Which books to buy?

[Kumori]

Hello all! I've recently had my first experience with Pathfinder and I'm looking to pick up a few books for it. Obviously, I'll be getting the three core rulebooks, but what else should I pick up? What is your favourite book and why?

[Codenpeg]

Advanced Player's Guide (Brings you a bunch of goodies, Alchemist, Cavalier, Inquisitor, Oracle, summoner, and witch), Ultimate Combat and Magic would round it out nicely.

[Thealtruistorc]

Advanced Player's Guide is a must. After that, I would go with Advanced Race Guide followed by the Ultimate books (I love my player races).

[Extra Anchovies]

I'd say the Advanced Class Guide, but I'm still holding out for a reprint of that one... so many errors. So, so many errors.

[malonkey1]

The Psionics stuff from Dreamscarred Press. Or really, anything from DSP. It's actually really well balanced, and even got used in a Paizo module.

[Fouredged Sword]

Buy whatever looks interesting and has pretty pictures. Or just buy adventure paths. Everything RAW is online. Support Pathfinder by buying stuff for sure, but books are more for the fluff and pictures than for rules at this point.

[Thealtruistorc]

The Psionics stuff from Dreamscarred Press. Or really, anything from DSP. It's actually really well balanced, and even got used in a Paizo module.

Which one? I'm curious now.

[Sayt]

Which one? I'm curious now.

The module Dragon's Demand, has two monsters with Psi-Like Abilities.

[Greenish]

The crunch is all available for free, so if you have any interest in the setting, I'd go with the Golarion books rather than the system-neutral splats (which are by necessity far blander).

[Psyren]

Buy whatever looks interesting and has pretty pictures. Or just buy adventure paths. Everything RAW is online. Support Pathfinder by buying stuff for sure, but books are more for the fluff and pictures than for rules at this point.

Yeah that. I personally buy books/PDFs for:

(a) the art (particularly for the latter, where I can enjoy/extract the cooler images for my sheets)
(b) to support my FLGS (in the case of the former) and Paizo in general,
(c) to get something early that I've been anticipating, and don't want to wait for the various RDs to update
(d) for fluff (in the case of Golarion content)
(e) the odd convention where I feel like playing PFS
(f) to understand a subsystem that I might have trouble wrapping my head around reading it online (Ultimate Campaign and Ultimate Magic had examples of these, and some third-party stuff.)

Plus I find that showing your DM something on a page is much more likely to get buy-in than showing it to them in a browser window. I think it's a psychological thing.

[Petrocorus]

The Psionics stuff from Dreamscarred Press. Or really, anything from DSP. It's actually really well balanced, and even got used in a Paizo module.

BTW, i'm a bit confused by DSP psionics line of products.
Ultimate Psionics = Psionic Unleashed + Psionic Expanded + Psionic Augmented? Right?
What about Psionics Embodied?
And what is the Psionics Expanded series with things like Psionics Expanded: Master the Battle and Psionics Expanded: Advanced Psionics Guide? Is this additional material?


Yeah that. I personally buy books/PDFs for:
(b) to support my FLGS (in the case of the former) and Paizo in general,

What is FLGS?



(d) for fluff (in the case of Golarion content)

Is Golarion actually good?
Can i find some material, or at least some description on line?



(f) to understand a subsystem that I might have trouble wrapping my head around reading it online (Ultimate Campaign and Ultimate Magic had examples of these, and some third-party stuff.)
Plus I find that showing your DM something on a page is much more likely to get buy-in than showing it to them in a browser window. I think it's a psychological thing.

I think it's a matter of credibility too. Internet website are always suspected to be flawed or full of errors. Not to mention the ones where homebrew materials is not well seperated of official ones.

[atemu1234]

If you haven't got the core stuff, get that first. Then get the other bestiaries (more variety) and then probably the one that has more classes in it.

[Psyren]

What is FLGS?

Friendly Local Game Store - those brick and mortar places that depend on us to buy books, games and Magic cards to survive :smallsmile:



Is Golarion actually good?
Can i find some material, or at least some description on line?

Golarion is a great setting. It's kitchen-sink fantasy where you can run different genres in nearly every country - e.g. gothic horror in Ustalav, tribal mysticism/tomb raiding in Mwangi, pulpy "sci-fi" in Numeria, political intrigue in Cheliax/Andoran/Galt, low-magic gunslinging in Alkenstar, swashbuckling piracy all over the Inner Sea, and mythic/epic sword and sorcery stuff in Irrisen, Worldwound, Nex etc. I also like their spin on various races, like Gnomes and Drow.

You need the books to go really in-depth but there is a lot of info on the wiki. (http://pathfinderwiki.com/wiki/)

[Zubrowka74]

I'd say the Advanced Class Guide, but I'm still holding out for a reprint of that one... so many errors. So, so many errors.

Every book that I got so far in the French edition has horrible, horrible editing blunders. Some more than others. I'm looking at you, Ultimate Magic!

Things like having three or four times the same paragraphs in a list of things.

[Petrocorus]

Every book that I got so far in the French edition has horrible, horrible editing blunders. Some more than others. I'm looking at you, Ultimate Magic!

