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Knight_Of_Twilight
2007-03-27, 10:25 PM
Hey, thought the class looked fun, and I'm starting up my build. I'm fine so far with spells and skills and such, but does anybody have any good suggestions for feats?

Ramza00
2007-03-27, 10:28 PM
Well there two more dark knowledge feats in heroes of horror if you want to do those :)

Knight_Of_Twilight
2007-03-27, 10:56 PM
Eh...I should be more specific. Ones not in heroes of horror. XD;

Tellah
2007-03-28, 12:21 PM
Take Divine Metamagic if you want to be ridiculously powerful and intend to keep this character into the higher levels. I like item creation feats for an Archivist, though, given the wide access they have to divine spells. If you're allowed to, do Craft Wondrous Item and Legendary Artificer from the ECS (I believe that's the one that reduces experience costs).

Clementx
2007-03-28, 12:24 PM
Yep, you are going to ROCK that Divine Metamagic with your zero turns per day.

ArmorArmadillo
2007-03-28, 12:32 PM
Yep, you are going to ROCK that Divine Metamagic with your zero turns per day.
Translation: Archivist's don't benefit from most cleric abilities; including the Cleric's toughness and melee capabilities.

Your real strength as a class is your ability to learn any divine spell; including doman spells (which encompasses many otherwise arcane spells).

As counterintuitive as it may seem, because you lack the Cleric/Druid's 3/4 BAB, you may want to take Weapon Focus (Ray/Ranged Spell) and Split Ray, as they would allow you to make use of your otherwise weakened Divine spells.

marjan
2007-03-28, 12:39 PM
Translation: Archivist's don't benefit from most cleric abilities; including the Cleric's toughness and melee capabilities.

Your real strength as a class is your ability to learn any divine spell; including doman spells (which encompasses many otherwise arcane spells).

As counterintuitive as it may seem, because you lack the Cleric/Druid's 3/4 BAB, you may want to take Weapon Focus (Ray/Ranged Spell) and Split Ray, as they would allow you to make use of your otherwise weakened Divine spells.

The only thing he needs for attack is Divine Power. And as for Turn Undead you can get into Sacred Exorcist from CD to get it.

Emperor Tippy
2007-03-28, 12:42 PM
Yep, you are going to ROCK that Divine Metamagic with your zero turns per day.
nightsticks are fun.

Clementx
2007-03-28, 12:49 PM
The only thing he needs for attack is Divine Power. And as for Turn Undead you can get into Sacred Exorcist from CD to get it.
Which makes it a question of, "How can a break an overpowered PrC with this new incidental base class?" Not really what the OP is asking. Nevermind the fact that the Sacred Exorcist's abilities depend on Cha (which does not do anything else for an Archivist), it enhance personal combat abilities he doesn't have, and he actually loses class features unlike clerics. But he wants to be an Archivist, not a cleric. As for nightsticks, if you are abusing them, you should also be telling him to just be a cleric so he can abuse them better. Just as pointless, nevermind stopped dead in its tracks by a sensible DM.

Your spellbook needs to be thick (since each divine spell is weaker than arcane ones, except for the self-buffs that just shore up what you suck at already- combat), and you need to work on getting those rare druid/domain scrolls. Extend Spell has plenty of benefits, as do Reserve feats for stretching out the value of each of your spell slots.

Knight_Of_Twilight
2007-03-28, 01:44 PM
Cool, thanks for the info so far guys. ^^
The DM said this campaign had a lot to do with Dead gods and stuff, so i thought this would be a cool character for it.

Question: Though I've played about 2 dozen warriors and rouges in my day, I'm a total spell-caster n00b, so forgive me if I ask really dumb stuff, but can I take regular Metamagic feats since I have to memorize spells like a Wizard does?

Edit: Nevermind, I see my question was answered already, sorta.

Person_Man
2007-03-28, 01:45 PM
Here is the Archivist (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20051007a&page=3), for anyone who isn't familiar with the class.

In my opinion, it is the strongest base class in the game.

They get access to every divine spell.

They get access to tons of arcane spells through domains. Look at crystalkeep, and you'll see just how many domains there are.

They get access to many divine and arcane spells one level earlier through domains.

They get Paladin, Ranger, and Blackguard spells that are scaled for a much higher ECL (for example, there's a 4th level Ranger spell in the Spell Compedium that duplicates the Arcane Archer's Hail of Arrows ability (ECL 14). The Archivist gets access to it at 7th level.

Look through this list (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=515321), and you'll see how easily this mechanic is abused.

I suggest that you not play one unless everyone else in your party is playing a well built full caster.

If you do play one and really want to abuse it and end your friendship with your DM, I suggest you pick up one level of Sacred Exorcist to gain Turn Undead to fuel Divine Metamagic, and one level of Dragonslayer (from the Draconomicon) to gain full weapons and armor. Then head into some other full caster PrC. Just don't give up any caster levels.

