Computer Bleakbane (Re-)Plays: TIE Fighter! For the glory of the Empire, destroy everything! [Archive]

Aotrs Commander

2014-12-19, 05:54 PM

Welcome to the first vaguely-proper-ish Bleakbane Plays A Thing! In this case, one of the Best Three Games of All Time:

TIE Fighter!

For those of you unfamiliar, I, Commadore Bleakbane of the Aotrs (I have been promoted long since I started using my screen-nom de plume) a Lich of quite immeasurable awesomeness, insanity and evilness. Unhelpful commentary will doubtless be provided by my second-in-command Commander Amalyar Hopereaver...

Um... Why the introduction...?

Because not all of these people are familiar with ponythread, Hopereaver, now hush.

Righty-doke, chief.

See, this is exactly what I'm talking about.

I had a crack yesterday, but having missed a bleedingly obvious bonus goal in mission 3 (and wussin out on mission 1 after umpteen attempts), I decided I was going to restart anyway and then pendell made the ridiculous mistake of saying...

I wouldn't mind hearing the tale of your adventures, perhaps in another thread. Open Skies and may the Dark Side be with you [r character]!

... so this is all largely his fault.

The ground rules.

This is not the first time I've played TIE Fighter, but it has been a loong time since I last played it and the days when space flight sims were about the only thing I played ahve gone quite some time ago. I first played the Collector's CD-Rom, which we shall be doing again here (with a few tweaks from this (http://www.savingcontent.com/2014/08/09/guide-play-x-wing-tie-fighter-series-on-windows-7-windows-8-windows-8-1-with-an-xbox-xb1-playstation-ps4-controller-flight-stick/6/) website to get it run. I do own the 1998 Windows version... But while the graphics are better, the later version heretically replaced the superlative interactive iMUSE score with dull un-interactive scores from the movie. Dumb.

I will thus be attempting to play and get all the medals (i.e. complete every mission's bonus goals). I will be starting on Hard mode (mark it well - there are VERY few games I am prepared to play above normal difficulty!) and it will remain so until I get too frustrated (which is sadly, relatively easy and why I don't generally play on higher difficulty levels!) I do thus have a cheat-sheet with a list of bonus goals (as in the campaign missions, you don't see the bonus goals until they are completed or you re-play the missions in the simulator). (The alternative was digging out my old save file - which I am pretty sure I still have in some of my back-ups!)

This will be updated as and when I play (and I warn you I do sometimes have ADD when it comes to games - which varies between that and single-minded laser focus. At current, pre-TIE Fighter, I have been solidly playing one of the other Best Three Games of All Time, Dungeon Keeper for about a month straight.)

There is also a right way and a wrong way to play TIE Fighter. You can treat it like you were playing a cartoonishly evil villain, twiddling the mustache you probably aren't allowed by regulations to where as a one-dimensional engine of death.

Or you can play it, as it does in the official adaptions, as a complex man, a little misguided to start with, and then ultimately caught up in events beyond his control and forced to do etheically questional things in the name of an Empire he's no longer certain off.

This is the wrong way.

Not jumping headfirst into the Dark Side and manically laughing like a complete lunatic as you butcher rebel scum, traitors, pirate and any civilians that get in your way in a game about the Galactic Empire is, well, kind of missing the point! It's like playing Dungeon Keeper and not torturing creatures and purposefully losing the level because you have "moral issues with playing a bad guy." Sure, you can do it, but where's the fun in that?!

(2/3 Best Games of All Time focus on you playing the bad guys. Co-incidence? I think not.)

We shall begin shortly - but first we must address the krayt dragon in the room.

As I eluded to above, official sources will tell you that TIE Fighter is the chronicle of Maarik Stele's career and that Maarik Stele himself was barely a step removed from being a rebel sympathiser, like Baron Soontir Fel.

This is of course, nothing more than rebel propaganda.

The very idea that any and all of the Empire's servants who were competant and not utterly loyal to the Empire is ludicrous. It is emphatically NOT true that the Empire can't have nice things without them all being stolen by the rebels and this case is CETAINLY one of them. But the idea is widespread, thanks to the rebel's camapign of defamation against the glorious New Order. The Empire, however, in this case, has not publically refuted the rebel claim for the simple reason that there is some advantage in having the rebels believe their own lies - and for one other reason, which we will come to momentarily.

No, Maarik Stele was merely the comically inept wingman of the real hero, who only survived his own hilarious stupidit and bulbling by the endless actions of Our Hero pulling his dead weight as well as continuing his great works.Anyone who tells you otherwise is wrong. Even if George Lucas himself1 emphatically say it is true - that just means the rebels got to him first.

So, then... who WAS the real hero of the events?

That was something of a mystery. Following the tumultuous events after Endor, the man in question disappeared. His records, full of confidential information, were lost or destroyed during the subsequent battles, particularly the fall of Coruscant. It was here that Maarik, always jealous of his superior, started claiming it was his work (allegedly in a seedy bar on Coruscant with drunk of his head on cheap Sullustan ale.) What could have just been drunking bragging was soon adopted and expanded on by the rebels as the official story, as there was much gain to made in creating the illusion that the very best of the Empire (that they hadn't demonstrably killed) were uncertain of its ultimate goals at the very least and in the worst case, outright rebel sympathisers. With most of the other participants dead - particularly all those with proof - there was no-one to put up any resistance. Maarik, caught in a web of lies he could no longer escape from, kept up the charade.

I have thus have long undertaken myself the quest to bring this man the recongition he deserves and cleave through the web of deceit laid down by the rebels with the Rocket Launcher of Great Justice.

I tracked down and spoke to the few remaining people who really knew what was going on. Those who know better than to believe the rebel's fabricated lies believed that, with the collapse of the secret order, he pledged himself to Thrawn and served as Thrawn's envoy; perhaps to serve Thrawn outside the Empire (with the Chiss). Other thought his mission may have been to track down and re-create all the advanced fighter technology he had fought so hard over. (It was for these reasons that it was best for him to be incognito. Stele provided a (barely) plausible cover, and son the rebels forgot that there was a very real and very competant - and very anti-rebel - imperial operative unaccounted for.) The last piece of information uncovered in my search was some evidence it might have been he that was Cloak Leader during the Battle of Sluis Van. But after that the trail ran cold.

Until today!

Because denizens of the playground, after some searching and several inter-dimensional transits via the literal magic of Aotrs Gate spells, I have found him!

Behold! General Wartax Vosker, the true hero of the events protrayed in TIE Fighter!

Today the truth behind the man and his disappearance shall be revealed! So General, enlighten us!

It was because a maniac lich teleported into my universe, grabbed me and dragged me to his space station.

Ah.

Right.

O...kay.

Good job, chief.

THANK you, Hopereaver, I don't need your input. Now shush: ranking officers are talking!

So, General, how about we fix my little... faux pas. I can send you back in time to the events in question and you can have another shot! And this time, armed with foreknowedge, you can do even better!

Let me get this straight, you want me to go back in time, engage in dozens of battles I barely survived the first time and destroy countless lives all over again in service to a corrupt and totalitarian regime?

Yes.

Where do I sign? I can never kill enough rebels and traitors!

General, I like your style!

Without any further ado, we shall begin. We will leave the combat room missions to do as I feel like it and jump straight into Battle 1 - the Aftermath of Hoth, Mission 1 - Patrol Outpost D-34!

General - sorry as of now Cadet again - Vosker will take it from here!

(For the sake of readability, I will toggle the station's audio-to-text output so Vosker is coming in black, rather than grey in the spoilers.)

Battle One

Mission One: Patrol Outpost D-34
This first operation is a preportedly simply mission: inspect all cargo craft in the area in TIE Fighter T/F Alpha 1, and be on the lookout for rebel scum.

Right off the bat, five BFF-1 bulk freighters, FRT Onece and two Delta DX-9 stormtrooper Transports, TRN Dayta show up. Experience shows you start by isnpecting the two transports (since they are furthest away and also leave soonest) and then the FRTs (which gives them time to get closer to PLT/1 Platform D-34). Onece 3 has rebels aboard! Primary mission objectives completed! I then pummelled its shields down - quite safely, since FRTs have no weapons - and leave for TRN Sigma to capture.

In the meantime, a trio of rebel Lambda-class Shuttles (SHU) showed up. I however, ignored them totally and rushed off after the second wave of cargo ships: three Corellian Transports CORT Yander 1 to 3 (i.e. a stock YT-1300 transport of which the Millenium Falcon once was) and two Container transports (CTRNS Taloos). Full power to engines (i.e. full cannon energy) to boost the the quite acceptable speed of 125MGLT, then switching back to full cannon charge to help brake. A quick pass over the five ships - all inspected, good! With Sigma easily disabling the FRT and capturing it, the secondary objectives are done, too!

I then dealt with the lone rebel Transport Glitch that had showed up near the second wave, which fell effortlessly. And then shunted all power to engines and legged it towards PLT D-34, because the the hard part comes up. The shuttles are, by his point, embroiled with TIE Beta 1 and TIE Gamma 1 (and their replacements). But once they go down - Delta-class JV-7 Escort shuttle E/S Tough (three ships) shows up. Escort shuttles are a modest problem for most fighters because they have a rear turbolaser... and T/Fs have no shields! It's thus very nasty and very easy to die against them. And to get the bonus objectives - we have to kill them.

But - bugger that for a game of soldiers, no sense in doing all the work yourself, is there? Legging it behind the platform and interposing it between you and them means that PLT will deal with them - you just have to stay alive long enough.

Sometimes, the TIE manage to take a shuttle or two out. But not today. After a miniute or so of watching Beta and Gamma 1 blunder about (Stele already proving his "worth" clearly...) I had to go help, and ended up killing all three shuttles. And then run back to the station. I didn't positon myself all that well, though the PLT opened up on E/SHUs as they approached. I got cocky and went to take a shot at one of them and BAM - two hits - dead.

After a brief stay in the medical bay, and Bleakbane had Gated back in time again, I tried once more...

Second verse, same as the first, save this Gamma 1 took one out, a kill-stole the third as I was about to blast it! I managed to get a much better position, this time, with the body of the station directly bewteen me and E/S Tough. and this, D-34 shot them all out. Minor problem... The station started shooting at me too! WHAT! I'm pretty sure I didn't accidently shoot them (because if you do that, ships do tend to shoot back!), so clearly their gunners were just peeved I was being lazy or something. I mean, really? I'm giving them rebels to kill! fortunately, being so close to the station, I was already in hangar bay traactor range, so I hit it just as the first hit landed and blew out the important part of my HUD...

Still, objectives acheived!

Primary Objectives:
100% of FRT group Onece must be inspected
100% of TRN group Dayta must be inspected
Secondary Objectives:
FRT Onece 3 must be captured
100% of CORT group Yander must be inspected
100% of CTRNS group Taloos must be inspected
Bonus Objectives:
100% of E/S group Tough must be destroyed
TRN Glich must be destroyed

Bleakbane popped in to have a word with the PLT gunner (I believe it was something along the lines of asking if he would like to try breathing in space, no, well, hard lines, he was going to or something).

I was promoted back to Flight Officer. Two kills, and about a 91% accuracy rating. That won't last! I find if you manage to break 40% you're doing well. One wonders why they even bother...!

After a short rest, I headed back to the briefing room for...

Mission Two: Red Alert!
This is a simple mission - fly TIE Fighter Aplha 1 (armed with 4 concussion missiles, a very nice little field modification!) and kill rebels (green) and Mugari pirates (pink) in their joint attack on D-34 with Y-Wings and X-Wings. The only tricky part is dealing with Corellian Corvette group CRV Ubote when they come in. But with a bit of care, you can blindside a CRV, though it's better to wait until the last one is going down before risking you neck!

With that in mind, I forwent the Concussion Missiles - against Y-Wings they really arne't necessary - and took a pair of Heavy Rockets instead. One rocket won't kill a CRV, but it will mostly ruin it's day. I was hoping to snag a couple of them...

Before I jumped back in, I went and spoke to the shadow figure in the corner. And, after I'd finished talking to Bleakbane, I spoke the Secret Order Monk, who told me I was destined for great things (hah! I knew that already!) He wanted me to inspect - and help capture a rebel shuttle that was expected to show up in the area. Easy job.

The mission started off very well. The first Y-Wing caught me with a glancing shot, but mercifully, not enough to do other than do hull damage. I mopped up five of them - I've have had some of the X-Wings too, but I had to rush off to inspect and disable the shields of Shuttle Scutz for Assault Gunboats to head in and disable for capture. After that, it was a case of waiting for Imperial Star Destroyer ISD Hammer to show up and tackling the CRVs.

I launched a rocket at two of them, but annoyingly, the kept targetting me as I tried to get in (yesterday I had been in a position to get behidn them) and, alrady damaged, I concetrated on dodging. Still, I managed to swing around and perforate the last one once the other two went down, so one out of three ain't bad and I did make the job for the others easier, so...

Primary Objectives:
PLT/1 D-34 must survive until other goals completed
ISD Hammer must have arrived
Secondary Objectives:
SHU Scutz must be inspected
Bonus Objectives:
100% of CRV group Ubote must be destroyed
SHU Scutz must be captured

On to Mission Three: Counter-Attack

TIE Bomber, this time, with Proton torpedoes. Another simple mission - this one dealing with a rebel and Mugari pirate meeting.

What I missed yesterday was I need to inspect one of the rebel transports - Dawn - before it is destroyed.

The first attempt was aborted early on as approaching that transport, an enemy fighter (no idea who) my ienpt escorts had not dealt with suddenly started attacking me - which wouldn't have been a problem, except the first hit took out the targeting computer (which you can fix) and the radar (which you can't unless you can call in a reload) and as you no longer have any idea of where stuff is, usually means game over. So I quit that and tried again.

Secondary try, then, starting out the same way: ordering TIE Alpha to ignore that ship and headed in the direction of the four Cargo Ferries (CARG), and lobbed a pair of torpedoes at three of them. As I closed, I passed Dawn and inspected it but left it for Nebulon B Frigate FRG Fogger2to deal with. I then mopped up two of the CARGs with lasers, and helped Alpha 2 take down the third, before finishing up the fourth solely with lasers. (Leaving six proton torpedoes left.) Fortunately these CARGs - as is often the case - were not armed. I then joined the dogfight, mopping up four Y-Wings (not averse to a bit of kill-stealing myself...!) The rebels dropped four B-Wings in. Unlucky, lads - I had some torpedoes with their names on! Dual-fire easily garentees you take a B-Wing out and Proton Torpedoes work nicely against them. I took out two on the first head-on pass with torps, and splashed another with lasers. Then the X-Wings arrived. I tossed one of my last two torpedoes are Red 2 - he dodged for a bit, but X-Wings aren't much better at dodging torps than B-Wings - and killed another two. I even had a torpedo left once I was done - that's rare!

Primary Objectives:
CARG Gallon must be destroyed
CARG Romold must be destroyed
CARG Kann must be destroyed
CARG Wess must be destroyed
TRN Prince must be destroyed
TRN Dawn must be destroyed
TRN Destion must be destroyed
SHU Xesre must be destroyed
SHU Durns must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives:
None
Bonus Objectives:
TRN Dawn must be inspected
100% of B-Wing group Gold must be destroyed
100% of X-Wing group Red must be destroyed

By mission's end, then, I had wracked up 15 out of the 21 kills the Empire made. Now, THAT'S more like it!

I was surprised, actually, my accuracy was about 60% on the last couple of missions (100% on warheads).

I easily made Lieutenant. Much faster than the first time!

On that glorious note, we have reached as far as I made my abortive attempt yesterday I think this is a good place to call the end of the first post!

(I've probably got few missions more left in me today, mind, but there IS a character limit to posts and e may as well start the discussion... Or whatever...!)

1Since The Mouse cares nothing for the truth, even to the point of pretending Thrawn did not exist, nothing he says matters at all anyway.

2Immortalised - as are many of the vessels in TIE Fighter - in Bleakbane's table-top Imperial fleet.

pendell

2014-12-19, 06:36 PM

Aotrs Commander

2014-12-19, 07:06 PM

Interesting. As the thread's apparent daddy, I think I must watch it as it goes off to school.

*Pulls up some popcorn*

*Breaks out his old secret order robe*.

Serve the Emperor above all others.

Good to see you haven't been destroyed by MY nemesis, which is following too closely behind a fighter I'm attacking and being hit by the wreckage when it comes apart.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Actually, I got clunked by some debris in that last mission - on the last kill - but fortunately not enough to kill me.

I suspect I had starfighter collisions turned off when I used to play back in the day.

Battle One, Continued

Mission Four: Outpost D-34 Has Fallen

Typical. You turn your back for five minutes, and it all goes to pot... The rebel scum captured D-34, so we must now liberate it. This is a nice easy mission. Flying TIE Interceptor T/I Alpha - and armed with twelve Concussion missiles for good measure.

To start out, there were immediately two Escort Shuttles closing in. A quick stream of fire along with everyone else, and they go down. Then its a rush over to Container Transport Gopher to inspect it, and find out the rebel scum are trying to make off with all our stuff. Attacking it gets youi turbolaser'd, so I left it to Transport Omega to capture. (And this point, the first try glitched out. Perils of my joystick if I hit one of the buttons wrong, it seems to boot be out to the debrief screen and I can't remap it.) Next, there was the bonus objective: killing E/S group Claf. This time, the boot was on the other foot. With a bit stronger hull and missiles, Claf went down very fast. Then it was a case of dealing with the A-Wings that showed up while Transport Sigma captured the station. THIS is when you accuracy drops RIGHT down. A-Wings are a pain, and the only rebel fighters I worry about. Still, with no missiles, I managed to knock three of the four out.

Only six kills this mission, but three of them were E/S and the other three A-Wings, so I made up for it in value!

Promoted to Captain (on my forth mission...) And inducted (back...) into the Secret Order. Nice job.

Primary Objectives:
TRN Sigma must have finished docking
PLT/1 D-34 must be captured
M/FRG Fogger must survive until other goals completed
Secondary Objectives:
CTRNS Gopher must be inspected
Bonus Objectives:
At least one of E/S group Claf must be destroyed
CTRNS Gopher must be captured

This brings to Mission Five: Attack Rebel Light Cruiser

Urgh. I don't like this mission at all. Plus side: Assault Gunboats. Downside, waves of rebel fighters - A-Wing with Advanced missiles if you accidently go close to the cruiser and at one point, all you cohorts frack off leaving you fighting the all alone.

First attempt today killed me when something hit me (either multiple A-Wings hit me at once Advanced Missiles or...?) Second I was being attacked by upteen A and X Wings (about seven or eight to one) I took the X-Wings down (disabled) but the A-Wings got lucky with missiles (they must have been firing from point blank for no sooner than I got the warning, than the missile would hit me - no time to dodge.) I just couldn't keep my shields charged. Also, I need to reconfigure the controls I do NOT want to be having to reset the Shield charge when I dump cannon power to shields every few moments - and that cost me precious seconds when I needed to be chasing the enemy to get a shot off.

I think that will have to do for the day - the next two missions are a serious drag and a time sink.

GloatingSwine

2014-12-19, 07:28 PM

Might be nice to grab some screenshots, they do liven up a lets play. Remember you can record missions with the mission camera so you don't have to grab them live.

Aotrs Commander

2014-12-19, 08:58 PM

Might be nice to grab some screenshots, they do liven up a lets play. Remember you can record missions with the mission camera so you don't have to grab them live.

I do keep meaning to do that, but evey time I start a mission, I forget to turn the camera on...

That said, I do recall having some... difficulty with the TIE Flight recorder the odd time I uses it, wherein it recorded all the ship movement, but played the mission all by itself completely differently, so I ended up with a lot of frantic screen chasing nothing... Must try it to see it again.

I'm actually not entirely sure that there wasn't a function for screenshots in TIE itself (unless it was in one of the later games) that was a later addition and not in the manual...

And on googling (nothing), and then reading the Readme file on the CD drive, there is: Alt-o, which saves the screen shots to a different file every time. That was quite well remembered, seeing as I probably last read about it some time in 1996-7...!

I'll try a bit harder to remember to do so for next time.

Forum Explorer

2014-12-19, 09:18 PM

Cool. Let's see some Rebels burn.

pendell

2014-12-19, 10:55 PM

Tip: Don't forget Shift-S will request reinforcements. I don't believe you forfeit any mission goals for using them, and they can really save your potato. What's the point of being Imperial if you can't bury your enemies under your superior resources?

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Aotrs Commander

2014-12-20, 10:19 AM

So, first job today was fiddle with the joystick. I finally actually tried googling to see if there was some proper confi software to go with the 16000M (the 3D pro had it with in on CD) - and lo and behold, there was! So I tweaked the confi#g up and have a much better set-up.

I tried Gunboat Mission 1 to a) test the joystick settings and b) try and road-test the screenshots and the flight cam (and, I noticed possibly the dosbox save-state).

I mapped the screenshot command to the keyboard, and got some shots. It is a long mission (about forty minutes) most of which is fighting five A-Wings. Having managed it, with the flight recorded running all the way through, I reviewed the footage and tried grabbing some screenshots with the in-game command. And then I tried saving it and the game aid it couldn't find the CD and crashed out, which also wasted the last forty minutes of time, since it didn't record more success. (Also, towards the end, it also went totally off track, failing to blow up a disable X-Wing and thus spawn in the A-Wings, which would have meant the rest of the recording was just my gunboat flying around shooting at empty space a lot...)

(And the save-state totally didn't work either. Eh, it was worth a shot.)

Annoying. Very annoying.

So it looks "screenshots if I can remember" is about it (though actually, I still keep ndging the left hat, so maybe it I map THAT to screenshots, we'll at least get some accidentally...!)

It also sometimes takes a while to get the joystick to configure properly without drifting... Not quite sure what the trick is other than to keep trying and not exit the game once it's settled...!

Okay. Aside from losing the last edit, we have reached a complete impasse on mission 5 (which by the way, is probably the the mission is dislike the most in the entire game). There are just WAAAY to many enemy vessels with advanced missiles in the bonus goals. The gunboat just can't dodge them and it they shoot more than one at you at once - it's over. They are also moving to fast I can't turn and burn to try and shoot them down. Fighting A-Wing in a gunboat is hard enough, but the advanced missiles are just beyond a joke. I've tried about six more times on Hard and two attempts on Medium (exactly the same problem). The reinforements don't even apprciably help, since they die as fast as I do.

So. We basically have a chice here, since I could play for days before I got anyhere and it's not even a fun mission. We can abandon the "get all the medals" and just shoot for the completeion (and as many of the frackers as I can take out before getting blown up) on hard (score over shiny), work on the basis is the MonCal cruiser Lulsa can cheat and be invulnerable this mission we can too, once the primary/secondaries are out of the way (shiny over score, and also, it is a cheat... Bare in mind I am not above that by any means when a game stops being fun - i it wants to be cheap, so will I...) and/or try at Easy (I shall try that next and see if it's even possible, but I won't progress until we reach concensus).

(It's worth noting that I don't think when I played in my youth (and was even less patient) I ever managed this mission's bonus goials with invulnerability.)

Nope, decision was taken out of my hands after that last medium run, as I must have clicked the wrong button and now it's moved on to mission 6 and I can't restore back. Crud. Well, we're stuck with it now, dammit.

Plus side - screenshots!

Mission 5: Attack Rebel Light Cruiser
(Mode: Medium)

The first part of a two-phase attack, Assault gunboats are to strip the fighter defences from the rebel cruiser Lulsa. (Why they don't just send in the whole lot to take it out with all the rebel fighters on board? Your guess was as good as mine and indeed is the way it works in nearly every other mission in the game.)

The primary objectives are easy: take out B-Wings X-Wings and few A-Wings and a couple of transports. The Secet Order also wants the containers inspected before being destroyed by the second wave. This part is tricker, because get too close to the Lusa and five A-Wings with advanced missiles come out to murder me specifically.

Shooting B-Wings is nice and easy...

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay002_zps26f99dd4.png

Die, rebel scum!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay001_zps0b7ead70.png

The only thing funnier is when the transports try to attack you... Transport Leven here demonstrates how well that goes...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay004_zps65c0c6e7.png

And here, about to die for the umpteeth time due to advanced missiles from A-Wing Gold, X-Wing Blue or the third A-Wing group that shows up
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay003_zps1e31ff34.png

Primary Objectives:
100% of X-Wing group Red must be destroyed
100% of B-Wing group Gold must be destroyed
100% of A-Wing group Blue must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives:
100% of CN/C group C440 must be inspected
Bonus Objectives:
100% of X-Wing group Blue must be destroyed

Well, so much for that "all medals run." Now I think I know why when I did that on my second playthrough, I was playing on Easy...!

GloatingSwine

2014-12-20, 01:07 PM

Aotrs Commander

2014-12-20, 01:17 PM

Best way to deal with missiles is to map a joystick button to space and press it as soon as you get the launch warning, then turn towards the missile and shoot it down. By the time you've done that the enemy is probably too close to lock again.

I know. The trouble is, the advanced missiles were coming in so fast that by the time I hit the button when I got the warning... They'd already hit me. I know it's not just incompetance, because I used to manage in the old days, when I was flying the other starfighters... I think perhaps this is just a case of them coming in far too soon - I think the slow speed on the gunboat (especially when you're trying to keep your cannons - and shields charged) is just not quite enough to dodge them - especially when you get two or three fired at you at once. I'm not sure I could have done it when I was at by best. The odds (five-to-one if you're lucky enough not to get attacked by X-Wing Blue and A-Wing gold at the same time) are also against you, since you find eventually, one of 'em will get far enough a way to get a shot off, and the you're on the defensive (and at those ranges, you just don't have time to dodge).

I can handle five-to-one A-Wings to GUNs or T/As... Just not when they have advanced missiles as well.

Next mission will have to wait a bit, since I won't have time to do it (I suspect) before I have to go out.

As a quickie mission, I headed off to the combat chamber for:

TIE Fighter Training Mission 4: Destroy Probe
(Why four? because I knew it was relatively quick).

The mission is simple - blow up a rebel probe. The problem is, you're in a TIE fighter and rebels keep popping in to hurt you!

The first one is an X-Wing, followed by Assault Gunboat Nu. I could have just whizzed past, but you may as well kill it as not. Once that went down, two A-Wings showed up. These rotters have concussion missiles, so you have to be careful. Fortunately, having a four missiles yourself, you can usually take out one of them as they close. Then a trio of X-Wings come in. I died the first time hee, a on of tem cuaght me in a lucky shot.

Second try, one of the A-Wings rammed me...

Third try, I dealt with all of them, and headed over to the probe and blew it up. Then I turned round and headed back to CRV Astin (another one immortalised in Blekabne's tabletop fleet).

A nebulon B showed up, and started disgorging Z-95s. I let the GUNs handle the first ones as I ran back to the safetly of Astin, where it could provide additional fire support, and then turned around to help kill them.

Sadly, I caught a glancing blow, which knocked out my radar. (I HATE that, it' basically game over.) I bumbled around a bit, and managed to knock another one or two out, but when you have no idea of 3D space or which way to turn if you can't see them... you don't last long.

Time ran out at this point.

Primary Objectives:
Probe PR-V74 must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives:
100% of X-Wing group Blue must be destroyed
Bonus Objectives:
100% of Z-95 group Red must be destroyed
100% of Z-95 group Blue must be destroyed
100% of Z-95 group Gold must be destroyed
100% of Z-95 group Striker must be destroyed
X-Wing Red 1 must be destroyed
100% of A-Wing group Gold must be destroyed

pendell

2014-12-20, 02:07 PM

Aotrs Commander

2014-12-20, 07:55 PM

I will be happy with a run that completes primary and secondary goals; some of the bonus objectives in later missions

Such as keeping the Adarga or Kuuztin's Courageous intact

Are extremely difficult; you would have to replay repeatedly, and who has time for that?

Yeah, I think - especially now having lost the nopportunity to do a "perfect medel" run anyway, I'll stick to just grabbing the ones I can. Especially since I'll generally be playing on hard.

I suspect the a wings with adv missiles exist solely to discourage us from trying to kill the Lulsla early; we aren't seriously expected to defeat them.

My approach to the probe mission is different; all power to engines, fly to probe, redivert to weapons, blow up the probe with one hit, power back to engines, back to Astin. I save heroics for when I have shields!
Respectfully,

Brian P.

Trouble is, they sometimes come out even if you don't get close to the Lulsa anyway (as does the flight of three A-Wings)... plus the X-Wing Blue - the actual mission goal - is about four waves of five /X-wi9ngs, also all with advanced missiles. Admittedly, X-Wings are SOO much easier to kill, but even so.

Also, though a balance point of note: if you don't bother with the training missions, this is the first time in the game you have enemies shooting missiles at you, and they start off with the most dangerous warhead you can face? What's with that? Difficulty step much...!

First off, to make sure the joystick was calibrated, I had another run at

TIE Fighter Training Mission 4: Destroy Probe

I did exactly as before, save that this time. I ran and hit behind the corvette and let the Gunboats mop up. The idiots though they let the last one get away! Z-95 Striker 4 took damage and headed off home. I desperatly tried to reach it in time, but it was merely half a second from the hangar when the frigate blew me up.

DAMMIT!

Primary Objectives:
Probe PR-V74 must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives:
100% of X-Wing group Blue must be destroyed
Bonus Objectives:
100% of Z-95 group Red must be destroyed
100% of Z-95 group Blue must be destroyed
100% of Z-95 group Gold must be destroyed
100% of Z-95 group Striker must be destroyed
X-Wing Red 1 must be destroyed
100% of A-Wing group Gold must be destroyed

Onto proper warfare, then, and back to the campign:

Battle One, Missions Six: Destroy the Lulsa

This time, the mission is simply to desroy the Mon Calamari Light Cruiser Lulsa - in its MASSIVE minefield - and secondarily to capture the shuttles containing their officers.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay006_zpsd71bf8bc.png

Appraching the first mine on mission start...

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay005_zps955f775b.png
(You can see the Lulsa more clearly in this one - I didn't actually call for reinforcements, I'd just hit the button by mistake... they wouldn't have helped anyway...!)

I started out trying to destroy the Lulsa too early, hammering it with heavy rockets. After the third or forth time that got me immediately killed, I switched to torpedoes (the better to shoot down the transports later). That aso got me killled the first time, so I then just contented myself taking out the fighters. By the time I'd done that, and had disabled one A-Wing and one X-Wing, everyone else was dead, and the Lulsa was on 36% shields.

Idiots.

So I started the labrious process of clearing the minefields (disabling the Type-C mines which fired missiles on destruction) so I could have clean run at the Lulsa, but during the process it got lucky and landed several hits, one of which damaged the engie. Instant death.

So, the next attempt, I went back to heavy rockets, planning to unload them right out the bat again and then deal with the fighters, and hopefully I might even be able to disable the Lulsa (after that, it's all easy.)

The Lulsa apparently had magic gunners, though, since since EVERY SINGLE TIME it managed to get a lucky hit, it took out my engines and killed me.

Which is REALLY FRACKING ANNOYING since my IDIOT compatriots cannot EVER managed to even knock it's shields out (they barely got it below 50% this time) meaning I have to frack about killling the mines while it's shooting at me.

FRACK'S SAKE.

Once more...

OH FOR [EXPLETIVE]'S SAKE!!!!

The rest of the them failed to reduce its shields to less than 42%. So I was clearing the damn minefield so I had a cat in hell's chance to take a shot at it with my heavy rockets and it fracking hyperspaced out!!!

Raaargh!

Next try, I aimed for something different: on starting out, I maintained my speed and throw one heavy rocket at each of the Lulsa's two warhead launchers. This attempt aborted very quickly, as the A-Wings came out almost immediately, and as I was dogfighting one, I got too close to the Lulsa. As in I saw the A-Wing ram into and explode about a half second before I did...

The NEXT try, FINALLY, the Dark Side woke up. I repeated my warhead attack, and went straight on to clear some of the mines. I then went on to disable the X-Wings and two A-Wings and cleared some more mines. With the warhead launchers down, Transports Sigma and Omega actually DID THEIR DAMN JOBS and knocked the Lulsa's hull to critical. (I have been content for them to take their shields out so I could disable it with one pass and get the kill myself, but whatever.) I then tracked the shuttles and transports - mindful of the mine field and the dying Lulsa... Though by the time I'd pulled around into Shuttle group Derris to disable them the Lulsa had exploded. I disabled both shuttles, ran down both groups of two transports.

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay007_zpscbff7896.png
I had some heavy rockets left, so I thought "why not?" and used them on the Transports at point-blank range.

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay009_zpsa48e7a46.png
I then assisted in taking out the containers (more kills...)

And then went off to destroy the disabled rebel fighters (no way was I letting anyone kill-steal anything else!)

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay008_zps6f59324a.png

This is how I like my A-Wings: helpless! Aaaaaaaahahahahaahaa!

I then went back to help the remaining imperial fighters to polish off three Y-Wings (one with a heavy rocket because why not...) - the other fighters had managed to take down ONE A-Wing between all of them... And then went about the tedious but now MUCH safer task of clearing the minefields

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay010_zps1f3bb910.png

Don't help me or anything, then, rest of Imperial fighters. Bastards.

It took a couple of passes and resting outside range to recharge, but eventually the job was done and the Day Was Saved, Thanks to the Assault Gunboat Taus! Or something.

Primary Objectives:
CRL Lulsa must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives:
100% of TRN Starway must be destroyed
100% of TRN Gargon must be destroyed
SHU Derris 1 must be disabled
Bonus Objectives:
100% of Mine group MX-A must be destroyed
100% of Mine group MX-B must be destroyed
100% of Mine group MX-C must be destroyed
100% of Mine group MX-D must be destroyed
100% of Mine group MX-E must be destroyed
100% of Mine group MX-F must be destroyed
100% of Mine group RQ-A must be destroyed
100% of Mine group RQ-B must be destroyed
100% of Mine group RQ-C must be destroyed
100% of Mine group RQ-D must be destroyed
100% of Mine group RQ-E must be destroyed
100% of Mine group RQ-F must be destroyed
100% of Mine group RQ-G must be destroyed
50% of SHU group Derris must be captured

Out of the 17 kills made, I made 12 (all but one A-Wings out of the nine enemy fighters... four transports, and a container. While the others grabbed the kill for the Lulsa (like they could have done it without MY HELP!!!) and two containers. Good job lads. By-the-By, apparently there were 46 mines...

I noticed that in nearly every attempt, Tau 2 got blown away almost immediately. You see what I mean now about Maarik being comically inept...?

Harkan, the treacherous bugger, was now making a deal with the rebellion... Meanwhile I was recieved with great glory by the Empire for finishing a battle! 5 medals for both secondary and bonus objectives so, that wasn't too bad. I also was inducted into the Second Circle of the Secret Order. By the end of Battle One, I had wracked up a respectable 98 kills.

On to better battles: the Sepan Civil War!

pendell

2014-12-21, 02:42 PM

Aotrs Commander

2014-12-21, 06:32 PM

Well done in finally killing the Lulsla.

My solution to something like the Lulsla is 1) Knock out its dual warhead launchers with infinite ammo. That makes everything much easier. 2) If the Empire is taking too many losses from a capital ship point defense, I remember that the individual weapons emplacements are targetable; most turbolasers can be killed in one hit regardless of shields. A few turrets require multiple hits, but they can wait until the one-hit-wonders have been reduced.

Clearing the ship defenses on even one aspect makes everything MUCH easier. SEAD Suppression of Enemy Air Defenses (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suppression_of_Enemy_Air_Defenses) is a critical mission in both the TIE Fighter and real world universes, even if they're also the most dangerous mission in both worlds.

Respectfully,

Brian P. .

I'm not sure it does have infinite ammo, you know. By the time I was the only Imperial left in the earlier runs, while it was killing the crap out me with turbolasers, it didn't shoot any missiles at me...

Battle Two: The Sepan Civil War
Battle One: Respond to S.O.S.

My first mission was to fly TIE Fighter Alpha 2 to assist a Riplobus (pink) convoy under attack by the age-old Dimok enemies (blue).

The trick here for the bonus goals is to do a lot of inspecting and not worry too much about the convoy. And then not get killed by Escort Shuttles...

It took SEVEN attempts...

The first two attempts I was killed by the Escort Shuttles later in the mission trying to be too aggressive. The third attempt I managed I got as far as suriving the E/S to find the list of bonus objectives I'd looked at was actually wrong and I needed to inspect the Dimok ships... Try again...

So for attempts four through seven, I adopted the following strategy.

Throttle up and inspect Modified Correlian Corvette M/CRV Falx...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay011_zps40a6e0f1.png

...CARG Mangonel (which was often destroyed ten or twenty seconds later by T/B Beta's torpedoes)...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay012_zps6a88874c.png

... and then pick off a Y-Wing or two (and not worry if they attack the convoy too much... in the worst case they reduced one of the ships to 19% hull - in fact, I found their attacks helpful).
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay013_zps5a868a7c.png

By this time, CARG Delphine would have arrived, so off to inspect that.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay014_zpsd5c84e8c.png

At about this time, too, the Dimok would have suffered 25% casualties and would be running home to Mummy. Primary mission objectives completed!

Now to inspect the Ripoblus convoy, Modular Convery CNVYR Asbo 1-3... (Heehee! "Asbo!")
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay015_zps5339553f.png
... to discover the dirty little ratbags have got Imperial Arms aboard!

As Transport Epsilon is dispatched to disable and capture them, I helped make their job easier by stripping away any shields... ignore the warning lock. No good locking on me if you don't have any guns to shoot me with, lads!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay016_zps28fa1949.png
You're welcome, Secret Order Guy! See, politeness gets you everywhere!

Then transfer all power to engines to whip over and inspect Mon Cal Light Cruiser Falaricae, while Epsilon now can easily disable all three transports, pretty much in one pass.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay017_zpsfd22bec2.png

And here was where it always got sticky. Three Escort Shuttles would show up, one after another, all flying in to attack TRN Epsilon. Trouble is... I'm in a TIE fighter. With no warheads this time! Now, fortunately, I'm not alone - the TIE Bombers have swapped in Concussion Missiles and that enormously hepled. As I sprinted back from the CRL, they'd usually take the first one out.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay018_zps84c63039.png

So, by this point we're up to attempt four. Attempt four and five ended exactly the same ignominious way - despite extreme heroics in attacking the next two E/S, I was killed by their exploding debris hitting me in the face! What are the chances? Attempt six got me killed on the turbolasers again.

But finally, I nailed both the frackers personally (and dodged like billy-o)!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay019_zps73122f51.png

HAH! Suck on that, E/S!

Then it was a simple matter of waiting for TRN Epsilon to finish capturing the convoy ships and go back to the VSD Protector...

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay020_zps3c47f87a.png
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay021_zps12053d77.png

... And then follow suite.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay022_zps22a0b9e5.png

Primary Objectives:
25% of all Dimok craft must be destroyed
VSD Protector must survive until other goals completed
At least one of CNVYR group Asbo must survive until other goals completed
Secondary Objectives:
100% of CNVYR group Asbo must be inspected
Bonus Objectives:
100% of all E/S must be destroyed
CRL Falaricae must be inspected
CARG Delphine must be inspected
M/CRV Falx must be inspected
CARG must be inspected
CNVYR Asbo 3 must be captured

My promotion to Commander was well deserved after that, I felt...

Mission Two: Intercept Attack

Another one that took several attempts - more or less soley because of the mission objectives and the general incompetance of my wingmates. The Riplobus are attacking a Dimok station. Fighting them off is easy - but the hard part is inspecting the Dimok station and knocking it's shields down so that Transport Epsilon don't die trying to disable it. I was flying TIE Bomber Beta 2, and opted once again foir Heavy Rockets rather than proton torpedoes.

The first modus operandii is to use one (or two) heavy rockets on Assault Transport ATR Sabre as it hyperjump right in front of me.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay023_zps2b3cb935.png

After that, to unload the other two or three heavy rockets on a target, then rush back to Victory Star Destroyer Protector to meet the Combat Utility Vehicle to reload as Modified Nebulon B Frigate M/FRG Dromand turns up to attack. If you catch it right, you can unload a continuous stream of rockets into the frigate while the utility vehicle reloads you.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay025_zps339febf7.png

Once that's down, hopefully the PLT's shields will be low or down, so you can whip past and inspect it and TRN Epsilon can capture it and the container with weapons and the remaining TIEs - and maybe you - keep the last escort shuttles off it.

This is much easier said than done. Annoyingly, as usual with TIE Fighter, it is largely down to luck whether it comes together or not (and you know what my luck is like.) I tried several permutations of stratagy: after taking out ATR Sabre, I could unload on either M/CRV Galliot or M/CRV Selander.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay024_zps6d6badd5.png

I even tried throwing rockets at the platform several times. Once the PLT was destroyed by the Ripoblus as they retreated, the other I as splashed by the PLT's turbolasers I went to inspect it. If the station's shields wee even reasonable, TRN Epsilion both got destroyed.

The final attempt did not start off well. I went after M/CRV Selander and lauched two rockets at it (which killed it) and then headed back to the Protector. The CUV was playing up, not reaching me a sensible place for some reason, not moving fast enough and meaning either it sat there taking hours to move into me or I met it right under the VSD where I couldn't get a good shot off. In addition, the last two or three time, my heavy rockets didn't target properly (don't know why, I never had the problem before) and went off instead of tracking onto the Frigate. Which wouldn't be a problem if the game suddenly stopped letting me shoot more. In frustration, I flew closer and managed to get a couple of rockets off and finish it with guns (amazingly, it didn't shoot back).

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay026_zpse164ac07.png
Just before my ill-fated rocket attack began...

With a full load of rockets, I headed to inspect the station. This time, the Ripoblus had done a good enough job - finally - to recude it's sheidls down to 10%. A quick pass to inspect it and the containers, and got some range and fired two heavy rockets. I then ended up embroiled with the Escort Shuttles, but mercifully managed to not die and get some distance.

It was at this point I forgot I had to inspect Shuttle Toten, which was nearly at it's FTL point. With a quiet scream, I slammed all energy into throttle, but I was sure I wasn't going to make it. But the Dark Side was with me... Either I'd unknowingly inspected it at some point earlier as I was skipping through targets, or I caught it just as it accelerated to hyperspeed past me. Either way, the job was done. To my enormous relief, I heard the Transport report the station was disabled. And then it was just a case of staying away from the E/S until the other TIEs took them down (I'd already caught a glancing blow from the station, so wasn't prepared to risk it) until TRN Epsilion finished boardering...

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay027_zps6ebe4d2a.png
...and made it home.

So, not bad, then: I would have liked to kill the other M/CRV, but it hypered away as I was appraoching. Still, given everything else, one more kill was just being greedy.

Primary Objectives:
25% of all Riplobus craft must be destroyed
VSD Protector must survive until other goals completed
CN/C Lab Module ? must survive until other goals completed
PLT/1 Youst must survive until other goals completed
Secondary Objectives:
CN/C Lab Module ? must be inspected
PLT/1 Youst must be inspected
Bonus Objectives:
SHU Toten must be inspected
TRN Epsilon 1 must complete mission
TRN Epsilon 2 must complete mission
M/FRG Dromon must be destroyed
CN/C Lab Module ? must be captured
PLT/1 Youst must be captured

Still, for my efforts, I made the Third Circle of the Secret Order, so there was that...

Aotrs Commander

2014-12-24, 11:38 AM

Time for one last post before Christmas!

Battle Two: Mission Three: Rescue War Refugees

A nice easy mission for once!

T/I Gamma 2 was to escort two SHU and one System Patrol Craft containing Ripoblus refugees to the VSD Protector, fending off Y-Wings and Shuttles, plus a quartet of E/S later in the mission.

Dead easy!

With no secondary objectives and easy targets, it was a simple enough affair and I did it first time!

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay028_zps10f4e05f.png
Like shooting rebels in a barrel...

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay029_zps434ac2f7.png
Almost too easy...

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay030_zpsc044819c.png
But hey! I ike easy!

Even the Escort Shuttles were not too bad - though I did get banged up a bit (fortunately, this time, the Dark Side or spirit of Christmas season was with me or something, since I took no system damage).
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay031_zpsaa6fedbb.png

Primary Objectives:
VSD Protector must survive until other goals completed
SPC Glas must finish docking
Secondary Objectives:
None
Bonus Objectives
100% of E/S group Typhon must be destroyed
100% of SHU group Nazaar must complete mission

And on to the next one!

Mission Four: Capture Enemies

Another mission that is easy on the surface, harder underneath.

Assualt Gunboat Nu 2 is help disable two shuttles, one of the Ripoblus and Dimok to capture their leaders as they meet. You must keep Z-95 Headhunters off of TRN Omega 2 while they board and capture the shuttles (Escort shuttles are in the area, but no-one ever seems to go after Omega 1...) This can be tricky, but the final part is the real killer - you have to inspect two frigates, one CRL, two (armed) CARGs and an M/CRV.

This is the part that tends to get you killed, as all but one Frigate and the CRL are hostile, and Gunboats are not great at dodging...

The first part was nice and easy...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay032_zpseda260a8.png
Target and disable shuttle Phantelle...

...and then kill Z-95 Adam as fast as possible (as you don't want them hanging around later in the mission.) on the last successful run, I disabled Adam 3, hoping it might stop any more coming in, but no help... I missed one, by the time Z-95 Baker and Charlie arrived. Killing them is a priority, since they always go after Omega 2. I took thgem all out with pairs of Concussion Missiles to be certain.

