Orcus strongest monster that does not have stats yet.

[Envyus]

Orcus Demon Prince of the Undead and his Wand are quite iconic to D&D. The DMG features stats for the Wand of Orcus and tells us what features it has while in Orcus' hands. Pretty much if Orcus has his wand (And he probably will if being fought.) he is probably the strongest monster in the game just due to the powers it gives him.

The major power that I say gives him the title of strongest monster with out stats yet (The others which you can read about in the DMG are just iceing on the cake.) is the power to summon undead. When used by a character with the Wand of Orcus they can summon 500 hit points of Skeletons and Zombies once per day anywhere within 300 ft of them, they obey the summoner and crumble to dust the next morning. A fantastic power worthy of the wand. However in Orcus' hands the power changes and becomes pretty much unbeatable. It's the same except he can summon 500 hit points of any type of undead. They last until destroyed or Orcus dismisses them. This means he can summon stuff like Liches, Death Knights, Death Tyrants and Demiliches along with other powerful undead.

Pretty much when Orcus gets stats he is going to be near unbeatable.

[JFahy]

And if you fight him in his realm, you're going to be ass-deep in undead
before he ever activates the wand. Yeah, Demon Princes are bad news.

[ghost_warlock]

Compared to some of the other demon princes and archdevils, not to mention actual gods like Tiamat, I really doubt Orcus is even a contender in a match for "strongest monster in the game."

Orcus isn't even the strongest monster in the Abyss considering that an actual god, Lolth, resides there. Also, there's good money on a bet that Demogorgon is actually more powerful than Orcus.

[Envyus]

Compared to some of the other demon princes and archdevils, not to mention actual gods like Tiamat, I really doubt Orcus is even a contender in a match for "strongest monster in the game."

Orcus isn't even the strongest monster in the Abyss considering that an actual god, Lolth, resides there. Also, there's good money on a bet that Demogorgon is actually more powerful than Orcus.

I mean currently in 5e. Just because we know what some of Orcus's powers are. While we know nothing about others.

Demogorgon, Orcus and Graz'zt are considered to be the top 3 Demon Lords in the Abyss. Lolth and Graz'zt are considered to be equals as well despite the formers godhood. (Other Demonlords considered doing what Graz'zt wanted during a meeting in Lolths realms. They wondered if it would be worse to upset Lolth or Graz'zt) Demogorgon and Orcus have killed gods before and Orcus was at one point a god and is considered to be the Demonlord closest to godhood.

All of these guys are very powerful and no one god or not messes with them lightly.

[andhaira]

Orcus Demon Prince of the Undead and his Wand are quite iconic to D&D. The DMG features stats for the Wand of Orcus and tells us what features it has while in Orcus' hands. Pretty much if Orcus has his wand (And he probably will if being fought.) he is probably the strongest monster in the game just due to the powers it gives him.

The major power that I say gives him the title of strongest monster with out stats yet (The others which you can read about in the DMG are just iceing on the cake.) is the power to summon undead. When used by a character with the Wand of Orcus they can summon 500 hit points of Skeletons and Zombies once per day anywhere within 300 ft of them, they obey the summoner and crumble to dust the next morning. A fantastic power worthy of the wand. However in Orcus' hands the power changes and becomes pretty much unbeatable. It's the same except he can summon 500 hit points of any type of undead. They last until destroyed or Orcus dismisses them. This means he can summon stuff like Liches, Death Knights, Death Tyrants and Demiliches along with other powerful undead.

Pretty much when Orcus gets stats he is going to be near unbeatable.

Uhm, considering DK and Vampire Lords have 100+ hitpoints, this means he can probably summon 2 in total maximum 1/day. So 2 DKs or 1DK + 1 Vampire Lord. That's not what I consider powerful. More like a walk in the park.

[Envyus]

Uhm, considering DK and Vampire Lords have 100+ hitpoints, this means he can probably summon 2 in total maximum 1/day. So 2 DKs or 1DK + 1 Vampire Lord. That's not what I consider powerful. More like a walk in the park.

I did some math. He can summon 2 Lichs and 2 Demilichs and a wraith. He could summon 3 Vampires or 3 liches along with stuff like wraiths and wights, 2 lichs and a Death Tyrant or Knight. There is also the the fact they don't go away until he wants them to after he summons them.

(Should mention that average hp on monsters is used.)

[JoeJ]

It would be pretty funny if it turned out that Orcus is really CR 1/4 without his famous wand.

[Envyus]

That would be pretty scary actually, because CR 1/4 creatures can get infinite amounts of Legendary Resistance for free, according to the DMG guidelines.

No they don't it's supposed to mean 0 to 4 not 1 to 0.

[Envyus]

Who told you that?

Common sense as it's a typo made a few other times. Anyway it's off topic on topic is Orcus' awesome wand.

