Spelljammer!!!!

[JoeJ]

According to this article (http://www.enworld.org/forum/content.php?2032-Two-D-D-Stories-A-Year#.VF6OS4clxig) at EN World, Spelljammer "isn't at the front of the line, but it is in line."

That's all. If you need me I'll be in the corner doing my happy dance. :)

[pwykersotz]

I never played Spelljammer, but this makes me super happy too. Here's hoping that Planescape is also in line.

[Shadow]

I never played Spelljammer, but this makes me super happy too. Here's hoping that Planescape is also in line.

from the thread/article:
" Mearls mentioned in his Reddit AMA that Planescape and Eberron were both "on the radar," "

[HorridElemental]

Spelljammer x Darksun crossover worlds are the best...

[Greylind]

from the thread/article:
" Mearls mentioned in his Reddit AMA that Planescape and Eberron were both "on the radar," "

I've modified Golarian on-the-fly to fit with 5E, looking forward to including spelljamming, planewalking, and strange alternate worlds into the long-term prospects.

[Yorrin]

The AMA had a lot of other interesting goodies:

Warforged and Kender will not be in DMG due to page count, but will be made available soon-ish.
Mass Combat Rules are still being playtested and will not be in the DMG.
Artificer is planned to come out with Eberron whenever they get them both working.

One of the more interesting quotes:

I'll give you an example of a theoretical expansion.

Let's say we wanted to do psionics. We'd tie that to a campaign you can play, maybe one centered on mind flayers or a similar foe.

The psionic sourcebook would be the player's companion to the DM's mind flayer campaign. The sourcebook would have all the info for creating psionic characters, along with world material for players who are creating characters for the mind flayer campaign. The player's book might also have a chapter written from an in-world perspective on psionics and psionic monsters, the kind of information that a character might have access to or have heard.

You can expect us to do one or two such products a year, to give people enough time to play through a campaign without overwhelming them with new options.

[silveralen]

I never played Spelljammer, but this makes me super happy too. Here's hoping that Planescape is also in line.

I noticed sigil got a shout out in the PHB, it kinda made me hopeful for something from there :smallsmile:

Sigil would fit easily as one of these pre-packaged campaigns+options even if wasn't a full setting at least.

[Inevitability]

I've never played spelljammer, so I guess that'd put me in the category of people whose knowledge of the setting is limited to GIANT SPACE HAMSTAAAAARS. Still, I'm interested.

Although I hope they'll be bringing Dark Sun back, too. At least give us playable Thri-Kreen.

[silveralen]

Although I hope they'll be bringing Dark Sun back, too. At least give us playable Thri-Kreen.

Seriously, I love Dark Sun. I even liked what they did with it in 4e, and the epic destinies and background system got me back into DnD and away from PF for a time. IF the bring it back, I will buy every single book vaguely related to it.

Of course, the problem is it really needs psionics... which could be an issue if psionic rules are in a player guide for a campaign about mindflayers, as that sort of interdependence is what they seem to be moving away from. Which is a problem I'm starting to see with the current system, some things are universal enough to need to be in multiple settings, but weren't universal enough to be in the big three.

[mr_odd]

The AMA had a lot of other interesting goodies:

Warforged and Kender will not be in DMG due to page count, but will be made available soon-ish.
Mass Combat Rules are still being playtested and will not be in the DMG.
Artificer is planned to come out with Eberron whenever they get them both working.

One of the more interesting quotes:

Warforged got cut? I thought they had been confirmed?

[Gnomes2169]

Warforged got cut? I thought they had been confirmed?

They were confirmed almost a year before the DMG's release date... Some of the confirmed things since then have been cut to give room in the DMG.

[Nargrakhan]

+1 for Dark Sun. Also +9001 for Ravenloft.

I love the grimdark settings. :smallsmile:

[mr_odd]

They were confirmed almost a year before the DMG's release date... Some of the confirmed things since then have been cut to give room in the DMG.

Well, I guess I'll just have to make my own until they give an official standard for them.

[Person_Man]

I, for one, welcome are new Giff overlords.