As soon as that was done, Omega 1 and 2 were soon out of the picture, and of home. The next job was to rush over to Nebulon B Frigate Shemsher and inspect it before it ran to hyperspace. (I cut in close enough on the penultimate attempt I inspected it AS it was accelerating to hyperspeed...!)
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay035_zpsf1e85a37.png

Then I punted all cannon over to engines and high-tailed it over to the Mon Cal Light Cruiser, which would run to FTL next...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay036_zps343210bb.png
Right, that's the need-to-do-quickly but easy part over.

Time now to mop up Adam 4, who I missed earlier and whom I did NOT want following me while I buzzed hostile capital ships.

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay034_zps01744a25.png
BOOM. Idiot. You shoulda gone home...

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay037_zps21616a2e.png
M/FRG Manus Ferre was closest, so I dashed through that next, doging like crazy.

I then, after getting killed about two seconds before I inspected the last ship last time, carefully skirted around it, and aimed for the first Cargo ship, taking time yo pump my shields and recharge my cannons as much as possible before getting into range.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay038_zpsc1dba5e7.png The two CARGs and the M/CRV are in a V formation, with the M/CRV at the back. So I made one pass over both CARGS, taking a fair bit of fire, and pulled out just enough to get some shield power back before rushing past the M/CRV.

After that hair-raising moment, I could then go back and finish off both disabled shuttles...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay033_zpse43e904a.png

...and Adam 3, because a kill's a kill, right?
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay039_zps5a489a22.png

Primary Objectives:
TRN Omega 1 must complete mission
TRN Omega 2 must complete mission
SHU Keydon must be boarded
SHU Phantelle must be boarded
Secondary Objectives:
CARG Glaive must be inspected
M/CRV must be inspected
CARG Godendag must be inspected
Bonus Objectives:
CRL Falaricae must be inspected
M/FRG Manus Ferre must be inspected
FRG Shemsher must be inspected

So, turns out after all my hard work (nailing nearly a whole squadron of Headhunters single-handed, for good measure) t'werent the Sepan leaders after all, but their children. And now we have to heavily reinforce and pacify the united peoples.

Crud...

Now, from memory, the bonus objectives for the next mission are a real bugger (another damn CRL again), so while I'm going to take a shot at it, I will have to be going out to start Christmas proper-like before I will have tme to post up the results... if any!

(Edit: ahahahahaha, no. I was wrong. You're in a TIE Fighter, and on of the o0bjectives is to destroy a CRL. Yeah, I'mma not goin' to try that one until I have a LOT more time to hand!)

So this will be the last one for a bit, since I am hoping to get some new games at Christmas. So it will probably be the new year before I post again.

pendell

2015-01-05, 10:07 AM

Aotrs Commander

2015-01-05, 10:28 AM

Watching anxiously for the rest of the story.

As towards the CRL ... there is a big, big difference between flying an X-wing and a TIE fighter. The X-wing encourages heroism. You pretty much have the ability to destroy everything else in the battle area, given enough time.

The fragility of the TIE fighter means it's not a ship for heroes. Instead, it's a ship for a person who is playing one part of a combined arms team. The TIE fighter does its job of destroying other fighters and elementary patrol. Destroying capital ships is the job of bombers or other actual capital ships. But charging a CRL with an unshielded craft is a recipe for suicide, regardless of how good the pilot is.

ISTR that the solution in this case is to allow bombers to kill the CRL rather than do it personally. I'm trying to remember just what we can do to help them, but at most I would plink at the individual laser ports, stripping away the CRL defenses , opening an entire aspect of the craft to attack. Then let the bombers do their job or huddle in the self- created blind spot and plink away until it blows up.

But ,realistically, I wouldn't do it at all. An assault on the CRL represents an unnecessary risk, and it is not vital either to complete the mission or to end the war.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Haha! Talk about co-incidence... I had a few minutes, so I was just going through the thread and re-linking the screenshots - I had to move them into a seperate folder in photobucket, as for some reason they were taking up the front couple of pages of my default folder, despite not being the most recent pictures - and I find in the time I've been doing that, you posted!

I haven't forgotten this - evidently! I have have Beyond Earth for Christmas, and picked up Tropico 4 at stupidly reduced price (and also bought Pokemon Alpha Sapphire), so my time has been split between them. That said, I am on my second game of Beyond Earth, though and the constant reloading (which takes forever - on top of the normal amount, if I'm fighting a war, I have to quit to windows and go back in about once every 2-3 turns because it keeps losing the weapon special effects) is starting to grate...! So depending on how things go, I might well have another crack one evening or at the weekend. (You posting is also making it more likely, since it's a bit of impetus!)

Yeah, I'm not putting up much hope of dealing with the CRL, certainly not on Hard! Even trying to shoot some turrets out is VERY risky in a T/F, since you only need one glancing blow and SPLAT! TIE Avenger, yeah, Gunboat or T/D even better (ion cannons!) It's been a long time since I've flown that mission, though, so I have no idea how much competance my fellow imperials will be showing. I suspect about the best I could do is try and keep the other fighters off them and keep my fingers crossed. Maybe I can get a shot or two in...?

I can garentee, though, if at any point it does go down SOMETHING will doubtless magically kill me (so I can't eject or something) seconds later, because random chance fracking hates me...

Over the break, though, I dug out my old Starwing fighter rules that I wrote (based on XWA back in about 1999 which we haven't played in about 14 years, played with the micromachines stuff that was readily availble from my local poiunds shops at the time) and we had a play - a rebel attack on Escort Carrier Spite, as modelled in fold-flat cardboard pop-up style. (I think my mate took a couple of photos on his phone, I'll see if I can get 'em and link 'em at some point.) Pretty much mutual destruction, since the rebels took the carrier out, but it was very likely that the TIEs would have mopped them up before they got away - meaning that only GUN Tau MIGHT have made it home if they would have survived the final fire phase. (We had to call it - we started late, and it had been a long time since we played - but another bound would have about finished it off.)

pendell

2015-01-05, 10:30 AM

It's been a long time since I've flown that mission, though, so I have no idea how much competance my fellow imperials will be showing.

My own recollection of this game is that the standard mook imperial pilots show roughly the same competence and skill as lemmings jumping off a cliff. Even an Imperial "victory" has an unpleasantly high casualty list.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

GloatingSwine

2015-01-05, 06:43 PM

My own recollection of this game is that the standard mook imperial pilots show roughly the same competence and skill as lemmings jumping off a cliff. Even an Imperial "victory" has an unpleasantly high casualty list.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

To be fair, so did the rebel pilots in X-Wing.

A TIE Fighter might not be the ship of heroes, but you're still basically left to do it all yourself.

Crow

2015-01-05, 08:07 PM

Well it only takes about 3 direct laser hits to blow up most of the TIE models. Once you get into the advanced models, your wingmen fare a little better.

Unless you're in an Assault Gunboat. Then you know the mission is going to be a meat grinder for everybody.

There is no easy blind spot on that cruiser. The best you can do to help is link up with the bombers and as you reach turbolaser range make sure you're the first thing the turrets can shoot at. Then sweep away from the bombers, juking as you go, while keeping yourself in the arcs of the turrets.

Basically think of it like being a vietnam-era wild weasel.

pendell

2015-01-05, 09:14 PM

Basically think of it like being a vietnam-era wild weasel.

IIRC the wild weasel job was the single most dangerous job you could do in an aircraft.

Ah, there we go (http://www.militaryhistoryonline.com/vietnam/airpower/wildweasel.aspx).

The purpose of the "Weasels" was to seek out and engage NVA SAM sites, and if possible destroy them. Often times though, the only way the Weasel pilots could locate a SAM site was by getting the NVA to fire a SAM at them, thus revealing their position. Tantamount to a suicide mission, the Weasel missions were amongst the most dangerous sorties of the war.

Of course, weasel pilots had anti-radiation homing missiles to destroy the SAM radars. A tie fighter pilot has ... well, nothing really, except turbo lasers which have a shorter range than those of a capital ship.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Aotrs Commander

2015-01-06, 07:44 PM

And we're back!

Battle Two: Mission Five: Guard Resupply

Okay, first off - I admitted defeat here. After about three attempts at the mission, I decided that trying for the bonus goals was just not worth the amount of time I'd have to sink in trying. (Especially as as I got into the third attempt, I realised my joystick calibration was off and felt very heavy - given it'd taken me several attempts to configure it (TIE's VERY touchy about it and if it decides it's not having it, you have to quit the mission to recalibrate it). So, I decided that if I managed to survive to the end of the mission, I'd just write this one off - like Battle One Mission Five as just not feasible without hours of time.

Let's see why, shall we?

Your objective is to fly TIE Fighter Alpha 2 and oversee the transfer of TIE Advanced to VSD Protector from Escort Carrier Tropsobor.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay040_zpsc565f75b.png

Very shortly, a Dimok CRL shows up with a M/CRV and starts launching Headhunters. The kicker is, one of them from group Killam (aha.Very funny.) is carrying missiles as will head straight to you. So you basically have to fly head-on at it and fire to take the missile out and hope you don't get killed in the exchange of head-to-head fire (which I did the first time - and took damage the second). Killem also basically ruin your chances of getting the T/A through with no casualties.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay041_zpsd05dc6e8.png

Once that's out of the way, you can maybe managed to tackle a couple of other Headhunters before Y-Wings start showing up to attack the carrier. Which for some bizzare reason, doesn't use any weapons to fire back. Not really noticing the joystick problem yet, I managed to die the second time by getting to close to the exploding Y-Wing.

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay042_zps2e6c82bb.png
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay043_zpse24d7a97.png

There's a modest number of Y-Wings, so I was kept busy kncking them down from Tropsobor, until they decided to start attacking the VSD. Meanwhile, my idiot compatriots were failing to protect the T/As and failing to damage the CRL. By the time T/A had got through, the TIE Bombers and Interceptors were all dead, and Headhunters were still coming. As I came under fire from two or three of them (struggling because of the joystick) - a glancing hit knocking out my lasers - I bit the bullet and called for reinforcements. I took out a couple, than made a run for my secondary objective, inspective Shuttle Omlaut.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay044_zps2a9d5a0c.png

I found one more Headhunter going after me, and managed to take it out.

While I sat, now pretty much helpless, save for a nearly-dead Alpha 3, the Ben Het, still with shields, gracefully sailed to the exit.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay045_zps686c159e.png

Gun Tau, useless as they were, attacked the M/CRV... And both died.

Gun Rho hypered in and succeeded in taking out the Ben Het's shields... But of course without any decent pilots, they didn't disavle it and thus died too.

Then it was just a cae of sitting and watching the Protector to splash the two Dimok CARGs that showed up, take out the dozen Ripoblus Escort Shuttles from FRG Shemsher...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay046_zpsc5550b82.png
...and the latter to bog off.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay047_zpsf16b5d53.png

After a long internal debate, I decided to cut my losses. I couldn't properly dogfight without reclaibrating the joystick anyway - but that was no garentee of being able to stop enough Headhunters to improve on the job of finishing more bonus goals. Maybe on easier difficultly levels, taking out the capital ships might be possilbe, maybe if I tried loads more times I might have saved the T/As... But I decided it just wasn't worth it for a T/F mission.

Still, fifteen kills, so there was that...

Primary Objectives
75% of all T/As must complete mission
VSD Protector must survive until other goals complete
ESC Tropsobor must complete mission
Secondary Objectives
SHU Omlaut must be inspected
Bonus Objectives
100% of all Z-95s must be destroyed
100% of all Y-Wings must be destroyed
CRL Ben Het must be destroyed
FRG Shemsher
CARG Suoi Tre must be destroyed
CARG Can Giouce must be destroyed
M/CRV Long Tan must be destroyed
100% of E/S group Raven must be destroyed
100% of E/S group Seakyte must be destroyed
100% of T/A group AA must complete mission
100% of T/A group AB must complete mission
100% of T/A group AC must complete mission
100% of T/A group AD must complete mission

(I am pretty sure I only ever managed to complete this mission 100% even on medium by using invulberability...)

That was the end of the Sepan Civil War.

I earned four secondary and four bonus goal medals, but that was it.

On to a MUCH more fun battle:

Battle Three: Battle on the Frontier

I like Battle Three. It has Thrawn in it, and I alwasy managed to get every goal on this one. Let's see if in hindsight, it's as rosy as my memories...

(Before that, I had about four tries at TIE Fighter mission 2, which as I recalled, was a fairly easy one. After the forth time the Y-Wings managed to kill me, I gave up...)

Mission 1:Load Base Equipment

I was assigned to TIE Bomber Alpha 1 (armed with 8 Concussion Missiles) to go and inspect a load of containers, and keep escort the Heavy Lifter group Mule as they carried them back to VSD Stalwart.

Easy. No - really. Dead easy!

The rebels showed up with a single Y-Wing...

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay048_zps56011a52.png

BOOM!

As a few more rebel fighters trickled in, and the TIEs from Vanguard assisted me in taking them out, TRN Scouter - my bonus objective showed up...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay049_zps59e15190.png
...and died in short order.

As I turned back to escort the heavy lifters, a shuttle dropped in to attack me...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay050_zpsdfa241e7.png
... And I didn't even mage to take it out myself, what with all the dozens of TIEs following me around...!

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay051_zps9d9402b9.png
We mopped up the last of the Y-Wings easily.

Then I guarded the heavy lifters.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay052_zps312a6459.png

The rebels made one more attack with a force of X-Wings and B-Wings.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay053_zps6e9ad894.png
They too, went down neatly.
Back to guarding the lifters, until the settled home!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay054_zpscef41168.png

Once they'd docked and I was heading to the hangar myself, a lone A-Wing showed up, vectoring in one me.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay055_zpsa3b6e8b2.png

Sadly for him, with all the other fighters around - and me having a quartet of missiles left, the straggler went down too!

Primary Objectives
VSD Stalwart must survive until other goals complete
100% of CN/A group THX 1136-A must be inspected
100% of CN/D group THX 1137-D must be inspected
100% of CN/B group THX 1138-B must be inspected
100% of CN/D group THX 1139-D must be inspected
100% of CN/D group THX 1140-D must be inspected
Secondary Objectives
HLF Mule 1 must complete mission
HLF Mule 2 must complete mission
HLF Mule 3 must complete mission
HLF Mule 4 must complete mission
HLF Mule 5 must complete mission
Bonus Objectives
TRN Scouter must be destroyed

100% mission success, and I was promoted into the Forth Circle!

Why can't more missions go that smoothly!

Mission 2, on the other hand, is virtually IMPOSSIBLE on Hard mode - the difficulty spike from Normal is clearly MASSIVE here (let alone from the first mission). I have had to simply abandon it for the moment - it has taken I don't know how many attempts. Almost as soon as you enter the mission, Headhunters shoot missiles at you (which is fatal about 50% of the time). And if you don't ignore them, a group of X-Wings and Headhunter with heavy rockets attacks your frigate. If you don't shoot down the Headhunters and rockets IMMEDIATELY, the Frigate will take so much damage, it will be impossible for it to survive the final rebel attack later. So, you basically can't even get STARTED on this mission unless you are lucky enough that the Headhunters don't shoot missiles at you right away, which the sometimes don't or be lucky enough to kill one as it comes in. Then you have to not get killed later, stopping Y-Wings (and three X-Wings which come after you personally) and THEN B-Wings before you can stop them destroying the frigate and hope the computer decides it's not going to get lucky (because with HUGE number of ships attacking you personally this mission, you simply can't avoid taking some damage - I'm pretty damn sure the Y-Wings keep attempting to ram you - and the lucky shots will eventually just add up and kill you.)

About the only way I can see to complete the mission is to basically game the mechanics and sit about over the containers until the one that's captured it so and then blow it up and IMMEDIATELY quit the mission before the Frigate is destroyed and you fail your primaries. Which is a pretty stupid way to go about things.

pendell

2015-01-07, 12:15 AM

It's probably just as well. In-game, peace between the factions requires balancing their strength. Taking a Ripoblus light cruiser off the board might tilt the balance of forces sufficiently to force a Ripoblus surrender -- which I don't think is in the Empire's interest.

There's some real subtlety here -- Admiral Harkov was tasked with ending the war. Instead, if I'm reading correctly

He was deliberately fanning the flames of the war, both by shipping Imperial equipment to both sides and by deliberately taking heavy-handed actions which would inflame the two sides. He did this so he could justify requesting reinforcements such as the TIE Advanced. The additional ships will come in very useful when he eventually defects to the Rebel Alliance.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Aotrs Commander

2015-01-14, 06:33 PM

And we're back again... (It seems as though Wednesday will be TIE Fighter eveing...)

It nearly wasn't though. TIE would just NOT calibate the joystick today. After about half-and-hour and fiddling weith all sorts of joystick settings, I was just about to give up and then on the very last try, it suddenly smacked in. As I was configuring in TIE Fighter Mission 2, I had a jolly good go at it. I was so surprised, I nearly forgot to take any screenshots!

Training Mission 2: Flight Leaders and Wingmen
This time, due to unforseen competance on the part of my wingmen (and me not going after the Heavy Lifters too early) we managed to succeed - with one exception... One damn A-Wing arrived but fragged off before we could get at it.

After that annoyance (and failed bonus objective) it was just a case of mopping up the heavy lifters as ISD Colossus arrived.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay056_zpsf0bf9521.png

Oh well. It is only a training mission...

Primary Objectives:
75% of all X-Wings must be destroyed
75% of all Y-Wings must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives:
100% of all Heavy Lifters must be destroyed
Bonus Objectives:
100% of all X-Wings must be destroyed
100% of all Y-Wings must be destroyed
100% of CN/E Group Xi must survive until other goals met
100% of CN/E Group Pi must survive until other goals met
100% of CN/E Group Chi must survive until other goals met
100% of A-Wing Group Gold must be destroyed

And then back onto Battle 3!
Battle 2: Destroy Pirate Outpost

Oi vey... This took some doing.

As I said last week, the major prboblem is on hard, right from the outset, you are personally attacked by Z-95 Headhunter Red 1 (and 2) who have concussion missiles. Simultaneously, M/FRG Ludwick is attacked by X-Wing and Z-95 Gold, who are carrying Heavy Rockets and Proton Torpedoes respectively. So, in order for Ludwick to not be killed later, you HAVE to intercept them before they can do too much damage. Meaning, about 50% of the time, you are killed by missile hits before you've gone five minutes.

After another umpteen attempts dying, I decided what the hell and called for reinforcements. TIE Bomber Delta showed up. "Greaaaat," I thought. "More bombers, just what we need." Turns out they have Concussion Missiles! I still died - DAMN Y-Wing rammed me, but at least I had a better chance now.

So. The final run. By this point, I had it down to an artform.

Start mission. Call for Reinforcements. Select enemy attacking me (Z-95 Red 1) and order the rest of T/B Alpha to go kill his face. Switch to rockets and fire a pair off at CRV Clavier (which would kill it), the closest enemy target.

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay057_zpsc5ad9799.png

Then immediately swing around to charge towards Gold group. I targetted the X-Wings first after I realised that I ws mistaken last week - it's them who have the heavy rockets. I found that if I did that fast enough, as I closed, I was in position to spray the first salvo of heavy rockets and - with a bit of luck - take them all out. Pray. (This was the point Red 1's missile usually killed me, but I got away with it this time.)

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay058_zpsfe301e76.png

I paused long enough to deal with Z-95 Red (with assistance from T/B Alpha and Delta)...

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay059_zpsbd60f6b8.png

... And then concentrated on dealing with the rest of the enemy fighters. With T/B Delta's missiles, suddenly this was WAY easier, and Ludwick got through the first stage with 8% shields!

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay060_zpsbf6fc15a.png

I WASN'T as lucky though, as the last damn Y-Wing hit me with a lucky shot and KO'd the CMD. It could have been worse (the radar screens), but not by much. But nevertheless, I gritted by teeth and carried on, spinning back to deal with the last CRV.

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay061_zps7dac6670.png

Then I desperately tried to get in to inspect the containers (a job made harder because until I realised the Z key display still worked shortly afterwards, I had no idea which ones I was expecting.)

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay062_zpscfdeca15.png

Thankfully, I appeared to manage it... as ATR Tiger headed over to capture it.

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay063_zps3eba0ea9.png

I meanwhile rushed back towards the Ludwick for the final round... Which wasn't long coming.

But again, T/B Delta proved their worth - we still had quite a few TIE Bombers left, so the Y-Wings started out going for T/B Beta, meaning I could fall on them nice and easily...

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay064_zps0d822f9a.png

...And then attack the X-Wings before they could do much more to Ludwick.

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay065_zpsba441652.png

Then the B-Wings showed up. I left the others to mop-up the X-Wings and did my damnest to break up their attack run.

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay066_zpsc897ce38.png

I took one out - with my CMD down, it was a lot more difficult than usual - and load of shuttles showed up. I headed back towards the other B-Wings, but the others killed them pretty fast. It was a bit touch-and-go with the shuttles, since they were a) trying to kill me and b) I had no idea how close they were and was fully expecting to be rammed to death. But no, we took them out - actually the other bombers did most of the work, since I was being very cautious! I like to think I was at least setting them up!

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay067_zpsfe8c79df.png

And then they were all gone. Smirking, I started heading back to kill the last four containers, now ATR Tiger was done.

And then...

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay068_zpsf68d75e2.png

Oh HELL, NO.

I was not dogfighting A-Wings in a nearly crippled TIE Bomber. And yeah, they were coming after me personally.

So I did the sane thing. Cannon enegy to engines Ran Like Buggery. That wouldn't keep me safe but it would buy me some time...

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay069_zpsebdd47ae.png
to use my last four heavy rockets...

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay070_zps657a38bf.png
...on all four...

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay071_zps33a2450a.png
.. containers, thus completing my primary objectives quickly and efficiently! Normally, i'd have used lasers, but I wasn't taking any chances! (I figured that if I knobbled the containers, if the A-Wings killed me, it didn't matter at this point, all the goals were completed.)

But to my amazement, while I was doing that, T/B Delta and company killed all three A-Wings! DAMN guys! That time I really WAS setting them up, and boy, did it work!

With that out of the way, I could then safely limp back to the Ludwick!

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay072_zps2bb926d1.png

Primary Objectives:
M/FRG Ludwick must survive until other goals complete
CRV Leach must be destroyed
CRV Clavier must be destroyed
CRV Grapler must be destroyed
100% of CN/A DLC11A must be destroyed
100% of CN/A CRM908A must be destroyed
100% of CN/B CG-78 must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives:
CN/A CRM908A ? must be boarded
Bonus Objectives:
ATR Tiger must have finished docking

I managed a fair 14 kills out of 39 - most of the rest, I suspect, at the hands of T/B Delta! I was promoted to General - much deserved after that, I think - but I definitely recommended T/B Delta for promotion as well! Damn it, they should have been out first, not as reinforcements!

Battle 3: Hold Position
Simple mission - apparently... Fly T/F Alpha 1 (with 8 Concussion Missiles) and defend the Ludwick until reinforcements arrive.

Okay... first up is a Nebulon B Frigate, the Huntress.

"Attack, it Alpha 1!"

Are they serious? In a TIE Fighter!? I'll pass...

First pass is nice and easy. But no bonus goals, since the shuttles I'm supposed to destroy didn't show up... Oh, they were serious about attacking the frigate. Crap.

So, I replaced Concussion Missiles with Heavy Rockets (again...)

Thus began the usual litany. When I did't die from being rammed (damn you Y-Wings B-Wings and on at least on occasion, T/I Gamma!), the Huntress escaped.

"'Kay," says I. "Looks like we're going to need the reinforcments again, aren't we?"

So this became the new plan of attack.

As soon as Huntress shows up, call for reinforcements (TIE Bombers) and lob the heavy rockets at it...

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay073_zps8747f128.png

... turn around and head back to Ludwick to get some distance.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay074_zpsa998e682.png

When the first group of B-Wings launched, I sent the rest of T/F Alpha after them, and myself went for the first pair of Y-Wings (to hopefully once again shoot down their warheads if they fired 'em before I reached 'em).

Then began the task of dogfighting with all the rebel fighters, starting with those attacking the Ludwick (and keeping an eye open for the odd Y-Wing that went for me.)
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay075_zps275209ab.png

Here, I was either killed by ramming enemy fighters, or the Huntress escaped, until the last couple of tries (when I called for reinforcements a bit later). This time, the bombers actually knocked it's shileds and hull down low enough to launch SHU Escape. Sadly, I had somehow got too close to the Huntress and while I was trying to extract myself from the Y-Wings and the shuttles themselves, Huntress picked me off.

On the last attempt, however, where I'd been very late with reinforcements (I'd been holding them off for a bit and then just... forgot!), I happened to be further away! (The Huntress still got away, I must add, but never mind.)

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay076_zps61b5c353.png

So I dealt with the shuttles - and the insistent Y-Wings and X-Wings - nicely.

Then... tragedy. The convoy arrived - primary mission objectives completed! And as I watched, the X-Wings launched heavy rockets and proton torpedoes at the Ludwick. I desprately tried to shoot them down, but to no avail too far away. Within mere seconds after achieving victory, the Ludwick was destroyed.

FRAG DAMN.

Still, it was a win, so I took pleasure in butchering the last of the rebel and pirate fighters - especially the X-Wings, damn them.

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay078_zpse8ca1107.png
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay077_zps34b61770.png
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay079_zps8fa105da.png

And then all I could do was fly back to VSD Stalwart (for once, T/F Alpha 1 didn't have so much as a scratch on it, amazingly) and mourn the loss of the M/FRG and it's crew... and all of my stuff, dammit!

(It took me, again, enough attempts I wasn't prepared to go back and do it again, having achieved all the bonus goals...!)

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay080_zpsc08b7170.png

Primary Objectives:
M/FRG Ludwick must survive until other goals completed
100% of CARG group Bakkun must have arrived
100% of M/CRV group Horvus must have arrived
100% of CNVYR group Gorfan must have arrived
100% of FRT group Ravn must have arrived
VSD Stalwart must have arrived

Secondary Objectives:
None

Bonus Objectives:
100% of SHU group Escape must be destroyed

I wracked up 17 kills, I think (ten of them Y-Wings...!) Not bad work. Vice Admiral Thrawn is pleased too, and that's what REALLY matters!

(Ye gods, if this is what the missions are like on the battle I remember as being pretty easy, I suspect we won't be onh Hard mode for much longer...!)

That's it for this time! Join us quite probably next week for the next installment...!

pendell

2015-01-15, 10:12 AM

mangosta71

2015-01-15, 10:24 AM

I need to figure out what the hell is wrong with my desktop and get this off GOG. I loved TIE Fighter when I had it as a kid.

Aotrs Commander

2015-01-15, 11:16 AM

Strange. I don't recall having near this amount of difficulty with these missions. Maybe it's because I was playing on Medium...? Or has the collector's edition version of the missions been reworked compared to the original DOS game?

At any rate, Kudos on surviving some very tough jobs! You're working for Vice Admiral Thrawn , now, right?

Respectfully,

Brian P.

I don't, either. I'm sure it is the difficulty spike for Hard. (Which I suspect is indeed adding things like more missile-armed enemies going after you personally and upgrading or adding more stuff with heavy rockets instead of proton torpedoes. Also, I'm 95% sure I had starfighter collisions turned off in those days, which would account for about 33% of all the deaths while flying unshielded TIEs...)

Yep, this is Thrawn's debut in TIE!

I need to figure out what the hell is wrong with my desktop and get this off GOG. I loved TIE Fighter when I had it as a kid.

Just be aware the GOG version is the 1998 version, which has non-interactive music (and not even the original score, though there are fan mods to at least get some of that back) and that it doesn't have all the features of the 1995 collector's CD ROM (which I'm playing); apparently it doesn;t have battles 11-13.

factotum

2015-01-15, 11:17 AM

Strange. I don't recall having near this amount of difficulty with these missions. Maybe it's because I was playing on Medium...? Or has the collector's edition version of the missions been reworked compared to the original DOS game?

Yeah, I remember TIE Fighter being rather easy when I played it 20 years ago, at least compared to the absolute hell in a bucket that was X-Wing (a game I only completed via massive amounts of savescumming and cheating myself two Veteran wingmen for every mission). Of course, it may well be the "20 years ago" that's the important part of that statement!

Aotrs Commander

2015-01-15, 11:59 AM

Yeah, I remember TIE Fighter being rather easy when I played it 20 years ago, at least compared to the absolute hell in a bucket that was X-Wing (a game I only completed via massive amounts of savescumming and cheating myself two Veteran wingmen for every mission). Of course, it may well be the "20 years ago" that's the important part of that statement!

Also, it may be also partly due to the fact I'm doing on on Hard AND trying to get all the bonus objectives - I did that last mission first try, no problems without doing the bonus goals.

(Finally, I am somewhat out of practise with flight sims, and my general level of gaming competance is... questionable.. at the best of times! It says something about TIE that is is one of the VERY few games I'm prepared to play above normal difficulty!)

Triaxx

2015-01-15, 01:12 PM

Very cool LP. If this and Dungeon Keeper 2 are two of the three best of all-time, what's the third?

Aotrs Commander

2015-01-15, 02:01 PM

Very cool LP. If this and Dungeon Keeper 2 are two of the three best of all-time, what's the third?

Dungeon Keeper 1.

DK2 was, overall, just not up to even distantly the same level as it's predessor. There were a few nicities in there (the humorous random comments being the best), but it just wasn't nearly as good.

The third is, of course, the still-as-yet-unequalled Planescape: Torment.

Aotrs Commander

2015-01-21, 06:25 PM

Onward!

First off, today's "have a go at the mission while we gte the joystick calibrated" was TIE Fighter mission 1. Blow up containers, shoot moving targets and then fight an increasing number of enemy fighters (Headhunters, then X-Wings.) I think I did manage it once, but it's basically just luck, since law of averages says eventually, glancing blow will kill you...

Did alright this time, though got up to Headhunter Dodec - but 12:1 is a bit much...!

To Battle Three, Mission Four!

Battle 4: Guard Space Station NL-1

I will be flying Assault Gunboat Tau 1, to protect the new station NL-1... and... the... Ludwick...?

IT'S A MIRACLE!

HAH! Must have been one of Thrawn's brilliant plans to make the rebels THINK they destroyed the Ludwick, when really they didn't! Some sort of clever thing where they detonated some combustibles and buggered off to hyperspeed or something!

That's completely believeable, right?

Well, actually... kinda is, isn't it?

Mission says proton torpedoes. Now, given what I've realised, that probably means heavy rockets are a better option, but we'll go with protons the first time...

And as it happens, the only time. Hurrah! A nice, easy mission again! Now, THIS is what I remembered Battle Three being like!

First up, Y-Wing Gold showed up, with some Modified Corvettes in tow. Some A-Wings did shortly thereafter, but after a moment of debate, I decided to leave them and concentrate on the attack craft. Which was well, since I shot down their first spread of torpedoes as I closed.

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay081_zpsusagrkbz.png

I then went after Y-Wing Blue. I hit one with a proton (because I took a shot as it and that was the weapon system I had active), which proved to me a proton can't quite one-shot a Y-Wing, but makes it easy to finish with guns. Good to remember.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay082_zpsiutvytix.png

Then I remembered to chase towards the station to put it into the memory and find out who was attacking - X-Wing Blue. I chased them down, firing at the three of them sequentially so they broke off their attack run and then mopped them up.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay083_zpsg74w9kgw.png

I happened to be pointing at one of the Corvettes after that, so I unloaded the requisite six protons to take that out.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay084_zpsyfszpneo.png

And then conveniantly, our secondary and bonus goal objective, Shuttle Shakkar tried to escape. Shuttle vrs Gunboat. Oh dear... So in seconds, Shakkar was inspected (bonus goals)..
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay085_zps9bvlyt4y.png

...and disabled. If only it was always that easy!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay086_zpsn9hmhmna.png

The remaining M/CRVs were now attacking Ludwick, and again, I was in prime position. Leaving Ludwick to handle the first one, I launched my last five protons and then finished it with cannon fire before it even really knew what hit it.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay087_zps8pgd63ww.png

Finally, three Transports were attacking the station and once more, they were basically passing right by me!

And a one...

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay088_zpsxe17nobf.png

...and a two...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay089_zpsc8ccgnmx.png

...and a three!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay090_zpsthvk1b49.png

(Hey, I even took 'em down in order! Neat.)

At this point VSD Stalwart arrived, completing the primary objectives. Which just left one last loose end to, aha, TIE up... A-Wing Blue.

I hate fighting A-Wings in Gunboats...

But that doesn't mean I can't do it!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay091_zpsaviaoiaj.png
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay092_zpsrs6l8rlv.png

And then back to VSD Stalwart in time for tea!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay093_zpslxzvnzwu.png

Primary Objective:
PLT/3 NL-1 must survive until other goals complete
M/FRG Ludwick must survive until other goals complete
VSD Stalwart must arrive
Secondary Objectives:
SHU Shakkar must be captured
Bonus Objectives:
SHU Shakkar must be inspected

Twelve out of eighteen kills (including two of the M/CRVs). Not bad! The platform was down to 10% shields (and it started at only 50%) and Ludwick was down to 76%.

Battle 5: Thrawn inspects NL-1

Ooer. The Man hisself is a comin' for an inspection of the NL-1. Better look sharp, T/B Alpha! (Unlike some OTHER Imperials, Thrawn doesn't need to "motivate" us with his powers - he does that just by showing up!)

We're using Advanced Missiles. Ohh-ho, YES! Muahahahaha!

Double load. And reloads! Ahahahahaha!

So, of course, the first time went perfectly, until one of the [expletiving] bonus goal shuttles rammed me. And then the second attempt, my idiot companions missed an A-Wing and it shot me with a missile.

Third time lucky, then (and just to prove it was just bad luck the first time...)

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay094_zpsp7fcozst.png
*salutes*

(Noting that, of course, Thrawn is in the no. 2 transport!)

The rebel attack begind with three A-Wings. And then three more. And then three more. If I didn't have advanced missiles, I'd be worried... Expereince on the first and second try said to ignore Red 1, which was attacking the platform (?) and go for Red 2 and Red 3, which were aiming for T/I Gamma.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay095_zpsayn3hta8.png

I threw a missile at each, and then turned to the Y-Wings which had just showed up to attack the station.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay096_zps1ufxbiwm.png

Once they went down a pair of missiles a piece, I turned to X-Wing Gold and assisted NL-1 in taking them out with another missile each. (TIE doesn't count assists, unfortunately, since that's what I mostly got this try. Generous soul that I am, setting people up...)
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay097_zpsqegdg8oq.png

Then I went and helped mop up X-Wing Yellow the same way. One blasted X-Wing smacked me with explosion debris, which wasn't good. Fortunately it didn't take out anything important or kill me this time, though.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay098_zpsvn0eucbc.png

Thrawn was on his way back to the Stalwart at this point when the Pakuuni Shuttles showed up. (We hadn't done as well as the first time, as at this stage there was a single X-Wing left - briefly. The first attempt, we'd cleared 'em all out.)
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay099_zpsjqjrzwnh.png
No. Bad shuttle. We do not attack Thrawn!

I splashed Gamer 1 with my last pair of missiles and then shot down Gamer 2. (Clearly, not very GOOD gamers, were they...? Maybe "gamer" means something lese in Pakuuni? "Blithering idiot" perhaps?)
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay100_zpsa1stqece.png

Shuttle Noway proved a bit more tiresome though. By this stage, TRN Omega - and Thrawn were safely home and everyone else was going home too, leaving me to deal with all three.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay101_zpspghghd3x.png

So, naturally, one of 'em got a lucky shot as I was trying REALLY hard not to ram or be rammed by the frackers and took out my CMD. Again, though, while this was serious, they WERE only shuttles at the end of the day and the biggest danger is the aforementioned ramming. One of 'em was a kill-stealing [expleteive] though, killing his mate before I could! I don't know whether to laugh at his incompetance or be mad he stole my kill...

Mad, I think.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay102_zpsx8t8tfk2.png
I don't think so, Noway. We don't steal MY kills.

And that was the bonus goals!

Primary Objective:
PLT/3 NL-1 must survive until other goals complete
M/FRG Ludwick must survive until other goals complete
TRN Sigma 2 must complete mission
TRN Omega must complete mission
Secondary Objectives:
None
Bonus Objectives:
100% of SHU group Bliss must be destroyed
100% of SHU group Gamer must be destroyed
100% of SHU group Noway must be destroyed

Only 10/26 kills this time (probably quite a lot more assists, though), but we're aiming for mission objectives, not Bestest Score/Kills.

A brief pause to extract the middle part of my second ATR from the 3D printer (pictures of the ATRs, TIE Defenders and Missileboats I've been 3D printing will doubtless come at some point...!) and we have just about enough time for one more.

Battle 6: Wait for Relief Forces

Now NL-1 is finished, we just have to protect it with GUN Tau until Thrawn shows back up with the Stalwart. And... protect its two System Patrol Craft.

Crap.

This is gonna be a [female canine] isn't it?

Suggested load is Protons again, and once again, I'll try 'em the first time around, since supposedly there'll be a lot of transports as well as ATRs. Heavy rockets are great (and have the best damage output/payload of all the munitions) but they are best against capial ships and sometimes you want something a bit more mobile. We'll see...

Okay. Bad start. Shuttle Electra shows up right away simply miles out and buggered off real quick. I failed to take out the ATRs on the first pass AND got caught up with A-Wings before I could get to the TRNs. Abort, retry...

Switch to heavy rockets and turn race straight for Electra at mission start, I think...

Second try I still ended up with Protons. Dammit. I managed to disable Electra this time, but Transport Rover killed the SPCs.

Third try, I went with heavy rockets. I managed to lauch one each at ATR Thunder as I passed, whipped over to TRN Rover, leaving Tau 2 to tackle Rover 1 and took out Rover 2 and 3 with a rocket a piece.

And then the station got blown up.

DAMMIT!

Forth try!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay103_zpsiqzjr6ey.png
Off goes VSD Stalwart...

And in come the rebels.

As before, I headed right out for ATR Thunder. As soon as my shields were maxed, I transferred power back to engines and accelerated and chucked a rocket at each. (Though they missed on the first pass, heavy rockets DO have some homing ability, because I got 'em later.)
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay104_zpsdzat4xyf.png

I screamed past - this time no A-Wings paying any attention to be towards SHU Electra. TRN Rover appeared as I passed the ATRs, so I dispatched Tau 2 to go attack them (which kept the A-Wings off me). As I reached Electra, I put max power into the cannons and ion'd the ever-living crap out of it.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay105_zpschxkmodf.png

Netx priority was again TRN Rover. Power back to engines, and I bolted over. This time, I got lucky, and came up RIGHT behind Rover 2 and 3 as they flew in formation, shooting at something and put a heavy rocket right up their tail-pipes. I chased after Rover 1, and was just ordering Tau 2 to break off and attack the A-Wing on his six when it killed him. I flashed past and hit Rover 1 with another rocket. Again, luck was with me,as the A-Wing didn't go for me instantly, enabling me to not even slow down, but sail past and scream over to ATR Taxel...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay106_zpseu13pv2x.png
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay107_zpsnahwjde0.png

...and put paid to their attack on the station with two more rockets.

I then could start mopping up the X-Wing that was now on my tail...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay108_zpsq7nes22x.png

..and the equally insane Shuttle, just as our own TRN captures Shuttle Electra, completing both secondary and bonus objectives.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay109_zpsu7plwksh.png

...and then help with the clean-up as the convoy returned.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay110_zpsfqbuwapz.png

Question - can we take out an A-Wing with a heavy rocket?
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay111_zpstdovj90o.png
Nope, but by 'eck, it didn't half TRY! Guns, then.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay112_zpsehjsh37d.png

And back to the Stalwart in victory!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay113_zpsoohgqkds.png

Primary Objectives:
PLT/1 NL-1 must survive until other goals complete
SPC Ranger 1 must survive until other goals complete
SPC Ranger 2 must survive until other goals complete
VSD Stalwart must arrive
Secondary Objectives:
SHU Electra must be captured
Bonus Objectives:
TRN Shark must have finished docking
SHU Electra must be inspected

As you can see, NL-1 took a bit of a pounding, but survived, but the SPCs were this time untouched. I got ten out of twenty kills. Only a couple of fighters (one X-W, one A-W), but all four ATRs, all three transports and that one shuttle (and Electra captured to boot). Good job!

Medals all round, commendations, a sector now fully secure against the rebel scum and I was promoted to the Inner Circle!

Yeah, that's more like what I rememdered Battle Three being like!

At this stage, we have 212 kills (42 of which are Y-Wings! Ahahahahah!) and 17 captures (and one craft lost).

So, next week we will dip into Battle Four!

Which, off the top of my head, I don't remember. On a quick look at the briefing map, it's the one that I think involves us getting tractor beams. I can't actually remember anything about the battle itself though, so this should be interesting!

factotum

2015-01-22, 03:23 AM

Out of interest, does the version of the game you're playing have all 13 battles (including Defender of the Empire expansion), or is it just the original seven?

Aotrs Commander

2015-01-22, 04:26 AM

Out of interest, does the version of the game you're playing have all 13 battles (including Defender of the Empire expansion), or is it just the original seven?

It's the Collector's Edition CDROM (which I purchased for a fiver, probably the best buy I ever made) so is arguably the "definitive" version with everything.

I literally couldn't run the original, since I don't have a physical floppy disk drve anymore - and the 1998 re-release which I also have (of which the gog re-realse is basically) has updated graphics, but butchers the music and apparently only has battles one through 10.

Crow

2015-01-22, 05:16 AM

This thread has inspired me to load up TIE fighter again. I have the collector's cdrom. Don't know if it has the updated graphics, it would appear not. Having iMUSE totally makes up for it though. I never realized how much that system helped to immerse you. I get voiced mission briefings too, which is pretty awesome for its time. :)

factotum

2015-01-22, 07:11 AM

but butchers the music and apparently only has battles one through 10.

I think 10 might be the actual number--apparently Defender of the Empire only added 3, could have sworn it did more! Really should go and get the GoG version (I've heard they provide both versions, incidentally--the DOS one with the proper music, and a Windows one with MIDI stuff instead).

Aotrs Commander

2015-01-22, 11:45 AM

I think 10 might be the actual number--apparently Defender of the Empire only added 3, could have sworn it did more!

That's because there were two expansions, Defender of the Empire (battles 8-10) and the later Enemies of the Empire (11-13), both of which (plus the doubled resolution and all the improved cinematics and voice-overs) you got with the CDROM version.

factotum

2015-01-22, 05:09 PM

Ah! So, does that mean that neither the 1994 or 1998 versions that you get when you buy the GoG version provide those additional 3 battles?

Crow

2015-01-22, 10:04 PM

Which one has the best resolution? I'm playing the cd rom collector's edition, and my max is 640x480

factotum

2015-01-23, 03:41 AM

Which one has the best resolution? I'm playing the cd rom collector's edition, and my max is 640x480

The original DOS game ran at 320x200, so 640x480 is better than you'll get from the 1994 version.

Aotrs Commander

2015-01-23, 04:00 AM

Ah! So, does that mean that neither the 1994 or 1998 versions that you get when you buy the GoG version provide those additional 3 battles?

Could well be, unfortunately.

I'd question why on Earth that the 1998 re-release didn't have everything on it, but I suspect the answer is obvious... Cut so they could make room for the waste of time that was the CD music instead of the much more compact midi iMUSE. I just glad I never got rid of the original or anything.

However, a quick look on Gog says that you get both expansions - but apparently only the 98 version has the enimies of the Empire expansion. (Which means as it's not the full 95 version, it is porbably missing some of the extra bits, but may still at least have al 13 battles - provided you play the windows, not the DOS version. Wierd.)

Edit: TIE fighter has been lying to us for twenty years. I just went and confirmed it. TIE Defenders emphatically do NOT have 200 SBD shields. It says they do, but they don't. I just went and tested it in TIE Defender mission 1 and one of the Gunboat missions. I both cases, I let them shoot missiles (regular, not advanced) missiles at me. In both cases, when they hit, the shields went from green to red in the outer layer. Which says the GUN and T/D must have the same shields. (This also explains why you can kill a T/D with a pair of advanced missiles of an advanced torpedo.) So why the heck does all TIE's documentation say it's 200? The briefing says the shields are the new "fast recharging type" which I think will require some experimentation to see if there is a difference.

Edit: Actually, it seems worsde than that. On a preliminary analysis, it takes twice as long for the T/D to regenerate it's shields (by either method by the by, I have again proven that recharge via shield power is quite utterly worthless) as the T/A. I'll have to run another tes with GUN later, but there is a danger the T/D was SUPPOSED to have 200, but only has 100 - or there is something very odd going on with the missiles.

Aotrs Commander

2015-01-23, 07:07 PM

Addendum to the edits above.

I spent a bit of time this evening doing a load of experimentation.

For twenty years, I have worked on the basis that the T/D as of TIE Fighter was a superlative fighter, so powerful it was broken for multiplayer, nearly at the pinnicle of the Empire's fighter program.

Now I'm not so sure.

What shields does a T/D have? XWA gave it 100, but TIE always said it was 200.

The problem is, as I've been experimenting - I don't think that's actually TRUE.

I've been running some test in TIE between the GUN, T/A, T/D and MISS, going into some of the early training missions and fiddling around with the power and timing it.

Some things of note.

1) The GUN and T/D take about 7-8 minutes to recharge from zero to maximum shields on full recharge. The MISS takes about 10... and the T/A takes about four.

2) All vessels recharge all their cannons from zero to full in about 32 seconds at maximum recharge.

3) The GUN takes 5 full cannon charge tracks to bring it from zero to maximum shields. The T/A takes two-and-a-half, the T/D 3.5 and the MISS 6.

