Best Melee Ranger Build? (preferably nonmagical)

[Dire Moose]

Some background on this idea: I've always liked the idea of a "badass normal" in roleplaying as well as an intelligent problem-solving warrior, and have tried to make a character like this in the past by doing a multiclass fighter/rogue. Unfortunately, I tend to wind up getting the short end of the stick relative to the rest of the party and have since been playing druids and clerics.

I'm now thinking of reviving my previous concept by trying a ranger build, but I prefer not to be a specialist archer and prefer melee combat. However, the common wisdom seems to be "Archery is the only good combat style; all the melee options suck." Is there a good melee ranger out there that you could recommend?

More ideas:

As per the "badass normal" mentioned above, I would prefer a nonmagical variant, but I can't see most of the skirmisher's ranger tricks being all that useful.

I tend to prefer lighter weapons that you can use with a shield or another weapon, but will use two-handed if necessary.

Not averse to level-dipping into other classes.

Options should be publicly available and Pathfinder Society legal.

[grarrrg]

PFS legal? There goes the natural-attack laden beast that is the Ragebred Skinwalker. Possible Favored Enemy on 5 attacks per round at level 2? YES PLEASE.

Since you want to forgo magic, have you considered the Slayer (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/hybrid-classes/slayer)?
Studied Target is basically a weaker Favored Enemy, and you get some Sneak Attack progression to up the damage sometimes.

[Mjollnir075]

I'm gonna go ahead and second Grarrrg on this one. Slayer is just the spell-less ranger with sneak attack. It's a good way to make sure all your attacks really hit home. Not having the Combat Styles from Ranger makes trying to Sword and Board a little less effective but I'm sure it can be done. TWF will probably work just as well as it does for a Rogue.

That being said, I am a fan of the Skirmisher Archetype. I recently got back in on a game with some old friends, and due to what happened when I played a caster last game (the group is so low op, our wizards main shtick was throwing his arcane bonded weapon at enemies..), I'm not allowed to cast spells (low magic world anyway, so whatever). My Ranger is a switch hitter, grabbing all archery feats + Power Attack. I really enjoy trying to use the Skirmisher tricks in creative ways. Cunning Pantomime is fun for RP reasons. Entangling Shot and Hobbling Attack are great ways to open up combat with big bads and the like.

Anyway's, hope maybe this gave you an idea or two.

[grarrrg]

I'm gonna go ahead and second Grarrrg on this one.

YOU FOOL! bonus points for still, technically, spelling the name wrong :P


Slayer is just the spell-less ranger with sneak attack. It's a good way to make sure all your attacks really hit home. Not having the Combat Styles from Ranger

There is the "Ranger Combat Style" talent. It limits you to 3 Ranger Feats, but it's there.

[watchwood]

Look up a Ranger build called the Switch Hitter. It's probably my favourite build for that class.

[Mjollnir075]

YOU FOOL! bonus points for still, technically, spelling the name wrong :P



There is the "Ranger Combat Style" talent. It limits you to 3 Ranger Feats, but it's there.

Was it the G?! WHY PROPER PUNCTUATION, WHY YOU DO DIS??!?!?!??!!?

I didn't catch the "Ranger Combat Style" talent. How about that!

@watchwood (I didn't cap his name, DID I DO GOOD grarrrg?! Lol.) I'm gonna look like an ass if that wasn't what I screwed up.
I agree with the switch-hitter, but I think OP was looking for a TWF concept, though he said he would grab a two hander if need be. I think you could probably still switch-hit with sword and board, but it's just so much more feat intensive. Dip fighter for a few more feats?

[KingSmitty]

any large race with darkvision, take levels of ranger specializing in twf, then go cavestalker PrC to use large spike chains as one handed weapons, dual weild or use your preferred bashing stick with your chain on the off hand, 20ft reach with a one handed tripping weapon, throw barbarian and other fun classes in there to boost melee effectiveness and go home smiling.

[Extra Anchovies]

Agreeing with the Slayer suggestion. Between the Style Feat talent and the Combat Trick talent (also Weapon Training and Finesse Rogue if you want them), you can have between three and five class-granted bonus feats by level 10.

The Slayer is also, in my opinion, the best chassis for two-weapon fighting in Pathfinder. Why?

1. They have a full base attack bonus
2. They have a way to boost their to-hit to (more than) offset TWF penalties (Studied Target, especially after 7th level)
3. They can add piles of bonus damage to each hit (Sneak Attack + Studied Target), some of which (Studied Target) can be multiplied on critical hits
4. They have a method of obtaining all three core TWF feats through class features (Style Feat talents), plus other bonus feats as needed (Combat Trick, Finesse Rogue)

I don't know of any other classes that can do all of those things. The only TWF-synergetic ability the Slayer doesn't have is Pounce, but that's a notoriously hard-to-get ability in Pathfinder.

