Punch Me in the Eye!!!

[jabberwocky9]

I've always like the martial idea but when it comes to running a monk, blaaaah! IMO, weak, weak class unless you have a powerful build playing hulk smash. Now stuck running fighter 1/rogue 1/mage 1 monk/assassin 4/4. I've lost focus somewhere grabbing feats worth not mentioning. I am hoping just for some helpful builds to get me more than just interested in playing this character. NO OPTION IN USING TOB to get that out of the way. Also I have to have the fighter/rogue/mage 1/1 levels and assassin levels due to DM homebrew idea(don't ask). My stats: STR 18, DEX 25, CON 16, INT 20, WIS 18, CHA 18...and those are set. Levels would total 13. Homebrew race so there isn't any use humans add'l feats or other races capabilities. I was thinking maybe stun focused, possible trip which I always liked. Psionics out of the loop also. Someone able to help will be dubbed a genious. Any information you need please ask and please be sympathetic.

[arkangel111]

Not really sure where to go here. You have dipped everywhere and hurt far more than helped.

First lose the monk level for sure.
Second is it gestalt? I am not getting the 1/1 or 4/4 references. If its gestalt the common thing is to use // for gestalted. I am gonna assume none gestalt and give you advice from there.
thirdly is mage a wizard or sorcerer? some other class? I will assume Wizard

Not sure on your order of classes or if that matters, also you presented 0 feats so its hard to judge what your trying to do.

1. Fighter - Sneak attack variant (1d6) - lose bonus feat
2. Rogue - Sneak attack 2d6
3. Wizard - (not even sure why its here to be honest) - pickup abrupt jaunt ACF at the least
4. Rogue - Grab evasion?
5. Assassin - assuming these levels must be assassin - SA 3d6
6. Assassin
7. Assassin - SA 4d6
8. Assassin
9. Assassin - SA 5d6 your spells now let you qualify for Arcane trickster
10. Arcane trickster
11. Arcane trickster - SA 6d6
12. Arcane trickster
13. Arcane trickster - SA 7d6

This would give you SA 7d6 (Same as solid classed rogue) and casting as a 9th lvl assassin or 5th level wizard your choice

Not sure if it'll work for what you want, but you can set yourself up as the typical Assassin with some Trickster Utilities and a short DDoor to help with flanking. If you can convince your DM to let you drop that dead level in wizard I'd grab 3rd lvl of rogue giving you the ACF (penetrating strike) for half dice SA on everything and 1 more SA dice.

[Azoth]

I'd rather go unseen seer than arcane trickster. Let's him nab some good SA spells. The first to come to mind is Hunter's Eye. I doubt he will get high enough level spells to persist, but swift action cast to add CL/3 dice to your SA can be handy.

[Extra Anchovies]

Regarding the above: The only thing you have to do to turn that into a monk build is to fight with monk weapons. TWF with a quarterstaff or something.

[jabberwocky9]

Not really sure where to go here. You have dipped everywhere and hurt far more than helped.

First lose the monk level for sure.
Second is it gestalt? I am not getting the 1/1 or 4/4 references. If its gestalt the common thing is to use // for gestalted. I am gonna assume none gestalt and give you advice from there.
thirdly is mage a wizard or sorcerer? some other class? I will assume Wizard

Not sure on your order of classes or if that matters, also you presented 0 feats so its hard to judge what your trying to do.

1. Fighter - Sneak attack variant (1d6) - lose bonus feat
2. Rogue - Sneak attack 2d6
3. Wizard - (not even sure why its here to be honest) - pickup abrupt jaunt ACF at the least
4. Rogue - Grab evasion?
5. Assassin - assuming these levels must be assassin - SA 3d6
6. Assassin
7. Assassin - SA 4d6
8. Assassin
9. Assassin - SA 5d6 your spells now let you qualify for Arcane trickster
10. Arcane trickster
11. Arcane trickster - SA 6d6
12. Arcane trickster
13. Arcane trickster - SA 7d6

This would give you SA 7d6 (Same as solid classed rogue) and casting as a 9th lvl assassin or 5th level wizard your choice

Not sure if it'll work for what you want, but you can set yourself up as the typical Assassin with some Trickster Utilities and a short DDoor to help with flanking. If you can convince your DM to let you drop that dead level in wizard I'd grab 3rd lvl of rogue giving you the ACF (penetrating strike) for half dice SA on everything and 1 more SA dice.