(Incidently, this proves that shield recharge above normal is absolutely pointless, as cannon => shields is much faster.)

I also attempted to get shot with one (regular) missile at full shields.

Both the GUN and the T/D were taken down to red on the outer layer. The MISS, when shot by an advanced missile, goes down to green on the inner layer. (I hadn't contrived to get a missle shot at a T/A yet.)

This would be consistent with the layers being 50/50 (that is 50/50 in the front arc and 50/50 in the rear arc), being reduced to 20/50 in the former pair and 60/60 to 0/60 in the latter.

I also made sure I shot a a fully-shielded T/D (on T/D mission one, where I could obligingly get one to stop for me). It reduced the shields to 96%. After it had recharged, a single advanced missile hit reduced it's shields to 40%.

I know from prior experimentation that a single shot is about 4 damage in XWA, and like the warhead damage, that hasn't changed from the earlier games.

The evidence is somewhat worrying.

A T/D takes 4 damage and goes to 96%, and takes 60 damage and goes to 40%. Which it can only do if it had 100 SBD shields. Notably, it has the same recharge time asthe GUN, and appears to show the same amount of shield loss as they GUN when hit by a regular missile.

Notably, the GUN's 5 full recharges (x 4 guns) => twenty, and the T/D's approx 3.5 recharges (x 6 guns) => 21... which suggests accounting for the rounding, it is twenty. The same.

The T/A, on the other hand, takes half as long to charge it's shields. This suggests either it has half the shields of the GUN and T/D, or has some sort of fast recharge.

I went and experimented with the T/A in T/A mission one and got hi by a missile. Which reduced the shields to green on the inner layer. So it appears it has less shields than the T/D and GUN... Indeed, the amount of damage taken would seem to support a 50SBD shield (25/25 => 0/20).

I haven't checked yet to see if difficulty levels make any difference (I'm playing on hard mode). I suspect they don't because I was doing a let's play of TIE and Battle 1 mission 5 and the X-Wings were hittin my GUN with advanced missiles and reducing the shields to yellow on the inner (consistent with 50/50 =>0/40) on medium as well, I'm pretty sure. (I will have to check.)

If the warhead damage is the same, though, it's pretty conclusive as far as I can experimentally determine. The GUN and the T/D appear to have the same shields... which is twice that of the T/A. Contrary to everything TIE Fighter said.

(Incidently, I can see no evidence for either TIE of any supposed "rapid recharge" shielding.)

This would also explain how you can KO a T/D with a pair of advanced missiles or a single advanced torpedo. (Which even at the time I thought was odd, since that should really have only reduced the shields to 40% and 25% respectively for a 200 SBD shield.)

The Missileboat, on the other hand, does appear to display consistency with a 120SBD (+20% recharge times in both forms of recharge, plus the evidence of the missile hits.)

So, XvT (and XWA) may actually not have modified the shields of the T/A and T/D much at all - they may have just corrected them to what they appear to have ACTUALLY been, not what TIE told us they were.

(I don't know how I didn't notice this two decade ago, really, or how anyone else hasn't!)

I'm a bit disheartened, really, since I have spent twenty years cheering on the T/D (and T/A) as ridiculously awesome and having to be toned down for the sake of cowardly rebels in the later games... To find out that, actually, it has been wrong since the start.

What is not clear is why the given values in TIE are wrong - and they're stated wrong in several places, so it's more than just one typo, and whether the intention was to have the T/A and GUN at 100 and the T/D at 200 or what.

As it happens, though, I ended up playing all the way through TIE Advanced Mission 1 (which is missile training and dogfighting.) I hadn't even properly configured the joystick, since I was really just mucking around. But YE GODs. I don't know whether it was the joystick, despite the up-and-to-the-left drift was flowing smoothly or whether it's just the T/A is so much stupidly better than the T/F, T/B and GUN I've been mostly flying but wow. Even taking six A-Wings to one (and they had missiles too) was a doddle. I suspect it's partially the latter.

TIE Advanced Training Mission 1: Concussion Missiles

No screen shots, since I wasn't really expecting to complete it (and really, as it was juts "shoot A-Wings" nothing really exciting anyway. But we can call that one done.

Primary Objectives:
X-Wing Target 1 must be destroyed
X-Wing Target 2 must be destroyed
X-Wing Target 3 must be destroyed
X-Wing Target 4 must be destroyed
X-Wing Target 5 must be destroyed
X-Wing Target 6 must be destroyed
X-Wing Target 7 must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives:
X-Wing Shooter 1 must be destroyed
X-Wing Shooter 2 must be destroyed
X-Wing Shooter 3 must be destroyed
X-Wing Shooter 4 must be destroyed
X-Wing Shooter 5 must be destroyed
Bonus Objectives:
100% of A-Wing group Duo must be destroyed
100% of A-Wing group Trio must be destroyed
100% of A-Wing group Quad must be destroyed
100% of A-Wing group Quin must be destroyed
100% of A-Wing group Hex must be destroyed

factotum

2015-01-24, 03:16 AM

Aotrs Commander

2015-01-24, 07:04 AM

I bought TIE Fighter off GoG last night, installed the 1998 version, and started the first battle on Medium difficulty. Ye gods, I don't remember it being this hard 20 years ago! I don't know if it's my aged reflexes or my old Saitek Cyborg Evo joystick being a bit stiff to turn, but I struggled mightily to get through those missions, especially if I tried to go for the bonus objectives. Took me a good 4-5 hours to finish Battle 1! Dreading what the later battles will bring.

I have found the joystick calibration can be very touchy. If you can get it so it doesn't drift, sometimes it means the stick moves like you'e flying through treacle. It appears to be basically luck as to whether or not you can get it right (or close enough to right).

(Incidently, if you get a point where even if you come ot of the mission and the curosr drifts off somewhere, Alt+C still allows you to config the joystick outside of mission, which will fix that.)

factotum

2015-01-24, 07:35 AM

Aotrs Commander

2015-01-24, 08:08 AM

I don't think it's calibration--the ship doesn't seem to drift, it just seems to be very difficult to make small, precise movements. Mind you, the fact the game will have you do stuff like destroy a bunch of A-wings while flying an Assault Gunboat doesn't help--it's near impossible to land a hit on the nimble little sods!

Ah, of course 98 version, so you probably don't have to calibrate the joystick at game start like the '95 version.

As for your earlier comments about the TIE Defender shielding--is it possible they changed this sometime between the original 1994 release and the release of the Collector's Edition that you're playing? I don't think anyone would argue that TIE Defenders were not stupidly overpowered in the original release of the game, so maybe LucasArts decided to change that.

Seems very unlikely they would make a change like that and not document it in any of the supporting material. And given TIE was single player only, changes to the T/A and T/D would somewhat scale, since it affects player and opposition (the amount of the enemy you have to fight...!)

Though you could run a quick test yourself, as the gog version comes with '94 DOS version, does it not? Just go into T/D mission one and get one of the T/D to shoot a missile at you and see how it affects your shields.

Actually, come to that, even easier, if I recall what I saw on the gog version, it said it also came with a copy of those lying Steele Chronicles, which was part and parcel of the stratagey guide. Perhaps you could have a squiz and see if it has a bit on the starship stats and what the T/D and T/A are rated at? I say this as I recall reading somewhere, it said the T/D was rated at 100SBD in that guide, which would appear to have more truth to it.

factotum

2015-01-24, 10:23 AM

I just downloaded the Stele Chronicles and they don't have stats for the TIE Defender at all, I'm afraid.

Crow

2015-01-24, 12:20 PM

factotum

2015-01-24, 03:49 PM

I changed my DOSbox joystick settings to just 2axis, and timed=false, and that took care of all my precise movement issues.

I'm playing the Windows version, not the DOS one, so not advice I can follow, I'm afraid.

Triaxx

2015-01-25, 09:15 AM

Imperial Scum should be glad they have shields, instead of complaining about the quality...

Wait, who said that?

pendell

2015-01-25, 04:25 PM

Stats or no stats, the T/D in player hands is an absolute beast in the TIE fighter games, going through X-wings like a wolf through sheep.

IIRC, the game designers nerfed the settings but that never made it into the in-game documentation; perhaps they were maintained by two different sets of people? Not an unusual thing in the industry.

Regardless, the T/D is incredibly overpowered in its initial appearance even with the nerfed shields; perhaps they dialed down the shields a touch to inject some actual element of challenge back into the game.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

factotum

2015-01-26, 03:20 AM

Stats or no stats, the T/D in player hands is an absolute beast in the TIE fighter games, going through X-wings like a wolf through sheep.

You don't need a T/D to cut through X-Wings like a knife through butter--a TIE Advanced will do that just fine! :smallsmile:

Crow

2015-01-26, 12:29 PM

Is it just me, or does it seem like any time they put you into an Assault Gunboat, the mission is going to be a meat-grinder?

factotum

2015-01-26, 03:59 PM

Is it just me, or does it seem like any time they put you into an Assault Gunboat, the mission is going to be a meat-grinder?

There's probably a reason that the third combat simulator mission for the Assault Gunboat is basically "we're now going to throw wave after wave of fighters at you, keep blowing them up until you can't blows up no more!"... :smalltongue:

pendell

2015-01-26, 04:50 PM

I think you're right. Any time they give you a ship with actual shields it's expected that you're going to need 'em :). I remember really HATING the first Lulsla mission. Eventually, I just cleared my primary objectives and hit "H" just as quickly as I could.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Aotrs Commander

2015-01-28, 06:02 PM

Long one today!

(One, I started early - largely because I completely forgot I was going to write a scenario for tomorrow's game, but nevermind, as we're basically playing the tabletop version of TIE Fighter anyway, it's hardly difficult! And two - battle four is comparitiviely easy!)

Okay, first off, I had another stab at TIE Fighter mission 4 as the calibration mission, and got killed by a Headhunnter again... Keep tryin'...

Battle Four: Conflict at Mylok IV
Mission One: Escort Convoy

Okay, escort a convoy of Cargo Ferries (carrying parts slated for new TIE Hyperdrives) in TIE Fighter Alpha 2, until Zaarin's Modifed Frigate Shamus arrives. Bad. 8 Concussion Missiles. Good. Z-95s and Y-Wings - belonging to the Nharwaak - to kill. Good. Bonus goals are inspect enemy corvettes. Bad.

First try did... okay. I managed to not die inspecting the corvettes, but the convoy took a bit of a pounding.

And then a Y-Wing rammed me.

Second and third try, the CARGs got destroyed...

On the forth try, I had the measure of it, and there's - as usual with TIE - a bit of luck in it.

Right out of the gate, the four CARGs are right in front of you, so you can just whip between them and get the inspections - and secondary goals - out of the way first.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay114_zpsdgms0oi8.png
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay115_zpsm6dzejis.png

Then the Y-Wings and Headhunters show up, along with the CRVs. The first two groups, Gold and Red only attack the TIEs. So I throttled up, and headed over to Gold group. I swung in behind them, forcing off their attack runs and then wipign them out. One lot down. At this stage, Y-Wing Blue and Yellow start appearing. A few waves of them - I wasn't keeping track - and these guys start going after the CARGs. However, it's only the lead craft that does. So the modus operandii was the moment they hypered in, I went after them, and ordered my surviving wingman (Alpha 3) to do so as well and between us we took out the lead one. I still managed to fail to stop Verack 1 being destroyed; while we were attacking Yellow, Blue got clear run. But after that first attack, they were staggered enough to manage.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay116_zps7vbnaqgf.png
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay117_zpsfvi1atac.png
This time, during the battle, I practially ran into the CRVs - the first indication was the green targeting light, but I don't think in any of the missions they actually fired at anyone! I needed to quickly inspected them - once M/FRG Shamus shows up, they die quickly. In fact, CARG Stimner were picking CRV Chaser 2 apart and I was actually concerned the CARGs would destroy it before I could inspect it!

I went to back to ensuring I killed all the Y-Wing flight leaders...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay118_zps4ruvjdwt.png
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay119_zpsjanc0en7.png
..and then mopped up. The last couple of groups - Striker and Scarlet - didn't even go after the CARGs.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay120_zpsvddvxg6x.png

After that, it was just a case of sitting and waiting for Verack 2...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay121_zpsiwkpw50a.png
..and CARG Stimner to dock. Mission accomplished!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay122_zpshqr8hpif.png

Primary Objective:
50% of CARG group Verack must finish docking
50% of CARG group Stimner must finish docking
M/FRG Shamus must survive until other goals complete
Secondary Objectives:
100% of CARG group Verack must be inspected
100% of CARG group Stimner must be inspected
Bonus Objectives:
CRV Chaser 1 must be inspected
CRV Chaser 2 must be inspected

11/33 kills (there are a lot of TIE around in this mission, plus the CARGs and the M/FRG), all of the Y-Wings. Not bad.

Misson Two: Attack the Nharwaak

Okay - this seems easy! Attack the Nharwaak supply base in TIE Bomber Alpha 2 as reprisal for the their attack on the convoy. No bonus goals, no secondary goals... (That might be a first...) All I have to do is not get killed by Y-Wings...?

The default load is Proton Torpedoes - so guess what, we're using Heavy Rockets.

(It is worth noting that Heavy Rockets are actually the best anti-ship weapon by miles; 1400 damage for standard 8-missile equivilent loadout as opposed to 600 for Protons, 900 for Advanced Torpedoes and 1300 for space Bombs. Protons are really only any use against mid-sized stuff like transports and even then there's an argument you can just use a heavy rocket - like I did to TRN Rover last week - or just use guns. Advanced Torpedoes are better, as in theory, you can use them as anti-fighter weapons and get slightly more bang for you load-out against stuff like TIE Defenders, though we'll see then we get that far.)

First job is to kill the Corvettes. Well, may as well use those Heavy Rockets! I unloaded two onto each, that that shortly took them out.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay123_zps9xmplffl.png

I moved right along to the Y-Wings. The first nasty surprise was Y-Wing Red having Concussion Missiles. Fortunately, I fired down the line as they approached and took the missile out, and Red 1 shortly thereafter.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay124_zpshb2id7ay.png

I chased after the first Shuttle, but annoyingly, it had finished delivering pilots at this point. And was making a concered effort to ram me as I killed it.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay125_zpscl39pzxq.png

And then - Red 2 starting attacking me, and caught me with a couple of shots. The last of which took out the engine.

Crap.

Still, it was a Y-Wing, so I hammered the bastard. I might have been stationary, but that just meant I was only slightly better manouverability than a Y-Wing normally! HAH!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay126_zps7gfampk9.png

The bugger still managed to clip me with one last shot (he'd had enough time to go out and turn around, with me being a sitting duck) before he died. Forunatetly, only my damage report machine was damaged... And then it was a long 90-second wait for my engines to repair. To my eternal fortune, ther were no other Y-Wings around.

As I sat helpless, one Y-Wing started making an attack run on the Shamus.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay127_zpsifykaxg2.png

I sent the rest of the squadron after him, but I needn't have bothered: Shamus was more than capable of tackling one Y-Wing.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay128_zpsuys9yrwx.png

Then I was back in action, and off I went to mop up the last Y-Wings...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay129_zpsuop7ivdo.png

...and the last shuttle. Dear Thrawn, WHY are shuttle pilots so damned insistant on trying to ram you? Did I miss something, or is the Nharwaak an alien form of the the GLA? I very nearly died several times before I killed the suicidal nutter.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay130_zpsmmpcnpyd.png

As the containers were taken out (some I might add, by TIE Bombers that would have been more help killing the enemy combat craft - good job lads...), I limped back to the Shamus.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay131_zpsije9wyh7.png

Primary Objective:
M/FRG Shamus must survive until other goals completed
CN/B Junker must be destroyed
CN/A Hume must be destroyed
CN/A Workshop must be destroyed
CN/B Repo must be destroyed
CRV Petor must be destroyed
CRV Shotgun must be destroyed
TRN Sunbird must be destroyed
SHU Pamir 1 must be destroyed
SHU Pamir 2 must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives:
None
Bonus Objectives:
None

I got ten out of eighteen kills - and fout of those I missed were containers anyway. I got both CRVs, both shuttles and six of the nine Y-Wings.

Yeah, despite the hairy moment in the middle there, that was a straightforward mission!

Misson Three: Defend Tech Center

This time, I'm flying TIE Bomber Alpha 1 out of Modified Corellian Corvette Phoenix to protect our allies, the Habeen from another Nharwaak attack. And I have to stop their Y-Wings from destoying the Habeen containers (freaking containers!), while two Shuttles and Transport board them. Crap.

Double load of missiles, this time, though, and again, no bonus or secondary goals to complicate things. Still, this doesn't feel good!

It isn't. Literally as you start out the mission, there are nine Y-Wings which are seconds away from firing crap tons of proton torpedoes. One of the defending Habeen CRVs goes down instantly and there's nothing you can do. First try, we failed totally to stop them glassing all the containers. Second time, the same thing (and I quit halfway in, as you don't get the failed mission until TRN Runner enters hyperspace.)

On the third try, I managed it - just barely.

As soon as we started, I order T/B Alpha to go after the nearest Y-wing and then went to the next target myself.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay132_zpsyhjd46ky.png

You're just too out of position to be able to shoot any torpedoes down, so I concentrated on foiling the attack runs of three Y-Wings I'd selected. After that it was a case of trying desperately to attack the ones that were on attack runs on the containers. This time, I found a second to two to be able to target one of the containers and thus go after who was attacking it. Fortunately, the two shuttles dock and et done very quickly, so it's really just TRN Runner you have to worry about.

Then Y-Wing Baker hypered in. Unlike the last attempt - where I'd been in position to splash all three (two with twin salvoes of missiles and one with guns) - this time I wasn't. But I was in the right position to shread their torpedo attack this time and the other TIEs were in position to help.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay133_zpskjktgy86.png

We mopped up the rest sufficiently fast this time, we actually had a breather!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay134_zpsq6l7ygmg.png

There must have been nearly a minute where TRN Runner had a clear run at the last container!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay135_zpsnfodkkf8.png

And then the next group of Y-Wings showed up. I managed to just about break off Y-Wing Grey's attacks.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay136_zps9u7f4si7.png
I am pretty sure about a second or two after that message - and mission objectives completed - the last container was destroyed. "Cutting it fine" is a bit of an understatement, lads!

With that out of the way, killing the rest of Y-Wing Grey was trivial. Back to M/CRV Phoenix!

Primary Objective:
75% of all Y-Wings must be destroyed
M/CRV Phoenix must survive util other goals complete
TRN Runner must finish docking
SHU Doyle must finish docking
SHU sgindek must finish docking
Secondary Objectives:
None
Bonus Objectives:
None

I got eight out of the fifteen Y-Wings - not too shabby. I probably could have got more, but forcing them off their attack runs is more important than killing them! Short mission, but not too bad in the end. Seems to be a theme with this battle. Probably why I don't remember it much - you go through this one quite fast!

Mission Four: Diplomatic Meeting

Good news! The Habeen, pleased with our performance in saving their arses (bad straight!) have decided to hand over the Hyperdrive technology. I will be flying TIE Interceptor Alpha 1 to protect the rendevous. No bonus goals again, but I need to inspect the Transport containing the new parts when they show up for the secondary goals.

There's a lot of mission goals here! First attempt failed when the enemy Y-Wings killed the very last Transport before it docked. I think the major problem was not no much the Y-Wings as the enemy corvettes. I figured on the second try, it was time to break out the heavy rockets again.

Second attempt: [expletiving] ramming Y-Wings.

Third time lucky, as seems to be my pattern!

Shuttles Fairfax and Nexus heading to dock for the signing of the trade agreement...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay137_zpspqvnxrsp.png

And here comes the Nharwaak! Four Corvettes, three Y-Wings.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay138_zpsragoytid.png
Very shortly TWO Corvettes. This time, as I was flying at full speed and knew where they were coming from, I was practically on top of the second one before my rockets had locked on.

I was then back on to Y-Wing hunting. Again I concentrated first on breaking their attack runs off before mopping them up.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay139_zps5ylpqydo.png

As it so happened though, I noticed one of them going for the shuttles. So I raced over to kill those, having to dodge Red 2, who had decided I was his next target.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay140_zpszq1j2waz.png

After I kept the shuttle's tails clean, they finished the trade agreement signing and I dealt with Red 2. then the transport launched. I inspected the first pair as they flew past, killed an errant Y-Wing, then inspected the second pair. Secondary objectives done!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay141_zps0tkpp4fc.png

I raced off to deal with the last of the Y-Wings - but was not quite in time to save my last wingman.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay142_zpsq3ptbhbr.png

But his killers did not last long!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay143_zpsobvaziwb.png

Back to the Shamus.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay144_zpsjgjomn1h.png

Primary Objective:
M/FRG Shamus must survive until other goals complete
FRG Lendova must survive until other goals complete
SHU Fairfax must survive until other goals complete
SHU Nexus must complete mission
TRN Ferry 1 must complete mission
TRN Ferry 2 must complete mission
TRN Ferry 3 must complete mission
TRN Ferry 4 must complete mission
Secondary Objectives:
TRN Ferry 1 must be inspected
TRN Ferry 2 must be inspected
TRN Ferry 3 must be inspected
TRN Ferry 4 must be inspected
Bonus Objectives:
None

Nicely done! I got two corvettes and a fair number of the Y-Wings (about eleven I think). We have now got proper TIE Hyperdrive technology, so the TIE Advanced can be properly finished!

Mission Five: Rebel Arms Deal

Oh crap, it's a Gunboat mission...!

Right. A Rebel frigate and the Habeen are meeting so the latter can hand over the hyperdrive technology. I don't think so, lads. This time, Gunboat Tau is performing anti-fighter operations, while TIE Bombers are going to attack the Frigate.

Oh hey, bonus objectives, that's a novelty for this battle...

You know what, I'm just going to cut to the chase and use Heavy Rockets right out of the gate! That should make the job for the TIE Bombers a bit easier, and hopefully when the frigate goes down, it'll take all the rebels fighters on board it. Hell, if I can take the shields out, a disabled frigate is easy meat, right?

Here goes nothin'...

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay145_zpshdwxcbx9.png
Crap, that thing's close! Right! 'Ave it, you rebel scum! Fire all the heavy rockets! (Oh hey, reloads. Neat.)

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay146_zpsbcck8q2t.png
Wow. That... worked better than expected. Right then!

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay147_zpsrr43cyij.png
MUAHAHAHAHAHA!

I love ion cannons. They make captial ships such a breeze!

As I was starting my next attack run on the now helpless friagte, TRN Tela launched.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay148_zps8ee08jia.png
Nope, no escape for you rebels! Secret mission objectives completed.

I then went back to Xerxes, determined to get my kill! Frack the enemy attacking me, I wanted to kill that frigate!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay149_zpsdneyz9xg.png

Sadly, Zaarin is a rotten kill-stealin'-bastard and the Shamus finished it off. Hilariously, just as one of the Habeen corvettes docked with the stricken ship, the corvette got blown up - I'm pretty sure that didn't help, either.
http://s168.photobucket.com/user/AotrsCommander/media/TIEplay/TIEPlay150_zps6a9lmepm.png.html?sort=3&o=5

I then started wiping out the remaining rebel fighters.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay151_zpsypcpwktg.png
A-Wing, mate, going head to head with a GUN is not going to do you any favours.

All that was left was a couple more CRVs. I tried running up behind one to blindside it, but didn't get it right. I was taking too much fire and backed off.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay152_zpsqqkmomfw.png

As I was skimming through the remaining vessels I remembered "uhm, duh, or I could get a reload from my reload ship!"
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay153_zpsbitr3odi.png

Perfect position - TRN Sigma loaded me as I drew a bead on the CRVs...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay154_zpsygydpdi6.png

...And boom! Well, at least I got SOME capital ships...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay155_zpsn3gc2gs2.png

Primary Objective:
M/FRG Shamus must survive until other goals complete
FRG Xerxes must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives:
None
Bonus Objectives:
TRN Tela must be destroyed

Eight kills - not the bloody frigate, though, I might add. And a new medal!

No promotion though. You don'y get much in the way of points for this battle - on account, presumably, of how few secondary or bonus objectives there are and the large number of Y-Wing targets which one presumes are low-value.

That was a very short battle - probably why I don't remember it. So short, in fact, I spent longer writing about it than playing it! If I'd been just playing, I probably would have breezed through the thing in an hour or so!

Still, a nice change of pace to have an easy battle. Especially with what's coming up next!

Next week: Battle Five!

factotum

2015-01-29, 04:09 AM

Oh, yes, it's always fun facing suicidal Y-Wings and Shuttles in an unshielded fighter...had one mission the other day where I got rammed and destroyed no fewer than four times (might even have been one of the ones in this battle, I forget). (Mind you, to be fair, this probably happens because they're so unmanouevrable--by the time they've turned enough to fire at you, they're already too close to avoid a collision!).

Crow

2015-01-29, 02:23 PM

Aotrs Commander

2015-01-30, 07:37 AM

I promised some pictures of the 3D printed stuff I've mentioned a couple of times, so here we are:

An Imperial task force to worry about...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/Imperial%20Rep%202_zpsmkagbmbp.jpg

Missileboat
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/MIS%20Rep%202_zpszl2dbwvk.jpg

TIE Defender
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TD%20Rep%202_zpsn7hw5jsz.jpg

Delta Dx-9 TRN
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TRN%20Rep%202_zpsun4tzcqn.jpg

Gamma ATR-6
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/ATR%20Rep%202_zpsmyogglcr.jpg

Total material weight => 200g. (Of which 150g are the two ATRs). Print time roughly 20 hours, spread over a couple of weeks. Time to make CAD models approx 4-5 hours, tops.

Total material cost: £3.60. (The fighters, incidently, come out at about 5.4 pence each.)

(Not earth-shattering good prints for the fighters - the T/Ds especially, the shape means they got very stringy, unfortunately - but for the price, I am quite satisfied.)

These will be gracing my tabletop very soon!

factotum

2015-01-30, 10:53 AM

Aotrs Commander

2015-01-30, 01:15 PM

Cool! Why does the missile boat have a seam running across the middle of the model, though? Unless you printed them in two halves and then stuck them together, I wouldn't have thought 3D printing would tend to produce such artifacts.

Yes, that's exactly what it is. (It's the same with all of 'em, in fact.) This is a HOME 3D printer, which means it has to be an extrusion printer (i.e. tube of toothpaste). And like a tube of toothpaste, you can't squirt it over thin air (though it will handle up to 45º). So you have a choice: you either have a lot of support material which you have to cut off, or you can find a good plane to split the model down and print it in two (or more) sections, (and the sections have the advantage of being optically flat).

A laser-sinter 3D printer as you would find at a commerical print-house (e.g. Shapeways) is a powder and self-supporting, allowing you to do things geometrically more clever without having to have supports. (For example, I can do 144th scale infantry. While the Rep 2 would actually PIRINT that, you'd neve get the supports off.)

Two points though. One, the quality from a prinhouse like shapeways is actually overall no better than the Replicator 2. They are both better in some areas, worse in others. (And, at wargames distance, you can't tell the difference anyway.) It is also CONSIDERABLY more expensive. Not ridiculosly for wargames models, but the comparison is crazy. You'd be looking at something like $6-12 dollars a fighter, instead of 5p (if you'll forgive me mixing my currencies, because shapeways won't let me use pounds...)

So, for something like this - where I'm not going be selling it (since I emphatically do NOT sell anything related to anyone's IPs on my shapeways store), the Rep 2 is more than sufficient. Hell, I tend only to use shapeways now for samples so I can sell my models, and do the majority of them on the Rep 2 for my 144 ground vehicles now at the best of times! (Unless the geometry is something I just can't do on the Rep 2, e.g. the Russian IMR-2 vehicle I did.)

factotum

2015-02-01, 09:07 AM

Aotrs Commander

2015-02-01, 12:57 PM

You know you were talking about the shielding on a TIE Defender a few days ago? I have a theory about that. Just got to the third mission of Battle 9, and it appears I have reached the point where my skill runs out--been playing on Medium up until now, had to drop it back to Easy after four failed attempts. On Easy, I was able to take down a TIE Advanced with two shots from a TIE Defender. OK, I was in a good position and all four lasers hit on each shot, but I'm pretty darned sure I wouldn't have been able to do that on Medium difficulty--which got me to thinking, maybe one of the ways they handle easy difficulty is by either making your own shields and weapons stronger, or those of the enemy weaker? If that's the case, then the reverse would be true on Hard, which is why you saw what you saw.

I don't think so... I had as much trouble on battle 1 mission 5 on medium as well: and in addition, it's quite clear that the GUN and T/D have the same shields, the T/A has only half that (and is basically the same as a A-Wing) and the MIS has more on Hard difficulty.

It's certainly possible that the enemy weapons do half damage or your do double or something on easy, though. (That wouldn't be surprising.) At hard, though, you tend to get more enemies, and more enemies with warheads going after you specifically, too.

I will have to have another experiment in T/D mission 1 at all three difficulty levels, I suppose.

Aotrs Commander

2015-02-04, 06:08 PM

Right, first off - I checked TIE Defender mission 1 on Easy. factotum was absolutely right. You do more damage and take less damage on Easy. A single laser hit did 8% damage to a T/D's shields and a missile hit dropped the outer shields from green to yellow (consistent to 50/50=> 35/50 (half damage) or perhaps 50/50=>27.5/50 (75% damage)). A single advanced missile dropped a T/D's shields to 4% (so maybe it's not quite 50% or something...?). A quad hit on a A-Wing dropped it to 48%. That's 26 damage, or 6.5 damage each, about 1.6 times the nomrla 4 damage/hit.

The maths suggests, then it's about +60% damage dealt (T/D 100 => 4% = 96 damage, 96/60 = 1.6) - slightly more than half. You can't judge the damage taken quite so mathmatically, but it's safe to assume that it's about the same margin (something 40-50% less damage).

A quick check on medium confirms the damage dealt and taken is the same as on Hard (4% with one laser hit to a T/D shields, outer layer to red on a missile hit.)

Battle Five: Battle for Honor

This is where TIE starts to hit hard, and the difficulty starts to spike. It is quite possible before long, we'll be dropping back to Medium (and maybe even Easy) once I start getting to fed up with banging my head on the walls...!

Let's deal with the plot-things first...

Initial Reactions of Bleakbane, Battle Five, Mission One, circa twenty years ago:

Okay, back to Harkan, righty-doke...

During the briefing:
"...show us how a hotshot clears a minefield in and unshielded craft!"

Umm... Ookay. This is going to be a bugger.

Flying out and starting to clear the mines in a TIE Interceptor...

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay157_zps9agg76em.png
"Gamma One is the Emporer's stool pigeon! Gamma Two and Three destroy Gamma One now!"

*spittake*

Ya...bwah.. wha...?

The hell?!

*change underwear*

(I was still living at the time.)

It completely blindsided me. Now, as soon as it happened, it all made perfect sense, of course. Heck, first cutscene is even seeing Harkan dealing with the rebels, and hints have been strewn through the first two battles.

But.

That was two battles ago, and you've been with Thrawn and Zaarin since.

So it was cold and out-of-the-blue enough to be able to come as a complete SHOCK (especially when one is not quite as astute and cynical, as at the time, this sort of curve ball was not COMMON like it is now) while at the same time, not being pulled out of their arses.

Mission One: Clear Minefield

Well, this time, we know this is coming. So, no need to frack about waiting for the hammer to drop, we'll pre-empt the little buggers!

First, kill Gamma 2 and 3 while they're in front of me. Boom.

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay156_zps5np4vfbh.png

Then, I spent about seventy billion attempts clearing the minefield. Usually very short attempts.

And then Harkov launches TIE Avengers at you. And this point, I DID call for reinforcements, and legged it over to the Osprey. T/A H-Alpha managed to kill me though as I was running for the shuttle to inspect it. Despite me clicking E several times to determine they weren't after me, the only warning I got was when the laser hit me and the warning light flashed at the same time. It took out the radar, which effecively ended any chance of finishing the mission or dodging the next shots. Annoying. VERY annoying.

So, okay, I abandoned that plan.

I started calling for reinforcements right away and pumping my engines and inspecting the containers sharpish-like. (The first time I did this, the lasers naturally hit my engines instantly.)

On the second such try, I ran for the Osprey.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay158_zpsusngsc1g.png

I killed a couble of the TIE Bombers that were attacking and then I doubled back to inspect Lambda, but there was no time for me to destroy it - docked way too fast, and at that point yo're ALSO being shot by the damn capital ship. (I think. Certainly the warning light is on, but I do wonder if it was actually shooting how I didn't get killed.)

I got to the Osprey and spend a few EXTREMELY frustating minutes trying to hit T/A H-Delta 3.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay159_zpsxbg4daoe.png

I could just not hit it at all. The difficulty spike from A-Wings is marked. And if you don't fire just exactly right, it'll dodge out of the way between you pulling the trigger and the lasers crossing the distance. Eventually, someone (maybe a T/A, maybe the Osprey) hit me and I boom. I am reminded why tractor beams are of critical importance from this stage forwards.

Still, mission success. I elected, screw it, I was just going to take this and move on. Trying to accomplish all the bonus goals would simply take far too much time and far too much luck that I just wasn't prepared to spend.

Primary Objective:
None
Secondary Objectives:
100% of CN/D group Psi must be inspected
100% of CN/D group Chi must be inspected
M/FRG Osprey must arrive
SHU Lambda must be inspected
Bonus Objectives:
T/I Gamma 2 must be destroyed
T/I Gamma 3 must be destroyed
100% of Mine 1A group must be destroyed
100% of Mine 1B group must be destroyed
100% of T/A group H-Alpha must be destroyed
100% of T/A group H-Delta must be destroyed
100% of T/B group H-Beta must be destroyed
100% of CN/D group Psi must be destroyed
100% of CN/D group Chi must be destroyed
100% of X-Wing group Blue must be destroyed
100% of Y-Wing group Red must be destroyed
SHU Lambda must be destroyed

Plot-wise this is a great mission. The taunting even works, since if you're actually trying to concentrate on killing the mines, it's REALLY annoying. You can't say there isn't a stupid amount of pressure on you to give you the urgency.

Gameplay-wise, though, I hate that mission, which is why after mananging to clear the mines once, I decided I wasn't going to keep doing just to fail on the later parts of the mission for the sake of points - or pride. I think the only time I've completed the bonus goals was by using Indestructible.

Mission Two: Assault Gunboat Recon

Crap. Gunboat mission. This is gonna suck, isn't it?

*sigh*

Suck it is, nearly to the point of "not even going to bother trying to get all the bonus goals."

You are flying Mu 2, under the command of Mu "Doom on You" 1 on a recon in force. (No, seriously, that's what is says on his cargo information...) The primary objective is to destroy a load of containers around a platform, a PLT/5. The bonus goals require you to inspect them all before they are destroyed. Sonds easy enough, right? Wrong.

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay160_zpsxft1raqt.png
Don't you believe, it Mu 1.

CORT Cimigo almost immediately launches and enters hyperspace.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay161_zpskqbflni6.png
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay162_zpsquzp9cok.png
You have barely got time to reach it, let alone fire (and even if you do, your guns will be nearly out of charge.) So you have to kill the shields with your advanced missiles (five of them) and when you get within range, transfer power from your shields. It is - just - possible to take it out.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay163_zpsmeqww3zi.png

Then, once I managed that, I had the job of not getting killed by the station. The trick here is, I think, to delay and inspect the CORT and deal with the two Z-95 Headhunters that come your way, that gives you sme time to pump your shields desparately back up. Then, you will either be slaughtered by the station (killed the flight controls - and then, the absolute second I had control back, punched through my full rear shields and killed me) or you will get lucky and manage to inspect all the containers and the platform. Secondary - and one bonus - goals completed.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay164_zpsiikacqbj.png
Yeah, sure, Mu 1, whatever.

Then you can mop up the remaining Headhunters and the B-Wings floating around.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay165_zpstqnayn1g.png

The other GUNs then started their attack runs on the containers around the station. I nipped ovcer to kill Cimigo while I had chance.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay166_zpsrpeqpqkt.png

I then helped mop up the rest of the containers - and Harkov arrived in the Protector. So I slung a couple of Advanced missiles at it (I actually only intended to fire one) and that gave me that goal. I killed one T/A of H-Alpha with missiles and knobbled one of A-W Blue with missiles... And then realised that T/A H-Beta was not going to show unless I killed all six of H-Alpha on my own, in a Gunboat. I managed to waste all my remaining missiles and I was getting nowhere. (I began to suspect that, actually, the joystick maybe WASN'T calibrated properly and was being heavy, since I'd have some trouble locking on the Z-95s.)

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay167_zpsxg3h2yve.png

After one attempt to hit them head-to-head which reduced my shield to red, I cut my losses and hyperjumped out. DAMN that last bonus goal.

Primary Objective:
100% of all CN/Bs must be destroyed
100% of CN/C Pi must be destroyed
100% of CN/E Xi must be destroyed
100% of CN/D Psi must be destroyed
VSD Protector must have arrived
Secondary Objectives:
At least one of all CN/Bs must be inspected
At least one of CN/C Pi must be inspected
At least one of CN/E Xi must be inspected
At least one of CN/D Psi must be inspected
PLT/1 DS 5 must be inspected
Bonus Objectives:
100% of all freighter craft must be inspected
At least one of A-Wing Blue must be destroyed
At least one of T/A H-Alpha must be destroyed
At least one of T/A H-Beta must be destroyed
VSD Protector must be attacked
CORT Cimigo must be destroyed

Nine kills, though, plus six containers.

I never did like this battle, though, from memory.

Nasty. I do wonder how much of this is joystick and not skill related. So I checked. Yeah. Little [expletive] was pulling heavy - I reckon about 80-90% of the turning speed of what it should have been. But the little bleeder was heavy in all directions equally - normally you can tell, because one direction will be notably slower. But when it's all equal and it's all CLOSE... No bloody wonder I was struggling. I think this is worst part of TIE, trying to get the joystick right. Dammit. I probably could have done a much better job in both those missions. (Trouble is, you dare not try and do it mid-mission, because if it fails to calibrate, that's it, you are permenantly in a down-and-left spin until you quit the mission and calibrate in the ESC menu screen.)

A quick look at the next mission and the bonus goals and such and it's quite obvious we're not going to get any more done this time - it's just going to take too long to make even one attempt. (Edit: actually, I did take a shot at it. Bonus goals are gong to be nearly impossible. Since you have to immediately drop all your power into engiens and fly 20 kliks to launch a heavy rocket at the first heavy lifter...and then of course, guess what, you're immediately jumped by the T/As you're supposed to avoid. This is freaking ridiculous. You're expected to fight three or four enemy craft with better manouverability than you, missiles and you won't have any shields or cannon power and you still have to go after enemy cargo vessels. Freaking stupid. Nintendo Hard indeed.)

Bit a of a come-down after last week's entire battle. But there we go. The difficulty curve is right up. And that means it's going to take me even longer start-up, because now I'm going to have to be absolutely sure the joystick is calibrated properly of it's going to be impossible from here on in...

Eldariel

2015-02-04, 06:39 PM

I recall way back in the day Clear Minefield was the only mission I never got all bonus objectives on. For whatever reason I remember T/A Alpha just keeping spawning infinitely. Or maybe it was the next one? But I remember flying a T/I against a horde of T/As so it can't be the next one. Then again, the fact that I recall another bonus objective being "attack VSD Protector" speaks for the next one again. Either way, one of these two missions is the one where I never got all bonus objectives on. Maybe I flew the next one in T/I or something, but I specifically recall the missing bonus objective being T/A Alpha having to be destroyed and I do remember destroying plenty of 'em so if the listed objectives were it, I would've gotten it. Ultimately, I'm just going to cut this pointless rambling and blame it on two decade-old memories being inaccurate and go with the Clear Minefield mission.

factotum

2015-02-05, 03:54 AM

It's interesting to note that they made that mission with the Cimigo much easier in the Collector's Edition I'm playing--you start a lot closer to the platform and the Cimigo takes absolutely ages before it fires up its engines and tries to run for it. I did recall having to perform that race to catch it when I originally played the game 20 years ago and was somewhat surprised when it was so easy this time around! It's possible this is due to playing the mission on Medium rather than Hard difficulty, mind you, I'll need to test that at some point.

I think the change in damage numbers in Easy is a bit over the top, to be honest--it really does make it easy. It's still possible to fail a mission, usually because you missed the one B-Wing that was about to lob heavy rockets at a mission-critical ship, but you're never really in any danger of dying.

pendell

2015-02-05, 06:52 PM

I remember first encountering Battle 5 mission 1 -- no tactical officer briefing, being sent in against a minefield in an unshielded craft -- the first thought that came to mind was "I'm being set up to die."

Which, totally, we are. Ordinary pilots would be dusted by the minefield even before being attacked by your own wingman.

I have to admit that left a bit of a scar, psychologically.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

factotum

2015-02-06, 03:30 AM

I remember first encountering Battle 5 mission 1 -- no tactical officer briefing, being sent in against a minefield in an unshielded craft -- the first thought that came to mind was "I'm being set up to die."

Bizarrely, though, one of the TIE Interceptor missions in the combat chamber is pretty much exactly the same--you're tasked with taking down a minefield in an unshielded craft. Kind of saps the whole "This is a really unusual thing to be asked to do" for that mission, IMHO.

pendell

2015-02-06, 09:07 AM

First of all, I hadn't actually played that mission when I got to battle of honor the first time.

In the second place, it's one thing to have a pre-scripted Kobayashi scenario in a simulator, another thing entirely to do it in real life. And for a first-time player, the minefield itself is challenging enough.

.. On the plus side, this is the last time we'll ever have to fly an unshielded craft in TIE Fighter, so its a final examination of sorts.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

factotum

2015-02-10, 03:00 PM

Aotrs Commander

2015-02-10, 04:07 PM

Well, finished the 13th and last battle. That final mission just feels way, way too easy; OK, I'm playing on Easy difficulty at this point, but the mission immediately before it (where Zaarin gets away with the Vorknkx) was *way* harder and had considerably more enemy forces in it than the grand finale.

Definitely planning to get X-Wing: Alliance as well at some point, but I think I need to play a game now that gives me a chance to rest my joystick arm! :smallsmile:

Don't rush... the X-Wing Alliance Upgrade project (which significantly upgrades all the graphics and adds a few other fixes - and the associated added craft packs) are currently down, while they figure out what Gog did to XWA so they can make it wqork. (Or at least it ws when I checked yesterday.) I'd installed XWA on XP a week or few ago, only to find Nvidia had left a bug in the drivers for XP they culdn't be arsed to fix. I tried again to instal it at the weekend on Win 7, but I next the aforementioned update to get that to work. (Seeing as i have the original.) But, given the level of the upgrade, it'll be worth waiting for. (Bear in mind that this project was going strong even when I was first on the interwebs at the time XWA first came out!)

mangosta71

2015-02-11, 10:01 AM

Given that Nvidia can't be arsed to release a driver that can display a desktop/web browser for more than 30 seconds without crashing, finding that they won't bother to fix something for XWA isn't that big a surprise.

Aotrs Commander

2015-02-11, 06:30 PM

Right! First job, is figure out a check to see if the joystick is right. So into GUN mission one and before calibrating (i.e. when there is a drift up the upper right), time how long it takes to do a 360º turn. About 7-8 seconds. Calicbrate joytaick until we get it steady, and then tiome it again... About the same, let's if that's okay.

Assault Gunboat Mission Two: Teamwork

True fact: the first time I played this mission and got "Why don't you navy cargo drivers take a hike? You've just become outnuhmbered, yer see!" in that Unconvicing Conkey accent, I had to pause the game, I was laughing so hard.

Easy mission, this time. Amazingly, TRN Sigma actually did their jobs, leaving us with the easy job of just mopping up the fighters and E/S. (And in a GUN, the latter hold much less fear.)

Done and dusted in short order.

Primary Objectives:
50% of all Rebel craft must be destroyed
CARG Filcher must be disabled
CARG Riirdo must be disabled
100% of E/S Devil must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives:
CARG Redbill must be destroyed
CARG Wippett must be destroyed
Bonus Objectives:
HLF Argis 1 must complete mission
HLF Argis 2 must complete mission

Okay, that was easy... Now the real test! Back to Battle five...!

Battle Five, Mission Three: Convoy Attack
This is going to be tough... The real test will be whether I can take down those T/As...

(No, the first problem is going to be my wingman NOT DOING WHAT I TELL THEM! I aborted after about two minutes when they ignored the orders to ignore the freighters...

Do that again, Mu 1, and I'll kill you myself!)

Okay, short answer.

No.

Just, no.

You simply cannot fight four TIE Advanced by yourself (with no shields, because you have to sink all power to engines to get to the Heavy Lifters) AND destroy the heavy lifters in the minute or two they show up, grab a container and go aboard the Protector AND inspect the convoy. (Reinforcements are ZERO help, since they go straight for the convoy and ignore your orders.)

I made one last try, keeping my shields at normal until I was much closer, giving me a bit more shielding. No good. I took out the first heavy lifter, I even managed to take out the second and even disable the third, and made it all the way back to the convoy, despite being under constant fire from FIVE T/As... My idiot wingmen all died, leaving me to contend with all the T/As single-handed and the A-Ws. I called for reinforcements, but multiple missile hits got me easily (because you can't dodge that many missiles).

So, with having failed the bonus goals last mission, I think we'll officially give up on this one. So we will stick to Hard and go for primary and secondary. If I can't manage that, we'll drop down to Medium and try for the bonus goals and so on and so forth. This will become standard modus operandii, I think.

