Favorite Level

[MadGrady]

So I often see builds that assume progress of a character all the way up to level 20. Yet I have only once or twice played a campaign where the levels went above 10. Often this is because the campaign has already been going on for months, and so we get bored and want something new. Yet, more and more, my group has realized that we really do prefer playing in that level 5-8 range most.

Reasons why?

1. Characters are high enough level that they have most of their main core abilities (with maybe one or two at tier 2 of said ability)
2. Characters have enough HP to survive several combats against a wider variety of foes
3. Spells and such aren't high enough to be game breaking, but you have a decent amount of spell slots and the spells you have provide a nice variety (obviously this is class/choice based)
4. Characters aren't so powerful that they can overcome death easily, so character death is much more impactful.


Obviously this is ENTIRELY a subjective argument, and in NO WAY is it supposed to rain on any parade that prefers the upper levels.

So my question is this - what levels do you prefer playing at, and why :)

P.S. This is meant to be just a discussion on why we play what we play - not on it's validity :) :)

[Selkirk]

for me it's gotta be 5th or 6th level...but i've always liked low level play in games anyways. you have ability score increases(at 4th level) and some power(increased hp's and better spells...3rd level spells ftw)-so the party knows it can tackle some heavy hitters. you are past the goblins and ready to move onto ogres and interesting undead. feels like you have earned something and the party can still be fairly grounded...doesn't have to be flying castles and lich lords just yet :D.

[Freelance GM]

Level 7, for the same reasons as you all liking 5 or 6. Your characters can take on an army of goblins, but are still threatened by greater threats like Demons. You're at a level where it is fair and acceptable to throw an adult dragon at you, and that's always fun.

Oh, and 4th-level spells just add too much fun stuff, IMO, like Dimension Door.

[Socko525]

having only played minimal 5e at this point, and only having played paladin, level 2 was huge for me. So much of the class comes online at that point: Smite, spellcasting, and fighting style. However at level 4 currently I'm looking forward to my next 3 levels a lot. 5th level=2nd level spells and finally getting Find Steed/my mount, 6=Charisma to saves for me and party members in a 10' radius and then 7 is my OotA's aura for half damage to from all spells for me/allies in 10' radius.

At this point my character has been pseudo elevated to party leader and being able to lead the party into battle while helping to tank/buff their saves and reduce their damage is awesome to me. We've had several near death experiences already with some of the squishies, so being able to protect them is something I really look forward to.

[Daishain]

6-10ish
Enough abilities have come online for the martials and halfcasters that they're feeling invincible, and the full casters have caught up from their initial weaknesses but aren't yet stealing the show wholesale. Meanwhile, the group as a whole is in a position to defeat hordes of the threats that challenged them at the start, but are still far from being unchallenged, having just swam into the deep end.

[Dalebert]

I'm going to vote for the higher levels just because I've never played a game that didn't flake out early. So those levels are still mysterious for me which holds a certain appeal. I'd just like to actually get there sometime.

[SliceandDiceKid]

Haven't played past level 5 before, DMed to 8. I like levels 1 and 2. The sense that you can die very easily makes people play differently. Fear of death is interesting to observe.

[Dalebert]

I've actually suggested that games not start at level one; maybe three. That seems about the time characters achieve just a basic competence. It's fine to start at 1 for your first game or two and get that experience, but I mostly just find it to be tedious. It depends on how long the game is going to go too. I've suggested a later starting level when the DM isn't expecting the game to go on very long or is just not sure if it will go on for a longer campaign.

As far as that fear of death thing, there's just not that much at stake. At that point, you just roll up a new character and it's no big deal. Having the fear of death has more to do with your style of DMing and whether you challenge the characters. It's admittedly tricky to do that without being a killer DM.

[SliceandDiceKid]

I've actually suggested that games not start at level one; maybe three. That seems about the time characters achieve just a basic competence. It's fine to start at 1 for your first game or two and get that experience, but I mostly just find it to be tedious. It depends on how long the game is going to go too. I've suggested a later starting level when the DM isn't expecting the game to go on very long or is just not sure if it will go on for a longer campaign.

As far as that fear of death thing, there's just not that much at stake. At that point, you just roll up a new character and it's no big deal. Having the fear of death has more to do with your style of DMing and whether you challenge the characters. It's admittedly tricky to do that without being a killer DM.

We've always had penalties for rerolling.

Different DMs have forced different penalties. Above level one, we've made people start from one.

One guy had to play a specific race and class.

Others have had to take lower ability scores or significant flaws.

Other times, we've said there was no rerolling. Those were fun campaigns.

[MaxWilson]

As far as that fear of death thing, there's just not that much at stake. At that point, you just roll up a new character and it's no big deal. Having the fear of death has more to do with your style of DMing and whether you challenge the characters. It's admittedly tricky to do that without being a killer DM.

