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View Full Version : Optimization Cloistered Cleric- The squishy mage



Shadowscale
2014-12-05, 10:34 PM
D&d seems to approach clerics as the heavily armored warriors capable of awesome domain powers, awesome divine metamagic and full acess to an impressive spell list.

Lots of fantasy like to approach clerics similar to arcane casters without armor, low hit points, but a spell casting fiend who rewrites reality and novas things to death.

Besides Cloistered cleric are there additional ways for a cleric to pull off not wearing armor and essentially supercharging their spellcasting and becoming the blaster, yet divine.
Prestige classes exist for this concept as well?

Thrice Dead Cat
2014-12-06, 12:43 AM
Archivist might fit the bill. They're poor BAB like the cloistered cleric, but I can never remember their armor proficiencies. They also have the benefit of being able to copy any divine spell from a scroll into their prayer book, even though they only have access to the base cleric list for their free spells from leveling up.

Some flavor of druid ACF might get rid of some of their armor proficiencies, too, but I don't know of any off-hand.

As for PrCs, I don't think Ur-Priest gives anybcuz proficiencies, so that's an option for an evil scholar. Sadly the only other quick divine-casting PrC is Divine Crusader, which comes with a BAB requirement and only one domain for its spell list. That being said, Anyspell is a domain spell from Spell Compendium from the Spell domain, IIRC (and go figure).

Inevitability
2014-12-06, 02:10 AM
Some flavor of druid ACF might get rid of some of their armor proficiencies, too, but I don't know of any off-hand.

There is. Monk Druid (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm) from UA. Basically, you are exchanging Wildshape and your armor for Wisdom to AC, Monk bonuses to AC, Fast Movement, Favored Enemy, Swift Tracker, and Track. Not worth it, as wildshape can just copy most of those bonuses.

Extra Anchovies
2014-12-06, 02:43 AM
There is. Monk Druid (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm) from UA. Basically, you are exchanging Wildshape and your armor for Wisdom to AC, Monk bonuses to AC, Fast Movement, Favored Enemy, Swift Tracker, and Track. Not worth it, as wildshape can just copy most of those bonuses.

It is indeed a pretty big step down for the class. However, a step down from druid is still at the high end of the tier system. Their main strength, despite Wild Shape and the Animal Companion, is still their casting. It can also be a nice way to intentionally reduce a druid's power to match a lower optimization level (because other than Natural Spell, a druid is basically pre-optimized). If I ever play a druid in a game that isn't intentionally high-op, I'm probably going to run it with that ACF, and possibly also the Druidic Avenger (that one I'm not as keen on, but it could be fun).

sleepyphoenixx
2014-12-06, 04:21 AM
It is indeed a pretty big step down for the class. However, a step down from druid is still at the high end of the tier system. Their main strength, despite Wild Shape and the Animal Companion, is still their casting. It can also be a nice way to intentionally reduce a druid's power to match a lower optimization level (because other than Natural Spell, a druid is basically pre-optimized). If I ever play a druid in a game that isn't intentionally high-op, I'm probably going to run it with that ACF, and possibly also the Druidic Avenger (that one I'm not as keen on, but it could be fun).

It also massively reduces bookkeeping which is often a concern for first-time druid players.
Not to mention that there are plenty of druidy character concepts where shapeshifting just doesn't fit, flavor-wise. Not everyone likes to spend most of their IC time in some kind of animal form, simply as a matter of taste or because it limits RP options unless specifically worked around.

Aside from that any Wisdom-based caster is usually better of with a Monk's Belt instead of armor & shield almost as soon as they can afford it. It's been a while since i did the math but iirc the belt becomes cheaper for the same AC at 20 or 22 Wis. And that's not taking into account that the belt automatically increases touch AC as well and any resources you spend on it also increase your spellcasting power.

Ellowryn
2014-12-06, 10:15 AM
Well, just because they can wear heavy armor doesn't mean they always have to. With the awesome Luminous Armor spell line you can run around with magic armor made of LIGHT!!!! which is better than armor for all but high levels. You can also not trade away Knowledge Domain and use wands to fuel your spellcasting along with cranking out high levels of wisdom over melee stats, becoming a holy wand wielding magic caster of DOOM!!!!!

Hand_of_Vecna
2014-12-06, 02:17 PM
You can also not trade away Knowledge Domain and use wands to fuel your spellcasting along with cranking out high levels of wisdom over melee stats, becoming a holy wand wielding magic caster of DOOM!!!!!

Are you confusing the Knowledge Domain Power with the Magic Domain Power?

Ellowryn
2014-12-06, 02:41 PM
Are you confusing the Knowledge Domain Power with the Magic Domain Power?

Er, actually, yeah. Never mind then, trade it away just like everyone else then, cause apparently nobody likes the domain!

nedz
2014-12-06, 03:06 PM
Lets see, IRL Clerics are into mind control etc., so this build is perfect for that — there's a touch of the divine also.

Beguiler 5 / Divine Oracle 1 / Beguiler +2 / Divine Oracle +2 / Beguiler ++
Feats: Educated [1] Arcane Disciple [1] Skill Focus [Know(Rel)][3] Arcane Disciple [6]

Other good feats for later
Dimensional Jaunt (If you took the Travel domain or similar), Penumbra Bloodline, Insightful Reflexes and yet more instances of Arcane Disciple.

Rebel7284
2014-12-06, 03:52 PM
Well first of all, blasters is among the weakest way to play a caster in D&D.

Here is how to build a poorly armored yet magic heavy cleric.

Azurin
Cloistered Cleric 3/Church Inquisitor 2/Dweomerkeeper 4/Sacred Exorcist 1/Contemplative 1/Dweomerkeeper +4/X1/Dweomerkeeper +2/Y2

Turn essentia instead of turn undead
Feats:
1. Magical Training (to qualify for dweomerkeeper)
Human. Quicken Spell
3. Initiate of Mystra
6. Divine Metamagic[Quicken Spell]

You get
- Supernatural Spell
- Anyspell and Greater Anyspell in any spell slot
- A bunch of spontaneous spells, including spontaneous miracle.
- Ability to cast in an antimagic field.
- DMM quicken for 2 spells per turn.
- Only cloistered cleric armor.