(I don't feel too bad about dropping the bonus goals - or even the difficultly, come to that - since factotum's admission he had to drop to Easy makes me feel a bit better - it's not that I'm just completely crap (or just not any more crap than anyone else!), it really is just that hard!)

Even doing THAT took two attempts. I tried to inspect and take out all the ships myself (using ions and guns), but by the time I'd gotten to the CRVs, I run out of wingmen AND rockets. I was taking the last CRV apart - with only first FRT I'd disabled to kill, when the all the T/As murdered me.

Final attempt...
We have learned. Don't attempt the bonus goals at all, don't try and do everything yourself.

So, first up, hyper in, pump cannon recharge, start charging shields. I let Mu squadron go after Karflo 1, and made an inspection pass of Karflo 2 and took both it and Karflo 3 out (one rocket and guns).
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay168_zpsujudfybe.png

CNVYR SoroSuub arrived next. I ordered my wingmen to attack the lead one, and went after the second, hitting it with a rocket, and as Mu killed SoroSuub 1, just in time ordered them to stop attacking it (it was on 3% hull!) to allow me to inspect it. I finished it off with one shot.

The next two Container Transports were easy. Though at this point, I was under attack from the TIE Advanced. I had, at least, full shields, so I could afford to ignore - for a short while. I flew straight at the CTRNS, doing a close range inspection and takng them out with one rocket a piece.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay169_zps3jgr8ley.png
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay170_zpsd7zjkwxs.png

Finally, the CRVs arrived. Again, I set Mu on the leader (amazingly, they were all alive this time..!) and went after Sundog 2.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay171_zpstxkgroag.png
Two heavy rocket laters (two passes, becaue it didn't set my rockets to twin fire mode!) and they were. At this point, discretion was the better part of valour, and I legged it with the rest of Mu squadron.

Primary Objective:
100% of FRT group Karflo must be destroyed
100% of CNVYR group SoroSuub must be destroyed
CTRNS Morgath 1 must be destroyed
CTRNS Morgath 5 must be destroyed
100% of CRV group Sundog must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives:
At least one of FRT group Karflo must be inspected
At least one of CNVYR group SoroSuub must be inspected
CTRNS Morgath 1 must be inspected
CTRNS Morgath 5 must be inspected
At least one of CRV group Sundog must be inspected
Bonus Objectives:
At least one of CN/E group Pi must be inspected
HLF AAA Tow must be destroyed
HLF A1 Tow must be destroyed
HLF A2 Tow must be destroyed
VSD Protector must be attacked
At least one of T/A group H-Alpha must be destroyed
At least one of T/A group H-Beta must be destroyed
At least one of T/A group H-Gamma must be destroyed
At least one of T/A group H-Delta must be destroyed

I think we all made it out, and Mu actually managed to get one of the T/As between 'em good job lads... An aweful lot of red, there, though...

Harkov, the dirty traitor, is going nowhere!

(By the by, I apologise for the decreasing number of screenshots... It's just by the time I get to the severalth-replay and I'm trying to not get killed, I don't have a lot of spare brainpower to remember to click the button (and it's even mapped to my hat along with the weapon and weapon link buttons...!)

Mission Four: Tactical Superiority
Okay, finally, we might actually be able to handle the T/As! With T/As of our own, and some Advanced Missiles, this should be slightly better...

Still the bonus goals include attack capital ships, so it's not all sunshine and roses... And I recall this mission being an arse...

Okay, the first attempt, I got killed by the bonus goal CARGs that are laying mines as I tried to attack them. So, I switched to Heavy Rockets so the second (and subsequent attempts), and lobbed one at each... But... SOMEHOW, that didn't kill them and they ran off to hyperspace.

What?

So, apparently, a heavy rocket isn't quite enough to kill one, and they IMMEDIATELY run to hyperspace, before you can even get in gun range, if you fire from max range...

After several more attempts, I finally managed it.

I started by pumping my shield with all available cannon energy, dumping cannon energy to shields, ordering Mu to cover me... and switching targets and going for CARG Badger 2 first.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay172_zpszhtgouan.png

Then it was a race to close range. Hurled one rocket, shot the mine that passed my crosshairs and fired a contunuous steam of laser fire into it. Then, as it exploded, slammed upwards, careened towards Badger 1, hit with some guns first as I closed, switched to rockets and blew that up too.

Then it was a case of tackling a couple of the TIE Advanced.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay173_zpswg6sn8uk.png

I'd got a bit too close to VSD Protector, by this point... so I made the most of the chance and let it have a quad burst, to give me another bonus goal completed.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay174_zpsvvrv5sub.png

I pulled back out of range, and when back to dealing with the T/As. By this point, Protector was hurling missile after missile after missile at me. Fortunately, being fairly far out, they didn't get more than one pass (if that), so I was actually managing quite well.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay175_zpsuexxacf8.png

Shuttle Toten finally made it's appearance, so I broke off, shunted cannon energy back to normal, made a flying pass to inspect it and then back safely out of starship gun range.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay176_zps72kwg7ar.png

Then began the most tedious and tiresome part of the mission. Fighting T/A after T/A. At some point, we reached the required 50% and the Protector buggered off. To be fair, at this point, I wasn't under so much fire I was struggling to survive, but it was a very loooong, slow process - especially since I reckon I must have been fighting about eight of the buggers at once. H-Alpha 4 proved especially annoying.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay177_zpsl8ciyhvl.png
[Expletive] you, H-Alpha 4.

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay178_zps2pwvxfal.png
And your flight leader, too!

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay179_zpsdjmatabq.png
FINALLY, the last one dies!!

Notice I was nearly at the 40-minute mark by this point...

So, last goals then. Inspect one or and destroy both rebel M/CRVs. Well, I'd saved myself a rocket when I'd shot Protector with guns, so after a short debate, I decided that it was best to use both remaining rockets on one (Wurger 1) and then attack Wurger 2 with guns (inspecting it was going to be inevitable at that point...!)
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay180_zpsbhcewy4z.png

Thank frag it was only an M/CRV! Despite the fire or both ship and station (since they were very lose now, with all the time I'd spent dogfighting), a series of passes, dodging inbetween launching quads...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay181_zpsuyt4va8t.png

And Wurger 2 was going down. At the last, I think my dodging caused Wurger 2's shots to hit the station, since it was firing at the M/CRV. For a moment, I got quite annoyed, since it was touch and go which one of us killed it. (Me, fortunately!) Then I hit hyperspace and got the fracking hell out of there!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay182_zpssen7ntgd.png

Primary Objective:
50% of all T/As must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives:
At least one of M/CRV group Wurger must be inspected
SHU Toten must be inspected
Bonus Objectives:
VSD Protector must be attacked
100% of M/CRV group Wurger must be destroyed
CARG Badger 1 must be destroyed
CARG Badger 2 must be destroyed

I got 12/22 TIE Advanced myself, plus both CARGs and both M/CRVs. Frack me, I'd only half-remembered that fighting T/A is such a PAIN in the ARSE without a tractor beam. The most annoying thing was when they dodge just after you press the fire button, like the computer says "whooop, no, can't be 'avin' that, mate."

Unsurprisingly, that brings us to the end of the time for this week!

Harkov will have to wait another week before we deal with him in another... *sigh* GUN mission. With mines. Type 3 mines.

Fun.

Just before I go, though: here's the completed new Imperial flight group I've been painting up, ready ruin the rebel's day!

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/ATRTDTRNMIS%20group%20Rep%202%20painted_zpsctzdfay b.jpg

Even the T/Ds haven't come out too badly at all (paint can hide a large number of sins!)

Can't actually use them for a bit, since a) it's panto tomorrow (and Friday and Saturday...) and my opposite number is awya in Russia, so we'll get (hopefully) one shot at 'em before the Hammerhead show at the end of February. Co-incidently, I should have a bit more free time after that (though I suspect it might ave to be sunk into quest-writing instead), so there might even be the odd update more (or I'll have longer). We'll see!

factotum

2015-02-12, 04:02 AM

In my experience, having a tractor beam makes things so much easier even if you turn the thing off, because you get so much extra engine power with one installed. You have to wonder why they don't fit power generators that good to ships which *don't* have the tractor beams, because speed is king in this game!

Aotrs Commander

2015-02-18, 04:49 PM

I'm afraid no update today. After the chaos of the panto last weekend, I now need to prepare for the convention the weekend after next - moreover, I need to get as much as possible done for a playtest tomorrow night!

So this evening has been mostly spent on record sheet and scenario creation (and some rules modification) - and an unforseen couple of hours wrestling with the cannon recharge system (made all the more difficult because it's based on X-Wing Alliance - which I can't play at the moment - and TIE Fighter's being subtly different). Fun fact: I realised that in TIE, a vessel with quad laser cannons can't actually run out of juice at maximum recharge. I never knew that... (In the end, I pretty much used what I had and just changed the wording a bit, but as usual, 95% of the work is determining whether that's right or not!)

And I still have to finish painting six CloakShapes (because the rebels need all the help they can get; eventually, when XWAU and the Craft Add patch is up, I might see if I can't add some E- and K-Wings in, but for the moment, they've got what they've got!) Fortuantely, that and the last bits for the convention I don't need to do instantly, because I've about had enough by this point...!

Aotrs Commander

2015-02-25, 05:19 PM

We're back again!

Right. Before we get back to it, some housekeeping.

Joystick calibration is now being done on GUN mission 1 (for conveniance), where I go in, time how long it takes to do a 360º rotation and calibrate until we lose the drift and keep the speed. As such, I'll not be picking at the training as calibration attempts now, but doing them "properly."

For the record, then, at the moment, here's where we stand on them.

TIE Fighter

Training Mission 1: Gunnery (Attempted, up to X-Wing Dodec (four bonus goals failed))
Training Mission 2: Flight Leaders and Wingmen (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)
Training Mission 3: Destroy Depot
Training Mission 4: Destroy Probe (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)

TIE Interceptor

Training Mission 1: Threat Display
Training Mission 2: Ambush!
Training Mission 3: Clear Minefield
Training Mission 4: Combined Attack

TIE Bomber

Training Mission 1: Proton Torpedoes
Training Mission 2: Space Bombs
Training Mission 3: Torpedo Run
Training Mission 4: Bombers Armed with Missiles

TIE Advanced

Training Mission 1: Concussion Missiles
Training Mission 3: Preemptive Strike
Training Mission 2: Rocket Attack
Training Mission 4: Hyperdrive Upgrade

Assault Gunboat

Training Mission 1: Shields
Training Mission 2: Teamwork
Training Mission 3: The Challenge (Attempted, completed and then progress lost because the game crashed out because I tried saving the flight camera...)
Training Mission 4: Escort Duty

TIE Defender

Training Mission 1: Dogfighting!
Training Mission 2: Tractor Beam
Training Mission 3: Inspect & Disable
Training Mission 4: Disable and Capture

Missile Boat

Training Mission 1: Dual Warheads
Training Mission 2: Anti-Warhead Defense
Training Mission 3: Disabling Minefield
Training Mission 4: Missile Boat vs. TIE Defender

Not many, in fact, as I've found! so, from now on, when I do one of the training missions, I'll update this list. (And I am going to keep doing them, because there are some good ones in there..!)

Let's get right to that, in fact, since I've had a week's break, so before I get back to Harkov, let's have a proper try and GUN Mission 1!

Assault Gunboat Mission 1: Shields

Okay, simple. Clear mines, disable Transport Weet, fight some fighters.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay183_zpsw3nobxdg.png
(This is why this is a good calibration test. It's Gunboat mission, and you start out with plenty of time have have a static object right in front of you to mark from.)

So, kill a few mines until TRN Weet launches...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay184_zpsdvv5mpka.png

Chase it down and disable it.Then back to clearing the last of the mines (this is SO MUCH EASIER with shields...!)
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay185_zpstazrwna8.png

Then all I had to do was wait for SPC Scythis to dock...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay186_zpsdvdjym1f.png

...and capture TRN Weet.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay187_zps3iq8n8ge.png

Then I blew up the cointainer and the rebel fighter arrived... Two Y-Wings, three B-Wings, four X-Wings, five A-Wings (with missiles) and six Y-Wings (also with missiles). I won't bore you with details, since this was easy and only the A-Wings are a pain. and even then, you just disable them first, and then kill at your leisure.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay188_zps1jyzaw8l.png

Primary Objectives:
100% of Mine group T1-A must be destroyed
100% of Mine group T1-B must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives:
CN/D Pi must be inspected
TRN Weet must be captured
Bonus Objectives:
100% of Y-Wing group Red must be destroyed
100% of B-Wing group Blue must be destroyed
100% of X-Wing group Gold must be destroyed
100% of A-Wing group Red must be destroyed
100% of Y-Wing group Blue must be destroyed

Job's a good 'un.

Okay, while we're here, then, let's have a go at T/I mission one.

TIE Interceptor Mission 1: Threat Display

Okay... This is actually hard. Because the enemy ships keep running away. One the first try, FRT Sunnida 1 ran to hyperspace because I didn't help TRN Epsilon take down the shields. On the second try, I got as far as B-Wing Red. (Oddly, TRN Epsilon 2 was destroyed - I think the idiots got in the flight path of the FRTs as they jumped out...) The rebels flying those ships are cowards, even by rebel standards. The second you shoot one of them, they start bugging out. On the third try, I got B-Wing Red 2 down to 1% hull before it was suddenly invulnerable (fracking cheating game). I quit the mission after that happened - there's no point killing the next wave if you don't get that one. Frankly, this isn't all that an interesting mission (since the first half is repetatively dull, and there's nothing you can do to chance tactics or anything), so I think we're done with this one for now... I think basically, you more or less have to not shot them until you settle in behind them and you have to basically not miss. (Which means, once again, it's down more to luck than tactics.)

Primary Objectives:
CORT Normannic must be inspected
SHU StarTour7 must be inspected
TRN Seinar T4D must be inspected
TNR Seinar T5D must be inspected
CRV Ritan must be inspected
FRT Elorac must be inspected
Secondary Objectives:
FRT Sunnida 1 must be captured
Bonus Objectives:
100% of SHU Yagmar must be inspected
100% of B-Wing group Red must be destroyed
100% of B-Wing group Gold must be destroyed

Right then, let's get back to dealing with Harkov!

Battle Five, Mission Five: Capture Harkov

Lessee... I can take 16 Concussion Missiles... or I can take 16 Advanced Concussion Missiles. Hmm... I wonder which one I'll choose... (Actually, in hindsight, this might have been one of the few missions where you actually might use Protons or Advanced Protons...)

That... was shockingly easy! (So easy, I nearly forgot to take screenshots!) And a GUN mission, too!

The primary job, is, of course, to capture Harkov.

And, if youre not prepared for it, this bit can be the doozy. He is in CORT Geddawai (ahaha, I See What You Did There), which pretty much immediately takes off.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay189_zpswovelcn6.png

It also moves pretty darn fast, and within a moment or two, I realised charging at it on normal engine power, I wasn't going to catch it. So I had to bang all power to engines. Fortunately, I had anticiapted something like this, and had already thrown 6 Advanced Missiles at it to drop its shields down to almost zero. I sailed past the minefield and the platform without taking more than a glancing blow or two and overhauled, disabled and inspected it. I then swung around to see GUN Mu disable TRN Kolermigon. Good job, lads! I flicked past it to inspect it as I came back, just in time to catch and disable SHU Toten as it finally launched.

I started on clearing the mines, and snapping the odd shot off at the PLT as I did so.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay190_zpss1sll5zh.png

The Lulsa attack had taught me the best way of clearing Type C mines is to disable them. So I did. That way, either me or someone else could clear them up later (and wnot worry about the missiles, or at least have them hit someone else!)
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay191_zpsnfrmagfa.png

I headed off to help clear the remaining fighters - snapping off a missile to knobble one A-Wing. Sometime around this point, the ISD Garrett and Lord Vader showed up, and the ATRs finished capturing all the disabled craft. (For once, the ATRs and GUN Mu had done a fine job of disabling the PLT without much help from me.)
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay192_zpsvr03ba1m.png

M/CRV Wurger showed up at this point, so I went after them instead. A bit leery of potential fire (unecessarily, actually, as they never even locked onto me), I threw six Advanced Missiles at Wurger 1 to reduce its shields, and disabled it in one pass.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay193_zps7mndno4x.png

I then emptied my last missiles onto Wurger 2 and hit it with all the ion fire I could muster. I thought I'd disabled it, but actually, I hadn't - but I was distracted by the arrival of FRG Olinor.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay194_zpsczpfjwwm.png

Which I needed to rush over with all power to engines to inspect (while ordering GUN Mu to ignore the M/CRVs), since it was 13km away and only two minutes or so from hyperspace, the cowards.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay195_zpsnqfsqoir.png

I inspected that safely, then headed right back to the corvettes. And then realised I'd not disabled Wurger 2 - but the Dark Side was with me, and I had chance to kill it before it went anywhere.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay196_zpsants1fn0.png

I then went back to finish Wurger 1 off and turned back to deal with ther last few A-Wings.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay197_zpsqzrufmvq.png

Sadly, I was too far out. At least two A-Wings - including Red 3 here - were able to hyper out (they'd been fighting the ATrs and got out of turbolaser range). Still, not a mission goal, so eh. *shrug*
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay198_zpsf5ffp5xm.png

The it was a case of flying back to the Garrett.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay199_zpsoiycy47z.png

Primary Objective:
CORT Geddawai must be disabled
SHU Toten must be disabled
TRN Kolermigon must be disabled
100% of all Mines must be destroyed
PLT/1 DS 5 must be disabled
Secondary Objectives:
SHU Toten must be inspected
TRN Kolermigon must be inspected
CORT Geddawai must be inspected
PLT/1 DS 5 must be captured
Bonus Objectives:
FRG Olinor must be inspected
100% of M/CRV group Wurger must be destroyed
CORT Geddawai must be captured
TRN Kolermigon must be captured

Harkov got what he had coming to him finally, the dirty traitor!

Only 7/16 kills, but that wasn't the main purpose of the mission, of course. That said, only Imperial casulaties were one T/A, one ATR and on Tug (which I can only assumed was launched as a reload vehicle and got in the way...!)

Before I move on to Battle Six, I think (in the time remaining), I'll have a go at one or two more training missions.

TIE Bomber Mission 1: Proton Torpedoes

First attempt failed because I forgot to inspect targets 3 and 4. The second attempt failed because the game was being an [expletive]. I blew up a Headhunter miles away, and it SOMEHOW managed to throw the debris miles and miles and hit me - which of course meant I got killed by a stray shot later. GRRRR.

Nope. It's just throwing a hissy fit today and doesn't want me to do anything. Completely contrary to last time, third attempt, it blew the reload ship up with a Headhunter. Well, given how damn long it takes to get to the "ahaha, I'mma screw you" portion of the mission, that's all I have time for today.

Primary Objectives:
100% of CN/A group Target must be destroyed
FRT Target 3 must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives:
CRV Target 4 must be destroyed
Bonus Objectives:
FRT Target 3 must be inspected
CRV Target 4 must be inspected
M/CRV Target 5 must be destroyed
FRG Target 6 must be destroyed
100% of all Z-95 Headhunters must be destroyed
CRL Target 7 must be destroyed

Actually, I decided I have one stab at T/I Mission 2, as it's one of my favourites, is quite easy, and short.

TIE Interceptor Mission 2: Ambush!
Fly TIE Interceptor Gamma 2 out of FRG Implacable (immortalised in my table top Imperial fleet) and help TIE Bomber Delta murderise a rebel platform and cruiser.

The only tricky part is killing CORT Neenoc, since it immediately launches and makes a rush for hyperspace. You basically have to pelt it over and then slam power back into your guns and if you're lucky, you'll just kill it before it jumps to hyperspace.

However, TIE was clearly feeling guilty about that last mission. Because something I've never seen happen before happened... CORT Neenoc crashed into the PLT taking off. I nearly had to pause the game to stop laughing! I have played that mission SO many times, and I don't recall that EVER happening before! Stupid smugglers!

And after, it's a really easy mission slaughtering rebel fighters. The TIE Bombers made VERY short work of the PLT and the CRL Ardent (though I don't recall them ever going down QUITE that fast - I think CORT Neenoc's accident may actually have saved the Bombers some Heavy Rockets!) and the rest is easy. (And so quick, in fact, I didn't get chance to take any interesting screenshots!)

Primary Objectives:
100% of all Z-95s must be destroyed
PLT/3 A77 must be destroyed
SPC Derdmin must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives:
CRL Ardent must be destroyed
100% of Y-Wing group Red must be destroyed
100% of Y-Wing group Gold must be destroyed
100% of X-Wing group Blue must be destroyed
100% of X-Wing group Red must be destroyed
Bonus Objectives:
CORT Neenoc must be destroyed
100% of A-Wing group Gold must be destroyed
100% of B-Wing group Red must be destroyed

13/32 kills, including all six B-wings!

Nice note to end on!

After next week's installment, my time will be clearing up again, so I might even be able to do some longer sessions.

TIE Fighter

Training Mission 1: Gunnery (Attempted, up to X-Wing Dodec (four bonus goals failed))
Training Mission 2: Flight Leaders and Wingmen (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)
Training Mission 3: Destroy Depot
Training Mission 4: Destroy Probe (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)

TIE Interceptor
Training Mission 1: Threat Display (Attempted, two bonus goals failed)
Training Mission 2: Ambush![/COLOR]
Training Mission 3: Clear Minefield
Training Mission 4: Combined Attack

TIE Bomber

Training Mission 1: Proton Torpedoes (Attempted, two bonus goals failed)
Training Mission 2: Space Bombs
Training Mission 3: Torpedo Run
Training Mission 4: Bombers Armed with Missiles

TIE Advanced

Training Mission 1: Concussion Missiles
Training Mission 3: Preemtpive Strike
Training Mission 2: Rocket Attack
Training Mission 4: Hyperdrive Upgrade

Assault Gunboat

Training Mission 1: Shields
Training Mission 2: Teamwork
Training Mission 3: The Challenge (Attempted, completed and then progress lost because the game crashed out because I tried saving the flight camera...)
Training Mission 4: Escort Duty

TIE Defender

Training Mission 1: Dogfighting!
Training Mission 2: Tractor Beam
Training Mission 3: Inspect & Disable
Training Mission 4: Disable and Capture

Missile Boat

Training Mission 1: Dual Warheads
Training Mission 2: Anti-Warhead Defense
Training Mission 3: Disabling Minefield
Training Mission 4: Missile Boat vs. TIE Defender

factotum

2015-02-26, 04:14 AM

If I was given the option of Advanced Torpedoes I'd always take them over the concussion missiles--the things are much faster than normal torps.

Aotrs Commander

2015-02-26, 01:27 PM

If I was given the option of Advanced Torpedoes I'd always take them over the concussion missiles--the things are much faster than normal torps.

They're only 140 - still half the speed of an Advanced Missile. Once you've got tractors, yeah, you can theorhetically try and use them on things like T/Ds, where you only need one as opposed to two advanced missiles. At this stage, you're still better off with advanced missiles, since against rebel fighters, you can afford to be more sparing with only using one missile and guns. (Battle five mission five may be one of the few times advanced protons might have been worth it... Though I don't know is the CORT will survive even a single hit from an advanced torp.)

Otherwise, if you may have noted, there have only been a couple of missions where I've been given the option to use advanced missiles and not had to fit heavy rockets instead to deal with captial ships. (And when dealing with cap ships, ALWAYS use heavy rockets if given a choice. They're so much better than advanced torpedoes, it's not funny.)

Protons and advanced protons share a dubious middle ground. Not ideal to use against fighters (at least not without tractor beams), and not really powerful enough to be useful against capital ships. Even argueably against transports you're better off with heavy rockets unless you're trying to capture them.

Incidently, I happened to discover that the Empire at War mod, Thrawn's Revenge - which last time I'd heard of it had ceased to be - actually got back up and was finished years ago !(And they're doing some tweaks to it again, apparently.) I'm starting to ruminate as to whether to look into a Let's play of that once I've done TIE.

Aotrs Commander

2015-03-04, 05:45 PM

Okay!

This week, we shall start with another attempt at T/B Mission 1...

Which ended in failure, as once again, the Headhunters killed TRN Omega. I think, clearly, you have to shoot the cruiser to get the Headhunters out, and then retire to the middle distance to kill them before trying to summon TRN Omega.

Oh well, another day perhaps...

Instead, I'll take a shot at T/B Mission 2. I made amny attempts at this once, ond one day, I finally did it and wiped everything. Let's see if I can do it again...

Tie Bomber Mission 2: Space Bombs

Fly T/B Beta out of FRG Implacable (immortalised in my table top Imperial fleet...) and kill a load of PLTs.

Nope. I got as far as the CRL showing up (right on top of the Implacable), and as I flew to assist, X-Wings (which were NOWHERE NEAR ME when I hit the "R" key a few seconds prior) suddenly hit me SEVERAL times (what?) and instantly took out both flight controls and engine, meaning I could do absolutely nothing at all except be killed.

Frag that, then.

Primary Objectives:
PLT/1 Abrihom must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives:
PLT/2 Bersabla must be destroyed
Bonus Objectives:
PLT/3 Cyrlus must be destroyed
CRS Ossus Day must be destroyed
100% of X-Wing group Red must be destroyed
100% of Y-Wing group Gold must be destroyed

Onwards, then:

Battle Six: Arms Race

Mission One: Protect Prototype

Fly TIE Advanced Alpha 2 (for only the second time...) and protect a load of TIE Defenders being loaded for evaluation. Don't remember much about this one, so I better watch myself. First try, we'll stick with the Advanced Concussion Missiles.

First attempt - managed to complete the mission objectives (despite being caught in digfighting A-Wings) and then one of them somehow managed to hit me head-to-head despite the fact I hit it first. TIE is just being a female canine today.

Aaaand, just I like I expected, on the second attempt, the A-Wing ignored me and the B-Wings attacked the CARGs and destroyed one. *sigh* Have I mentioned how much I hate missions that rely on luck?

Third time lucky...

Containers, ready for T/D Delta to board.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay200_zpsvrdwxhgy.png
(200th Screen shot, though I I think I've only uploaded about 150, I was being much less discerning to start with!)

The Rebel scum arrived.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay201_zps6oukk1pa.png

Once more, A-W Red went after T/A Alpha 1. As I closed the distance, I put each of the first three B-Wings into my target memory. I targeted A-W Red 2 and fired two missiles at it as I closed, then went after B-Wing Blue 1.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay202_zps6fyy74cg.png
Guns were plenty enough!

I then went after B-Wing Blue 2. This time, I fired two missiles at it and finished it with a quick laser salvo, because I was worried abut getting back to Blue 3, which was completely the opposite direction. I needn't have worried, though, since this time T/A were on the ball and it was going down.

I, meanwhile, got jumped on by about three A-Wings.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay203_zps8jzicwav.png
The CARGs were still loading away, even as I dodged missiles!

I tied up half of A-Wing Red, while the CARGs finished their job (and T/A Alpha and the T/Is polished off the last B-Wing).
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay204_zpsa2n19ama.png

Then it was a simple matter to start mopping up the A-Wings until FRG Thunderer arrived and the rebels stupidly broke off. I killed my last sparring partner with a pair of missiles, and T/A Alpha easily dispatched the last two as they fled. Bonus goals complete!

Primary Objective:
100% of all T/Ds must complete mission
100% of all CARGs must complete mission
Secondary Objectives:
None
Bonus Objectives:
100% of all Rebel craft must be destroyed

7/12 Kills - five A-Wings, two B-Wings. Not bad.

Mission Two: Prevent Rebel Ambush

Fly T/A Alpha to prevent a rebel ambush...Hmm. As the mission goals this time include Corvettes (and the inspection thereof), I might try using Advanced Torpedoes this time.

Nope. Bad idea. The Corvettes are laying a mine field. I got totally splashed trying to take them out, since the mines kept blowing up my torpedoes. Second try, we'll use an advanced proton apiece on their laser turrets and see how that goes.

Pretty well, except for the freaking X-Wing killing the very LAST TIE Defender as I was trying to get to them. *sigh*

Third try, got the primary and secondary goals, but some frack-wit let one of the X-Wings escape. Bloody idiots. Once more, then...

And again. Frack's sake, guys, KILL them.

And AGAIN.

FINALLY!!!

By this point, I'd got the CRVs nailed down pat. On mission start, pump cannon energy to max, start charging shields. Lock onto the first CRV, shoot one advanced torpedo at each laser turret, and one at the hull, then do the same for the second. (This stopped either of them firing at my torpedoes from close range, and as I was targeting components, I didn't destroy them before I'd inspected them.)
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay205_zps2jqeueot.png

I made an initial strafing run, inspecting both and taking out any mines that I saw in passing.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay206_zpssduvboit.png

Then I bounced between each CRV, lasering the crap out of them - by the time I had to abort my attack run on one, I was far enough to make one on the other.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay207_zpszlimmcq8.png
CRV Mar Dunn goes down...

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay208_zpsqqdcaoq1.png
...followed by CRV Vop Hui!

CRVs, dead, mines all dead, ESC Hininberg had arrived. Next job: kill those %£$&*^# X-Wings before they got away this time!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay209_zpsvxpygidy.png
If you want something done right...

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay210_zpszw5rlh3w.png
...do it your damned self.

(Actually, the reason they kept getting away ws because of the ESC's missiles, which it can't always follow up on. But with me there, the buggers didn't get away this time. Also the ESC gunners were probably mad at me, because about twice I killed their missiles just as they were about to hit a fighter...!)

I wiped them just in time to settle in behind Y-Wing Blue as they attacked the Hininberg. Unlike previous missions, I hadn't quite been able to foil their attack runs earlier this time - but at least no rebel1 was going to escape.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay211_zpsfxt1a6aw.png

Y-Wings in a T/A. Like shooting...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay212_zps4vdyupsg.png

...well, Y-wings really, no simile would be sufficient.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay213_zps6eywzwtg.png

Then the B-Wings arrived, so I went straight after them. Like idiots, they went after me. Heh - they didn't even go for the containers this time.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay214_zpszu7akibf.png

I mopped the first two up - the third had inexplicable gone after my remaining wingman - as the last T/D boarded. The Hinenburg set off just as I was I headed off to assist Alpha 3, who was being attacked by the last rebel fighters.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay215_zpsomage0dd.png

Last-X-Wing...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay216_zpsnkjqpmv0.png

.. and last B-Wing. No fricking running away this time, rebel scum!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay217_zpsozazoe17.png

Meanwhile, Vader tells the Emperor all about the new T/Ds, and that Zaarin fears a leak and the rebels have a new weapon...

Primary Objective:
100% of all T/Ds must complete mission
ESC Hininberg must complete mission
Secondary Objectives:
CRV Mar Dunn must be inspected
CRV Vop Hui must be inspected
Bonus Objectives:
100% of all Mines must be destroyed
100% of all Rebel craft must be destroyed

12/20 kills. Both CRVs, all the Y-Wings (4), all the B-Wings (3) and three X-wings! No lost ships, either. T/A Alpha 1 got to hyper space and T/F Theta ddn't lose anyone, either! About time!

1Had to actively fight the urge to write "norebel" here... Dammit, pony...

That's all we have time for today!

As I said last week, though, my time is now gong to be much less limited, so we might get longer or more sessions per week, dending on how I go!

TIE Fighter

Training Mission 1: Gunnery (Attempted, up to X-Wing Dodec (four bonus goals failed))
Training Mission 2: Flight Leaders and Wingmen (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)
Training Mission 3: Destroy Depot
Training Mission 4: Destroy Probe (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)

TIE Interceptor
Training Mission 1: Threat Display (Attempted, two bonus goals failed)
Training Mission 2: Ambush![/COLOR]
Training Mission 3: Clear Minefield
Training Mission 4: Combined Attack

TIE Bomber

Training Mission 1: Proton Torpedoes (Attempted, two bonus goals failed)
Training Mission 2: Space Bombs (Attempted, four bonus goals failed)
Training Mission 3: Torpedo Run
Training Mission 4: Bombers Armed with Missiles

TIE Advanced

Training Mission 1: Concussion Missiles
Training Mission 3: Preemtpive Strike
Training Mission 2: Rocket Attack
Training Mission 4: Hyperdrive Upgrade

Assault Gunboat

Training Mission 1: Shields
Training Mission 2: Teamwork
Training Mission 3: The Challenge (Attempted, completed and then progress lost because the game crashed out because I tried saving the flight camera...)
Training Mission 4: Escort Duty

TIE Defender

Training Mission 1: Dogfighting!
Training Mission 2: Tractor Beam
Training Mission 3: Inspect & Disable
Training Mission 4: Disable and Capture

Missile Boat

Training Mission 1: Dual Warheads
Training Mission 2: Anti-Warhead Defense
Training Mission 3: Disabling Minefield
Training Mission 4: Missile Boat vs. TIE Defender[/QUOTE]

factotum

2015-03-05, 03:44 AM

Aotrs Commander

2015-03-05, 04:06 AM

You have so much more patience than I do--part of the reason I dropped the difficulty was so I wasn't having to replay the same missions over and over again, because that sort of repetition annoys me immensely. (Yet I was perfectly happy running Mephisto over and over in Diablo 2, possibly because he would drop something different each time and I was always hoping for phat lewtz).

On an unrelated note, looks like I won't be playing X-Wing: Alliance after all, at least not until I upgrade something on my computer--there's an issue that when I start actually flying the display messes up massively (it becomes a purple mess covering only the left hand side of the screen). There's a suggestion in the support forums this might have been fixed in an ATI driver that was released in 2014, but the latest Vista driver they have for my card (Radeon 5770) dates from the end of 2013! :smallfurious:

I am in generally in the same boat with repetition... But this is TIE Fighter, still one of my favourite games and one I spent even more times on back in the day, just under 25 years ago. (We got our first PC in '96, so I reckon I was playing TIE around '97-98.) So it' something of an exception.

(Also, to be fair, the let's play is keeping me more honest that I might have been otherwise, as in the day, my tendancy was to turn the cheats on once I got too annoyed!)

You might, like me, have to wait until the X-Wing Alliance Upgrade patch is rereleased on thier website (it's been down for over a month since the gog version of XWA was released) as that apparently should fix the graphical problems. I'm in the same boat with it myself.

Aotrs Commander

2015-03-11, 05:59 PM

The X-Wing Alliance Upgrade patch (and the attendant Ultimate Craft Pack) is finally back up for anyone playing XWA, for a significant graphical upgrade. I had a quick blast yesterday (and realised I actually need to play into the game a bit before I can get to the tech room for stats...!)

Odd thing, though... Despite the better graphics... I still think TIE is better. In XWA, everything seems more... hurried. I'm pretty sure the rate of fire is much faster. (Also, B-Wings and Y-Wings are no longer quite so laughable, as the buggers tend to shoot their laser AND ion cannons. It's not nearly so funny when YOU get disabled...!)

Anyhoo, down to today's business!

Let's try TIE Bomber Mission 2 once again.

Tie Bomber Mission 2: Space Bombs

Straight out of the gate, I vectored towars the two Headhunters that were approaching my wingmen, but they both were taken out this time. So I transferred all cannon energy to engines, hit 90 MGLT and unloaded all my space bombs on Abrihom. I swung round and went right back towards ATR Mako for a reload.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay218_zpsmjazfpba.png

While I was doing that, T/B Beta finished it off. I headed out for Bersabla, pausing to try and gun down a Z-95 that was chasing my wingmen. I got him, but not before it took out Beta 2. By the time I was in range of Bersabla, its shields were already down. I unloaded half of my bombs on it (in the hope that would finish it off) and then swung around to launch the last pair at Cyrlus.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay219_zpsludllqmh.png

BOOM. Bersabla went down.

Memorable TIE Fighter Quotes no.1: Today has been a very bad for the rebels!

This is the point it gets bad. The CRL Ossus Day show up, and I found - just like last time - ATR Mako was far away on the opposite side of it from me. I pegged it over, and got past it - though not without a glancing hit. I then got jumped on by a B-Wing and about four X-Wings while I struggled to get back to Mako. I got them all this time, though not without taking another hit, though fortunately not to anything important.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay220_zpsdqweanem.png

Sadly, FRG Implacable could't take a CRL, but it went out fighting. I was getting close, when the last couple of Y-Wings attacked.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay221_zpsh3qbxaxt.png

With them handily cleared, it left me, T/I Gamma and ATR Mako verses a CRL and PLT/3. I rushed over to Mako for a reload. Gamma bravely - and largely pointlessly - suicided attacking Ossus Day.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay222_zpsudjv0jp3.png
They managed to knock 4% of its shields, so, good job, lads...?

Next attack run. I was about 7.5 clicks from the Ossus Day at this point, so the "fire-while-reloading" trick was not going to work (and works very badly with Space Bombs anyway - you really need to be just outside of turbolaser range, really.) They knocked it down 64% hull. "Great," says I! "This is done!"

And then realised Ossus Day was now running to hyperspace. I had a fraction over two minutes.

Crap.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay224_zpsspz2ohck.png

It was now a race against time. Could Mako get the last 0.28 klicks to me and reload, and then could I get to speed and have the bombs hit before Ossus Day got to hyperspace...?
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay225_zpskfwpue6e.png
Yes.

Yes, I could! Thank Thrawn!

After that, then it was a case of one more reload from Mako (I was perilously close to being out of reloads at this point!) and then sit back and watch Cyrlus panic and die.

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay226_zpsyk7hzahn.png
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay227_zpsnznyunmo.png

Primary Objectives:
PLT/1 Abrihom must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives:
PLT/2 Bersabla must be destroyed
Bonus Objectives:
PLT/3 Cyrlus must be destroyed
CRS Ossus Day must be destroyed
100% of X-Wing group Red must be destroyed
100% of Y-Wing group Gold must be destroyed

10/27 kills. Two PLTs, the CRL, four X-Wings, a Headhunter, Y-Wing and B-Wing. The score was not bad, either I think the very best I managed was the day I killed all three PLTs and the CRL, but it wasn't far off that!

Always did like that mission!

Well, while I'm on form, I figured I should try T/A mission 2!

TIE Advanced Mission Two: Rocket Attack

A full squadron of TIE Advanced is to attack a rebel supply cache and destroy a rebel Frigate and MC-80 Mon Calamari Cruiser.

Being a bit older and wiser, only fired one rocket at FRG Inamo, to take out it's warhead launcher. I then strafed it until it died. I then helped TIE Beta mop up the containers until CRS Ardentarrived. First job was shoot the warhead launchers. I killed one, but I was having trouble getting in position to hit the other, and the CRS didn't seem to be shooting them anyway, so I landed the last pai of rockets on it. I left the fighters to my wingmen, and strafed the CRs, teadily taking out all the guns as I made consequtive passes. Once it's shield went down, I order TIE Alpha to come and help, as it was trying to flee to hyperspace. And then SHU Argus launched, and to my disgust, managed to fly right around the CRS where I couldn't get it and then buggered off, thus failing the sixth bonus goal. Ardent went down, though, and mopping up the rest of the A-Wings was trivial.

Dammit, so freaking close!

Primary Objectives:
100% of all CN/Ds must be destroyed
FRG Inamo must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives:
CRS Ardent must be destroyed
Bonus Objectives:
100% of all Z-95s must be destroyed
TRN Mule 1 must be destroyed
SHU Argus must be destroyed
100% of X-Wing group Red must be destroyed
100% of A-Wing group Gold must be destroyed
100% of A-Wing group Blue must be destroyed

Right, let's get back down to the proper battles!

Battle Six, Mission Three
Mission Three: Convoy Escort

An escort mission. With Gunboats.

This is gonna suck, isn't it?

Well, we'll stick with Advanced Missiles for the moment.

...

Hang on, this might be the one where you get attacke from two different directions.. Better watch myself...!

Yep. I was right.

First try, I got taken down by the rebel ATRs. Hmm. On the one hand, Advanced Missiles are not the best way of taking them out... But according to my failure brief from the Order, A-Wings will be showing up to attack any B-Wings I disable. Stick with the for the moment, I think.

Second try, same as the first...

Third time lucky!

This time, I was a bit better organised. As soon as I arrived, I started pumping shields and flying to approixmately where the convoy would be. The convoy arrived - followed shortly by X-Wing Blue, from the opposite direction. I ordered GUN Tau to go after them, and carried on.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay228_zps4uozavrm.png

The five B-Wings arrived, followed by ATR Storm. As I closed, I hurled two missiles at the first B-Wing, and then let them go past. Instead, I took out the most dangerous threat - the ATRs. The B-Wings being armed with Mag Pulse warheads are not a particular threat to the FRTs, since the latter don't have any cannons to drain and the former have to make attack runs with their guns. The ATRs, though, with turreted ions, are not funny. I fired three pairs of Advanced Missiles at Storm 1, knocking it out. I was at this point passing Storm 2, but it was too busy looking at the FRTs. I spun around, and thumped another three pairs of missiles into it - passing dangerously close as I did - before it could decide to start shooting turrets at me and take out my missiles like it did the last two times.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay229_zpszklzbddy.png

I now could turn back to the B-Wings. I lobbed m last two missiles at another on, then went after both damaged B-Wings with ion cannons first, then disabled the rest of the group.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay230_zpsnhp3xsuh.png

Something killed Blue 5 (not sure what) so I made a point of telling everyone to innore the rest. Next job was quickly clearing the rest of the X-Wings, so Gun Tau - who would maybe still have missiles - would be clear when the A-wings showed up. That was done quickly, so then it was a matter of waiting while the Anterab and Degathem docked (for primary) and Heavy Lifter U-3F14 grabbed one of the B-Wings (for secondary).
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay231_zpszoqr3nuv.png

The A-Wings arrived a minute or two later.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay232_zpsmglqmmiz.png

They were miles out, fortunately. the lead took a bead on the HLF, and I ordered GUN Tau to kill it. It died in the first pass, and the others were attacking my wingmen, so we cleaned them up pretty fast. Bonus goals complete!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay233_zpsqwugqylc.png

While I was waiting for the ships to finish docking, I went around and destroyed al the uncaptured B-Wings for good measure.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay234_zpssr4c7tux.png

Job done! That was...surprisingly less painful! (Mind you, I have a feeling Battle Six was about the last point I was ever able to consistently get bonus goals, so we'll see!)

Primary Objective:
FRT Anterab must complete mission
FRT Degathem must complete mission
Secondary Objectives:
HLF U-3F14 must complete mission
At least one of B-Wing group Red must be boarded
Bonus Objectives:
100% of X-Wing group Blue must be destroyed
100% of A-Wing group Gold must be destroyed

10/15 kills... Both ATRs, three B-Wings, three X-Wings, two A-Wings.

And I made Emporer's Hand, finally!

Mission Four: Punitive Raid

GUN Tau - all six of us - that's unusual! - are going to go raid the company that created the new Mag Pulse warhead the B-Wings were carrying last time.

Now, what I do remember about this is I need to VERY carefully watch the fighters I'm supposed to capture, since I recall this mission. I disabled one of them, and as I watched, my wingmen in the distance suddenly switched fire from blue to green... I frantically had to order them all to ignore the remaining fighters while I disabled them myself. So I better be careful!

Okay, first try, killed by the PLT. Heavy rocket time I think...!

Second and third try I was killed by the PLT. I needed to leave it until slightly later, when it's a bit distracted.

Forth try, I did really well. I got all the way to the end of the mission and found one of the bonus goal A-Wings had escaped. GRR!!!

Next two or three tries were the game throwing a wobbly again...

And then we come to the successful (mostly, as you'll see) attempt.

The first job is to kill Z-95 Headhunter Charlie, who start right behind you. Once all four are down, I turned my attemption to PLT Pondut and let it have all eight Heavy Rockets.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay235_zps9cc4dhfc.png

As we'd cleaned the Z-95s up fast this time, I flew over to TRN GEC U-47 on full cannon recharge, and pumped my shields. As it was, I managed to get past Pondut (as on 12% shields, I wasn't going to be able to disable it very fast) as GEC U-47 started to leave. I was then able to chase it down and disable it.

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay236_zps7ifh450k.png

SHU Kalree launched next, down the same vector, so that too, was disabled.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay237_zpscsn4eo48.png

Then Correlian Transport Lucky Day took off. Those buggers are fast (they're actually 89MGLT in XWA, and I suspect they must be close in TIE). Same vector though. By now, my ions were running low on charge, so in the interests of expediency, I shunted shield energy into cannons to disable it, and then pumped it back once it was down.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay238_zpsioqiocvk.png

ATR Omega had arrived by this point, and were attacking the station. I when in to help - the station was on 2% shields enough for me to make a near-suicidal ion-blitz attack (I even ended up setting my shield to double-front) but disabled it.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay239_zpsacqs6net.png

I could now assist in mopping up the umpteen Headhunters left with impunity, while ATR Omega completed their capture operations.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay240_zpss5vjmbom.png

The Y-Wings and A-wings showed up. I set GUN Tau after A-Wing Red 1 and then told them to ignore all of Y-Wing Blue. (Last time, I'd lost one of them to something or other.) I then chased down all four and disabled the whole lot of them, pausing to send Tau after Red 2 when Red 1 died.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay241_zpsrssmtoql.png

I finished the last one practically onto of CARG Bujiboi, so I made a near-point balnk attack run, landing the last shot at the very last second before I had to pull out or hit it!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay242_zpsutsva4ix.png

I killed A-Wing Red 2 myself (can't rely on wingmen some days...) I then had a breather for a couple of minutes. I went looking for the Tug that was supposed to be a reload vehicle (not that heavy rockets would help against B-wings), but it had been destroyed earlier on. The other Tugs set off for the disabled Y-Wings (this would take a while. Tugs are SO. Slow.)
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay243_zpsketgilaz.png

The five B-Wings arrived. Despite my very best efforts, I was not able to stop them destroying the unshielded PLT with heavy rockets, so I had to content myself with wiping them all out.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay244_zpsohtb5vpa.png

Now all I had to do was sit back and wait for the Tugs to grab the Y-Wings.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay245_zpscvwoxz2c.png

Except... Afte Blue 2 - the first one - was captured...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay246_zpseyksug5m.png

All three Tugs just... stopped. They all sat, frozen, partway through their docking operations, with neither time nor distance closing. For several accelerated minutes. I screamed. I tried ordering them to stop, and then go. This didn't help. In the end, I just ordered them home (which they did mercifully), which at least completed their bonus goal - and blew up the last four Y-Wings myself. Dammit, that should have been three more captures!

