Barbarian totem warrior , The most tank?

[Shakart]

First of all, i dont speak english, so apology my language.

Anyone have any idea which is more melee tank?

I will create a totem barbarian warrior (bear), which I think has great potential as a tank and also do considerable damage.
I need build opinions and other options also

Thx

[silveralen]

Depends on the level range and what you mean by tank. Assuming you just mean someone who can take a lot of punishment while putting out a threatening amount of his own, bear barbarian is one of the best. High HP and early damage resistance make for a solid combo.

Monk around level 12-14 gets pretty good at this. By then he has solid AC, saving throws, and can use stoneskin on himself (monk of the elements only). At 18 he gets even better.

Paladin with oath of the ancients is similar, good all round saves, high AC, stoneskin, resistance to magic damage, and self healing. He is a bit more well rounded early on, with solid saves, AC, and some resistance to damage by lvl 7.

For raw physical damage barbarian wins, but the other two can catch up later on, and have the advantage of withstanding a number of save or whatever effects.

[MaxWilson]

You almost never want someone to cast stoneskin on himself, it's self-defeating because you have to make a Concentration check each time you get hit. It's much better to have someone else cast it on you.

[silveralen]

Which is why they can buff you with other spells as well, or you can use yours as a fallback when the caster has something better to do with their single concentration spell. Not every caster will want to devote their time purely to buffing their teammates.

Self sufficiency helps quite a bit imo.

[Krymoar]

I did a write-up on a Dex Barbarian as a tank. (http://www.reddit.com/r/dndnext/comments/2ji303/the_class_is_a_lie_the_lil_chef/)

It's focus is on being a Halfling Chef, but it is an outline that uses sword and shield as a barbarian, and uses the Lucky Feat combined with the Undying ability at level 11 to just be awesome.

There is a lot you could move around in it. I think you could even do Str+Heavy armor without interfering with any of the Barbarian stuff outside of Unarmored Defense

[Ralanr]

I did a write-up on a Dex Barbarian as a tank. (http://www.reddit.com/r/dndnext/comments/2ji303/the_class_is_a_lie_the_lil_chef/)

It's focus is on being a Halfling Chef, but it is an outline that uses sword and shield as a barbarian, and uses the Lucky Feat combined with the Undying ability at level 11 to just be awesome.

There is a lot you could move around in it. I think you could even do Str+Heavy armor without interfering with any of the Barbarian stuff outside of Unarmored Defense

Raging in heavy armor denies the following:
Advantage on Strength checks and strength saving throws.
The bonus rage damage
The slashing, bludgeoning, and piercing resistance.

[Shakart]

I thought of multiclass with fighter, but not worth more lvl up to 13. With half plate arrived in 17 AC, then my idea is to use shield and axe for tanking (19 AC) and THW use when I want more damage.
As a barbarian full dex did not convince me, I could not use atack reckless and would lose the bonus damage from rage. In situations where damage is needed is good

[edge2054]

I like barbarian/rogue with shield master and sentinel. Use medium armor, a short sword, and a shield.

Some control, decent damage, good damage reduction, decent ac, good saves, ability to punish when ignored, and excellent mobility.

[Ralanr]

To me just get good Con, Dex and a shield and you should be fine AC wise without any armor. Course I could be wrong, I'm only looking at paper.

And paper is a flimsy thing.

[Krymoar]

I thought of multiclass with fighter, but not worth more lvl up to 13. With half plate arrived in 17 AC, then my idea is to use shield and axe for tanking (19 AC) and THW use when I want more damage.
As a barbarian full dex did not convince me, I could not use atack reckless and would lose the bonus damage from rage. In situations where damage is needed is good

As Ralanr pointed out, wearing heavy armor takes away some rage abilities, even though Bear 3 overrides one of them by still giving you the damage resistance.

Dex and Con with a shield offers up AC 24 AC with your capstone. 22 if you want to be a two weapon fighter.

Str would be fine so you can use axes, but you will take the missing advantages of heavy armor and won't reach the same AC Levels.

[Ralanr]

As Ralanr pointed out, wearing heavy armor takes away some rage abilities, even though Bear 3 overrides one of them by still giving you the damage resistance.



Are you sure bear overrides that?

[Felvion]

I'm currently playing a lvl7 (started playing him at lvl 6) barbarian and he's tanky as hell. I have 16 on Str and Con and a 14 of Dex. With a shield I have 17 AC which is nice but to be honest I rarely care for my AC. My Hp maximum is 81 and while in rage (always be in rage when needed) my actual Hp are 162!
I also took the resiliest feat and applied it to my wisdom saves. Add to all these adv in dexterity saves vs stuff you can see and this left Cha and Int saves to be my only weak spot. Thats why (amongst other things) i took the feat lucky since i'm human. Well i'm always the last man standing in my party.
To be honest last session, I got some angry looks from my dm since i could easily withstand all the incoming damage from 2 different encounters that were designed to be fought individually according to our level!

In case you want a tank that never dies the bearbarian will be fine. The Lucky feat will help a lot for these times your dm will try to hit you on your dump saves.