Sorry 'bout that, bad habit of stating mage instead of wizard. As for your build, I likey. Unfortunately, I have to go the with the monk route. I didn't mention my feats because I'm ashamed. I know I gave the perception of not wanting the monk but it's too late for me now. The classes I'm stuck with is fighter 1, rogue 1, wizard 1. Have to have assassin and monk. I wanted to portray someone that is capable to be mobile, able to defend himself martially and defensively. DM homebrew campaign/race has me stuck definitively with the fighter/wizard/rogue and monk/assassin. The only thing I may be able to rearrange are the feats and maybe ACFs. I was researching to see what route I can go to maybe focus on my stunning or possibly trip focus or Assassin orientated abilities.

[FearlessGnome]

Talk to your dm and ask him to just kill off your character/have it leave the party and just make a new one.

[Petrocorus]

Monk 2 can be a good dip. It's redundant with Rogue for some things.
Don't take more than 2 level of Monks.

[jabberwocky9]

Talk to your dm and ask him to just kill off your character/have it leave the party and just make a new one.

I've tried getting myself killed. Apparently I can't do that right either plus he couldn't hit me so maybe I'm doing something right.

[jabberwocky9]

I've tried getting myself killed. Apparently I can't do that right either plus he couldn't hit me so maybe I'm doing something right.

Also guys, I have to apologize. I am asking way too much!!! Too much limitations and unworkable classes. At least not optimal.

[Extra Anchovies]

Are you asking for us to rebuild your character, or are you asking for suggestions for what to do next?

[Blackhawk748]

Well you could go Dragon Disciple from the DMG, as it isnt really set up for any one class and it gives you extra spell slots, so it makes a decent melee character with a bit of magic.

[Phelix-Mu]

Sounds like five levels of Abjurant Champion should be your next levels. If you managed to take assassin and remain good, use luminous armour from BoED, acquire an AC of "No." Trade out your familiar for Abrupt Jaunt. Take Sun School; teleport behind ppl and slam them into the next decade.

Use wands of wraith strike and greater mighty wallop. Dispense much damage.

[arkangel111]

You list the monk and assassin separately is this gestalt? Or are you saying all 5 of your classes must have at least 1 level in them? Or maybe you are level 11 with monk 4/assassin 4 the other classes each having 1? In which case we have 2 levels to adjust and acfs to adjust?
I am afb but if the last is the case you could have a ton of bonus feats to play with and might have something viable hidden in this pile.
feat rogue
monk acf that grants 2 feats at level 1
a couple wizard acfs trade things for feats as well.

[Rubik]

How about some war mind and some Tashalatora? Look in the SRD for the former, and Secrets of Sarlona for the latter. (It's a feat.)

Also, optimize your WBL. http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=15474863#post15474863 Start small and work your way up. Stack those weapon special abilities!

[Azoth]

If you want to help your DM kill your character, just prepair Blade of Blood in all of your lvl1 and above spell slots for wizard and assassin. You should have atleast 5-8 of them (25-40 damage). Pop it off every round of combat adding 3d6 damage to your first hit of the round and dealing 5 damage to yourself.

Technically you don't need to be in combat to do this, but it helps justify it. You could just re-up it every couple of rounds and pay the 5hp kicker.

Denying yourself whatever buffs you would normally self cast should make it easier to hit you, and limiting yourself to an attempted damage boost could work. Hell, put yourself in the AoE of some DoT spells and just stand there taking it (voluntarily fail the save) while fighting.