[Sayt]

Man, I was all ready to front for the Strength patron Witchguard. Because what does the Ranger really, really need?

Divine Power. Combined with, y'know, Instant Enemy. What is best in life Conan?

Alas, Alack, Et Cetera.

Anyway.Slayer is pretty damn good, I played a Tw0-handed playtest Slayer through Jade Regent, and I have a few things worth noting:

*It is very worth badgering any other melee in your party to pick up Outflank, or even just pick of a Ring of Tactical Precision (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/rings/ring-of-tactical-precision) to foist on your comrades.

*I was running two-handed Katana with Improved Crit, mostly because I had the Plot Artifact, but a better option to spend EWP on would be the Elven Curve Blade or Falcata.

*Two Crit Fishers plus Combat Reflexes and Outflank is really good, as every time you get a crit, your outflank friends gets an AoO. There was particularly memorable fight where my friend made an attack, which let me make an attack from the opportunist advanced talent. My attack confirmed a crit, so the ally got another attack, confirmed a crit and then I got another attack and then my ally finished his TWF full attack.

Generally speaking, two handing is better than TWF, but TWF can be made to work, and I especially advise a pair of agile Kukris for a TWF Ranger or Slayer. Beyond that, you'll want to pick up Piranha Strike, if so.

[Extra Anchovies]

Generally speaking, two handing is better than TWF, but TWF can be made to work, and I especially advise a pair of agile Kukris for a TWF Ranger or Slayer. Beyond that, you'll want to pick up Piranha Strike, if so.

Or if DSP is allowed just nab Deadly Agility and Weapon Finesse. The two feats (the latter being a prereq for the former), plus Agile Maneuvers if you want to do combat maneuvers, eliminates the need for a Strength higher than 10.

[grarrrg]

Divine Power. Combined with, y'know, Instant Enemy.

Generally speaking, two handing is better than TWF, but TWF can be made to work, and I especially advise a pair of agile Kukris for a TWF Ranger or Slayer. Beyond that, you'll want to pick up Piranha Strike, if so.

Only problem with Instant Enemy is that it's for Society, and those top off at level 12, and Instant Enemy isn't available until 10.

Agile Kukris for the win though.


Or if DSP is allowed...
Again...Society...


any large race with darkvision, take levels of ranger specializing in twf, then go cavestalker PrC to use large spike chains as one handed weapons, dual weild or use your preferred bashing stick with your chain on the off hand, 20ft reach with a one handed tripping weapon, throw barbarian and other fun classes in there to boost melee effectiveness and go home smiling.

:smallsigh:
Pathfinder tag in the title.
Mentioned "archetypes" in opening post.
Mentioned "Pathfinder Society Legal" in opening post...
:smallsigh:

[Extra Anchovies]

Again...Society...

Indeed. Deadly Agility is good in general cases.

[Dire Moose]

At this point, I'm thinking of doing a switch-hitter since PFS is pretty variable with regard to class and it's not possible to know what the party will consist of in advance. I can already cover the skillmonkey angle well enough, and can now cover for melee and ranged attackers.

And as such, a two-handed weapon is definitely preferable since I wouldn't be able to get the off-hand stuff out in time. I was thinking of a one handed weapon and a buckler, but the latter really isn't enough extra AC to justify it.

I will keep a warhammer in the event that I do need to carry something else while fighting (and in case of skeletons).

The Slayer is an interesting idea too; I will definitely read into that some more when considering a badass normal. Particularly because one of the reasons I initially tried a fighter/rogue was the possibility of applying Sneak Attack damage with already-powerful attacks.

(as an aside, though, I really don't like the name "slayer." It's nothing to do with the class; just that I've usually heard the term associated with bad things in the past.)

[Extra Anchovies]

At this point, I'm thinking of doing a switch-hitter since PFS is pretty variable with regard to class and it's not possible to know what the party will consist of in advance. I can already cover the skillmonkey angle well enough, and can now cover for melee and ranged attackers.

Really, all you need to switch-hit (assuming an archery focus) is Power Attack; even Furious Focus is mostly optional.

[grarrrg]

(as an aside, though, I really don't like the name "slayer." It's nothing to do with the class; just that I've usually heard the term associated with bad things in the past.)

You sir, need to watch some more Buffy The Vampire Slayer.