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CyberThread
2014-11-06, 03:55 PM
Hi folks, this was going to be just a refluff, but found nothing really to refluff that really fit the theme of what I was writing. So I decided to just take the opportunity to write an entire new subclass, that revolves around the karsite race of 3.5 and the forsaker prc of 3.0.

So, I make no promise on the balance of this choice. It does take some of the champion archtypes of simplicity, but the raw power that the eldritch knight gets with access to spells, I am creating this choice fitting the anti-magic item 5e phase, but leaving open potential growth that edition glut may give us.



KARSITE FORSAKER


Fighter, 3,7,10,15,18


3rd

Spell Resistance: Gain Advantage against two schools of magic.
Fast Healing: Gain (1/5 character level rounded down, for at least 1) point of healing per round, up to (3* per character level ) points per long rest.
Forsake Magic: Canít use magic or magic items, Be it benign or harmful. Healing magic used on you, only does ľ of effect.

7th:

Magic Inquisition:
Chose one of these abilities. You may not chose the same ability twice.
Magic Drain: Melee strike a target, and drain a creature of all magical items it may wear for three turns. Your next melee attack harnesses the stolen energy into a paladins smite ability. May be used once per short rest.
Magic Drinker:Spells resisted heal the Karsite Forsaker for 2 HP.
Magic Denyer: Prevent the target on a melee strike from using any magical spells or abilities until the end of your next turn. Any ongoing spells or spells requiring concentration automatically fail or dispel. Once per long rest.

Spell Resistance: Gain advantage against one additional school of magic.


10th

Magic Inquisition:
Chose one of these abilities. You may not chose the same ability twice.

Natural Advantage: Your will and hate towards magical beings and those that wield magic has lead you down a focused path. Weapons you wield are considered magical for the sake of damage resistance. Spells such as detect magic will not show the weapons while in the warriors hands to be magical.

Spell resistance mastery: Gain Immunity to a previously chosen spell school, or gain another spell school you gain advantage against.

15th: Gain damage resistance against magical weapons.

18th:
Magic Inquisitor: You may use an ability twice before the needed rest requirement, or heal 5 HP per resisted spell.
Spell resistance mastery: Gain Immunity to a previously chosen spell school, or gain another spell school you gain advantage against.

Z3ro
2014-11-06, 04:10 PM
When I first read the thread title, I thought it was "karate forsaker" and imagined a character shunning martial arts, and was excited and intrigued. Anyway...

Not sure what you mean with this ability


15th: Gain advantage against magical weapon attacks.


How would this work? Is it effectivly disadvantage when someone attacks you with a magic weapon? Or is it something else; there really isn't a "defensive advantage" mechanic that I'm aware of.

Easy_Lee
2014-11-06, 04:11 PM
How would this work? Is it effectivly disadvantage when someone attacks you with a magic weapon? Or is it something else; there really isn't a "defensive advantage" mechanic that I'm aware of.

Regarding this, resistance might work better.

CyberThread
2014-11-06, 04:16 PM
rephrased it, thank you for the input.



Also as for, what you imagined, Karsites, are from 3.5 a race that is anti-thetical to the magic of the world. Unable to even use it.

Forsakers were a badly made 3.0 class, that rejected magic and magic items, due to some sort of tragedy in the past.

So I combined the two :)

Easy_Lee
2014-11-06, 04:31 PM
I like it. The balance would depend on the campaign, but taking away magic items is such a huge penalty that I think we can safely say it's not OP.

Do you imagine this as an archetype or a variant fighter? It strikes me as a custom archetype limited to one race.

CyberThread
2014-11-06, 04:36 PM
I like it. The balance would depend on the campaign, but taking away magic items is such a huge penalty that I think we can safely say it's not OP.

Do you imagine this as an archetype or a variant fighter? It strikes me as a custom archetype limited to one race.


archetype, if you remember karsite, had an optional easy to add rule, that made it a template also, not just a race.

Zweisteine
2014-11-06, 05:49 PM
First off, this belongs in the homebrew forum.

Second, please try to write abilities formally, as if they came from a book. It makes them far easier to understand and use. (Example, using your spell resistance ability: "Select two schools of magic. You gain...")

