Monk Vows?

[Extra Anchovies]

Are any of them worth taking? Poverty, Peace, Chains, and Celibacy are all massive self-nerfs, but the others don't seem to challenging to maintain, provided your DM isn't of the sort to make the paladin fall/force you to violate your vows/etc for their own amusement. Cleanliness is fine; get a hireling to loot bodies for you, and carry a weapon to fight undead with. Fasting is easy enough as long as your party doesn't have an Alchemist, because who uses potions anyways? Truth is hardly a limitation at all, since you can always remain silent rather than speak a lie, and Silence is rather easily overcome (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/wondrous-items/wondrous-items/h-l/helm-of-telepathy). Between the four, that's 14 bonus ki points - more than enough, so any one of them (probably Fasting) could be easily dropped.

What do you all think?

[Psyren]

Chains is not as bad as you're letting on. -1 attack and -10 speed is not going to break the bank past low levels. I consider it a worthwhile trade for +6 ki.

Other than that, yeah your assessent is about right. Truth is the easiest one to live with (most lawful characters do this anyway), Silence is easily bypassed and Fasting, in addition to not mattering without an alchemist, doesn't actually prevent you from benefiting from potions if the party pours them down your throat while unconscious, which can save you in negatives.

[Extra Anchovies]

Chains is not as bad as you're letting on. -1 attack and -10 speed is not going to break the bank past low levels. I consider it a worthwhile trade for +6 ki.

Other than that, yeah your assessment is about right. Truth is the easiest one to live with (most lawful characters do this anyway), Silence is easily bypassed and Fasting, in addition to not mattering without an alchemist, doesn't actually prevent you from benefiting from potions if the party pours them down your throat while unconscious, which can save you in negatives.

Hm. That's an interesting nuance of Fasting, didn't realize that aspect of it. And you're right about chains; I read it as reduces speed to 10 feet, which would be pretty bad, but taking -10 to speed is nothing when, as a monk class feature, you're already getting +60 — your speed penalty is offset by 3rd level, and it only goes up from there.

[Psyren]

The key is the line: "If a monk knowingly and willingly breaks his vow..." If you're unconscious, then you're neither of those things, so the party can save you.

(Well, I suppose you might be considered willing, but that's a different matter.)

[Dappershire]

Plus, Vow of Chains is just awesome with fluff. I'd take it just for that aspect alone. Who wants to play maxed anyways?

[Extra Anchovies]

Plus, Vow of Chains is just awesome with fluff. I'd take it just for that aspect alone. Who wants to play maxed anyways?

Indeed. But the bonus ki is really nice... with the above vow-stacking (truth/silence/cleanliness/fasting/chains), a monk would get 20 extra ki by 20th level, for a grand total of 30+Wis... I like. Now to find some good Qinggong abilities to spam with all of my ki.

[Psyren]

If you have excess ki, Cold Ice Strike + Scorching Ray = up to 26d6 per round for 5 ki at level 14, 30 ft. away.

Combine with Drunken Master and you can replenish your ki by getting sloshed.

[Erik Vale]

If you have excess ki, Cold Ice Strike + Scorching Ray = up to 26d6 per round for 5 ki at level 14, 30 ft. away.

Combine with Drunken Master and you can replenish your ki by getting sloshed.

Which however, doesn't work with Fasting.

[Drelua]

If you have excess ki, Cold Ice Strike + Scorching Ray = up to 26d6 per round for 5 ki at level 14, 30 ft. away.

Combine with Drunken Master and you can replenish your ki by getting sloshed.

Don't forget a ring of ki mastery. Store two ki points in it, which last indefinitely, and all your ki powers cost 1 less, to a minimum of one.

Honestly though, I never bother with any of the vows. Some of them are worth it mechanically, but they almost all get really silly. Fasting is the most reasonable to me, and truth is okay, but they usually go way too far, to a point where they get ridiculous. Eating nothing but rice is hugely unhealthy, though I can handwave that by saying you're supported by ki. I might consider playing a monk with those two vows, but I'm just not interested in RPing a character with any of the others.

[Psyren]

Which however, doesn't work with Fasting.

Rice wine! :smallbiggrin:

Okay okay, that one is a stretch, I agree.