[pwykersotz]

A "typo" made several times suggests that it's not a typo. Abilities get cheaper as CR goes down, and below CR 1 they are free.

I would love to see a Al'miraj with infinite LR in the MM2. :smallbiggrin:

[pwykersotz]

So...don't hate me...I took a stab at statting Orcus. This is the first project I've done in 5e to completely stat something of this high a CR, so there might be some problems. Let's take a look!


Large Fiend, Chaotic Evil
Armor Class 19 (natural armor and wand)
Hit Points 620 (40d10 + 400)
Speed 40ft., Fly 40ft.



STR
DEX
CON
INT
WIS
CHA


30 (+10)
18 (+4)
30 (+10)
29 (+9)
24 (+7)
24 (+7)


Saving Throws Str +19, Con +19, Int +18
Skills Arcana +18, Athletics +19, Deception +16, Insight +16
Damage Immunities necrotic, cold, poison; bludgeoning, piercing, and slashing from nonmagical weapons
Damage Resistances lightning
Condition Immunities blinded, charmed, deafened, frightened, poisoned, paralyzed, stunned
Senses darkvision 120ft., passive Perception 17
Languages Abyssal, telepathy 120ft
Challenge 30 (155,000 XP)

Magic Weapons. Orcus' claws and sting are considered magical weapons.

Aura of Undead Command. Undead feel a strong kinship to Orcus. Any undead within 120ft who attempts any hostile action against him must first make a Charisma save vs DC 23 or their action is wasted.

Legendary Resistance (5/day). If Orcus fails a saving throw, he can choose to succeed instead.

Limited Magic Immunity. Orcus is immune to all spells of 6th level or lower unless he wishes to be affected. He has advantage on all other saving throws against spells.

Wand of Orcus. Orcus has the full powers of the Wand of Orcus, DMG pg 227.

Spellcasting. Orcus can cast spells as a 20th level Wizard, and thus has 29 prepared spells. His preferred spells are listed. Orcus is always considered to have prepared Animate Dead and Create Undead. His saving throw DC is 23.
9th/1: Power Word Kill, Time Stop, Imprisonment
8th/1: Dominate Monster, Feeblemind
7th/2: Plane Shift, Forcecage
6th/2: Circle of Death, Eyebite, True Seeing
5th/3: Cloudkill, Cone of Cold, Geas, Hold Monster
4th/3: Evard's Black Tentacles, Blight, Greater Invisibility, Phantasmal Killer
3rd/3: Bestow Curse, Counterspell, Dispel Magic, Vampiric Touch
2nd/3: Blindness/Deafness, Crown of Madness, Mirror Image, Shatter
1st/4: Detect Magic, False Life, Protection from Evil and Good, Shield
Cantrips: Chill Touch, Friends, Poison Spray, Prestidigitation, Shocking Grasp

Actions
Multiattack. Orcus can attack with the wand, a claw, and a sting.

Wand of Orcus. Melee Weapon Attack: +22 to hit, reach 5ft., one target. Hit: 20(2d6+13) bludgeoning damage plus 13 (2d12) necrotic damage.
Claw. Melee Weapon Attack: +19 to hit, reach 5ft., one target. Hit: 15 (1d10+10) bludgeoning damage plus 13 (3d8) necrotic damage.
Sting. Melee Weapon Attack: +19 to hit, reach 10ft., one target. Hit: 15 (1d10+10) piercing damage and 13 (3d8) poison damage.

Teleport. Orcus teleports, along with any equipment he is wearing or carrying, up to 240 feet to an unoccupied space he can see.

Legendary Actions. Orcus can take 5 legendary actions, choosing from the options below. Only one legendary action option can be used at a time, and only at the end of another creature's turn. Orcus regains spent legendary actions at the start of his turn.

Last Word (Costs 5 actions). Orcus uses vestiges of the power of the Lost Word he gained during his time as Tenebrous. It has lost much of his power, but is still quite potent. The creature must be able to hear him speak. It must make a Charisma save vs DC 23 or be instantly destroyed. Orcus does not use this power lightly, for if his target succeeds in resisting, the power rebounds back on him and he takes 20d10 radiant damage. Orcus cannot reduce, redirect, or block this damage in any way.
Assault (Costs 1 action). Orcus may use one of either his wand, his claw, or his sting to make an attack.
Expedient Wizardry (Costs 3 actions). Orcus may cast any spell he knows.
Wand Mastery (Costs 2 actions). Orcus may activate any spell or effect of the Wand of Orcus.


He's probably a bit much...I took inspiration from his stat block from Dungeon Magazine 149 pg 56-57. His spells might need to be pared down to innate spellcasting, not sure.

[Envyus]

Well I don't think he should be that intelligent and I find the spell casting to be a bit much.