[silveralen]

Well, I guess I'll just have to make my own until they give an official standard for them.

Could just start with the playtest version. The last playtest packet I saw had races very similar to the final release.

[MaxWilson]

I've never played spelljammer, so I guess that'd put me in the category of people whose knowledge of the setting is limited to GIANT SPACE HAMSTAAAAARS. Still, I'm interested.

Although I hope they'll be bringing Dark Sun back, too. At least give us playable Thri-Kreen.

What you need to know about Spelljammer: somebody at TSR sat down and said, "What if we take this whole fantasy-physics thing seriously? What if D&D really isn't like Earth, not just because of magic?" According to Spelljammer, gravity is binary (either you have exactly 1g like Earth or you have nothing), stars are not fiery balls of gas burning billions of miles away but only pinpricks of light in the firmament, and solar systems are contained within giant crystal shells outside of which flows phlogiston. Some planets float in space like ours, supported by nothing, others are carried on the backs of giant turtles or humanoids. One planet (Falx) is populated entirely by creatures which look exactly like the Tarrasque and are presumably members of the same species.

Mind flayers are still lawful evil, but you can sit down and have a drink with one and maybe do some business. Beholders roam the spaceways in giant stony spaceships captained by beholder hive-queens and overseers; beholders mostly concern themselves with racial purity and killing other beholders who have a different skin texture or color or a different number of eyestalks or eyestalk powers. Everybody hates neogi slavers and their umber hulk slaves. The Imperial Elvish Navy is a universal Elven fleet, vaguely remiscent of the Napoleonic-era British fleet, which maintains loose contact with ground-based elven powers on Toril and Greyhawk but concerns itself primarily with maintaining IEN territorial integrity and developing bioweapons. Lurking in the shadows are the Scro, a race of hyper-intelligent orc-descendants who have turned their backs on orcish culture because they were tired of losing; Scro are just as warlike as orcs but a whole lot more disciplined and strategic, and they are itching for a rematch of the First Unhuman War, which their ancestors lost to the elves. (Actually, hmmm, I need to bring Scro into 5E.)

That's Spelljammer, and it rocks.

[JAL_1138]

from the thread/article:
" Mearls mentioned in his Reddit AMA that Planescape and Eberron were both "on the radar," "

I hope they bring back the factions in Sigil. Then again, the resulting rage from everyone that liked the Faction War stuff would be through the roof...


--Something else about Spelljammer, Krynnish tinker-gnomes got a lot more dangerous. Yes, they're responsible for the infamous Giant Space Hamsters, but free from the influence of Krynn's gods, all their harebrained inventions actually work instead of just exploding, and they're all completely [expletive deleted] insane and frequently horrifyingly lethal.

[JoeJ]

--Something else about Spelljammer, Krynnish tinker-gnomes got a lot more dangerous. Yes, they're responsible for the infamous Giant Space Hamsters, but free from the influence of Krynn's gods, all their harebrained inventions actually work instead of just exploding, and they're all completely [expletive deleted] insane and frequently horrifyingly lethal.

It also contains the only thing in the multiverse cooler than fantasy pirates - fantasy space pirates. And it's the only setting where you can walk into a bar past a pair of mind flayers smoking a water pipe, to find that the bartender is an outcast beholder named Large Luigi.

There are space whales, flying pyramids crewed by the undead, planet killing weapons left over from the last war between elves and goblinoids, ancient thri-kreen religions, and 9 foot tall anthropomorphic hippos who dress in colorful uniforms and like to blow things up. And one of the first published adventures involves trying to stop what is essentially a beholder Death Star. It's completely over the top, insane, and wonderful.

[MaxWilson]

And it's the only setting where you can walk into a bar past a pair of mind flayers smoking a water pipe, to find that the bartender is an outcast beholder named Large Luigi.

The cosmopolitan nature of Spelljammer seems likely to have influenced the cosmopolitan flavor of Planescape. In some ways, Planescape is Spelljammer-sans-weird-physics for traditionalists. If you like the one it is possible you might like the other.


