Bleach D20

[zadcap]

What you just said brings up a very, VERY interesting point about Zampakuto. They are, in D&D terms, inteligent magic items. At shikai they should get an ego score, and a larger one at bankai. n fact, everything they imply twords learning bankai, it seems like constant ego saves.
More than that thou, is the vizard mask. If bankai were to have an ego of 5, a mask would have 20. I think that works best as an existing rule to modify to fit the need. Manifesting a mask creates an inteligent item. It grants whatever bonus is appropriate, but instead of frenzy, make a will save or be dominated. Remember also that the inner hollow is stuck in the same body as the shinigami, they don't want to get themselfs killed, as Ichigo's hollow had implied.

If your existing mechanics work, no need to change them, but I was thinking that this might be more acurate to the bleach flavor. Of course, this would meen that Inner Hollow would be a feat, should be a requirement to Vizard. I don't know if this part is already in there, but something about when you hit 1/4th health it attempts to manifest, and each time you repress it untill you become a Vizard the save to not be dominated gets harder?

[ZebulonCrispi]

There comes a certain point at which further complexifying the rules for raw canon consistency stops being cost-effective.

[Behold_the_Void]

The problem with the Ego idea (which I had considered for the zanpakutou) is that it forces you to track the ego and ability scores of every zanpakutou. That's way too much book-keeping. They're good rules, but in a world where everyone's carrying around a magic talking sword, I decided it'd get really cumbersome FAST.

Arrancar and hollows CAN be PCs, but they're not generally set up to be PCs. The entire game mechanics are skewed. And if you want to be an Arrancar PC, you're just going to have to start higher level.

How in the world would we state the guardian of the gates of hell? He's shown up once and impaled a dude. There's nothing there.

Beastmen race will not be made until I see a) someone else like Komamura and b) unified traits that significantly differ from other shinigami to justify a separate race. Right now, Komamura's race is flavor (for both him and his zanpakutou, which attacks the way the kind of fox Komamura probably is does).

You can't endlessly stack bankai abilities under the rules, just like you can't endlessly stack shikai abilities. And with multiple ability scores, the "difficulty to decide" represents exactly why people won't be stacking them all anyway. As I said with the ego for items, I decided while making the system that having to track intelligent items with their own MENTAL ability scores (much less physical ones) I deemed to be too much bookkeeping.

[FelixZ]

For the manifestor awakened human:

Attack: Range is 20ft per level.

Counter: Make an opposing attack roll. If successfull, the incoming attack rebounds at the foe at 1/2 power.

Defense: Adds +(1/4 manifestor level) to defense when used.

Heal: Heals normal damage done.


Feats:

Manifester Power Boost
Prerequest: Manifester level 3
Description: Increase the damage die done by your summons by one step.

Just some quick stuff thrown out there.

[NightmareToilet]

well int item rules are in the standard books anyway for those who want to use them, which I would probably try something with. But the mask only shows to dominate really when Ichigo is about to take a hit that could kill him or send him below 0 at least, well, untill it happens a few times and then the hollow has gotten powerful enough to try a takeoever anytime he draws his sword.

[Caros]

Hola! Been following this thread for a while. Decent rules system, tried to do a bankai level playest, things... well lets just say they got a little out of hand. Gonna cover the things we noticed in our initial work.

Keep in mind that all of the following are based off of the main page rules (I haven't been able to successfully get the update.)

Elemental types, Perhaps it might be possible to collect the 'base' elemental abilities into their own section, rather than retyping them for every element.

Blood Type, Specifically Blade of blood. A player can theoretically use this to end a fight against most equal leveled oppents instantly, only worrying about missing due to AC. Pair that with the 'Roll 20' ability of Bankai and it becomes... scary.

Furthermore, how does this ability scale in bankai. As it stands it actually gets worse since all numeric effects double. The minimum damage you can take in bankai is 10 for 4d6. Least thats what we got out of it.

As pointed out above, the improved ability score thing is broken. Take strength and you can create a Bankai that allows you to kill nearly any single target in one round (We called him bigby, with a bankai of a giant hand.)

Assuming you stack on strength say... 3 times. Your strength is probably somewhere around 60. Thats a +25 Strength. Any character who didn't invest in strength or anti grapple loses against you if you win initiative (First attack 'grapple', second attack 'pin'.)

Elemental type Bankai become terrifying when used in conjunction with Kido type. My Bankai is fire type. I activate it, start a fire, stand next to the fire and gain 5 spell points a round. This is effectively infinate.

The extra shikai feat seems to be the only feat one would ever take ^_^

Dancing lights coupled with improved damage bankai ability is just sick (Assuming the damage is added to each, which, by the rules it seems to be)

Sundering is terrfying under this system, and in our opinion at least, should probably be removed. For one thing, it is incredibly rare for someone's zanpaktou to break unless they're dropping. For a more mechanical reason, Since so many abilities are based off the sword, it becomes a prime target and in many cases fights should very well turn into sundering matches (I know good players won't, but I'm talking from a general perspective here.)

Healing also bothers me, but thats just a personal pet peeve. Healing in bleach takes a signifigant amount of time from everything we've seen. Byakuya was out for days after fighting Ichigo, and we never see anyone recover from a major fight in under a day, which is contradictory to the high level "Heal Heal Heal" Kay, I'm ready to go.

My suggestion would be to change the healing spells to give bonuses to heal checks (And thus allow people to heal more quickly, naturally, which seems more to the flavor.)

To do this I would also suggest adding something akin to the Saga Edition starwars "Second wind". The fighter starts taking it seriously, releases their true power etc.

Thats all I can think of off the top of my head. Not ragging on the system, but improvement is made through discourse. Ciao.

[NightmareToilet]

There is one point when Ichigo is about to attempt to rescue Rukia when he is sensed as an incoming "captain" due to his level of reiatsu. Maybe someone could get captain prestige when they hit a certain reiatsu level, and be un-squaded but captain level. Plus, if someone like Ichigo's dad stops having a squad, he is still a captain and gets the same benefits from the prestige. This would also do more to explain Ichigo's power, give him more zanpakuto abilities, since he would get captain prestige benefits due to his reiatsu.
Would he get captain and vizard, someone who is a captain and a vizard? Trading bankai abilities for most hollow abilities is not equal. Plus, so you get a +10 to the 3 stats for a mask you can barely wear. Just take +10 at bankai for three captain levels and you get that as long as can hold bankai. Why take Vizard?!

Edit: From Ichigo I think Vizard should gestalt with captain. That is what makes it so powerful. And otherwise it would mean Ichigo will now only be getting hollow abilities. But he is a shinigami most of the time, not a vizard most of the time. It is really like a gestalt and that is why it is so deadly. I think the shinigami side does not stop progressing. After all, Zangestu old man is there and functioning as before. The hollow is in addition. What do you think?

Edit: For arrancar, Espada do have abilities that only they can do, like Noble Cero, so having them be a prestige equivalent to captain could work. And, for 10 of them, maybe each is level 11 - 20, one per level, or maybe some overlap but one is more powerful or has a nastier ability than the other. Unlike Shinigami rogue captains, when Arrancar cease being espada, they do seem to lose power, maybe drop 2 levels or something, you might consider.

[FelixZ]

for augement abilities, couldn't you just use a mix of shikai/hollow abilities? Because Chad comes out and says that his right arm has the same abilities of the hollow, a cero blast

[NightmareToilet]

Maybe this is throwing in a big wrench but I think this might be cool:


There are 4 paths, they said: Zanpakuto, Kidou, Hand to Hand, and Shunpo

Using the Modern classes as a base for this example:

5 columns:

1st column: The Character: [EDIT] Odd levels = feats, Evens = talents; feats may also “increase shunpo” or unarmed combat, or gain a spell, if that is the character’s focus more than the average shinigami.

2nd column: shunpo standard progression

3rd column: kidou standard progression, OR The Character may choose to use this as a second Zanpakuto column, choice made per level for the next level.

4th column: Z column, standard Zanpakuto progression: [Edit] Odd levs = Abilities (Z feats); Even levs = Adjunct abilities (Z talent for an ability it already has). Optional: Use Intelligent Item rules and ego. (Also, the Z will actually have abilities you are not powerful enough to get, yet, but those are not included here until you get them.)

5th column: Hollow column, for those who choose to have hollows. The hollow gets abilities, but you don’t get them till you are a Vizard, progressing in the order that the hollow got them. Optional: Use Intelligent Item rules and ego.


So, Character and Zanpakuto are their own columns, their own progressions, and this set-up allows for specializing or personalizing amongst the paths, too.

So you get more than 100% because you have the zanpakuto, and you get more than 200% if you have a hollow (the drawback being it trying to take over sometimes, and all that Ichigo went through).

Then of course there are the columns for defense and save, etc.

Something like this may be great, I think.

Edit: I wonder what it would look like if the captains were statted out this way vs the way it currently is?

Edit: Ha, just realized the implications of "Hollow" being the "5th column" : ) ... If you know the saying, "5th column".

[ZebulonCrispi]

NightmareToilet, why don't you start a third Bleach d20 thread?

[Behold_the_Void]

Just real quick on the bankai thing, thanks for that input, that'll really help. The bankai rules were made really early in inception, and I've been meaning to power them down significantly, that gives me a great place to start.

[Xuincherguixe]

Ichigo just was "over 9000" to borrow from a meme. He wasn't a captain, but he had the Strength of one. Ichigo wouldn't have Captain levels unless he became a captain in the normal fashion. Or I suppose an abnormal fashion might work too, but it's still in the realm of plot, not just gaining levels. I mean there can only really be 13 captains at any time.

It's because he was over level 10 or 15 or where ever that mark gets placed.

This does pose an interesting question though, can a Vizard gain Captain levels?
Minor spoiler
The Vizard organization were implied to be have been judged as criminals by Soul Society. So it's unlikely they'd let any of them be their captains. But yet they don't seem to have a problem with drafting Ichigo to solve their problems. It seems unlikely they'd miss the fact he was a Vizard. While he's not a captain yet, it's reasonable to assume one day he might become one if something horrible doesn't happen to him, and he joined them. Both big assumptions.


I was thinking about coming up with some demons for a hypothetical Bleach D20 campaign. There aren't a lot of enemies to fight. Pretty much Hollows and Shinigami (and their relatives Arrancar and Vizard). That, and regular Hollows stop being much a threat. Why is it that there seems to be this endless stream of Vasto Lorde and Arrancar when they're supposed to be rare? The gates of hell suddenly bursting open and spewing many mouthed atrocity that eats captains for breakfast might solve that problem.

But that'd be some pretty heavy creative license.

[Behold_the_Void]

If you can get approved, it's possible to take levels in Vizard AND Captain, but not probable.

[NightmareToilet]

Well, you could use the blanks idea or that strange pockets could form out of a "limbo" type chaos area, or some old experiment long forgotten suddenly breaks the seal of where they were locked away (that's always a nice plot that shoes up in sci-fi and fantasy). Then pretty much anything goes, invasion from the far realms, tentacled monsters with odd powers, etc.

I don't really think I have time or brains or whatever to do a third thread and some system on my own, just tried to come up with some stuff. I think this one has a lot going for it, just gave some ideas and all, way it seemed might help it. I do think that last way might be good to look into, but of course playtesting is what really discovers stuff, and at the moment I don't have a group for that.

[zadcap]

Well, my playtest group has disbanded, so I was wondering if anyone else has an opening or is starting a new group I could join?

[FelixZ]

NightmareToilet, why don't you start a third Bleach d20 thread?

Aye. She seems to be going a bit off on what is going on....


I just can't wait until the SA classes are done...

[Behold_the_Void]

For bankai, the general revision is going to look a bit like this:

Double the amount of shikai abilities you have, then reconstruct. Numeric values are not doubled. Bankai abilities will likely be toned down, but will be a lot of interesting things that you normally cannot do.

[NightmareToilet]

For cast, Ichigo was level 2 shinigami it seemed when he beat Renji, who had spells and zanpakuto abilities by that time. He had spells in the flash back to the academy, along with the others.

So, I think spells should start sooner and will you try to match Ichigo able to do this? He had some training so a level 1 or 2 human with brawl and some stuff would work, but he just swung his sword wildly it was said, so not much training, but he was faster than Renji then.

[Bandededed]

That's true, Nightmare, but Renji was also under a severe reiatsu limitation placed on anyone of rank lieutenant or higher when traveling in the real world.

Also, let's not forget that Renji was beating him bad before the plot bug came out and upped ichigo's fighting ability.

[VanBuren]

One last thing about the Inner Hollow that may or may not have been covered.

Long before Ichigo became a Vizard, and even before he began to transform during fights, Ichigo's Hollow still had a presence in battle. During the Renji (rematch in Soul Society) and Kenpachi fights, Ichigo's mask appeared under his robes and absorbed would-be fatal blows. Is this fluff, or should it be reflected in the feat?

Incidentally, if this were part of the feat, Inner Hollow would be starting to become one bad mother.

[NightmareToilet]

Oh, good call with the mask appearing. It also adds kind of a creepiness that this think is there and you and your opponents don't know what is growing in power there, keeping itself (and you) alive. Could be like the "defensive roll" talent/feat in some way but plus some story telling to fit it in, mush style?

[Xuincherguixe]

If an Inner Hollow type thing comes up, the best way to handle it is that it's not something that can be relied on. One's Hollow does as they please.

It's not going to suddenly show up so you can cheat at poker. It's not going to give you romantic advice. If however it turns out the person you're going out with is a serial killer and they try and stab you in the chest it *might* manifest. Or it might just laugh while you bleed. The thing wouldn't be invincible either. If your serial killer date turns out to be a captain (ooo that eye patch is so sexy.... Ooo! What a big sword you ha... AHH! YOU'RE TRYING TO KILL ME!") It's not going to be enough to stop the blow.

So, maybe 5/- Damage reduction when your hollow thinks you might die.

[Behold_the_Void]

I'm thinking I might have the DM give the player an action point pool for the Inner Hollow, it'd represent a good way of the hollow intervening.

Edit: Oh, I'm uploading the current document. Some Augment abilities are up, but not all, and I've fixed the Bankai mechanics, they should be workable now. Added new feats like Inner Hollow, probably some various other changes that I can't think of off the top of my head.

[ZebulonCrispi]

Okay, sorry for the delay, new file up in the same place as the old one (http://professor.fireandrobot.com/Bleach-D20-Rulebook-Compilation.doc).

I have to remake nearly EVERYONE now thanks to the new Bankai rules. Awesome.

[NightmareToilet]

vizard:
"those with the Alternative Demon Path feat gain +10 to either Wisdom or Intelligence, as specified by their feat"

this +10 is in place of the cha+10, not in addition to it, I assume, in line with the feat?

[NightmareToilet]

"Alternate Sealed Form Zanpakutou’s Sealed Form is different. 1st Level"

needs content put in proper columns? "1st level" is listed as the benefit.


edit:


Bankai questions:

Double the amount of shikai abilities means that for each time the class says "shikai ability" you get to pick the same amount of additional shikai abilities for inclusion in the bankai?

Does the 1st level "alternate sealed form" ability apply, also (it is a shikai ability but is taken at 1st level)?

So a 12th level warrior would have 6 shikai abilities (1 per odd level) and would thus get to pick 6 more, which are only available during bankai?

And then each time you get a new shikai ability, each odd level after 12th, you also get to pick another one for use during the bankai? And the ability cap lessening with shikai is from then on?

:smallsmile: I think the paragraph could benefit from some more clarity and being made into a few paragraphs.


edit:

It looks like Ichigo gets some of the shunpo feats, like trail, only during his bankai. Can Bankai be used for feats? I guess why not?

[Behold_the_Void]

Yes, it means in place of, I'll clarify for next update.

Yes, for each time it says Shikai Ability, you get another one when construction your bankai's base.

No, Alternate Sealed Form does not count. It gives you the effect of a shikai ability, not a shikai ability.

I will probably make emulate feat a shikai generic ability, which would explain Ichigo in Bankai.

Level 12 would have 5, one for level 3, 5, 7, 9, and 11. For a bankai base, a level 12 would have 10 shikai abilities to construct the bankai base with.

The bankai form benefits from the lessened requirements, not shikai form.

[merashin]

i really like the new system... when will a character sheet be made available for this system, i already saw someone else posted one, but i get an error everytime I try to open it.

[NightmareToilet]

Thanks for clarifying. When we see some characters mapped out this way it will make more sense to newcomers like me and people can play with swapping things.

What about the relationship between regular base land movement speed, and ac or avoidance (speed concealment)? I mean if someone dumps the bankai shikai into speed to get +50ft, they are so fast that it should count as something and have an actual effect in combat, I'd think, especially if they also have evasion and uncanny dodge. Add flight and you can double the speed, and also use shunpo at key moments, and the enemy is in real trouble.

But likely better to just use those shikai on increasing shunpo and shunpo feats. Does flight double shunpo?!:smallbiggrin: It doubles movement speed, so that could work!


edit:
re:
"As a full round action on a target at least 10 feet away, expend shunpo equal to the movement required to reach the target plus shunpo greater than or equal to the target’s AC (rounded up to the nearest increment of 5). Make a single attack on the target. The target is considered flat-footed for the purpose of this attack."

Are they flatfooted even with uncanny dodge or evasion?

As to AC, is that one shunpo step per pt of ac?


Edit:
Yuroichi used shunpo 100 times in a row and got fatigued because she had not fought in 100 years, if I recall. So she must have a huge shunpo ability (Goddess of Flash). How will you handle flash release and stat her? She did not use bankai to get more shunpo, and she was likely 20th level when she left Soul Society.

[Edungeon]

Is the Quincy Human Body supposed to be different from the spiritually-awakened ones? :smallconfused:

[NightmareToilet]

Another question:

With quick release, is that good to take if you already have constant release? It allows faster release of shikai abilities or just the shikai itself? Why need bankai for quick release when constant release is at an early level?

thanks.

[Behold_the_Void]

I will likely change the Quincy Human Body to be more in line with the Spiritually Awakened Human Body.

Quick Release is useless for those with Constant Release. It applies only to the actual releasing of a zanpakutou.

Oh, and something I forgot to address in the last post, as you gain shikai abilities after attaining bankai, you still gain two shikai abilities to distribute to your bankai as well.

[zadcap]

Yuroichi used shunpo 100 times in a row and got fatigued because she had not fought in 100 years, if I recall. So she must have a huge shunpo ability (Goddess of Flash). How will you handle flash release and stat her? She did not use bankai to get more shunpo, and she was likely 20th level when she left Soul Society.

I think herFlash release is something like Kenpachi taking off his eyepatch, somewhere earlier called a 'soft bankai'. If we had to make her a Shinigami, her zampakuto would be all Emulate Feat abilities, and perhaps lightning as a type, both paralizing Ichigo and, well, giving off lightning when she released.
Thou... she probably should be a seperate class, since there's more then Shinigami in soul society. Shinigami, Kido whatevers and the Police Force-ish people.

[ZebulonCrispi]

I think herFlash release is something like Kenpachi taking off his eyepatch, somewhere earlier called a 'soft bankai'. If we had to make her a Shinigami, her zampakuto would be all Emulate Feat abilities, and perhaps lightning as a type, both paralizing Ichigo and, well, giving off lightning when she released.
Thou... she probably should be a seperate class, since there's more then Shinigami in soul society. Shinigami, Kido whatevers and the Police Force-ish people.

The current standing theory is that Yoruichi does have a Zanpakuto, but she never carries it, prefering to fight unarmed.

She *does* have to be a Shinigami, after all, what with her being Soi Fon's superior officer in the past.

[zadcap]

The current standing theory is that Yoruichi does have a Zanpakuto, but she never carries it, prefering to fight unarmed.

She *does* have to be a Shinigami, after all, what with her being Soi Fon's superior officer in the past.

Superior officer in the special forces/police thing, I thought, as Yourichi has never been referd to as a captain even when they said Soi Fon took her position... as head of something, not a captain.

[NightmareToilet]

There may also be some benefit to being a noble. Yoruichi and Byakuya are both nobles, right? This may give some unspecified benefit, access to special training, something. Should her noble status mean she is shinigami? Wait, she was in academy, right, and trained in shinigami garb and sword with Uruhara in their secret cavern, right? I think she'd have to be a shinigami.

The fact that she mentioned how only 100 made her fatigued is likely an indicator that she did not use bankai or flash release but just the shunpo she said she used. She is just really powerful with shunpo.

Some interesting info here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yoruichi

"Yoruichi also taught Byakuya some techniques of her own creation involving flash steps, including one called utsusemi (空蝉, lit. cicada, in reference to their molting) which allows a person to move out of harms way by creating another image of themselves."

Shunpo Cicada (cooler than trail, imho):smallsmile:

[Full_Time_Slack]

There may also be some benefit to being a noble. Yoruichi and Byakuya are both nobles, right? This may give some unspecified benefit, access to special training, something. Should her noble status mean she is shinigami? Wait, she was in academy, right, and trained in shinigami garb and sword with Uruhara in their secret cavern, right? I think she'd have to be a shinigami.

The fact that she mentioned how only 100 made her fatigued is likely an indicator that she did not use bankai or flash release but just the shunpo she said she used. She is just really powerful with shunpo.

Some interesting info here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yoruichi

"Yoruichi also taught Byakuya some techniques of her own creation involving flash steps, including one called utsusemi (空蝉, lit. cicada, in reference to their molting) which allows a person to move out of harms way by creating another image of themselves."

Shunpo Cicada (cooler than trail, imho):smallsmile:

I got the impression that all of the Noble Family members have a striong reiatsu. It makes sense, considering all families in the Soul Society are adoptive, that the families who control everything would only adopt those souls who are innately powerful--and of course from there they'd train them in their powers' uses.

[Behold_the_Void]

I got the impression that all of the Noble Family members have a striong reiatsu. It makes sense, considering all families in the Soul Society are adoptive, that the families who control everything would only adopt those souls who are innately powerful--and of course from there they'd train them in their powers' uses.

That's likely the case. There needs to be no mechanical benefit for being a noble, a) we don't know much about all of the noble houses (Kuchiki, Shihouin, two others, and then Ganryuu and Kuukaku, both of which fell into disgrace, which seems like a popular trend amongst noble families) and b) I don't like giving mechanical benefits for basic backstory/fluff reasons. There's no reason to say "I'm a noble!" and suddenly be better than your party members. Generally speaking, one can assume a higher percentage of nobles are shinigami than an equivalent percentage of Rukongai dwellers. Of course, there's a LOT more Rukongai dwellers, so the numbers are skewed in the noble's favor.

[NightmareToilet]

Yeah just a reputation bonus if you earn it.

Ok, for senka, the shunpo spring and strike vitals, the description doesn't expand on what that exactly means. Is it an assassin's death attack or what is the actual damage change for using this?

thanks.

[Behold_the_Void]

Yeah just a reputation bonus if you earn it.

Ok, for senka, the shunpo spring and strike vitals, the description doesn't expand on what that exactly means. Is it an assassin's death attack or what is the actual damage change for using this?

thanks.


Benefit: As a full round action on a target at least 10 feet away, expend shunpo equal to the movement required to reach the target plus shunpo greater than or equal to the target’s AC (rounded up to the nearest increment of 5). Make a single attack on the target. The target is considered flat-footed for the purpose of this attack.