[pwykersotz]

Well I don't think he should be that intelligent and I find the spell casting to be a bit much.

Yeah, I was surprised at his Int too. But 3.5 has him super smart. His stat array in Dungeon is 40/27/42/31/24/24. Int is his highest mental stat. And let's just say I took away most of his casting. :smallsigh:

[Envyus]

Yeah, I was surprised at his Int too. But 3.5 has him super smart. His stat array in Dungeon is 40/27/42/31/24/24. Int is his highest mental stat. And let's just say I took away most of his casting. :smallsigh:

Actually I guess I was looking at Orcus wrong. His Int has apparently always been his highest mental stat in every thing until 4e. He was also promoted to Gargantuan in 4e as well. I have have feeling he will keep that status when he gets officially stated.

[ghost_warlock]

Come to think of it, I'd like to see stats for The Lady of Pain. :smalltongue: Characters could actually interact with her somewhat frequently in Sigil as long as they don't completely piss her off. I think there's a good chance that she's actually the most powerful creature in D&D, even if she's never going to leave the cage.

[Scots Dragon]

Come to think of it, I'd like to see stats for The Lady of Pain. :smalltongue: Characters could actually interact with her somewhat frequently in Sigil as long as they don't completely piss her off. I think there's a good chance that she's actually the most powerful creature in D&D, even if she's never going to leave the cage.

So I put together some quick and dirty stats for the Lady of Pain;


Should any player character run afoul of the Lady of Pain, roll a d20. On a roll of 1, the character is flayed and instantly slain to degrees so thorough that no magic can possibly resurrect them. On a roll of 2-5, the character is flayed and instantly slain, but may be resurrected. On a roll of 6-20, the character is placed within an extraplanar maze with almost no possibility of escape, but such an occurrence may be used as the hook for a lengthy dungeon crawl adventure..

[RealCheese]

So I put together some quick and dirty stats for the Lady of Pain;

I think on a 20 she should just ignore them and move on. Unless this was specifically for if they had slighted her.

[andhaira]

Use Tiamat's statblock in Rise of Tiamat and work your way down from there. Removing spellcasting should be the first thing you do; Tiamat can only cast 1 spell, Divine Word 3 times/day.

One thing I wanted to ask: Tiamat's stat block states she is immune to fire, bludgeoning, lightning, etc. Does this mean she is immune to spells that cause that damage as well, even if said spells are above 6th level? Her immunity does not protect against magic weapons, so it should make sense that spells above level 6, like Meteor Swarm, should affect her as well despite being immune to fire.

[pwykersotz]

Use Tiamat's statblock in Rise of Tiamat and work your way down from there. Removing spellcasting should be the first thing you do; Tiamat can only cast 1 spell, Divine Word 3 times/day.

One thing I wanted to ask: Tiamat's stat block states she is immune to fire, bludgeoning, lightning, etc. Does this mean she is immune to spells that cause that damage as well, even if said spells are above 6th level? Her immunity does not protect against magic weapons, so it should make sense that spells above level 6, like Meteor Swarm, should affect her as well despite being immune to fire.

I did that already. :smallwink:

I considered stripping spellcasting entirely. But I felt that some difference between the two would be nice. Orcus is far less of a damage brute than Tiamat, but he's got some more flexibility. I considered Innate Spellcasting for a few of his super thematic spells as well. I'm AFB right now, but I might try to make a non-casting version when I have the chance.

[Scots Dragon]

I think on a 20 she should just ignore them and move on. Unless this was specifically for if they had slighted her.

I had considered the idea of the Lady of Pain just ignoring them on a 20 even if they had slighted her after I posted it, but with the note that persistence causes a reroll with a -10 on the roll.

[ghost_warlock]

So I put together some quick and dirty stats for the Lady of Pain;

Needs more "flays 1d10 adventurers per round." :smalltongue:

[Envyus]

One thing I wanted to ask: Tiamat's stat block states she is immune to fire, bludgeoning, lightning, etc. Does this mean she is immune to spells that cause that damage as well, even if said spells are above 6th level? Her immunity does not protect against magic weapons, so it should make sense that spells above level 6, like Meteor Swarm, should affect her as well despite being immune to fire.

She is immune to Fire damage and spells that cause fire damage. Her statblock says she is immune to Bludgeoning, Piercing and Slashing from Non Magical weapons. Meaning Magical weapons can hurt her as she is not immune to them. She can't be hurt by anything he is immune to she is just not immune to magic weapons. Meteor Swarm would not do any fire damage to her. (It would do Bludgeoning damage still)

[mr_odd]

If you don't summon Orcus every session, you're not doing D&D right.

[JAL_1138]

So I put together some quick and dirty stats for the Lady of Pain;

The Lady's stats are basically "YOU LOSE. Even if you're Pun-Pun, you still lose."