When you want a character to die, don't trust the DM to do it. You make it happen. Tactics and self preservation go out the window. You start thinking like a 1980's action movie hero and just charge headlong into the enemy horde trying to take them all out single handedly while causing as much collateral damage as possible.

You throw up a quickened sleet storm while charging through the hail to slam into an enemy in the back row. The next round you full attack someone and then drop a quickened fireball at your feet.

[jabberwocky9]

Are you asking for us to rebuild your character, or are you asking for suggestions for what to do next?

No, not all at all. Suggestions on what possible feats I can use for this character and/or how many levels I should take with monk and assassin with the unfortunate levels of fighter/rogue/wizard with 1 level each in them.

[jabberwocky9]

No, not all at all. Suggestions on what possible feats I can use for this character and/or how many levels I should take with monk and assassin with the unfortunate levels of fighter/rogue/wizard with 1 level each in them.

something to get excited about!!!

[jabberwocky9]

If you want to help your DM kill your character, just prepair Blade of Blood in all of your lvl1 and above spell slots for wizard and assassin. You should have atleast 5-8 of them (25-40 damage). Pop it off every round of combat adding 3d6 damage to your first hit of the round and dealing 5 damage to yourself.

Technically you don't need to be in combat to do this, but it helps justify it. You could just re-up it every couple of rounds and pay the 5hp kicker.

Denying yourself whatever buffs you would normally self cast should make it easier to hit you, and limiting yourself to an attempted damage boost could work. Hell, put yourself in the AoE of some DoT spells and just stand there taking it (voluntarily fail the save) while fighting.

When you want a character to die, don't trust the DM to do it. You make it happen. Tactics and self preservation go out the window. You start thinking like a 1980's action movie hero and just charge headlong into the enemy horde trying to take them all out single handedly while causing as much collateral damage as possible.

You throw up a quickened sleet storm while charging through the hail to slam into an enemy in the back row. The next round you full attack someone and then drop a quickened fireball at your feet.

Truthfully, I have taken the approach of the action hero and done some pretty cool things. I really don't want to kill him off since it's not fair to the DM. He's worked diligently on this homebrew campaign and my character is important to him. The usual characters I play with in this group are in support roles even though I'm capable of kicking butt. "Don't wake the sleeping bear".

[jabberwocky9]

You list the monk and assassin separately is this gestalt? Or are you saying all 5 of your classes must have at least 1 level in them? Or maybe you are level 11 with monk 4/assassin 4 the other classes each having 1? In which case we have 2 levels to adjust and acfs to adjust?
I am afb but if the last is the case you could have a ton of bonus feats to play with and might have something viable hidden in this pile.
feat rogue
monk acf that grants 2 feats at level 1
a couple wizard acfs trade things for feats as well.

Right now my levels are: Rogue 1, Fighter 1, Wizard 1, Monk 4, Assassin 4. I am stuck with rogue/fighter/wizard at those levels and Monk/Assassin classes. I could possibly add more rogue/fighter/wizard but still have to have Monk/Assassin levels.

[Petrocorus]

Right now my levels are: Rogue 1, Fighter 1, Wizard 1, Monk 4, Assassin 4. I am stuck with rogue/fighter/wizard at those levels and Monk/Assassin classes. I could possibly add more rogue/fighter/wizard but still have to have Monk/Assassin levels.

That means your level 11, right?

You should be careful with double, triple, quadruple posts and self quoting.
It is frown upon on this forum.
Edit your last post to had things instead, until someone posts after you.

[oxybe]

Is there any reason you can't just ask the GM "Hey man, I'd like to rework my character's classes/skills/feats since the current build just isn't really gelling as I would have liked. Same concept, just a different engine under the hood."?

You keep saying you have to use certain things, but any particular reason why?

[jabberwocky9]

That means your level 11, right?

