Lightning Rod Grappler

[Perseus]

So one of the problems with the EK is that it is a little MAD and you typically won't have the Int to pull off the save spells which leaves you with buffs... Nah I think I know what to do. Strength and Intelligence based "lightning rod".

I'm building a Fighter EK Jujitsu master type (except a shield will be used). If you have the grapple condition then you take disadvantage on Dex saves after all :D.

Fighter 1/Rogue 2/Fighter 17 is my current build.

Stats:

Str: Priority but with x2 prof to athletics it doesn't need to be maxed.

Dex: No penalties unless necessary.

Con: 12+, I love me some HP but the fighter levels should do nicely.

Int: high as possible.

Wis: no penalty but if you must...

Cha: Dump stat for this build.

Feats: I won't take all of these and most of them can be switched out depending on player preference.

Tavern Brawler (need!)
Shield Master (need!)
Grappler (with RAI reading, obviously)
War caster (need!)
Mobile (want, not needed)
Athletic (want, not needed)
Ritual Casting/Magic Initiate/Martial Adept: (want, not needed)

Tactics versus big baddie... Or really anyone.

Round 1 (Lock): Move in, shield attack (1d4+Str), BA grab.

Round 2 (Drop): BA trip, Action Restrain, action surge Dex based spell.

Round 3 (Leave us alone): Cast darkness or have ally do it (saves you a round)... You are blasting area spells so no disadvantage for you... To bad disadvantage doesn't stack lol. The mooks might just be all like "yo man we don't even need this job" after they see the Fighter grapple-tackle the boss and go to town on him. The screams from the darkness might be worth advantage on a intimidation check...

Rolled stats for this PC in front of the next DM I'll have for a one shot... Should be fun ;).

Str: 17 (15+1 human, +1 Tavern Brawler)
Dex: 10
Con: 14
Int: 16
Wis: 12 (11+1 human)
Cha: 9

Basic Feats...
Human: Tavern Brawler
Fighter: Grappler, War caster, Shield Master, Athletic (+1 Strength) ,+2 Int, +2 Int

Hmmm enlarge person will allow me to grapple more creatures...

So what am I missing? I'm thinking this might make a better Rogue/Cleric build...

Edit:

Material Components could be troublesome, I'll need to see how they interact with war caster...

Edit 2: Lightning Bolt will be a fun spell to use for this build. Might need to MC one more time for more spells... Which is where Tempest Cleric comes in...hmmm.... Actually a fun thing to do would be to roleplay as if I'm using the grappled creature as a energy source for my spells... Hmm...

Edit 3:

Fighter 1/Rogue 2/Fighter 17 gets me pretty much all I want. 6 feats/ASI and cunning action isn't to bad. I'll get every EK martial archetype feature too.

When grappling (advantage) my damage will be 1d4+2 (deulist)+Str (3 - 5)+1d6(sneak attack) which averages out to something like... 11 damage with +3 strength. That's when I don't have a shield. Wonder if I can convince the DM a buckler is a finesse weapon?

High level...

I end up with 18 strength and 20 Int...

Athletics: 12 (expertise) + 4 (strength) = +17 to grapple/pin/shove...

DC: 8 + 6 + 5 = 19

Oh yeah, I should probably take shocking grasp as a cantrip... Lol

[MaxWilson]

Eldritch Knight is not MAD at all. Sure, he benefits from having high Int, but even with Int 10, Eldritch Strike means his spells are roughly on par with spells from an Int 20 wizard. DC 19 vs. DC 14 with disadvantage are quite similar threat profiles. Of course DC 19 with disadvantage is even better, but that is MAD.

In regards to your specific build I see two problems: you can't use a bonus action to shove with your shield on the same turn you use another bonus action to trip; and it is incorrect that grappled imposes disadvantage to Dex checks. Perhaps you are thinking of Pinned. Or is this a bonus from the Grappler feat? I'm AFB.

[Perseus]

Eldritch Knight is not MAD at all. Sure, he benefits from having high Int, but even with Int 10, Eldritch Strike means his spells are roughly on par with spells from an Int 20 wizard. DC 19 vs. DC 14 with disadvantage are quite similar threat profiles. Of course DC 19 with disadvantage is even better, but that is MAD.

In regards to your specific build I see two problems: you can't use a bonus action to shove with your shield on the same turn you use another bonus action to trip; and it is incorrect that grappled imposes disadvantage to Dex checks. Perhaps you are thinking of Pinned. Or is this a bonus from the Grappler feat? I'm AFB.

Sorry, that was two rounds worth of actions, forgot to add a space lol.

Lock n drop in two rounds.

I believe Grappler gives you the option to pin/restrain a target. I'm AFB but I'm sure that's where I got it from.

Later I'll put this guy up on a google doc character sheet.

Fighting Style:

Protection or Deulist. The other options don't really appeal to me.

Edit:

Damn it I forgot... I may need a higher Dex to MC rogue... Doable but annoying.

[CyberThread]

Am just thinking realsiticly, how often folks make it to level 20.

