What's more useful - Wizard/Sorc famliar or Druid/Ranger animal companion

[Jermz]

Just curious on where you guys stand on this issue? We're talking about core, here, and not variations of familiars and animal companions found in other sources. In this instance, let's talk about benefit to the entire party and not just combat.

Animal companions can be buffed to high-hell and are basically an additional fighter for the party. They can't really perform complex tasks, aren't very intelligent (unless awakened, I guess), and one needs to have ranks in Handle Animal to push it or get it to do things, by the books.

Familiars are intelligent and can communicate with the wizard much easier than an animal companion can. They can perform complex tasks, have an opinion and are more squishy than animal companions. In addition, at 1st level one can automatically get an intelligent and flying companion for scouting purposes, and not just a dumb hawk.

Bottom line, I'd give the edge to animal companions, especially if one can communicate with them via Speak With Animals.

Thoughts?

[Eldan]

Companions make the much better beatsticks, certainly. But don't underestimate familiars.
First of all, with share spell and shapeshifting, such as with Polymorph, they can become very capable beatsticks, too.
Also, at least some can conceivably use magic items. Not just permanent ones, you can stick those on a companion, too. But things like wands.

They have one enormosu drawback, however. When they die, you lose XP. It makes them a liability.

[Abd al-Azrad]

For the most part, I find these two types of critters fill completely different roles.

The animal companion, it exists to be your arm, your combat presence. You buff it up, then launch it at foes to fight on your behalf. Having an animal companion is about having a gigantic wall of muscle behind which to hide.

The familiar buffs you up, increases your versatility and gives you some flexibility regarding the points of origin for your spell attacks. Having a familiar is more about making you better as a reality-massacring full caster.

So in terms of raw "strength," of course I'd give the Animal Companion the edge. But I'd still almost always pick the familiar, because people don't bring a full caster to a fight out of a need for walls of muscle. The familiar provides you a boost to action economy and tools to ensure you always have an edge needed to ruin reality for your party's favour.

Also you can always cast Mental Pinnacle (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/spells/mentalPinnacle.htm), share it with your familiar, and dish out crazy boatloads of Charisma damage (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/egoWhip.htm) and dazing attacks. Let's see a bear do that.

[Jermz]

You both have very valid and good points. I'm not really brushed up on all aspects of familiars, since I've never played a caster of high-enough level to actually get to all the nice sweet spots when a familiar levels up. That's basically why I'm asking this question. Also, I don't think that Mental Pinnacle is from the Core Books, although it does show up on the SRD.

I concur about the strength, it's misleading. I'll edit the title of this post to reflect that - I'm not really sure why I chose such a stupid term anyway.

[Red Fel]

Here's another key point. Animal companions, barring certain feats or class features, are animals - they have limited intelligence and generally few or no magical abilities. Their functionality tends to be limited to "Kill that thing," "Retrieve this thing," and "Shut up and let me ride you." Even when you add feats like Exalted Companion, which expand your animal companion list to include a handful of magical creatures, their utility is finite. Exalted Companion provides a fairly small list, and the creatures on it tend to be slightly upgraded animals, if that.

Familiars also start as animals. But thanks to Improved Familiar, they can become substantially more than that. They can be elementals, Imps, Mephits, or a variety of things with useful spell-like abilities. Having an intelligent creature with its own pool of abilities multiplies your versatility far more than simply having a backup beatstick.

And let's not forget about the other use of a familiar or an animal companion - trading them for ACFs. In my experience, Wizard ACFs that require trading away your familiar can be extremely potent; by contrast, ACFs that require trading away an animal companion are somewhat more situational (although some, such as the Shifter Druid Beast Spirit ACF, are still pretty punchy).

[Abd al-Azrad]

Mental Pinnacle is from the Psionics Handbook, it's basically Tenser's Psionic Transformation.

http://vitavalka.cz/img/hypnotoad.jpg

[defiantdan]

it depends on what level we are talking about. low levels I would give it to the animal companion. Mid levels goes to Familiar (imbue spell gives a major advantage) beatstickery at these levesl is less relevant. High levels they equal out since both classes get shapechange. Trading away a familiar or an animal companion knowing you are going to make it to level 17 isn't worth the loss of extra actions you could take.

[Urpriest]

You both have very valid and good points. I'm not really brushed up on all aspects of familiars, since I've never played a caster of high-enough level to actually get to all the nice sweet spots when a familiar levels up. That's basically why I'm asking this question. Also, I don't think that Mental Pinnacle is from the Core Books, although it does show up on the SRD.

I concur about the strength, it's misleading. I'll edit the title of this post to reflect that - I'm not really sure why I chose such a stupid term anyway.

Remember, Core Books isn't a game term. Its meaning varies from table to table. Plenty people here will assume that it includes the SRD, for example, and I've seen a few posters who even include the Complete series!

[Jeff the Green]

And let's not forget about the other use of a familiar or an animal companion - trading them for ACFs. In my experience, Wizard ACFs that require trading away your familiar can be extremely potent; by contrast, ACFs that require trading away an animal companion are somewhat more situational (although some, such as the Shifter Druid Beast Spirit ACF, are still pretty punchy).

Particularly for Rangers, an urban companion (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20070228a) is a good choice. It's basically a much better familiar, with 3/4 your HP and entirely disposable, though unfortunately it only works with Improved Familiar with a very permissive reading. The big thing is that most of its abilities are entirely independent of your effective Druid level, meaning it isn't actually useless.

[Psyren]

Psicrystals :smallbiggrin: