Armor Check Penalties and Casting

[Adept_Scholar]

I heard that there are no armor check penalties associated with spell casting in 5th, and as I have not read the 5th edition P.H., I thought I would ask from those who have if this was true, and if so, what would keep a character interested in playing a caster from simply picking up a level of fighter to gain proficiency in heavy armor (subsequently gaining a fighter's AC without having to sacrifice spell casting capabilities)? :smallconfused:

[Maxilian]

I heard that there are no armor check penalties associated with spell casting in 5th, and as I have not read the 5th edition P.H., I thought I would ask from those who have if this was true, and if so, what would keep a character interested in playing a caster from simply picking up a level of fighter to gain proficiency in heavy armor (subsequently gaining a fighter's AC without having to sacrifice spell casting capabilities)? :smallconfused:

Well the caster will need at least 13 str for the lowest type of heavy armor (16 AC) if you want the other types of armor (17 AC or 18 AC armor) you will need 15 str, is not much but is still a sacrifice that most mage don't really want to make (Note: also you get disadvantage on Stealth checks)

[Ralcos]

While its true that there is no Spell Failure Chance, taking a level in Fighter after a 1st level in Sorcerer/Warlock/Wizard only gives you proficiency in Light and Medium armors, as well as with simple and martial weapons.
There is also a Feat (optional in 5e) that give proficiency in Heavy armors.

The penalty is more along the lines of limiting your spellcasting potential with taking that level in Fighter (I have an awesome AC, but I sacrificed 1 Hit Die and a spell level to get that).

I say that'd it'd be easier to go Eldritch Knight subclass (for Fighter) if you wish to cast spells with a high AC. You're limited in casting, yes, but at least you aren't sacrificing spellcaster HD.

[Human Paragon 3]

If you think it's worth it to delay your high level spells a level, and divert your good stats into STR for heavy armor, I don't see a problem with this.

You can also select mountain dwarf as your race for free heavy armor proficiency without losing much of anything (as long as you have the STR to wear it).

[HugeC]

You can also select mountain dwarf as your race for free heavy armor proficiency without losing much of anything (as long as you have the STR to wear it).
Actually you only get medium armor proficiency as a mountain dwarf, but you can get the feat for heavy at 4th.

[SliceandDiceKid]

If you think it's worth it to delay your high level spells a level, and divert your good stats into STR for heavy armor, I don't see a problem with this.

You can also select mountain dwarf as your race for free heavy armor proficiency without losing much of anything (as long as you have the STR to wear it).

You can start as a fighter with low str and just use medium armor. But this depends on what stats you roll. If you manage 14 dex, med armor is for you. Grab a shield and the defense fighting style for 19 AC, then start casting at level 2. (You only need one free hand for casting)

But unless you want to get in the mix, you generally shouldn't have to worry about your AC. Either way, have fun!

Fighter gives you proficiency in all weapons, so that's nice to fall back on. You also get second wind which is a great bonus action. Take shield spell for awesome reaction.

[MaxWilson]

Well the caster will need at least 13 str for the lowest type of heavy armor (16 AC) if you want the other types of armor (17 AC or 18 AC armor) you will need 15 str, is not much but is still a sacrifice that most mage don't really want to make (Note: also you get disadvantage on Stealth checks)

I don't think you strictly need STR 13. IIRC, it's just that if you have STR 8 you'll lose 10 feet of movement while wearing heavy armor. I hope you never have to run away from anything.

[SpawnOfMorbo]

Bounded accuracy stops mages in armor from being as annoying ad it sounds.

Big AC doesn't make up for tiny HP in this edition.

[SliceandDiceKid]

I don't think you strictly need STR 13. IIRC, it's just that if you have STR 8 you'll lose 10 feet of movement while wearing heavy armor. I hope you never have to run away from anything.

Good catch. This is on pg 144.

[SliceandDiceKid]

Bounded accuracy stops mages in armor from being as annoying ad it sounds.

Big AC doesn't make up for tiny HP in this edition.

It definitely helps

[odigity]

The penalty is more along the lines of limiting your spellcasting potential with taking that level in Fighter (I have an awesome AC, but I sacrificed 1 Hit Die and a spell level to get that).

I say that'd it'd be easier to go Eldritch Knight subclass (for Fighter) if you wish to cast spells with a high AC. You're limited in casting, yes, but at least you aren't sacrificing spellcaster HD.

I don't know where you're getting this concept of "Spellcaster HD", and why you think it's important. A Fighter's HD is larger than all full spellcasters; it's an upgrade, HP-wise. Having HD from levels in your spellcasting class gives you no advantage in any mechanic I've seen.


You can start as a fighter with low str and just use medium armor.

Don't forget that you need to satsify the ability minimum requirements in *both* classes when multiclassing.

Since Fighter's can use Dex to qualify, I'd go with a Dex base and dump Str. Start with Dex 14, grab Breasplate or Half Plate (depending on whether or not you care about Stealth), a Shield, and Defense fighting style. End up with 18-19 AC.


But unless you want to get in the mix, you generally shouldn't have to worry about your AC.

Disagree. There's ranged attacks, and highly mobile enemies that can/will target you. AC is always appreciated, if not identically amongst the classes.


You also get second wind which is a great bonus action.

True. Second wind would be minorly useful, though it only scales with Fighter levels. Still, a free 6.5 HP 1/encounter as a bonus action isn't terrible.

[SpawnOfMorbo]

Good catch. This is on pg 144.

Not as much as in past editions.

[SliceandDiceKid]

I don't know where you're getting this concept of "Spellcaster HD", and why you think it's important. A Fighter's HD is larger than all full spellcasters; it's an upgrade, HP-wise. Having HD from levels in your spellcasting class gives you no advantage in any mechanic I've seen.



Don't forget that you need to satsify the ability minimum requirements in *both* classes when multiclassing.

Since Fighter's can use Dex to qualify, I'd go with a Dex base and dump Str. Start with Dex 14, grab Breasplate or Half Plate (depending on whether or not you care about Stealth), a Shield, and Defense fighting style. End up with 18-19 AC.



Disagree. There's ranged attacks, and highly mobile enemies that can/will target you. AC is always appreciated, if not identically amongst the classes.



True. Second wind would be minorly useful, though it only scales with Fighter levels. Still, a free 6.5 HP 1/encounter as a bonus action isn't terrible.

Good catch on multiclass sing requirements. But like I said, 14 dex and you're fine. Our wizard has been fine with his 11 AC. And second wind only becomes marginally more useful as you level up. Sure, 20th level is better than 1st, but a free heal is nothing to scoff at.

[Theodoxus]

And there is an armor check penalty - though it's actually a 'lack of armor proficiency' penalty. If you wear armor you're not proficient in, you can't cast at all - that's for both arcane and divine!

[Mechaviking]

With point buy you can go 15 str, Con & Int/cha(+ Race) and still probably hit 20 in the casting stat by lvl 9(if that´s what you want).

Start as fighter and then go the rest casting class of your choice.

Or you can play Buddy Jones, Hill Dwarf necromancer in medium armor.

But this aside:

No penalty for casting spells in armor so long as your character is proficient, if you aren´t you can´t cast spells in armor.

[MeeposFire]

I don't think you strictly need STR 13. IIRC, it's just that if you have STR 8 you'll lose 10 feet of movement while wearing heavy armor. I hope you never have to run away from anything.

Or be a dwarf and just not care at all. Heck be a mountain dwarf, take heavy armor prof, and keep your low str score and enjoy heavy armor with no fighter levels and no additional speed loss.