The Orc (PEACH; suggestions welcome!)

[Jesterface]

Hey all! I've been trying, for a few years now, to compile a homebrew world. Overall, the setting is 'industrialised' (think Iron Kingdoms, Fable 2 and 3, etc.). The one thing I ruled out early on were the PHB's 'half-breeds'; half-elves and half-orcs simply do not exist (though I may re-evaluate half-elf as I've seen some interesting 'fixes' for them). As such, the orc fills in the gap left by the half-orc. I want a race that's strong, maybe a little brutish, but just as able to mesh into urbane, industrialised sociery as the other races.

My ideas so far... (A number of which have been inspired by looking at people's ideas for fixing the half-orc)

Orc Humanoid (Orc)
Size: Medium.
Racial attributes: +2 Strength, -2 Intelligence. Orcs are more powerful and muscular than most races, but tend to neglect intellectual pursuits.
Special abilities:
Darkvision 60ft.
Weapon Familiarity - Orcs treat the Orc Double Axe as a martial weapon.
~~~~~
Languages: Automatic: Common, Orc. Bonus: Goblin, Giant.
Favoured Class: Barbarian

Now, I'm thinking about how to give the orcs other abilities, and some skill bonuses maybe. Orcs managed to get by in the indutrial revolution by aping, stealing and 'retro-fitting' other races' inventions, leading to them producing a lot of shoddy, single-use machines, or rickety contraptions (think something not unlike 40k Orks), and generally being hired as muscle. Whilst advancing with the times, they still cling to their tribal past.

Thoughts:
Bonus hit points (maybe 3 or 4, like a free Toughness)
Endurance as a bonus feat
Some sort of bonus/ability relating to scavenging/salvaging?
Bonus to Intimidate (can use Str instead of Cha

Does anyone have any suggestions at all? Thanks in advance!

~J

[Just to Browse]

It's pretty bland, and I don't see much reason to pick it over a human for your run-of-the-mill fighter types. If you want the Orc to be special, you should pick a niche for it and then build the Orc into that niche instead of watering down the original version.

[Jesterface]

Okay, good input.

If we're going to talk niches; the halflings are the thieves, the dwarves are the crafters, the gnomes are the tinkerers, the goblins are the traders, the elves are the aristocrats, the warforged are the workers and the humans are the jack-of-all-trades. I personally think this leaves the orcs as 'bruisers'. I "washed down" the stats so they more readily filled the PHB half-orc niche, I want them as a "cultured race", not a monstrous race. So, I kinda want them being able to dole out, and soak up, some of the punishment. Visually, they have warty hide-like skin, solid muscle-mass and sloping, solid skulls (and decidedly less pig-ape looking faces).

These guys have essentially been uplifted from their tribal origins by being given baubles and trinkets in payment for working as bodyguards, raiders and general strongarm flunkies. In recent years, Warforged have taken some of the work away from them, as have dwarves and hobgoblins, but none of them manage to portray the same image of power and ferocity that an orc conjures.

https://scontent-b-lhr.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/292732_10151557432251747_689997471_n.jpg?oh=8070d9 9a21646f32109395767d888be1&oe=54D7ECB6

[Just to Browse]

That sounds like a great start. I would recommend thinking up some unique mechanics to support the idea you've got going -- like dwarves get stonecunning, elves get the ability to search for secret doors without looking, warforged don't need to sleep, etc.

Things I would recommend:

Resistance / Immunity to poisons
Ability to eat bad food or otherwise inedible stuff
Environmental resistance / Endurance
Bonus hit points
Bigger carrying capacity
Str to Intimidate (kind of weird to make it racial, but very cool)
Scary roar
Better at breaking objects and other Str checks


The drawing is fantastic.

[Jesterface]

Thanks! It's a couple of years old and needs finishing/retouching, along with a lot of my other doodles for this project.

I was thinking Endurance would be big and clever for them, along with using Strength for Intimidate. Bonus hits was one thing I was aiming for as well, and I like the idea of the Iron Stomach (one of the Pathfinder feats for them was very similar) but I think resistance to poison maybe steps on the toes of the dwarf a little bit. So, in addition to the stats above...


Iron Stomach: Orcs receive a +2 racial bonus on saves versus ingested poisons and diseases transmitted through eating.
Monstrous Mien: Intimidate is always a class skill for orcs. Orcs may choose to use their Strength modifier on Intimidate checks. This choice must be made at character creation and cannot be changed afterwards.
Endurance: Orcs gain Endurance as a bonus feat.
Born Tough: Orcs gain an additional 4 hit points at 1st level.

[Just to Browse]

That's pretty good, but it's a bit overloaded. I would remove one of those features to bring the race in line (personally either Endurance or the +HP, since feats and HP aren't unique racial things like the elves' doorsight).

Also you should consider what happens if a class grants Endurance as a bonus feat (like the Ranger). Is the Orc player punished for picking ranger? Should they select an additional feat, making the Orc like a quasi-human for people who play rangers? Or do they get something else on top of Endurance if they double up, making ranger sort of like an automatic ACF for Orcs? All three are valid choices, but they do different things.

[Jesterface]

Okay, so I'm thinking lose the bonus HP, and stick with Endurance. Clarify that should they gain Endurance as a bonus feat from another source, they gain Diehard.

But, like you say, they do need something unique. Gnomes get their cantrips and illusion power boost, halflings have their resistance to fear and thrown weapon skill, and the elves and dwarves are as you pointed out, able to detect certain things. I'm just at a loss as to what to give these guys.