Depending on the plot, "fear of failure" could mean more than "fear of death." If your first level characters are just random adventurers exploring a dungeon, failure doesn't matter. If they are the lone survivors of the avalanche that wiped out High Wizard Morrolan and half of the Sauromatian Expeditionary Force, leaving the other half trapped, and their mission is to dodge goblin patrols until they can get word to someone who can rescue the trapped legion... failure matters a lot more. (I'm about to run this scenario, although it will be more complicated than this.)

Heroes are born when something disastrous has just occurred.

[SliceandDiceKid]

Depending on the plot, "fear of failure" could mean more than "fear of death." If your first level characters are just random adventurers exploring a dungeon, failure doesn't matter. If they are the lone survivors of the avalanche that wiped out High Wizard Morrolan and half of the Sauromatian Expeditionary Force, leaving the other half trapped, and their mission is to dodge goblin patrols until they can get word to someone who can rescue the trapped legion... failure matters a lot more. (I'm about to run this scenario, although it will be more complicated than this.)

Heroes are born when something disastrous has just occurred.

Heroes get remembered, but legends never die. Follow your heart, kid, and you can never go wrong.

[Thurmin]

I'm going to vote for the higher levels just because I've never played a game that didn't flake out early. So those levels are still mysterious for me which holds a certain appeal. I'd just like to actually get there sometime.

I'm here with you. Can't seem to get into a game that lasts beyond level 6-9.

edit: typo

[pwykersotz]

I'm going to buck the trend and say level 14-15. A lot of cool features come online at those levels, and spells are at 7th-8th level. I love the challenge of taking on the obscene and impossible but without the end-game tools that level 17-18 bring. It's intense and fun. I'm looking forward to starting Hoard of the Dragon Queen and moving into Rise of Tiamat in January. :smallsmile:

[MaxWilson]

Speaking of obscene high-level challenges, a hoard of 200 goblins rates at the high end of Deadly encounters for a party of 4 20th level characters. So now you can run a high-level campaign without invoking Tiamat or the Tarrasque; thanks to bounded accuracy you can instead be a "punitive army" of 4 people sent by the Seguleh to punish the Pannion Empire for their arrogance.

Setup is simple. Just set up any old wargame scenario, and neglect to give the "good guys" an army. All they get is the PCs.

[charcoalninja]

Speaking of obscene high-level challenges, a hoard of 200 goblins rates at the high end of Deadly encounters for a party of 4 20th level characters. So now you can run a high-level campaign without invoking Tiamat or the Tarrasque; thanks to bounded accuracy you can instead be a "punitive army" of 4 people sent by the Seguleh to punish the Pannion Empire for their arrogance.

Setup is simple. Just set up any old wargame scenario, and neglect to give the "good guys" an army. All they get is the PCs.

To me I don't like that. At 20th level I expect my PCs to be invading Hell, fighting and sneaking their way past the armies of Hell to confront asmodeus on the seat of his power, not worrying about a company of short dirty green bandits.

For me my favourite is level 10-20. I love high level games for the intensity of the challenges, the finesse required to run them, and because in most editions it takes that many levels to actually pull off your concept (especially in 5e since you have so few feats).

My most memorable campaign lasted from 12 I think... Might have been 15 and went until level 33. I'm a big high level games kind of guy.

[MaxWilson]

It turns out I misunderstood the encounter-building rules. (Also, there's a bug in kobold.club.) The goblins would rate at the high end of Hard, just under the Deadly threshold. There is no upper limit on Deadly.

There's nothing wrong with throwing huge challenges at 20th level characters... but if you invade Baator, those challenges will probably be closer to CR 30 than CR 20. (If 200 goblins is a CR 20 challenge, what is a whole legion of Bone Devils? CR 30 is as high as the system goes but it doesn't seem high enough.)

[MadGrady]

It turns out I misunderstood the encounter-building rules. (Also, there's a bug in kobold.club.) The goblins would rate at the high end of Hard, just under the Deadly threshold. There is no upper limit on Deadly.

There's nothing wrong with throwing huge challenges at 20th level characters... but if you invade Baator, those challenges will probably be closer to CR 30 than CR 20. (If 200 goblins is a CR 20 challenge, what is a whole legion of Bone Devils? CR 30 is as high as the system goes but it doesn't seem high enough.)

Nothing higher than deadly - dead is dead lol

Well....until the party has/finds a cleric of high enough power to resurrect. In that case, dead is merely inconvenienced for a few hours/days and some gold. Of course if NO ONE survives, then that's a different story. Dead goes back to just being dead.

It really depends on the style and substance of your magic elf game. lol

[Longcat]

11 - 20, because this is where you get your signature abilities and the opportunity to actually use them.

I do like starting at level 1 however. This way, it feels like I "earned" it.