Don't forget a ring of ki mastery. Store two ki points in it, which last indefinitely, and all your ki powers cost 1 less, to a minimum of one.

Also a ki mat. (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/wondrous-items/wondrous-items/h-l/ki-mat) Put it in the cart while the party is traveling between combats.



Honestly though, I never bother with any of the vows. Some of them are worth it mechanically, but they almost all get really silly. Fasting is the most reasonable to me, and truth is okay, but they usually go way too far, to a point where they get ridiculous. Eating nothing but rice is hugely unhealthy, though I can handwave that by saying you're supported by ki. I might consider playing a monk with those two vows, but I'm just not interested in RPing a character with any of the others.

I like Chains on a grappler or pummeler. That big hulking guy in the robe seems all the more menacing with broken shackles dangling off/wrapped around him. You can also fluff it as a massive Buddhist rosary, similar to the one worn by Caffeine Gaira from SS.

Silence can be hilarious and handy too, both on experienced roleplayers (just look at R2-D2 from Darths and Droids with his Mute flaw) and inexperienced ones (gives them the perfect excuse not to have to speak up.)

[(Un)Inspired]

You can also fluff it as a massive Buddhist rosary, similar to the one worn by Caffeine Gaira from SS.


I just googled it. Those don't look like prayer beads... They look like... Something else...

[Fax Celestis]

I like Chains on a grappler or pummeler. That big hulking guy in the robe seems all the more menacing with broken shackles dangling off/wrapped around him. You can also fluff it as a massive Buddhist rosary, similar to the one worn by Caffeine Gaira from SS.

Or how about Chains from Lies of Locke Lamora?

[Psyren]

I just googled it. Those don't look like prayer beads... They look like... Something else...

"Sometimes, a string of beads is just a string of beads." -Sigmund Freud


Or how about Chains from Lies of Locke Lamora?

The who from what? Image?

[georgie_leech]

Or how about Chains from Lies of Locke Lamora?

Rogues can take Vows? :smalltongue:

EDIT: Father Chains is the eyeless Priest of Prelandro, God of Mercy, Martyrs, Beggars, and other unfortunates. Charismatically devout, he's been chained to the walls of Prelandro's Church in Camorr longer than anyone can remember, after he had his eyes put out and chained himself to the wall in a public display of devotion. He sits the steps each day, thick chains nearly taut, as he entreats the passersby to charity and mercy.

It's all lies of course, but the image is nice.

[Fouredged Sword]

Both drunken master and Vows trade still mind unfortunately.

[Psyren]

Both drunken master and Vows trade still mind unfortunately.

Whoops, scratch that then



EDIT: Father Chains is the eyeless Priest of Prelandro, God of Mercy, Martyrs, Beggars, and other unfortunates. Charismatically devout, he's been chained to the walls of Prelandro's Church in Camorr longer than anyone can remember, after he had his eyes put out and chained himself to the wall in a public display of devotion. He sits the steps each day, thick chains nearly taut, as he entreats the passersby to charity and mercy.

It's all lies of course, but the image is nice.

Is there a picture of this guy anywhere?

[georgie_leech]

Is there a picture of this guy anywhere?

Alas, best I can do is fanart. (http://tolmancotton.deviantart.com/art/father-Chains-142940933) Though an important mentor, he's ultimately a secondary character to the story, guiding the protagonists' early development but only indirectly involved with the major plot.

[Fax Celestis]

Is there a picture of this guy anywhere?

Perhaps a better one:

http://th05.deviantart.net/fs70/PRE/i/2014/237/d/6/father_chains_by_xoujji-d7wnjtf.jpg

[Tommy_Dude]

I played a Halfling Monk with two of the vows. Cleanliness and Chains. This was in a Skull & Shackles AP group and he was eventually to become a pirate. His story was that he was the personal slave to an evil queen at one point, but won his freedom through brutality (and other things NSFW). In the end, he was offered the key to his shackles, but he simply broke them instead. Later he actually enchanted his manacles with Armor Enhancements and my DM allowed me to add the Brawling enchantment. (even though we aren't sure that's technically RAW.) He was my favorite character by far.