Primary Objective:
75% of all Z-95s must be destroyed
PLT/2 Pondut must be captured
TRN GEC U-47 must be disabled
CORT Lucky Day must be disabled
SHU Kalree must be disabled
Secondary Objectives:
At least 1 of Y-Wing group Blue must be disabled
TRN GEC U-47 must be captured
CORT Lucky Day must be captured
SHU Kalree must be captured
Bonus Objectives:
100% of A-Wing group Red must be destroyed
CARG Bujiboi must be destroyed
100% of B-Wing group Gold must be destroyed
Tug U4F91 must complete mission
Tug U4F92 must complete mission
Tug U4F93 must complete mission
Tug U4F94 must complete mission

We have the beam weapon, the Mag Pulse, and I've just been assigned to TIE Defender Training! A good day!

18/29 kills: three Y-Wings (*sigh*), one A-Wing, two B-Wings, eleven of the sixteen Headhunters and the CARG. Five captures (though it should have been eight!) Still, just shy of a hundred thousand score: 99733 - the highest score I've so far gotten on any mission! (I only got about 103K for the entire of Battle four!)

Let's have a look at the kill count. So far, I have 364 kills, 26 captures and two craft lost. an astonishing 86 are from Y-Wings, another 34 are Headhunters. 32 Are X-Wings, 23 are A-Wings, which means the rebel fighter I've killed least are B-Wings at 21. Well, I would argue that the B-Wing is about on the level of the Assault Gunbiat, and probably the overall best fighter the rebels have, so this is not perhaps surprising.

Next time, I shall have another good stab at some of the training missions (especially the T/D ones!) before we step into battle seven!

TIE Fighter

Training Mission 1: Gunnery (Attempted, up to X-Wing Dodec (four bonus goals failed))
Training Mission 2: Flight Leaders and Wingmen (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)
Training Mission 3: Destroy Depot
Training Mission 4: Destroy Probe (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)

TIE Interceptor
Training Mission 1: Threat Display (Attempted, two bonus goals failed)
Training Mission 2: Ambush![/COLOR]
Training Mission 3: Clear Minefield
Training Mission 4: Combined Attack

TIE Bomber

Training Mission 1: Proton Torpedoes (Attempted, two bonus goals failed)
Training Mission 2: Space Bombs
Training Mission 3: Torpedo Run
Training Mission 4: Bombers Armed with Missiles

TIE Advanced

Training Mission 1: Concussion Missiles
Training Mission 3: Preemtpive Strike (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)
Training Mission 2: Rocket Attack
Training Mission 4: Hyperdrive Upgrade

Assault Gunboat

Training Mission 1: Shields
Training Mission 2: Teamwork
Training Mission 3: The Challenge (Attempted, completed and then progress lost because the game crashed out because I tried saving the flight camera...)
Training Mission 4: Escort Duty

TIE Defender

Training Mission 1: Dogfighting!
Training Mission 2: Tractor Beam
Training Mission 3: Inspect & Disable
Training Mission 4: Disable and Capture

Missile Boat

Training Mission 1: Dual Warheads
Training Mission 2: Anti-Warhead Defense
Training Mission 3: Disabling Minefield
Training Mission 4: Missile Boat vs. TIE Defender

factotum

2015-03-12, 03:39 AM

Is it possible the TUGs assigned to capture those Y-wings were waiting for the first capture to get back to base before completing their missions?

Aotrs Commander

2015-03-12, 04:25 AM

Is it possible the TUGs assigned to capture those Y-wings were waiting for the first capture to get back to base before completing their missions?

No - because that was my first thought too. The first one did get back and they still sat there. It was definitely a glitch. TIE always did suffer from those occasionally. (I remember odd times when, for example, ATR Mako in T/B Mission 2 would end up 99+km away because instead of stopping after a reload, it'd fly off somewhere.) I'm sure it was never an problem in previous times when I'd played that mission - I'd have remembered a bug like that.

pendell

2015-03-12, 02:39 PM

Aotrs Commander

2015-03-12, 02:59 PM

Fortunately, that doesn't seemed to have every happened in the collector's CD version of the game. What a frustrating glitch! I'd throw my controller at the screen, if I was younger and saw that.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

But I AM playing the Collector's CD version...!

It's the first time I think I've seen that particular glitch, but, like I say, TIE can be a bit odd sometimes... And, of course, I am inevitiable unlucky when it comes to this sort of thing!

Aotrs Commander

2015-03-18, 06:08 PM

So, today I plan to tackle some of the training missions.

I tried T/A Mission 2 again.

TIE just WOULD NOT have it. Eight attempts later, it was just determined not to let me achieve anything.

Either the crusier killed me by getting several simultaneous hits and destroying my engine, or the crusier entered hyperspace when it was supposed to be two or three minutes away from the hyperspace point, when I sat shooting it safely, it turned and killed me, and then, when I'd saved my heavy rockets, we'd killed the Inamo way ahead of schedule the shuttle launched, rammed me and then jumped to hyperspace before I could even turn around, ot just shot straight out of the hangar and into hyperspace in a handful of seconds.

THE FRACK.

Basically, in order to kill the shuttle, you have to happen to be in EXACTLY the right place with perfect accuracy, else it just sods off.

The bit that is REALLY [EXPLETIVING ANNOYING] is it takes about ten, TEDIOUS minutes of holding the fire button down while you chip away at the Mon Cal's shields (your wingmen don't even seem to BOTHER to try at this point) for it all to be utterly wasted so the game can have a good old laugh at your expense.

Okay then. We''l try T/A Mission 3.

TIE Advanced Mission Three: Preemptive Strike

Fly a T/A from FRG Lightning (another vessel immortalised on my tabletop fleet) and destroy a rebel staging area.

From the sublime to the ridiculous (or rather the reverse this time...)

I came in, ordered my wingmen to kill one TUG that was sending pilots to the rebel ships and went after the second. Both of them died in the first pass. A B-Wing with missiles had a go at me, but I largely ignored it and went to inspect the containers.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay247_zpsraax5amd.png

I then ordered my wingmen to help me and we killed both active B-Wings. I then ordered them to help and we killed the CARGs.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay248_zps25zqknr8.png

It was then a trivial matter to mop op the rest of the helpless rebel fighters.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay249_zpsglqmtmxx.png

Done in six and a half minutes.

Primary Objectives:
100% of A-Wing group Red must be destroyed
100% of Z-95 group Red must be destroyed
100% of B-Wing group Red must be destroyed
100% of X-Wing group Gold must be destroyed
TRN Trole must be destroyed
100% of Y-Wing group Gold must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives:
None
Bonus Objectives:
CN/A Retinue must be inspected
CN/A Reyue must be inspected
CN/A Garble must be inspected
100% of CARG Juble must be destroyed

13/20 kills. Didn't even fire a single missile.

And this is supposed to be a harder mission than the last one.

Right onto TIE Advanced Mission 4 then.

TIE Advanced Mission 4: Hyperdrive Upgrade
Protect mission.

Bugger. This is going to be a pain, isn't it?

...

Yes. TIE Fighter just will NOT play fair today.

First play through, I got to the end and found one of the first A-Wings had slipped off right out of the gate.

After that, it continually attacked me advanced missiles (two hits are you're dead, full shields don't matter) AND something hyperspaced out. I lost count of the number of attemps I made.

I wouldn't even let me do it when I got so pissed I put invulnerable and unlimited ammo on.

Primary Objectives:
FRG must survive until other goals completed
FRT must have finished docking
Secondary Objectives:
100% of X-Wing Red must be destroyed
100% of Y-Wing group Red must be destroyed
100% of B-Wing group Blue must be destroyed
100% of A-Wing group Blue must be destroyed
100% of) Y-Wing group Blue must be destroyed
100% of SHU group Silver must be destroyed
100% of TRN group Logan must be destroyed
100% of Y-Wing group Scarlet must be destroyed
100% of E/S group Jackal must be destroyed
Bonus Objectives:
CRV Glaser must be destroyed
CRV Chiller must be destroyed
CRV Spurtzer must be destroyed

So I'm afraid at this point, that's it. TIE just doesn't want me to do anything today and we're out of time, with the least sucessful session so far.

Photobucket's stupid bingo popup (which it isn't supposed to be able to activate) crashed firefox, and it is only the grace of the new post-saving system that prevented me from just giving up in utter disgust.

This comes after on Monday the [expleteive]wits doing the road outside cut the power off without warning. Which mercifulyl my paranoia about saving meant I aboided losing more than a few minutes of work, but it did wastes about five hours of printing time on the 3D printer, as inot only did it cost me the time for the powercut itsel,f but another two hours to redo the print they ruined AND could have seriously screwed up the printer. (You're not even supposed to turn it off until the fans have swicthed off when it's finished printing.) Oh, and for good measure, despite us being the only house they're doing roadwork infront of, the [expletiving] council couldn't even be arsed to send us a note. It's almost impossible to get out of the drive because there's no straight run back tot he right, they've put sandbags on the left barely a car-width apart and someone always parks directly opposite the drive.)

Some weeks there just isn't any point in getting out of the crypt except to arbitarily inflict bloody death on anyone who happens to pass by.

TIE Fighter

Training Mission 1: Gunnery (Attempted, up to X-Wing Dodec (four bonus goals failed))
Training Mission 2: Flight Leaders and Wingmen (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)
Training Mission 3: Destroy Depot
Training Mission 4: Destroy Probe (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)

TIE Interceptor
Training Mission 1: Threat Display (Attempted, two bonus goals failed)
Training Mission 2: Ambush![/COLOR]
Training Mission 3: Clear Minefield
Training Mission 4: Combined Attack

TIE Bomber

Training Mission 1: Proton Torpedoes (Attempted, two bonus goals failed)
Training Mission 2: Space Bombs
Training Mission 3: Torpedo Run
Training Mission 4: Bombers Armed with Missiles

TIE Advanced

Training Mission 1: Concussion Missiles
Training Mission 2: Rocket Attack (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)
Training Mission 3: Preemtpive Strike
COLOR="#DAA520"]Training Mission 4: Hyperdrive Upgrade (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)[/COLOR]

Assault Gunboat

Training Mission 1: Shields
Training Mission 2: Teamwork
Training Mission 3: The Challenge (Attempted, completed and then progress lost because the game crashed out because I tried saving the flight camera...)
Training Mission 4: Escort Duty

TIE Defender

Training Mission 1: Dogfighting!
Training Mission 2: Tractor Beam
Training Mission 3: Inspect & Disable
Training Mission 4: Disable and Capture

Missile Boat

Training Mission 1: Dual Warheads
Training Mission 2: Anti-Warhead Defense
Training Mission 3: Disabling Minefield
Training Mission 4: Missile Boat vs. TIE Defender

Edit: One last question while I think about it. How do we tackle T/D Mission 1? It can either take two hours to do it "properly" (I did it once) or it can be done ludicously easily by just telling everything to sit still or you can trigger everything at once into a massive furball. What do you reckon should we do?

factotum

2015-03-19, 03:16 AM

T/D 1 is the one where you shoot cargo containers to get the enemies to attack in waves, isn't it? When I did it, even after destroying the waves, the ships kept hyperspacing in and then immediately hyperspacing out again, which was very odd. I'd suggest the massive furball approach first off and see what happens!

Sorry to hear about your troubles, anyway--may the fleas of a thousand camels infest the planning officer at your local council. :smallsmile:

mangosta71

2015-03-19, 04:56 PM

Cristo Meyers

2015-03-19, 05:37 PM

I remember T/D 1 from back in the day. Yes, if you shoot a container one of the fighters of each veterancy level hypers in, but if you destroy the container they hyper out immediately after their entrance.

That and T/A 2 were the missions I played most often just for fun. Lob a bolt at every container and watch the furball commence! I killed entire afternoons just dogfighting.

pendell

2015-03-23, 05:07 PM

Furball. The easy way is the boring way, even if that means we can't complete all the bonus goals.

T/A Training mission 2: Is that this one?

(NF) Historical Combat 5 Mission 2: Rocket Attack
Summary: This is one of few truly historical simulator
missions. Observation of a supply cache caught a Rebel
frigate during a refit. It was ambushed and quickly
destroyed. A Rebel cruiser showed up to help, and was
severely damaged, but not destroyed, before fleeing into
hyperspace.
Pilots would practice using heavy rockets against enemy
warships.
Commentary: The name of Tiger held by a single ATR in this
mission is also seen in B8M2 as a group, so the two may be
related.
Ship List: Inamo, Mule (also seen in B3M1), Nav/B1 NB-73,
Argus, Ardent (See also H2M3); groups: Tiger (see also B3M2
(no relation) and B8M2 (possible relation); these are Z-
95s), Shark (see also B3M6; no relation), and Demon.
[E.E.: In the goals summary, the container groups are
called Prongeds, but they are seen as Pi, Chi, and Xi in
the mission.]

I don't recall having super difficulty with this one. I think the reason why is that I carefully shot out the turrets and laser guns on the cruiser, turning it into a gigantic target balloon in space. Then plinked it to death.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Aotrs Commander

2015-03-23, 06:44 PM

Furball. The easy way is the boring way, even if that means we can't complete all the bonus goals.

T/A Training mission 2: Is that this one?

Yup/

I don't recall having super difficulty with this one. I think the reason why is that I carefully shot out the turrets and laser guns on the cruiser, turning it into a gigantic target balloon in space. Then plinked it to death.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

The difficulty is killing the *&£$#@& shuttle in the scant seconds between it launching and going to hyperspace... And another attempt meaning another five minutes of doing nothing but sat still holding the fire button down. Completing the primaries is [urine]-easy, even on hard.

I had another crack at XWA over the weekend. Dear FRAG it is so much less fun and harder than TIE! (Granted, I am playing on hard mode, but...) I took five or ten attmepts to get through the third or forth mission, because pootling around in a fraggin' transport where you can't dodge makes you easy prey for a concerted fighter attack. I kept getting killed by the planetary fighters. Eventually, I realised the only way to do this was to bugger your paltry two lasers and bang the shield rehargeto max (and dump the cannon energy in for the little fgood it does when you get hit0, since actually that gave you some moderate more power back.

Mission five is even worse, though. It's a "you must protect 66% of these ships" mission from an ISD plus T/F plus T/B attack. Best I managed was 57% - and the really annoyign thing is is doesn't give you a mission failure if they detroy the ships, so you'll be killing the dozens of TIEs and then realise you're the only bugger left. The biggest pain in the arse is that re-flying this mission means you have to fly out, fly through one sector and sit on you arse for two or three minutes before the ISD shows up. I think the only way to do it is to somehow managed to kill ALL the T/Bs more or less as they launch. I tried that the last time I played it, and the Empire managed to destroy all but 7% of the targets. I was like "what the fracking... Right, bugger this, thenm I'm going to play Zeus instead!"

Notably, there appears to be exactly one - fairly bare-bones and unhelpful - walktrough for XWA from around the interwebs, as opposed to the two or three more in-depth ones for TIE. Which is strange, sicne XWA is that much harder.

pendell

2015-03-23, 10:14 PM

I had another crack at XWA over the weekend. Dear FRAG it is so much less fun and harder than TIE! (Granted, I am playing on hard mode, but...) I took five or ten attmepts to get through the third or forth mission, because pootling around in a fraggin' transport where you can't dodge makes you easy prey for a concerted fighter attack. I kept getting killed by the planetary fighters. Eventually, I realised the only way to do this was to bugger your paltry two lasers and bang the shield rehargeto max (and dump the cannon energy in for the little fgood it does when you get hit0, since actually that gave you some moderate more power back.

There is a better way. Set your turret laser to shot at your currently targeted ship, then fly an evasive pattern. The YT-2000 is the toughest ship in the game, properly handled. I've taken out fully shielded VSDs with them, simply by using the turret lasers set to automatic fire on targeted ship.

And yes, the front lasers are pointless on a transport.

As it turns out, I happen to have the official strategy guide for XWA in my house. If you ask, I can look it up and post a sentence or two on any specific mission you have trouble with.

But yes, XWA is MUCH harder. I'm trying to remember how I passed that mission -- so far as I recall, it was just a matter of smashing the bombers as quickly as I could, paying special attention to any bomber firing on an unarmed ship. Warheads are much less useful against armed ships in XWA, because corvettes and above can just shoot them down.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Eldariel

2015-03-24, 03:28 AM

But yes, XWA is MUCH harder. I'm trying to remember how I passed that mission -- so far as I recall, it was just a matter of smashing the bombers as quickly as I could, paying special attention to any bomber firing on an unarmed ship. Warheads are much less useful against armed ships in XWA, because corvettes and above can just shoot them down.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

I recall you could dumbfire to avoid this.

factotum

2015-03-24, 03:41 AM

There is a better way. Set your turret laser to shot at your currently targeted ship, then fly an evasive pattern.

I recall doing that as well. I also recall that the turret guns don't use any of your laser energy, so you can set your laser recharge to zero and get some more speed out of your engines--that helps too!

Aotrs Commander

2015-03-24, 04:47 AM

There is a better way. Set your turret laser to shot at your currently targeted ship, then fly an evasive pattern. The YT-2000 is the toughest ship in the game, properly handled. I've taken out fully shielded VSDs with them, simply by using the turret lasers set to automatic fire on targeted ship.

And yes, the front lasers are pointless on a transport.

Yeah, the turrets are the only weapons worth spit on the transports. (It's worth noting I was dying in the YT1300, rather than the YT2000, and that was because I was trying to keep my shields charged with the lasers. I managed much better once I stopped trying to do that...)

The YT-2000 is waaaay better, though. Hell, the in-mission debrief says "run away when the advanced missile assault Gunboats come out!" Yet I absolutely creamed then easily every time.

In fact, if I ever get to the point of y'know, completing the mission objectives, I'm going to seriously have a crack at taking the ISDII down.

(There's a point you might stick some energy back into the cannons - to use the ion cannons once you take the shield generator components down...)

As it turns out, I happen to have the official strategy guide for XWA in my house. If you ask, I can look it up and post a sentence or two on any specific mission you have trouble with.

But yes, XWA is MUCH harder. I'm trying to remember how I passed that mission -- so far as I recall, it was just a matter of smashing the bombers as quickly as I could, paying special attention to any bomber firing on an unarmed ship.

If it has any specific advice on this particular mission (other than "attack the bomber to the exclusion of everything else"), I certainly could use it!

Warheads are much less useful against armed ships in XWA, because corvettes and above can just shoot them down.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Yeah, I will never forget learning that! One of the first things I did when I first started playing it first time around was to jump in the skirmish and say "right then, let's see how we fare: I know, I'll start with something easy like a Missileboat verses a CRV!" Finding out it shot the missiles down was an unpleasant surprise.

Finding out the Missileboat didn't have its SLAM was a worse one...!

I recall doing that as well. I also recall that the turret guns don't use any of your laser energy, so you can set your laser recharge to zero and get some more speed out of your engines--that helps too!

*skulldesk*

Dammit, so stupid! If I'm not putting any charge in the cannons, why am I keeping them at normal recharge after I empty them into the shields? I can afford to dump all the cannon energy into the shields, put the recharge to maximum and go back to a sensible speed and at the very least I can run down the T/B can't I?

There really is a big difference between flying a transport and a fighter, isn't there?

factotum

2015-03-24, 07:24 AM

There really is a big difference between flying a transport and a fighter, isn't there?

There is, and that's one of the things I liked best about XWA. Really must get around to downloading the patch thing and see if it will work on my machine, but at the moment I'm not starting any lengthy games because of Pillars of Eternity coming out Thursday.

Aotrs Commander

2015-03-24, 07:45 AM

I hear ya!

I'm putting around on Zeus mainly, myself: XWA I'm really only playing to get to the tech room!

Crow

2015-03-24, 02:12 PM

pendell

2015-03-24, 02:56 PM

If it has any specific advice on this particular mission (other than "attack the bomber to the exclusion of everything else"), I certainly could use it!

Right. We're talking about the 'defend the medical station' mission, yes?

The important thing in this mission is not to rush things. You can win the mission if you jump the gun, but that's doing it the hard way. Don't head toward the Corrupter and the Lancer-class frigates until after you're asked to join the fighter screen. Unless you wait, the fighting gets very heavy very quickly, and you're likely to lose too many rebel ships.

Prioritize the bombers. Remember, it's faster to disable them than it is to destroy them. It wouldn't hurt to have Emon attack that target type.

The assault gunboats' arrival is your signal to leave. Defeating them takes amazing skill: You must dodge madly while using E to determine which gunboats are attempting a lock. Break the lock by passing them or by using F to get them to veer off (preferably both) . It's vital you don't get hit by a missile; the time you spend spinning out of control will earn you many more in rapid succession. It's possible -- but not probable -- to survive one such barrage if you were near maximum shields when it happened. If you manage to defeat the gunboats, you can get the ISDII and the assault transports .

So that's probably what it is -- there's a hidden trigger which will dump fighters on you if you approach the Imperials too quickly. That must be why I had no trouble and you did -- I stayed near the platform on point defense until ordered to join the fighter screen. Unless I miss my guess, you're charging the Impies right away and getting more bombers dumped on you than you can handle.

That may be a more long-lasting clue towards this sort of game as well; when in doubt, role-play what a starfighter pilot would be reasonably expected to do and make the mission triggers work for you, rather than against you.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Aotrs Commander

2015-03-24, 04:10 PM

I kicked the crap out of that mission.

I dumped all my laser energy into engines and when the gunboats got within missile range I hopped in the turret and flew a straight line. This let me unleash a barrage on easy-to-hit gunboats while shooting down their missiles in the process.

That said, I couldn't bring myself to finish XWA. I just didn't like the asthetic of the game. The rendered environments probably looked great when the game first came out, but every time I play I feel like I've stepped into an episode of Max Headroom. I much prefer the drawn styles of TIE and Xwing.

Yeah, oddly the GUNs didn't give me any problems.

Ah, this is was the XWA Upgrade project (or Darksabre's Ultimate Craft Pack) is for. It's been around since back in the day, actually, but it's just got better and more refined. The latest thing is they've figured out how to replace the backdrops. It certainly DOES look phenominal. I'll try and grab some screenshots, though of course it's not like TIE where there's a conveniant button...!

Right. We're talking about the 'defend the medical station' mission, yes?

So that's probably what it is -- there's a hidden trigger which will dump fighters on you if you approach the Imperials too quickly. That must be why I had no trouble and you did -- I stayed near the platform on point defense until ordered to join the fighter screen. Unless I miss my guess, you're charging the Impies right away and getting more bombers dumped on you than you can handle.

That may be a more long-lasting clue towards this sort of game as well; when in doubt, role-play what a starfighter pilot would be reasonably expected to do and make the mission triggers work for you, rather than against you.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Interesting... Well, I try that next time, too.

Though the GUNs might be more of a problem at range, when they have more time to thoow missiles...

Well, with realising I can dump my cannon energy to shields, I might be able to do better anyway!

Tomorrow, though back to TIE!

Probably have another shot at T/A 2, maybe do GUN 3 and have a stab at T/D 1.

Crow

2015-03-24, 06:19 PM

Once I realized that I could switch my turrets from firing on their own to linked with the cockpit at will, things became much easier. If the target isn't in my sights at that instant, I'm letting that puppy fire at will until I'm ready to take a shot, then I take over.

Aotrs Commander

2015-03-24, 08:15 PM

Bonus Round!

I finished the campaign I was on Zeus really quickly, so rather than start something new (with Pillars coming out), I did a bit of TIE!

I had another go at T/A mission 2, and even kept a heavy rocket to trhow at the shuttle, but once again, unless you are precisi#ely and exactly magically in the right spot, nope.

I had a couple of attempts and GUn mission 3, but after the third or so time I died to the frigate, I decided to leave that one.

I then attempted T/D Mission 1...

TIE Defender Mission One: Dogfighting!

No screen shots, because a) dogfighting shots are not all that interesting and there's no "story" to tell and b) I just couldn't be bothered by the time I was done to see if I'd gotten any anyway.

So, as agreed, I started off by shooting all the conainters and startiung a massive furball.

It took two attempts - the first one some rebel bugger actually hypered out!

The second , fortunately successful one took two-and-a-half hours.

You'll have to forgive me, but when it cam to the TIE Defenders, I gave up. I fought properly until all the rebels were dead and I was out of missiles. And after a hour and forty minutes, trying to shoot down T/Ds with lasers - seeing as the rebels got virtually none of them (three out of FIFTY), I just was not going to try that. - especially as TIE had hit the point where the text started to go all distort-y and I was frightened it might crash out or something and I did NOT want to do that again! (And the CUV had been destoryed long before.) So I told them all to wait, and took them out one-by-one.

This still took fifty minutes. If you didn't hit them from exactly the rear, they'd just accelerate off and it was a bugger to catch them.

Once I'd finally - FINALLY - killed the last one, I mopped up the containers.

Primary Objectives:
At least one of X-Wing group Novice must be destroyed
At least one of Y-Wing group Novice must be destroyed
At least one of B-Wing group Novice must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives:
At least one of X-Wing group Officer must be destroyed
At least one of X-Wing group Veteran must be destroyed
At least one of X-Wing group Ace must be destroyed
At least one of X-Wing group Top Ace must be destroyed
At least one of Y-Wing group Officer must be destroyed
At least one of Y-Wing group Veteran must be destroyed
At least one of Y-Wing group Ace must be destroyed
At least one of Y-wing group Top Ace must be destroyed
At least one of A-Wing group Officer must be destroyed
At least one of A-Wing group Veteran must be destroyed
At least one of A-Wing group Ace must be destroyed
At least one of A-Wing group Top Ace must be destroyed
At least one of B-Wing group Officer must be destroyed
At least one of B-Wing group Veteran must be destroyed
At least one of B-Wing group Ace must be destroyed
At least one of B-Wing group Top Ace must be destroyed
Bonus Objectives:
CN/E Challenge must be destroyed
100% of T/D group Novice must be destroyed
100% of T/D group Officer must be destroyed
100% of T/D group Veteran must be destroyed
100% of T/D group Ace must be destroyed
100% of T/D group Top Ace must be destroyed
100% of X-Wing group Novice must be destroyed
100% of X-Wing group Officer must be destroyed
100% of X-Wing group Veteran must be destroyed
100% of X-Wing group Ace must be destroyed
100% of X-Wing group Top Ace must be destroyed
100% of Y-Wing group Novice must be destroyed
100% of Y-Wing group Officer must be destroyed
100% of Y-Wing group Veteran must be destroyed
100% of Y-Wing group Ace must be destroyed
100% of Y-Wing group Top Ace must be destroyed
100% of A-Wing group Novice must be destroyed
100% of A-Wing group Officer must be destroyed
100% of A-Wing group Veteran must be destroyed
100% of A-Wing group Ace must be destroyed
100% of A-Wing group Top Ace must be destroyed
100% of B-Wing group Novice must be destroyed
100% of B-Wing group Officer must be destroyed
100% of B-Wing group Veteran must be destroyed
100% of B-Wing group Ace must be destroyed
100% of B-Wing group Top Ace must be destroyed

221/255 kills. The rebel got a laughable three T/D, while they apparently got 7 A-Wings, 7 Y-Wings, 6 B-Wings and 11 X-Wings.

Mission score 373977

Well, funnily enough after that, I have had plenty enough for today!

Tomorrow will probably another stab at some of those missions I've no cracked yet and maybe one or two of the ones I haven't yet - I want to get at least a few mnore done before I get on to Battle 7!

TIE Fighter

Training Mission 1: Gunnery (Attempted, up to X-Wing Dodec (four bonus goals failed))
Training Mission 2: Flight Leaders and Wingmen (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)
Training Mission 3: Destroy Depot
Training Mission 4: Destroy Probe (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)

TIE Interceptor
Training Mission 1: Threat Display (Attempted, two bonus goals failed)
Training Mission 2: Ambush![/COLOR]
Training Mission 3: Clear Minefield
Training Mission 4: Combined Attack

TIE Bomber

Training Mission 1: Proton Torpedoes (Attempted, two bonus goals failed)
Training Mission 2: Space Bombs
Training Mission 3: Torpedo Run
Training Mission 4: Bombers Armed with Missiles

TIE Advanced

Training Mission 1: Concussion Missiles
Training Mission 2: Rocket Attack (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)
Training Mission 3: Preemtpive Strike
COLOR="#DAA520"]Training Mission 4: Hyperdrive Upgrade (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)[/COLOR]

Assault Gunboat

Training Mission 1: Shields
Training Mission 2: Teamwork
Training Mission 3: The Challenge (Attempted, completed and then progress lost because the game crashed out because I tried saving the flight camera...)
Training Mission 4: Escort Duty

TIE Defender

Training Mission 1: Dogfighting!
Training Mission 2: Tractor Beam
Training Mission 3: Inspect & Disable
Training Mission 4: Disable and Capture

Missile Boat

Training Mission 1: Dual Warheads
Training Mission 2: Anti-Warhead Defense
Training Mission 3: Disabling Minefield
Training Mission 4: Missile Boat vs. TIE Defender

pendell

2015-03-24, 11:13 PM

This still took fifty minutes. If you didn't hit them from exactly the rear, they'd just accelerate off and it was a bugger to catch them.

Once I'd finally - FINALLY - killed the last one, I mopped up the containers.

Odd. You should be able to outrun them. Once you hit them a few times they should have to divert power to recharging shields. With lasers at max and shields at 0 recharge you should still have a velocity of 156.

Though I agree the little dude are fast, maneuverable, and a pain in the center of gravity to shoot down.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

factotum

2015-03-25, 03:44 AM

Yeah, for me, taking on TIE Defenders without having a tractor beam and missiles available is just Not Happening. :smallsmile:

Aotrs Commander

2015-03-25, 05:34 AM

Odd. You should be able to outrun them. Once you hit them a few times they should have to divert power to recharging shields. With lasers at max and shields at 0 recharge you should still have a velocity of 156.

Though I agree the little dude are fast, maneuverable, and a pain in the center of gravity to shoot down.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

It was still a nuisence!

Somebody on ponythread linked this (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PN_CP4SuoTU&feature=youtu.be): seven=and-a-half minutes of glorious Imperial triumph. I'd seen the work-in-progress before, but this what a two-minute short. This full version apparently only was put up yesterday.

I want what that lass in the TIE Bomber was using!

factotum

2015-03-25, 07:26 AM

Somebody on ponythread linked this (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PN_CP4SuoTU&feature=youtu.be): seven=and-a-half minutes of glorious Imperial triumph.

That was *awesome*. However, if that mission had been in the actual game it would have been the easiest one ever--two SDs and an Interdictor versus a Nebulon-B and a corvette? :smallsmile:

pendell

2015-03-25, 10:23 AM

It was still a nuisence!

Somebody on ponythread linked this (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PN_CP4SuoTU&feature=youtu.be): seven=and-a-half minutes of glorious Imperial triumph. I'd seen the work-in-progress before, but this what a two-minute short. This full version apparently only was put up yesterday.

I want what that lass in the TIE Bomber was using!

AWESOME. And that is quite clever use of interdictor grav cones. Why doesn't anyone else do that?

Respectfully,

Brian P.

mangosta71

2015-03-25, 10:41 AM

I want what that lass in the TIE Bomber was using!
I don't watch a lot of anime so I don't know how often targeting systems like that pop in general, but I recognized it from the various Macross series. And yes, it would be amazing to have something like that in a game. Imagine unloading every warhead a Missile Boat carries in a single volley...

factotum

2015-03-25, 11:48 AM

If you want missile spam on that scale, play Freespace 2--there are small swarm missiles in that which look very similar to what the TIE Bomber did. Plus, it's an awesome game, so there's that too. :smallsmile:

pendell

2015-03-25, 01:29 PM

At 2:24-2:27 is that everyone's favorite flight officer in the briefing room looking quietly satisfied as all the TIE flights launch according to plan? You know, the one who briefs us on every mission in TIE fighter?

Respectfully,

Brian P.

russdm

2015-03-25, 03:46 PM

The guy who made it mentions that it is supposed to be a homage to TIE Fighter. We so need an animated version of TIE Fighter, with dialog and everything. The whole game.

Thrawn in Anime....Just sounds so wonderful.

Disney, remake TIE Fighter and X-Wing so we can play them again. (own both games in collectors edition, plus strategy guides for both. I even bought a joystick to play, an usb one) I loved the games.

Regarding the first TIE Defender mission:

If you inspect the container, the craft from that container will (should) arrive one at time thereby allowing you to blow them up one by one (I think, been a while since I played). If you shot the container, all the craft show up one right after the other and you get to fight them all off.

Aotrs Commander

2015-03-25, 06:34 PM

AWESOME. And that is quite clever use of interdictor grav cones. Why doesn't anyone else do that?

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Oohhh! Oohhhh! I missed that! i just thought it was some sort of jamming field, but you're right! That's so much more awesome!

If you want missile spam on that scale, play Freespace 2--there are small swarm missiles in that which look very similar to what the TIE Bomber did. Plus, it's an awesome game, so there's that too. :smallsmile:

Yep! I played that a year or two ago (and got about 75% of the way through the mod that allowed you to play Freespace 1 in 2. I didn't finish 'cos when I felt like going back to it, my joystick had had it.)

At 2:24-2:27 is that everyone's favorite flight officer in the briefing room looking quietly satisfied as all the TIE flights launch according to plan? You know, the one who briefs us on every mission in TIE fighter?

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Pretty sure it is! I loved the nod in the icons of all the fighters on his giant display, too!

Regarding the first TIE Defender mission:

If you inspect the container, the craft from that container will (should) arrive one at time thereby allowing you to blow them up one by one (I think, been a while since I played). If you shot the container, all the craft show up one right after the other and you get to fight them all off.

Oh, I know.

That doesn't make it any quicker to the the mission, though. Hell, you can inspect the container, fight them one at a time and order the others to halt one after the other and kill all 250 one at a time, pausing for reloads in the case of the T/Ds. (Or order them all to wait and shoot 250 sitting ducks.)

I think I may have done that once... I wouldn't care to hazard a guess how long it took me, but it was probably hours...

Right, on with it then!

We'll start today with TIE Interceptor mission 3.

TIE Interceptor Mission Three: Clear Minefield

Fly T/I Gamma 1 from FRG Lightning immortalised in my tabletop fleet!) and destroy some mines around a quartet of containers.

Well, this mission is going to be quick but messy...

Shock, horror, the first few times I died horribly (well, actually the first two times, they took out the radar, so I quit).

First time I cleared the mines, it was going great, until TIE decided to be a little bastard. I just killed a B-Wing - from a safe distance, I might add, but it threw the debris simply miles directly at me and killed me.

Grr.

Died almost straight away the next two times...

Next time, I went striaght to it once more. This time, I got a better rhythm. I find it you can basically pull into one mine after another, you manage much better and I did this time!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay250_zps6bibsmog.png

With the out of the way, time to kill the TUG, inspect the containers and destroy all but Koss 1 (which this time is the target.)

Three TRNs now show up to attack Lightning, so off I went to intercept.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay251_zps9t5g64a9.png

I got two, and Lightning's other fighters got the third.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay252_zps0zpok5pn.png

I moved after the B-Wings next.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay253_zpsxadxi52l.png

I killed the last one B-Wing, and completed my bonus goals. At this point, three shuttles had showed up and were attacking me. Ahrman 1 got awfully close and - as I was trying to get some space - the little fracker rammed me scant seconds after the screenshot.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay254_zpsdqva2tnd.png

Well, as I'd completed all the bonus goals, I figured, well, screw it, it's only a training mission. We'll call this one done: it's not like score really matters to the training room anyway, so...

Primary Objectives:
100% of all mines must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives:
None
Bonus Objectives:
CN/A Koss 1 must be boarded
TUG T-WF must be destroyed
100% of B-Wing Green must be destroyed

Let's stick with the T/I and have another go at T/I mission 1...

Nope, once again, B-Wing Red immediately start running to hyperspace the second you start shooting at them and you can't kill the fast enough. Maybe you have to fly behind them until they're much closer to the platform and let it help you...?

Welp, nevermind, let's try T/I mission four!

TIE Interceptor Mission Four: Combined Attack

Fly out of the Lightning in T/I Alpha 1 and destroy a rebel supply base and cover the TIE Bombers while they destroy the containers. TUGs are delivering rebel pilots to the fighters and transports, but are mostly well out of reach of you to stop them.

Frag me, this took a lot of attempt. Your wingmen are basically useless. despite my very best efforts, on all but a singler occasion, one dies int eh first pass, and the one time they both survived the first three X-Wings, the next Y-Wing got them BOTH. In sucession, a heartbeat apart. Bastard.

On my penultimate attmept, I came so very close, but a lucky hit had knocked out my radar. I still nearly managed it, but the TRN finally got another lucky hit in when iot was the very last ship to be killed...

Sucessful attempt then...

First off, in order to at least TRY to keep my wingmen, I ordered them to attack X-Wing Red 1 (who goes for me) while I went after Red 2 in the first pass (so at least they might just not quite go head-to-head... it didn't work well) and then Red 3 and finally Red 1.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay255_zpstmlfcchp.png

I then headed towards the Y-Wings. I knew I needed to kill Container Transport Moth quite fast, but the Y-Wings always killed my surviving wingmen... Normally Gold 1 went for me, but this time it didn't and went right after my wingman and killed him before I could even find the Y-Wings (because they weren't attacking me, nor were closer than the TUGs). Blast them, the little buggers. right. time to die!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay256_zpssjejtkql.png

With the functional Y-Wings out of the way, I made a beeline at Moth.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay257_zpsl5fbt6kl.png

I kept my speed low (I kept at the speed I matched the last Y-Wing at), as I had found last time I could nearly take it out in one pass and I was determined to this time. As I pummeld it and got closer, I matched speed to it so give me more time. It was at this point TRN Bultz got in range and started firing. Whoops! I slammed up to full throttle, but fortunately, I was just about done.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay258_zpscssfdpfa.png

Right - not having this "shooting at me" lark, not after last time...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay259_zpsjetvfrf9.png
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay260_zpswptg8plc.png
Especially not out of you, matey.

With that, it was now just mopping up... Killing the remaining stationary Y-Wing...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay261_zpsuf1emsn2.png

... and the last TUGs. I'd nearly forgotten, but TUGs are a right bastard to hit. If you aim right at them, you will nearly always miss, even at close range. I found this time, if I aimed slightly off-right, my left lasers would clip them. I managed to ram into the penultimate one, though... Fortunately, not doing too much damage this time...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay262_zpsmknfrsjd.png

Then home to Lightning!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay263_zpsgsusatxq.png

Primary Objectives:
100% of SHU group Revt must be destroyed
100% of TRN group Bultz must be destroyed
100% of Tug group T-SE must be destroyed
100% of Tug group T-SF must be destroyed
100% of Y-Wing group Gold must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives:
CN/A Duce 1 must be destroyed
CN/A Duce 2 must be destroyed
CN/A Duce 3 must be destroyed
Bonus Objectives:
CTRNS Moth must be destroyed

13/22 kills, not bad... Another one dusted, then!

Well, go on then...! We'll have a quick stab at the only TIE Fighter mission I've not managed to fail at completing yet, TIE Fighter mission 3!

TIE Fighter Mission Three: Destroy Depot

Take a single TIE Fighter (albiet with 4 Concussion Missiles) and destroy a rebel supply depot. TUGs are delivering pilots to the rebel fighters again.

The first time was perfect (I took all of the TUGs out in nearly one pass, and thus had a slaughter of the static targets) - right up until TIE decided to be a [female canine] again and killed me with one hit from the debris of the very first X-Wing. (I was fracking undamage, and it wasn't like I was even that CLOSE!)

I aborted the second try after realising the A-Wing moved off on their own after a minute or two.

Third attempt, I wiped all the TUGs, though, not before one of the X-Wings started moving. I killed it and the TUGs fast and the wiped the A-Wings. Then I inspected and destropyed the containers. X=Wing Gold showed up - three X-Wings. Which you have to destroy FOUR times. And, on the third wave, two A-Wings show up (and too close for me to be able to throw missiles at them). As I was beginning to have trouble - the CRV that had come to pick me up was doing its damnest, but it wasn't helping a couple of GUNs showed up. "Thank frack!" I thought. I managed to hunt down one A-Wing, but then - as usual for TIE Fighter missions - lucky hit = game over.

Well, that's it for time today then...

Primary Objectives:
100% of X-Wing group Blue must be destroyed
100% of Tug group T-XL must be destroyed
100% of A-Wing group Red must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives:
100% of CN/A group Vic must be destroyed
100% of CN/A group Limi must be destroyed
Bonus Objectives
100% of CN/A group Vic must be inspected
100% of CN/A group Limi must be inspected.
100% of X-Wing group Gold must be destroyed
100% of A-Wing group Blue must be destroyed
100% of B-Wing group Blue must be destroyed

Rather more productive than last week, at any rate...

I think the problem is with the missions I've been stuggling to complete, it basically comes down to luck, rather than skill. If you don't happen to be lucky, you'll fail the bonus objectives - some of them are absurbly narrow. (I may have plaed T/A mission 2 enough that I actually got that damn shuttle in the end, but it must have taken me loads of tries - and I would likely have been on medium!) This is ESPECIALLY true of the T/F missions, where you are so fragule, it is literally just luck as to whether not not you can survive.

I'd say I'd consider a reassessment of the training mission status to include whether or not they've at least have the primary/secondary missions completed... But some of them are so trivial it's not worth it...

TIE Fighter

Training Mission 1: Gunnery (Attempted, up to X-Wing Dodec (four bonus goals failed))
Training Mission 2: Flight Leaders and Wingmen (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)
Training Mission 3: Destroy Depot (Attempted, three bonus goals failed)
Training Mission 4: Destroy Probe (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)

TIE Interceptor
Training Mission 1: Threat Display (Attempted, two bonus goals failed)
Training Mission 2: Ambush!
Training Mission 3: Clear Minefield
Training Mission 4: Combined Attack

TIE Bomber

Training Mission 1: Proton Torpedoes (Attempted, two bonus goals failed)
Training Mission 2: Space Bombs
Training Mission 3: Torpedo Run
Training Mission 4: Bombers Armed with Missiles

TIE Advanced

Training Mission 1: Concussion Missiles
Training Mission 2: Rocket Attack (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)
Training Mission 3: Preemtpive Strike
Training Mission 4: Hyperdrive Upgrade (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)

Assault Gunboat

Training Mission 1: Shields
Training Mission 2: Teamwork
Training Mission 3: The Challenge (Attempted, completed and then progress lost because the game crashed out because I tried saving the flight camera...)
Training Mission 4: Escort Duty

TIE Defender

Training Mission 1: Dogfighting!
Training Mission 2: Tractor Beam
Training Mission 3: Inspect & Disable
Training Mission 4: Disable and Capture

Missile Boat

Training Mission 1: Dual Warheads
Training Mission 2: Anti-Warhead Defense
Training Mission 3: Disabling Minefield
Training Mission 4: Missile Boat vs. TIE Defender

(Actually looked, spotted and corrected all the formatting typos this time...! Why you've let me post it without mentioning that for several sessions in a row without mentioning it...!)

factotum

2015-03-26, 03:17 AM

Disney, remake TIE Fighter and X-Wing so we can play them again. (own both games in collectors edition, plus strategy guides for both. I even bought a joystick to play, an usb one) I loved the games.

You can already play them? Just get the GoG versions if the disc ones don't work.

Aotrs Commander: Yeah, you deserve a pass if you complete all the objectives before getting killed by the malicious hate of the RNG. :smallwink:

pendell

2015-03-26, 08:53 AM

And that's why unshielded craft are so horribad; because no matter how skilled and maneuverable you are, it only takes one fragment of stray debris to end a promising career. Perhaps that's one reason the Rebels have better pilots; their pilots have a much better chance of surviving the first mission!

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Cristo Meyers

2015-03-26, 09:05 AM

Perhaps that's one reason the Rebels have better pilots; their pilots have a much better chance of surviving the first mission!

One of the Rogue Squadron novels (the first, I think), actually says that this is pretty much the case. Imperial pilots rarely get much experience because their craft are so fragile and attrition is so high compared to the Rebellion.

Of course, it also means that any Imperial pilot good enough to last is really, really good.

hamishspence

2015-03-26, 10:39 AM

factotum

2015-03-26, 12:42 PM

One of the Rogue Squadron novels (the first, I think), actually says that this is pretty much the case. Imperial pilots rarely get much experience because their craft are so fragile and attrition is so high compared to the Rebellion.