Senka allows you to make one attack against an opponent, and the opponent is treated as flat-footed for the purpose of this attack. The most obvious application I can think of is if you've invested in sneak attack.

[NightmareToilet]

How about emulating the bankai's "vital pierce"? After all, it takes a lot of feats to get senka. Sneak attack is actually not a prereq, and maybe it would not have to be since the target is wide open and any fighter of a level capable of using senka would know where to hit. I think sneak attack should be given eventually, like level 12, maybe.

[Behold_the_Void]

How about emulating the bankai's "vital pierce"? After all, it takes a lot of feats to get senka. Sneak attack is actually not a prereq, and maybe it would not have to be since the target is wide open and any fighter of a level capable of using senka would know where to hit. I think sneak attack should be given eventually, like level 12, maybe.

No, it will not emulate Vital Pierce, that's way too powerful.

I may drop down the feat requirement a bit, and require sneak attack for it, I've yet to decide. Catching someone flat-footed has other benefits, they lose their AC bonus from several sources, like their zanpakutou bonus. It's a potent ability.

[NightmareToilet]

Thats' true, but uncanny dodge can fix some of that unless uncanny dodge is negated. You could have senka disable 1 level of uncanny dodge and have it do a lesser version of what the bankai does? It depends how powerful you envision it. I mean, Byakuya does it well, but he is so powerful already. Someone else would not do it as well.

[Dante & Vergil]

Superior officer in the special forces/police thing, I thought, as Yourichi has never been referd to as a captain even when they said Soi Fon took her position... as head of something, not a captain.

If I remember correctly, when Yami and Ulquoirra came to the human world, Yoruichi and Urahara inervened, Ulquoirra tells Yami that he could not take them on because they were ex-captains Urahara and Yoruichi.
I pretty sure this happend. If so, this is proof that Yoruichi is a captain.

[Behold_the_Void]

Thats' true, but uncanny dodge can fix some of that unless uncanny dodge is negated. You could have senka disable 1 level of uncanny dodge and have it do a lesser version of what the bankai does? It depends how powerful you envision it. I mean, Byakuya does it well, but he is so powerful already. Someone else would not do it as well.

The only time Byakuya's Senka has been effective is when Ichigo was still crappy. It doesn't deserve to be that powerful, it's not THAT good. Uncanny Dodge could indeed negate it, which Renji and Ichigo both illustrated.

[NightmareToilet]

Oh, I rememer that, ok. Yeah, I hate him using that move anyway, its like cowardsly for a powerfully trainined guy to do that.

Having summons able to do shunpo is good though. But would they have to be taking away from the shunpo of the shinigami? I think maybe they should start with the same amount of shunpo the user has left. I'm thinking, share abilities + shunpo feats, btw. It makes sense for them to be able to do that, right? So I could put shunpo stuff into bankai base, along with summoning some faeries or whatever and they could tap into the shunpo to spring attack and stuff.

[NightmareToilet]

Hi, I have not checked recently but,

How about including some rules for parrying? Some weapons have effects that would use this, such as making enemy weapons heavier or releasing shocking blasts.

Would it be good to first see if you avoided the attack and then to roll an opposing attack roll to see if you parried? Expertise and any parrying bonuses, such as from a certain type of weapon, could then be added to this parry roll, also to see if it was a parry that caused you to avoid the attack.

I see some systems use a parrying skill, but that is kind of strange I think for D&D type systems, since parrying is of course part of combat.

Also, I think having a second weapon should of course give a parry bonus to anyone trained in fighting, which is a whole-body training, not a limb by limb training! 2 weapon defense should be just as natural as having a shield to someone who has done style training with 2 weapons. I never really bought the whole D&D thing about it being so much more difficult that it should give big penalties and not automatically let you parry, but then I have not tried it, myself.

[Bandededed]

Is anyone planning on running a bleach game anytime soon? I'd really like to try these rules out.

[Dante & Vergil]

Hollow Abilities

Vizard gain access to Hollow abilities while their mask is manifested. Vizard may select any hollow ability from the list that does not physically alter their body in a noticeable way (i.e. Increased Size, Extra Limb, and Increased Hit Die). Vizards may begin taking Adjucha-level abilities when their Vizard level reaches 12.

Vizards only can reach level 10 in the PrC. I'm going to assume that you ment when your character level reaches 12.

[merashin]

or they're in epic levels

[merashin]

i really like the new system... when will a character sheet be made available for this system, i already saw someone else posted one, but i get an error everytime I try to open it.

did you all just overlook this, or didn't feel like responding

[NightmareToilet]

I thought it said Vizards can go on forever, no cap, but maybe character level 12 would make more sense, something equal to the kind of reiatsu an Adjucha would have. Otherwise it would take quite a while, you could be level 30 before you finally get what a lowly Adjucha can get!

[NightmareToilet]

How about a good save, medium save, bad save, as in +2,+1,+0? I think this is better, not such a drastic difference. Or even +3, +2, +1. Or 5 pts to distribute towards saves (none higher than 3), and they progress from there.

[the moo]

Hey I found this Bleach D20 and i must say i like it a lot, but i had a few comments and questions
1. I feel that the defense bonus system doesn't work right for this, it seems too low, i ran a game and my players at lvl 1 could hit lvl 10 characters with out to much trouble
2. this is a newb question: I see that your premade characters you released all have weapons with enhancement bonuses like +1 - +8, i was wondering how they got them
3. Also Ichigo seems to have a bankai ability i cant find called "Time stands still" what is it and/ or where is it?

thx and good job on the game

[NightmareToilet]

Looking again at Ichigo in your file,

I think from the show he should have brawl and iron will, maybe a feat to use will for fortitude or the reverse?

He has incredible willpower!!

Maybe 2 levels human?

He has track?

Where can I find a description of "enhancement: parrying"
I don't see it on the srd website http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/magicWeapons.htm

Actually, I don't see mettle there either. http://www.d20srd.org/indexes/feats.htm

[Behold_the_Void]

Hey I found this Bleach D20 and i must say i like it a lot, but i had a few comments and questions
1. I feel that the defense bonus system doesn't work right for this, it seems too low, i ran a game and my players at lvl 1 could hit lvl 10 characters with out to much trouble
2. this is a newb question: I see that your premade characters you released all have weapons with enhancement bonuses like +1 - +8, i was wondering how they got them
3. Also Ichigo seems to have a bankai ability i cant find called "Time stands still" what is it and/ or where is it?

thx and good job on the game

Time Stands Still was renamed to "Furious Blade", the enhancements are I believe accidental carry-overs from older parts of the system where numeric bankai values were doubled, all zanpakutou enhancements also grant an equivalent bonus to AC.


did you all just overlook this, or didn't feel like responding

I am not terribly skilled with making character sheets, so I have no idea when I'll be able to get one up so we'll have to see with that.



Vizards only can reach level 10 in the PrC. I'm going to assume that you ment when your character level reaches 12.

The Vizard class does not cap at 10, once it normalizes at level 6, the progression stays that way potentially infinitely. Same goes for Arrancar.


How about a good save, medium save, bad save, as in +2,+1,+0? I think this is better, not such a drastic difference. Or even +3, +2, +1. Or 5 pts to distribute towards saves (none higher than 3), and they progress from there.

I'm not fond of using Medium saves since they don't show up in the normal D&D and it's another mechanic people have to learn when there's a lot of other stuff they need to learn already.


Looking again at Ichigo in your file,

I think from the show he should have brawl and iron will, maybe a feat to use will for fortitude or the reverse?

He has incredible willpower!!

Maybe 2 levels human?

He has track?

Where can I find a description of "enhancement: parrying"
I don't see it on the srd website http://www.d20srd.org/indexes/feats.htm
Actually, I don't see mettle there either.

Brawl's not a bad suggestion, I'll look into getting that swapped in. Human levels get converted into shinigami/spiritually awakened humans. Giving him the good will progression feat is also an option.

He most certainly does have Track. He used it to find where a hollow was early in the series (the white cord materialization, Ishida has it too).

Parrying and Mettle are things that were added non-core, I can't provide any appropriate links unfortunately.

[NightmareToilet]

Can anyone tell me where to find parrying and mettle? Thanks.

edit:

Ok, check out parrying here:
http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/items/weapons.htm

Zanpakuto and psionic weapons = : )

found this: Parrying (+1 insight), Weapon Enhancement, +2. MIC, p. 40

Also, how about these and other feats: http://www.d20srd.org/indexes/psionicFeats.htm
http://www.d20srd.org/indexes/divineAbilitiesFeats.htm


edit:
http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/precognitionDefensive.htm
Considering that, maybe the insight could go up by +1 per 3 levels due to increased reiatsu?

[Dante & Vergil]

I just say a class online that gave mettle and this is what it is. I hope this is what it is.
Mettle (Ex)
If you succeed at a Fortitude Partial or Willpower Partial save, you take no effect as if he had immunity.

[NightmareToilet]

If that is what you want it to be I think you should put it in the file along with parrying, so that people don't have to try to hunt it down.

Also, I was thinking, should getting parrying mean I have to have a weapon type? It does not change the appearance and is actually sort of a barrier ability, along with defender and some other things. I am surprised you have armor in there. How about putting the ac benefitting stuff also in barrier?

[VanBuren]

It's strange. He was able to track that Hollow easily at the beginning, but has been fairly inept at repeating success with that kind of skill.

[Josh the Aspie]

Hey there. This is my first post in this thread.

First of all, I'd like to complement you on taking on such a large task, and continuing it so long after what was likely your spring break. You've got a large amount of material here, potentially enough to sell as a derivative work at game conventions if US copyright law hadn't gotten so out of hand.

Secondly, I'd like to note that a group I'm looking at joining on another board is investigating making an RP using the rules linked to on the front page, which is how I got exposed to them.

I'd like to make a few recommendations for changes. I'm afraid that for some of these, if you were to take them, would require a fair amount of work.

First of all, if you are going to link a profession or social class to a D20 class, you should have a single class, and possibly some prestige classes. Example: A single balanced base class for shinigami to represent basic training, followed by specializing prestige classes to allow specialization in one or more aspects of the class.

If you don't want a single class for the social class or profession then people not in that social class or profession should be able to take that class and access the vast majority (if not all) of it's abilities, with only the appearance and in character name of the ability being different.

For example, Orehime's abilities fall in the 3 areas of protection, healing, and weapon strikes. This could be represented using the rules you already use for zanpakto. The abilities of Chad's arm(s) revolve around protection, and additional damage. Even the Quincy are a specialized kind of augment who would take several of the ranged weapon abilities.

One of the augment classes matches up fairly well against the shinigami warrior class, while another matches up well against the shinigami expert class. For all we know, there may be some spell casters among the augmented humans that just didn't show up in the series.

This would also allow you to combine several of the ability lists, and make the character creation for shinigami and augments even more flexible.

Further, it would greatly help enhance class balance if members of similar classes had access to similar progressions and abilities.

You could then simply call the classes "Warrior" "expert" and "Spellcaster" instead of requiring someone to be a member of a certain group to access the abilities in a class.

You might also want to alter the damage progression so that at certain intervals in the given classes, the damage (from whatever weapon is used) increases by 1 size type. This would have a few different advantages.

First, it would allow very powerful individuals to have normally sized zanpakto that do more damage than the zanpakto of those below them, but for individuals (like ichigo) who have much larger weapons, it would still give them a boost to damage from having that larger weapon at any point in the progression.

Second, it would make it easier to understand what happens when people multi-class, so that if someone wanted to balance their character between raw damage, and expertise in skill might be able to do so (say, by multi-classing between warrior and expert), and make it clear when they gain increases to their weapon damage.

Third, epic monks gain more bonus feats which they can use on increasing their fist damage if they so choose, rather than having a continuing damage progression... so it's not clear when you get greater epic damage when progressing through epic levels, where-as with this system you would know when you will get those damage bonuses.

There are already guidelines for how to use the class defense bonus when multi-classing.

[Josh the Aspie]

Oh, and as for armor Nightmare:

There are examples of people gaining armor with a release of their weapon in the series. Rengi, for example, when he gains banki. This is most evident due to the tuft. Ichigo as well gets some sort of protective covering. When he releases his special bow Ishida also gets new protective gear.

The butterfly wings Yoroichi gains might be considered armor as well.

[VanBuren]

Oh, and as for armor Nightmare:

There are examples of people gaining armor with a release of their weapon in the series. Rengi, for example, when he gains banki. This is most evident due to the tuft. Ichigo as well gets some sort of protective covering. When he releases his special bow Ishida also gets new protective gear.

The butterfly wings Yoroichi gains might be considered armor as well.

Except Ichigo's new clothing isn't armor at all. It's just new clothing that, incidentally, more or less matches the clothing Zangetsu wears.

With Renji, it's not clear that it actually serves any defensive purpose but is more likely another example of matching the Zanpakuto.

Yoruichi's main attribute is speed. So it would stand to reason that armor may slow her down. In addition the wings look more like just an overflow of energy, and they're also part of her Flash Cry attack.

You've probably got something with Ishida and his Final Form, though.

[zadcap]

Or perhaps it has something to do with Reiatsu increase received upon gaining Bankai. As Kenpachi said in his first fight with Ichigo, when two spiritual objects meet, the stronger one pushes harder. Bankai gives a huge spike in reiatsu, and if you decide to concentrate it twords yourself instead of your weapon, your skin turns into platemail.

[NightmareToilet]

wow, this forum is always down, maybe there is a better place to have this bleach stuff?

The butterfly spots are from Soifon's attacks I thought.

Ichigo uses his reitsu as armor, as do some others. I think this was even commented on. a feat maybe.

The new clothing is for art, basically, and to help them look different and to show them taking an aspect from the appearance or the zanpakuto spirit, like Zangetsu's cloak manifests a little. Some other shows do this, give the character a new wardrobe when they power up. Kind of silly sometimes. I wouldn't assume it does anything special.



Here is something I made for parrying z, and a barrier ability:

Parrying Zanpakuto:
-------------------
precognitive intuition: insight +1 to ac and saves

Increase by +1 per 3 levels, due to increased natural reiatsu focused in the blade (Req: Barrier type zanpakuto for this increase).

For fighters with more than one parrying zanpakuto, the wielder intuitively understands which weapon and movement is best for each parry and save. This effect makes two-weapon fighting easier and more productive: It counters -2/-2 of the attack penalty.

Having more than one parrying weapon stacks their bonuses, for they each channel more reiatsu into the manifesting precognition.


Barrier: Enhanced Expertise: (fixed this)
--------------------------------------
req: expertise, zanpakuto (barrier type)

Your Zanpakuto takes hold with you and enhances your expertise, making it twice as effective. Whatever bonuses you switch from offense to defense are doubled on the defense, so 1 becomes 2, 2 becomes 4, etc, 5 becomes +10.

It may thus exceed your base attack bonus, since it is not just you doing it.

This is a full body dodge effect, not per weapon, so 2 weapons do not double it.


--
If you want to include these, you can go ahead, or whatever.

[Josh the Aspie]

And using one's increased reitsu as armor, by turning it toward's one's self, rather than one's Zanpakto could very well be represented by a zanpakto ability... as it currently listed under barrier abilities.

As for ichigo's clothes: that looks a lot like a leather trench coat to me, which could easily be represented by D&D's leather armor. In modern era d20 systems, etc, there is often a form of armor that can represent a leather jacket or leather trenchcoat.

[NightmareToilet]

Oh its fine to have armor in barrier, I was wondering why it was listed in weapon type also, but I guess it could work....

edit: and maybe you can't even cut someone more than a level higher? due to the reiatsu affect? How would that work, though? You only fight those equal to you or else one guy simply can't cut the other?

[NightmareToilet]

I'm thinking how Inuyasha's sword is a lot like a zanpakuto. It would be nice to have a backlash wave that could return an enemy's reitsu on itself and add yours to it.

Here is something I was thinking up that has some similarity to that:

Barrier: Karmic Parry: (fixed this to not be so powerful)
--------------------
Barrier: Rejection: Karmic Parry: If parried, the attacker's reiatsu and killer intent is instantly, unavaoidably, rebounded upon him. The opponent must take damage from their own reiatsu equal to what they would have dealt, by killer intention. They cannot take more or less. Also, since this works by their intent, it has nothing to do with damage reduction (or other such things), and this rebound carries any ill effects with it from zanpakuto abilities. The reason it does not kill outright is that their intent was not strong enough to kill outright, even if they thought it was (an excuse for it not being overpowered, or perhaps this is just “mercy”).

Also, this surprise result of taking karmic damage ends the opponent’s attack action and opens them to an attack of opportunity unless they are at least 4 levs higher.

Note: Karmic Parry can only function from blades, not from armor.

[Josh the Aspie]

Oh, and by the way, the butterfly wings I was referring to were the ones that sprouted from Yoroichi's back.

[Behold_the_Void]

Hey there. This is my first post in this thread.

First of all, I'd like to complement you on taking on such a large task, and continuing it so long after what was likely your spring break. You've got a large amount of material here, potentially enough to sell as a derivative work at game conventions if US copyright law hadn't gotten so out of hand.

Secondly, I'd like to note that a group I'm looking at joining on another board is investigating making an RP using the rules linked to on the front page, which is how I got exposed to them.

I'd like to make a few recommendations for changes. I'm afraid that for some of these, if you were to take them, would require a fair amount of work.

First of all, if you are going to link a profession or social class to a D20 class, you should have a single class, and possibly some prestige classes. Example: A single balanced base class for shinigami to represent basic training, followed by specializing prestige classes to allow specialization in one or more aspects of the class.

If you don't want a single class for the social class or profession then people not in that social class or profession should be able to take that class and access the vast majority (if not all) of it's abilities, with only the appearance and in character name of the ability being different.

For example, Orehime's abilities fall in the 3 areas of protection, healing, and weapon strikes. This could be represented using the rules you already use for zanpakto. The abilities of Chad's arm(s) revolve around protection, and additional damage. Even the Quincy are a specialized kind of augment who would take several of the ranged weapon abilities.

One of the augment classes matches up fairly well against the shinigami warrior class, while another matches up well against the shinigami expert class. For all we know, there may be some spell casters among the augmented humans that just didn't show up in the series.

This would also allow you to combine several of the ability lists, and make the character creation for shinigami and augments even more flexible.

Further, it would greatly help enhance class balance if members of similar classes had access to similar progressions and abilities.

You could then simply call the classes "Warrior" "expert" and "Spellcaster" instead of requiring someone to be a member of a certain group to access the abilities in a class.

You might also want to alter the damage progression so that at certain intervals in the given classes, the damage (from whatever weapon is used) increases by 1 size type. This would have a few different advantages.

First, it would allow very powerful individuals to have normally sized zanpakto that do more damage than the zanpakto of those below them, but for individuals (like ichigo) who have much larger weapons, it would still give them a boost to damage from having that larger weapon at any point in the progression.

Second, it would make it easier to understand what happens when people multi-class, so that if someone wanted to balance their character between raw damage, and expertise in skill might be able to do so (say, by multi-classing between warrior and expert), and make it clear when they gain increases to their weapon damage.

Third, epic monks gain more bonus feats which they can use on increasing their fist damage if they so choose, rather than having a continuing damage progression... so it's not clear when you get greater epic damage when progressing through epic levels, where-as with this system you would know when you will get those damage bonuses.

There are already guidelines for how to use the class defense bonus when multi-classing.

A shinigami social-based class would work fine as an expert.

I was actually originally intending to make all classes mirrors of each other, just with different ability sets to represent them. However, Zebedee came up with his Quincy, which used entirely different mechanics, so I decided to try for a somewhat different system for the other human-based classes. If it becomes too challenging to balance, I'll likely just go back to the original intent.

I'm REALLY trying to avoid multi-classing outside of prestige classing if at all possible. That's the reason I based it off the generic classes, so things like that wouldn't happen. I have an idea of how multiclassing MIGHT be handled, which I may include as an optional rule, but as it stands I'm really trying to avoid that.

I don't have rules for epic damage scaling as of yet, but I'll likely just keep the system the same for those purposes. Epic Monks don't normally get it, yes, but I always felt the Epic Monk was uninteresting and lackluster anyway, so I don't mind adding the increase to damage and the like.

[Josh the Aspie]

I was not suggesting you introduce a new shinigami progression class. I meant "Social class" in the traditional sense of the phrase, not in the D20 sense of the phrase. Shinigami are set above other spirits in the social order. They are higher in the fudal class system, and above the level of the shinigami are the noble shinigami.

And why on earth avoid multi-classing? It provides the ability to blend the advantages and disadvantages of the various classes, and is an intrinsic part of D&D.

I think that your original intent to use the 3 generic classes is a good one.

Thus far the quincy are definitely far and away inferior to the shinigami at the same level as they are stated out.

If you alter the weapon damage as I detailed above, and combine the ability lists, the only problem left should be magic, which might be handled as detailed below.

You already have caster level for warrior Shinigami equal to 1/2 their class level. When someone multi-classes between warrior and spellcasting shinigami you can add their respective caster levels together, and say that the maximum level of spell they can learn is 1, plus 1 for every 2 caster levels above 1. This would give warriors slightly better casting ability, true, but not substantially.

You could also set the caster level of experts to be 2/3 that of their class level, and use the same system. Experts would also gain a slightly improved casting, but their maximum spell level would only go up to 7th from 6th.

Alternatively, you could say max spell level is 1/2 caster level, rounded down, but that would have mostly the same effect.

[Behold_the_Void]

Ah, I see what you mean about social class. I'll have more about that when I write up the essays on capturing the fluff.

As far as avoiding the multiclassing aspect, since I used the Generic Classes as a base. The way it's set up, the idea is to make a viable gish simply be the expert. With a bunch of different spell progressions and the like, it would probably turn out a bit strange, and it's more number-crunching than I want to deal with right now. The generic classes in the SRD do have the ability to multiclass, and it's possible to incorporate it into the system, but figuring out the caster levels would be complex and something of a hassle. I do have some idea of how to handle multiclassing, but it will be a bit involved and if I have rules for it, it will require it's own chapter to explain. The fact that it goes off something akin to psionics helps, I'll probably be taking something from the Tome of Battle maneuver progressions if I do do it.

I may just make my own Quincy, I haven't had any real opportunity to balance them against each other. Zebedee said he had some changes he wanted to make, but I haven't seen him around in awhile.

[zadcap]

And an additional thought, a simple mechanic that probably needs adding... When a Paladin falls, they can instantly convert their level into Blackgaurd. I think that perhaps when a Quincy or Awakend Human dies, they should make a will save to become a shinigami of equal level. The will save is because, as far as I can tell from 99% of the anime/manga/movies, people dont remember their past life when they get sent to soul society. The ONLY exception I can think of is the little boy who was traped in the bird who befrended Chad. Of course, since the players should get to transform... A will save, if they pass they keep their memories and become a Shinigami of appropriate class and level, if they fail they make a shinigami of their level minus how much they failed the check by with no memory. Therefor, it should be around a DC15.