And did you grant three separate abilities at level 1?

Review-y stuff for the abilities, in order:

Spell Resistance: Gain Advantage against two schools of magic.
Spell Resistance: Poorly worded. What do you gain advantage on? I presume saves, but that should be made clear.


Fast Healing: Gain (1/5 character level rounded down, for at least 1) point of healing per round, up to (3* per character level ) points per long rest.
This could easily be misread as insanely powerful. It sounds like you are trying to give 3HP/level healing per rest, but it is hard to discern that. And what happens if you have less than a fifth of your level in damage?
Also, I suggest replacing "character level" with " fighter level." 5e keys nearly all abilities off of individual classes (the only really notable exception being spell slots).


Forsake Magic: Canít use magic or magic items, Be it benign or harmful. Healing magic used on you, only does ľ of effect.
While not as bad as it would have been in 3.5e, taking away magic items is bad. And does the healing round up or down?

[/quote]Magic Inquisition:
Chose one of these abilities. You may not chose the same ability twice.[/quote]
How would you be able to gain more than one? You only ever have the one opportunity to take one. (Also applies later on.)


Magic Drain: Melee strike a target, and drain a creature of all magical items it may wear for three turns. Your next melee attack harnesses the stolen energy into a paladins smite ability. May be used once per short rest.
What does this mean? It's a bit unclear, and seems to allow no defenses against the item drainage. Does this also deal weapon damage? And what does it mean to "harness the stolen energy into a paladins smite ability"?
(Also, "melee strike" is not a thing.)


Magic Drinker:Spells resisted heal the Karsite Forsaker for 2 HP.
What does "spells resisted" mean? Any spell you succeed on a save against?

And 2 HP is trivial even at level 7.


Magic Denyer: Prevent the target on a melee strike from using any magical spells or abilities until the end of your next turn. Any ongoing spells or spells requiring concentration automatically fail or dispel. Once per long rest.
This looks like it is meant use an attack to prevent the target for casting for a round, but the wording is somewhat vague. I would suggest also giving this a save of some sort, at least for spells the target is concentrating on (or are just passively present).


Spell Resistance: Gain advantage against one additional school of magic.

Your bolding is backwards here.
The same comment as I gave for the earlier spell resistance ability applies here.


Natural Advantage: Your will and hate towards magical beings and those that wield magic has allowed you to fight it on equal footing. Weapons you wield count as magical for the purpose of overcoming resistance and immunity to nonmagical attacks and damage.
This one is simple, and seems balanced, though I modified the wording in the quote above (it now matches the phrasing used by monks).


Spell resistance mastery: Gain Immunity to a previously chosen spell school, or gain another spell school you gain advantage against.
This is quite overpowered. No published class ever gains complete immunity to a single type of damage, let alone an entire school of spells. I would suggest making this match the abjurer's advantage on all saves against spells and resistance to damage from spells (copy the wording).
Also, a better name might be "Improved/Greater/Superior Spell Resistance."


15th: You gain resistance against damage dealt by magical weapons.
What, no name for this ability?
I can't decide if this is overpowered or not, because I don't know how many high-level opponents will wield magic weapons.


Magic Inquisitor: You may use an ability twice before the needed rest requirement, or heal 5 HP per resisted spell.
This needs to specify which abilities, and probably needs better phrasing (not that other things don't). And does this grant two related ability upgrades, or does it make you choose (probably should read "and")?


Spell resistance mastery: Gain Immunity to a previously chosen spell school, or gain another spell school you gain advantage against.
I suggest removing this as part of my previous comment on Spell Reistance Mastery.

CyberThread
2014-11-06, 06:28 PM
Thank you for going through it so much.

I will have to go through your statements besides editing later tonight.

Yes the concept is hard to balance due to what is involved. As for reducing the power of the school immunities. I will look into it. This person should eventually act as if they are a walking anti magic field by level 18.

rlc
2014-11-06, 06:51 PM
And does the healing round up or down?


down, just like everything else.
"There's one more general rule you need to know at the outset. Whenever you divide a number in the game, round down if you end up with a fraction, even if the fraction is one-half or greater."

Castaras
2014-11-08, 06:52 AM
Mod of the Apocalypse: Moved to Homebrew Design.