Thing is, though, the whole "put thousands of cheap, fragile fighters out there" thing is Imperial doctrine. Presumably, if they care so little about the loss of a fighter, they care equally little about the loss of the pilot, so they probably don't even bother to give them much training. So long as they can launch from a mothership and identify which of the dots on their radar they should be firing at, job's a good'un! :smallsmile:

Cristo Meyers

2015-03-26, 01:30 PM

Thing is, though, the whole "put thousands of cheap, fragile fighters out there" thing is Imperial doctrine. Presumably, if they care so little about the loss of a fighter, they care equally little about the loss of the pilot, so they probably don't even bother to give them much training. So long as they can launch from a mothership and identify which of the dots on their radar they should be firing at, job's a good'un! :smallsmile:

Quantity has its own quality :smallwink:

I never said that it didn't make sense for an entity like the Empire. It does on more levels than people give it credit for (i.e. actual economic/political realities instead of puppy-kicking).

Though the idea that the 'Imperial Academy' that Luke was so jonesing to get off to being some metal shack out on Kuat is a pretty hilarious image...

"Push this stick to go forward, this one to speed up, and this one to fire. Only shoot the red things. Congrats, you're now a TIE pilottrynottodie!"

russdm

2015-03-26, 01:48 PM

You can already play them? Just get the GoG versions if the disc ones don't work.

I don't have a computer for playing them yet, will get and play until beaten. definitely doing x-wing first then tie Fighter.

And that's why unshielded craft are so horribad; because no matter how skilled and maneuverable you are, it only takes one fragment of stray debris to end a promising career. Perhaps that's one reason the Rebels have better pilots; their pilots have a much better chance of surviving the first mission!

Respectfully,

Brian P.

One of the Rogue Squadron novels (the first, I think), actually says that this is pretty much the case. Imperial pilots rarely get much experience because their craft are so fragile and attrition is so high compared to the Rebellion.

Of course, it also means that any Imperial pilot good enough to last is really, really good.

It gets repeated later - in, I think, Isard's Revenge - when TIE Defenders come into play.

Thing is, though, the whole "put thousands of cheap, fragile fighters out there" thing is Imperial doctrine. Presumably, if they care so little about the loss of a fighter, they care equally little about the loss of the pilot, so they probably don't even bother to give them much training. So long as they can launch from a mothership and identify which of the dots on their radar they should be firing at, job's a good'un! :smallsmile:

Quantity has its own quality :smallwink:

I never said that it didn't make sense for an entity like the Empire. It does on more levels than people give it credit for (i.e. actual economic/political realities instead of puppy-kicking).

Though the idea that the 'Imperial Academy' that Luke was so jonesing to get off to being some metal shack out on Kuat is a pretty hilarious image...

"Push this stick to go forward, this one to speed up, and this one to fire. Only shoot the red things. Congrats, you're now a TIE pilottrynottodie!"

To be honest, I think it has the affect of making the average surviving TIE pilot simply better than his average surviving Rebel pilot, because good TIE pilot ended up getting really good which is not the case with Rebel pilots as much. More of the less capable pilots will survive as Rebels, and surviving a mission doesn't necessarily mean learning from your mistakes. When you can live or die to the smallest mistake, it forces you to up your game and try harder, as we have seen with our LPer on this thread when flying unshielded craft.

I think having shields on Rebel craft helped them get better pilots, but it also means they keep the ones that lack talent or are unable to improve their skills. If you really look at, the Rogues/Wraiths are elite pilots, but act in ways suggesting being that elite isn't actually that high from standard rebel pilots. More pilots survive, but apparently the overall average skill is way lower than it ought to be.

Baron Fel is extremely happy that X-Wings have shields, whereas it appears that most rebel pilots pay no attention to that fact and look down on TIE pilots for lacking shields while not appreciating their own. I think the shields help Rebel pilots make more fatal mistakes. In fact when wedge is flying in a TIE Fighter at points in the X-Wing novels, he flies better than when in an X-Wing.

The tactical doctrine doesn't help either.

mangosta71

2015-03-26, 02:13 PM

I just don't see how a shield generator can be so expensive that it's more economical for the Empire to replace an entire fighter and the pilot rather than simply equip fighters with them in first place, while at the same time being so cheap and widely available that the strapped-for-resources Rebels can have them on every single craft they field.

factotum

2015-03-26, 03:06 PM

hamishspence

2015-03-26, 03:12 PM

I don't think the Rebels *are* particularly strapped for cash, are they? They seem to be able to get starfighters of entirely their own design manufactured, for a start, and their base on Hoth was extremely well equipped--a shield generator capable of withstanding a bombardment from an Imperial fleet and an ion cannon capable of taking down a Star Destroyer don't come cheap, I would imagine!

It should be noted that in the newcanon, A-Wings appear some time before the Battle of Endor (they're in preview pictures from Rebels Season 2) and B-Wings are used by pirates (and they're seen mere weeks after the Battle of Yavin - Luke ends up fighting them).

Cristo Meyers

2015-03-26, 03:42 PM

... and B-Wings are used by pirates (and they're seen mere weeks after the Battle of Yavin - Luke ends up fighting them).

I've long since shed most of my geekdom for Star Wars, but that still made me twitch just a little.

It's like quitting smoking, apparently, you're never actually free.

pendell

2015-03-26, 05:57 PM

To be honest, I think it has the affect of making the average surviving TIE pilot simply better than his average surviving Rebel pilot, because good TIE pilot ended up getting really good which is not the case with Rebel pilots as much.

I've already argued this, but I'll do it again. I don't think it works that way.

I believe the SW fighter battles are based on WWII experience, with the Tie fighter as a stand-in for the Zero (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitsubishi_A6M_Zero) while the X-wing closely resembles the American Hellcat (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grumman_F6F_Hellcat).

The Zero was a marvel of engineering for its time; it was extremely maneuverable and extremely long range, amazing performance made possible only by getting rid of all the weight that American aircraft carried: Pilot armor, self-sealing fuel tanks, ejection seats, radios.

The Japanese approach to training was also quite different: Their prewar regimen was incredibly rigorous and produced some of the best pilots ever; but after the war started those pilots were simply kept in the battle line until they were killed. As the list shows (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_World_War_II_aces_from_Japan). Remaining pilots were put in almost untrained.

The Americans, by contrast, rotated their pilots back to instructor duty, to ensure that the next generation of fighter pilots would have the benefit of their experience.

By 1944, the results spoke for themselves (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Philippine_Sea) . 373 Japanese casualties in the air vs. 23 American aircraft in a head-on air engagement. That's down to pilot skill, nothing else.

I believe the flaw in your analysis is that the number of TIE fighter pilots who survive long enough to learn from their mistakes is vanishingly small; certainly it was in the real world. A cursory review of the records suggest that, of the Japanese aces, they are almost all graduates of the prewar program. I cannot find an exception. I cannot find a single instance of a single hero pilot beating the odds to become a legendary ace. The American pilots, by contrast, were for the most part not ace caliber. They were, however, skilled enough to tear apart raw recruits, and that is all the experience they needed.

I think the same would work in the SW universe: Individual rebel pilots flying X-wings will survive their first few sorties more frequently and , for the most, part , will become competent pilots. The TIE forces will be increasingly made up of a very few extremely hot pilots with hundreds of kills to their score, backing up a mass of untrained cattle waiting to be slaughtered. Historically, those few hot pilots are not enough to turn the tide of an air war, or even an engagement. Sure, it happens in first-person games designed to make the player the hero, but not often outside that. Certainly X-wing alliance is brutal even to very good pilots.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

russdm

2015-03-26, 07:50 PM

I've already argued this, but I'll do it again. I don't think it works that way.

I believe the SW fighter battles are based on WWII experience, with the Tie fighter as a stand-in for the Zero (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitsubishi_A6M_Zero) while the X-wing closely resembles the American Hellcat (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grumman_F6F_Hellcat).

The Zero was a marvel of engineering for its time; it was extremely maneuverable and extremely long range, amazing performance made possible only by getting rid of all the weight that American aircraft carried: Pilot armor, self-sealing fuel tanks, ejection seats, radios.

The Japanese approach to training was also quite different: Their prewar regimen was incredibly rigorous and produced some of the best pilots ever; but after the war started those pilots were simply kept in the battle line until they were killed. As the list shows (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_World_War_II_aces_from_Japan). Remaining pilots were put in almost untrained.

The Americans, by contrast, rotated their pilots back to instructor duty, to ensure that the next generation of fighter pilots would have the benefit of their experience.

By 1944, the results spoke for themselves (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Philippine_Sea) . 373 Japanese casualties in the air vs. 23 American aircraft in a head-on air engagement. That's down to pilot skill, nothing else.

I believe the flaw in your analysis is that the number of TIE fighter pilots who survive long enough to learn from their mistakes is vanishingly small; certainly it was in the real world. A cursory review of the records suggest that, of the Japanese aces, they are almost all graduates of the prewar program. I cannot find an exception. I cannot find a single instance of a single hero pilot beating the odds to become a legendary ace. The American pilots, by contrast, were for the most part not ace caliber. They were, however, skilled enough to tear apart raw recruits, and that is all the experience they needed.

I think the same would work in the SW universe: Individual rebel pilots flying X-wings will survive their first few sorties more frequently and , for the most, part , will become competent pilots. The TIE forces will be increasingly made up of a very few extremely hot pilots with hundreds of kills to their score, backing up a mass of untrained cattle waiting to be slaughtered. Historically, those few hot pilots are not enough to turn the tide of an air war, or even an engagement. Sure, it happens in first-person games designed to make the player the hero, but not often outside that. Certainly X-wing alliance is brutal even to very good pilots.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

While I agree with most of what you are saying, there is one point that you are ignoring: The Americans had something like 3 to 1 or more in sheer number of fighters and pilots available to what the Japanese had. The Americans had overwhelming numbers, being more TIE Fighter like than the Japanese were.

Yes, the TIE Fighter could have been drawn from the Zero, but the sheer number of ships is drawn from the American side. And it wasn't so much pilot skill as numbers. The same exact situation as with the Japanese pilots happened with the Luftwaffe in the war.

The only time that even remotely resembles the situation for the Rebellion in Star Wars from the War was the Battle of Britain, where the Royal Air Force defeated the superior and more Numerous Luftwaffe. That was not the case or how it was for the Japanese, which in fact was the complete reverse of the Rebellion situation in that the Americans were the Empire and the Japanese were the Rebellion but the other sides' craft.

Numbers won more than pilot skill in this case. There were simply more American Pilots that could be thrown into action. In the case of the Battle of Britain, it was pilot skill and being able to retrieve pilots. If anything, the Star Wars Situation can only be draw from the Battle of Britain otherwise it makes absolutely no sense to claim it was from WW2 battles. By the time of 1944, the Allies simply have way more planes than their enemies do and you should be expecting the casualty ratio because of that.

I agree with your last point, but not your reasoning to get to it. No American situation could have resulted in how the situation is for the Rebels because it simply didn't occur like that. There is certainly influence, but Lucas flat out didn't copy Japanese vs. American air battles as much as European theater ones. If Lucas was copying the American/Japanese conditions then he had no clue what was going on.

hamishspence

2015-03-26, 11:57 PM

The trench run on the Death Star is themed more after The Dam Busters, than American bomber strikes, I'm told.

Crow

2015-03-27, 12:36 AM

The entire wingman/wing leader doctrine was in fact derived from numerical advantage as an effective way to press that advantage.

No other factor has as much of an impact on air to air success.

pendell

2015-03-27, 08:07 AM

Maybe so, but when the numbers are anywhere close to parity it's murder to send in undertrained pilots against those with experience. The only time in modern air warfare where I can recall that working is on the Eastern Front of WWII (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5JCsrjDI7hk), when the Russians continuously threw waves of undertrained pilots at the German Luftwaffe. Most of them died, a few became skillful. At the end of the war , the Russians had an overwhelming air power advantage while the German Air Force was non-existent. I suspect this was in part due to other pressure on the Germans from air battles against the western powers.

So it appears that sending undertrained pilots in inferior machines up against an opponent is murder. Crow mentions numbers as being the first deciding factor, but the second is flight hours (https://books.google.com/books?id=PlAAJReESsIC&pg=PT43&lpg=PT43&dq=flight+hours+fighter+pilot+measure&source=bl&ots=Fyc-g1Ea9H&sig=KLvrxy11yGBwVmb13ouALkoPE8o&hl=en&sa=X&ei=nlYVVeOSF4mogwSdgYToAg&ved=0CEAQ6AEwBQ#v=onepage&q=flight%20hours%20fighter%20pilot%20measure&f=false); skill, training, aggressiveness, experience. Indeed, below 100 flight hours a pilot is very likely to be killed from sheer accident.

If you have an overwhelming quantitative advantage you can still win, but you'll still pay a very high cost in pilot's lives. I have my doubts as to whether even the Galactic Empire can continue to throw away the lives of trained specialists, cloned or not, under such circumstances. At any rate, it seems to have cost both the fictional Empire and the real-world air forces who depended on this strategy a number of winnable battles.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

hamishspence

2015-03-27, 08:14 AM

So it appears that sending undertrained pilots in inferior machines up against an opponent is murder. Crow mentions numbers as being the first deciding factor, but the second is flight hours (https://books.google.com/books?id=PlAAJReESsIC&pg=PT43&lpg=PT43&dq=flight+hours+fighter+pilot+measure&source=bl&ots=Fyc-g1Ea9H&sig=KLvrxy11yGBwVmb13ouALkoPE8o&hl=en&sa=X&ei=nlYVVeOSF4mogwSdgYToAg&ved=0CEAQ6AEwBQ#v=onepage&q=flight%20hours%20fighter%20pilot%20measure&f=false); skill, training, aggressiveness, experience. Indeed, below 100 flight hours a pilot is very likely to be killed from sheer accident.

I remember Roald Dahl's Going Solo making a big point of this sort of issue - in his account of his experience of the Greece campaign.

Aotrs Commander

2015-03-27, 08:16 AM

That was why, of course, when Thrawn took over properly, he ordered all T/I to be fitted with shields...!

Thing is, the Empire too, was big enough that they could and seemed to take a sort of China-ish approach to problems: through (largely expendable) manpower at it.

Which really highlights how dumb not spending the money on the better fighters really was... But that was basically down to absolutely nothing more than politics. After all, it only takes a handful of people at the top who don't like the idea to make sure it doesn't come to pass. And there are plenty of example in history where this eact thing happened. (The British Army in WWI only being given something like two machine guns per brigae or something at least to start with, the French army in the same period refusing to wear helmets... the British Admiralty dragging their heels on guns... The list goes on and on.)

hamishspence

2015-03-27, 08:19 AM

Some of the later EU showed shielded interceptors right after the Battle of Yavin (Brian Wood's Star Wars comic series) - specifically, book 1: In The Shadow of Yavin.

Aotrs Commander

2015-03-27, 08:37 AM

Some of the later EU showed shielded interceptors right after the Battle of Yavin (Brian Wood's Star Wars comic series) - specifically, book 1: In The Shadow of Yavin.

Oh, yes, they were seen around quite bit. Thrawn just made it standard policy to apply to ALL T/I, not just the few that were converted by a few Imperials.

pendell

2015-03-27, 09:06 AM

Oh, yes, they were seen around quite bit. Thrawn just made it standard policy to apply to ALL T/I, not just the few that were converted by a few Imperials.

There may also be a certain amount of standardization going on behind the scenes. I don't believe a stock TIE interceptor can mount shields without taking a performance hit, since the power being pulled to pay for the shields is going to be taken from either the engine or the guns.

So an improved TIE interceptor is going to need a better power plant, at least.

Possibly Thrawn's decisions looks at all the different custom-made mods various Imps have done, and chooses one particular set of shield generator + engines + who knows what else which becomes standard throughout the Imperial fleet. This means the spare parts and training to run the new ship become standard as well, so the entire fleet can do it, not just the one squadron who has someone called "Pliers" as their crew chief and a box of extremely unstandard spare parts taken from a pirate gang.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

factotum

2015-03-27, 11:44 AM

There may also be a certain amount of standardization going on behind the scenes. I don't believe a stock TIE interceptor can mount shields without taking a performance hit, since the power being pulled to pay for the shields is going to be taken from either the engine or the guns.

So an improved TIE interceptor is going to need a better power plant, at least.

This must be possible though. Just look at the game TIE Fighter (hey, look! A sort of on-topic thing!)--many of the ships later in the game can have a beam weapon fitted, and it always works out that they're just as fast as the ones without beam weapons even when charging their beam at 50%. Therefore they must also have more powerful generators, as you say.

russdm

2015-03-27, 02:43 PM

This must be possible though. Just look at the game TIE Fighter (hey, look! A sort of on-topic thing!)--many of the ships later in the game can have a beam weapon fitted, and it always works out that they're just as fast as the ones without beam weapons even when charging their beam at 50%. Therefore they must also have more powerful generators, as you say.

I think that the beam weapon comes with its own generator which you can dump power from into your engines. Or maybe a new power plant installed first? The ships that get the beam weapons all have shields plus weapons, so maybe they have the extra power already in for use.

pendell

2015-03-27, 03:23 PM

Aotrs Commander

2015-03-27, 04:08 PM

From an engineering perspective, I'd wire it into the main power plant to make integrated power management and distribution from the cockpit easier, without the need for too many additional switches or controls. There's also the issue of where exactly we'll put an additional power generator on something the size of a TIE fighter; it's basically a spacegoing bicycle with guns.

ETA: Looking at Otaking's comments on the video (he's the original artist) -- yes, that IS the flight officer we knew from TIE fighter, voiced by Guy Siner.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Given how frequently the T/I is modified - never mind the sheilds, the not-infrequently added hyperdrive - though that DOES add some bulk, as T/Is so equipped do noticably suffer a performance hit), there's warhead launchers (which you can install WITH shield generators is you only fix 6 missiles instead of 12) or instead of the launchers, adding back the two chin lasers where the T/F had then - it would seem to appear the T/I actually DOES have a lot of space going spare.

You've got all that space you don't need on typical rebel shandy-drinking luxaries like landing gear, life support or (ouytside of TIE Fighter and company) ejection seats...!

hamishspence

2015-03-28, 11:38 AM

We know from Rebels Visual Guide that the TIEs of that era don't have ejectors at least. Or life support.

Meaning that in Fire Across The Galaxy, Hera & company were probably relying on the little oxygen a cockpit that size could hold for a few minutes - instead of wearing spacesuits or installing life support systems on that captured ship. They didn't even have time to remove Sabine's art from the ship's hull, after all.

Crow

2015-03-28, 12:46 PM

We know from Rebels Visual Guide that the TIEs of that era don't have ejectors at least. Or life support.

According to Wookieepedia: "During the scenes of the Millennium Falcon being pursued through the asteroid field, tiny figures that are TIE Fighter pilots can supposedly be seen ejecting from their fighters just moments after colliding with asteroids and exploding."

hamishspence

2015-03-28, 12:51 PM

According to Wookieepedia: "During the scenes of the Millennium Falcon being pursued through the asteroid field, tiny figures that are TIE Fighter pilots can supposedly be seen ejecting from their fighters just moments after colliding with asteroids and exploding."

Yup - though I only saw it happen once. It's possible that between Rebels and TESB, the Empire started installing ejector seats - or, it's possible that the corpse of the guy was thrown clear from the explosion.

mangosta71

2015-03-29, 10:18 AM

Consider the X-Wing versus the TIE Fighter. Similar speed and maneuverability, the X-Wing packs a shield and twice the firepower (before even considering standard warhead launchers). Same story with the Y-Wing and TIE Bomber. Somehow, despite the fact that everyone supplying materials to the Rebels was part of the Empire in recent history, the Rebels have access to vastly superior power generators. Granted, the TIE Advanced is superior to everything the Rebels field, and the TIE Defender is basically an unstoppable godchariot, but there's no good reason for the Empire to not have better fighters at the beginning of the war.

hamishspence

2015-03-29, 10:31 AM

Granted, the TIE Advanced is superior to everything the Rebels field, and the TIE Defender is basically an unstoppable godchariot, but there's no good reason for the Empire to not have better fighters at the beginning of the war.

Is the TIE Advanced really that much better than the X-Wing? It has the same two laser armament as a standard TIE (slightly beefier ones) - it just has access to missiles as well (whereas the X-wing has torpedoes). I could see it being faster than the X-wing - but is it more manoeuvrable and harder-hitting?

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/TIE_Advanced_x1

Standard TIEs tend to be portrayed as a bit faster and a bit more manoeuvrable than the X-Wing - but less durable and less heavily armed. TIE-Advanced are more like X-wings.

TIE Hunters were created specifically to counter X-wings and the like - combining speed with durability and armament:

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/TIE/HU_Hunter_multi-role_starfighter

pendell

2015-03-29, 11:10 AM

Is the TIE Advanced really that much better than the X-Wing?

Yes. It has 145 base speed compared to the X-wing's 100. In a turbolaser-only fight, speed is life. While I haven't tested it in X-wing Alliances' multiplayer mode, I think it fair to say that , given even numbers and absent surprise, Advanced will own X-wings.

The weakness there is the Advanced's superiority over the A-wing is by no means as obvious. The speed advantage, while still there, is far less impressive and the A-wing's missiles , especially if they are advanced missiles, make them considerably more dangerous than an X-wing with turbolasers only.

At any rate , the reason the Empire has such crummy fighters is because the Empire doesn't use fighters by themselves; they are an adjunct to an ISD. The fighters' primary purpose is to clear away Y-wings until an ISD closes into range and pounds the enemy to dust with its gun mounts.

It's a lot of the same reason why, in WWII, the US deliberately sent in tanks which were unable to defeat the top-of-the-line German models (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M4_Sherman#The_tank_destroyer_doctrine). In a 1v1, a Tiger's armor was impenetrable at any range with the original Sherman 75mm cannon.

This wasn't a mistake. The Shermans weren't built to tackle Tigers in the first place. They were supposed to break through enemy lines and support the infantry NOT get into tank-vs-tank duels. That's what Tank Destroyers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tank_destroyer) were for. Shermans didn't exist by themselves; rather they were one part of a combined arms team.

The choices made allowed the US to crank out 25,000 Shermans during the course of the war. By contrast, the Tiger and related tanks such as the Panther were produced in the low thousands, which had to be used on all fronts. And quantity , as it has been observed, has a quality all its own.

I think the same logic went into building the TIE fighter. The TIE fighter is not intended to be a craft for superheroes who are able to engage and defeat any combination of forces from unarmed containers up to star destroyers; instead, it is only one part of a combined arms system, the heart of which is the ISD. Yes, they probably knew from the start that TIE fighters would be no match for an equal number of X-wings, Y-wings, Z-95s or what not. The response of the Imperial planners would be , I expect, that if you're sending in unsupported TIEs to fight equal numbers of starfighters, you're doing something wrong.

The flaw in that logic, discovered by both fictional Imperials and real-life American tankers, is that optimal matchups are pretty rare; the enemy also gets a chance to choose the grounds and terms of engagement. When that happens, TIE fighters can find themselves fighting X-wings or Shermans find themselves fighting Tigers, watching their shells literally bounce off the front glacis at any range. It is possible for the inferior force to win, but always, always, always at the cost of high casualties.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Crow

2015-03-29, 12:41 PM

I believe Imperial doctrine called for TIE pilots not to engage the enemy with less than a 3 to 1 advantage in numbers.

hamishspence

2015-03-29, 12:48 PM

Turbolasers are generally a capital ship weapon - very few fighters can mount even the smallest of them. Certainly not the X-Wing or the TIE Advanced.

If you go by the data Wookieepedia cites, the maximum speeds and maximum accelerations of various fighters are as follows:

TIE/LN: Max speed: 100 MGLT, max acceleration: 4100G
TIE Advanced: Max speed: 105 MGLT, max acceleration: 4150G
TIE Interceptor: Max speed 111 MGLT, max acceleration 4240G
TIE Defender: Max speed 144 MGLT, max acceleration 4220G

X-wing: Max speed: 100 MGLT, max acceleration 3700G
E-Wing: Max speed: 120 MGLT, max acceleration 4200G (no source given for the acceleration though)
A-wing: Max speed: 120 MGLT, max acceleration 5100G

It has 145 base speed compared to the X-wing's 100.
Are you sure you're not thinking of the TIE Avenger?

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/TIE/ad_starfighter

When I was speaking of TIE-Advanced, I was thinking of the ship class used by Vader and a few others.

Aotrs Commander

2015-03-29, 08:30 PM

Are you sure you're not thinking of the TIE Avenger?

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/TIE/ad_starfighter

When I was speaking of TIE-Advanced, I was thinking of the ship class used by Vader and a few others.

Be careful. The TIE Advanced x1 is NOT the same as the TIE Advanced (aka TIE Avenger). (The former vessel does not even appear in TIE Fighter and onwards, though it appeared in X-Wing as "TIE Advanced" too.) It only even is not more confusing than it is, because the "avenger" thing was mentioned exactly ONCE in TIE Fighter as a throwaway line: otherwise, TIE Advanced remains the way that vessel is referred to throughout TIE Fighter (and it's sequels). It is only in other EU material outside the games that the TIE Avenger is called "avenger" and not "advanced" as a matter of course.

For the purposes on this thread, then, you should expect the use of the game terminology (since that's what we're discussing). I personally always make sure to refer to the TIE Advanced x1 with it's designation. (Technically, since the x1 was a limited production prototype and the T/A was a full production model, the T/A is the proper TIE Advanced anyway.)

Also, the stats on wookiepedia are very inconsistent and not always correct. (It lists both the T/A and T/D as 100 SBD - the TIE stats for one, the XWA stats for the other - and as I proved up thread, the T/A in reality never did have 100 SBD, and the T/D actually did.) I've been going through a great deal of sources trying to work out what stats to use for my tabletop games and the depressing truth is, there is no "correct" answer and wookiepedia, is sadly, no more a correct and concrete source than any other.

hamishspence

2015-03-30, 01:09 AM

And to add to the confusion, another TIE Advanced variant was introduced - the TIE Advanced v1 from Rebels (same kind of ship as the Inquisitor's TIE).

Also, the stats on wookiepedia are very inconsistent and not always correct. (It lists both the T/A and T/D as 100 SBD - the TIE stats for one, the XWA stats for the other - and as I proved up thread, the T/A in reality never did have 100 SBD, and the T/D actually did.)

I remember this bit:

Addendum to the edits above.

I spent a bit of time this evening doing a load of experimentation.

For twenty years, I have worked on the basis that the T/D as of TIE Fighter was a superlative fighter, so powerful it was broken for multiplayer, nearly at the pinnicle of the Empire's fighter program.

Now I'm not so sure.

What shields does a T/D have? XWA gave it 100, but TIE always said it was 200.

The problem is, as I've been experimenting - I don't think that's actually TRUE.

I've been running some test in TIE between the GUN, T/A, T/D and MISS, going into some of the early training missions and fiddling around with the power and timing it.

Some things of note.

1) The GUN and T/D take about 7-8 minutes to recharge from zero to maximum shields on full recharge. The MISS takes about 10... and the T/A takes about four.

2) All vessels recharge all their cannons from zero to full in about 32 seconds at maximum recharge.

3) The GUN takes 5 full cannon charge tracks to bring it from zero to maximum shields. The T/A takes two-and-a-half, the T/D 3.5 and the MISS 6.

(Incidently, this proves that shield recharge above normal is absolutely pointless, as cannon => shields is much faster.)

I also attempted to get shot with one (regular) missile at full shields.

Both the GUN and the T/D were taken down to red on the outer layer. The MISS, when shot by an advanced missile, goes down to green on the inner layer. (I hadn't contrived to get a missle shot at a T/A yet.)

This would be consistent with the layers being 50/50 (that is 50/50 in the front arc and 50/50 in the rear arc), being reduced to 20/50 in the former pair and 60/60 to 0/60 in the latter.

I also made sure I shot a a fully-shielded T/D (on T/D mission one, where I could obligingly get one to stop for me). It reduced the shields to 96%. After it had recharged, a single advanced missile hit reduced it's shields to 40%.

I know from prior experimentation that a single shot is about 4 damage in XWA, and like the warhead damage, that hasn't changed from the earlier games.

The evidence is somewhat worrying.

A T/D takes 4 damage and goes to 96%, and takes 60 damage and goes to 40%. Which it can only do if it had 100 SBD shields. Notably, it has the same recharge time asthe GUN, and appears to show the same amount of shield loss as they GUN when hit by a regular missile.

Notably, the GUN's 5 full recharges (x 4 guns) => twenty, and the T/D's approx 3.5 recharges (x 6 guns) => 21... which suggests accounting for the rounding, it is twenty. The same.

The T/A, on the other hand, takes half as long to charge it's shields. This suggests either it has half the shields of the GUN and T/D, or has some sort of fast recharge.

I went and experimented with the T/A in T/A mission one and got hi by a missile. Which reduced the shields to green on the inner layer. So it appears it has less shields than the T/D and GUN... Indeed, the amount of damage taken would seem to support a 50SBD shield (25/25 => 0/20).

I haven't checked yet to see if difficulty levels make any difference (I'm playing on hard mode). I suspect they don't because I was doing a let's play of TIE and Battle 1 mission 5 and the X-Wings were hittin my GUN with advanced missiles and reducing the shields to yellow on the inner (consistent with 50/50 =>0/40) on medium as well, I'm pretty sure. (I will have to check.)

If the warhead damage is the same, though, it's pretty conclusive as far as I can experimentally determine. The GUN and the T/D appear to have the same shields... which is twice that of the T/A. Contrary to everything TIE Fighter said.

(Incidently, I can see no evidence for either TIE of any supposed "rapid recharge" shielding.)

This would also explain how you can KO a T/D with a pair of advanced missiles or a single advanced torpedo. (Which even at the time I thought was odd, since that should really have only reduced the shields to 40% and 25% respectively for a 200 SBD shield.)

The Missileboat, on the other hand, does appear to display consistency with a 120SBD (+20% recharge times in both forms of recharge, plus the evidence of the missile hits.)

So, XvT (and XWA) may actually not have modified the shields of the T/A and T/D much at all - they may have just corrected them to what they appear to have ACTUALLY been, not what TIE told us they were.

(I don't know how I didn't notice this two decade ago, really, or how anyone else hasn't!)

I'm a bit disheartened, really, since I have spent twenty years cheering on the T/D (and T/A) as ridiculously awesome and having to be toned down for the sake of cowardly rebels in the later games... To find out that, actually, it has been wrong since the start.

What is not clear is why the given values in TIE are wrong - and they're stated wrong in several places, so it's more than just one typo, and whether the intention was to have the T/A and GUN at 100 and the T/D at 200 or what.

mangosta71

2015-03-30, 12:21 PM

At any rate , the reason the Empire has such crummy fighters is because the Empire doesn't use fighters by themselves; they are an adjunct to an ISD. The fighters' primary purpose is to clear away Y-wings until an ISD closes into range and pounds the enemy to dust with its gun mounts.

It's a lot of the same reason why, in WWII, the US deliberately sent in tanks which were unable to defeat the top-of-the-line German models (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M4_Sherman#The_tank_destroyer_doctrine). In a 1v1, a Tiger's armor was impenetrable at any range with the original Sherman 75mm cannon.

This wasn't a mistake. The Shermans weren't built to tackle Tigers in the first place. They were supposed to break through enemy lines and support the infantry NOT get into tank-vs-tank duels. That's what Tank Destroyers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tank_destroyer) were for. Shermans didn't exist by themselves; rather they were one part of a combined arms team.

The choices made allowed the US to crank out 25,000 Shermans during the course of the war. By contrast, the Tiger and related tanks such as the Panther were produced in the low thousands, which had to be used on all fronts. And quantity , as it has been observed, has a quality all its own.

I think the same logic went into building the TIE fighter. The TIE fighter is not intended to be a craft for superheroes who are able to engage and defeat any combination of forces from unarmed containers up to star destroyers; instead, it is only one part of a combined arms system, the heart of which is the ISD. Yes, they probably knew from the start that TIE fighters would be no match for an equal number of X-wings, Y-wings, Z-95s or what not. The response of the Imperial planners would be , I expect, that if you're sending in unsupported TIEs to fight equal numbers of starfighters, you're doing something wrong.

The flaw in that logic, discovered by both fictional Imperials and real-life American tankers, is that optimal matchups are pretty rare; the enemy also gets a chance to choose the grounds and terms of engagement. When that happens, TIE fighters can find themselves fighting X-wings or Shermans find themselves fighting Tigers, watching their shells literally bounce off the front glacis at any range. It is possible for the inferior force to win, but always, always, always at the cost of high casualties.

Respectfully,

Brian P.
The flaw in applying this logic to the Empire is that cranking out huge numbers of subpar pieces of equipment is a move that only happens during wartime, when there isn't time to develop something better and convert the industrial base. The Empire has had control and peace for 20 years when the Rebellion pops up. They have the time and infrastructure for some R&D. It's inconceivable that not a single commander in the entire Imperial Navy did anything to protect his pilots until Thrawn came around and started having shields installed on some of his TIEs. We're supposed to believe that, at no point, a commander looked over a casualty report from an engagement and thought, "Well, we need to replace 90% of our fighter screen again. If only there was some type of cheap, readily available equipment that would reduce our losses." It's preposterous. Even if they don't care about the lives of the men under their command, they should be annoyed that they have to return to port after every engagement and be out of action for however long it takes to assemble a new air group.

hamishspence

2015-03-30, 12:24 PM

I could see them having to fight pirates, and "leftover Separatists" throughout those 20 years - even if it was a far lower level of conflict than the Clone Wars were.

Crow

2015-03-30, 12:45 PM

I believe the emperor's guard used TIE interceptors fitted with shield generators. So surely somebody considered it at some point.

pendell

2015-03-30, 03:18 PM

I believe the emperor's guard used TIE interceptors fitted with shield generators. So surely somebody considered it at some point.

In TIE Fighter the game, they use assault gunboats.

At any rate, I agree that just because they haven't had a major war in 20 years doesn't mean there isn't plenty of work for the navy performing peacekeeping, pirate suppression, and so forth. I think only about half your missions in TIE fighter are against the Rebellion proper.

Of course, there's another factor at play in these battles and that is intimidation. If an ISD jumps in next to your hidden asteroid pirate base, dogfighting TIE's is probably going to be the last thing on your mind. What you want to do at this point is to evacuate as quickly as possible. You'd want to avoid dogfighting TIES because if you get into it with them, you'll be swarmed and they'll tack a murder charge onto whatever else you're wanted for, if you hit them.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Crow

2015-03-30, 05:41 PM

In TIE Fighter the game, they use assault gunboats.

At any rate, I agree that just because they haven't had a major war in 20 years doesn't mean there isn't plenty of work for the navy performing peacekeeping, pirate suppression, and so forth. I think only about half your missions in TIE fighter are against the Rebellion proper.

Of course, there's another factor at play in these battles and that is intimidation. If an ISD jumps in next to your hidden asteroid pirate base, dogfighting TIE's is probably going to be the last thing on your mind. What you want to do at this point is to evacuate as quickly as possible. You'd want to avoid dogfighting TIES because if you get into it with them, you'll be swarmed and they'll tack a murder charge onto whatever else you're wanted for, if you hit them.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

This actually makes sense, especially if you consider the TIE's to be a type of "light cavalry", a pursuit force. It wasn't until the Alliance started getting their hands on heavy-hitting hardware that the empire started shielding their craft, because until then people weren't standing toe to toe with them on a basis regular enough to warrant it.

factotum

2015-03-31, 02:15 AM

I think only about half your missions in TIE fighter are against the Rebellion proper.

I don't think it's even that many, possibly because the TIE Advanced and TIE Defender outmatch the equivalent Rebel fighters by such a margin that it would be a cakewalk if you were just fighting the Rebellion!

hamishspence

2015-03-31, 05:57 AM

If, as Aotrs Commander points out, the TIE Defender and TIE Advanced's "real" shield ratings are only 100 and 50 respectively, they may not outmatch their Rebel counterparts so much.

Aotrs Commander

2015-03-31, 06:19 AM

If, as Aotrs Commander points out, the TIE Defender and TIE Advanced's "real" shield ratings are only 100 and 50 respectively, they may not outmatch their Rebel counterparts so much.

To be fair, though, the T/A and T/D are still better than the rebel fighters - T/D especially - on account of you just can't shoot the [expletives]. It's just the margin of supremacy is less than I've been lead to believe over the last twenty years.

And the Missileboat still urinates on them all from a great height, while laughing.

I think only about half your missions in TIE fighter are against the Rebellion proper.

Let's take a quick check shall we? Out of 6 battles so far, we have currently 1/6 which "vrs Empire." Battles 7,8,9,11 and 13 are also vrs "Empire" basically, while 10 and 12 vrs "not Empire." So you are fighting roughly 6/13 against "imperial" enemies and 7/13 against not Imperial enemies (with battle 10 actually being somewhere in the middle.)

So, yes, about 50% then, is against, if not rebels, then rebel-level tech.

hamishspence

2015-03-31, 06:30 AM

Aotrs Commander

2015-03-31, 07:17 AM

In the books, TIE Defender shields are sometimes portrayed as even weaker, "equal to those of an X-Wing" in Starfighters of Adumar (although it's possible that the X-Wings in question are significantly more advanced than those at the Battle of Endor - it's 8 years on, after all - with the Imperial Remnant not having upgraded their few Defenders as much).

Firepower, speed, and maneuverability are where it exceeds them.

The later models of X-Wings are supposed to be much better, having "stronger" shields and "better" manouverability... But apart from speed, I'll be damned if I can find anywhere that even suggests by what sort of magnitude their shields strength or manouerability is "better."

Which is tedious, since on the tabletop games, the rebela kinds need something to vaguely keep up...

mangosta71

2015-03-31, 08:56 AM

By the time T/Ds are around, the Rebels have numerical superiority. And since they've been at war the whole time, it makes sense for them to fill the skies with lower-cost, not-quite-as-good craft and depend on their numbers to overwhelm the Remnants.

But I still maintain that peacekeeping and hunting pirates do not require anything approaching the resources that war on a galactic scale does. There's no sensible reason for the Empire's R&D to not make a single advance in 20 years, and then suddenly go into overdrive and pump out the T/A, T/D, and Missile Boat all in short order (that close together means simultaneous programs and prototypes, not to mention that the MB is explicitly designed to counter the T/D, which means the design process would have had to start before the plans for the T/D were even finalized). At the very least, the T/A should have been the primary front-line fighter when the Rebellion popped up, with T/Ds starting to be deployed to elite squadrons, and the T/F, T/I, and T/B relegated to training squadrons, garrisons, museums, anywhere but the front. Not that shields seem to matter in the movies, as a single hit will destroy any fighter that doesn't have impenetrable plot armor anyway...

I guess I've just become less of a fan of unrealistic universes in general as I've aged and learned more about how things actually work. :smallsigh:

hamishspence

2015-03-31, 09:41 AM

In the very recent book Imperial Handbook (virtually the last Legends reference work) TIE Defenders are already described as being a work in progress.

(the book purports to be an in-universe document created for Imperial Commanders right before the Battle of Yavin - the "in-universe" conceit is the same as for previous books in the series, The Jedi Path, Book of Sith, and The Bounty Hunter's Code.)

In The Essential Guide to Warfare there's a page on the TIE Advanced programme:

TIE Advanced x1 (Vader-type, never went into production)
TIE Advanced x2 (Eventually became the TIE/AD, "dubbed the TIE Avenger")
TIE Advanced x3 (Became the TIE Interceptor - was the one the Fleet "opted for" instead of the TIE Advanced x2)

Appearances of ships that look like TIE Defenders before the Zaarin campaign, or TIE Interceptors some time before Yavin, can be explained as prototypes rather than production models. TIE Advanced x7, in the case of the TIE Defender.

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/TIE/Ad_x7
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/TIE/D_Defender

TIE Defenders appear in Star Wars Battlefront: Renegade Squadron and fighters which appear to be TIE Defenders can be seen in Star Wars: Rebellion 5: My Brother, My Enemy, Part 5, both of which take place before the canonical debut of the class after the Battle of Hoth, as established by TIE Fighter and repeated in numerous sources. This is similar to the history of the RZ-1 A-wing interceptor, whose pre-Yavin appearances have since been retconned into the R-22 Spearhead. The appearance of the TIE Defender in Renegade Squadron was explained in The Official Starships & Vehicles Collection 67 which established them as early TIE Advanced x7 prototypes.

factotum

2015-03-31, 09:53 AM

There's no sensible reason for the Empire's R&D to not make a single advance in 20 years, and then suddenly go into overdrive and pump out the T/A, T/D, and Missile Boat all in short order

Part of the problem is that the Star Wars galaxy is supposed to be largely technologically stagnant, with breakthroughs generally being re-inventions of earlier tech--hence the tech level in KotOR, set 4,000 years before the movies, is not significantly lower than "modern day".

pendell

2015-03-31, 12:20 PM

Indeed. The SW universe is like premodern China or the middle ages, in which a first century farmer's life is not notably different from a tenth century one.

Still, the writers did give the rebels new toys such as the E-wing (http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/E-wing_escort_starfighter).

I think the problem is that X-wings are iconic, so they're kept around despite in real-world technology they are long past their sell-by date. In the real world, the X-wing's sharp angles and unstealthy profile make it look anachronistic next to the real world Rafale (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dassault_Rafale) or F-22 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_Martin_F-22_Raptor).

...

I suppose that if air war had occurred in a fictional universe people would still be flying around in prop planes since the modern BVR environment isn't anywhere near as sexy and dramatic. Sort of like this (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Tails).

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Crow

2015-03-31, 12:49 PM

I believe I read somewhere that the Republic's aurek strikefighters and hammerhead cruisers served the republic for around 300 years. The models were in use that is; I don't think individual ships served that long.

hamishspence

2015-03-31, 01:12 PM

Capital ship designs can last even longer.

Sadow's Derriphan-class battleship did fine during the Great Sith War 1000 years later - at least until it got caught in the supernova its unwary captain accidentally triggered.

More Derriphan-class ships were created by Revan after finding the Star Forge, I think.

And the Corporate Sector Authority used the downright ancient Invincible class dreadnoughts from 3000 years before.

The X-wing, I see as like some long-lived aircraft designs in real life (Hercules? B52?) - new avionics can keep an old design going much longer than originally intended.

I think the problem is that X-wings are iconic, so they're kept around despite in real-world technology they are long past their sell-by date. In the real world, the X-wing's sharp angles and unstealthy profile make it look anachronistic next to the real world Rafale (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dassault_Rafale) or F-22 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_Martin_F-22_Raptor).

The existence of the F-22 doesn't mean that the F-15 Eagle is "completely past its sell-by-date" though. Sufficiently good old designs can stay viable even when there's new ones.

GloatingSwine

2015-03-31, 07:32 PM

I think the problem is that X-wings are iconic, so they're kept around despite in real-world technology they are long past their sell-by date. In the real world, the X-wing's sharp angles and unstealthy profile make it look anachronistic next to the real world Rafale or F-22.

On the other hand, you can't have stealth in space anyway because you can't make heat not be a thing, so your radar cross section isn't terribly relevant to the proceedings.

hamishspence

2015-04-01, 12:26 AM

This is Star Wars though, where we have at least 3 kinds of cloaking devices - stygian crystal cloaks, hibridium crystal cloaks, and the double-blind cloak (can't see in, can't see out) that Thrawn retrieved from Wayland (it wasn't till The Essential Guide to Warfare that it was clarified that this is not a hibridium cloak though.

Instead of "radar cross section" we have "sensor cross-section" - and "sensor-stealthing" that can reduce it. In the Hand of Thrawn books, while a New Republic Defender starfighter has "minimal sensor-stealthing" - it still has a small cross-section, and no hyperdrive emissions, making it capable of sneaking at least some way into a star system if another ship transports it there.

The StealthX variant of the X-wing has a special form of Tibanna gas which its ion engines use - which creates vastly less heat than ordinary ion engine trails do - making it good at sneaking around.

pendell

2015-04-01, 08:16 AM

Also, the point on stealth in space makes a lot more sense when superluminal travel isn't possible. In a universe where light and heat travels much faster than a powered spacecraft, it is extremely difficult to approach a solar system undetected because the craft emissions will get there a long time before the craft itself does. But in the SW universe a craft can jump from the Oort cloud to the inner system in minutes.

This implies that SW tech has some sort of active sensor for use against FTL-capable ships somewhat akin to modern radar, and the various tricks used against stealth would be appropriate here as well.

Why does a starfighter even need wings anyway?

At any rate, SW tech has a number of features which we don't have in the real world, such as FTL travel and directed energy weapons. I would have said "deflector shields" as well, but real world tech (http://www.engadget.com/2015/03/23/boeing-plasma-shield/) is starting to catch up. Not the same thing, of course, the SW deflector shields are the product of imagination, not engineering.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

hamishspence

2015-04-01, 09:57 AM

At any rate, SW tech has a number of features which we don't have in the real world, such as FTL travel and directed energy weapons.

We are catching up when it comes to directed energy weapons though:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advanced_Tactical_Laser

imagine what could be, 25,000+ years along the line. Even with periods of stagnation, lasers or laser-like weapons could progress way beyond what we have now.

Aotrs Commander

2015-04-01, 10:35 AM

Welp. Let's make an early start.

Training missions, then...

Assault Gunboat Mission $: Attack Rebel Conference
I don't actually remember this one at all...

Okay then, take GUN Tau and disrupt a rebel meeting with potential new allies; capture or destoy all transports. "Watch out for new rebel fighters?" Hmm, didn't think you got stuff like the T-Wings or Starchasers until the expansion missions. Eh, they're no hassle, anyway.

Right, we'll as per usual take heavy rockets since we're up against capital ships...

...

FRACKING HELL! This mission is RIDICULOUSLY hard! I so very nearly gave up in the end. I happend to for ONCE get ridiculously lucky on the last attempt, which you have to do otherwise, this mission is basically impossible!