On the other hand, if by the term tank you mean someone that can protect your party while still taking quite some damage (like those found in MMORPGs) i'd recommend something different.
The only good moves a barbarian can offer teamwise are lots of grapples (with advantage) ,which shouldn't be underestimated, or the wolf stuff which is nice if there is quite a large party to take advantage of you.
A paladin offers great aoe protective auras, superb saves, decent healing and spells, nice mount stuff and is quite tanky himself due to heavy armor+shield proficiency.
Shield master feat and protection fighting style are always noce to a tank of any sort.
Also you will easily find some sentinel related threads for controlling people but i think the feat is a bit overrated due to 3.5 bias.

[silveralen]

Are you sure bear overrides that?

Bear totem lacks any language to prevent it from reducing damage while in heavy armor, unlike normal rage. It also states that it grants resistance to all damage but psychic while raging (including S/P/B) not that it adds additional types to the set barbarian already resists. Compare to eagle, right below it, which does mention losing the effect in heavy armor, and wolf below that which doesn't mention losing the fearure in heavy armor. RAW, bear barbarian gets damage resistance even in heavy armor, and it seems to be intentional given that one totem feature specifically mentions having no effect in heavy DM.

It's open to the DM, but considering heavy armor still has drawbacks and is only available via multi classing or feats it seems reasonable.


Also you will easily find some sentinel related threads for controlling people but i think the feat is a bit overrated due to 3.5 bias.

Yeah, I have to agree. With only on reaction sentinel isn't going to do a lot per turn control wise, and it's not going to grant you a ton of extra attacks considering most melee mobs will likely swarm you, entering your reach in the same turn. Preventing disengage is decent, as is reaction attacks if they target others, but it's still a max of one attack, which isn't big damage or a huge deterrent.

I'd say it gets so much hype from people trying to remake the tripping warrior 3.x builds, 4th edition players who want that version of lockdown fighter, or 4th edition players who learned off round attacks were the key to high damage. The latter is the only reason I'd look at it personally.

[edge2054]

Sentinel allows for extra sneak attacks. Hence the barb/rogue build mentioned above. Shield master also has great control and defense when paired with a barb rogue.

The issue I see with low ac barb tanks is healing. I heal for a barb on my cleric and I'd much prefer an ac tank over a soak tank. Of course, a high ac soak tank is the best of both worlds.

[Shakart]

My idea for my character is this: it is a half-orc warrior Totem Barbarian (Bear) and lvl 4. With 16 Str and Cons / 14 Dex / 10 Int and Wis / 8 Char. Half-Plate which would come with 17 AC, then shield and battleaxe for times that need tanking 19 AC, at times it is necessary to do much damage I would use the Greataxe. Already the maul does more damage per share but prefer to roleplay axes. Since I think role-play as a hard piece of meat that gets between hacking away at enemies while resisting much damage LOLOLOL
At lvl 4 I would like to choose Great feat master weapon to do more damage, but I also like feats:

-Shield Master / Resilient / Tough (for tanking and Saves)

-Lucky (For saves and relentless rage, attacks and also check)

-Sentinel / Polearm Master (together create great control area) THW: Halberd



I do not like the idea of ​​being a barbarian because full Dex to render would need to use a finesse weapon and that is appropriate Shortsword or Rapier. Also you can not use the fury damage nor recklesss atack. And see a rapier fighting barbarian who does not have the strength to lift a cart is really demoralizing LOL. I admit that I would come to have incredible AC, but it is also important to follow the style and roleplaying for each class. Because like it or not is a role-playing game :D

Opinion pls

[edge2054]

A shortsword works with both barbarian abilities and rogue abilities. The finesse property of the weapon lets it work with sneak attack. The fact that you can still use strength lets it work with barbarian.

Basically you do something like...

Str 16, Dex 14, Con 14 and dump the rest.

Wearing Breastplate and a Shield you get 14 + 2 (dex) + 2 (shield) for 18 AC.

At level 10 the build looks like this.

1-5 Barbarian, bear totem, shield master feat at level 4.

5-10 Rogue, archetype really doesn't matter, sentinel feat at level 9.

At level 10 you have.

3 rages per day, danger sense, reckless attack, extra attack, fast movement, +2 damage while raging, expertise (athletics), sneak attack +3d6, cunning action, uncanny dodge.

With a non-magical shortsword you swing twice with +7 to hit and deal 1d6 + 5 damage while raging. If you knock the target prone first (athletics roll at +11 and with advantage) you have advantage on both of these attacks and the first one deals 3d6 additional damage. If someone hits a nearby ally you get a reaction hit from sentinel at +7 to hit that deals 4d6 + 5 damage while raging. If they hit you instead you can use your reaction to reduce the damage in half, which stacks with Bear damage reduction (so you take 1/4).

If you go human instead of half-orc, you can add 1 to all of the numbers above as you'll need one less feat and will have 18 strength sooner.

Anyway, just wanted to point out that Barb/Rogue does work and how it works.

For the playstyle you seem to be drawn too I think Polearm Master would work best. Tank via control rather than mitigation and punishment.