Change as youd like :smallbiggrin:

[ZebulonCrispi]

And an additional thought, a simple mechanic that probably needs adding... When a Paladin falls, they can instantly convert their level into Blackgaurd. I think that perhaps when a Quincy or Awakend Human dies, they should make a will save to become a shinigami of equal level. The will save is because, as far as I can tell from 99% of the anime/manga/movies, people dont remember their past life when they get sent to soul society. The ONLY exception I can think of is the little boy who was traped in the bird who befrended Chad. Of course, since the players should get to transform... A will save, if they pass they keep their memories and become a Shinigami of appropriate class and level, if they fail they make a shinigami of their level minus how much they failed the check by with no memory. Therefor, it should be around a DC15.

Change as youd like :smallbiggrin:

Give me an example of a Quincy or Awakened Human who dies and instantly becomes a high-level shinigami.

Spoiler tag it, naturally.

[zadcap]

... Ichigo?

Urahara explained that Rukia gave him her power, and that’s what he lost when Byakua stabbed him. He then goes on to explain that Ichigo had the potential within himself to be a shinigami without someone else making him one, so he knocks Ichigo out of his body and cuts his chain, killing Ichigo. He then throws him in a hole and says something like "Now you must find your power, or become a Hollow." Well, Ichigo finds his power, through what looked a lot like a will save, and gains Shikai almost instantly so he was probably higher level than he was when fighting Renji.
Even before that, he was a Human who could see and interact with spirits (Actually the only one of Ichigo's friends who could see a hollow instantly, vs. being knocked out of body or attacked by one for a while. The only other Human who could do that was his sister.)When Rukia trapped him in a kidou, he broke out of it and surprised Rukia a lot. When Rukia transferd her powers to him, she mentions that she only meant to give him a little, but he became so very powerful. In my opinion, being stabbed in the heart is lethal, and it was the instant transference into shinigami that stopped him from becoming a ghost.
In both cases he was a human who could see ghosts, died and became shinigami. Which makes me curious... is his body just a gigai now?

And you know, even if it isn't a perfect match, it would be more for the sake of the players than anything else. The show revolves around the afterlife, so a players death should NOT be an ending for them. If you wanted to follow the series better, they would become Hollow after they die, since odds are they were killed by a hollow and probably devoured by their killer. Without a resurection spell to bring players back to life death is a one way ticket, but it doesnt have to meen end of game. If the main character can die and become a shinigami, why can't the oh-so-powerfull players?

[NightmareToilet]

It's similar to human + celestial = half celestial
So, sub-race half-shinigami. Can see ethereal, etc.
And others are like touched, they got close to an otherworldy power and awakened powers themselves.

[Spirit Arrow]

Then how do you explain the Quincy. They can seemingly see spirits at birth.

[Bandededed]

I like zadcap's idea, so I may be biased, but
Quincy and spiritual humans have spirit power / reaitsu / whatever you translate that as. I know it was probably filler crap, but during the backstory that extended the Ichigo v. Renji round 2 fight, we saw that the main requirement for becoming a Shinigami was to have that spirit power (it also was the only reason anyone would be hungry in the afterlife).
So it is feasible that a human / person with spirit power could become a shinigami after they die. It's going about it that is the problem. I feel that it would be best represented by percentile dice. So for every level the ____ had, they would have a x% chance of retaining all of their HD and become a shinigami. Otherwise they lose so many HD per however far they miss their chance, although they can never go below 1 HD.

Edit: It should still require some kind of training to master the zanpakutou, though it would probably reflect the powers the _______ had in life.

[NightmareToilet]

Also, look at the case of Hitsugaiya. He was a little kid but look what was inside him, his powerful ice dragon. I have not seen the movie but I saw some preview with his backstory you can find on youtube and why he became a shinigami.

Maybe some of the people just have something others don't, in addition to some people getting it from a shinigami or special ancestry. Maybe he had a strong will and personality that develped such a powerful creature and such a powerful reiatsu for him to become a shinigami. See his backstory.

[NightmareToilet]

I hope you still plan on doing the dedicated warrior by itself.

I was thinking maybe a good way to show a difference is:

+1 level: you go lev 5 to 7 instead of 5 to 6: gets +1 level here.

This takes into account the spell training time the others have and makes your def and bab +1 better in comparison and gives you the level 6 and 7 abilities, feats, together, whereas the other guys spent time on spells.

What do you think?


Also, with twin mastery, those different shikai abilities don't count separately for bankai base, right, or do they?

[F.H. Zebedee]

Much as when we were discussing Spirit Warrior progressions, I can go and quote BtV. A Quincy that dies, (ahem, major plot point in Uryu/Mayuri's fight!) stays a Quincy without a physical body. Such was stated multiple times.

On the other hand, we do see a low level Spirit Warrior, Ichigo, gain Shinigami powers twice. I'm thinking that maybe we should use the Spellcraft skill to cover rituals.
-Pass the Dark Force: By thrusting their Zanpakutou through the heart of a subject, a Shinigami imbues them with Dark Force, Shinigami powers.
Requires a Spellcraft check (DC 15) by a Shinigami with their sealed Zanpakutou and the willing non-Shinigami subject present. If failed, the subject takes damage equal to a maximum damage roll critical hit by that Zanpakutou, and the ritual fails. If successful, the Shinigami performing the ritual and the subject of the ritual make opposing will saves. Whichever one has the higher result decides how many levels (up to one less than the performer of the ritual's level) are removed from the performer of the ritual, and for how long (with a maximum duration of permanent). The subject then gains that many levels in a Shinigami class of their choice, and loses all former levels.
The subject of this ritual may not unseal their Zanpakutou while they retain levels from this ritual. If they are killed in Spiritual form, then the levels automatically return to the performer of the ritual.
This ritual is a full-round action for the performer that does not provoke attacks of opportunity.

(Ichigo succeeded the will save, but remaining in character, chose the maximum possible ammount, which was somewhere between five and eight levels. Rukia's lack of a Zanpakutou for a while can be chalked up to flavor.)

Metamorphosis at the Boundries: When a soul's chain is cut, they tread the boundaries between Hollow and Shinigami. The war within their soul decides which path they take.
If an individual's Soul Chain is cut, roll 2d20 to determine the number of hours until it fully encroaches. While their Soul Chain is encroaching, an individual is always Shaken. At the end of that time period, the character is entitled to make a will save (DC 20+1 per hit die). If they fail, they become a Hollow, with hit dice equal to their previous form. If they succeed, the become a Shinigami of level equivalent to their previous hit dice.
This character automatically meets the prerequisites for taking Vizard levels at a later occasion.

(I'm assuming that Ichigo was a moderately leveled Spiritual Warrior, that dumped all his ability gains and such into flavor skills. I'd say at least level 7.)

Quincy were under ranged, as my playtesters pointed out. Maybe doubling their range should help fix them. I've been leaving them alone for a while, but I do need to fix them up.

As for my whereabouts, I've been working on my own version of the game, trying to go for a more "Bleach D20 Alpha" feeling, where the mechanics were a bit clunkier, but felt a tad more Bleach-y. Major differences? I've been tweaking the skills/casting systems for personal preferences (Namely redoing the skill list, and instead of using a previous casting system, trying to create one of my own, still using spell points.) Different feats, designed moreso for customizing characters within the system than for including D&D abilities.
Bullet point list?
-Shinigami are the version from before Final Shikai/Final Bankai was added, though those both are going to be filed under a feat.
-Quincy still need a fix, so that'll be on my list, up there with Kidou.
-Casting is going to be all homebrew spells that get rid of the D&D flavor in favor of Bleach style. Various metakidou feats included that are designed to avoid broken casters.
-Different Vizard and Spirit Warrior classes, both designed to be capable of semi-multiclassing with Quincy and Shinigami (So that one can make Spirit Warrior/Quincy Vizard)
-Different Skill list, eliminating useless/contrived skills from D20 while adding some to fix the flavor. Different feat list with some toned down epic feats and powered up basic feats.
-Hollows aren't template based, but individual monsters. I need to create some rules about various templates to add to them, and also about being a Vizard.
-Oh, and Shinigami give big bonuses (+4) to all physical stats, while Quincies get three +2s to burn on any stat they like. Though 90% of the time, at least two of those go into dexterity. -_-

I'm not saying that my version is superior, far from it. It's just moreso designed for my style of DMing and the tastes of my players. I'd say BtV's system is much sleeker and more efficient, more towards 3.5 ed style with ease of play while mine's more towards 2nd ed, more clunky and taking more work, but asserting more flavor.

[Spirit Arrow]

Zeb glad to see you're still alive! Life catch up with ya?

Also I like your idea for bestowing shinigami powers. It can explain later levels in shinigami.

[Ryvaken]

Book 8 chapter 62 page 5. Urahara states that the typical corrosion process takes months or years. Ichigo's little hole in the ground was constructed to accelerate the process to 72 hours. This was not the first or last time Urahara manipulated events in ways that directly impacted Ichigo's power.

[FelixZ]

There's theories that the Vizard were once Urahara's squad members and that he is pulling the strings behind EVERYTHING in the series.


$500 on that theory holding true. :smallbiggrin:

[zadcap]

Book 8 chapter 62 page 5. Urahara states that the typical corrosion process takes months or years. Ichigo's little hole in the ground was constructed to accelerate the process to 72 hours. This was not the first or last time Urahara manipulated events in ways that directly impacted Ichigo's power.

If thats said twords me, I know this quite well. Mr. Shadow King is my favorite character by far :smallwink:
However, even then, when that chain runs out something happens to a person. Most will become weak Hollow, but in the time it takes before that happens a strong soul, namely a mid to high level awakend human, should be capable of taking the power they had as a human and taking it out in the form of a zampakuto. If Orihime were to die, her zampakuto would be the farries. Her sealed form... think Nanao, it's known she has one, but its invisable. Her shikai would be able to project a powerfull sheild and give off a healing aura(Barrier and Healing type zampakuto) and her Bankai... would be the same thing with stats doubled.
And Chad... Sadly, he seems like prime Arancar material. His powers are referd to by manny as very Hollow-like.

[FelixZ]

He even stated himself that his arm blast is a cero.

[F.H. Zebedee]

Here's my take on Arrancar and Vizards, both of which are considerably different. Also noted, I don't use the Captain prestige class, so it ended up being a bit odd with progressions.
ARRANCAR: My take on Arrancar is the opposite of BtV's, placing a limit on the growth of a Hollow instead of removing their limitations, a sort of "Cap". It is designed with ease of application in mind, though it is less modular than the official one.

Arrancar
Some Hollows decide to remove their mask, the force binding them into their animalistic bodies. When they do such, they gain the ability to restrain their powers while gaining the powers of a Shinigami.

Hit Die: D12
Skill Points: 4+Int
Saves: An Arrancar has two good save progressions and one poor.
Class Skills: An Arrancar receives six skills as class skills, in addition to any skills that it had a racial bonus to while it was a Hollow.

Requirements:
Special: Any Hollow. It must have succeeded a DC 30 or higher Will save at some point, or make a DC 25 Knowledge (Spirits) check.
Level Base Attack Bonus Special
1st +1 Transformation, Zanpakutou, Zanpakutou Ability, Natural Armor +1

2nd +2 +1 DR, Power Unmasked +1

3rd +3 +2 Constitution, Improved Natural Attack 1

4th +4 Zanpakutou Ability

5th +5 +1 DR, +1 Natural Armor

6th +6 Bonus Feat, Power Unmasked +2

7th +7 Improved Natural Attack 2, +2 Constitution, Zanpakutou Ability

8th +8 Zanpakutou Ability, Bonus Feat

9th +9 +1 DR

10th +10 Zanpakutou Ability, +1 Natural Armor, +2 Constitution, Power Unmasked +3

Transformation: When becoming an Arrancar, a Hollow undergoes several major changes.
*Change its size to Medium. All modifiers are applied, except for to ability scores, which remain the same.
*The Hollow loses all special attacks and attributes except for Cero, Gran Rey Cero, Bala, Consumption, and their DR (both normal and Hollow). They lose all move speeds other than their normal one.
*The Hollow retains all feats, ability scores, skills and skill modifiers, BAB, HP, and Saves from when they were a Hollow. They retain their natural armor bonus to AC.
*They lose all natural attacks, and gain a Zanpakutou and Unarmed Strike, both of which deal damage equal to their most damaging former Natural Attack.
*They have their INT, WIS, and CHA increased by 2 each. If these stats totaled still remain under 35, increase their CON, STR, and DEX by 2 each.

Zanpakutou: An Arrancar’s Zanpakutou acts as both a weapon and a focus to help them store up power. When releasing their Zanpakutou, an Arrancar doesn’t only gain the Zanpakutou abilities, they also regain all former movement speeds, special attacks, natural attacks, and special attributes. Upon gaining this ability, they may choose to make it so that when releasing their Zanpakutou, they change their size to match the size of their original Hollow form. If doing so, they receive all modifiers connected to the size change.

Zanpakutou Abilities: Arrancar only have a single release for their Zanpakutou. The abilities used for this are the same as Shinigami shikai abilities.

Natural Armor Bonuses: Arrancar are known for being capable of shrugging off even the most powerful assaults. Every time this appears, they receive a cumulative +1 natural armor bonus to their AC.

DR: An Arrancar’s skin can deflect even the steel of a Zanpakutou. Every time this appears, increase their damage reduction by 1/-.

Power Unmasked: An Arrancar gathers power to such a degree that few Hollows can even compare. Wherever this appears, increase the enhancement bonus on the Arrancar’s Natural Attacks, Zanpakutou, and Unarmed Strike by 1.

Constitution: An Arrancar’s exceeding strength makes it difficult to deal a lasting injury to. Every time that you see this, increase their Constitution by the shown amount.

Improved Natural Attack: As an Arrancar grows, their powers as a Hollow grow as well. Increase the damage dealt by all of their natural attacks by one step. This occurs each time it appears.

Total Class Benefits: +2 to all mental statistics, 5 Zanpakutou Abilities, +3 Natural Armor, +3 DR/-, +6 Constitution (total: +8), +3 Enhancement Bonus to Zanpakutou, Unarmed strikes, and Natural Attacks, and all natural attacks improved by 2 steps


VIZARD: My Vizard class, similarly, is designed to fit more snugly within the 20 level spread (personally, I find that with Bankai at 12, going anywhere above 20 is bordering on absurd, boss territory. E.G. Captain Aizen) It also is designed to be compatible with Spirit Warriors and Quincy, a little touch that I included for plot reasons for my campaign. In a sense, it's almost substitution levels for Shinigami, though it requires a Semi-obnoxious 1st level of disadvantages before it can become an asset.

I'm thinking of including a stacking feat that allows for extended Mask use, though not by more than 15 rounds total.
Vizard
Sometimes, Shinigami begin to manifest Hollow powers. On such occasions, they usually train to learn to suppress and control these powers, rather than letting the powers begin to control them.

Hit Die: D12

Requirements:
Class:
Any Class, 5+ Levels
Special: To initially take a first level in this class, a character must somehow indicate developing Hollow powers.
To gain a level in this class beyond 2nd requires that another Vizard, or an individual taught in their ways, be on hand to train them.

Level Base Attack Bonus Fort Save Ref Save Will Save Special
1st N/A +1 +1 +0 Hollow Manifestation, Fortunate Mask

2nd N/A +2 +2 +2 Restrain Spirit, Masked Form, 2 Masked Form Abilities

3rd N/A +3 +3 +3 2 Masked Form Abilities

4th N/A +4 +4 +4 2 Masked Form Abilities

5th N/A +5 +5 +5 2 Masked Form Abilities, Masked Adaptation

Shinigami Levels: A character taking Vizard levels continues gaining BAB, Skill Points, Weapon damage and abilities, and Spellcasting progressions as if they were still taking levels in whatever class they have the most levels in. If taking levels in another class after Vizard levels, they gain the special abilities from the levels they missed by taking Vizard levels instead of those for their current Shinigami level, while continuing with their class’s BAB, Weapon damage and abilities, and Spellcasting progressions.
Hollow Manifestation: If a character has less than 2x(total class level) HP remaining at the start of a turn, then they must make a Will Save, DC 20. A character may intentionally fail this save. If failing this save, a Hollow Mask appears on the character’s face, and the character enters Berserk Form. While in Berserk Form, the character gains 8 STR and 8 CON. While in Berserk Form, a character is in a wild frenzy, consumed by pure bloodlust. The only actions they may take are actions intended to somehow attack or harm a character they see as an enemy, and may not use Spellcasting of any sort. While in Berserk Form, a character sees all characters in range, including their allies, as enemies. At the beginning of every turn that a character is in Berserk Form, they may attempt to make a Will save (DC 20-((CHA Modifier)+(Number of Turns They’ve been in Berserk Form)). If they succeed, they tear off the mask and revert to normal.
Fortunate Mask: Whenever this character is hit by an attack that would kill them, roll a Fortitude save, and reduce the damage they take from that attack by the result of the save. This ability may only function once per day. After it is used, a mask is found at the site of the wound.
Masked Form: At 2nd level, Vizard learn how to control their Hollow powers, if only for a short time. They gain access to Masked Form, and may transform into it as a full round action that doesn’t provoke attacks of opportunity once per day per Vizard level. A character may voluntarily exit Masked Form as a free action.
Masked Form lasts for a number of turns equal to a character’s Vizard level. In Masked Form, a character has +20 Feet of Speed, +4 STR, +4 CON, and +4 DEX. In this form, their eyes change color and a hollow mask forms over their face/head. In addition to the statistic increases from Masked Form, a character may pick a number of additional Masked Form abilities per level stated above. These abilities may be used only when in Masked Form.
Masked Form Abilities:
*Damage Resistance: This character gains DR 3/-. This ability may be taken a maximum number of times equal to this character’s Vizard level, each time stacking.
*Cero Blast: Once every (15-Constitution Modifier) rounds, as a Standard Action that provokes attacks of opportunity, this character may fire a Cero Blast attack. A Cero Blast is a ranged attack that deals Xd4 Force damage, where X is the number of hit dice this character has, and has a range of 80 feet. Apply DEX modifier and this character’s highest BAB for the roll To Hit. The targeted character may make a Reflex Save (DC 5+This Character’s Hit Dice) for half damage. This counts as taking two Masked Form abilities.
*Gran Rey Cero: Once every (30-Constitution Modifier) rounds, this character may use a Gran Rey Cero attack as a full round action. It is treated as a Cero Blast attack, but with a range of 200 feet, and dealing xd6 Force Damage. The save DC for a Gran Rey Cero is (10+this character’s hit dice.) To take this ability, one must have already taken the Cero ability.
*Bala: This character may, as a standard action, make a Bala attack. A Bala attack is a ranged attack that deals xd4 Force damage, where X is one quarter of this character’s hit dice. A Bala attack has a range of 100 feet, and applies DEX modifiers and this character’s highest BAB for the to hit roll. The targeted character may make a Reflex Save (DC 5+This Character’s Hit Dice) for half damage. To take this ability, one must have already taken the Cero ability.
*Enhanced Speed: This character increases their speed by 10 feet. This ability may be taken multiple times, and its effects stack.
*Enhanced Strength: This character has an additional +3 STR while in Masked Form. This ability may be taken multiple times, and it stacks.
*Shrug Off: This character receives a +1 Racial Bonus on all Saving Throws. This ability may be taken multiple times, and its effects stack.
*Heal Wounds: At the start of every turn, this character heals HP equal to their Vizard level. This ability may be taken multiple times, and stacks.
*Enhanced Stamina: This character has an additional +2 CON and 5 additional Temporary Hit Points while in Masked Form. This ability may be taken multiple times, and its effects stack.
*Enhanced Reflexes: This character has an additional +3 DEX while in Masked Form. This ability may be taken multiple times, and its stacks.
*Persistent Transformation: This character’s Masked Form lasts one additional turn. This ability may be taken multiple times, and it stacks.

Restrain Spirit: At 2nd level, a Vizard learns how to better control their inner Hollow. They lose the Hollow Manifestation ability.
Masked Adaptation: At fifth level, a Vizard has become comfortable enough with their masked form that they can stay in it longer. They can now stay in Masked form three turns per Vizard level.
So, that's my two variant classes. Feel free to use them in your games if you want.

Next thing I give y'all will be my update to the Quincies. I know exactly what I'm doing, I just need to type it all out.

[merrja666]

I know that this is off topic e.g. not discussing the latest episode in the Hueco Mundo Arc, and how it affects everything, but is there a place where all the files are zipped or can be found easily? Thanks.

[Dante & Vergil]

On the other hand, we do see a low level Spirit Warrior, Ichigo, gain Shinigami powers twice. I'm thinking that maybe we should use the Spellcraft skill to cover rituals.
-Pass the Dark Force: By thrusting their Zanpakutou through the heart of a subject, a Shinigami imbues them with Dark Force, Shinigami powers.
Requires a Spellcraft check (DC 15) by a Shinigami with their sealed Zanpakutou and the willing non-Shinigami subject present. If failed, the subject takes damage equal to a maximum damage roll critical hit by that Zanpakutou, and the ritual fails. If successful, the Shinigami performing the ritual and the subject of the ritual make opposing will saves. Whichever one has the higher result decides how many levels (up to one less than the performer of the ritual's level) are removed from the performer of the ritual, and for how long (with a maximum duration of permanent). The subject then gains that many levels in a Shinigami class of their choice, and loses all former levels.
The subject of this ritual may not unseal their Zanpakutou while they retain levels from this ritual. If they are killed in Spiritual form, then the levels automatically return to the performer of the ritual.
This ritual is a full-round action for the performer that does not provoke attacks of opportunity.

(Ichigo succeeded the will save, but remaining in character, chose the maximum possible ammount, which was somewhere between five and eight levels. Rukia's lack of a Zanpakutou for a while can be chalked up to flavor.)

Metamorphosis at the Boundries: When a soul's chain is cut, they tread the boundaries between Hollow and Shinigami. The war within their soul decides which path they take.
If an individual's Soul Chain is cut, roll 2d20 to determine the number of hours until it fully encroaches. While their Soul Chain is encroaching, an individual is always Shaken. At the end of that time period, the character is entitled to make a will save (DC 20+1 per hit die). If they fail, they become a Hollow, with hit dice equal to their previous form. If they succeed, the become a Shinigami of level equivalent to their previous hit dice.
This character automatically meets the prerequisites for taking Vizard levels at a later occasion.

(I'm assuming that Ichigo was a moderately leveled Spiritual Warrior, that dumped all his ability gains and such into flavor skills. I'd say at least level 7.)

That's something I've really wanted to see for this.


As for my whereabouts, I've been working on my own version of the game, trying to go for a more "Bleach D20 Alpha" feeling, where the mechanics were a bit clunkier, but felt a tad more Bleach-y.

Have you put this "Bleach D20 Alpha" on the forums? If you havn't please do.

[F.H. Zebedee]

All it is is BtV's system with different peripheral classes, skills, feats, and spells, and slightly tweaked Shinigami (Bankai is handled differently, Level 5 Shikai.)

I will post my feat list and spell list when I get around to them.

[NightmareToilet]

So if the vizard or shinigami and an arancar had a child ...?

It should have access to both shinigami and hollow abilities?

Would you give it a mask or how would you handle it?

As for devour, it was mentioned that even devouring 3000 did nothing to improve Grimm's companions, but he had a different ability or destiny.

And the one espada could devour and get abilities but said he was the only one who could advance that way, so it is not something they all get?