Things like having three or four times the same paragraphs in a list of things.

BTW, I'm really interested in getting French edition instead of original ones. In Québec, do you have the Black Book Editions' ones, or do you have other translations?
Do you have translations of DSP material, PoW and Psionics notably?

[daryen]

Obviously, I'll be getting the three core rulebooks, ...

OK, I am curious: what are the "three core rulebooks"? There is, of course, the actual Pathfinder Core Rulebook. Outside of that, what else is deemed to be "core"? I figure that one is likely the first Beastiary. Is that correct? What is the third one?

Personally, I have Core, Beastiary I, and APG. Plus the on-line PFSRD. I also got the all-in-one Runelords book so I could have a full adventure campaign. (I wish they would do that with other old adventure paths.)

[Ssalarn]

I'd say the Advanced Class Guide, but I'm still holding out for a reprint of that one... so many errors. So, so many errors.

And they recently revealed that they sold out pretty much the entire first print run, so there will definitely be a second (corrected) printing. Definitely worth getting, but even more worth waiting for.



The Psionics stuff from Dreamscarred Press. Or really, anything from DSP. It's actually really well balanced, and even got used in a Paizo module.

Also, very much this. Ultimate Psionics is probably the single best expansion to the Core Rulebook you can get, with a huge wealth of well balanced material, including great and easy to play classes, feats, prestige classes, archetypes, etc.

As others have mentioned, the Advanced Player's Guide is a must-have item, and Ultimate Magic is very good as well. Ultimate Campaign has a lot of cool adventure building tools for GMs, and the Advanced Race Guide introduces or refines lots of cool player options for exotic or unusual races if you like your fantasy to be a little more World of Warcraft and a little less Lord of the Rings. Ultimate Combat has some good stuff in it, but it dedicates a lot of pages to optional rules and combat settings (may or may not see any use), and it features the worst designed subsystem Paizo has ever put out, firearms.

[Extra Anchovies]

And they recently revealed that they sold out pretty much the entire first print run, so there will definitely be a second (corrected) printing. Definitely worth getting, but even more worth waiting for.

Yes! That may be a book that I buy, because A) I actually really like the hybrid classes (dunno why, but they seem to get a lot of hate) and B) there's a few things in there that aren't on the SRD (like racial favored class bonuses).

[Psyren]

And they recently revealed that they sold out pretty much the entire first print run, so there will definitely be a second (corrected) printing. Definitely worth getting, but even more worth waiting for.

The first one is also likely to be a collector's item.

But for myself, I'll likely sell or gift the misprint and pick up the second run, I prefer accuracy.


Yes! That may be a book that I buy, because A) I actually really like the hybrid classes (dunno why, but they seem to get a lot of hate) and B) there's a few things in there that aren't on the SRD (like racial favored class bonuses).

Not to undermine Paizo or anything, but those are on the PRD (http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/advancedClassGuide/classes/index.html) if you don't want to wait :smallwink:

(Hey, they uploaded them)

[Ssalarn]

Yes! That may be a book that I buy, because A) I actually really like the hybrid classes (dunno why, but they seem to get a lot of hate) and B) there's a few things in there that aren't on the SRD (like racial favored class bonuses).

Some of the hybrid classes were really solid and/or fulfilled under-supported niches, so I'm generally okay with them. In a couple instances, I think their theme of hybrid classes actually weighed down some concepts instead of facilitating them, but it is what it is at this point. Balance was solid throughout, ideas were (mostly) cool... The biggest issues were editing related, which is actually pretty easy to clean up once the problems have been identified (as they pretty much have been at this point; I'd be surprised if anyone at Paizo wasn't intimately familiar with the bulk of the issues). I think the only real mechanical issues were in the chassis of the Swashbuckler and a couple of his supporting feats, and in a few other specific feats.

The second printing should be the amazing book the first printing could have been with a little more care and polish.

[Psyren]

The archetypes had some issues too. Ecclesitheurge (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/cleric/archetypes/paizo---cleric-archetypes/ecclesitheurge) comes to mind.

I was hoping they'd make a band-aid feat to fix that in ACGO, but they didn't. They've made archetype-specific feats before after all (e.g. Planar Preservationist.)

[Extra Anchovies]

Not to undermine Paizo or anything, but those are on the PRD (http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/advancedClassGuide/classes/index.html) if you don't want to wait :smallwink:

(Hey, they uploaded them)

Hm. Is the PRD more comprehensive than the PFSRD (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/home)? I've mostly been using the latter.

[Ssalarn]

The archetypes had some issues too. Ecclesitheurge (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/cleric/archetypes/paizo---cleric-archetypes/ecclesitheurge) comes to mind.

I was hoping they'd make a band-aid feat to fix that in ACGO, but they didn't. They've made archetype-specific feats before after all (e.g. Planar Preservationist.)