Right out of the gate, you get in and barely have time to charge your shields before you get jumped on. From behind. At practically point-blank range.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEPlaysilly4_zpsbiakcroz.png
What the hell, TIE? What the actual hell??

The speed and manouverability of those things is INSANE! And they come flying RIGHT at you, out of the gate. Oh, and guess what they're armed with? Advanced. Missiles. I got killed, like, five times before I'd made a minute into the mission. I finally managed to survive long enough to actually get on with the job at hand by instantly on entering the mission ordering my wingmen to go after them, which bought me enough time to at least charge my shields and call for reinforcements (GUN Rho), who at least tie the buggers up.

Then I had to move sharpish to deal with CORT Drebin before it got away, and believe me it leads you on a MERRY chase.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEPlaysilly2_zpstsuvovca.png
Got 'im, though...!

The next problem comes in stopping A-Wing Gold from making attack runs on Carousel Boutique.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEPlaysilly1_zpskehuyrmf.png
Just damn lucky the little bastards don't have torpedoes or something because seriously. There's about half-a-dozen of them, and it doesn't help that every. Time. Carousel Boutique gets a hit, everyone screams at you that it's under attack. Yes, guys and girls, I freaking KNOW! Just shut up and let me do my damn job. Drama queens.

Meanwhile, ATR Sigmare actually managed to disable the PLT - good job, finally, folks - and got on with the capturing. The final straw is trying to take on the TAR/40. Seriously, it's another one of those where you have to time in JUST right, or bam! off it goes. If you're not in the EXACT right place at the right time when it shows up, hangs aroud for barely a minute and then pops off (after mocking you with a transmission for good measure), you can forget it. Last attempt, I FINALLY, FINALLY got lucky - having saved my Heavy Rockets - I managed to get the little bleeder by hovering around the PLT and then shutning cannon energy to normal recharge the second it shows up. Four rocket hits and a panicked salvo of ion cannons, and I got it before it got very far (and could polish it off at leisure.)
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEPlaysilly3_zpszxvg9kfo.png
I'll give you timey-wimey, you obstreperous old git.

[Expletiving]ly finally, I actually managed to wipe the rest of the rebels out and complete the last bonus goals.

Freaking heck.

Primary Objectives:
PLT/1 Wuthphuq be must captured
CORT Drebin must be disabled
SHOP carousel Boutique must complete mission
50% Rebel craft must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives:
CORT Drebin must be inspected
TAR/40 Sexy must be inspected
Bonus Objectives:
100% Rebel craft must be destroyed
CORT Drebin must be captured
TAR/40 Sexy must be destroyed
PRTY/1 must be attended
NOFRAKS must be given

17/36 kills and three captures, but I am NEVER doing this mission again.

Rainbow Dash art from http://racefox.deviantart.com/art/Rainbow-Dash-Flying-352969625

Sorry chaps, I am going to have to have a break before I tackle anything else, that was a NIGHTMARE.

factotum

2015-04-01, 10:41 AM

Well played, sir, well played. :smallbiggrin:

DigoDragon

2015-04-01, 11:58 AM

Welp. Let's make an early start.

Training missions, then...

Heehee, that was fun. :D

PairO'Dice Lost

2015-04-01, 12:34 PM

This implies that SW tech has some sort of active sensor for use against FTL-capable ships somewhat akin to modern radar

Indeed it does. (http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Cronau_radiation/Canon)

Aotrs Commander

2015-04-01, 05:02 PM

Right, rested up, let's try again...

As I said last week, we're going to have a slight alteration to the training missions: I'm going to partially green them once I've done all but the bonus goals (otherwise I might be here forever trying to get them all!) I may still go back and have the odd shot at the one's Ive not fully completed as a warm-up to the other missions, but I'm not going to push so hard to get all the bonus goals!

TIE Bomber Mission Three: Torpedo Run

Fly T/B Alpha 1 with Proton Torpedoes to a rebel storage yard and blow it up.

Another mission that is a bit tedious. The first problem is that you have to inspect everything (which measn first off assigning your wingmen to attack (fruitlessly) the TUG while you inspect the first Transport. You can then set your wingmen after the Transport (because your command ship is a freaking Corvette and thus very vulnerable to Torpedo attack), while you deal with the shuttles. One problem that kae this more tedius is SHU Enouck has a tendacy to ram and explode something before you can even get to it, meaning you have to restart. After that, the major problem is trying to take three A-Wings in a TIE Bomber with nor warheads (or wingmen,by this point). I think maybe you might do better if you stick by the Corvette, but after several attempts (mostly to due to SHU Enouck) I'll leave that for another day.

Primary Objectives:
CRV Control must survive until other goals completed
100% of SHU group Enouck must be destroyed
100% of SHU group Xarxis must be destroyed
100% of TRN group Axet must be destroyed
Tug T-ST must be destroyed
Tug T-SP must be destroyed
100% of CN/A group Vic must be destroyed
100% of CN/A group Limi must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives:
None
Bonus Objectives:
100% of SHU group Enouck must be inspected
100% of SHU group Xarxis must be inspected
100% of TRN group Axet must be destroyed
100% of CN/A group Vic must be inspected
100% of CN/A group Limi must be inspected
100% of A-Wing group Red must be destroyed
100% of Y-Wing group Red must be destroyed
100% of B-Wing group Red must be destroyed

So I moved on to Bomber Mission four.

TIE Bomber Mission 4: Bombers Armed with Missiles

Take TIE Bomber Beta into a supply yard - rather like last time - and kill everything. The difference is, this time, you have slightly more useful load of 16 Concussion Missiles. Not that you need them until the end - as usual, you're better off saving them.

First time, I died to an A-Wing - a stationary A-Wing. I was making a strafing pass, and killed on, and either flew right into the one right behind it pulled up into the container above it. *sigh*

Once more, then...
First job - take out that TUG! With Concussion Missiles, my wingmen cold do that easily, while I rushed in to do an inspection flypast - Transports first again.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay264_zpsdh7y9dop.png

Then it was a case of flying around, dodging Shuttle fire while I inspected them, and taking them out. I ordered my wingmen after the TRNs, and between them and the FRG, the TRNs didn't last long (though I lost one wingman in the process.)
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay265_zpstmltr0ur.png

Just after that a pair of X-Wings popped in, but Beta 3 and I made short work of them. Then I went on to deal with the parked A-Wings - from a safe distance this time!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay266_zpsjmm5pjpx.png

Before I could finish the job, a trio of Y-Wings showed up, so I broke off to deal with them. Beta 3 was doing really well untill the last one, where the poor bastard flew right across my beam just as I fired. Lucky for him, it only dropped him to 16% hull - and the Y-Wing went after him as he headed home, presenting me with a nice target for an easy kill. I then went off and inspected Container Berm...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay267_zpsifusypfq.png

... and then finished off the A-Wings and their container, and went back to clear Berm. Primary objectives completed!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay268_zpsd8y80oop.png

Now the possibly hard part - one A-Wing - with missiles. Sadly for the rebel scum, I'd saved all mine, and let him have four. He actually didn't die right away, and turned to flee into hyperspace before the last one got him.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay269_zpsi16nz1m8.png

Finally, two B-Wings showed up. Whaddaya know, I still have 12 Concussion Missiles left! Red 1 caught six on the way in...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay270_zpssf8osqqq.png

... and after making sure Red 2 didn't hit me as he closed, I dropped in behind him and emptied the last six into him.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay271_zpstpybfkhb.png

Job done. And home!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay272_zpsxidnddbx.png

Primary Objectives:
FRG Compton must survive until other goals completed
100% of TRN group goode must be destroyed
Tug T-DP must be destroyed
CN/B Clip must be destroyed
100% of CN/C group Berm must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives:
100% of SHU group Trail must be destroyed
100% of SHU group Guild must be destroyed
Bonus Objectives:
100% of SHU group Trail must be inspected
100% of SHU group Guild must be inspected
100% of TRN group Goode must be inspected
100% of CN/C group Berm must be destroyed
CN/B Clip must be inspected
100% of X-Wing group Red must be destroyed
100% of Y-Wing group Red must be destroyed
A-Wing Red 1 must be destroyed
100% of B-Wing group Red must be destroyed

18/25 kills. FRG Comton and T/B Alpha got all the transports, the TUG and one X-wing.

Okay, GUN mission four next, since we've not tackled that one yet...

Assault Gunboat Mission Four: Escort Duty

Escort three FRTs from rebel attack. This is gonna suuuuck.

*sigh*

Another mission largely of tedium, where all your effort is snathced away by the game going "ahahaha! No!"

First attempt failed when I got killed by the FRG. Second attempt failed when the X-Wings destroyed one of the freighters, while I was tied up with A-Wings.

Last attempt.

First things first, start charging shields.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay273_zpshksmsfih.png

And as soon as the rebels show up, call for reinforcements. (All of two GUNs. great.)
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay274_zpspb0bserj.png

First job: kill two A-Wings, and fast. I learned from last time: send my wingman after the one attacking me, go after the one attacking him. I managed to disable both this time, just as the first four Headhunters (with missiles) showed up.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay275_zpsxmgrvwqm.png

They're not match for a GUN, of course - let alone four - but that's not the problem. That's killing them while being able to kill the Y-Wings which will otherwise murder your FRTs. (You have to do this while right next to the FRG, of course. I did snatch a moment or two to missile the FRG's warhead launcher, so we stood a slight chance...)
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay276_zpsolynklyd.png
I hastened the death of the Y-Wings by actually using a missile to break their attack run off.

Then more A-Wings. (At least thse don't have missiles.) This is where it get hard, because if you don't kill them fast, the four X-Wings that arrive will sail past you (and of course, they can fly faster than you can) and take out the FRTs. This time, I just about managed to keep on top of the A-Wings and Tau 2 and I were able to take them out ansd the X-Wings shortly thereafter. (That at least brought us to Secondary objectives.)
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay277_zpsola5uqxr.png

Then four more Headhunters. The reinforcements were either dead or gone home (having inflicted all of maybe 10% to the FRG's shields...) Tau 2 died here, and I had to let one get away, as by the time I realised, it was 13km out and trying to hyperspace home. Eh, not a mission goal, who cares. A couple of B-Wings showed up, but at this point the FRTs finally reached the jump-point - little threat and easily destroyed.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay278_zpsvb0ybkjn.png

Which just left the more tedius part of the mission: trying to take down a FRG in a GUN. This is extremely difficult. Ironically, I had FAR less trouble taking out a CRL in a T/A with half the shields. It's also very boring and time-consuming, because the only way to do it is to run out, fully charge you shields, switch to normal recharge (for the speed) and make strafing runs on the turrets, run out of range, stop, fully charge cannons and shields before doing it again. (Oh and apparently turbolasers penetrate shields and inflict hull damage even when you have shields left. WHAT.)
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay279_zpscs2qp1gt.png
I attempted to expedite matters by using my remaining missiles to take some system out, but it didin't seem to help much - I think they missed. Wonderful.

So, twenty minutes later, I had gotten down to the last three turrets...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay280_zpsazhknmrd.png

...when it did the whole "yes, I don't care if you have shields, I'mma hit your hull anyway" and killed my engines. Dead.

Yeah, not in a hurry to replay that, given how long tedious (and ultimately fruitless and frustrating) that is.

(GUN mission 3 essentially starts you off with the same, if you want to complete the bonus goals, then makes you do it to a CRL and CRS too. Gonna have to have a go at that next week, though I'm not sure I will attempt the bonus goals. Not on Hard, anyway.)

Primary Objectives:
100% of FRT group Rugle must complete mission
Secondary Objectives:
50% of all Rebel craft must be destroyed
Bonus Objectives:
FRG Dodger must be destroyed
SHU Leap must be destroyed

TIE Fighter
Training Mission 1: Gunnery (Attempted, up to X-Wing Dodec (four bonus goals failed))
Training Mission 2: Flight Leaders and Wingmen (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)
Training Mission 3: Destroy Depot (Attempted, three bonus goals failed)
Training Mission 4: Destroy Probe (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)

TIE Interceptor
Training Mission 1: Threat Display(Attempted, two bonus goals failed)
Training Mission 2: Ambush!
Training Mission 3: Clear Minefield
Training Mission 4: Combined Attack

TIE Bomber

Training Mission 1: Proton Torpedoes (Attempted, two bonus goals failed)
Training Mission 2: Space Bombs
Training Mission 3: Torpedo Run (Attempted, two bonus goals failed)
Training Mission 4: Bombers Armed with Missiles

TIE Advanced

Training Mission 1: Concussion Missiles
Training Mission 2: Rocket Attack (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)
Training Mission 3: Preemtpive Strike
Training Mission 4: Hyperdrive Upgrade (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)

Assault Gunboat

Training Mission 1: Shields
Training Mission 2: Teamwork
Training Mission 3: The Challenge (Attempted, completed and then progress lost because the game crashed out because I tried saving the flight camera...)
Training Mission 4: Escort Duty (Attempted, two bonus goals failed)

TIE Defender

Training Mission 1: Dogfighting!
Training Mission 2: Tractor Beam
Training Mission 3: Inspect & Disable
Training Mission 4: Disable and Capture

Missile Boat

Training Mission 1: Dual Warheads
Training Mission 2: Anti-Warhead Defense
Training Mission 3: Disabling Minefield
Training Mission 4: Missile Boat vs. TIE Defender

pendell

2015-04-01, 05:24 PM

Some really neat stuff with the MLP mission. So do they have ponytroopers too?

Respectfully,

Brian P.

factotum

2015-04-02, 02:06 AM

I don't recall ever taking damage from laser hits while my shields were up? Is that a Hard-mode only thing, or something?

Aotrs Commander

2015-04-02, 03:02 AM

I don't recall ever taking damage from laser hits while my shields were up? Is that a Hard-mode only thing, or something?

Me neither, but I was coming out of those passes with hull damage, while I still had red or yellow on my forward shield inner circle (and mstly full rear shields), before I was sinking my cannon energy in, so, I dunno WHAT was happening there.

hamishspence

2015-04-02, 06:18 AM

"Shield-piercing" maybe - a bit like armour-piercing bullets, but with laser bolts that the shields just can't stop properly.

DigoDragon

2015-04-02, 07:02 AM

That was *awesome*. However, if that mission had been in the actual game it would have been the easiest one ever--

Make for a nice demo or opening training mission. :D

AWESOME. And that is quite clever use of interdictor grav cones. Why doesn't anyone else do that?

I dunno, George Lucas?

Aotrs Commander

2015-04-08, 05:45 PM

Right - let's have a stab at GUN 3...

Assault Gunboat Mission Three: The Challenge

You, GUN Tau 1, verses a rebel Frigate, then a Light Cruiser, then a Cruiser.

This is probably one of the hardest training missions.

I tried twice attacking the FRG... First I disabled the lone Y-Wing, took out the warhead launcher with four Concussion Missiles... and kept dying before I'd barely got started.

I decide, frack that, this isn't even fun, it's tedius: we'll do the mission the "proper" way. So I mopped up all the fighters to complete my primary mission goals... and the FRG sat there. No attempt to leave (I'm SURE it did last time, unless I really took 45 minutes to do what I managed in 10 this time...?) To I ended up attacking it and dying again.

So, at that point, I'mma give up. It just ain't worth the hassle of having to repeatedly get lucky.

Primary Objectives:
Y-Wing Red must be destroyed
100% of Z-95 group Gold must be destroyed
100% of X-Wing group Blue must be destroyed
100% of B-Wing group Blue must be destroyed
A-Wing Gold must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives: None
Bonus Objectives:
FRG Challenge must be destroyed
CRL Luklucle must be destroyed
CRS Trident must be destroyed
100% of X-Wing group Red must be destroyed
100% of X-Wing group Gold must be destroyed
100% of B-Wing group Red must be destroyed
100% of Z-95 group Red must be destroyed
100% of Z-95 group Blue must be destroyed
100% of A-Wing group Blue must be destroyed
100% of A-Wing group Gold must be destroyed
SHU Movt must be destroyed
100% of TRN group Jupit must be destroyed

Right then, that actually brings us to all the basic training missions done for the fighters we currently have available in the campaign!

We'll make an attempt at TIE Defender Mission 2, see how we go and then maybe move on to Battle 7...

TIE Defender Mission Two: Tractor Beam

This time, we have to fly a lone TIE Defender to run down some Corellian Transports - then assist in mopping up so that the traitorous scum on the PLT can be taken for... "processing." (Memorable TIE Fighter Quotes no.2.)

This one is, like most similar missions, hard then really easy. The trick is to manage to run down the CORTs before they get away, and after that, it's all golden.

This was proved by the first attempt, in which CORT Ko got away...

Second try! First off, I went straight after CORT Lin. I decided it might be a good idea to listen to the briefing officer's advance, and use a pair of my Advanced Missiles to help take the shields out. (With a tractor beam, the A-Wings in this mission are really really not much of a threat, anyway!)
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay281_zpsx61g4ffs.png

Once that was disabled, I turned around and ran after Cort Kaar, and used another air of missiles and disabled that. Then CORT Ko launched, with A-Wing Rogue 1 & Rogue 2 as escort.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay282_zpsjoqopkhu.png

I hit Ko with my remaining missiles and just about disabled it before it got away! Hard part done. Now to mop up the A-Wings. Imperial Star Destroyer Glory arrived to deal with the station, and I just left it to it.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay283_zpsrtnvha3z.png

I actually only got one, as the other ran off to hyperspeed, showing that he was, clearly, flying not Rogue, but Yellow... I flew to FRT Renspects to do an inspection flyby.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay284_zpsxhmeilat.png

As I flew to the FRT, to see Shuttle Poltroon docked with it. B-Wing Scaret 4 launched - as was nearly immediately disabled. I then killed the shuttle, knocked out the FRT's shields and disabled it. I had half a mind to take it out there and then, but then four A-Wings hypered in, so I went to deal with them. In a T/D with a tractor beam it was almost trivially easy!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay285_zpspfcgg1dc.png

A half-dozen Y-Wings were suicidally attacking Glory, so I kicked over to wipe them out.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay286_zpslz1moz0c.png

The last one was making a concerted effort to get to hyperspace, so I slammed as much power to the engines as I could (leaving only cannon and shield at normal) and killed the fleeing fool.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay287_zps49gn13ve.png

I could now finish off FRT Renspecs and sit and wait...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay288_zpspmjv3xnw.png

..for the Heavy Lifter to capture B-W Scarlet 4.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay289_zpsvzxc4wdd.png

All done!

Primary Objectives:
CORT Lin must be disabled
CORT Kaar must be disabled
CORT Ko must be disabled
Secondary Objectives:
PLT/3 AZ 77 must be disabled
FRT Renspects must be inspected
Bonus Objectives:
PLT/3 AZ 77 must be captured
SHU Poltroon must be destroyed
CORT Lin must be captured
CORT Kaar must be captured
CORT Ko must be captured
FRT Renspecs must be destroyed
B-Wing Scarlet 4 must be captured

11/17 kills and a ridiculous 117k score (all those captures!)

Right then, as that was so easy, we'll have a crack at:

TIE Defender Mission Three: Inspect & Disable

TIE Defender Alpha 1 is to inspect a load of cargo vessels, and assist TRN Omega in capturing any rebels you find.

Again, this one took two attempts, because I let one of the ships get to hyperspace.

However, it did show that I could ignore the rebel fighters!

Stright out of the gate, there are Y-Wings attacking you. I ignored them, and flew to inspect the first two Modular Conveyors, CNVYR Trawler, followed by the next pair, CNVYR Switch; also ignoring the A-Wing and B-Wings that showed up. While I waited for the next batch, I disabled one of the Y-Wings, and then killed the A-Wing.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay290_zps878aa5nn.png

CARG Juble, CTRNS Olumpa and CORT Hatch arrived at this point. I made a flying pass down the line, inspecting all but Juble 2.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay291_zps99pbk1dk.png

I then doubled back up the line, and inspected Juble 2 - which triggered TRN Omega. Now, with my primary objectives completed, I was free to deal with the rest of the fighters. As the previous time, two X-Wings showed up to attack TRN Omega. I wanted them dead fast, so I dropped in and landed four Concussion Missiles down each of their tailpipes. leaving Omega in the clear. I put a couple of ion cannon shots into Juble 2, just to finish it off for Omega.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay293_zpsayezko62.png

I could now deal with the remaining Y-Wing (the other had crashed into something some time ago - idiot!) and B-wings.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay294_zpsnlxpz7kt.png

While TRN Omega went to capture Juble, 2, I went back to the disabled Y-Wing.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay295_zpszlnkphac.png

Last two objectives were the NAV BOUYs. I killed the first one, but as I approached the second, CRV Slasher dropped in.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay296_zps6axejuyv.png

Slasher was basically right next to the bouy, so as I made my first pass, I swivled to take the bouy out - bonus goals done. It was now a case of dealing with all five waves of CRV Slasher. For kicks and giggles.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay297_zpssh5sbegy.png

A CRV - even with missiles - is not match for a TIE Defender. I shunted my beam energy to engines (aside from a touch while dealing with the A-Wing, I'd not used it anyway), and started making high speed passes with fire-linked quads. Really, I didn't even need to dodge... Once each CRV's shields went down, I switched to Ions and disabled it, came to a halt nearly by and finished it up... And then throttled up and repeated.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay298_zpsstf4qmnz.png

Without much effort, CRV Slasher all went down and I went home!

Primary Objectives:
100% of CRV group Red must be inspected
CORT Hatch must be inspected
CTRNS Olumpa must be inspected
100% of CNVYR Trawler must be inspected
100% of CNVYR Switch must be inspected
100% of CARG Juble must be inspected
Secondary Objectives:
CARG Juble 2 must be captured
Bonus Objectives:
A-Wing Red 1 must be destroyed
100% of B-Wing group Blue must be destroyed
100% of X-Wing group Gold must be destroyed
100% of Y-Wing group Gold must be destroyed
Nav Buoy B-52 must be destroyed
Nav Buoy B-53 must be destroyed

12/13 kills - so all but that hilarious one Y-Wing who managed to crash.

That just leaves us with TIE Defender Mission 4 (and the Missileboat missions, but I'll get to them a bit later after some more campaign battles.)

T/D Mission 4 is one I remember as being one I played a bit - somethign of a favourite, so to finish off today, we'll round out the list and have a go!

TIE Defender Mission Four: Disable and Capture

TIE Defender Alpha - both of you - are to disable one of two Rebel Escort Carriers. "Helpfully" you've got all of two Space Bombs to do it with.

Yes, I knew I liked this mission! First try!

The first job, is, of course, to shunt your tractor energy to engines, start pumping your cannon energy, and release the space bombs at 156 speed at ESC Prowler 2.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay299_zps69o4vgyp.png

I then swung over to Prowler 1, to inspect it, and then made my first attack run on Prowler 2. I continued hitting it with lasers - quads give you some time to jink inbetween firing - and then switched to ion cannons when the shields were nearly out. This summons in Intedictor Suelu, making this mission a very rare - possibly unique - event in TIE Fighter, where a capital ship is doing a capture operation.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay300_zpszo7okfmw.png

At this point, more rebels arrive: four CRVs and some X-wings (and I think some A-wings). I killed the fighters attacking me and then things got a bit hectic for the next few minutes, as I swung between all four CRVs, blasting away, and getting scads of missiles (which I largely ignored!) thrown at me, trying to knock out their shields and disable them.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay301_zpsnbi1fqft.png
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay302_zpsgf6h3a5h.png
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay303_zpsbsb4bike.png
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay304_zpsfzpzi9is.png
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay305_zps4fup3dgn.png

I broke off to clear Alpha 1's tail.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay306_zpssplkznob.png

And then made sure I killed at least one of the buggers...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay307_zps2hlx1hil.png

About this time INT Suelu finished its boarding operation, and FRG Egale showd up. (I wonder if it was supposed to be "Eagle" and they just shrugged and kept the typo?) While I engaged the fighters, Egale destroyed CRV Burke, the other Imperial vessel - though Burke did at least shave 10% of its shields. M/CRV James arrived to replace it. I made sure to kill the B-Wings that were lining up on it, and then went to assist T/F Gamma (whom I presume launched from INT Suelu, but I was too busy to check) and Alpha 1.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay308_zpsvklzyavu.png

Having cleared out - or so I thought - the X-Wings, I started making my attack on FRG Egale. My first attack run was to ensure I took out the warhead launcher. then I starting making runs on the turrets...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay309_zps2jdedskb.png

...only to have to break off to deal with the A-Wings it launched.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay310_zpsls9whw4l.png

Once they were down, I starting making my attacks on Egale. (I broke off at one point when I realised there was one X-Wing left, and killed it so Alpha 1 could help.) Then it was a case of making passes and picking off all the guns. It's amazing - the extra speed and the quads make all the difference, unlike trying this in a GUN. Once I'd neatly picked off all the turrets, I matched speed and sat underneath hammering it until its shields went down and I disabled it.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay311_zps48n7azva.png

Then I told Alpha 1 to ignore it, and pumped it full of lasers.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay312_zpsmi0kx7k9.png
That's for GUN Mission 3, you bastard!

And home! (Well, actually, past Suelu to M/CRV James, but whatever.)
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay313_zps1aphefsr.png

Primary Objectives:
50% of ESC group Prowler must be captured
Secondary Objectives:
100% of ESC group Prowler must be inspected
100% of CRV group Sharky must be destroyed
100% of CRV group Spear must be destroyed
Bonus Objectives:
100% of A-Wing group Red must be destroyed
100% of X-Wing group Blue must be destroyed
100% of A-Wing group Gold must be destroyed
100% of B-Wing group Red must be destroyed
FRG Egale must be destroyed

21/29 kills. All but two of the X-Wings, all the A-Wings and B-Wings and the FRG. Sadly, only one out of the CRVs, but I did significantly weaken or disable them, so there's that!

Well, that was remarkably benign tonight! (It even calibrated thr joystick effortleessly this time.) Apart from GUN 3 anyway...

Just goes to show!

Anyway, that's all the training missions (sans Missileboat) done - or at least completed, if not 100% bonus goals done - so next week, we will finally move onto Battle Seven!

TIE Fighter
Training Mission 1: Gunnery (Attempted, up to X-Wing Dodec (four bonus goals failed))
Training Mission 2: Flight Leaders and Wingmen (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)
Training Mission 3: Destroy Depot (Attempted, three bonus goals failed)
Training Mission 4: Destroy Probe (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)

TIE Interceptor
Training Mission 1: Threat Display(Attempted, two bonus goals failed)
Training Mission 2: Ambush!
Training Mission 3: Clear Minefield
Training Mission 4: Combined Attack

TIE Bomber

Training Mission 1: Proton Torpedoes (Attempted, two bonus goals failed)
Training Mission 2: Space Bombs
Training Mission 3: Torpedo Run (Attempted, two bonus goals failed)
Training Mission 4: Bombers Armed with Missiles

TIE Advanced

Training Mission 1: Concussion Missiles
Training Mission 2: Rocket Attack (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)
Training Mission 3: Preemtpive Strike
Training Mission 4: Hyperdrive Upgrade (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)

Assault Gunboat

Training Mission 1: Shields
Training Mission 2: Teamwork
Training Mission 3: The Challenge(Attempted, twelve bonus goals failed)
Training Mission 4: Escort Duty (Attempted, two bonus goals failed)

TIE Defender

Training Mission 1: Dogfighting!
Training Mission 2: Tractor Beam
Training Mission 3: Inspect & Disable
Training Mission 4: Disable and Capture

Missile Boat

Training Mission 1: Dual Warheads
Training Mission 2: Anti-Warhead Defense
Training Mission 3: Disabling Minefield
Training Mission 4: Missile Boat vs. TIE Defender

Edit: By the by, hamishspence - I haven't forgotten to reply to your PM; I've taken your suggestions on board. I have just had to prioritise for the moment; I've got a 2/3 finished quest to sort before next Saturday and some 3D stuff to do next week and I can't do much more on the upgraded X-Wings until I get further into XWA where I can have a nosey at the E-Wing stats. I'll get back to you when I return to it!

pendell

2015-04-08, 06:03 PM

Aotrs Commander

2015-04-08, 06:54 PM

Outstanding work.

Ironically, in GUN 3, the first Y-wing has initial orders you to escort you of all things. One time I just meekly followed it back to the frigate, to see if they really would allow me to defect. Nope. A blistering rain of fire from the Challenge put a stop to that idea.

Typical lying rebels.

I did kill the Challenge as follows:
1) Kill the warhead launcher.
2) Fly out of range, charge up shields.
3) Fly back, plink off a laser gun.
4) Rinse and repeat steps 2-3 until all guns and turrets have been eliminated.
5) Knock down the shields, then ion cannons to disable, then turbolasers to finish off the hull.

The one danger of this is that ISTR disabling a capital ship will prevent the launch of some shuttles or transports, and that means no 100% bonus goals.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

That's what I did last week in GUN 4 and tried today... It's just not easy to do it in a GUN. It's funny, but the GUN is actually the worst shielded vessel for attacking capital ships on your own... You really need the speed - especially on the Nebulon Bs, which seem to have a rather nasty concentration of fire. T/A vrs CRL - easy. T/D verses FRG - easy... GUN verses either... Nightmare. Trouble is, you need twice as many hits from twins as quads to take a turret out, and lower speed means you can't dodge around the clusters of fire so easily. Having basically done that last week in GUN 4 and died at the last minute, a couple of deaths in, and it just doesn't seem worth it. (I think in the old days, I actually did do it, but I was more prepared to play it again and again - for one thing, I didn't have anything like the amount of other things I could have been doing.) Especially since you've got to do it three times...!

hamishspence

2015-04-09, 02:19 AM

Edit: By the by, hamishspence - I haven't forgotten to reply to your PM; I've taken your suggestions on board. I have just had to prioritise for the moment; I've got a 2/3 finished quest to sort before next Saturday and some 3D stuff to do next week and I can't do much more on the upgraded X-Wings until I get further into XWA where I can have a nosey at the E-Wing stats. I'll get back to you when I return to it!

No worries. I've been looking at the new Armada game, that came out in some shops on March 27 - following the various previews on The Bell of Lost Souls and the FFG site - and thinking about how the rules for Armada squadrons compare to the rules for X-Wing individual ships - and how much those might have in common with the older games.

One thing that stands out - TIE fighters are significantly faster than X-wings in both games (compared to older sources giving them the same maximum speed in MGLT - albeit different accelerations).

Aotrs Commander

2015-04-15, 05:45 PM

Late start today, between CAD work and last-minute sort out of a player for my weekend game.

Battle Seven - Treachery at Ottega

Mission One: Trap the Protector

After completing the TIE Defender training (hey, whattya know, we actually did this time!), it's off into TIE Advanced Alpha 1 to go knobble the last of Harkov's traitorous forces. Interdictor Harpax (again, immortalised in my tabletop fleet) will prevent the rebels from running of (ha!) so all we have to do is kill some TIEs and containers and maybe rebels. And we get a tractor beam. The bonus goals seem deceptively easy, too...

Okay, well, we'll take Advanced missiles and off we go!

...

Right. Failed the first time... I was doing fine until I realised the heavy lifters were nicking the cargo containers. Whoops...!

Second time... Finished the mission and was killed by some fracking X-Wings with advance missiles. Frag DAMMIT.

Third attempt, missed the heavy lifters...

Forth aborted... Fifth hit a heavy lifter and died...

Sixth try...

I started out throwing one advanced missile at one of the T/Is (this time, picking the one that wasn't attacking me and it actually died. This was the only time I actually used my missles this mission... T/F H-Alpha comes right at you, so I snapped off a few shots as I passed (I honestly can't remember if I got one this time around) and when straight onto strafe the crap out of CARG Whell.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay314_zps2dv3a15s.png
Alpha 2 actually got to finish it off this time, blast 'im...

I then took out the containers in a couple of short passes.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay315_zpspg7p8zud.png

On to Heavy Lifter Waq. This took rather longer than I would have liked, despite them going down in a couple of quad hits, what with Waq having several waves. By this point, a couple of T/F H-Alpha were chasing me around, but I ignored them for the majority.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay316_zpspoiiwrov.png

While I was finishing to the Heavy Lifters. the rebels started coming in, from CRS Warhawk. (As I got my bonus goal notification, the traitor FRG showed up, too.) I headed off to engage the Z-95 Headhunters it was launching.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay317_zpsfbrkrztr.png

A couple of them try to shoot missiles at you... But in a T/A, I could usually take out one or even two in a single pass, as I did this time. Harpax was nicely taking them out, too, with a single Advanced Missile a piece, faster than I could!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay318_zpsqizlqpqr.png

As I dived in on the final group, I saw them launch Heavy Rockets. Well, crap! fortunately, I was in a very nice positon, and for once, I was able to kill the Headhunter and nicely swing in behind the rockets and take them all out too!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay319_zpsvtetierq.png

At this stage, leery of X-Wing Gold (whose latter waves show up with Advanced Missiles), after assisting Harpax wipe the first wave, I high tailed it over the INT (and not the Protector, like I did the third try by mistake...!)
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay320_zpsdz6hujjw.png

Now I FINALLY broke off and mopped up T/F H-Alpha who'd been following me the whole time! Unfortunately, they seem to be on pretty much endless spawn, but at least now they went for something else. As I did, ATR Lambda showed up.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay321_zpsetk3wcjq.png

That left me having to deal with at least one wave of X-Wing Gold with Advanced Missiles. This time, I got lucky and managed to kill the missile in the first pass. I considered leaving the last X-Wing alive and just chasing it around for a bit, but decided not.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay322_zps3z9svxrl.png

ATR Lambda finished their job, so, rather than fight on potentially endless Advanced Missiles X-Wings (shades of Battle One Mission Five again...) I whipped into the Harpax's hanger.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay323_zpss0u7xxew.png

Primary Objective:
INT Harpax must survive until other goals complete
100% of CN/B group HX must be destroyed
100% of CN/E group HM must be destroyed
100% of CN/C group Oxin must be destroyed
100% of CN/D group c223 must be destroyed
100% of ATR group Lambda must complete mission
Secondary Objectives:
None
Bonus Objectives:
CARG Whell must be destroyed
100% of HLF group Waq must be destroyed

The briefing said I only got 1 of 2 mission goals, yet I killed all the Heavy Lifters and the Carg this time (well, naturally THIS time it was Alpha 2, of course...), but I got the "bonus goals completed" announcement in mission, so I'm gonna take it, especially on the sixth attempt...! (Probably means I actually did it the third time, it's just bigged1)

30/51 kills! All seven (!) heavy lifters, though not the CARG this time, since aloha 2 the kill-stealin' bugger, wiped it from about 11%... Four X-Wings, five Z-95, a T/I, three T/F, two T/B and the containers. Not bad at all!

That's all I have tome for this week, I'm afraid (especially with that taking so many attempts!)

I vaguely recall next mission being an absolutely bugger...

factotum

2015-04-16, 02:17 AM

Well, this *is* the final battle of the original unexpanded game, so you'd expect it to be a bit tricky. Albeit the difficulty curve in TIE Fighter is totally messed up, with early game missions being difficulty cliffs compared to some later ones...

Eldariel

2015-04-16, 07:35 AM

Albeit the difficulty curve in TIE Fighter is totally messed up, with early game missions being difficulty cliffs compared to some later ones...

It's almost like the Imperial tour of duty didn't have a stable level of opposition :smalltongue:

Aotrs Commander

2015-04-22, 05:26 PM

Okay, let's get cracking!

Battle Seven, Mission Two:Destroy the Akaga

Protect INT Harpax by destroy the Akaga betwen you and your one wingman, flying a T/A. The mission says use Space Bombs, but forget that, Heavy Rockets are better!

Well, there's a turn-up! Did it first time! Must have been thinking of a later mission.

Not a good sight to hyper into... three enemy capital ships... I wasted no time in unloading my four rockets.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay324_zpsd4juqylg.png

As I was about to start strafing, I noticed a reload Transport launching. I thought, "bugger that then, quick, while I've got time, get a reload!"
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay325_zpsy7pkhvj2.png

I swung about and rushed over the TRN. I was lucky. Despite a missle or two being thrown at me (that I was able to turn to face and destroy as it came in) and TIE Bomber H-Beta closing on me, I was just about reloaded in time. I dashed off, just having time to get to full speed before practically running into Akaga and letting it have four more rockets, which took it out. I then turned my attention to the rebel fighters as well as dealing with the errant TIE Bomber.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay326_zpsxnpv78vf.png
I'm not exactly sure when during all that, this was taken (aside from the time stamp and the number of screenshot, obviously). I reckon it must be just moments after I destroyed the Akaga (I suspect the "inspected" message is the slight delay in the log with everything else that was going on!)

The Y-Wings were fairly easy prey though the steady stream of missiles from Harpax was ruining their day anyway.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay327_zps37xpu8sk.png

The first group of Headhunters I closed on were launching rockets, so I managed to turn into them and destroy at least one of them. Harpax dealt with the Z-95 Headhunters faster than I could with its missiles.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay328_zpsao3ovced.png

I knobbled a couple of TIE Bombers and Imperial Star Destroyer Garrett arrived just as the last bonus goals - X-Wings - showed up. I was disinclined to follow Vader's immediate order to return, since I was busy forcing the X-Wings off their attack run on Harpax. Again, Harpax got them before I could spin around to finish them. Damn it's nice to have competant help!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay329_zpszx1563uh.png

I went after the TRNs that were also setting up on Harpax, but barely managed a helping hand, with all the allied fighters now around, so I went on to kill more enemy fighters.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay330_zpsomymmvfj.png

With the sky clear of enemy fighters now, T/A Gamma started making torpedo attacks on the Protector, so I went to help.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay331_zpsfh5xarj6.png

A bit of brawling and knobbling one turret later, I decided there were too many missiles coming in, and made a break for Garrett. Fortunately, neither Protector nor the TIE Bombers could land enough bows until I was safely out of range. I skirted past CRL Warhawk - I was looking at my Z threat display and saw it shooting and thought "I wonder what's that shooting a-oh[expletive]!!!" - and ran to the hangar.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay332_zps1vd3f4r8.png

I could have fought more T/B, but after the apparent endless respawns last mission... I thought I'd not bother. I'm at about the halfway point of the game and am at 1200000 points, I think I'll probably managed to reach the 2 million mark pretty safely...!

Primary Objective:
INT Harpax must survive until other goals complete
FRG Akaga must be destroyed
ISD Garrett must arrive
Secondary Objectives:
None
Bonus Objectives:
100% of Y-Wing group Red must be destroyed
100% of Y-Wing group Gold must be destroyed
100% of Z-95 group Red must be destroyed
100% of Z-95 group Blue must be destroyed
100% of X-Wing group Gold must be destroyed

12/33 kills: the Akaga, nine T/B, a Y-W and a T/F. Not bad!

Mission Three: Retibution
Fly T/A Alpha with 6 Advanced Torpedoes and protect the Harpax and the Garrett while ensuring that the Warhawk - and the Protector - are destroyed and waiting for Zaarin's reinforcements to come help.

Wow, that's a lot of capital ship bonus goals...

Once again, very much inclined to take Heavy Rockets the first pass! Let's see how this one goes...

Wise choice. This one was only one attempt again... Saving the Harpax just seems like it's not worth the hassle, if it is indeed possible, as we'll see shortly!

To start with, the Warhawk is down to 50% shields, but gaining on the Harpax - which has 0% shields. I unloaded my first lot of Heavy Rockets right away.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay333_zpshcvfhb0n.png

To my surprise, there was a distinct lack on enemy fighters. So I pulled about and went back to TRN 18f1 for a reload.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay334_zps3c5izxy7.png

The Warhawk went down as I was reloading. One down...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay335_zpsmafdf1cq.png

I now started on the Protector. First try, I aimed to throw a rocket at each warhead launcher, and one more against each shield generator. I don't think it worked particularly, though I think I took out one of the former.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay336_zpsbundd3zf.png

The pattern of the next few minutes was to fire, spin around and return to reload.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay337_zps7jcndbc3.png

As I made my third reload, the Protector was finally starting to flag. By the time I'd reloaded, it too was gone.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay338_zpsky0pofnw.png

Next job was to attacking the now-arriving rebel the B-Wings attacking Harpax.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay339_zps55jvfxgz.png

Then bad news! Dirty traitor Zaarin's forces attacked us! M/CRV Arditi 1 and 2 paid for their treachery immediately, as they had a pair of heavy rockets each. I paused to wipe the two rebel Escort Shuttles that were floating around.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay340_zpshechl26v.png

Then ATR Upsilon arrived. All FIVE of them. This was the point I realised I couldn't save Harpax. They showed up right on top of it and started firing heavy rockets.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay341_zpsluochc3r.png

Even if I had rockets left, even if I'd had torpedoes... Even if, my desparate and futile attempt to shoot the rockets down (I missed all of them) had been successful... There was no way I could kill five ATRs fast enough to save an unshielded capital ship (especially since it had taken damage.) Maybe you could save it, but you'd have to be damn-near perfect and I'm not that!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay342_zpst2cgplfq.png
I wrote that one off as just not worth losing sleep over, heartbreaking as it was. (Never fear Harpax, you achieved a better immortality in my tabletop fleet!)

The next few minutes were busy, but not quite frenetic, as I flew about, taking shots at M/CRVs and ATRs as I passed.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay343_zpspnpo0z3k.png
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay343_zpspnpo0z3k.png

I then started to get shot at by GUN Tau, so I broke off to chase them both down.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay345_zpsjit99gcp.png

Hey, you know what, it's much more fun on THIS side of the GUN vs T/A equatation!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay346_zpsiaklm8l0.png

I took out another M/CRV or so, and dealt with Tau's second wave. As I passed the next set of M/CRVs, I noticed TRN 18f1 sitting pretty, barely a klick-and-a-half away. With no enemy fighters and not having attacked the nearest enemy M/CRV, I grabbed a quick reload (my forth!)
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay347_zpsloxlojh7.png

I took out two more of the last three M/CRVs. It was at this point I discovered Tau (or this next wave, anyway) had ADVANCED Missiles. Mercifully, I didn't lose anything serious, and made sure to take them out fast.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay348_zps6ycmxjpr.png

One last couple of strafing runs took out the last M/CRV...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay349_zpsfvdzmy1i.png

And then the rest of the fighters and I mopped up the last of GUN Tau.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay350_zps7tfsxm5x.png

Phew!

That was a pretty steady pull, if not quite the frenetic pace you sometimes get (the lack of enemy fighters did that, I suspect.)

Primary Objective:
VSD Protector must be destroyed
CRL Warhawk must be destroyed
ISD Garrett must survive until other goals complete
Secondary Objectives:
100% of M/CRV group Arditi must be destroyed
100% of M/CRV group Falcon must be destroyed
100% of M/CRV group BaKaar must be destroyed
100% of ATR group Upsilon must be destroyed
Bonus Objectives:
100% of all Rebel craft must be destroyed
INT Harpax must complete mission

18/32 kills. 7 M/CRVs, both E/S, three ATRs, five GUNs and a B-Wing. Not too shabby!

Time for one more!

Mission Four: TIE Defender

Lord Vader, clearly impessed with my awesomeness, is having me lead a five-ship group of TIE Defenders (with him as no.6) to go and rescue the Emperor! first stop, M/FRG Osprey to be fitted with Advanced Missiles.

(Let's see if TIE is smart enough not to let me have those this mission then... Actually, I think I'll be taking heavy rockets again after a look at the goals...!)

Now I can really see a measruable improvement over my youth - I struggled on this mission (which you almost want to do, since it leads to one of the best lines in the game from Lord Vader...) Not so now.

Right out of the gate, the first job was to kill the GUNs attacking me.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay351_zpsqbn7i909.png

I then turned my attention to the Harpago. Once again, I fired single rockets at the warhead launcher (which is futile, you DO have to use two) and then hammered the hull with the last two. I got in and started strafing, my first job being to kill that damn warhead launcher.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay352_zpsk97yku7o.png

I'd just done that, but then the GUNs caught up to me again, so I broke off to deal with them.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay353_zpspiygvzek.png

Not that I needed for GUNs, but I figured I may as well get into the habit of using the tractor beam, I will need it later, after all...! The Osprey arrived, and I devoted my attention to taking out the TIE Bombers it was launching. I was in fine position, actually, and they went down like flies. As I was doing so, someone took out the Harpago.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay354_zpsjk3ogqqt.png

Then it was a case of quickly mopping up the escaping GUNs for the bonus goal and then killing the last three hapless TIE Bombers who had nowhere to go...!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay355_zpsuul64q4n.png

I watched Lord Vader back into the hangar and job done.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay356_zpshg49wtna.png

Sort of disappointed, acrtually - the Osprey never got touched, which is a shame, since:

Memorable TIE Fighter Quotes no.2: (Lord Vader) The Osprey's Shields have failed! You must FIGHT HARDER!!!

...is comedy gold.

Primary Objective:
T/D Delta 6 must complete mission
M/FRG Osprey must survive until other goals complete
Secondary Objectives:
INT Harpago must be destroyed
Bonus Objectives:
100% of all GUNs must be destroyed

17/25 kills... Honestly, what was Vader doing! 9 out of the dozen GUNs boats, eight out of the dozen T/B... Just sorry I missed the Harpago!

Aww, heck, that was quick... Go on, we'll have one more!

Mission Five: Save the Emperor

Take T/D Alpha and go save the Emperor!

(Now, this time it's a three-ship plus Vader flight group. I lost two T/Ds in the last mission... Co-incidence...? I don't think TIE is actually that clever, but hey, versimilitude, right?)