[Xuincherguixe]

I got to thinking. Hollows don't seem like they'd be good as a player option, but Arrancar are much more viable. The big thing here is that Hollow's have lost their humanity. Arrancar get at least some of it back.

So, in a similar way to how Ichigo is a human who obtained Shinigami powers, a human character might have Hollow ones. So...

(spoiler for plot points which probably have been mentioned already anyways but I I thought it was courteous to spoiler this.)

What if they released their Hollow, and smashed their mask? I'm thinking the above might involve some sort of will save. With a reasonable dose of "power of plot".

The Hōgyoku (Wikipedia's spelling) is another way to go about it, but it seems a more cumbersome method.

The problem with the smashing of the mask, is about how much humanity Arrancar regain. (Or in this hypothetical scenario, retain) DM fiat certainly can resolve the problem. Either they could say that despite the odds, somehow they became a complete Arrancar. Or that despite being incomplete, in the important ways they are still human. They only will be perceived as a monster.

A mask smashing human seems like a good way to make one of these "Complete" Arrancar alluded too. A Hollow who has never devoured another person's soul (we'll assume they haven't gone out of control) and doesn't go through some cheap short cut. A pure will that demands their humanity. Just being hungry for power doesn't seem to stack up against that.

If another hypothetical situation similar occurred in which some villain (by which I mean an awful person who probably but not necessarily is a non player character) wishes for power, they would almost certainly fall while short. Their Agenda would have to be a very human one.

This line of thinking brought something else to my mind. A hollow smashing ones one mask. The mask is only a symbol. The smashing of a mask to become an Arrancar should be symbolic too. The problem with this is that Masks can definitely be harmed. Either a Hollow's mask regenerates if they didn't really have the desire to be something different, or a Hollow's physical force is useless against it's own mask only.


I know that you said that the Arrancar in the Heuco Mundo Arc are complete, but it seemed like a good use of the ambiguity.


An Arrancar, or some other form of Human Hollow would work great in a game in which no one is on the players side.


I apologize if this question has been answered already, but what would happen if a human became an Arrancar in the fashion described in the spoiler. Would some of their class levels become hit dice? Or do they keep their old class levels? Or, would they be replaced with levels as Shinigami?

I suggest having the hollow powers leave the body, but in Bleach only Ichigo ever does this. The spiritually aware humans are always in their bodies. When they need to travel to other worlds, they have their bodies converted.

The theoretical Arrancar player would most likely be an Augmenter, or possibly a Manifester. Would they now need to separate from their body? Would they have already lost it? The best way I think to handle it would be to assume that when they activate their powers, they also have a broken mask. Their focus already a Zanpakto equivalent. As an Arrancar, they would have the ability to "release" that focus, and get a Hollow like shell. Which could look very weird if they're say, flying.

If hollows don't work as PCs, it doesn't make much sense to level as one. If they're gaining Hollow Hit Dice, we've already established their's a way they can work, and we don't actually need Arrancar anymore. They might still become one, but they don't NEED to.


I suppose in the end I know more or less how to handle all this. So it's more like a list of suggestions than anything. And pretty much to everyone writing up rules. Still I think I'm onto something with the Arrancar players.

I've also been thinking about making my own Bleach Adaptation using the Shadowrun rules. Probably won't happen though. If it does, I'll start a thread and probably put a link on my profile. Since I procrastinate like crazy, I don't want anyone to get their hopes up. But really, how many people would be at all interested in a Shadowrun Bleach anyways?

[Dante & Vergil]

So if the vizard or shinigami and an arancar had a child ...?

That's saying if it is possible for a vizard or shinigami to mate with an arrancar. I don't even think that spiritual beings can have childeren. (Unless they are using a gigai. See Ichigo's dad as an example.)


It should have access to both shinigami and hollow abilities?

If they can mate, that will be a likely result.


Would you give it a mask or how would you handle it?

Since we haven't seen anything like this, I really couldn't say but your free to come up with something.


As for devour, it was mentioned that even devouring 3000 did nothing to improve Grimm's companions, but he had a different ability or destiny. And the one espada could devour and get abilities but said he was the only one who could advance that way, so it is not something they all get?

I think the number is just flavor fluff. If a hollow devoured 3000 souls they would deffinitly reach the 20th level gap a long time ago. On the other hand, I think because he can't become an Adjuchas that becoming one should be a little more difficult. (The hollow I think your thinking of is Shawlong Koufang.)

[zadcap]

If hollows don't work as PCs, it doesn't make much sense to level as one. If they're gaining Hollow Hit Dice, we've already established their's a way they can work, and we don't actually need Arrancar anymore. They might still become one, but they don't NEED to.

You bring up a good point. At the moment, Hollow is either a template or a monster, but Arrancar is a prestige class. Would it not make more mechanic sense to make Arrancar a template as well? One HD in it is an 'incomplete' arrancar, like the early/filler ones, then more HD gains more powers. Espada arnt a class, just the strongest of the arrancar.

And coincidentaly, something brought up somewhere else, the characters are prety much plowing through the Espada. Earlier in the series, it was said that just 10 Vasto Lorde would be able to destroy all of soul society. It has no affect on anything yet, but that implys that Vasto Lorde are stronger than even Espada. If anything should be allowed epic levels, it's them. In fact, I might consider breaking out my Dieties and Demigods book when Tite introduces them.
And to keep going... I'm predicting they will show up after Aizen. The plot rolls on.

[NightmareToilet]

I think maybe devour plus another req, like a high con score, or make a save on a couple scores, otherwise they don't have the ability to ascend. Grimmjow eventually got his scores up, made a save, but the others he was with were too far away from being able to pass it and so devouring failed them and they said devour us. I wouldnt put it to just flavor. Maybe every 100 devoured could raise a score by 1 pt (like the old system with str having 1/100th in it). So you devour a load, make a save to get an increase, or something, maybe.

Considering the "technology" they have, I'd say procreation could be possible, at least if assisted by wierd technology.

Of course with gigai, you could have a quincy gigai, a bount gigai (both would be illegal), a manifester gigai maybe? No, maybe those powers go to the soul in the bodies rather than the bodies.

But yeah, when the hollow becomes an arrancar, only the one Rukia faced had the ability to increase, he said. The others switched to shinigami levels, apparently, but that one could do both due to a special ability?


Fire zanpakuto: how about a lava attack?

Hey I just was watching an early episode and Rukia was using a load of hand signs for her spell on grand fisher, like they do in Naruto, just noticed that.

Maybe the list can be built up using spells from naruto also. In fact, the two look easy to combine, with manifesters like sharingan and other things would fit. Thus, you get a human spellcaster ability. I think it works!
And the Reaper would actually be a Vasto Lord, then.

[Dante & Vergil]

And coincidentaly, something brought up somewhere else, the characters are prety much plowing through the Espada. Earlier in the series, it was said that just 10 Vasto Lorde would be able to destroy all of soul society. It has no affect on anything yet, but that implys that Vasto Lorde are stronger than even Espada. If anything should be allowed epic levels, it's them. In fact, I might consider breaking out my Dieties and Demigods book when Tite introduces them.
And to keep going... I'm predicting they will show up after Aizen. The plot rolls on.

If you look at the hollow's outline when Hitsugaya gives the description of the Vasto Lorde, it looks suspiciously like Ulquiorra. It is also said by Ashido when the group is in the Forest of the Menos that there are Vasto Lorde in Las Noches. So I assume that Aizen has atleast 1-2 Vasto Lorde in the Espada.

[zadcap]

if Ulquiorra is one, then I am terrified of the numbers lower than him. And for Aizen to control them... But then again, he IS taking an unbeleivably long time getting out of that thing.



But yeah, when the hollow becomes an arrancar, only the one Rukia faced had the ability to increase, he said. The others switched to shinigami levels, apparently, but that one could do both due to a special ability?

No, he said he's the only one capable of infinate growth. The others have room, but only he can go on forever.
Probably because he doesnt just get stronger when he eats someone, he gains their power. Why, he could even eat Ulquiorra and instantly turn himself into a Vasto Lorde, hmm?

[F.H. Zebedee]

Yeah, the ones they've been tearing through have mostly been adjuchas. Ulquiorra, and presumably the two above him, are most likely Vasto Lorde material. Nell Tu was most likely at the upper limit of Adjuchas at the peak of her power. And yeah, Vasto Lordes are definately epic, since it's been implied that most Shinigami couldn't really stand a chance against them.

10 of them could take out Soul Society? Who gave that estimate, again? Soul Society has the Gotei 13, which was, until Aizen went traitor, two level 20 Shinigamis (Aizen and Yamamoto), and eleven Shinigami that were around level 14-18. Not to mention Lieutenants, all around levels 5/6ish-11 (Plus Renji, at 12-14, Ikkaku, also in that range, and Ayasegawa, who is implied to be at 10/11). Then, there's hundreds of lacky level Shinigami that are a non-factor, and the non-Gotei 13 corps, which are implied to also be pretty beefy. (The fact that Soifon has never used Bankai is really questionable. Yoruichi says that 12 of the captains can use Bankai, but it seems that she's been out of touch for a while.)

(The D20 SRD calculator, when fed only estimated Captains/Bankai users, put the captains (Plus Renji and Ikkaku) at a party ECL of 20.6. So, 10 CR 20s actually would be a major threat, and would probably outright kill a major number of the Seated Officers, Lieutenants, and low Captains. And that was BEFORE losing Aizen, Gin, and Tosen.) (After losing them, they're down to ECL 19.3)

So, my word on it? Vasto Lordes COULD be CR20, though that's most likely only in my No-Epic version. They'd probably be low-epic in this system, up there with Captain Aizen (who, even by my scale, is Expert 20, most likely Vizard 4/5)

[zadcap]

It was Hitsugaya actualy. Looked for it, he actualy said 10 of them under Aizen, so it's just the 9 captains now. That puts them on par with captains, Wikipedia says they are slightly stronger than the average, so by your system they're 18ish.
Thinking on it... what scares me mroe is what tite will do next. Progresivly stronger characters, right? Something stronger than Vasto Lorde... Kenpachi learns Bankai?

[NightmareToilet]

hm, but Aizen supposedly mastered all 4 paths, so how does he do that by level 20? That means all kidou, all shunpo, all zanpakuto, and and hand to hand. Maybe the scale should go up to level 30 for folks like Aizen, before they have to go vizard to keep going. Oh, well, or he is level 20 max but 4 times! So that is character level, gack, 80!? Or say there are prestige classes for each of the 4 paths, then he has 10 levels in each plus ten to begin with is still level 50.

[F.H. Zebedee]

I did Aizen as a sort of Rule 0 class, since "Captain Broken" wouldn't work well in player's hands. He had full BAB, all Good saves, max skill points per level, full casting, and full Zanpakutou and Shunpo progressions. The Vizard levels were left out, since they just kinda- Well, my players IRL are level 1, and we're starting out with the plot a few months before Bleach proper.

If any of them does a valiant rush at Aizen, using out of character knowledge, even doing subdual damage would leave them comatose for days... :smallsigh: Though maybe they'd deserve it.

Not to mention that Vizard levels would be total overkill, since he already had something like 400 HP.

For those that want to be LESS DM fiat, go Spellcaster, and give him a sick score for point buying his stats. 80 point buy? (just winging out a stupid number. Something that could put his STR at a +10 modifier, at least, and his Dex and Con at ungodly sums, as well. All the while keeping his Cha, Wis, and Int at at least 20.)

OOC: Or, if you don't mind overkill on it, he can just be a Level 18 spellcaster with the Paragon template. Makes sense, though it's CR 33, and nigh invincible to ANYTHING.

[Sin]

I finished reading everything in this thread mid yesterday, and waoa, I must say I'm fantastically enthused with your version, Void. My friends and I are hardcore freaking gamers and have been looking to utilize a well balanced Bleach d20 campaign for sometime, but didn't have the time to develop a system for it ourselves. We have all been extremely impressed and plan on starting a game within the next week or so.

Somethings caught our eyes however, and need clairification. I have a great memory and rememebr just about everything covered in the thread thus far, but I just want ot make sure. Additionally, I've been editing the compendium you have posted for grammatical errors as I've been reading (no offense, just a habit I;ve developed while, well, being a freelance editor).

You can be sure to expect a great deal of detailed feedback relating to gameplay, mechanics, and balance overall. We're all quite keen to see this become a highly polished finished product. Additionally, you can count on our replies being founded primarily by directed evidence from Bleach canon, not fan-theories.

1) I know you touched on it already, but would like it reviewed: Should you take Specialized Zanpakutou, you recieve two bonus shikai abilities instead of the normal two weapon types and one starting Shikai ability. Does the bonus shikai ability granted by this feat get doubled for Bankai purposes?

2) With reference to Captain class, you may have touched on it, but I simply can't recall: Many of the Shinigami abilities scale with level. Does taking the Captain Prestige class forfeit the progression of all of these abilities, or do they still progress as if the captain was taking levels of the original class? I require specific details regarding each of the following-Shunpo, Kidou, class bonus feats, saves, BAB, Zanpakutou base dmg & defense bonus progressions.

3) After multiple build tests, the Dedicated Warrior feat proves to have mechanical issues, specifically in relation to charictars which take the Captain PrC. It proves helpful, but if the Captain prc abilities negate the progression of class bonus feats, but allow Kidou progression (based off of class table categorizations, then the feat loses nearly all it's worth as a Kidou substituter (not to mention having to lose a feat just by virtue of taking Dedicated Warrior to get the substitution initially.

4) I have not personally begun analyzing the gritty mechanics and balnce issues between Quincy/SA's and Shinigami yet, but my team assures me that there are significant balance issues regarding the current layout for Quincy. Landing, im told, 95% in the Quincy's favor. I'll get specifics for you bu mid next week regarding Quincy balance.

5) You've made a number of old abilities available as feats in your version, and have created new feats which by flavor would fit mechically and flavorfully in the Warrior Shinigami's bonus feat list (aka. Fighter bonus feats). Do you have intentions to list any as such? And/or for Expert? As you already have metamagic feats available for the spellcaster list, but no concern is raised there because you do not have any homebrewed metamagic feats on your list.

There are many more, but it's very late for me and my daily schedule, so I will bring them up with you to address at a later time. I look foreward to you and your team's response to my questions. Things likely to take priority on my next posting will be Vizard, Arrancar, and Hollow abilities.

My team and I will convene and get suggestions for you if you desire more constructive input on mechanical balance, etc. Simply ask in your reply post.

Thank you very much for your hard work,
-Sin & Advocates

[Sin]

Wow, I just read my own post this morning. I must say I really should refrain from doing such extended posts so late in the evening. All too many grammar errors and run on sentences... But, I think it's well enough to sustain basic scrutiny (i.e. I was understandable). Again, I look foreward to the design team's responses.

Later today sometime, I should have feedback on some of the other balance issues I have noted or taken notes on and will post for you guys to potentially address. Notwithstanding a potential explaination for their current structure in the mechanics.

Thanks you,
-Sin

[Behold_the_Void]

I finished reading everything in this thread mid yesterday, and waoa, I must say I'm fantastically enthused with your version, Void. My friends and I are hardcore freaking gamers and have been looking to utilize a well balanced Bleach d20 campaign for sometime, but didn't have the time to develop a system for it ourselves. We have all been extremely impressed and plan on starting a game within the next week or so.

Somethings caught our eyes however, and need clairification. I have a great memory and rememebr just about everything covered in the thread thus far, but I just want ot make sure. Additionally, I've been editing the compendium you have posted for grammatical errors as I've been reading (no offense, just a habit I;ve developed while, well, being a freelance editor).

You can be sure to expect a great deal of detailed feedback relating to gameplay, mechanics, and balance overall. We're all quite keen to see this become a highly polished finished product. Additionally, you can count on our replies being founded primarily by directed evidence from Bleach canon, not fan-theories.

1) I know you touched on it already, but would like it reviewed: Should you take Specialized Zanpakutou, you recieve two bonus shikai abilities instead of the normal two weapon types and one starting Shikai ability. Does the bonus shikai ability granted by this feat get doubled for Bankai purposes?

2) With reference to Captain class, you may have touched on it, but I simply can't recall: Many of the Shinigami abilities scale with level. Does taking the Captain Prestige class forfeit the progression of all of these abilities, or do they still progress as if the captain was taking levels of the original class? I require specific details regarding each of the following-Shunpo, Kidou, class bonus feats, saves, BAB, Zanpakutou base dmg & defense bonus progressions.

3) After multiple build tests, the Dedicated Warrior feat proves to have mechanical issues, specifically in relation to charictars which take the Captain PrC. It proves helpful, but if the Captain prc abilities negate the progression of class bonus feats, but allow Kidou progression (based off of class table categorizations, then the feat loses nearly all it's worth as a Kidou substituter (not to mention having to lose a feat just by virtue of taking Dedicated Warrior to get the substitution initially.

4) I have not personally begun analyzing the gritty mechanics and balnce issues between Quincy/SA's and Shinigami yet, but my team assures me that there are significant balance issues regarding the current layout for Quincy. Landing, im told, 95% in the Quincy's favor. I'll get specifics for you bu mid next week regarding Quincy balance.

5) You've made a number of old abilities available as feats in your version, and have created new feats which by flavor would fit mechically and flavorfully in the Warrior Shinigami's bonus feat list (aka. Fighter bonus feats). Do you have intentions to list any as such? And/or for Expert? As you already have metamagic feats available for the spellcaster list, but no concern is raised there because you do not have any homebrewed metamagic feats on your list.

There are many more, but it's very late for me and my daily schedule, so I will bring them up with you to address at a later time. I look foreward to you and your team's response to my questions. Things likely to take priority on my next posting will be Vizard, Arrancar, and Hollow abilities.

My team and I will convene and get suggestions for you if you desire more constructive input on mechanical balance, etc. Simply ask in your reply post.

Thank you very much for your hard work,
-Sin & Advocates

I appreciate both grammar checking and detailed reviews of the system, they help me fix things up. I've gone through to edit things and corrected grammar as I see it, right now I've been word-dumping and it's easy to screw things up.

So, to address the points:

1. I'll add this text to the feat, but these extra shikai abilities DO get doubled in your bankai form.

2. For all prestige classes, aside from what is specifically replaced in the progression, assume you had been advancing in your regular base class for purposes of the prestige class. BAB, saves, shunpo, casting, bonus feats, all that stays the same.

3. I'll fix the text to make sure Bonus Feats are included. The idea is that the only thing changed is zanpakutou progression, everything else stays the same.

4. Zebedee made the Quincy, but definitely post the problems you see and we'll find a way to fix it.

5. I definitely want to make a bonus feat list at some point, but because of the wealth of splatbooks, I've not yet had the chance to go through all of the feats around. I'll try to get the Core, Psionic and extra feats into a bonus feat list soon.

Keep the mechanical feedback coming, it helps a lot.

And I may bring other requirements to the table for ascending to higher levels of hollow, but I can't do anything until we actually get a confirmed Vasto Lorde.

[Sin]

I have some time available, so I figured I'd drop in and make mention of the other items to which I referred previously.

The 'Drain Reiatsu' ability entry, under Blood-type Shikai, is incomplete. It says,
You may make a single ranged touch attack with a range of 25 ft.+5 for every 2 levels you possess.But that is all it says. Could you perhaps elaborate?

Mettle and Improved Mettle are still not listed as an ability aquirable as a feat. Multiple posts in the thread have indicated that they are available as feats for this system, but likely due to accidental oversight, they remain omitted from the manual. So this one is just an FYI.


With regard to augmenting Kidou:

Kidou also may be augmented, by spending extra spell points on them they can be made more powerful. You cannot spend more spell points on kidou than your level (thus, an 8th level spellcaster shinigami may spend up to 8 spell points on any given kidou). Warrior Shinigami may only spend spell points equal to half their level (rounded down) on kidou, and only one fourth their level (rounded down) on incantation-less kidou.
Is this section simply still under development? How do you plan on dealing with augmenting Kidou on the whole? Will it be on a spell-by-spell basis? Or will you utilize a system like that utilized for a basic d20 psionics system, where the augments available to you must be aquired through metakidou feats (i.e. conversions of metamagic/metapsionic feats)? Extremely curious here, as there are multiple players in my group who are anxious to play significantly or completely Kidou-oriented Shinigami characters.

I'm also curious to know if you plan to draw up rules for characters like Urahara's two little'uns? Or would you fit those under the category of SA's and work on expanding the list of the SAs' available abilities later?

Regards,
-Sin & Advocates

[Behold_the_Void]

I have some time available, so I figured I'd drop in and make mention of the other items to which I referred previously.

The 'Drain Reiatsu' ability entry, under Blood-type Shikai, is incomplete. It says, But that is all it says. Could you perhaps elaborate?

Mettle and Improved Mettle are still not listed as an ability aquirable as a feat. Multiple posts in the thread have indicated that they are available as feats for this system, but likely due to accidental oversight, they remain omitted from the manual. So this one is just an FYI.


With regard to augmenting Kidou:

Is this section simply still under development? How do you plan on dealing with augmenting Kidou on the whole? Will it be on a spell-by-spell basis? Or will you utilize a system like that utilized for a basic d20 psionics system, where the augments available to you must be aquired through metakidou feats (i.e. conversions of metamagic/metapsionic feats)? Extremely curious here, as there are multiple players in my group who are anxious to play significantly or completely Kidou-oriented Shinigami characters.

I'm also curious to know if you plan to draw up rules for characters like Urahara's two little'uns? Or would you fit those under the category of SA's and work on expanding the list of the SAs' available abilities later?

Regards,
-Sin & Advocates

Crap, didn't finish that one. Drain Reiatsu is likely going to drain spell points.

Mettle and Improved Mettle are an oversight, I'll get them up in the next update.

Basically, the Kidou system is exactly like Psionics, sans the Psionic Focus requirement to use Metakidou feats. All of the kidou listed already appear in the psionics handbook, and those that are augmentable can be augmented as normal. Assume Metapsionic feats are the ones to use when getting such feats for a caster.

[Sin]

I appreciate both grammar checking and detailed reviews of the system, they help me fix things up. I've gone through to edit things and corrected grammar as I see it, right now I've been word-dumping and it's easy to screw things up.

So, to address the points:

1. I'll add this text to the feat, but these extra shikai abilities DO get doubled in your bankai form.

2. For all prestige classes, aside from what is specifically replaced in the progression, assume you had been advancing in your regular base class for purposes of the prestige class. BAB, saves, shunpo, casting, bonus feats, all that stays the same.

3. I'll fix the text to make sure Bonus Feats are included. The idea is that the only thing changed is zanpakutou progression, everything else stays the same.

4. Zebedee made the Quincy, but definitely post the problems you see and we'll find a way to fix it.

5. I definitely want to make a bonus feat list at some point, but because of the wealth of splatbooks, I've not yet had the chance to go through all of the feats around. I'll try to get the Core, Psionic and extra feats into a bonus feat list soon.

Keep the mechanical feedback coming, it helps a lot.

And I may bring other requirements to the table for ascending to higher levels of hollow, but I can't do anything until we actually get a confirmed Vasto Lorde.

Thank you very much for getting back to me so promptly. I'll address my response comments in the same format you did.

