Criticize me, captain!

[SliceandDiceKid]

Im about to make a ridiculous change.

I'm a rogue 2 in HotDQ.
Our DM has said he'd let us get a feat for free. I'm variant human with sharpshooter. I throw daggers and darts. Stats are
11/16/16/9/14/13.

I think I'm going to jump to fighter for med armor, a shield, and a whip. I miss out on some sneak dice and archetype, but if I take shield master right now, it offsets evasion. Use every bonus action to dodge, attack from 10'. I might go back to rogue at level 8, after extra attack.

What else am I about to **** up?

I'm pretty dead set on whip shield combo, not worried about disadvantage on sneak.

[S_Dalsgaard]

To multiclass into fighter you need STR and DEX 13.

[GiantOctopodes]

No you don't. You need Str 13 -OR- Dex 13.

In terms of what you're saying, if you're walking away until level 8, you may as well take one more level of Rogue first, get your archetype features and then head over to Fighter. If you're dead set on the whip shield combo, and extra attack, not much else to be said. However, be aware that the extra attack will not keep up with the 3d6 lost sneak attack damage, so you will be losing overall damage. Just FYI.

[SliceandDiceKid]

No you don't. You need Str 13 -OR- Dex 13.

In terms of what you're saying, if you're walking away until level 8, you may as well take one more level of Rogue first, get your archetype features and then head over to Fighter. If you're dead set on the whip shield combo, and extra attack, not much else to be said. However, be aware that the extra attack will not keep up with the 3d6 lost sneak attack damage, so you will be losing overall damage. Just FYI.

I am aware.

Thanks octo!

[S_Dalsgaard]

No you don't. You need Str 13 -OR- Dex 13.

My bad. You are absolutely right.

[Rallicus]

I'd much rather criticize your DM for allowing the human variant and giving out a free feat.

[SliceandDiceKid]

I'd much rather criticize your DM for allowing the human variant and giving out a free feat.

Only one player heard we got a free feat(or I wouldn't have gone H variant), and my warlock died so I rerolled. I hit level 2 and we were talking about a new campaign he was doing for players with no prior experience. We advised giving them feats to make HotDQ a little easier, and he said we had free feats. So we're getting one now.

[Regulas]

Isn't the whip a finess weapon? So you would still get at least the firs d6 of sneak attack dice.

(as obscene and stupid as it is to be using a whip as a weapon to begin with, for that matter not sure why it is a d4 weapon and not a 1 dmg weapon)

[Slipperychicken]

(as obscene and stupid as it is to be using a whip as a weapon to begin with, for that matter not sure why it is a d4 weapon and not a 1 dmg weapon)

Because the devs hatred of monks and unarmed combat far exceeds their hatred of whips.

Also, they like to pretend at times that whips can be usable weapons (throwing out a feat or class feature which allegedly works with them), while they often go out of their way to ensure unarmed attacks are strictly inferior to armed ones.

[SpawnOfMorbo]

Isn't the whip a finess weapon? So you would still get at least the firs d6 of sneak attack dice.

(as obscene and stupid as it is to be using a whip as a weapon to begin with, for that matter not sure why it is a d4 weapon and not a 1 dmg weapon)

Have you not seen how utterly destructive a whip can be? It is pretty messed up how much slashing damage it can do to a person.

[Regulas]

Have you not seen how utterly destructive a whip can be? It is pretty messed up how much slashing damage it can do to a person.

Whips can do a lot of pain. And they can leave some nice lacerations, but it doesn't even come close to comparing to the damage a blade of mace can do. More then anything a whips damage is too shallow, and would be completely negated by any amount of armor.

[McBars]

Whips can do a lot of pain. And they can leave some nice lacerations, but it doesn't even come close to comparing to the damage a blade of mace can do. More then anything a whips damage is too shallow, and would be completely negated by any amount of armor.

Maybe that's true in the real world, but in fantasy settings....

"The blade stuck fast, protruding out from the Bloodthirster's shoulder blades before it turned and lashed out with its whip. Felix had no idea what that infernal lash was made from but it cut through dwarf-forged armour with ease and flayed its targets to the bone. Felix saw skin and muscle part as if slashed with a cleaver, white bone and yellow cartilage suddenly exposed in the dim, guttering light. The whip lashed forward again, spinning its shrieking victim like a top and tugging more flesh from his carcass."

lol

[SpawnOfMorbo]

Whips can do a lot of pain. And they can leave some nice lacerations, but it doesn't even come close to comparing to the damage a blade of mace can do. More then anything a whips damage is too shallow, and would be completely negated by any amount of armor.

Yeah and a dagger does the same damage to a guy in plate armor as a naked guy... The system isn't made to make sense of that stuff.

