Disarm-o-mancer (3.5)

[madtinker]

I had an idea for an NPC/encounter; an enemy who's fighting style is simply, grab the other guy's sword and hit him with it/throw it at somebody. rinse, repeat until the party is completely disarmed.

I started googling feats that benefit disarm. The goal here is not to get my disarm modifier as high as possible, it is to get it to a reasonable level and then do interesting things once I have disarmed the other guy.

The party is level 5-6, consists of a monk, a cleric, a battle sorcerer, and a DMPC fighter.

Available sources: Anything I can find on-line (through SRD, DnDwiki, or Dndtools).
So far, I have:

Feats:
Improved Unarmed Strike (because he'll usually start unarmed)
Combat expertise (a prerequisite for Improved disarm)
Improved disarm (avoid AoO)
Weaponfocus (prerequisite for Master disarm)
Master disarm (+2 to disarm)
Throw anything (prerequisite for Disarm and Fling)
*Disarm and Fling (throw a weapon anfter disarming opponent)
*Strike at the Tail (attack after disarming)
Backhanded Throughstrike (+4 to attack after disarming)

*These give extra attacks after a successful. At first blush, they don't look mutually exclusive. SO I could get an extra melee attack and then a free ranged attack, yes?

Classes: At first I thought fighter or monk, but maybe Unarmed Swordsage is a better chassis for this. A few fighter levels may be necessary to pick up enough feats.

Races: The campaign is mostly humans, but an elf or orc variant could fit. If ToB is used, I would like to use dwarf, (because in this world, only dwarfs have ToB). I know getting large size would be a big help, and I'm not against adding a template that grants large size This would be a special individual, after all.

Skills: I'll absolutely need tumble to be mobile in combat without provoking AoOs. Not sure other than that.

Abilities: haven't rolled yet, but int of at least 13, dex of 15. Good strength, of course.

Houserules: I don't really hold with feat prerequisites that require "fighter level x," and monks have full BAB.

Any helpful suggestions?

[Flickerdart]

>wants to make a disarming guy
>DMPC is the only character in the party that can't do his thing while unarmed

What

[MilesTiden]

A ghost. Bam. Telekinesis, violent thrust, the works.

[heavyfuel]

Snatch Weapon from Song and Silence. It's 3.0, but I don't think it was ever updated and is therefore legal.
Brutal Throw in case your Dex is low

Besides that, I'd suggest taking a look at tripping builds, specifically, how to get size/effective size to just go to town

[TheCrowing1432]

>wants to make a disarming guy
>DMPC is the only character in the party that can't do his thing while unarmed

What

I second this

[weckar]

Thirded. If this is a clever way to ship off the DMPC, I applaud it.

[heavyfuel]

>wants to make a disarming guy
>DMPC is the only character in the party that can't do his thing while unarmed

What

Hmmm. Can you disarm material components when they are being manipulated? If so, this will really screw both the Sorcerer and the Cleric as well, assuming the game isn't high OP.

[madtinker]

My players aren't much at optimizing or tactics. I'm trying to make them explore options other than "hit it with my sword." Really, the cleric has yet to cast a useful spell in combat. The battle sorcerer is a halfling that tries to contribute by GRAPPLING. I am not worried about how optimal this is. A few rounds of snatching weapons will end with someone figuring out that they can do something besides hit stuff with a stick. The PCs will feel clever and realize they can be creative with their abilities. Mission accomplished.

[Flickerdart]

Hmmm. Can you disarm material components when they are being manipulated? If so, this will really screw both the Sorcerer and the Cleric as well, assuming the game isn't high OP.
No. You can only disarm weapons and loosely worn items.


My players aren't much at optimizing or tactics. I'm trying to make them explore options other than "hit it with my sword." Really, the cleric has yet to cast a useful spell in combat. The battle sorcerer is a halfling that tries to contribute by GRAPPLING. I am not worried about how optimal this is. A few rounds of snatching weapons will end with someone figuring out that they can do something besides hit stuff with a stick. The PCs will feel clever and realize they can be creative with their abilities. Mission accomplished.
But...how will disarming the sorcerer stop him from grappling?

