10 feet up, do you take damage for the fall back down?

[Easy_Lee]

If you jump more than 10 feet up, do you take damage for the fall back down?

From my reading of the PHB, it's unclear. I'd personally argue you don't take damage for falls within 10' of how high you can jump, and would probably set a minimum damaging fall of 15-20', but that's just me.

[Maxilian]

If you jump more than 10 feet up, do you take damage for the fall back down?

Well there's nothing said about that in any of the 5e manuals we have, but... the PHB says that after a long jump and you land in difficult terrain, you must succeed on a DC 10 Dexterity (Acrobatics) check to land on your feet. Otherwise, you land prone, and doesn't add anything about damage, so i would say, as long as you jump and fall the same distance that you can jump (for example: a monk can jump 40 feets, after he jumps he can fall 40 feets without taking damage, but in case the monk fall 40 feets -without jumping- he will take damage in that case -maybe give him a Dexterity (Acrobaticss) check to know if he lands safely, if he don't he takes damage )

[Easy_Lee]

Well there's nothing said about that in any of the 5e manuals we have, but... the PHB says that after a long jump and you land in difficult terrain, you must succeed on a DC 10 Dexterity (Acrobatics) check to land on your feet. Otherwise, you land prone, and doesn't add anything about damage, so i would say, as long as you jump and fall the same distance that you can jump (for example: a monk can jump 40 feets, after he jumps he can fall 40 feets without taking damage, but in case the monk fall 40 feets -without jumping- he will take damage in that case -maybe give him a Dexterity (Acrobaticss) check to know if he lands safely, if he don't he takes damage )

The text about falls used in the PHB says you take damage from a "long" fall, but then specifies 1d6 per 10'. So it's pretty firmly up to the DM as to how far you can fall before you take damage. Looks like there's no official ruling yet as to what happens when you fall on someone else.

[emeraldstreak]

what are the rules on Jumping anyway? Today we had it come up in a fight against a beholder.

[Slipperychicken]

what are the rules on Jumping anyway? Today we had it come up in a fight against a beholder.

They're on PHB, page 182.


You have your high jump and long jump, which you can do without rolling. You only need to roll Strength(Athletics) to move further or jump in difficult conditions.

You can jump as far your strength score in feet, assuming a 10ft running start. If you don't get a running start, you jump half the distance.
You can jump as high as your strength modifier + 3 feet, assuming a 10ft running start. If you don't get a running start, you can only jump half that height.
Your arms can reach as high as half your height. That means the height you can reach with your hands is [1.5*height + jump height].
Your DM might require you to make jump checks in difficult conditions.

[Easy_Lee]

They're on PHB, page 182.


You have your high jump and long jump, which you can do without rolling. You only need to roll Strength(Athletics) to move further or jump in difficult conditions.

You can jump as far your strength score in feet, assuming a 10ft running start. If you don't get a running start, you jump half the distance.
You can jump as high as your strength modifier + 3 feet, assuming a 10ft running start. If you don't get a running start, you can only jump half that height.
Your arms can reach as high as half your height. That means the height you can reach with your hands is [1.5*height + jump height].
Your DM might require you to make jump checks in difficult conditions.


Yep, and it doesn't even give the DM a guideline on the check for "moving further". If you want to jump more than 8 feet with 20 strength, what's the DC? How much DC is added for each additional foot of distance? They were a bit too open-ended in this case, IMO.

[Slipperychicken]

Yep, and it doesn't even give the DM a guideline on the check for "moving further". If you want to jump more than 8 feet with 20 strength, what's the DC? How much DC is added for each additional foot of distance? They were a bit too open-ended in this case, IMO.

If they're going to include more in-depth skill DC guidelines, I would assume they'd put it in the DMG. I think that would be the more logical place to put it, since the DM is supposed to arbitrate skill checks.

[infinitetech]

what if you use the flesh to stone spell on yourself when doing this, since it will take a few turns to come back down, and use some other spell to increase speed as you go down, the stone you will be way heavier and wont let go of anything you have, then while using these and the turns you have left summon as many items to you as you can and freeze them, weld them, stick them, tie them, whatever, to yourself, when you hit you will effectively do railgun damage due to increased weight, velocity increase past terminal velocity, and probably having it all hit in a very small point of impact, say hello to meteor slam build, lets take out the tarrasque now... (btw, is there stone to metal yet? because if you can have someone do that...

[Eslin]

what if you use the flesh to stone spell on yourself when doing this, since it will take a few turns to come back down, and use some other spell to increase speed as you go down, the stone you will be way heavier and wont let go of anything you have, then while using these and the turns you have left summon as many items to you as you can and freeze them, weld them, stick them, tie them, whatever, to yourself, when you hit you will effectively do railgun damage due to increased weight, velocity increase past terminal velocity, and probably having it all hit in a very small point of impact, say hello to meteor slam build, lets take out the tarrasque now... (btw, is there stone to metal yet? because if you can have someone do that...

