How Do You Beguile in Pathfinder?

[Palanan]

For an upcoming game I'd love to play a beguiler, but I don't know if there's a direct counterpart in PF.

I'm looking for a chassis which gives abundant skills, in particular with a social and diplomatic emphasis, together with modest and subtle spellcasting. If there's no exact equivalent to a beguiler, what's the next best thing?

[Skya]

An investigator focused on charisma skill could be your best option. There is an archetype for that if i remember well.

Or a bard.

[The_Snark]

If your GM is open to stuff from the Occult Adventures playtest (available freely (http://paizo.com/products/btpy9a0i?Pathfinder-Roleplaying-Game-Occult-Adventures-Playtest), although it's PDF-only and I think you have to sign up for the site), the mesmerist class sounds like exactly what you're looking for.

[The Grue]

Magus perhaps? There's lots of Arcana and some archetypes that have stealthy/skillmonkey synergy.

[Xsatra]

One option to consider is to simply port the Beguiler. Talk with your GM to see if he'd be OK with that. Here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?258256-Pathfinder-Beguiler) is a thread discussing a conversion and spitballing ideas for additional tweaks.

[daryen]

Archeologist Bard. You get the full suite of Bard spells, you get some Rogue abilities, you get 6+ skills, and you replace bardic performances with Luck.

Your flavor is then decided by your spell selections.

[Psyren]

I would go with Magician Bard myself. With Expanded Repertoire and some of the Summoner's discounted spells you can come close to rivaling a true Beguiler in power.

Another option is a human or half-elf Shadow Bloodline sorcerer with a decent Int score for lots of skills.

[Ssalarn]

If your GM is open to stuff from the Occult Adventures playtest (available freely (http://paizo.com/products/btpy9a0i?Pathfinder-Roleplaying-Game-Occult-Adventures-Playtest), although it's PDF-only and I think you have to sign up for the site), the mesmerist class sounds like exactly what you're looking for.

This was going to be my suggestion as well. The Mesmerist does a lot of what the Beguiler did, granted in a slightly different way, and was written specifically for Pathfinder, so it should click right in.

[Palanan]

Thanks for the suggestions on this, I appreciate it.


Originally Posted by The_Snark
…the mesmerist class sounds like exactly what you're looking for.

Outstanding, thank you. Love the mesmerist. So sexy.

However….


Originally Posted by Xsatra
One option to consider is to simply port the Beguiler.... Here is a thread discussing a conversion and spitballing ideas for additional tweaks.

As it happens, my DM found a beguiler rebuild for PF that looks as if it had been written up from exactly that thread. d8 HD, poor BAB, and "beguiler talents" which look just like rogue talents. Trapfinding is dropped, which is a bit of a downer...but it doesn't really fit my character concept anyway, so I can live with it.

So, I'll probably be going with the beguiler rebuild--but if my DM hadn't found that, the mesmerist would've been my first choice. Great flavor, interesting abilities, a good match overall. Definitely something I'll keep in mind.



So, one more question for you fine folks:

What feats in Pathfinder would be good for a third-level beguiler? The character is an exiled diplomat and dabbler in magic, and I'm open to all suggestions.

[Psyren]

Not that you even need it in PF (you have dispel magic for the magical traps), but you can get Trapfinding back with a trait (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/traits/campaign-traits/mummy-s-mask/trap-finder) if you want it.

As for feats, Hellcat Stealth (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/general-feats/hellcat-stealth) and Dampen Presence (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/general-feats/dampen-presence) are good ones for a sneak.

[Palanan]

Very nice, thanks.

What about social feats? Is there anything that would help a charming manipulator be a little more so?

[The Grue]

Very nice, thanks.

What about social feats? Is there anything that would help a charming manipulator be a little more so?

Other than Persuasive and Skill Focus? There's not a whole lot in the way of non-numerical bonuses to social skills. Pathfinder sn't really a social-focused game system. Fake edit: I did just dig up Rhetorical Flourish (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/general-feats/rhetorical-flourish) and Antagonize (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/general-feats/antagonize), though, so that's something.

That said, if you can get rogue talents there's several that work. Charmer (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/rogue/rogue-talents/paizo---rogue-talents/charmer-ex) is the obvious one. Apart from that, 3.5 had some social feats and skill tricks in a couple of splatbooks, maybe see if your DM will allow them?

[Palanan]

Is Arcane Strike really worthwhile? It sounds vaguely useful, especially against anything incorporeal, but at third level I don't know how much good it will do.

Also, the character won't have much of a combat focus…a rapier for style and a crossbow for keeping his distance, but no specialization in either. (I.e., no Weapon Finesse, Point Blank Shot, nada.) Would Arcane Strike be a helpful touch, or mainly wasted here?

[Ssalarn]

Is Arcane Strike really worthwhile? It sounds vaguely useful, especially against anything incorporeal, but at third level I don't know how much good it will do.

Also, the character won't have much of a combat focus…a rapier for style and a crossbow for keeping his distance, but no specialization in either. (I.e., no Weapon Finesse, Point Blank Shot, nada.) Would Arcane Strike be a helpful touch, or mainly wasted here?

It's basically a nice use for your swift action if you don't have something better to spend it on. It's bonus damage that doesn't also come with a penalty to-hit, and the fact that your weapon gets to be magical is nice if you don't already have a magical one. As more of a dedicated caster though, you're probably going to have better things to do with that swift.

[Palanan]

Okay, thanks. At third level I'm not sure what else I could be doing with swift actions…but I've never been an artiste with those.

I'm really stumped with feat selection here. Right now Extend Spell is the only thing that seems all that useful, apart from the good points you mentioned for Arcane Strike.

[The Grue]

Extend Spell is always a solid pick.

[Palanan]

...except I just realized I'll only have first-level spells, so I couldn't extend anything but cantrips. Which I can just cast again anyways.

Looks like a corner case where Extend Spell isn't so great after all.

[Johnmakuta]

I would suggest the Inquisitor because he has spells as swell as many different skills though I still don't understand why Beguiler would be a problem in PF