Well, they meant to take away Blessing of the Faithful, they just forgot to remove the reference to it. As I understand it (and I occasionally game with the guy who wrote it) Blessing was meant to be a proactive thing the Ecclesitheurge could do since the bulk of the cleric spell list is more buffing or reactive. The development team decided that the ability wasn't really necessary and they'd rather use the room to elaborate on the other abilities presented in the archetype (and show off some dwarf art), so the ability was cut but they missed a reference. That to me falls under editing error as opposed to design error.

Although the poor Bolt Ace, that guy had some design errors that should have been caught in editing/development :P At least his chassis works though.

[Psyren]

Hm. Is the PRD more comprehensive than the PFSRD (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/home)? I've mostly been using the latter.

No - the PFSRD includes (a) 3rd-party and (b) scrubbed 1st-party material from the APs, modules and Golarion books e.g. Inner Sea X. So it is more comprehensive.

But the PRD is still useful to reference even when the same books are in both places. It is also the more official of the two.


Well, they meant to take away Blessing of the Faithful, they just forgot to remove the reference to it. As I understand it (and I occasionally game with the guy who wrote it) Blessing was meant to be a proactive thing the Ecclesitheurge could do since the bulk of the cleric spell list is more buffing or reactive. The development team decided that the ability wasn't really necessary and they'd rather use the room to elaborate on the other abilities presented in the archetype (and show off some dwarf art), so the ability was cut but they missed a reference. That to me falls under editing error as opposed to design error.

Although the poor Bolt Ace, that guy had some design errors that should have been caught in editing/development :P At least his chassis works though.

I don't know what the Blessing did, but the Archetype as written does have issues - the cleric list is notoriously light on low-level AC boosts, and the Ecclesitheurge can't wear armor. Unlike a wizard or sorcerer, they don't get Mage Armor or Blur or False Life or Barkskin or anything to help keep them from being pincushions at low levels. They get Ice Armor, but they aren't proficient with a breastplate and nonproficiency penalties matter at those levels. So it's either an oversight, or poor design.

[Ssalarn]

No - the PFSRD includes (a) 3rd-party and (b) scrubbed 1st-party material from the APs, modules and Golarion books e.g. Inner Sea X. So it is more comprehensive.

But the PRD is still useful to reference even when the same books are in both places. It is also the more official of the two.

Also of note, the PFSRD has to change the names of a lot of stuff and occasionally has to make other tweaks to the way information is presented since they decided to go commercial and break away from the free use clause of the OGL; they aren't allowed to use setting specific names for feats, deities, archetypes, etc. and such unless those are specifically added to the OGL. It's also managed, reviewed, and updated completely separately from any of the publishers who support the system, so mistakes can creep in (though thanks to its popularity, those are usually quickly caught and corrected).

[Extra Anchovies]

Also of note, the PFSRD has to change the names of a lot of stuff and occasionally has to make other tweaks to the way information is presented since they decided to go commercial and break away from the free use clause of the OGL; they aren't allowed to use setting specific names for feats, deities, archetypes, etc. and such unless those are specifically added to the OGL. It's also managed, reviewed, and updated completely separately from any of the publishers who support the system, so mistakes can creep in (though thanks to its popularity, those are usually quickly caught and corected).

Huh. And here I was thinking it was the official one. That explains why DSP stuff is on there.

[Psyren]

Nope - as you now see, the official one is the one hosted by Paizo themselves (i.e. on the "paizo.com" root domain.)

[Zubrowka74]

BTW, I'm really interested in getting French edition instead of original ones. In Québec, do you have the Black Book Editions' ones, or do you have other translations?
Do you have translations of DSP material, PoW and Psionics notably?

For all the Paizo material I've come acrosse to this date it's the same Black Books version, at twice the US price or so... As for third party, I don't know.

[Palanan]

Originally Posted by Psyren
Golarion is a great setting. It's kitchen-sink fantasy where you can run different genres in nearly every country….

Overall I like most of what I've seen in Pathfinder, but I'm afraid that as a setting Golarion is less appealing for me. I've been looking through the Inner Sea World Guide and I'm underwhelmed by the kitchen-sink approach; it feels very clunky and scattershot to me, as if they designed each country around a particular trope without much thought for how they'd actually coexist on a continent.

I suppose it works well enough for individual games that want to use this or that scenario, but I like my worlds to be a little more coherent.


Originally Posted by Psyren
But the PRD is still useful to reference even when the same books are in both places. It is also the more official of the two.

I was never sure about the difference between the two, and I'd been treating the PFSRD as a little dubious, since it's the PRD that's on Paizo's own website. It has more of a trim, proper feel to it, while the PFSRD has a lot of oddball stuff mixed in.

[Petrocorus]

For all the Paizo material I've come acrosse to this date it's the same Black Books version, at twice the US price or so... As for third party, I don't know.

Same problem here, apparently 1 $ > 1 € according to publishers, at least for hardcovers. But you can buy the PDF for 10 €.
I'm glad to know the Black Books Editions' versions are full of editing errors before buying them. Thank you.

[ZamielVanWeber]

The Psionics stuff from Dreamscarred Press. Or really, anything from DSP. It's actually really well balanced, and even got used in a Paizo module.

This. Not a Pathfinder fan but always a fan of DSP's work.