1. Excellent, just what I was hoping and expecting. This certainly helps make up for the fact that a feat and weapon type were given up for focused power over flexibility.

2. Again, this makes sense, as the Captain PrC is hard enough to get into already, it's quite understandable that its benefits would simply be a reflection upon the character's co-affinity with and understanding of themselves and their Zanpakutou. Should the Captain have simply gotten the Zanpakutou benefits, it would most definitely been worth it to remain in the basic class rpogression and receive Shikai/Bankai progression normally.

3. Same response generally as that for #2.

4. Will do, once my team is able to convene and discuss after balance and mechanical testing. Specifc note however: Is the Range value give for solid maximum range or for range increments?

5. I wouldn't expect you to plow through splatbooks so much as focus on the books listed as necessary in your manual's introdutory section. Updates regarding splatbooks can come later for sure.

I understand about the Hollow issue, as the Hollow mechanics need much more evidence. For the most part, the only evidence available is that a Shinigami show up and a Hollow gets cut to pieces before it can do much of anything. Save instances of much more powerful hollows, but then those are still sketchy on the power gauge.


Crap, didn't finish that one. Drain Reiatsu is likely going to drain spell points.

Mettle and Improved Mettle are an oversight, I'll get them up in the next update.

Basically, the Kidou system is exactly like Psionics, sans the Psionic Focus requirement to use Metakidou feats. All of the kidou listed already appear in the psionics handbook, and those that are augmentable can be augmented as normal. Assume Metapsionic feats are the ones to use when getting such feats for a caster.

1. I'm eager to see Drain Reiatsu once completed.

2. Again, I assumed this to be the case.

3. YaaaaHOOOOOOOooooooOOOO!!!!! I do believe this fits very well with your theory of "don't try mettling with something that works well already." Or however you put it earlier.

I'll give you all the feedback you want if you keep the responses coming! *Does a little dance. Spins in office chair. Gets looked at oddly by coworkers. Gets back to eating lunch.*

-Sin

[NightmareToilet]

re Aizen, perhaps the way to see him is that he goes to level 20 and then the character level progression stops as a shinigami and he gestalts, takes prestige classes as gestalt to learn stuff, and then when he is done he is a level 20 with quadruple gestalt (the 4 paths) and then he goes vizard since he has gotten all he can from being a shinigami.

So, he would have the best of a quadruple gestalt 20 and then vizard to go 21. How about that?

Maybe some prestiges could be offered using Aizen as a key to making a system.

[Ryvaken]

Quincy? Overpowered? d4 hitdie with half Con bonus, a range increment that doesn't stack up against a shortbow in lower levels, let alone a longbow, with a popgun's worth of damage. No spells, no bonus feats, pitiful defense and attack. No enhancement bonuses to bows. A spirit charge max that makes the few potent abilities usable once before recharging, which takes most of an encounter to charge up that high once. Longer if you fail a concentration check.

No. The Quincy is not overpowered. The Quincy is somewhere between a Wizard with an intelligence score of 3 and that wizard's familiar in terms of ability.

[Sin]

Quincy? Overpowered? d4 hitdie with half Con bonus, a range increment that doesn't stack up against a shortbow in lower levels, let alone a longbow, with a popgun's worth of damage. No spells, no bonus feats, pitiful defense and attack. No enhancement bonuses to bows. A spirit charge max that makes the few potent abilities usable once before recharging, which takes most of an encounter to charge up that high once. Longer if you fail a concentration check.

No. The Quincy is not overpowered. The Quincy is somewhere between a Wizard with an intelligence score of 3 and that wizard's familiar in terms of ability.

Although you description is colorful, it's not an accurate depiction of events.

Yes, after reading everything and build testing, just to be sure, one is really only capable of minor ridiculousness with a Quincy. As given in the current manual, they are indeed horribly underpowered. Against minor to mid level hollows, the given Quincy is a force to be reckoned with, however, the value of each ability choice is severely biased, and preference must go to a maximum of MAYBE three potential builds, which could stand on par until 11th level with an average Shinigami. Once level twelve rolls around however, it's a scenario of the Hollow asking the Shinigami, "Is that your friend there in the wood chipper?"

I'm sorry Zeb, but your build doesn't stand up to scrutiny. At least not here. Perhaps in a more gear-enhancement style game, I could see your Quincy lasting until about 13-14. After that, it's back in the wood chipper.

And that means sorry for you to Void, as you'll now have to construct a Quincy build that can take the test. To aid you, I'll have listed out the particular flaws in Zeb's build. And how and why they don't stack up.

First and foremost, the charge system utilized is broken in the sense that in a fight between a toddler and a level 20 Quincy, my money is on the tot. Unless the Quincy takes full-on damage upgrades, he can be sure to expect the miniature monstrosity to deal out a far more effective level of damage. Everything takes too long and is woefully over-cost with regard to necessary Spirit Charge to use just about anything. Additionally, you do not see any relief in your frequency or availability of Spirit Charge intake until 10th level when you'd receive Upwelling Power.

Second, let's talk about Favored Enemy. Besides the canon literature depicting the Quincy as hunters of the Hollow, and philisophically based enemies of the Shinigami, I don't see any reason for this to be a Quincy ability. There is extremely poor canonical support for it, and it serves no purpose in evening Quincy to the level of the Shinigami build structure. I'd toss it, and leave it.

Formation Fighting: Unless you foresee a campaign farremoved (either backwards or foreards) from the current canon timeline featuring the reclaimation of the Quincy race, why is this here? Quincy are archers, yes, archers stand in lines to help ensure group accuracy, however, this wouldn't need be the case for Quincy. The ability to arc around obstacles and/o seek/home-in on targets makes the need to stand in a line to improve accuracy pointless. Additionally, should the Quincy be standing together, I don't see how that would improve each other's Spirit Charge intake. It would more likely be that the formation hinders itself by feeding off of each other's spirit particles, and the same immediate surroundings.

Bow Attibutes:
I already mentioned how horribly underpowered these are, correct? Did I mention how many you receive in total by 20th level? FOUR, and not in regular intervals either.

Master Shot:
A small improvement over the Bow Attribute abilities. But only by a few hairs.
Also, the more powerful abilities illustrated in the canon have been severely nerfed, such that I wouldn't even bother taking them over others from this class build.

Bow Range, Arrow damage, & +ATK/+DMG abilities & progressions:
The bow range increments are sad early on, but likely this build's strongest redeeming feature in later levels. the ATK and DMG progressions should simply be changed to match the Zanpakutou progressions evenly. Arrow damage is fine. Otherwise these are fine.

Hirenkyaku:
This system is pathetic. Match it to a Shunpo progression and just rename it already.

Spirit Burst:
What in the canon supports this abilitity's existence?

Human body:
Kill me now. With the compartive maxed HP Shinigami's and Hollows get, and the level of damage they are able to dish out, there is no excuse for this ridiculousness whatsoever. Ishida takes something of a thrashing here an there, so give him credit. So too does Chad, mroe so even, with a human body and still stands upright. This ability makes me just want to fight Uryuu with a Shikai'd twig for the fun of it.


Now, wrapping up somewhat, I apologize if I came off a little harsh. However, some fo the nerfings bestowed upon the Quincy were also particularly harsh (specifically the web bow-it's been made 100% worthless here). And I'm not in much of a great sense of mind and being at the moment. So I thank those who bore with the ranting on the balance issues. My team is making further notes and discussion with regard to this and will get back to you on it soon with suggestions for improvement options which would better balance the class with the Shinigami baseline (which can get horrifically scary BTW). I'll put a build or two up soon to illustrate my point.

Regards everyone,
-Sin & Advocates

[Josh the Aspie]

Again, more evidence for why the classes should be combined down to 3. >.<

As for why those 3 should be able to be multi-classed... yes, the expert is somewhat close to a balance between warrior and spell caster with a bonus of skill points. However what if someone wanted to balance between caster and expert? Or expert and warrior?

[NightmareToilet]

Well, you could say people get tracked in the academy, but then later on even a dedicated warrior may want to switch to expert and pick up some spells. They should be able to do so. Or an expert may decide to focus training on combat and put aside the spells for a while, take some levels as a dedicated warrior. They should be able to do so.


Here is another barrier:
Barrier: Lucky Defense:
--You get a reality affecting luck bonus equal to the bonus given by a parrying zanpakuto. This applies to ac and saves.
--Once per encounter you can roll a second time if your defense failed you.

[Ryvaken]

There are a few things that would make the Quincy more powerful without a complete rewrite.

Hitpoints, defense, attack, and damage progressions need to be kicked up a notch or seven. Use the Ranger class as a guide, with damage following the Warrior Shinigami's zanpakutou. Remember that in everything we've seen, Uryu is capable of a huge amount of damage with his bow.

Add some kind of ability score improvement to damage. Charisma looks to be an easy choice, as that is 'the' magic stat thus far.

Start the range increment off at 100 feet.

Change the bow compositions and forms. As it stands the Crossbow is by far the most powerful, and there's no incentive to go for a soul-synthesized bow. The Longbow is pathetic, and the Whip bow is just freaky.

Triple the maximum charges held, make charge gain a free action once per round that can be enhanced by taking move actions, and consider increasing the rate of charges gained. Quincy start any given encounter with a high percentage of their spirit charges already available. Remember how much Uryu moves around in combat; blowing actions on gathering charges does not fit with the Quincy tactics we have seen. That said, I like the mechanic and it gives the class a very different feel from the Shinigami.

Add a flat enhancement bonus to bows to match zanpakutou and stack with spirit charge enhancements.

More bow attributes, more master shots, standardized progression. I actually like the current abilities, although the attributes could stand some improvement to keep up with Shikai.

Some kind of bonus feat progression. 1 per four levels or so.

Hirenkyaku is a good idea. Get it earlier, throw in a limit on how far any one jump can go, but I like seeing it work off spirit charges. Maybe halve the cost though. Again, working off charges instead of duplicating Shunpo is a good thing.

Lower the level requirement for most Quincy feats and standardize the ability requirements. Some of them don't even make sense.

Add a mechanic for using the silver tubes and Quincy spells. I have more specific ideas there.

Finally, give Quincy a way to break level 20 for the really high-level games.

[Sin]

There are a few things that would make the Quincy more powerful without a complete rewrite.

Hitpoints, defense, attack, and damage progressions need to be kicked up a notch or seven. Use the Ranger class as a guide, with damage following the Warrior Shinigami's zanpakutou. Remember that in everything we've seen, Uryu is capable of a huge amount of damage with his bow.

Add some kind of ability score improvement to damage. Charisma looks to be an easy choice, as that is 'the' magic stat thus far.

Start the range increment off at 100 feet.

Change the bow compositions and forms. As it stands the Crossbow is by far the most powerful, and there's no incentive to go for a soul-synthesized bow. The Longbow is pathetic, and the Whip bow is just freaky.

Triple the maximum charges held, make charge gain a free action once per round that can be enhanced by taking move actions, and consider increasing the rate of charges gained. Quincy start any given encounter with a high percentage of their spirit charges already available. Remember how much Uryu moves around in combat; blowing actions on gathering charges does not fit with the Quincy tactics we have seen. That said, I like the mechanic and it gives the class a very different feel from the Shinigami.

Add a flat enhancement bonus to bows to match zanpakutou and stack with spirit charge enhancements.

More bow attributes, more master shots, standardized progression. I actually like the current abilities, although the attributes could stand some improvement to keep up with Shikai.

Some kind of bonus feat progression. 1 per four levels or so.

Hirenkyaku is a good idea. Get it earlier, throw in a limit on how far any one jump can go, but I like seeing it work off spirit charges. Maybe halve the cost though. Again, working off charges instead of duplicating Shunpo is a good thing.

Lower the level requirement for most Quincy feats and standardize the ability requirements. Some of them don't even make sense.

Add a mechanic for using the silver tubes and Quincy spells. I have more specific ideas there.

Finally, give Quincy a way to break level 20 for the really high-level games.


I think these are some pretty reasonable and easily implemented suggestions for improving the class.

Hit points should probably be at about a maximized d6+CON per level. It fits with canonical evidence that Quincy can take a bit of a beating, but nothing too serious. It also doesn't make them a brittle twig.

As any experienced gamer will tell you, the archer character in any campaign is going to grab obscene amounts of dexterity, as strength doesn't help them much in combat or most other situations. Because of this and other considerations, leaving the BAB as it is would be fine.

Make the Quincy Bow's enhancement progression the same as the Shinigami expert. Give a damage bonus to arrows equal to the character's charisma score, is the stat is 'the' magic stat of this module. Hower, in order to represent how a Quincy is able to release more powerful arrows when they add extra spirit charge to them, make an ability available at low level which would read something like...

"By expending spirit charges, a Quincy is able to loose a more powerful version of their spirit arrow. To use this ability a Quincy spends any number of their spirit charges, up to their effective Quincy class level. Doing so changes the Quincy arrow's damage to equal that of a Warrior Shinigami Zanpakutou damage whose level equals the amount of sirit charges expended in this manner."
OR
"By expending a number of spirit charges equal to the its Charisma modifier, the Quincy is able to loose a more powerful version of their spirit arrow. Triple the Quincy's Charisma modifier whem calulating arrow damage. This ability must be declared before rolling to hit with the enhanced arrow. This abilty counds as a Standard action."

You could even make the ability scalably better over time. Or provide feat options which may better enable the Quincy to utilize this power. Either by increasing the multiplier, reducing the action requirment, etc.

I agree, make the Quincy bow's range increment 100ft to start. However, scale it's progression very slowly over time. Progress it too quickly and you'll have Quincy running rampant who can het you between the eyes a half-mile away.

I very much like the concept which was intiated for the Quincy regarding their Spirit Charge, but it does need significant improvement. Greatly increasing the maximum charges held, and the rate at which a Quincy repleneses their available quantity would prove the most effective method of resolving the problems.

The alternative bow options still need much reworking. You're right, take the crossbow on that list over anything else.

Bonus feat progression every 4 levels would be amazing.

Minor enhancements need be made to the Bow Attribute and Master Shot tables. Additionally, as has been mention multiple times now, their progression needs to be standardized, and the Quincy could stand to attain a couple more of each in order to stay on par with any Shinigami of equal level.

The concept for the Quincy's Hirenkyaku is cool. Making it work off spirit charges should be the goal. I was probably a little to quick to suggest to be equal to Shunpo. Effectively, it should work in much the same way as far as technical mechanics from the GM's perspective. However, one must simply do too much math to figure out how far they can go with a given expenditure of Sirit Charges. I guess I suggested it match Shunpo because the system in place for that ability is so spectacularly balanced for this game module. So if something isn't broken, there is no point in trying to make something else which effectively does the same thing and say, "Look what I can do!"

You're right, some fo the feats are kinda convoluted. Void, I think you can work those out well enough without our help. You've proven extremely skilled at all of this so far.

As the game module stands, the only character types able to break level 20, are Vizard and Arrancar. Though I'd like to see more ways for characters of different kinds to break the barrier, I don't think it's a high priority item.

Seele Schneider needs serious fixing. It's really pathetic as a uber Quincy weapon right now. As for the tubes and whatnot, I'm in agreement. Ishida relied on those pretty nicely to both enhance his powers and to lessen recovery time between fights. The system could do well to see these worked up along with the rest of the Quincy fixes.

Hope these words-of-whatever help,
-Sin

[Behold_the_Void]

Something I'd also like to add as far as the Quincy is a spell progression. Ishida has clearly demonstrated that he can use incantations and cast spells.

If Zeb doesn't want to rework though, I'll likely make the Quincy become more like the Shinigami, much like I'm doing for the human classes and the bount class. It's a simple formula, but it's easy to balance against itself.

[Josh the Aspie]

By the way, one quick thing that I think could use some clarification in the documentation.

There is some confusing wording in the "Inner Hollow" feat, when it comes to how often the inner hollow tests you.


Once per month, -1 per character level, the hollow may attempt to break free, taking over its host.

Does -1 per character level mean it takes one more month per character level for it to try to break free? Once per 30 Days - 1 per level?

[zadcap]

Now in the relm of Quincy, there's another form of special attack that should be added, probably as a feet. Mostly Uryu, but also Byakua, have ended many fights by hiting opponents in certain spots. I'm wracking my mind, but the best I can come up with is "When you would cause leathal damage to an opponent (about to kill them, not just damage), you can instead aim for the Soul Sleep (or whatever they call it) and give them X negative levels, where X is the ammount by which you would have killed them by, minimum 1. Their HP is set to 0."
It's harsh, but it's an alternate to death, so it can be. Perhaps make it require to hit the AC +(number), or even a critical hit, since it's aiming for a very specific target.
And I still think Arancar should be a template, not a class.

With love and tidbits of advice,
~Z~

[Ryvaken]

I considered suggesting that the range progression be ramped down, but remember that when we first met Uryu he was shooting Hollows out of the sky from a considerable distance. These guys are snipers.

[Sin]

I considered suggesting that the range progression be ramped down, but remember that when we first met Uryu he was shooting Hollows out of the sky from a considerable distance. These guys are snipers.

I agree, they are indeed snipers. But you also have to consider that 100ft range increment is really substantial, and since Dexterity is their prime statistic, the are going to be able to hot you from an extreme distance, even at a very low level. Additionally, if you increase the range increment too much, they would be considerably overpowered by means of a ranged bullrush attch, placing an opposing entity potentiall as far back as they started. Now that would just be ridiculous, and everyone would snag Quincy for it's ridiculousness. Remember, we're aiming for balnce here, and primarily ranged classes are the hardest to even-out against others, along with spellcasters.

[Josh the Aspie]

Well you could alternatively remove the ranged bullrush ability.

Also, I'd like to point out that in different circumstances A quincy might beat a Shinigami, or a Shinigami might beat a quincy. I personally thing that an intelligent and skilled Shinigami would, as the stats currently stand, normally defeat a Quincy of the same level. A situation where a quincy would have the clear advantage is if the Quincy and Shinigami were facing each other in a duel, started several hundred feet away, so that even with a shunpo-enhanced charge, the Shinigami could not reach the Quincy on the first turn. The battle field would truely be a field, rather than an urban area, a forest, or a hilly area.

In such a circumstance an archer should win over a melee warrior in real life as well. There is a reason why archery exists, and is potent. That is range.

If there were cover surrounding the pair the Shinigami could simply move from cover to cover, using Shunpo to avoid giving the Quincy any chance at a shot until he closed to range.

With the Shinigami and the Quincy face to face, or nearly so, as the stats currently stand, I feel the Shinigami would definitely kick the Quincy up and down whatever terrain type they would be in.

-------------------------------------

Even with all of that in mind, we need to keep in mind that any D20 system meant to be played by a group, people work together, and people won't be designed to all be good at the exact same things.

"Balance" does not begin and end with "who can kill who in x situation?"

Would any of you really argue that in a D&D party that goes dungeon delving that the fighter is 'overbalanced' relative to the rogue because he can kill things better? The rogue has access to several skills that the group needs. The Rogue might be a traps rogue, or a stealthy scout that gives the entire party an advantage. In the city, the rogue might well be a skilled diplomat.

So setting up artificial situations in which one charcter is 'broken' relative to another in combat isn't nearly as productive in reference to 'balance' discussions as many people try to make it.

Perhaps, we should be discussing whether each class has the possibility of filling a distinctive and necessary, or even supplemental, role for the group within any given campaign that will allow the player of that class to feel that they are a skilled and useful member of the group, and thus allow the player to have fun.

I do think that classes need to be balanced against each other in potency, but I don't really think that "X can kill Y, P% of the time under C circumstances" is the best way to explore balance.

-------------------------------------

Oh, and as a note for the system builder, the new skill "Suppress Reiatsu" does not have a key attribute listed. Personally I think it should be tied to whatever the person's Kidou path is. The skill could potentially helped by one's general ability to fool others by passing one's self off as what they are not (charisma), an instinctive understanding of one's inner self and nature (wisdom), or an intellectual (intelligence, duh) analysis and insightful experimented control of the arcane nature of spiritual energy.

What one is likely to rely on would be what they are used to relying on for the manipulation of their Reisatsu for Kidou.

Due to there being non-kidou using classes, I think it should default to charisma (see bluff and disguise), and then have Alternate Demon Path also change the stat one uses as the key attribute for this skill.

You might also consider giving it a synergy bonus from bluff, especially since the skill is opposed by sense motive. Disguise, which also involves hiding one's true nature gets a synergy bonus from bluff.

Also, if there are certain D&D skills that aren't needed, it might be a good idea to list some of those that are being removed. For example, it seems as though anyone in the series that wants to be able to use any magical item out there can. It may be that use magical device just isn't a needed skill.

The only real monster type seems to be Hollows. What knowledge would cover identifying the abilities of an individual Hallow? They are their own type, so none of the existing lists works. Knowledge (Religion) for undead? Knowledge (Arcana) for magical beasts? Knowledge (The Planes) for outsiders?

Maybe some of these knowledge skills should be combined, or broken into new categories to reflect the different cosmology and nature of spirits / creatures / magic.

[Behold_the_Void]

By the way, one quick thing that I think could use some clarification in the documentation.

There is some confusing wording in the "Inner Hollow" feat, when it comes to how often the inner hollow tests you.



Does -1 per character level mean it takes one more month per character level for it to try to break free? Once per 30 Days - 1 per level?

I forgot some key words there. Basically, 30 days -1 day per level you possess.

Surpress Kidou is Charisma-based, I'll fix that. Probably add in the alternate demon path that Surpress Kidou's base gets changed as well.

The Knowledge skills will likely be revamped entirely, that's on the to-do list, I just haven't been working on it because I'm messing with other stuff at the moment.

[Josh the Aspie]

Cool.

In addition to having Alternate Demon Path change the Suppress Reisetsu attribute, I think there's an additional feat you might want to consider adding too.

While I do think that fine control of one's Reisatsu levels is more important than social ability in hiding one's Reisatsu levels, there is another skill where one can change Reisatsu levels... but relies on brute force of the Reisatsu more than fine control.

You might want to create a feat called "Reisatsu Level Control" or the like that would allow one to change not only one's Reisatsu level to hide it better based on attribute, but also to pump it up higher based on that attribute, allowing one to change the specific use of intimidate to do so... similar to how some feats let you use strength instead of charisma when you intimidate by smashing things. Since it only changes a specific use of one of the two skills, you might also want to give a +1 bonus to each.

After all, Tactile Trapsmith and Agile Acrobat from D&D both affect 2 full skills, and tactile Trapsmith gives you a special ability besides.

Or you might just want to make it a +2 / +2 feat.

The above feat would be more useful to Quincy and other Augmented Humans, who have no Demon Path, as well as by Shinigami with "Dedicated Warrior" who also have no kidou.

If you recall from Ichigo's battle with him, Kenpachi Zaraki was skilled both at the use of Intimidation, and at hiding his Reisatsu. This might be a feat that someone like him would take.

You might want to consider haivng Intimidate give a +2 synergy bonus to Suppress Reisatsu, and having Suppress Reisatsu give a +2 bonus to the specific use of Intimidate based on the above as well.

----------------------------

One more request for clarification, relating to Prestige classes.

Some of them mention that you can only take Bankai abilities if you have Bankai, but also say they change the progression of access to Zanpakutou abilities. Would someone with the Captain class or Vizard class gain access to Bankai when they otherwise would?