Master transmuter could probably do it, you'll just need to spend ten minutes 'handling' your friend before you send him into the sky.

[Maxilian]

what if you use the flesh to stone spell on yourself when doing this, since it will take a few turns to come back down, and use some other spell to increase speed as you go down, the stone you will be way heavier and wont let go of anything you have, then while using these and the turns you have left summon as many items to you as you can and freeze them, weld them, stick them, tie them, whatever, to yourself, when you hit you will effectively do railgun damage due to increased weight, velocity increase past terminal velocity, and probably having it all hit in a very small point of impact, say hello to meteor slam build, lets take out the tarrasque now... (btw, is there stone to metal yet? because if you can have someone do that...

But how much would your weight increase? you could do the same with enlarge (make you bigger and increase your weight 8 times, it would be easy to make you hit the enemy with 20d6, even more in you have the find steed spell, cause every spell you cast in yourself also affect your mount, so you and your mount will become 1 size bigger -you will become large and your mount will be huge and will take 15 feets around the area, so it will be harder to evade-,

Note: Remember that if you want to damage someone by falling on top of them you need to fall from at least 10 feets, and you will also take damage when you fall 1d6 for each 10f, i don't know how much damage can you take in stone form without shattering... (i will check later)

[infinitetech]

they never specify type of stone, so potentially alot, and if chosen wisely certain bedrock tectonic stones are about 35 lbs per cubic inch or more and are 50 or more times harder/more durable than modern advanced alloys, thus why we cant mine past them

[Easy_Lee]

So now we have a character who jumps high into the air, turns to stone (hopefully adamantine), and falls on his opponents...did we just make Tanooki Suit Mario?

[Eslin]

So now we have a character who jumps high into the air, turns to stone (hopefully adamantine), and falls on his opponents...did we just make Tanooki Suit Mario?

More super smash bros Kirby, I think.

[Slipperychicken]

More super smash bros Kirby, I think.

Only once he has the Swallow Whole ability.

[infinitetech]

you could use gaseous form at the top of the jump to get higher then trigger the rest, thus dropping from near orbit and if you use push on yourself or some other force spell you could speed past terminal velocity

[Maxilian]

you could use gaseous form at the top of the jump to get higher then trigger the rest, thus dropping from near orbit and if you use push on yourself or some other force spell you could speed past terminal velocity

But how much damage would you take? have in mind that you're a stone, so you're more vulnerable, if the damage is too big, a piece of you may break :smalleek:

[Eslin]

Honestly, this is taking too much setup time. I like leaping in the air, punching and eldritch blasting them up further, then dropping on them.

[infinitetech]

if planned right this could be a lower damage 1 turn or higher damage 2 turn or insane damage 3 turn, and actually rock is far stronger than flesh for this sort of thing

[Yagyujubei]

Honestly, this is taking too much setup time. I like leaping in the air, punching and eldritch blasting them up further, then dropping on them.

lol I like the simple shadow step into the air using the darkness spell targeted on my familiar, and then dropping down doing a melee attack with both of my knees. 6d10 from fall, 1d10 from my weight, and 2d6+8 from the two melee attacks, I call it the ninja drop and it takes 0 Ki to set up, and I COULD use jump to add another 35 feet to the trick, but I don't wanna die.

I convinced my DM that I should take slightly(1d10 for medium or large, 2d10 for huge or gargantuan) reduced damage due to having their body break my fall a bit, and I have slow fall so the dmg to me isnt too great that I cant use it a couple times per fight.

does require lvl 9 though, but still 7d10+2d6+8 (54avg) is pretty great at will dmg at any level let alone 10

[Maxilian]

lol I like the simple shadow step into the air using the darkness spell targeted on my familiar, and then dropping down doing a melee attack with both of my knees. 6d10 from fall, 1d10 from my weight, and 2d6+8 from the two melee attacks, I call it the ninja drop and it takes 0 Ki to set up, and I COULD use jump to add another 35 feet to the trick, but I don't wanna die.

I convinced my DM that I should take slightly(1d10 for medium or large, 2d10 for huge or gargantuan) reduced damage due to having their body break my fall a bit, and I have slow fall so the dmg to me isnt too great that I cant use it a couple times per fight.

does require lvl 9 though, but still 7d10+2d6+8 (54avg) is pretty great at will dmg at any level let alone 10

If there's a Wizard in your party, make him cast Enlarge on you and do the same combo (you will weight 8 times more) so your damage will increase a lot

Note: Also thanks for the idea of using darkness + Shadow step to use these combo, these's a great idea