There are space whales, flying pyramids crewed by the undead, planet killing weapons left over from the last war between elves and goblinoids, ancient thri-kreen religions, and 9 foot tall anthropomorphic hippos who dress in colorful uniforms and like to blow things up. And one of the first published adventures involves trying to stop what is essentially a beholder Death Star. It's completely over the top, insane, and wonderful.

The best thing about the giff is that here you have a race of extremely strong creatures who are fascinated by a weapon technology which absolutely fails to leverage their strength at all. They've racially gimped themselves for role-playing reasons. It's awesome.

[JAL_1138]

The cosmopolitan nature of Spelljammer seems likely to have influenced the cosmopolitan flavor of Planescape. In some ways, Planescape is Spelljammer-sans-weird-physics for traditionalists. If you like the one it is possible you might like the other.

They can even fit together with a bit of work, since Planescape largely ignores the Prime Material and Spelljammer largely ignores the afterlife. Portals are only so large, and are often hard to access and unreliable, so for Primes it makes sense to move cargo, armies, and colonists from one world to another through the phlogiston instead of detouring through the Outer Planes. It's probably best not to mix them in one campaign, though.

Edit: At least not at the same time. It's hard to square the factions with the interstellar (interspherical?) empires, and the tech levels can be at odds. But that can still work, there's not much to outright stop it. Both settings are so marvelously, relentlessly weird and full of whimsy and grit at the same time that pretty much anything can fit.

[JoeJ]

The cosmopolitan nature of Spelljammer seems likely to have influenced the cosmopolitan flavor of Planescape. In some ways, Planescape is Spelljammer-sans-weird-physics for traditionalists. If you like the one it is possible you might like the other.

Planescape is on my short list of things to check out as soon as my reading backlog shrinks a bit (there's a lot of reading in grad. school), assuming I can find a copy of the boxed set that isn't hideously expensive.

[JAL_1138]

Planescape is on my short list of things to check out as soon as my reading backlog shrinks a bit (there's a lot of reading in grad. school), assuming I can find a copy of the boxed set that isn't hideously expensive.

The box sets are on the pricey side, and WotC sadly doesn't have the "Planescape Campaign Setting" box up as a pdf on dndclassics. Check NobleKnight, ebay, and Amazon, but $70-80 is around average. For stuff like Planes of Conflict and Planes of Law, the boxes are insanely expensive, but dndclassics does have those as pdfs.

[silveralen]

Of course, planescape: torment is always an option to introduce you to the setting. You don't get quite as much of an overview, but it really captures the... sheer oddness of a planescape campaign. It's also one of the best DnD computer games ever released, as well as almost always ranking as one of the top RPG's of all time.

[JAL_1138]

Of course, planescape: torment is always an option to introduce you to the setting. You don't get quite as much of an overview, but it really captures the... sheer oddness of a planescape campaign. It's also one of the best DnD computer games ever released, as well as almost always ranking as one of the top RPG's of all time.

Put it this way: You've got one of the most gut-wrenching and tragic explorations of mortality, reincarnation, and morality in all of gaming...and Homer Simpson voicing a rogue modron. :smallbiggrin:

[Eldan]

I hope they bring back the factions in Sigil. Then again, the resulting rage from everyone that liked the Faction War stuff would be through the roof...

Go the Planewalker route. "The Factions are banned from Sigil officially. They are still very powerful out on the Planes, they still have all the strongholds. And they are constantly trying to get back in."

Plus, it is a perfect opportunity to bring something new and interesting to the setting. New factions. Someone has to take control of Sigil, after all.

[JAL_1138]

Go the Planewalker route. "The Factions are banned from Sigil officially. They are still very powerful out on the Planes, they still have all the strongholds. And they are constantly trying to get back in."

Plus, it is a perfect opportunity to bring something new and interesting to the setting. New factions. Someone has to take control of Sigil, after all.

As long as they don't try to stat the Lady. Her only stats are "YOU LOSE." :smalltongue:

[Eldan]

No, they aren't. She can be tricked in several ways, and has been before. Her stats are "You don't know". Important distinction.

[silveralen]

No, they aren't. She can be tricked in several ways, and has been before. Her stats are "You don't know". Important distinction.