You should be careful with double, triple, quadruple posts and self quoting.
It is frown upon on this forum.
Edit your last post to had things instead, until someone posts after you.

gotcha...yes currently level 11 but went up two levels

[gorfnab]

Let's see if we can salvage this

LE
1. Rogue - Craven
2. Fighter - Sneak Attack ACF (UA), Hit-and Run Tactics ACF (DotU)
3. Wizard - Abrupt Jaunt ACF (PHBII), Simple Martial Wizard ACF (UA) - Weapon Finesse, Two Weapon Fighting
4. Rogue
5. Monk - Invisible Fist ACF (EoE), Cobra Strike ACF (UA) - Dodge
6. Monk - Invisible Fist ACF (EoE), Cobra Strike ACF (UA) - Mobility, Kung Fu Genius or Carmendine Monk
7. Assassin
8. Assassin
9. Assassin - Blindfight
10. Assassin
11. Assassin
12. Assassin - Spring Attack
13. Assassin
14. Assassin
15. Telflammar Shadowlord - Improved Two Weapon Fighting
16. Telflammar Shadowlord
17. Telflammar Shadowlord
18. Telflammar Shadowlord - Greater Two Weapon Fighting
19. Telflammar Shadowlord
20. Telflammar Shadowlord

If Flaws are available pick up Darkstalker and Combat Reflexes

[jabberwocky9]

Is there any reason you can't just ask the GM "Hey man, I'd like to rework my character's classes/skills/feats since the current build just isn't really gelling as I would have liked. Same concept, just a different engine under the hood."?

You keep saying you have to use certain things, but any particular reason why?

I'm sure I can ask him. I really don't want to annoy the DM by changing the choices made by taking monk/assassin. What do you have in mind? The concept of this character was to be mobile, unarmed combatant. Which I am. I was wondering if there is anything that can boost my capabilities. Currently have dodge, mobility, spring attack, combat expertise, improve trip, practiced spell caster which I want to drop, ascetic rogue which I only have one level of rogue and which I should have more rogue levels of course. I also have combat expertise and improved trip. Feats for monk classes IMO sucks. I do like the idea of superior unarmed strike(ToB) which I should be allowed. I just can't use any ToB classes(suck that I can't). Knock down would be nice for the tripping focus. Improve natural attack couldn't hurt I think. Rapid stunning could be beneficial for monk feats. Putting it all together for me has been difficult and I need to take to some time to think 'bout what I could focus on. Suggestions from you guys would maybe give me a better understanding from what direction I could move forward to.

[jabberwocky9]

Let's see if we can salvage this

LE
1. Rogue - Craven
2. Fighter - Sneak Attack ACF (UA), Hit-and Run Tactics ACF (DotU)
3. Wizard - Abrupt Jaunt ACF (PHBII), Simple Martial Wizar ACF (UA) - Weapon Finesse, Two Weapon Fighting
4. Rogue
5. Monk - Invisible Fist ACF (EoE), Cobra Strike ACF (UA) - Dodge
6. Monk - Invisible Fist ACF (EoE), Cobra Strike ACF (UA) - Mobility, Kung Fu Genius or Carmendine Monk
7. Assassin
8. Assassin
9. Assassin - Blindfight
10. Assassin
11. Assassin
12. Assassin - Spring Attack
13. Assassin
14. Assassin
15. Telflammar Shadowlord - Improved Two Weapon Fighting
16. Telflammar Shadowlord
17. Telflammar Shadowlord
18. Telflammar Shadowlord - Greater Two Weapon Fighting
19. Telflammar Shadowlord
20. Telflammar Shadowlord

If Flaws are available pick up Darkstalker and Combat Reflexes

Excuse my ignorance. EoE is Exemplars of Evil? I'll check this out, seems interesting.

[gorfnab]

Excuse my ignorance. EoE is Exemplars of Evil? I'll check this out, seems interesting.
Yes.

Invisible Fist trades the monk's Evasion (which you get anyway from Rogue) for the ability to turn invisible every third round.

[jabberwocky9]

Thanks guys, gave me better options, ideas, and direction. I'll be working on it and at least enjoy the process of it.