[Jesterface]

Tried to come up with some ideas and had a few suggestions from friends.

Suggestions have been:

Bonus to Str and Con skill and ability checks
Increased hit dice (D6 become D8, etc)
Bonus to confirm critical hits
Ability to use improvised weapons
Stay conscious and mobile while 'dying' (a la Pathfinder)


Some of these seem doable with feats, but I'm not sure. Thoughts and suggestions anyone?

[Andion Isurand]

If you keep the Light Sensitivity that standard mountain orcs get as they are written, I would increase the range of their Darkvision from 60 to 90 feet.

If you like the weapon groups variant from Unearthed Arcana, I would go ahead and give orcs the following:


Weapon Group Proficiency: Mountain Orcs are proficient with any one group of weapons in addition to any others.

If you go back to giving them +4 Str, -2 Int, -2 Wis, -2 Cha... don't forget to give them a +2 racial bonus to Intimidate, and probably add in a +2 racial bonus to Survival as well.

---------------------------------------------

On the point of environmental resistance, you could give them a Climate Tolerance ability similar to Neanderthals (from Frostburn) along with a +2 racial bonus on saving throws against cold and fire effects, as well as the effects of high altitude.

[jqavins]

Visually, they have warty hide-like skin, solid muscle-mass and sloping, solid skulls (and decidedly less pig-ape looking faces).
Please tell me they're not green. I'm so sick of green orcs.

Comments inserted into quote in red.
Suggestions have been:

Bonus to Str and Con skill and ability checks They already have a bonus to strength, so this is saying it's effectively even higher for skill purposes? I don't like it. Just my two cents.
Increased hit dice (D6 become D8, etc) Seems like you've gone back and forth on giving them extra hit points. I like giving them extra hit points, but: one increased die size is, on average, the same as +1 hp for each die. The same can be had from a Con modifier, so why not just +2 Con?
Bonus to confirm critical hits Meh.
Ability to use improvised weapons Meh.
Stay conscious and mobile while 'dying' (a la Pathfinder) Meh-aybe.
Iron Stomach: Orcs receive a +2 racial bonus on saves versus ingested poisons and diseases transmitted through eating. Good. How about also the ability to be fully nourished as well as not sickened by poor quality food?
Monstrous Mien: Intimidate is always a class skill for orcs. Orcs may choose to use their Strength modifier on Intimidate checks. This choice must be made at character creation and cannot be changed afterwards. Good.
Endurance: Orcs gain Endurance as a bonus feat. Meh.
Born Tough: Orcs gain an additional 4 hit points at 1st level from childhood. A baby has one extra hit point as soon as it is weaned, and gains another every 5 yers until reaching the full benefit at age 16. I like it, even in addition to the Con bonus. It gives a bonus that means a lot early on but fades away in importance. It's awesome for a school age orc!



For ability scores, I'd suggest +4 Str, +2 Con, -2 Int, -2 Wis, -2 Cha.

As for their social situation, what you're describing sounds a lot like Ankh-Morpork's trolls; I like it.

[Jesterface]

As for their social situation, what you're describing sounds a lot like Ankh-Morpork's trolls; I like it.

I... You... This... I can't even begin to state how perfectly you've summed this up for me! As for the green; they come in green, but not all of them are (as much as it pains me, as I LARP as a greenskin).

Thanks for the input, it's been stellar!
The clarification on 'Iron Stomach' is definitely a good call, and I think I'll go with the additional HP over time aspect of the 'Born Tough' thing.

As for the ability scores, I'm still wanting to err on the side of them being more like the other core races in terms of attributes. I'm loath to give them hits to all their mental stats because I like the idea of them having sorcerous and druidic flair, but sucking at stuff like wizardry and reasoning.

One thought I had on my way to work yesterday was not so much a bonus on Str checks (as was suggested by a friend), but a bonus on checks to break stuff (as Just to Browse suggested) as I really thought what that could mean; breaking out of bonds, smashing down doors, etc. Possibly highly situational, but could be useful and indeed fun.

[Jesterface]

Bumping with an updated version.

I want to make it clear that these aren't the same as the savage 'caveman orcs' from the MM, though they are still the "damage-dealing thicky" of the core races. They're almost ape-like in many of their approaches to life; technology is either going to be smashed, taken apart or taken apart then haphazardly reassembled by an orc. While they're not often found in the upper echelons of a community, there's no reason why an orc can't be civilised and polite (though they are more likely to be uncouth thugs truth be told).


Attribute adjustments: +2 Strength, -2 Intelligence
Race: Humanoid (Orc)
Speed: 30ft
Size: Medium
Darkvision 60ft
Weapon Familiarity: Orcs can treat Orc Double Axes as a martial weapon.
Orcs treat Intimidate as a class skill. At 1st level an orc may choose to apply their Str modifier to Intimidate checks instead of their Cha modifier. This choice cannot be changed after 1st level.
Orcs receive a +2 racial bonus on saving throws against ingested poisons and diseases contracted though consumption of spoiled, contaminated or 'disease-causing' foods. Orcs can also be fully nourished by spoiled/inedible foods and by most organic matter.
Orcs receive a +2 racial bonus on Str checks made to break objects and on attack rolls made to Sunder objects. This bonus also applies on Str checks to break out of bonds.
Automatic Languages: Orc, Common
Bonus Languages: Goblin, Giant, Dwarf, Gnoll
Favoured class: Barbarian