I think he meant that "you lose" if you fight her. Which is more or less true. Going around her is another matter entirely.

[Eldan]

I think the important thing is that everything about her is enigmatic. We're not thought to fight her. Or even encounter her, ever. She's just there so the world can exist.

But if the DM thinks the players should fight her? There's also nothing saying she doesn't have a weakness no one has discovered yet. Or a long list of things she can't do anything about.

[Inevitability]

What you need to know about Spelljammer: somebody at TSR sat down and said, "What if we take this whole fantasy-physics thing seriously? What if D&D really isn't like Earth, not just because of magic?" According to Spelljammer, gravity is binary (either you have exactly 1g like Earth or you have nothing), stars are not fiery balls of gas burning billions of miles away but only pinpricks of light in the firmament, and solar systems are contained within giant crystal shells outside of which flows phlogiston. Some planets float in space like ours, supported by nothing, others are carried on the backs of giant turtles or humanoids. One planet (Falx) is populated entirely by creatures which look exactly like the Tarrasque and are presumably members of the same species.

Mind flayers are still lawful evil, but you can sit down and have a drink with one and maybe do some business. Beholders roam the spaceways in giant stony spaceships captained by beholder hive-queens and overseers; beholders mostly concern themselves with racial purity and killing other beholders who have a different skin texture or color or a different number of eyestalks or eyestalk powers. Everybody hates neogi slavers and their umber hulk slaves. The Imperial Elvish Navy is a universal Elven fleet, vaguely remiscent of the Napoleonic-era British fleet, which maintains loose contact with ground-based elven powers on Toril and Greyhawk but concerns itself primarily with maintaining IEN territorial integrity and developing bioweapons. Lurking in the shadows are the Scro, a race of hyper-intelligent orc-descendants who have turned their backs on orcish culture because they were tired of losing; Scro are just as warlike as orcs but a whole lot more disciplined and strategic, and they are itching for a rematch of the First Unhuman War, which their ancestors lost to the elves. (Actually, hmmm, I need to bring Scro into 5E.)

That's Spelljammer, and it rocks.

Consider me converted to the Great Church of Spelljammer. :smalltongue:

No, seriously; a planet full of Tarrasques? I want this. Now to convince my players that we should try a game of spelljammer...

[MaxWilson]

Consider me converted to the Great Church of Spelljammer. :smalltongue:

No, seriously; a planet full of Tarrasques? I want this. Now to convince my players that we should try a game of spelljammer...

Full transparency: Falx is briefly described in a one- or two-paragraph blurb in Practical Planetology, nothing more, so while Spelljammer gives you the framework and scope for this kind of awesome, your DM will still have to come up with appropriate details himself.

If it were me DMing, the encounter would probably go something like this:

Players: we fly the ship around until we see a Tarrasque in an open area. Then we Feather Fall to the ground, prepare our Phantom Steeds, and commence kiting it to death with magic arrows.
Me: All right. The Tarrasque roars with rage and begins to pursue you, but you fall back and continue pelting him with arrows. Over the next two minutes he takes 300 HP of damage. Then suddenly, he stops abruptly, sniffs at the air a couple of times, and commences running in the opposite direction. You notice that the sand you are travelling over feels loose and shifty, and the ground is trembling slightly. What do you do?

One minute later: http://fc07.deviantart.net/fs71/i/2012/354/f/8/dune_sandworm_3_by_ollycb-d5okzfo.jpg

[pwykersotz]

Full transparency: Falx is briefly described in a one- or two-paragraph blurb in Practical Planetology, nothing more, so while Spelljammer gives you the framework and scope for this kind of awesome, your DM will still have to come up with appropriate details himself.

If it were me DMing, the encounter would probably go something like this:

Players: we fly the ship around until we see a Tarrasque in an open area. Then we Feather Fall to the ground, prepare our Phantom Steeds, and commence kiting it to death with magic arrows.
Me: All right. The Tarrasque roars with rage and begins to pursue you, but you fall back and continue pelting him with arrows. Over the next two minutes he takes 300 HP of damage. Then suddenly, he stops abruptly, sniffs at the air a couple of times, and commences running in the opposite direction. You notice that the sand you are travelling over feels loose and shifty, and the ground is trembling slightly. What do you do?