What about Access to the Final Bankai ability? Would a 20th level Vizard gain that?

----------------------------

Oh, and for Combat Maneuver: according to the normal rules of D&D, anyone can try a disarm action with any weapon they possess. Why would someone need combat Maneuver to gain the ability to try to disarm someone with their Zanpakutou?

[Behold_the_Void]

Final abilities are not gained through prestige classes, nor is bankai through the Vizard class. Vizards need to level up in the actual shinigami class if they want bankai.

[Byakko]

Hi, first of all thanx for this system, me and my friends are finally able to try a little Bleach campaign thanx to you, so thanx =)
Secondly I have a question about this, it might sounds like a stupid question but after 21 pages I thought it was worth asking heh
Are the file linked in the first post up to date with the changes and all discussed so far ? Before se sit down and start rolling out toons I'm kind of wondering that heh

[FelixZ]

Optional rule idea: Beating your zanpakuto to earn bankai.


In order to achieve bankai, a shinigami must first show their ability to command their zanpakuto. To do this, they must defeat them in battle in a one on one duel. Those that fail simply don't achieve bankai. Those that do are able to unlock it's secrects.

The zanpakuto spirit has the exact same stats as the shinigami it belongs to, except they wield a zanapakuto that is always in shikai form. Zanpakuto spirits not in human form have their primary attack treated as the zanpakuto for all purposes.

[Xuincherguixe]

Well, was it that one had to defeat their Zanpakto in battle, or just force them to submit?

It stands to reason that it could take all sorts of different forms.

[Josh the Aspie]

Additional Notes:

You might want to specify whether regeneration (a hollow ability) works if the limb was severed using an attack that had the energy type that negates it's fast healing. If so, and the being with regeneration has another way to gain fast healing (say, if they are an Arancar or Vizard) would that fast healing allow regeneration to activate?

Under the Zanpakutou abilities of the darkness type, bestow Darkvision does not list Darkvision as a prerequisite, and swift bestow darkvision does not list dark bestow Darkvision as a prerequisite

[Behold_the_Void]

System is currently not totally up-to-date from some of the most recently clarifications. I'll get an update up when I have time to add a bit more content.

Good catch Josh, fixing that.

Defeating your zanpakutou is a rule I've considered for awhile, I'll implement it later when I'm sure how I want to handle the mechanics.

[F.H. Zebedee]

Indeed, I balanced it incorrectly. The range was supposed to be designed to keep even with Shinigami's capacity for damage, but ended up being way too low overall.

Favored enemies is rather Cannon supported. The ones shown, barring Soken, have a major hatred for specific enemy types going (Both Shinigami, though Soken probably took Hollows instead of what his son and grandson did.)

Spirit Burst was based on the sort of effects that Uryu was having while he was angered in the fight against Mayuri. Ground melting away under his feet, spirit pressure forceful enough to feel like an explosion, etc.

Formation fighting was intended for just that, past campaigns, as a way of making a lot of low level Quincies threatening. Probably should be exorcised and made into a feat, though.

My quick fix for the Quincy, after thinking it over (BtV, please edit these in ASAP. My paths should be forthcoming shortly.):
*Two good saves, if not already listed.
*Full HP and Con to health. Change Human body to only make them use skills as standard, not Shinigami.
*Double all ranges first, and then-
+100 ft. to all ranges (No range increments), +an additional 50 at level 11, and + another 50 at 16) (I think that giving them range over 500ish feet gets ugly, because then only Expert Shinigami can get to them without having to take multiple run actions/burn out all of their Shunpo (and with my system, Shinigami have 50 ft movement, and still will get gunned to hell on a rush.). This in itself would be okay, except for the fact that afterwards, a Quincy can just Hirenkyaku back and laugh at the Shinigami.)
*Double maximum Spirit Charge capacity, and Output per level. That will make them more self sufficient.
*Change Hirenkyaku to cost half as many Spirit charges.

That will make them much more even with Shinigami. They'll get Attributes to damage when I do their paths (DEX, CHA, or INT, IIRC.)

Coming upgrades: Reworking Master Shots and the Spirit Charge for more efficiency, Paths for some juicy bonuses, replacing Spirit Burst with a protecting ability (making Spirit Burst a feat instead.), reworking the bows, and a Bonus Feat Progression.

BTW, has BtV put any archery feats in yet? They might be helpful, too.

Finally, the power of the Quincy is twofold. First, they were designed with a party roll in mind distinct from the Shinigami. While most Shinigami are getting drubbed in close, barring the Spellcasters, the Quincy is fighting at range. This means that most Hollows won't even get a whack at the Quincies, and if they try to, then they're going to get smacked for the effort. (assuming a party of one of each Shinigami class, and Quincy.)

The other forte of the Quincy? Renewal. While Shinigami run on SP and Shunpo per day, IIRC, Quincy can recharge them on the fly. This means that at the end of the day, while the caster is burnt out and the Expert is stuck running on foot, the Quincy is still sniping away and teleporting around like they're fresh into combat.

When properly realized, it won't be in damage or toughness that Quincy will be king. They should be like a laser beam, striking at any point on the battlefield while giving their opponent no ability to retaliate.

NOTE: This post of mine was written assuming the old Shunpo rules. Daaang... Though it doesn't give the Quincy as much of a staying power edge, this makes them GODS of mobility. Now, they can out-flash step even experts by a considerable ammount (under the fix.)

NOTE 2: Hmmm... Just looking over the changes again, and trying to figure out what is broken enough to need fixing. I think that the above fix is a bit too drastic, though making a character who can snipe Hollows from miles off while balancing against others is tricky. Quincy severely lack: HP, damage, but have too much: Range, Mobility. Maybe make these changes as well, if balance is needed:
*Make Hirenkyaku have a limit of "20xMaximum spirit charge enhancement on To-Hit" limiting them 100 feet of movement. Meaning they can still jump around, but no longer are untouchable.
*Pushing shot seemed a game breaker before, but then I realized that it allows a Strength check every ten feet. If you can't make a DC 13-19 Str Check, which you get every 10 ft, you probably don't want to be in melee anyways. If it still seems broken, have it also include a Reflex save, same DC, to avoid it entirely.

[Josh the Aspie]

Glad to help out. I've been doing a fair amount of work creating my character recently, and so have been reading up on many of the abilities.

[Behold_the_Void]

Good stuff, that will be edited in for the next update.

[Dante & Vergil]

Optional rule idea: Beating your zanpakuto to earn bankai.


In order to achieve bankai, a shinigami must first show their ability to command their zanpakuto. To do this, they must defeat them in battle in a one on one duel. Those that fail simply don't achieve bankai. Those that do are able to unlock it's secrects.

The zanpakuto spirit has the exact same stats as the shinigami it belongs to, except they wield a zanapakuto that is always in shikai form. Zanpakuto spirits not in human form have their primary attack treated as the zanpakuto for all purposes.

I think that is an excellent way to do Bankai.
I also think that if the Shinigami does a test, determined by the zanpakuto Spirit, that they may earn Bankai. It hasn't been seen in the show or manga but it seems like a resonable suggestion.

[Behold_the_Void]

I think that is an excellent way to do Bankai.
I also think that if the Shinigami does a test, determined by the zanpakuto Spirit, that they may earn Bankai. It hasn't been seen in the show or manga but it seems like a resonable suggestion.

The problem is codified rules for it. I agree that it's a good idea and gives a great mechanic for it, but I still need a way to make a easily accessible system for creating such a challenge, or at least some way to help DMs do it.

[Josh the Aspie]

Shikai abilities, under restorative healing: It says that "This does not increase the casting time of the spell, but it still expends the spell slot."

It should likely instead indicate one of the following, depending on how you want to balance things.

"This does not increase the casting time of the combined spells, but you must still pay the Spell Points for each spell. The cap on spell points applies to each spell individually for the purpose of augmentation and metamagic/metapsionic feats."

or

"This does not increase the casting time of the combined spells, but you must still pay the Spell Points for each spell. The same cap on spell points applies to both spells for the purpose of augmentation and metamagic/metapsionic feats, as they have basically become the same spell."

The second would basically treat restoration / the shikai ability as a metapsionic / augmenting ability for the cure wounds spell, reducing the amount that they can heal by, while still allowing both effects to occur.

Edit: Found another.

Shikai Abilities under Fire:

"Fire Form: This changes the form of one of the zanpakutou’s attacks, changing it to cold. For example, Projectile-based Zanpakutou will now do fire damage, whereas Summon-based Zanpakutou will gain the Fire subtype and do fire damage. Flame Blade may still be used in conjunction with Fire Form."

I think you want it to change the damage type to fire, yes?

Edit #2:

Under "Suppress Reisatsu" it does not indicate whether certain abilities (kidou, shikai, etc) can be utilized when you are suppressing your Reisatsu, or if this ends the supression effect. It seems like Zaraki Kenpachi (Kenpachi Zaraki? I always get the order confused on him) was able to suppress his aura in the middle of battle, but this could be because he wasn't using any abilities at this time that he didn't always have (constant Shikai, for example).

[NightmareToilet]

They said something about bankai being the willingness to share pain with your blade. It seems also that defeating his blade is not just a normal battle, and same with defeating his hollow. His will and faith has to rise above the enemy.

There is a talent called faith that could be cool to include.

And make a will save each time you attack your zanpakuto so that if you hit, you only can damage if you make your will save vs his/her will? For fighting your z or hollow, I'd like to see more than just a normal mirror fight. The character has to develope and realize something in themselves. Again, it has a faith component and a will and ego component in addition to battle skill.

Plus, in Ichigo's fight, his reiatsu at first did not increase, even though his fighting skill did, so that shows that increase could mean something. In Naruto there was a battle with mirror clone type things, and they had to go up a level in the battle to overcome them, which were set at how the characters were when they entered the battle.

So:
1. Must fight your z till you go up at least one level and your reitsu increases during the fight.

2. you develope the faith talent (which you then get).

3. must make some opposing will saves.

How about those ideas?

[Sin]

Greetings again,

I apologize for my small bout of absense and lack of input. I have been extremely busy with other things these last few days. I have a great deal to say concerning what has been posted since my I last logged in, but will not be able to do such untile either later this afternoon, or on Wednesday.

However, I have a few items to cover briefly...

1. Void:
I have a few Shinigami character builds you'll want to look at which serve to illustrate a few significantly unbalanced game mechanics. Specifically in relation to the Blood-type for Zanpakutou. I should have them to you by Wednesday at the latest. Also, read the following items covered below.

2. NightmareToilet:
Although it may not be my place, I think it may need mentioning. You've had some interesting suggestions for improving the module, for which I may have developed mechanics that Void was worried might be unquantifiable. However, please remember that this module is based off of Bleach's, not Naruto's, canon. So bringing ideas to this table which have Naruto canon to suppport their inclusion here is completely irrelevant. Blease support your ideas with references to Bleach canon and d20 mechanical canon alone. I'm just letting you know because it's been a steady and supported habit to have individuals who're brings ideas up which continue to be hindering and/or unhelpful to start their own thread. Since a good few of your ideas have a reasonable bit of support from Bleach canon (even if you don't reference it yourself), I'd like for you to continue to be able to put in your two cents here.

3. Quincy 'Shunpo' (Hirakyuuken??-can't remember...):
I agree that it should be based off of Spirit Change for their game mechanic. But a formula needs to be established which places its use on par with Shunpo advancement.The advantage would be that the quincy can do it infinitely. There is nothing in the Canon which indicates the Quincy are exponentially better at the movement style than anyone else.

4. Shunpo feats:
I think it need be addressed that the Shunpo feats are extendable to Quincy Hirakyuuken and Sonido users as well. Bleach canon supports the distribution of these same abilities many times to all of these user types, but only Shunpo is addressed specifically in the current mechanics' feat section.

5. Next available update for Module?:
Void, I was just curious if you had an ETA for the next completed rules update? I have a bunch of type/spelling/grammar edits for you, but it would be tedious for you to recieve them from me either right before or right after the next release.

Thanks for reading. Again, my next full scale post will be by Wednesday, but I'll likely keep up with what gets posted here until then.

Ciao,
-Sin

[Behold_the_Void]

Fixed the errors pointed out by Josh.

Sin, go ahead and send me those edits, as well as those balance issues.

ETA for the next update will likely be Friday at the earliest, depending on how my story load for my journalism class goes. I'm going to try to finish at least the Augmenter abilities.

[NightmareToilet]

Ok, but I still think the leveling up during the battle makes sense from what happened to Ichigo during his fight and how that enabled him to overcome.

I think levels 12-13 (or even 12-14) would be good bankai transition leveling after a series of chalenges and fights during which the character becomes better and raises the reiatsu, too, which could mean they get a +1 or 2 stat (con?) bonus from the battle, maybe, and faith.

Even when vs his hollow, there had to come a point where something clicked and Ichigo was then able to do better and win out, rise above the situation where he and the enemy were equal, or above where he was lesser, to get to where he was greater. It happens during the battle.

Actually, that does with vs Kenpachi, too.

[NightmareToilet]

re: Rukia and using hand sign magic: Perhaps this would increase the power of the spell? Normally the character would have a sword in hand, but if they chose to use sheath it and use hand signs in addition to the incantation, should this give a bonus? Or maybe it was just that spell. I don't know if it was used elsewhere. Just something I was wondering about.

[Josh the Aspie]

As it currently stands, someone who has taken the Shikai ability "Fire shield" four times will have a fire shield that extends 15 feet away from them but only sheds light 10 feet away from them (que?) due to how it references fire shield.

I would like to suggest that for every time one takes it the light it sheds either also increases in radius by a set amount (10 feet? 15 feet?), or doubles.

[Josh the Aspie]

The "Hand signs" are often called "seals" and there are multiple effects which require the use of a hand. Cure requires you to touch the person. The red ray of fire requires you to extend at least one hand/finger, etc.

[Byakko]

Ok yet another stupid question from me.
I was playing SWSE yesterday and in a break moment me and my friends started discussing about D&D 4E that will be released in Jan and while the discussion goes on on stuff I wont mention I thought about Bleach D20 you guys are making and I started wondering if you considered porting it to 4E when it's released since it sounds like there will be an open licence as there is for 3.0/3.5
?

[Behold_the_Void]

Ok yet another stupid question from me.
I was playing SWSE yesterday and in a break moment me and my friends started discussing about D&D 4E that will be released in Jan and while the discussion goes on on stuff I wont mention I thought about Bleach D20 you guys are making and I started wondering if you considered porting it to 4E when it's released since it sounds like there will be an open licence as there is for 3.0/3.5
?

The port will happen, but right now I want the baseline rules out before I even start worrying about conversion.

[Sin]

Fixed the errors pointed out by Josh.

Sin, go ahead and send me those edits, as well as those balance issues.

ETA for the next update will likely be Friday at the earliest, depending on how my story load for my journalism class goes. I'm going to try to finish at least the Augmenter abilities.
I'll do that when I get home this evening sometime. I'm just checking in from work at the moment. It might be a bit later into the evening, as I have a draft to write up this eveing as well. Also, thanks for the ETA. I think that will work out well. I'll do the gruntwork for you and compare the current copy with the release at the end of the week and send you a revised copy of the new release. I'm extremely busy the rest of this week with my workload and maving my brother into my house.


The port will happen, but right now I want the baseline rules out before I even start worrying about conversion.
By all accounts, the new system should be overwhelmingly similar to 3.0/3.5. The expectation and general hypothesis is that since 3.0 was an entirely different system than 2.0/AD&D there were a great deal of mechanical issues which came up in some way or anoher. Hence, the 3.5 release, effectively patching a significant amount of the system flaws, consolidating numerous errata releases, and offering up a some new material to work with in the process. 4.0 is basically expected to be a finalized version of the current system, in order to facilitate the continued use of all the 3.0/3.5 sidebar material so it all doesn't have to be redone, again. For you new gamers reading along, by sidebar material, I'm referring to any of the non-core rulebooks. In other words, if there is any porting to be done to this module, it's very likely that it'll be minimal. Especially because so much of this module is stand alone and homebrewed. Any porting would really just have to account for significant changes to the core system's mechanics.

Void:
I have not had an opportunity to look into SA's yet, as I'm still slugging through balance tests for the Shinigami. Mostly because I need a bit more clairification on many pieces of the system. I'll post significant issues tonight, and wait for the weekend's update release before bringing up minor concerns, unless you'd like them sooner. My tea has also been a bit busy with their own schedules, but I'll check in with them to see if they have anything they'd like me to address in my next few postings this week as well.

At any rate, keep up the good work. I look foreward to seeing the updated material.

Regards,
-Sin

[Senir]

Hi guys.

I've been following this project for a while now, and thought I'd finally help out (if I can).

I only read up till and including page 4 and flashes of other pages, but there are several things I noticed (sorry if already discussed).

One problem adressed was the starting HP. I do think that characters (in general, not just with this setting) are too fragile to begin with. What I think really works (I use it in my own bleach campaign) is to give the players a starting pool of HP equal to (3×max HD)+con. This gives a 10 con dedicated warrior 36 hp to start with, an expert 24 and a spellcaster 18. This may not seem fair, but those few hit points even out along the way, and it reduces the major threat of magic (since magic in general is unbalancing).

What I strongly suggest (though you may have been doing this/posted it along the way) is that you redo the file so that people know what's been updated and what not. If I'm correct, the file available from the front page is from may 18 or something like that, and that's far from updated. If you like, I could do this. I also noticed several major mistakes in the form of tables and stuff like that. I've already written about 3 settings (though never finished one completely), so I'm quite familiar with PDF's and the compilating of rules.
*EDIT: I understand the update is coming soon, so never mind this.

A general question. Can you take the Increased Shunpo feat at level 2 if you have a high enough reflex save? It doesn't really make it clearer in the text of the feat, but since the prerequisite is òr Shunpo 20 ft òr Reflex 3+, I thought you could.

Another thing I read and really liked was the Shunpo Alternative feats, like losing the Shunpo to gain a higher base speed. I think more alternatives should be thought off to further implemend the fact that you can almost completely flavor your character. Maybe something like Dedicated Warrior, but sacrificing Shunpo and gaining something else (maybe enhancement to strength/dexterity/attack bonus usable like rage, showing that you use the knowledge of that speed in another way?)

Another thing I took from the SWSE is that the characters deal normal damage with their weapons, +1/2 their character level, showing off their expertise. I don't know if it would be unbalancing, but I do think it shows the gain of power in spirit force of the characters, making their blades sharper, their arrows more powerful and their attacks more lethal.

Lastly I suggest you start finding yourself some art, even though the system is still in a 'beta fase'. I for starters would be honoured to render some art for the system, but I know there are many artists on DeviantArt who have some spectacular Bleach works on their pages (especially the self-made bleach characters rock), and they would probably be honoured as well to give their art and skills to the project.
*EDIT: I saw someone already uploaded a art-full book, though I couldn't find the actual file.

Anyway, thank you for the great system so far, but it is still far from done. That's what we are here for, right? ;)

BtV, if you want to, please add me to your msn if you have it (apparantly not everybody has it). I send you a PM. I want to become a (over)active part in this project.

[NaYoN]

These rules are really nice, I think you should add more detailed info about mod souls and pluses and other extraordinary creatures... I'd want to help but I'm not really good with crunch... Anyway, what will be included in the next update?

[Senir]

To go further on my PM and previous post, I would like to offer my services to supply the system with some of the following:

- A hollow manual (cause it's hecka lot of work)
- Beginner adventure ideas
- Adventures
- Tips on the campaign and dm-ing
- Alternative rules (don't know what, but I'll see)

[Behold_the_Void]

Give me any minor concerns and clarifications you need as well, those can be edited immediately and aren't too hard to do.

Anyone interested in doing artwork is more than welcome, PM me about it and we'll get you set up.

[NightmareToilet]

How about more stuff on scientists and their wierd creations, like the intelligent item that, what did it do, made people able to see souls? Various other wierd science from Bleach. A chapter with more bleach mad science would be interesting for people wanting to use that or build on it.

I just thought of what if your zanpakuto's constant release is a plunger! Squad 4 plumber devision, haha! Special abilities come with it, of course. It would be earth + water type and you can fill in the rest ... ; ). That would be an interesting character to put in as an npc! She could be a deadly opponent! Having some npcs that differ a lot from one another as examples and for fun could be good (I mean besides the regular cast). Of course, if anyone is a programmer and could make a generator, that would rule.

[Sin]

Will be posting an extened post shortly. Stay tuned.

[Sin]

Scratch that, sorry everyone, the contents of the fabled post have now been accounted for in the next update BtV releases.

[Senir]

I'll post a few ideas I have for alternative rules/extra rules (totally optional for those who use the system, if it is used in the system).
-Alternative Shikai (as part of a test with approx CR 4)
-Alternative Bankai (as part of a test with approx CR 12)
-Sundering (tell me if this is already done)

And on another note, it's my birthday tomorrow!

[Senir]

Ok, the idea for sundering.

We've seen several people sunder weapons in Bleach. For instance Byakuya with Ichigio and Ishida with the shuriken-sword-wielder. But the general sunder rules aren't enough for this system. I got my idea from Weapons of Legacy.

First of all, all weapons (from the shinigami, awakened and quincy) should have a base saving throw of +20 for all saves. Except with normal attacks, they are extremely hard to destroy.

When I thought of how sundering should be handled the first thing that came to my mind was that it wasn't the sundering system itself that needed changed, so the way to sunder it should remain the same. It's the weapon's stats that matter.

A weapon's strength is directly influenced by the wielder's spirit power (using Cha as the ability and the character's level as the base). So that is one thing to bear in mind. I then wondered what would influence the rest, and I figured it is the physical resilience and power of the person, so I came up with the following.

Hardness: A special weapon's hardness equals 5+charisma modifier+1/2 level (rounded down), with a minimum of 6
Hit Points: A special weapon's hardness equals 1/2 their wielder's hit points (minimum 5) + (4×charisma modifier) (minimum 10)

Tell me what you think. I think the hit points may need other multipliers, but I made it this way because now Warriors will have a worse Hardness but better hit points than Experts, Spellcasters and Quincy. Maybe along with a feat like 'Improved Weapon Hardness' that adds 2 to the hardness every time you take it of 'Improved Weapon Hit Points' that increases the hit points of the weapon by 1/level every time you take the feat.

This makes the Improved Sunder special attack a better choice, but not an overpowered one.

Four examples of characters I made myself (level 3 now):

Warrior 1: Hardness 8, HP 53
Warrior 2: Hardness 6, HP 46
Expert: Hardness 8, HP 40
Spellcaster: Hardness 10, HP 57

These may seem unfair, but the 2nd warrior has a higher strength and stuff so it will be harder to sunder him to begin with. The spellcaster has some high scores but will be sundered more easily. The expert really is the only one with a disadvantage, but that's mainly because of the build.

[NightmareToilet]

From what we've seen of dedicated warriors, even though they sunder one another's, maybe they should get tougher blades than those who also relly on spells. Plus, casters can fall back on spells, but dw's can't. Also, maybe constant release should play a part. So, DW with constant release = more resilent zanpakuto. After all, it was too powerful to be sealed, even.

[Sin]

Ok, the idea for sundering.