This is a fantasy game, there is no reason a whip (or an unarmed attack for that matter) to deal such pitiful damage.

Weapon damage isn't based on how much damage it does against full plate. It is abbritarily determined based on old rules.

I'm actually not a fan of a dagger doing d4 damage while a sword does d8. A dagger will kill someone just as easy as a sword will, actually in a lot of instances it will kill easier.

Damage with weapons should be based on the user's ability to deal damage with them. So with light or finesse weapons a rogue would deal XXX damage and with any weapon the fighter would deal XXX damage. As each class levels up their damage increases because they are better at stabbing/hitting with the weapon when they connect with the attack.

[Regulas]

Yeah and a dagger does the same damage to a guy in plate armor as a naked guy... The system isn't made to make sense of that stuff.

This is a fantasy game, there is no reason a whip (or an unarmed attack for that matter) to deal such pitiful damage.

Weapon damage isn't based on how much damage it does against full plate. It is abbritarily determined based on old rules.

I'm actually not a fan of a dagger doing d4 damage while a sword does d8. A dagger will kill someone just as easy as a sword will, actually in a lot of instances it will kill easier.

Damage with weapons should be based on the user's ability to deal damage with them. So with light or finesse weapons a rogue would deal XXX damage and with any weapon the fighter would deal XXX damage. As each class levels up their damage increases because they are better at stabbing/hitting with the weapon when they connect with the attack.

Daggers were commonly used against armour because they can be slipped into joints.

[SpawnOfMorbo]

Daggers were commonly used against armour because they can be slipped into joints.

So what's the problem with whips hitting these same small openings?

Perhaps the eyes, or it just hits the armor so damn hard the concussive force hurts the defender.

Like when you out kendo armor on and get hit by a shinai, the shinai is built to dispearse the force and the armor is built to protect but it still hurts like hell when a strong guy or gal hits you on the armor.

Stop limiting things to your personal faux idea of reality when we are dealing with a fantasy game.

The term "She/he is just that good" comes to mind.

[Regulas]

So what's the problem with whips hitting these same small openings?

Perhaps the eyes, or it just hits the armor so damn hard the concussive force hurts the defender.

Like when you out kendo armor on and get hit by a shinai, the shinai is built to dispearse the force and the armor is built to protect but it still hurts like hell when a strong guy or gal hits you on the armor.

Stop limiting things to your personal faux idea of reality when we are dealing with a fantasy game.

The term "She/he is just that good" comes to mind.

Because again whips don't deal significant damage. Before it was fine because they dealt non-lethal damage, but now that there is no nonlethal they shouldnt do the same damage as before.

With one strike with any other weapon could kill. With a whip you would be hard pressed to kill someone even if you had a long time, and it would be from shock or slow slow bloodloss or infection, and would take forever.

The point is simply a whip is not a weapon to begin with.

[SpawnOfMorbo]

Because again whips don't deal significant damage. Before it was fine because they dealt non-lethal damage, but now that there is no nonlethal they shouldnt do the same damage as before.

With one strike with any other weapon could kill. With a whip you would be hard pressed to kill someone even if you had a long time, and it would be from shock or slow slow bloodloss or infection, and would take forever.

The point is simply a whip is not a weapon to begin with.

Until you stop ignoring that this is a fantasy game (or stuff that is being typed) I'm done.

[Regulas]

Until you stop ignoring that this is a fantasy game (or stuff that is being typed) I'm done.

Well if it's a magic weapon whip, or a rope dagger, or something then that would be fine.

[Human Paragon 3]

Rule of Cool says whips deal plenty good damage.

As for the career choice, I see nothing wrong. Screw the archetype features, they're not that great. A fighting style is just as good as any of them.

You will be the whip master. Definitely take Battle Master at 3 so you can do all the cool whip maneuvers you desire (grabbing, disarming, tripping, intimidating, the list goes on!).

[bloodshed343]

A regular whip might not be a weapon.

A 10 foot length of chain covered in blades? That's a weapon.

[SliceandDiceKid]

Rule of Cool says whips deal plenty good damage.

As for the career choice, I see nothing wrong. Screw the archetype features, they're not that great. A fighting style is just as good as any of them.

You will be the whip master. Definitely take Battle Master at 3 so you can do all the cool whip maneuvers you desire (grabbing, disarming, tripping, intimidating, the list goes on!).

This was what I had in mind. Ranged trip, then hit 'me while they're down!


A regular whip might not be a weapon.

A 10 foot length of chain covered in blades? That's a weapon.

Yeah! That's the spirit!



Also, I'm pretty sure a good crack will wreck your skull.