The Vorpal Tribble
2007-03-28, 01:48 PM
I currently play a Grey Elf Archivist/Seeker of the Misty Isle and he has feats such as Archivist of Nature and Master of Knowledge from the same book.

He's the one to go to about inexplicable disapearances, missing ships, and the weather. Basically his parents disapeared decades ago along with many other ships over the years and he's been trying to figure it out sense.

Really, what feats you choose depends wholey on the character type you are playing.

Edit: As for it being overpowered, I say bah. You don't really get to cast that many per day. My guy hasn't really been all that eye-catching and he's got an Int of 21 and tons of bonuses, as well as having spent most of his money on extra spells for his books.

You may know a great many spells (and simultaneously be near dirt poor by the end), but you can only choose a very limited handful every day.

marjan
2007-03-28, 01:53 PM
can I take regular Metamagic feats since I have to memorize spells like a Wizard does?


Sure, why not. In regard to casting and preparing spells Archivist is just like Wizard.

Morgan_Scott82
2007-03-28, 02:54 PM
The brokenness of the Archivist depends directly on the DMs decision about the availablity of druid/domain scrolls. Unlike wizards who all get scribe scroll for free, for clerics or druids it involves the expenditure of a precious, precious feat. Furthermore in the campaign world in which you're playing clerics of some domains may be more prolific and widespread while others are extremely locally focused in particular areas. All of these things can mitigate the brokenness of the Archivist. Contrarily if the GM says, yeah you can buy any scroll you want for the base market price per the DMG then yeah Archivist becomes the single most powerful class in the game.

As for how to play or build your archivist, I'm on slightly more shakey ground as I have no personal experience playing one, though its been on my list of classes to play for a long while now. Basically for your feats I see three clear paths to go down, improving your Dark Knowledge class feature through things like Archivist of Nature, Skill Focus on knowledge feats, improving your spell casting with metamagic feats, or using your larger than typical spell selection to become an item crafter.

Of these I would say the metamagic route is the most powerful, if thats all your concerned with, however I would encourage you to find a path that closely fits the way you want to roleplay the character and make power a secondary concern.

For spell selection, are you going to be the party's primary divine caster? If so this basically mandates that you select the Cure series of spells at each level as soon as they become available, and also the lack of spontaneous healing means that you will have to prepare the majority of your spell slots as cure spells, this is why the archivist is best as a parties secondary devine caster. Beyond that I would recommend, from the core only (I don't have my books ATM and am working from the SRD) Summon Monster I, Obscuring mist, Bless, Bless weapon, and Shield of Faith, as possible starting spells.

Just a few thoughts off the top of my head, though I haven't actually tested any of them personally, so take them with a grain of salt.

Knight_Of_Twilight
2007-03-28, 04:15 PM
Cool, I have a good idea of what to do now.

About the classes power level...I was attracted to it, because I really like it themeatically, and it reminds me a bit of Dr. Strange or the Slayers, where all magic is summoned by some sort of Demon or god or whatever.

When I read it thourghly, there was a brief moment of "Ooooh, shiny!" when I realized how powerful it was- having played many of the hybrid classes, I know that they get some good stuff at lower casting levels, not to mention all those domains and druid spells....

Regardless, though some may call me a bit of a power gamer, I'm not interested in making anyone else feel irrelevant. I'll try and tone down my thirst for power.

Tellah
2007-03-28, 04:21 PM
Yep, you are going to ROCK that Divine Metamagic with your zero turns per day.

Take a level of Sacred Exorcist.

Clementx
2007-03-28, 04:32 PM
Domain Cheese: No domain outside the PHB is granted to the core deities, and those that are available to them, it is by DM option. So you get exactly as many domain lists as your DM allows. Nothing forces your DM to make those non-core optional deities even exist, nevermind have enough clerics that you can find a pre-made scroll.

Hybrids Cheese: Most of their spells are also cleric/wizard/druid spells at a reasonable level, and by the DMG item rules, you assume that all scrolls are made by those classes. The ones that aren't fall under two DM controls. One, the above limiting of how often it gets scrolled. Second, the existing model showing that a lvl4 Paladin Spell is equivalent to lvl5 cleric spell in power, therefore an Archivist should follow that guideline. Unless you think learning something from a less-talented source should make the same task easier.

The archivist is interesting, but only broken when you assume your DM is an idiot with an infinite multiverse completely at the whim of the next WotC supplement.

Aquillion
2007-03-28, 07:58 PM
On the other hand... I like the flavor of allowing just a reasonable amount of that. Archivists are supposed to be constantly searching for obscure scrolls; having them looking for spell of obscure dead diety X or Y is very much part of the class. You just don't want to let it get out of hand... obviously, Archivists shouldn't be able to just walk into a scroll store and buy every scroll on every domain list everywhere, plus every spell on every non-cleric divine caster class.

The thing about learning obscure spells is that they're obscure. Getting them too easily would ruin both the balance and the flavor of the class.

Knight_Of_Twilight
2007-03-28, 08:58 PM
I don't think balance will be an issue, this guy is usually really stingy with treasure. XD;