We've seen several people sunder weapons in Bleach. For instance Byakuya with Ichigio and Ishida with the shuriken-sword-wielder. But the general sunder rules aren't enough for this system. I got my idea from Weapons of Legacy.

First of all, all weapons (from the shinigami, awakened and quincy) should have a base saving throw of +20 for all saves. Except with normal attacks, they are extremely hard to destroy.

When I thought of how sundering should be handled the first thing that came to my mind was that it wasn't the sundering system itself that needed changed, so the way to sunder it should remain the same. It's the weapon's stats that matter.

A weapon's strength is directly influenced by the wielder's spirit power (using Cha as the ability and the character's level as the base). So that is one thing to bear in mind. I then wondered what would influence the rest, and I figured it is the physical resilience and power of the person, so I came up with the following.

Hardness: A special weapon's hardness equals 5+charisma modifier+1/2 level (rounded down), with a minimum of 6
Hit Points: A special weapon's hardness equals 1/2 their wielder's hit points (minimum 5) + (4×charisma modifier) (minimum 10)

Tell me what you think. I think the hit points may need other multipliers, but I made it this way because now Warriors will have a worse Hardness but better hit points than Experts, Spellcasters and Quincy. Maybe along with a feat like 'Improved Weapon Hardness' that adds 2 to the hardness every time you take it of 'Improved Weapon Hit Points' that increases the hit points of the weapon by 1/level every time you take the feat.

This makes the Improved Sunder special attack a better choice, but not an overpowered one.

Four examples of characters I made myself (level 3 now):

Warrior 1: Hardness 8, HP 53
Warrior 2: Hardness 6, HP 46
Expert: Hardness 8, HP 40
Spellcaster: Hardness 10, HP 57

These may seem unfair, but the 2nd warrior has a higher strength and stuff so it will be harder to sunder him to begin with. The spellcaster has some high scores but will be sundered more easily. The expert really is the only one with a disadvantage, but that's mainly because of the build.

I'm sorry, but this sundering system has major flaws when trying to apply Bleach canon standards. the way you have it structured, almost every caster focused character will win for base hardness and hp for zanpakutous. it would be applicable to both canon and game mechanics to say that zanpakutous are immune to abilities which reduce/ignore/negate their hardness. But, as Improved sunder is a measure of a characters experience and know how when it comes to destroying an opponent's weapon, their bonus to their attempt, and the removal of a AoO penalty are both still valid. It would be better to say, an opposing concentration check to the sunder attempt would negate the damage to the zanpakutou. This both accounts for the balance of game mechanics (those characters with higher levels are more capable at managing their reiatsu), and the canon reference to needing to harden up (focus, i.e. concentrate) their reiatsu in their zanpakutou to prevent an opposing sunder--evidenced by Ichigo's first fight with Byakuya, and his fight with Zaraki.

[Spirit Arrow]

I don't think this question has been asked, but how can you replicate Chad's El Directo? Is it possible under the current rule set, as I could not find a method to do it.

[zadcap]

As far as sundering goes, whatever else goes into it, shikai and bankai should get much harder to break. There's cannon material in this in regards to Ichigo. Either Bytakua or Urahara talks of his unreleased form as mere fluff, a large weapon showing his power, but with none of that power pushed into it. It might help DW more if constant release gave a bonus to resist sunder.

[Senir]

I'm sorry, but this sundering system has major flaws when trying to apply Bleach canon standards. the way you have it structured, almost every caster focused character will win for base hardness and hp for zanpakutous. it would be applicable to both canon and game mechanics to say that zanpakutous are immune to abilities which reduce/ignore/negate their hardness. But, as Improved sunder is a measure of a characters experience and know how when it comes to destroying an opponent's weapon, their bonus to their attempt, and the removal of a AoO penalty are both still valid. It would be better to say, an opposing concentration check to the sunder attempt would negate the damage to the zanpakutou. This both accounts for the balance of game mechanics (those characters with higher levels are more capable at managing their reiatsu), and the canon reference to needing to harden up (focus, i.e. concentrate) their reiatsu in their zanpakutou to prevent an opposing sunder--evidenced by Ichigo's first fight with Byakuya, and his fight with Zaraki.

Okay, it was only an idea. Should I try and think of something with what you suggested then, or do you want to do that yourself?

[Sin]

Okay, it was only an idea. Should I try and think of something with what you suggested then, or do you want to do that yourself?

Senir,
I apologize if I sounded rude, it was not my intention. I thought the system you proposed was noble, and at the very least, you brought up a topic which needed to be discussed and mechanized within the system to fit Bleach standards. My comments cam e only after I actually tested your system on the slew of character builds I have made already and continue to adjust and readjust with each rules update. I'm generally what most people call a mega cheesemaker when playing, so I have a fair amount of knowledge on what's reasonable to see characters doing at each power increment, and what can easily be taken advantage of for making delicious cheese. The other part of my comment was denoting the fact that the mechanics this module is being based on are based off of specific support references from Bleach manga/episodes, something for which your proposed system didn't seem to account. Again I apologize if I sounded harsh, I did not mean to come off that way.


As far as sundering goes, whatever else goes into it, shikai and bankai should get much harder to break. There's cannon material in this in regards to Ichigo. Either Bytakua or Urahara talks of his unreleased form as mere fluff, a large weapon showing his power, but with none of that power pushed into it. It might help DW more if constant release gave a bonus to resist sunder.
Zadcap,
Thanks for reminding us of this, I seem to have forgotten to account for that in my proposed sunder system. I think there were two references to this notion, one made in reference to Ichigo's zanpakutou (can't remember who made the comment), and Ichigo's father to the evolved Grand Fisher.


I don't think this question has been asked, but how can you replicate Chad's El Directo? Is it possible under the current rule set, as I could not find a method to do it.
Spirit Arrow,
Yes, you can replicate it undeer the current rules. You must utilize the S. Aware human class, the Augmentor. The class is directly based off of Chad, the little red haired kid, and Ichigo's younger sister (the soccer loving one).
The rules are still rough, but they are managable. We're still getting some of the finer details worked out of Shinigami, Quincy, and Hollows as well. Please just keep in mind that this is a work in progress, but mostly usable at it's current stage. As a DM, you will want to be aware of potential cheesemaking like you would any other 'in development' module you might use.

Regards everyone,
-Sin

[otakulrd86]

Hi, first off I would like to say that I've been following this thread for sometime now and I want to say great job, and keep it up. I do have a question/idea of wandering if you have ever thought of using the Tome of Battle to represent some of the abilities, and manuvers, again, just a thought.

[Sin]

Hi, first off I would like to say that I've been following this thread for sometime now and I want to say great job, and keep it up. I do have a question/idea of wandering if you have ever thought of using the Tome of Battle to represent some of the abilities, and manuvers, again, just a thought.

An excellent suggestion for those following along with the thread. I'm sure a great deal of the material from that book will be referenced into a later, or at least the final version of the module, but it's easier to stick to the core rules and mechanics of the module first, then flesh out more expansive details later. That way, the extra things can be modified as needed to better serve the base rules, the DM, and the players.

[Dante & Vergil]

Known kidō spells

Binding spells
1. Restrain (塞, sai?)[6] — Locks a target's arms in place behind their back.
4. Crawling Rope (這縄, hainawa?)[7] — An energy rope entangles a target's arms.
9. Strike (撃, geki?)[8] — Engulfs a target in red light, completely paralyzing them.
58. Summoning of the Tracking Sparrows (摑趾追雀, kaku****suijaku?)[9] — Tracks and locates any spiritual force the user focuses on. To activate it, the user must draw a circle on the ground, cut into four parts with a specific character in each. The incantation animates the circle, causing various numbers to appear within until the specific set is found. The number set seems to be a variation on longitude and latitude.
61. Six Rods Prison of Light (六杖光牢, rikujōkōrō?)[10] — Summons six thin, but wide, beams of light that slam into a target's midsection, holding them in place. This also appears to immobilise the target's limbs, as Kuchiki Byakuya used it to prevent Rukia from moving her sword without directly binding her arms. Referred to as "Six Rod Light Restraint" in the English manga.
75. Quintet of 1 kan Iron Pillars (五柱鉄貫, gochūtekkan?)[11] — Summons five incredibly tall and thick pillars to pin a target to the ground.
77. Heavenly Rickshaws in Silken Air (天挺空羅, tenteikūra?)[12] — Transmits messages to anyone within Soul Society. In addition to reciting the spell, the user must draw specific markings on their arms, which are animated by the spell to convey the messages.
81. Splitting Void (斷空, danku?)[13] — Creates an energy barrier in the form of a rectangular wall. According to Byakuya, it is capable of stopping destructive spells up to #89.
99, Part 1. Seal (禁, kin?) — Binds the arms of a target with spiritual fabric and iron shafts.[14]
99, Part 2. Great seal (卍禁, bankin?) — This spell covers a target from head to toe with spiritual fabric (first song), stabs them with numerous metal blades (second song), and then smashes them with an immense metal cube (final song).[15]

[edit] Destructive spells
1. Thrust (衝, shō?)[16] — Pushes the target away from the caster.
4. White Lightning (白雷, byakurai?)[17] — Fires a concentrated bolt of lightning from the caster's forefinger.
31. Shot of Red Fire (赤火砲, shakkahō?)[18] — Fires a ball of red energy at a target.
The English dub uses the phrase "Red Flame Cannon" in conjunction with the Japanese name. It also incorrectly identifies this spell as bakudō 33 in certain scenes, though correctly identifies it in the scene in which it is revealed.
33. Blue Fire, Crash Down (蒼火墜, sōkatsui?, Pale Fire Crash in the English dub)[19] — Fires a burst of blue spiritual energy at a target in a similar manner to 31, but over a wider area and with more power.
54. Abolishing Flames (廃炎, haien?)[20] — Fires a blast of purple spiritual energy that will incinerate a target completely when it makes contact.
63. Thunder Roar Cannon (雷吼炮, raikōhō?)[21] — Fires a massive wave of yellow energy at a target.
63. Twin Lotus Blue Fire, Crash Down (双蓮蒼火墜, sōren sōkatsui?)[22] — Essentially a doubled version of #33, this spell fires two shots of blue fire with greater potency than the single-shot variety. In the anime, Rukia labels this spell as #73.
90. Black Coffin (黒棺, kurohitsugi?)[23] — Forms a box of black energy around a target, which is then pierced by dozens of energy "spears", lacerating the one inside from head to toe. Its appearance and function is reminiscent of a common magician's trick, as well as certain torture devices used during the Spanish Inquisition.

[edit] Other
These spells are not explicitly stated to be in one category or the other.

White Crawl (白伏, hakufuku?)[24] — Momo Hinamori uses this spell while imprisoned to knock out a guard and destroy everything within a certain radius of herself. The anime suggests that it is a binding spell, but doesn't number it.
Mirror Door (鏡門, kyōmon?)[25] — Tōshirō Hitsugaya used this to seal Momo Hinamori's hospital room. It creates a glass-like barrier which is difficult to break from the outside, but quite simple to break from the inside.
Reverse Demon (反鬼, hanki?)[26] — This technique nullifies an opponent's kidō by hitting them with a perfectly opposite surge of energy. Yoruichi uses this against Soifon's shunkō.
Kidō Cannon (鬼道砲, Kidōhō?) — As the name suggests, the Kidō Cannon is basically a high-intensity energy weapon powered kidō in Bleach: Memories of Nobody. It consists of a crystalline focus point attached to the top of a massive pole, with several smaller crystal structures circling up towards the main one. It is powered by hundreds of shinigami working in concert, creating an energy blast capable of obliterating the Valley of Screams. The blast forms into several animal shapes which roar just before contact. The power of the blast is such that, in addition to destroying its target, it also causes a small amount of damage to both the human world and Soul Society. Despite its power, it is not a reliable or reusable weapon, as it burns into a pile of scrap after being fired.

Here is a list of the kido. Just use this for reference.

[Senir]

Senir,
I apologize if I sounded rude, it was not my intention. I thought the system you proposed was noble, and at the very least, you brought up a topic which needed to be discussed and mechanized within the system to fit Bleach standards. My comments cam e only after I actually tested your system on the slew of character builds I have made already and continue to adjust and readjust with each rules update. I'm generally what most people call a mega cheesemaker when playing, so I have a fair amount of knowledge on what's reasonable to see characters doing at each power increment, and what can easily be taken advantage of for making delicious cheese. The other part of my comment was denoting the fact that the mechanics this module is being based on are based off of specific support references from Bleach manga/episodes, something for which your proposed system didn't seem to account. Again I apologize if I sounded harsh, I did not mean to come off that way.
Oh I didn't take it as rude at all :P I'm not english, so the tone of my sentences may be a bit off. But go back to the sundering, what I don't like on what you suggested is that it requires another roll, which makes it take longer (and sundering is already quite a long process). And even if you used it, the Zanpakutõu should have hardness and hit points, which it doesn't have so far.

But I did, in fact, think of it as something considering the happenings in the anime/manga (haven't read the manga). The Charisma score was the force of personality and the Reiatsu attunement. The larger the Reiatsu, the bigger the blade and the stronger it is (though the size is most often restrained by the user for personal ease), and I thought that the Hit Points from the blade should derive from the user's hit points since they are in the very core the same thing/being. The only difference is that they both have a 'soul' or mind or whatever.

Maybe I'll think of something later today/tonight. Now I've got to clean my room. And that's a lot of work :P

*EDIT

Okay, thought of something.

A Zanpakutõu's Strength: A Zanpakutõu that sunders an enemy's Zanpakutõu who is no more than one level lower than the character, he ignores all hardness. Furthermore, it has the following stats.

Hardness: A Zanpakutõu's Hardness equals half its wielder's HD. The hardness increases to once the user's HD in Shikai and to two times its wielder's HD in Bankai, rounded down.

Hit Points: A Zanpakutõu's Hit Points equals five times its maximized base damage. For instance, a level 6 Warrior Shinigami's Zanpakutõu has a base of 40 Hit Points, and a level 16 Expert Shinigami's Zanpakutõu has a base of 60 Hit Points. Hit Points for the Zanpakutõu double when Shikai is used, and triple when Bankai is used.

Something like this? Not dependant on stats, but maybe a bit too weak? (Hit Points rise very slowly and regenerate very slowly as well). The biggest problem I have with this one is that I think it becomes almost impossible to sunder any weapon of the enemy at higher levels, since they will probably your level or higher, and as of such have massive Hardness. Maybe the sunderer should just get 1/2 level as a bonus to sunder damage instead of the enemy losing the Hardness to a more experienced fighter.

[NightmareToilet]

Incorporeal, undead = no con score.

How about doing that for shinigami and hollows?

Use Cha for Con.

Ichigo, when he had depressed reiatsu = beaten up easily

just redistribute pts or move con pts to cha.

maybe use cha for str too?

Losing a battle could then do temporary cha damage?

I'm still not fully clear on the con vs will (from wis) vs cha vs str, relationship in Bleach and how to best represent that with d20.

[NightmareToilet]

How about something for warming up to your opponent? Maybe a feat, or for DW's just an ability gained by DW's at a certain level.

Look at the latest manga with Kenpachi and sundering. Heck, sundering is like breaking, I thought, but I guess you can cut or pierce through, also, due to the reiatsu effect upon a weaker reiatsu.

Which also brings to mind the skin hardening, like you shouldn't be able to get harder skin than the hardness of your weapon. The weapon's hardness should be the max you can learn to harden your reitsu or your hide, right? And there should be something for naturally negating hardness.

How about sundering rules vs steal skin or vs armor? Need to sunder any hardness in order to get through it?!

[Josh the Aspie]

So far, in my understanding, the system has been made to use the SRD. Tome of Battle is not a part of the SRD, so I doubt that it will be incorporated. Then again, I am not one of the major system makers, just a play tester that reports possible bugs and some ideas.

---------------------------------------------

Edit 1: Speaking of things I noticed... Thus far the justification for the special weapons starting off with less damage than a katana has been that this is damage done against hollows, and nothing else can damage hollows... but Sado was able to bash one just with his enormous strength, as well as being able to bash one rather solidly with a telephone pole.

---------------------------------------------

Edit 2: Also, there -is- a way to negate hardness-like DR or other resistance to being harmed. You take the Shikai weapon-type special ability "Special Material" and choose to treat your weapon as Adamantine.

I would also like to point out that any system which would take sundering into account needs to take into account the differences in hardness between Steel, Cold Iron, an Alchemical Silver weapon, and Adamantine.

[zadcap]

Good point on edit 1 Josh.

Only spiritual weapons can sauce damage to a spiritual creature, or so it has been said. However, Hollows have been seen to break physical objects. So that leads to...

Non-leathal damage. Chad simply beat the thing sensless, so when his spiritual arm manafested, the thing was near to passing out anyway.

Nightmare, your first idea, with incorpeal and undead, while it seems logical you would be getting rid of a stat, that exists for a reason, from half the characters and all the monsters. Besides, all weapons and such can hit eachother, changing non-spiritual attacks to non-leathal damage fixes that.

As for your second idea... I don't remember where it's from, but there is a feat for that already. Each round you fight an opponent, you get a +1 to attack and/or armor against that opponent. This bonus resets when you attack anyone other than that opponent, even if its an attack of opportunity.

could you clarify your last idea, the skin hardness thing?

[Josh the Aspie]

I've also broken objects. Martial artists can shatter concrete blocks with their hands. Does that mean that being bashed with the same would be non-lethal damage for them?

[Behold_the_Void]

Hollows can be damaged by conventional means, they just have a good amount of DR against it. 20/zanpakutou or magic.

Chad's just REALLY strong. And he didn't do anything hugely threatening to it either, he just whacked it good a few times.

Anyway, new file is up, some shikai balance fixed, Augmenter ability list completed. Will work on Manifester next, and unleash abilities (although really, it'll more or less be like the Bankai ones).

[Mando Knight]

Hit Points for the Zanpakutõu double when Shikai is used, and triple when Bankai is used.

Madarame Ikkaku's Bankai is known to be somewhat easily damaged... should there be a "weakness" option to the Zanpakutō like there is for character creation?

[NightmareToilet]

Well for the idea with armor and steal skin, natural armor, how can you harm the opponent unless you first break through, sunder, the object, the hardness, in the way? Arrancar steal-hard skin or even plate mail or a shield, it is a hardness like a weapon that can be broken though, has to be broken through in order to do harm. And it is directly related to what causes a weapon's hardness, the reiatsu, right? So shouldn't it be treated similarly? The hardened reiatsu is what protects a weapon vs sundering, and it is also what causes the skin or armor to be hard, so if you have to succeed at sundering to break though the weapon, then shouldn't you have to succeed at sundering to pierce the hardness of stealed skin or armor?

[Senir]

As far as I know, this is all accounted for in normal AC, it's just breaking through the armour that is the flavor part of hitting the AC. It either means your enemy failed to dodge, you hit the unprotected areas, or you broke through his guard/armour. Kenpachi stabbing through Ichigo's zanpakutou is a flavored hit as far as I can see.

[Behold_the_Void]

As far as I know, this is all accounted for in normal AC, it's just breaking through the armour that is the flavor part of hitting the AC. It either means your enemy failed to dodge, you hit the unprotected areas, or you broke through his guard/armour. Kenpachi stabbing through Ichigo's zanpakutou is a flavored hit as far as I can see.

Pretty much. More sunder rules needlessly complicate the system and just aren't needed. They aren't even very flavorful, when fighting Arrancar, they either break through and cut them or they fail to do so because of the Iron Skin. That's what Natural Armor AC IS.

Still considering options for zanpakutou sundering, I do intend to make it difficult since you don't really see people sunder zanpakutou a lot.

[Sin]

I apologize for not delivering on my promise of mechanical reviews this last weekend, as I need to go buy a new modem and router after some unexpected issues came up with my last ones. So those comments are delayed until further notice. Currently, I have some time at work, and will address some issues that have been brewing for a while on the forum.

So here's the problem with proposing Sunder systems which function off of opposing characters' "Reiatsu level" in this module:

There is no system for quantifying reiatsu in this module.
Thus far at least.

There are likely a variety of reasons for this. I'll illustrate what I presume to be some of the most critical points in regard to this matter. For reading purposes, I'll discuss 'Pro' as items in favor of a calculable Reiatsu value, and 'Con' as items in favor of not having one. This may seem a little wonky, considering the fact that there isn't a system for Reiatsu values, but you'll pick it up quickly enough I expect.

Pro:
A calculable Reiatsu level would clear up a great deal of messy items regarding game mechanics and the module's ability to match the Bleach universe. Examples of solved problems include Reiatsu hardening to prevent damage to the character, stabilize the character's health, kidou/shunpo issues, and sunder mechanics.

Con:
Defining a system for measuring an exact value for Reiatsu inevitably brings many game mechanic problems as well as solutions. Players would no doubt create characters which maximize Reiatsu capabilities in order to enable their character to have the mathematic advantage over opponents in systems revolving around opposing Reiatsus (nearly everything in the Bleach universe). Leaving Reiatsu values undefined enables characters to express character strength through roleplaying and other character ability choices (feats, skills, shikai/bankai abilities, attributes, etc). Additionally, calculation of Reiatsu values entails many mathematic and mechanical challenges for the module designer(s), because such a system would redefine the essential game mechanics-in ther words, the base d20 system would be considerably less valuable as a base system for established balanced game mechanics and functions.

That is not to say that Reiatsu levels are not to be defined at all. There are many mehtods of expressing a character's Reiatsu level, power, control, and speciality in the current version of the module. Spell points are the system in place for character's who've focused their knowledge for that aspect, and those with more focus in the spell system have it expressed with greater spell point pools, higher spell levels available, more spells, and more metakidou capability (higher Reiatsu control, specialization, base level), than those characters who chose to focus more towards aspects of Zanpakutou combat. With regard to Zanpakutou combat, those characters who specialize further and further are rewarded with abilties representing that Reiatsu contol, useage, and growth through feats, a higher BAB, at some cost of Kidou capability. Then, there is room for characters which dabble in a bit of both (ex: the Expert Shinigami), and whos abilities are not nearly as highly specialized in either the Kidou or Zanpakutou combat abilities, but have a fairly substantial amount of experience and control with some of both. These same traits are carried over into the other available classes as well, albeit represented in slightly different manners.

Likely, there should be a system for multiclassing, which would further the module's ability to represent a character's efforts to learn or develope in new and exciting ways. But the moduel is still in it's infancy, perhaps a toddler stage at this point, and many things are still being worked out. The lead designer has mentioned the desire to try and work out a multiclassing system in the future, but has prioritized many more critical aspects of the system ahead of those plans (Hollows, Kidou, significant game mechanics/balancing questions, etc).