What do you think of going Fighter 17/ Bard 3, instead of rogue 2? I know you would lose out on the fighter archtype, and rogue dash/disengage business, but you would get a full ton of abilties to those around you, not just the slim build concept your going for.

[Perseus]

Am just thinking realsiticly, how often folks make it to level 20.

What do you think of going Fighter 17/ Bard 3, instead of rogue 2? I know you would lose out on the fighter archtype, and rogue dash/disengage business, but you would get a full ton of abilties to those around you, not just the slim build concept your going for.

I play in high level one shots from time to time so I like having a low, mid, high level build fleshed out :).

I really don't want Cha to be that high to deal with those spells and stuff. But I prefer the mobility of the rogue since that is one of the weaknesses of grapplers. Plus dragging halves my speed, BA dash gives me my speed back.

Barighter (great name for a bar fighter build with tavern brawler...) is a good build but not something I want to do with this character.

I need to up the Dex on this PC to get MC qualification. Even if the DM hand waived it I would want it to be a legit build...

Str: 17 (15 +1 Tavern Brawler +1 Human)
Dex: 14
Con: 12 (11 + 1 Human)
Int: 16
Wis: 10
Cha: 9

Bah, I hate low wisdom but whatever... :/


Edit: I wasn't thinking of getting Fly but really... That could lead to some fun stuff. If I can get up high enough an Atomic Suplex of Doom (TM) could be fun. Fly (with cunning action dash) would be 60ft... Hehehe

[MaxWilson]

I really don't want Cha to be that high to deal with those spells and stuff. But I prefer the mobility of the rogue since that is one of the weaknesses of grapplers. Plus dragging halves my speed, BA dash gives me my speed back.

But you already can get Bonus Action Dash because you're an Eldritch Knight who can cast Expeditious Retreat.

The thing that puzzles me about this build is that it's built around grappling/pinning an enemy in order to give it disadvantage on Dex saves--but since you're an Eldritch Knight you can already give it disadvantage on Dex saves just by hitting it with a weapon. That doesn't mean grappling is bad, if that's the character you want to play, but it seems like a very roundabout way of accomplishing your goal.

[Perseus]

But you already can get Bonus Action Dash because you're an Eldritch Knight who can cast Expeditious Retreat.

The thing that puzzles me about this build is that it's built around grappling/pinning an enemy in order to give it disadvantage on Dex saves--but since you're an Eldritch Knight you can already give it disadvantage on Dex saves just by hitting it with a weapon. That doesn't mean grappling is bad, if that's the character you want to play, but it seems like a very roundabout way of accomplishing your goal.

Taking Rogue 1 = Expertise
Rogue 2 = what essentially is Magic Initiate but the spell is at will and not a spell. Plus I then have an open spell known I can use for something better.

Hitting an enemy is nice and all, I like me some damage. However this guy locks down an enemy, or two enemies if I don't use a shield.

Attack rolls are nice and all but I won't get +17 anytime soon. Monsters do not get fantastic bonuses to their skills...

This character is every damage dealer's best friend. Rogues and Evokers mostly but others can get mileage out of it... Restrained target versus smite? A very single target controller ish type character.

If the enemy can't move then the enemy is a sitting duck and doesn't get to use tactics... If you don't use tactics against me/my groups then you don't last long.


TL;DR: Rogue allows me to double prof bonus and gives at will version of a spell freeing up a slot. Grapple has higher mod than attacking.

And

Bzzzzt!

[Felvion]

You don't have to mc into rogue. Start as a rogue to get rid of the 13 dex requirement.
Pros:+1 skill overall, better stat allocation
Cons:-4 hp (dont think they matter too much on a highlevel oneshot)
Ofc your save proficiency changes too but thats up to you to bother.
Have fun with your character mate, hope i pointed the above thoughts sooner you'd come up with by yourself.

[MaxWilson]

You don't have to mc into rogue. Start as a rogue to get rid of the 13 dex requirement.

That doesn't remove the 13 requirement. A rogue without 13 Dex can never multiclass to anything at all until he raises his Dex.

[Bakakiba]

You don't have to mc into rogue. Start as a rogue to get rid of the 13 dex requirement.
Pros:+1 skill overall, better stat allocation
Cons:-4 hp (dont think they matter too much on a highlevel oneshot)
Ofc your save proficiency changes too but thats up to you to bother.
Have fun with your character mate, hope i pointed the above thoughts sooner you'd come up with by yourself.

You need to meet the stat requirements of both classes you multi into and out of.

[Perseus]

You don't have to mc into rogue. Start as a rogue to get rid of the 13 dex requirement.
Pros:+1 skill overall, better stat allocation
Cons:-4 hp (dont think they matter too much on a highlevel oneshot)
Ofc your save proficiency changes too but thats up to you to bother.
Have fun with your character mate, hope i pointed the above thoughts sooner you'd come up with by yourself.

My second post already on thebDex issue. Thanks though.

[Felvion]

Well, i got caught there... I guess i didn't pay much attention reading the multiclassing rules. Thanks everyone that cared enough to correct me!