One minute later: http://fc07.deviantart.net/fs71/i/2012/354/f/8/dune_sandworm_3_by_ollycb-d5okzfo.jpg

Alternately:

http://b0.raptrcdn.com/img/screenshots/orig/09c8aa57de86a7494c9166ea1611a9c9.f57a8d95ab2788308 637b2113c1efddb.jpeg

:smallbiggrin:

[JAL_1138]

Alternately:

http://b0.raptrcdn.com/img/screenshots/orig/09c8aa57de86a7494c9166ea1611a9c9.f57a8d95ab2788308 637b2113c1efddb.jpeg

:smallbiggrin:

You know, now that you mention it...elves = asari, giff = turians, scro or beholders = krogan or batarians, tinker gnomes = salarian or quarian, mind flayers are sort of collector-ish because of the whole kidnapping populations thing...there's races I'm forgetting since it's been years, I'm sure there's some that match up even better....but you could easily, easily run a fantasy version of Mass Effect with the serial numbers filed off in Spelljammer.

[rlc]

Warforged got cut? I thought they had been confirmed?

yeah, it seems weird that a confirmed race got cut from the book when, according to this thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?383087-DMG-Excerpt-How-to-create-new-races-*faints*), some unconfirmed ones are in.

[Shadow]

yeah, it seems weird that a confirmed race got cut from the book when, according to this thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?383087-DMG-Excerpt-How-to-create-new-races-*faints*), some unconfirmed ones are in.

Well, to be fair, the only "confirmation" that we ever recieved about warforged and kender being in the DMG came during interviews from a couple of months ago. He never said that those were the only ones, nor was it an official announcement. So when page restrictions force them to make changes, that unofficial announcement basically goes out the window.

It was never an official confirmation. It was an unofficial statement that was true at that time it was made.

[rlc]

i guess that's true and i don't care about either warforged or kender specifically, but i'd rather have something that was at least mentioned than something that wasn't, based on principle alone.

[Tenmujiin]

i guess that's true and i don't care about either warforged or kender specifically, but i'd rather have something that was at least mentioned than something that wasn't, based on principle alone.

Both warforged and kender were originally campaign specific (eberron and dragonlance respectively) while Eladrin and Asimar are basically to fey and celestials what tieflings are to fiends (and honestly should have been in the PHB)

[mr_odd]

Both warforged and kender were originally campaign specific (eberron and dragonlance respectively) while Eladrin and Asimar are basically to fey and celestials what tieflings are to fiends (and honestly should have been in the PHB)

I wouldn't say that they should have been in the PHB (we have a good amount of options), but I am excited to see that they are linking classes/races with settings/adventure paths.

[rlc]

Both warforged and kender were originally campaign specific (eberron and dragonlance respectively) while Eladrin and Asimar are basically to fey and celestials what tieflings are to fiends (and honestly should have been in the PHB)

that's all well and good, but like i said, they're taking out confirmed things in favor of unconfirmed things.

[Tenmujiin]

that's all well and good, but like i said, they're taking out confirmed things in favor of unconfirmed things.

I see it as them taking out things that will be in campaign specific manuals in favor of more general ones that likely wouldn't otherwise be put into an official book.

[silveralen]

I see it as them taking out things that will be in campaign specific manuals in favor of more general ones that likely wouldn't otherwise be put into an official book.

Though the question in that case is why did they orginally plan to include them in the DMG rather than said books?

The most likely reason I can think of is they didn't orginally plan to have actually full setting books for dragonlance/eberron, and the intial salea/popularity of this edition changed their minds. Which would bode well for 5e overall.

[mr_odd]

Though the question in that case is why did they orginally plan to include them in the DMG rather than said books?

The most likely reason I can think of is they didn't orginally plan to have actually full setting books for dragonlance/eberron, and the intial salea/popularity of this edition changed their minds. Which would bode well for 5e overall.

Yeah, this could be a very good thing for us and 5e rather than what was supposed to happen.