[madtinker]

That isn't my point. My point is that the group's tactics are sub optimal.

[Inevitability]

Or... The sorcerer see the disarmer doing his thing and now wants to disarm too.

[Garktz]

That isn't my point. My point is that the group's tactics are sub optimal.

And if thats the point, how about throwing some Tucker´s Kobolds?
I believe that your point would be much stronger if the "bad guys" are much weaker than the party....
I mean, if you throw a "Disarm-o-mancer" they can think "wow, that single guy was really strong" and not "wow, that tactic was really strong, we can consider something besides hack&slash"

Or, an "oposed party" but way better than them
monk (focused on grapple), a cleric (focused on buffing), a battle sorcerer (bfc and debuffing), and a DMPC fighter (go with tripper).
They wont try to kill your pc´s but lecture them because they offended some noble guy and wants to warn them not to mess with him....




*Disclaimer: English is not my natural language, post might be a bit confusing

[Flickerdart]

That isn't my point. My point is that the group's tactics are sub optimal.
Sure. But a disarming guy won't exactly help that, because the party doesn't rely on weapons so the character's schtick won't be useful. I would recommend something like tripping instead, which works against everybody and is also not a terrible tactic (so your group will actually learn a useful lesson from the encounter).

[Psyren]

All you're probably going to end up doing is making them all want to buy weapon chains or locking gauntlets. If you have an issue with players only doing X, the best solution is to talk to them about it.

[madtinker]

I respect your opinions, and this character may never see play. Nevertheless, I still want to build it. Does anyone have any suggestions that help with the build itself?

[Tvtyrant]

Disarm rules follow the "giant things are better" line, and so does unarmed damage. So becoming big is imperative, and at that level you seem to be stuck with Expansion as your only real option.

Also don't disarm while unarmed, you take a big penalty. You should be able to use a large Sai two handed (with a penalty to attack) to get a bonus to disarms (+8) and then add +4 per size category bigger than the party.

[madtinker]

But if you disarm while armed you don't end up with the weapon in your hand, unless you burn a feat AND have a free hand. Any way around this?

I'm sure that this has been asked before, but are there any templates/races that give large size with no level adjustment? The Goliath looks nice; it's treated as being large for opposed checks. If I'm Large, that's a +4, which offsets the -4 from unarmed. Then I can use weapon focus+disarm master for +3, in addition to bonuses from high str and full BAB. It wouldn't be foolproof, but would it be playable?

[Psyren]

Monk of the Enabled Hand treats his empty hands as large weapons for disarm purposes. Combine with Powerful Build + Expansion and you get to treat your hands as Gargantuan.

[madtinker]

Ooh, that's a good one. It requires deflect arrows, which is another feat, but with Powerful Build that's eleven feats to stuff into ~8 levels.

2 Flaws, Human bonus feat, feats at 1st, 3rd, 6th, fighter bonus at 1,2,4 = 9 feats.

If I drop weapon focus and master disarm, I come out ahead. It's doable, certainly. And with a human monk type, it even fits into the campaign and could be a helpful NPC instead of an enemy. To avoid DMPC overshadowing, this could be a great "I'll hold them off, get out of here" last stand character.

[Flickerdart]

Ooh, that's a good one. It requires deflect arrows, which is another feat, but with Powerful Build that's eleven feats to stuff into ~8 levels.

Powerful Build isn't a feat.

[madtinker]

Ah, I see on DnD wiki that it came from the homebrew section. Didn't see that earlier.

[weckar]

DND wiki? Avoid that place, seriously.

[madtinker]

DND wiki? Avoid that place, seriously.

Noted. It I prefer dndtools, but the wiki was at the top of the search results for "powerful build."

[Psyren]

It's a racial ability. However, you can (sort of) get it in feat form via Jotunbrud, because disarm is an opposed roll.

[madtinker]

Jotunbrud will do nicely. Doesn't have everything from Powerful Build (racial ability), but it has enough.