I'd like to express the fact that the designer has opted for the 'Con' approach as described above. I'm guessing he expects characters to flesh out their Reiatsu related abilities through existing means, with the help of supplementary material he provides (shikai/bankai, new feat/skill choices & funtions, etc). And expects the DM of a campaign to be the one who moderates characters development and abilities with regard to the presented system. He ahs on repeated occasion, epressed a desire to leave alone systems which already funtion properly and make a minimum of required changes/alterations to those that do not serve the module's needs. He has decided to let progressing AC values and other such ameneties represent and solve the issues regarding the functioning of the Bleach universe, rather than install a supplementary or overriding system to represent all the crazy nuances of the Bleach universe. Also, repeated review of the fact that this is a roleplaying game, and not a numbers game, has been made. Some things can just get so convoluted, or so out there, that representing them with actual mechanics becomes both extraneous and a burden, simply remember this is a game, and chalk it up with DM approval and role playing. There is a desire to represent critical aspects of the Bleach universe, and I believe that the designer(s) intend to do so like they have stated previously, "with minimal alterations to the existing system." Likely, the additional mechanics to things like Sundering, etc, will be represented with alternative uses of skills, and other types of existing checks. Just as how sense motive has gained a side use relating to the track feat, etc.

-Sin

[Senir]

Just wondering, though I probably already know the answer.

Do the prestige classes cause your Shunpo, Shikai abilities and Bankai abilities to increase? No, right?

[Behold_the_Void]

Just wondering, though I probably already know the answer.

Do the prestige classes cause your Shunpo, Shikai abilities and Bankai abilities to increase? No, right?

Shikai and Bankai progress at the listed rate for the class. Shunpo increases as if you were gaining levels normally, it's mentioned in the section on Prestige classes as to what you retain and what you do not retain.

[Senir]

True, but those weren't stated.

[Behold_the_Void]

True, but those weren't stated.

Weird, I could have sworn I added Shunpo Progression. Well, should be fixed in the next update.

[Sin]

Yeah, I remember discussing the same topic with you about two weeks ago, and you mentioned putting it on the to do list. That's probably what you're remembering. As we got caught up discussing a bunch of issues regarding some bankai abilties and feats.

[Deathfish]

I'm not sure if I completely missed this but i notice in the latest compilation of the rules, the Bankai feat "Time Stands Still" was not there. Again if I'm just being crazy and asking a question that already has been answered then please just ignore my crazy nonsense.

[Sin]

I'm not sure if I completely missed this but i notice in the latest compilation of the rules, the Bankai feat "Time Stands Still" was not there. Again if I'm just being crazy and asking a question that already has been answered then please just ignore my crazy nonsense.

I noticed that as well. And I don't think it was in the previous release either, BtV. Would you be so kind as to fill us in?

[Behold_the_Void]

It's been renamed since I remembered the Maneuver "Time Stands Still" isn't OGL so I shouldn't be using the name. It's been powered down to more or less duplicate the effects of the maneuver, and has been renamed "Furious Blade."

[Dante & Vergil]

I was just checking the characters and I'm a little confused with the damage progression of the zanpakuto. If someone here could, could you post up an expanded progression of the zanpakuto (using any of the classes) past what is listed and explain the pattern used to do it?

[Ryvaken]

In Bleach chapter 259 page 1, Uryu retrieves the Seele Schnieder he shot in the previous chapter. This is contrary to the ruling that seele schnieder are destroyed when used as arrows.

The saves required to wear a sanrei glove are absurdly unlikely for any character simply by the sheer number of saves required, and it entices players to have poor reflex saves which makes even less sense.

The ability to use a full round action to perform double the spirit charge gain of a single move action is superfluous. That the full-round action also provokes an AoO makes it, literally, worse than useless.

[Sin]

In Bleach chapter 259 page 1, Uryu retrieves the Seele Schnieder he shot in the previous chapter. This is contrary to the ruling that seele schnieder are destroyed when used as arrows.

The saves required to wear a sanrei glove are absurdly unlikely for any character simply by the sheer number of saves required, and it entices players to have poor reflex saves which makes even less sense.

The ability to use a full round action to perform double the spirit charge gain of a single move action is superfluous. That the full-round action also provokes an AoO makes it, literally, worse than useless.

Yes, trust me when I tell you that whaling on the current Quincy write up is like beating a dead horse. A few of us have already gone to town on that animal. It's not BtV class build, but someone else's, and isn't specifically designed for this module, but the other person's as well. I'm guessing it was included as a baseline for ideas, but it really lacks the ability to be compared to the shinigami or supernaturally aware human classes.

-Sin

[Ryvaken]

Some things have been fixed in the latest version of the rules regarding the Quincy. Thus, clearly, things are being changed. And the horse is only dead when the thing is balanced; until then it's just bruised, broken, and bleeding.

[Dante & Vergil]

I was just checking the characters and I'm a little confused with the damage progression of the zanpakuto. If someone here could, could you post up an expanded progression of the zanpakuto (using any of the classes) past what is listed and explain the pattern used to do it?

I hope someone will get this up for me.

[Sin]

Point taken. Everytime the class gets an update, the horse is effectively revitalized and ready for another beating. However, many of the changes that were deemed necessary were not yet applied in the latest edition of the class. So, rather than spend a great deal of time rehashing old issues, concentrate on beating the hell out of the new ones. Unless of course, you notice the new updates have somehow created mechanical issues with previously available material.

If the above seemed in any way confusing, just ignore it. But please, support your claims/comments/concerns in an applicable fashion. Otherwise you can consider yourself ignored by the module designer(s).

-Sin

[Behold_the_Void]

I may just end up doing my own Quincy write-up so I can balance them to each other.

Also, I'm looking to add a 3rd Spiritually Awakened Human, the Mystic, which would be a caster-based class. Keep them all balanced against each other and all that.

[Josh the Aspie]

I was just checking the characters and I'm a little confused with the damage progression of the zanpakuto. If someone here could, could you post up an expanded progression of the zanpakuto (using any of the classes) past what is listed and explain the pattern used to do it?

There is no specific expanded progression. According to the module writer the damage is based on the monk's damage progression. There is no monk damage progression past level 20.

[KBF]

There is no monk damage progression past level 20.

To expand, there is no level progression past 20 in Bleach D20, that's actually a special ability of Vaizard and maybe Arrancar... I forgot.

[Josh the Aspie]

To expand, there is no level progression past 20 in Bleach D20, that's actually a special ability of Vaizard and maybe Arrancar... I forgot.

Yes. Of both of them. But those base their Zanpakutou progression on the other classes. That's likely why he wanted to know what the progression of those classes is past level 20.

[zadcap]

because there is no progression past level 20. As Vizard, you just start gaining abilities, no more damage unless thats the ability you take. No more Kidou points, no more flash step range, no more attacks or damage. Unless all three continue to progress past level 20, it would be unfair if only one class out of three got their main area boosted.

[Behold_the_Void]

There is a formula for calculating beyond for purposes of expanded damage and the like. Basically, 2d10 - 3d8 - 3d10 - 4d8 - 4d10 and so on. I'll post the table in the rules in the next update.

[zadcap]

I could be wrong...

So do Shunpo and Kidou advance past level 20 as well?

[Dante & Vergil]

Thanks for that, 'Void.

[hacim]

first, I love the system

in the show, characters are creating inventions, magic effects, and the like all the time, but there is no section on that. Also characters can channel pure spirit power and can deal massive blows with it, but the damage values are all based on psyonics, which deals relatively low damage, while normal shinigami are crazy strong. also the entire section on manifesting human abilities is missing

[Behold_the_Void]

I could be wrong...

So do Shunpo and Kidou advance past level 20 as well?

Shunpo yes, Kidou to a certain degree. Epic Casters continue to have their Caster level raised and thus can augment higher. I'll have epic progressions posted later.


first, I love the system

in the show, characters are creating inventions, magic effects, and the like all the time, but there is no section on that. Also characters can channel pure spirit power and can deal massive blows with it, but the damage values are all based on psyonics, which deals relatively low damage, while normal shinigami are crazy strong. also the entire section on manifesting human abilities is missing

Creating magic and special items is extremely touch-and-go, the D20 system isn't structured around player-created content so the ability to do that is severely limited. The damage levels are more or less fine (adjustments will be made based on playtesting). Again, this is the D20 system I'm working with. I'm making rules that work within the pre-existing rules and not modifying anything I don't have to. Manifesters are in progress, the system is not yet complete.

[Dante & Vergil]

Do you plan to keep this 3.5/3.0 with 4.0 coming out, 'Void? I hope you do.

[Senir]

That question was already answered. The system is primarily 3.5, and only after completion 4E will be looked at.

[Dante & Vergil]

I highly doubt this will even be taken into account, but from what I saw in chapter 311, which is the most recent chapter as I am posting this, Kenpachi's attacks get stronger because he starts swinging his zanpakuto with both of his hands. It seems to be something more to do with what Kenpachi does, but do you guys think it's relevent?:smallconfused:

[Xuincherguixe]

Sounds to me like a case of two handed weapon. So he adds a strength bonus of 1.5. Which fo 'patch is oodles.

[zadcap]

I might say a feat, since it's something he learned, "Make one attack at full attack bonus and _____." Depending on how it turns out next chapter, I'd say "And add your level to attack/damage/both" Not as relevent, but that two handed downword strike is prety popular in anime.

This brings up something to add to the general rules, and saves you work in the long run. Note when the most recent chapter out is when you release an update on the update, so people don't come saying "Oh, well so-and-so did this realy awesom attack, but there's no rules for it, how come?" or similar comments.

[Behold_the_Void]

I might say a feat, since it's something he learned, "Make one attack at full attack bonus and _____." Depending on how it turns out next chapter, I'd say "And add your level to attack/damage/both" Not as relevent, but that two handed downword strike is prety popular in anime.

This brings up something to add to the general rules, and saves you work in the long run. Note when the most recent chapter out is when you release an update on the update, so people don't come saying "Oh, well so-and-so did this realy awesom attack, but there's no rules for it, how come?" or similar comments.

It really doesn't need a feat.

Yama-jii might have taught him some techniques but all it really comes down to is he starts two-handing his sword, adding 1.5x his already grotesque strength bonus.

[Dante & Vergil]

How hight do you think Kenpachi's strength is before and after he removes his eye patch?

[Xuincherguixe]

I say 41.03

[zadcap]

I'd say maybe 30 with it on, 40-50 off, because it's his version of Bankai, and tremendouse ability boosts are on these somewhere.

[Dante & Vergil]

How are things coming along with the project?

[Byakko]

I have a question about the other units beside Gotei 13. I haven't read the comic yet, and I'm not even sure it has been explained there eighter, and I was wondering if the Special Militia run by Siphon or the Shinigami Research Institute are sub groups of the Gotei 13 or separate bodies AND if it's possible for a Shinigami to be part of the Gotei and one of this group. For example my character is a memeber of the 7th Squadron as a Shinigami expert and wanted to join the Reseach Institute, do you think that whould be possible ?

[zadcap]

I know it's a small thing, but when did we lose the pictures? The decorations made it more fun to read :smallwink:

[Xuincherguixe]

Pretty sure the research group is one of the gotei 13, and the special forces are not.

That being said, you could help other squads.

[F.H. Zebedee]

Research, IIRC, is exclusively the province of 12th division. Special Forces, on the other hand, is not directly connected and can stack, in a sense, though it doesn't have to (Yoruichi was in it, but not the Gotei 13, while Soifon(g) was in both.

[Byakko]

Thank for the info, that make things a bit more clear =)
I have now a question about Bankai abilities.
It says that when you reach bankai you double your shikai abilities to craft your basic bankai and that's clear enough but I was wondering what happens when you grow in lvl and get more shikai (IE from lvl 12 to 13 where you get a new shikai ability), does those successive shikai add and multiply for your bankai ?

[Dante & Vergil]

'Void has already said that any shikai abilities obtained after bankai was count towards crafting bankai.

[Behold_the_Void]

'Void has already said that any shikai abilities obtained after bankai was count towards crafting bankai.

Correct.

I haven't had much time to work on it, I'm in the process of setting up an online business venture and approaching the end of the quarter and finals. I'm still figuring out how I want to handle the Manifesters, but they're going to be much like normal casters with their abilities, just with their own slew of different applications (it also will let me test a system I had considered for another world since D20 is OGL and all that). More to come later.

[zadcap]

How much do you have on spiritualy awakened humans? I'dlike to see what you have, even if it's incomplete.

Nevermind, found it. An update to the table of contents is desperatly needed :smallwink:

How about feats for them that function like the zampakuto feats?
((I'll start working on some))

[Dante & Vergil]

I was looking at the manifester and I didn't see an ability list for them, unlike the augmenters. I was wondering when that would get put in?

[Behold_the_Void]

Manifester is the next scheduled update. That will be some time after Finals, unless someone wants to write my Anthropology assignment and take my Econ test for me.

[zadcap]

I'd love to... sadly I don't know Anthropology or Econ.

[Dante & Vergil]

You got any updates for us, 'Void?

[Behold_the_Void]

I just finished finals and have been taking care of business at home. I'll try to have something up in the next few days.

[Byakko]

I was wondering how is everyone handling the hand-to-hand aspect of the shinigami. They have Hakudo and they do train in it and is one of the 4 abilities a shinigami has to train in (Sai Fon and Yuroichi are even master of that as we have seen).

[Behold_the_Void]

I was wondering how is everyone handling the hand-to-hand aspect of the shinigami. They have Hakudo and they do train in it and is one of the 4 abilities a shinigami has to train in (Sai Fon and Yuroichi are even master of that as we have seen).

Improved and Superior Unarmed Strike.

[Dante & Vergil]

With the most recent chapters foreshadowing of what is to come, we might actually get to see what a Vasto Lorde is capable of, but this might not be for a little while because I heard that they're doing a series of chapters that give the backstory to the series that will last about 2 months. The first of these chapters, -108, is quite interesting. It gives another section of high power characters that we know little about. It appears that the most of the vizard were captains. Captains can be promoted to a higher rank if strong enough I guess. (Which is really nuts 'cause the captains are strong enough as is.) When a captain gets promoted, the go to Division 0, which is the Royal Guard. Digest this for a little and respond.

[Xuincherguixe]

It just occurred to me. If that -108 is what it sounds like... it could be two years before it comes back to this plot line.

[Byakko]

Improved and Superior Unarmed Strike.

Don't you think some kind of progression should be automate. After all, the other abilities of a shinigami, shumpo, reijutsu e kido grow with them, why only hakudo has to be selected and not only that but with two feats non the less ?

[zadcap]

Probably because it is the least used aspect of the shinigami? Of all the characters we know, 100% have swords, 80% have used flash step, 50% have used Kidou of some form, and only two use hand to hand fighting. And technicaly, one of them uses her zampakuto, I'd stat her as using a dagger rather than bare handed.

[F.H. Zebedee]

Actually, Shinigami that used unarmed combat:
-Yoruichi
-Soifon (kinda. I see her as using unarmed strikes and busting out her Shikai upgrades her damage to Zanpakutou levels)
-Aizen (Uses some weird Kidou/Unarmed Combat to waste that hollow in the past)
-Tessai (Who as a SPELLCASTER has the oomph to waste a moderate Hollow)
-Nemu (More of a grappler from what we've heard/seen in Golden Cup)

I'm noting that most of the martial artists are also kidou users of a high degree. I'm thinking this has to do with their weaker Zanpakutou, though I'll also need to remember that when I'm homebrewing spells (make some Unarmed Damage boosting ones.)

[Dante & Vergil]

Do we have any updates? 'Void? Zebulon?
On a crazy note, I was thinking that DR could be delt with percentages instead of straight numbers, depending on whatever skill check that raises raiatsu. What do you guys think?

[Senir]

In the DnD franchise they aren't too happy about percentages. It is pretty weird that if you have a DR of say, 20%, that a damage that would deal massive damage would lose a significant part of its damage, but a super weak attack would still do damage. And above all it takes more maths, which will slow down the game.

[Dante & Vergil]

Your right. Percentages don't work as well as I thought they might. How about keep DR numbers as is but increase the actual numbers 'cause DR 8 dosen't seem like it will stop anything effectively.
Edit: What if you made a Reiatsu check (1d20+charisma or whatever+concentration ranks [or a darned skill that deals with reiatsu]) against someone elses Reiatsu check when you make an attack against that person, if they maintain a concentration check before hand. If you beat it by X or more, you deal normal damage, if you beat it by <X, you deal damage, but not as much, but if you don't beat it, you deal no damage, and if you fail to beat it by Y or more, you take the damage instead.
To do this you must maintain a concentration check each round to keep your armor reiatsu.

The numbers and other specifics can definitely be changed, as needed. Other than that, what do you guys think?

[Behold_the_Void]

Sorry, been busy with my other project, the overall Anime-based homebrew system. It's hard to come back to D20 after working on it since the new system is just generally so much better at representing Bleach.

As far as Hakuda, it is used by shinigami and is a branch of their disciplines but isn't used by everyone, which is why the Improved Unarmed Strike and Superior Unarmed Strike feats can represent it well without requiring any additional mechanics.

[Dante & Vergil]

Sorry, been busy with my other project, the overall Anime-based homebrew system. It's hard to come back to D20 after working on it since the new system is just generally so much better at representing Bleach.

Oh, a new system? Care to share that with us? I know I would love to see it.:smallbiggrin:

[Behold_the_Void]

I'll likely be posting it up here when I'm ready for more playtesting, I'm running the initial playtest right now and that plus our projections have it working well. I actually want to market this system so it's being kept more under-wraps.

I'm still working on this, it just takes a bit of effort to switch gears between the two since they're so wildly different.

[Dante & Vergil]

That's a shame that you can't share that, but I totally understand. Oh well.:smalltongue:

[F.H. Zebedee]

Just found a feat that seems VERY similar to Shunko.
http://realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Arcane_Strike,

Another system? Sounds interesting, to say the least.

[Glitch Override]

I have been following this wonderful undertaking that everyone has contributed to for some time now. I was wondering if there are any new updates of any kind. Also does anyone have new feats that they use as a 'house rule' in any game they play/dm??

[FelixZ]

I'm waiting until it's ready to be tested...

[Xenoti]

awesome progress guys. I love it!

[TheLogman]

Wow, I really can't see.

Great Homebrew, keep up the good work. I may return if I run into problems with the Sinigami I'm making.

[HeroicSociopath]

Shouldn't all non-hollow spirits posess divine aura?

You'd have to change it a bit, but from what I've seen, divine aura is essential. When someone is closeby, people begin kneeling from the weight of the aura, and feel hungry and fatigue.


As for kenpachi, he's bassicaly an epic barbarian/fighter gestalt with ghost touch feat. He even bassicaly states magic is for panzies, and doesn't care that he can't even callout his Zanpakto for basic spells.
http://images.encyclopediadramatica.com/images/5/57/Some_picture.jpg

The Eyepatch is actually a living thing, most likely an abberation, that bassicaly grants a -3 to his BaB, dexterity, constitution, strength, HP, damage rolls, and reduces his divine aura. When he removes it, he's even more badass.

[TheLogman]

Specialization seems a little overpowered, I mean 3 weapon abilities from one section is still a lot better than 1, of course, it will come back to bite the wielder, but still.

[Hadrian_Emrys]

In crap that's so over the top as Bleach tends to be, DR and ER would fit better if it was something based on a system like x (base resistance) times y (ECL of the creature), only tweaked to balance with the power level of the system.

[Behold_the_Void]

So, regarding this system.

I've been considering shutting this project down (at least temporarily) for several reasons. The first is that D&D 4.0 is coming out, and it's going to be wildly different. When they first announced it, I thought it might in some way be convert-able, but with the revisions they're making, 4e will simply be an entirely different system and most of the work here will become more or less obsolete.

The second reason is that 4e looks FAR more promising as a system that will support this endeavor. With the new changes to gameplay and balance, the power system and the tiers (shikai at heroic tier, bankai at paragon tier, vizard/arrancar as an epic destiny) are far more suited to Bleach than the current 3.5 system. I'm somewhat inclined to sit it out with the material I have and take a look at 4e, rework what I DO have, and give it another go.

The third and final reason is the current anime system I AM working on is turning out to be far more suited for a Bleach campaign.

So to that end, I think that this system will at the very least be put on hold until the release of 4e. I AM, however, willing to work with the current homebrew system I do have and put together a Bleach module for those who are interested. I hope to release my homebrew system for playtesting on this site soon, or at the very least make it marginally available to those who are earnestly interested in running a playtest campaign (I do want to market it so I may not be posting large swaths of mechanics like I did for Bleach), so either way those who want to give it a go will have access to that.

Anyway, I'm open to imput regarding a possible 4e upgrade as well as a Bleach module for my current homebrew system, so let me know what you want, I'll try to accomodate it as much as possible since this is a playable but still unfinished project and I feel bad for leaving you guys hanging after all the great support you've given me for the project.

[Dante & Vergil]

So, regarding this system.

I've been considering shutting this project down (at least temporarily) for several reasons. The first is that D&D 4.0 is coming out, and it's going to be wildly different. When they first announced it, I thought it might in some way be convert-able, but with the revisions they're making, 4e will simply be an entirely different system and most of the work here will become more or less obsolete.

The second reason is that 4e looks FAR more promising as a system that will support this endeavor. With the new changes to gameplay and balance, the power system and the tiers (shikai at heroic tier, bankai at paragon tier, vizard/arrancar as an epic destiny) are far more suited to Bleach than the current 3.5 system. I'm somewhat inclined to sit it out with the material I have and take a look at 4e, rework what I DO have, and give it another go.

The third and final reason is the current anime system I AM working on is turning out to be far more suited for a Bleach campaign.

So to that end, I think that this system will at the very least be put on hold until the release of 4e. I AM, however, willing to work with the current homebrew system I do have and put together a Bleach module for those who are interested. I hope to release my homebrew system for playtesting on this site soon, or at the very least make it marginally available to those who are earnestly interested in running a playtest campaign (I do want to market it so I may not be posting large swaths of mechanics like I did for Bleach), so either way those who want to give it a go will have access to that.

Anyway, I'm open to imput regarding a possible 4e upgrade as well as a Bleach module for my current homebrew system, so let me know what you want, I'll try to accomodate it as much as possible since this is a playable but still unfinished project and I feel bad for leaving you guys hanging after all the great support you've given me for the project.

It's a shame that it will most likely change to 4th edition, many problems I see with it for mainstream D&D, but Bleach could work really well with it. Don't worry about leaving us hanging, at least me anyway. I knew you had a lot on your hands with the new system your coming up with, so no worries.

[Glitch Override]

Void,

I don't believe that anyone is or will be mad at you for putting the current system on hold till 4e comes out and you have time to make the change over to 4e. I for one would love to get my hands on that once its finished being changed over. I look forward to running a test campaign and reporting the results to the hungry Bleach mob.

[FelixZ]

Well, with 4e you can make a seperate class for each 'role', with the powersource being Spirit. The four different roles are Controller, Striker, Defender, and Leader. Depending on which squad you are in, you would be in one of those areas. For instance, 4th squad make great defenders, while 11th squad are perfect strikers.

[Lord Firedrake]

So I've just started running a Bleach Campaign using this system and I've run in to a small issue.

At level one all Shinigami have "Alternate Zanpakutou Form" I'm not sure what exactly that is, I believe that it's the whole every Zanpakutou has a different hilt and cross guard, is that the case.

[Behold_the_Void]

So I've just started running a Bleach Campaign using this system and I've run in to a small issue.

At level one all Shinigami have "Alternate Zanpakutou Form" I'm not sure what exactly that is, I believe that it's the whole every Zanpakutou has a different hilt and cross guard, is that the case.

Yes, that's it exactly.

[Lord Firedrake]

Like i said I thought so, but i wanted to make sure...