Advanced missiles.. Hmm. I'm going to go with them the first try, tempted though I am by Advanced Torpedoes this time.

First try... Something destroyed the rescue M/CRV very quickly - suspect the E/S. Gonna switch to Advanced Torpedoes and take out a couple of the other escrot shuttles first, I think...

Okay, now armed with Advanced Torpedoes, I left the first wave of T/A to Lord Vader, Alpha 2 and Alpha 3. I settled in behind the Escort Shuttles, one of whom was carrying the Emporer.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay357_zpsygicz22o.png

I inspected them one by one. Once I'd clearted on, I hit it with one torpedo and then a couple of lasers to kill it, tanked the desparate firing by the exploing wreck and moved to the next one.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay358_zps1seh6s3a.png

When I found Haven 3 was holding the Emporer, I ordered my Wingman to ignore it, and took out the last two E/S before moving on to disable it with guns (and I think one slight collision...) M/CRV Mescue now had a clean run at Haven 3.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay359_zpskfw8ymhz.png

Now it was just a case of hitting as many T/A as I could. I held my remaining torpedoes, not sure if I needed to deal with ISD Glory later and stuck to guns and tractor beam.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay360_zps0jat0ym3.png

A few of them made a fairly suicidal run at Vice-Admiral Thrawn's (huzzah!) arriving ISD Vanguard, but between T/D Alpha and the Vanguard, we mopped them up.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay361_zps7eqta70a.png
The Vanguard is partly immortalised in my tabeltop fleet, albiet as VSD, not an ISD...

Meanwhile, Mescue finished its job!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay362_zpsxbsb2lfq.png
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay363_zps2v6acnpm.png
YES. I AM BRILLIANT!

Glory ran off, and we mopped up the last T/A... Leaving just one last little loose end to tie up, since I had torpedoes to spare, traitorous dogs...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay364_zpsqzhcbwh2.png

Then I headed home in glorious victory, accompanied by a heavily damaged (ike 3% hull), but still flying Alpha 2 and an untouched Alpha 3! Clearly, we left Maarik Stele behind a couple of missions ago, since these guys were competant!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay365_zpsmsqumkdw.png

Primary Objective:
E/S Haven 3 must be boarded
ISD Vanguard must survive until other goals complete
M/CRV Mescue must survive until other goals complete
Secondary Objectives:
None
Bonus Objectives:
None

11/26 kills. All six Escort Shuttles and five T/A!

Talk about difficulty all over the place, last week's first mission was solid but they got easier as we went along!

And so we come to the end of TIE Fighter!

Let's stop and take a quick look, then shall we?

TIE Fighter
Training Mission 1: Gunnery (Attempted, up to X-Wing Dodec (four bonus goals failed))
Training Mission 2: Flight Leaders and Wingmen (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)
Training Mission 3: Destroy Depot (Attempted, three bonus goals failed)
Training Mission 4: Destroy Probe (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)

TIE Interceptor
Training Mission 1: Threat Display(Attempted, two bonus goals failed)
Training Mission 2: Ambush!
Training Mission 3: Clear Minefield
Training Mission 4: Combined Attack

TIE Bomber

Training Mission 1: Proton Torpedoes (Attempted, two bonus goals failed)
Training Mission 2: Space Bombs
Training Mission 3: Torpedo Run (Attempted, two bonus goals failed)
Training Mission 4: Bombers Armed with Missiles

TIE Advanced

Training Mission 1: Concussion Missiles
Training Mission 2: Rocket Attack (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)
Training Mission 3: Preemtpive Strike
Training Mission 4: Hyperdrive Upgrade (Attempted, one bonus goal failed)

Assault Gunboat

Training Mission 1: Shields
Training Mission 2: Teamwork
Training Mission 3: The Challenge(Attempted, twelve bonus goals failed)
Training Mission 4: Escort Duty (Attempted, two bonus goals failed)

TIE Defender

Training Mission 1: Dogfighting!
Training Mission 2: Tractor Beam
Training Mission 3: Inspect & Disable
Training Mission 4: Disable and Capture

Missile Boat

Training Mission 1: Dual Warheads
Training Mission 2: Anti-Warhead Defense
Training Mission 3: Disabling Minefield
Training Mission 4: Missile Boat vs. TIE Defender

We have completed properly 13/24 of the training missions - just slightly over half - which is nice! We only had to swtich back to Medium on one mission (and that was largely by accident on the dreaded Battle One Mission Five...) All gold medallions are nevertheless earned!

Current score stands at a grand 1317285!

Skill is long-maxed out at 65535.

Total kills: 456

Of which:
X-Wing: 36
Y-Wing: 87
A-Wing: 23
B-Wing: 26
Z-95: 39
T/F: 4
T/I: 3
T/B: 21
T/A: 18
GUN: 14
SHU: 24
E/S: 16
TRN: 14
ATR: 10
CRV: 12
M/CRV: 14
FRG: 1
M/FRG: 1

Captures: 26

Craft lost: 2

Battle One: Five secondary, five bonus medals
Battle Two: Four secondary, four bonus medals
Battle Three: Four secondary, six bonus medals
Battle Four: Two secondary, two bonus medals
Battle Five: Five secondary, two bonus medals
Battle Six: Three secondary, four bonus medals
Battle Seven: Two secondary, two bonus medals

I am a General, and the Emporer's Hand!

Next week, then, we shall begin the foray into the (as I recall MUCH harder) expansion missions in Battle Eight!

factotum

2015-04-23, 12:43 AM

The final missions in final battles being easier than what has come before seems to be a trend in TIE Fighter, doesn't it? Congrats on completing the original game!

Aotrs Commander

2015-04-29, 05:46 PM

I shall get straight to it!

Battle Eight - Strategic Warfare

Mission One: TIE Advanced Plants

Fly T/D Alpha and oversee the evacuation of TIE Advanced plant FAC Omar 1, 2 and 3. Great - starting off with a protect mission!

Okay, one of the bonus objectives is to destroy the Modified Frigate. We'll go with Heavy Rockets and see if we can't disable it early on...

First attempt - died as the M/FRG is armed with Advanced Missiles. Second attempt, this time attacking the warhead launcher with one rocket and then wasted the others so I quit out.

About TEN or TWELVE attempts later, it actually deigned to let me take out the warhead launcher at all. And then the TIE Bombers were somehow able to attack the FAC despite being nowhere near it - having cleared the air, Omar 1 was destroyed by - something and the EIGHTEEN, EIGHTEEN Assault Gunboats all hyperspaced in AT ONCE right on top of the last ships and utterly obliterated them advanced torpedoes before I could even BEGIN to get to them.

WHAT. THE. [EXPLETIVE].

Talk about a RIDICULOUS difficulty spike. I knew I didn't like these Zaarion battles much and this is why.

Frack my tin hat.

The last try, I didn't frack about and immediately called for reinforcements. They arrived, as I as still closing on the M/FRG Raptor in the form of GUN Nu. I once more made my run on Raptor's warhead launcher (while sending Alpha 2 and 3 after the first wave of of TIE Bombers), fired one rocket and then broke off to start chasing down the TIE Bombers who were attacking FAC Omar 1.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay366_zpssg428pas.png

As I finished up, I was far enough that - with no missiles to help it - I took a few seconds to empty my last rockets at Raptor. (It managed to kill on then...)
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay367_zpsiagtl6wu.png

I then carried on wiping the TIE Bombers. With Nu helping, I was able to drop in behind them and hit them with quads, making them break off one by one, and my wingmen and Nu helped mop up. We were so successful that Omar 1 didn't even get it this time.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay368_zps7ocsn4za.png
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay369_zpsxqxs8sqf.png

It was at this point a pair of TIE Advanced hypered in and one targeted me. *sigh* No missiles, no tractor beam. Doing this the hard way, then... I went after the one targeting me, suspecting - rightly - they were packing advanced missiles.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay370_zpsgzj7mf9s.png

I killed that one, just in time to intercept the very final wave of T/Bs.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay371_zpsaytyoe99.png

I then realised there were more T/As flying around, and both my wingmen and the GUNs went down in rapid sucession. I was lucky-ish - I managed to avoid fighting more than one at once until the last pair. This proved time-consuming and difficult, because the damn things won't stay still.
http://s168.photobucket.com//albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay372_zpsqhprl9th.png
Get out of here, Timber, you're the last damn one!

As I was dealing with the last one, and CORT Timber was launching, Transports started arriving. I killed the last T/A and chased to attack them before they took out Omar 1.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay373_zps2xflek4l.png

That.. did not go so well.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay374_zpsl5pz45ux.png

They had Heavy Rockets, and despite Omar 1 being on full strength, they were able to take it out as I tried to close. I figured I better intercept them before they could take out Omar 2 and...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay375_zpszxwseokh.png
... fragnuggets.

Yes, apparently Omar 1's destruction is the trigger for GUN Z-Mu, Z-Nu and Z-Tau to show up. All at once. Dear Lichemaster. I've never SEEN that many GUNs in one place at once! No wonder the GUNs never showed up anywhere else in the EU, Zaarin fielded like half of them ever made! Where the hell were these guys when I was fracking around in battle one?! Thank frack, though, they only have Advanced Torpedoes, so I was safe or there would have been NO way to win. The next few minutes were frantic, as I desparately made passes on the TRNs to try and save Omar 2 (for fear of something ELSE showing up!)
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay376_zpsmf4adjwc.png

Despite my best efforts, I failed, though I did kill every last one as they fled. I then started dealing with the... *sigh* squadron and a half of GUNs trying to kill me.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay377_zpsfvv2bobs.png

They were managing to hit each other, so after I killed a couple, I tried luring them past Raptor, hoping to make them hit it.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay378_zpsihmu895k.png

This didn't work well, though. I decided then, as I was doing quite well dodging their fire, I would concentrate on Raptor (in case it got any ideas about running off). I kept my speed high, and kept making passes at about 1km out, and breaking off fairly shortly (I did NOT want to accidently ram Raptor and ruin all my hard work!) After a few more passes, still under heavy fire, I managed to kill the shields, and one last pass disabled it.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay379_zps9oevmegf.png

Having come WAY too close to hitting it as I started on the GUNs again, I broke off and flew 3 km out, before beginning the long process of taking the remaining GUNs out.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay380_zpsc7la5l3b.png

Last one...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay381_zps5m9ylpfn.png

I now could cruise back safetly to Raptor and destroy it at leisure.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay382_zpshrs0nv2l.png

Or so I thought. At 50% hull, six more TRNs hypered in, TRN Sigma and Omega. Okay chaps, that's just nasty. If you actually do attack the M/FRG early, you trigger more TRNs to attack the FACs - which triggers the GUNs to wipe the convoy. Railroading you much? In any case, they immediately ran for hyperspace (well, you would, wouldn't you?) and due to the distance, I was only able to get one before they made it out alive. Dammit.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay383_zpsm4daed63.png

Well, Raptor wasn't going anywhere, anyway...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay384_zpsnypbzdrf.png
Die, traitors, just freaking DIE!

Primary Objectives:
CORT Timber must complete mission
CORT Hut must complete mission
CORT Libro must complete mission
FRT Subcom must complete mission
FRT Teal must complete mission
CORT Nomme must complete mission
Secondary Objectives:
None
Bonus Objectives:
M/FRG Raptor must be destroyed
100% of T/A Z-Alpha Must be Destroyed

44/59 kills. 18 GUNs (!), 14 T/B, 5 T/A, 6 TRN, 1 M/FRG. My score (at about 67k) is actually the forth-highest I've achieved on any campaign mission, and I think the only one that didn't involve capturing anything...! (AND I called for reinforcements.)

Funnily enough, after all that lot, I ran out of time for this week!

(We seem to go in fits and starts, don't we?)

I'm slightly dreading the next mission if this is how they are all going to go...!

factotum

2015-04-30, 01:48 AM

You kind of think that Lucasarts took the criticism of the original missions being too easy on board when they designed the expansions, then went way too far the other way... :smallwink:

And yes, you really need to know in advance what order to do things in TIE fighter or else you fail hard, which is one of my few criticisms of the game.

pendell

2015-04-30, 02:49 PM

Aotrs Commander

2015-04-30, 05:17 PM

One thing that made battle 8 mission 1 easier is that the bombers are unshielded -- which means, 1 shot of ion cannon puts their systems in the yellow and grinds them to a dead stop. TWO shots will kill them, of course, but sometimes its useful to keep one alive and stopped so that the next wave doesn't launch until I'm ready.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

*skulldesk*

Why didn't I think of that? If you disabled them all, and told you wingmen to ignore them, they wouldn't be spawning more waves, would they?

Stupid, stupid.

mangosta71

2015-04-30, 06:01 PM

Because, like a true Imperial patriot, you glory in shedding as much blood as possible.

Crow

2015-04-30, 11:57 PM

*skulldesk*

Why didn't I think of that? If you disabled them all, and told you wingmen to ignore them, they wouldn't be spawning more waves, would they?

Stupid, stupid.

That was my secret to getting through X-Wing.

Aotrs Commander

2015-05-01, 06:22 AM

I mean, it's not even like I don't do that as a matter of course when I'm flying against the rebels, is it?

Guuuh.

I still cannot BELIEVE I didn't try that!

DigoDragon

2015-05-01, 07:40 AM

I still cannot BELIEVE I didn't try that!

Rebel Blue Leader: "Gold team, get your pilots in that fight! They're mopping up our support carrier!"
Rebel Gold Leader: "I can't, they haven't finished off that last pilot on Red team!"

Aotrs Commander

2015-05-01, 10:04 AM

Rebel Blue Leader: "Gold team, get your pilots in that fight! They're mopping up our support carrier!"
Rebel Gold Leader: "I can't, they haven't finished off that last pilot on Red team!"

That sounds about right...

factotum

2015-05-01, 10:21 AM

Reminds me of X3: Terran Conflict (a completely different game, I know, but bear with me). In that game one of the starts (Bankrupt Assassin) has you being attacked by mercenaries pretty much constantly, but you can get round that by destroying all but one of an assassin group and then severely damaging the hull on the last one. No new assassin groups will spawn while that last assassin from the previous group is there, and damaging his hull makes him far too slow to ever catch you, so you can pretty much forget about assassins (at least until the damaged ship limps into a Xenon sector and gets roasted).

Squark

2015-05-03, 10:39 AM

Aotrs Commander

2015-05-03, 05:54 PM

Just a heads up- GOG.com released the collector's edition (the '95 one) as a free upgrade for all those who already had purchased Tie Fighter there, and it's now part of the purchase if you pick it up later. So, yay!

Good on GOG! That really needed to be done, in the absence of a proper "enhanced edition" or something, wherein they would take the 95 version and upgrade ONLY the graphics - and the requisite gubbins to make it work better (and leave the music damn well alone!)

Aotrs Commander

2015-05-06, 04:55 PM

Okay, we will remember to Disable Stuff is we possibly can...!

Battle Eight, Mission Two: Save T/A Factory

Fly T/D Alpha and stop Zaarin's cargo forces from looting TIE Advanced plant ZA-13.

Okay, they give us Protons, so we'll take Heavy rockets...

Was doing alright on the first attempt, then one of the CARGs blew up... Try again...!

Second attempt, I better knew what I was doing. First off, I ordered my wingmen to attack the TIEs attacking us, and then fired one Heavy Rocket at each of the four big targets: CNVYR Z-Cod 1 and 2 and M/CRV Z-Oz 1 and 2.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay385_zpso2nvx2jb.png

I then set to work strafing them with ions (starting with the M/CRVs) until they were disabled and ordering my wingmen to ignore them.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay386_zpswl9gqn92.png

I then switched to making runs on CORT Coral, ignoring the TIE attacking me.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay387_zps90n3vmvv.png

After I dealt with that, I just turned to attempt to disable that last TIE, when my wingmen got it. Two individual T/As appeared, so I went after them.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay388_zpsqahkyi8p.png

I killed them, and a new pair appeared. I foolishly left them to my wingmen, broke off to take some shots at the static targets. Both my wingmen, however, manged to get themselves killed a few seconds apart, so Ihad to deal with the last pair solo. After a long and tedious chase, I managed to take them both out, disabling the last one to forestall any more reinforcements.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay389_zpsmswrlgod.png

With the area secure, I went back and destroyed the now-boarded cargo ships.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay390_zpseeu1r32x.png
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay391_zps5gajqd7w.png

After I destroyed the last one, TRN Z-Elpi tried to flee out of the FAC/1. It did not get far!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay392_zpsreypva1m.png
For once, I was quite literally on top of it, a deftly dropped in behind.

Then I just waited until E/S Omega boarded it and then destroyed the disabled T/A - which turned out to be the last one, naturally. and then headed home!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay393_zpsdr99wus8.png

Primary Objectives:
CNVYR Z-Cod 1 must be destroyed
CNVYR Z-Cod 2 must be destroyed
CORT Z-Coral must be destroyed
100% of M/CRV group Z-Oz must be destroyed
FAC/1 ZA-13 must survive until other goals complete
Secondary Objectives:
CNVYR Z-Cod 1 must be boarded
CNVYR Z-Cod 2 must be boarded
CORT Z-Coral must be boarded
100% of M/CRV Z-Oz must be boarded
Bonus Objectives:
100% of M/CRV Z-Oz must be inspected
CNVYR Z-Cod 1 must be inspected
CNVYR Z-Cod 2 must be inspected
CORT Z-Coral must be inspected
100% of ATR group Tiger must complete mission
E/S Sigma 1 must complete mission
E/S Sigma 2 must complete mission
E/S Sigma 3 must complete mission
TRN Z-Elpi must be captured
E/S Omega must complete mission

9/14 kills - all five cargo ships and four T/A. And a promotion to Emperor's Eyes (which is a personal first!) Huzzah!

That was unsettlingly easy... which probably means a nightmare for the next one!

Mission Three: Save T/A Plant

Frack baskets. Another protect mission! No bonus or secondary goals, so this is going to be either really easy... or really, really hard!

Um... the default load is a double load of Heavy Rockets?

*gulp*

Actually, it was a bit hectic to start with, but I managed... just!

You arrive safely, so I had a short while to start charging my shields before CRV Caplure (... Lucasarts, stop calling ships by the job and changing one letter!) arrived, followed by five Assault Gunboats from Z-Tau.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay394_zpsowmwrhml.png

I ordered my wingmen after the latter, and threw one Heavy Rocket at each CRV. I then stafed them with ions and disabled all three... Just in time for a Carrack cruiser to show up! I emptied my remaining Rockets at it, but it nailed a couple of them, annoyingly. Then a trio of TRNs showed up, so I screamed off to deal with them (via ion cannon). At this stage, I was far too busy to remember to take screenshots, as I was nearly constantly slamming energy into my shields and volley after volley of missiles were shot at me - I assume mostly from the Carrack. I disabled the TRNs (and ordered my wingmen to ignroe everything I'd disabled). While I was doing that, the Carrack had reached the station and was pummelling it. My reload TRN was beckoning, but I didn't dare go for it - the stations only hope was to keep the Carrack shooting at me. My shields were still reeling and between the Carrack and the GUNs...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay395_zps17chzept.png
...this happened. CrapcrapcrapcrapCRAP!!!

By some miracle of the Dark Side, I was able to keep away long enough to wait out those long 45 seconds, before I could come back in. I ordered my wingmen to attack the Carrack, while I made more stafing runs, hoping to just get those damn shields down!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay396_zpsmm5na9ij.png

As I pulled around for another pass, I saw yellow dots on the radar and went "please be Heavy rockets, please be Heavy rockets, please be Heavy rockets, YES!" My wingman came through and I disabled Carrack Z-Jumimi. Now I could go after the GUNs!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay397_zps8pubwzph.png
As you can see, Z-Jumimi was awfully close to the FAC/1. So close in fact, that this GUN here - and unfortunately one of my wingmen - ran straight into it!

I disabled the last GUN, and ordered my remaining wingman to ignore it. Things went quiet. SHU Sigma had not arrived yet and I suspected it would be triggered by something dying. So I flew over to my reload TRN, and re-stocked. Without moving, I emptied the launchers onto Z-Jumimi. I could have killed it with lasers, of course, but with no idea what might come next, I wanted to have a load of rockets immediately to hand.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay398_zpsrm8hydir.png

So, because I hadn't moved, by the time the rockets hit it, I had reloaded again, just in case!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay399_zps3ko6czmz.png
BOOM! Muahahahaha!

The CRVs were next - lasers were plenty sufficient.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay400_zps7nw1ga3x.png

As I destroyed the second one SHU Sigma arrived - as well as a single TIE Advanced, with both me and wingman went after.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay401_zpsh58kmnlm.png

Third CRV...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay402_zps2bwtx5j7.png

And then I waited for SHU Sigma to dock.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay403_zpspvnit8c6.png

With the mission complete, ISD Render showed up, and I headed off to destroy the three TRNS and last gunboat. That triggered one more T/A, which ws destroyed in short order. And hyperspace home!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay404_zpss2iw2sdf.png

Primary Objectives:
ATR Java must finish docking
100% of ATR group Themor must finish docking
SHU Sigma must complete mission
E/S Omega must complete mission
FAC/1 XA-13 must survive until other goals complete
Secondary Objectives:
None
Bonus Objectives:
None

10/14 kills: three CRV, one CRCK, three TRN, a GUN and two T/A. A bit hairy - and I was lucky, for once! - but we managed.

Mission Four: Supply T/A Plant
*skulldesk*

Damn you, protect missions!

This time, we've got to protect the whole convoy to resupply ZA-13 from rebel attack.

At least we've still got a double load of warheads - and I think this time, it might be wise to stick with the Advanced Missiles...

First try, got killed by the four or so CRVs by a steady barrage of missiles.

Second time lucky!

Straight out of hyperspace...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay405_zps1juis4bo.png

...and there are immediately two Y-wings to destroy!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay405_zps1juis4bo.png

The next job was B-Wing Red. I ordered my wingmen to go after Red 2, and fired two missiles at Red 1, and then disabled it (telling my wingmen to ignore it). I then killed Red 3.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay407_zps9bambmzm.png

By this point, four Y-Wings, three more B-Wings and some Z-95 Headhunters has arrived. I took out the Z-95 targeting me with a desultory head-to-head pass. Ordering my wingmen to attack the second B-Wing, I chased down and destroyed and disabled the first two, using a couple more missiles in the process. The third was getting away, so I sent my wingmen after the Headhunters and chased right across the station to take it out. I then pulled round hard, and went after the Y-wings, taking one out on the head-to-head pass and then dropping in behind them to foil their attack run...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay408_zps37xlal39.png

...making sure to disable one!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay409_zpsuz8cwvzc.png

I now turned my attention the rather more concerning CRV Cobra - four of them - that were closing in. I learned from last time, and only attacked one at a time - disabling once their shields were down and ordering my wingmen (once they'd finished up the Headhunters) to help. (I think somewhere around this time, I took out another Headhunter that tried to attack me, but honestly, they were just an easily forgotten minor distraction!)
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay410_zps1msatk9j.png

I had disabled three CRVs, when another wave of Y-Wings showed up. I veered off and went for them. I destroyed two in the first pass with missiles, and made short work of the others.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay411_zpswk8oongd.png

And now I could deal with the last CRV. Somewhere along the line, my wingman had gone, so at least I could stop having to order him to ignore the disabled targets! I think one of the or other of the convoy ships picked off a couple of the disabled fighters, though.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay412_zpsi5nqazrm.png

That bought me a break, while the penultimate vessel docked.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay413_zps67cybsfi.png

And then three A-Wings showed up. They shot down my missiles on the initial pass, so I had to take them out the hard way. By lucky happenstance, choose to I disable the second one, which was good, as when four X-Wings arrived while I was still dealing with the last one, I was able to finish it quickly.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay415_zpsfx01cf8w.png

The X-Wings were going for CARG Terry 2, which had started at only 50% shields. I jetted over, and used the last of my missiles to kill two on the way in, and quickly mopped up the last two before they could do too much damage. (Fortunately, I think they were armed with Mag Pulse, or something or that would have been it!)
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay416_zps8zadmczn.png

It went quiet again, and a relaod TRN showed up. While Terry 2 - the last ship - was heading to hyperspace, I grabbed a quick reload (never sure what might be coming next).
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay417_zpsrwq3vzgy.png

As it was, that was it. So all that remained was mop-up duty, before I headed home.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay418_zpsl9xnkxko.png
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay419_zpsudfxebuc.png

Primary Objectives:
FAC/1 ZA-13 must survive until other goals complete
100% of CARG group Terry must finish docking
CTRNS Cartel must finish docking
CNVYR Vendor must finish docking
100% of CNVYR group Dromii must finish docking
Secondary Objectives:
None
Bonus Objectives
CTRNS Cartel must complete mission
100% of CNVYR group Dromii must complete mission
100% of CARG group Terry must complete mission
CNVYR Vendor must complete mission

21/33 kills... 4 X-W, 5 Y-W, 3 A-W, 3 B-W, 2 Z-95, 4 CRVs.

That actually wasn't too bad!

Well, those were certainly less bad than I was expecting, and definitely easier than last week! Still, there's a couple more to go, and I recall one of them being a right pain! But we shall see next week!

factotum

2015-05-07, 03:02 AM

Interesting cat picture in the middle of that last battle report. :smallsmile:

Seems using the IONs is definitely making these a lot easier...should have thought of that myself when I was playing through this!

Aotrs Commander

2015-05-07, 12:24 PM

Interesting cat picture in the middle of that last battle report. :smallsmile:

The crap...? Oh, damn, extraneous "]".... And it was the wrong image anayway... *sigh*

Fixed..!

Seems using the IONs is definitely making these a lot easier...should have thought of that myself when I was playing through this!

Actually, a fair amount of my ioning didn't change much this time, since it was clear that there were other triggers... But it does help in places!

(In fact, the latter couple of missions in Battle One can be a darn sight easier if you can manage to disable the Lulsa, for instane. It might be invulnerable in mission 5, but you can still disable it!)

Crow

2015-05-07, 12:51 PM

Ions are fantastic for slowing down A-wings too.

Aotrs Commander

2015-05-12, 05:25 PM

Okay, we're a day early this week, since it fits my schedule better!

Battle Eight, Mission 5: Capture Mag Pulse Weapon

This time, TIE Defender Alpha are going to disable a rebel PLT containing the MagPulse weapon. (One I recall not finding all that useful, personally...)

Default load is 8 heavy rockets, so we'll stick with that...

First try, got as far as disabling the PLT but it somehow killed me in a few scant seconds. What the hell?

Second try, same thing. The hell is up with those turbo lasers?

Okay, third time lucky...

First job was order my wingmen to attack the PLT/2 iand unload all of my Heavy Rockets on it.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay420_zpsf3eg9shq.png

And then turning to face the attacking Z-95s, preferrably before their missiles hit.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay421_zpschlzokai.png
As per usual drill, I was attemping to disable them.

Once they were down, the PLT/2 was down to 1% shields, so I rushed in and we disabled it.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay422_zpsxkqronsv.png

It launched TRN Blue, which I JUST had time to disable before having to break off to chase down the new flight of rebel the new T-Wings (a laughable attempt at a new starfighter if ever there was one), which had arrived and started going for ATR Leopard. Fortunately for Leopard, it was able to shoot them all down, despite heavy damage, before I could assist. I then went after the newly-arrived X-Wings, once again disabled them.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay424_zpsec6zfeq8.png

While TRN Lambda arrived to capture TRN Blue.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay423_zpsgs6vau5v.png

I went after the M/CRVs next, and disabled them in short order - though the first one was blown up my wingmen's remaining Heavy Rockets (not before I inspected them, fortunately).
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay425_zpsxnlt9syc.png

As the objectives were being completed in relative safety, my wingmen started attacking the disabled craft (despite the fact I'd ordered them not to, and did so again) and pretty much destroyed all of them. I felt not at all sorry, then, as we were attacked by successive waves of two A-Wings, two, three and four B-Wings when they were killed by the B-Wing's Advanced Missiles.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay426_zpsn3a1c4nl.png

Somewhat annoyed, I headed home.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay427_zpss2vfjagl.png

Primary Objectives:
ATR Leopard must finish docking
TRN Omega 1 must finish docking
TRN Omega 2 must finish docking
E/S Sigma 1 must finish docking
PLT/2 RS-32 must be captured
Secondary Objectives:
TRN Blue must be captured
Bonus Objectives:
TRN Blue must be disabled
ATR Leopard must complete mission
TRN Omega 1 must complete mission
TRN Omega 2 must complete mission
E/S Sigma 1 must complete mission
100% of M/CRV Rampart must be inspected

A pathetic 9/24 kills. My wingmen completely ignored my "ignore target" commands, which was VERY annoying. Next time, I'll just order to wait or go home if they're not to follow my damned orders! As a result, I only got credit for the B-Wings.

Mission Six: Trapped

I remember hating this mission.

And, on briefing, I know why.

Fly two T/D - with a laughable single T/A for escort, and help the three TIE bombers destroy the enemy Interdictor cruiser. While under attack by a M/FRG and its fighters. Both of which are closing on the VSD Skeltor. I appreciate your confidence my abilities, Admiral Thrawn, but maybe, I dunno, you could have brought more than SIX fighters on the Victory star Destroyer!

Oh, and they want you to use Mag Pulse warheads, of which you are given FOUR. Fantastic.

I am of two minds as to whether to bother or just use Heavy Rockets.

But go on, we'll try the first time...

Oookay. That... went better than expected.

First thing I found was I was under attack by TIE Interceptors with Advanced Missiles. No time to worry about the enemy capital ships, I had to clear the first wave...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay428_zpsdpgkbelc.png
Really bad news - to my utter disgust - if you disable any enemy fighters in the mission they explode. So, the wingmen ignoring me last mission was probably deliberate.

M/FRG Shadow was also launching TIE Bombers. First to kill the station, and then going after VSD Skeltor... with Heavy Bombs. Skeltor did a good job of taking them out itself (thougb it took at least one bomb hit), I went after several, trying to stop them, but it got them with missiles faster than I could.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay429_zpsjuots6je.png

All the while, T/Is with advancd missiles and TIE Fighters with missiles were launching and closing in. I was very shortly on my own, but at least I didn't have to worry about the my T/Bs yet. While all this was going on Strike Cruiser Striking Serpent had arrived. Once it got within shooting distance of Skeltor, I launched my first Mag Pulse warhead at it. I hung around to make sure it was disabled once its shields went out - to make sure it wasn't going to be shooting Skeltor again!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay430_zpstmfncbuh.png

As I didn't fancy attacking either capital ship yet - I really needed them to be close enough for Skeltor to help - I went back to destroying T/Is.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay431_zpsevpxzmyw.png

But I kept a sharp eye on INT Grappler. As soon as it started exchanging fire with Skeltor, I hit it with my second Mag Pulse and then stuck around as the TIE Bombers launched from Skeltor, dogging like crazy and hammering it until the shield went down.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay432_zpsufpimlvt.png

And then disabled it, leaving Skeltor and our TIE Bombers to finish up.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay433_zpspsjwb4tu.png

Skeltor was in the clear, and in fairly good shape.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay434_zpsw0ju7r3k.png

M/FRG Shadow looked like it was getting close to Skeltor, so I went after it, hoping I could get Skeltor to help me take that down to, and started with a Mag Pulse. Our T/Bs were attacking it too, so, I tried to draw fire (in between dealing with the last few T/Fs), but Skeltor didn't help much this time. Shadow caught my last Mag Pulse with a laser, so I ended up doing it the hard way.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay435_zpsgu9s3c2a.png

Skeltor hypered out, leaving one T/B behind (who had broken off attacking Skeltor, but at least someone had reduced the shields to about 44% first...) So it was a case of the usual drill of attack passes until the shields went down and I could disable it.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay436_zpsng8hqw9a.png

And then I could sit in saety an deal with it! Job done, and hyperspace home!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay437_zpsajlg82w3.png
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay438_zpsqmijcit8.png

Primary Objectives:
VSD Sceltor must complete mission
INT Grappler must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives:
None
Bonus Objectives:
None

20/40 kills... 11 T/I, 1 T/B, 7 T/F and the M/FRG.

That wraps up Battle Eight, as Zaarin destoys all the T/A Plants I'd fought so hard to protect the moment my back was turned. FRACK. DAMMIT.

Battle Nine - TIE Defender Technololgy

Oh boy, if I thought I had remembered disliking Battle Eight, Battle Nine was something I really didn't get on with! Especially as the later missions are "keep your wingmen alive!"

That said, there is the faint optimism that I actually did all the bonus goals in Battle Eight, so maybe I won't feel too bad if I miss then in Battle Nine!

Mission One: Capture Platform

We are to fly T/D Delta (of which I must keep at least alive *sigh*) and stop Zaarin's forces from looting the R&D platform where the T/D was developed.

Standard load is Advanced Missiles and a tractor beam, so we'll stick with that until I see what I'm up against... There's an awful lot of fighters to deal with, from looking at the bonus goals! And I was wrong - keeping your wingmen alive is one of the goals right away.

Hmm. Failed first time, as one of the CARGs got away, though I did disable all of the shuttles.

The second time, the fraking game didn't TELL me when all the ATRs were destroyed and you can't complete the mission (not to mention my wingmen died VERY early on); hell, the PLT has its shields taken out by the rebels (who showed up right in the middle of the attack). The PLT also NEVER ran out of missiles and I spent most of the mission dodging them.)

Fracking idiots. Why don't you fracks NOT send the ATRs until the area is damn clear? Or at least have a damned mission failure, so you don't waste half an hour pointlessly.

I HATE this mission. It's nearly as bad as the Lulsa missions.

One more time, and this time we're calling for reinforcements immediately.

Fortunately, for once, the reinforcements are actually worth their weight in gold. Not only do the two GUNs from Rho group go out and start disabling the shuttles, but they have at least four waves, if not more!

First job was take out the TIE Bombers attacking me with Advanced Missiles. Then I fired three missile at the PLT's Warhead Launcher because that was such a massive pain last time, followed by disabling the nearest of the five Shuttles and mopping up a bomber or two (now thAT I had a little bit of leisure in allowing GUN Rho to go after the shuttles. And I also remembered to use my tractor beam this tiem, to make the job a bit faster.)
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay439_zps2upgx6gp.png

I then raced over towards the CARGs, since stopping them is critical.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay440_zpsqk2nfrdb.png

I disabled both of them as fast as I could.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay441_zpsromwdcsm.png

About this sort of time, my first wingman bought it. I kept dealing with the bombers and also helped GUN Rho disable on of the Shuttles. ATR Omega started to arrive at this point, all six in dribs and drabs and headed off after the disabled CARGs.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay442_zpso8nzcbu6.png

Ahead of time - thanks to Rho - mopped up the Bombers and ordered m remaining wingman to head home (whereupon he flew off and flew around in circles until Adarga arrived much later and I didn't get my bonus goal. *sigh* Either 50% of T/D Delta does not, in fact, appear to include you completing your mission, but does count you in the 50% count and you thus have you to keep both wingmen alive or meaning the game glitched.) It was then Escort Carrier Jitte arrived. I headed right over, and, largely ignoring the (shielded) TIE Fighters armed with missiles it was launching, managed to take out one of its turrets and 8% off its shields. Then the last CARG showed up, and the station started launching TUGs. I broke off to make sure the CARG didn't get away - once more helping ATR Omega by disabling it. I then wiped the three TUGs for good measure, still ignoring the TIEs.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay443_zpskt3jk1y7.png

I then headed back to assist ATR Omega in taking the ESC down, hopefully before it killed them all this time...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay444_zpsmm2d3hum.png

Even the one turret down helped, and I managed a couple more before we brought the shields down and I disabled it for ATR Omega to finish off.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay445_zpswkuzc26k.png

Now they could (with GUN Rho's dubious help!) diable the station, and I could mop up the last T/Fs. Including one that was fruitlessly chasing my wingman around...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay446_zpsiv8u6hyc.png

No rebels yet, fortunately, so it was a case of sit and wait for Omega 3 to capture the station.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay447_zpse89cgkda.png

THAT caused Imperial Star Destroyer Adarga to arrive and start launching craft to capture all the shuttles. The rebels started arriving too (must have been the death of ATR Omega last time, I guess) - a lone A-Wing (which I took out with missiles), followed by 4 A-Wings at considerable distance, and quartet each of X-Wings and B-Wings. I moved to intercept, GUN Rho following behind. It was a bit touch and go, since one very nearly got away - it was trying to reach the hyperspace point, so I shot a missile at it; except it turned out to be two by mistake. Whoops. I then went after the X-Wings, using my last missile as I closed, while GUN Rho engaged them. I killed three and realised the last had obviously taken a missile hit, was running away and was about two click out and I had no missiles left. Que cannon recharge to max, Beam power to engines, and I just managed it.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay448_zpsg9wpjjso.png

That just left us mopping up the B-wings, which didn't take long - we even managed before they got close enough to attack the PLT.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay449_zpslqtsnh9x.png

I then settled in to wait for all the craft to finish docking, cursed my damned wingmen, and then flew home.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay450_zpso7hh07qd.png

Getting that last bonus goal seems nearly impossible. Either telling them to "head home" and not being able to arrive in the Adarga's hangar broke that goal, or you have to keep both alive. Either way, it wasn't worth the extra hassle, and I just was to get past Battle 9 to the more fun ones later on...

Primary Objectives:
75% of all CARGs must be destroyed
75% of all T/Bs must be destroyed
PLT/3 R+D Lab must be captured
Secondary Objectives:
50% of all SHUs must be captured
ESC Jitte must be destroyed
Bonus Objectives:
100% of all T/Bs must be destroyed
100% of all T/Fs must be destroyed
A-Wing Red 5 must be destroyed
100% of A-Wing group Red must be destroyed
100% of X-Wing group Gold must be destroyed
SHU Upsilon 1 must be captured
SHU Upsilon 2 must be captured
SHU Lambda 1 must be captured
SHU Lambda 2 must be captured
SHU Sigma 1 must be captured
100% of B-Wing group Blue must be destroyed
50% of T/D group Delta must complete mission

28/37 kills. 4 T/F (bwecause Jitte was destroyed before it could launch any more!), 9 T/B, 4 X-W, 5 A-W and 3 B-W, plus the three tugs. I was also promoted to Emperor's Voice, so that was some consolation, I suppose...!

Well, one down, several to go, and I don't think any of one them were much better than the first, from memory...! Let's see if I'm right next week!

factotum

2015-05-13, 02:31 AM

I'm really rather glad that I was not only playing on Easy but also not caring overmuch whether I completed the bonus objectives here...looks horrific.

Aotrs Commander

2015-05-13, 04:23 AM

I'm actually quite staggered I'm doing as well as I am, honestly. I guess maybe doing the whole game on Hard has actually pumped my skills up or something. I'm certainly having less difficultly now than I did years ago, and I'm playing on the top difficutly level, something I never did then!

It's also clear that "disabling stuff" they went out of their way to obviate as a viable tactic for buying you time, so despite all my cursing about not doing that a session or two ago, it probably wouldn't have helped me anyway.

I have no idea why there is a smiley on the title of my last post... It's certainly not something I intentionally added, by the way. (I general, because I am deeply rooted in ages past, I somewhat disapprove of emoticons on a fundemental level...)

pendell

2015-05-13, 01:33 PM

Sometimes they give you a jamming beam as well, which helps a GREAT deal against ATRs.

May the Force assist you in keeping ISD Adarga alive. :smallamused:

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Squark

2015-05-13, 01:37 PM

Sometimes they give you a jamming beam as well, which helps a GREAT deal against ATRs.

May the Force assist you in keeping ISD Adarga alive. :smallamused:

Respectfully,

Brian P.

The jamming beam was only introduced in the final battles- I want to say after the Missile Boat gets retired?

Aotrs Commander

2015-05-13, 02:44 PM

I hope so, in that makes it as late as possible; I found it more or less completely useless.

mangosta71

2015-05-13, 03:54 PM

I don't think I ever chose it over the tractor beam.

factotum

2015-05-13, 04:23 PM

Same here. You can't jam *everybody's* weapons, and a couple of advanced missiles up the tailpipe will usually prevent that particular enemy from shooting on a rather more permanent basis.

Aotrs Commander

2015-05-13, 05:39 PM

There are maybe a couple of ways you might have gotten it to be more useful. Like maybe having to fire a pulse (that discharges, I dunno, quarter/half or something of the power) that disables the weapons for a short period of time (like a Mag Pulse) - timed so that it would be slightly less time than it would take to recharge that amount of power at full recharge. Or maybe just having it function on the target in the CMD so long as it was within less than a klick or something, from any angle.

Though both of those might have been beyond what TIE Fighter could have accomplished with the level of technology and computing power available at the time.

pendell

2015-05-13, 06:17 PM

I find it most useful against a capital ship. The beam is useless in starfighter combat, and it's not very helpful for your own anti-capital ship runs, but when you must escort a flight of unshielded tie bombers against a capital without fighter cover it's just the thing.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

factotum

2015-05-14, 02:31 AM

Actually, thinking about it, there's another thing that makes the jamming beam largely useless--the existence of the tractor beam. If you've locked an enemy into flying in a straight line then they can't bring their weapons to bear or fire missiles unless something happens to fly in front of them, which is unlikely unless you hit them with the beam while they were flying at a capital ship. So, in 99% of situations the tractor beam does the same job as the jamming beam, only it also makes the enemy much easier to hit and disable or destroy!

mangosta71

2015-05-14, 09:45 AM

As pendell said, the only time the jamming beam is useful at all is against capital ships. Even then, it's hardly necessary. It's been a while, but I seem to recall being able to take out cap ships' weapon hardpoints with hit and run tactics. Once you hit their missile launchers, you can run out of range of their lasers to sweep the fighter cover, then tuck in behind their engines at point blank range so that any turbolaser mounts you haven't destroyed can't get an angle on you.

Aotrs Commander

2015-05-20, 01:48 PM

Just the one this week, bit short of time...

Battle Nine: Mission Two: Hold Platform

Oh crap baskets. I didn't like this mission, either...

Now I have to fly T/D Delta alone (thanks, wingmorons...) and stop enemy ATRs and TIE Defenders.

For once, there's no obvious choice on munitions. Advanced Missiles will make taking the T/Ds out much easier, hile Heavy Rockets will make short work of a few of the ATRs... Or I could take Advanced Torpedoes, which against TIE Defenders caught in the improved tractor beam may take them out efficiently...

First pass, we'll take the missiles, I think, until I see what I'm up against.

FRAG DAMMIT!

I was doing moderately okay until two of the ATRs bloody rammed me one after the other.

Okay, I did okay fighting the T/Ds and disabled one, so we'll try heavy rockets this time.

Nope. That went even worse this time. the platform got capture and more T/Ds shows up, and surprisingly, I can't fight four to one odds with no missiles with them having Advanced Missiles. I called for reinforcements, but they attacked the disabled T/D instead, frackwits.

Okay we'll try again, and this time call for reinforcements right away.

[EXPLETIVING EXPLETIVE!!!!!!]

Got through all the mission, finding it VERY hard to keep the enemy T/D from being destroyed by the fracking reinforcement GUns who WOULD NOT ignore target - I had to send them home - just for the [EXPLETIVING] TUGS TO GLITCH OUT AGAIN and not capture anything. TUG stops dead, in approach to target, doesn't move again. I blew up the first T/D, so it went to the second and FRACKING DID IT AGAIN even further away.

AND the bonus goals in the FAQ are, in fact, wrong, as apparently, I have to disable all four T/Ds in order to get all four TUGs.

Oh great one of the bonus goals is the Adarga. Yeah, because THAT'S going to be possible with multiple ways of ATRs with Heavy Rockets.

(And to add insult to injury, I had almost no score to boot.)

So, sorry lads, that's it for this week. I don't have time to do that all again, so we'll try that next week (and if it does it again, we're going down to damn Medium.)

Primary Objectives:
100% of all ATRs must be destroyed
100% of E/S group Red Knight must arrive
PLT/3 R+D Lab must survive until other goals complete
Secondary Objectives:
At least one of T/D group Z-Alpha must be boarded
Bonus Objectives:
Imperial Star Dest Adarga must have completed mission
Tug 8F9 must complete mission
Tug 7F9 must complete mission
Tug 6F9 must complete mission
Tug 5F9 must complete mission
Utility Tug 3f1 must have completed mission
100% of Probe group Keyhole 1 must be destroyed
100% of Probe group Keyhole 2 must be destroyed
CRV Uhu 1 must be destroyed
CRV Uhu 2 must be destroyed

factotum

2015-05-20, 03:29 PM

It's annoying enough to fail a mission because you ran out of luck or skill, but to fail it because the supposedly-helpful AI borks is ragequit-inducing. You have my sympathies.

pendell

2015-05-20, 03:55 PM

One time -- ONE TIME -- I was able to save the Adarga.

It's been years , but I think the solution involved 1) Shooting down the ATR rockets 2) Hitting the other transports with only a few shots to get them to abort their runs, thus buying time and preventing the Adarga from being slaughtered all at once. And also using the "kill every ship but one in a wave" trick.

IIRC, there are three attack groups in two waves hitting the Adarga. So the trick is to reduce all three waves to just one ship, destroy the last ship in one group, then clear the reinforcement wave, then move on to the next flight group, all the while evading the enemy T/Ds. The Adarga can survive the assault of THREE ATRs for a lot longer than it can survive NINE.

The reinforcement gunboats are, IME, worse than useless because they will destroy the last ship in a wave, bringing in the reinforcement wave before you are ready to do anything about it. Better to do it alone!

If you must have reinforcements, consider using Shift-W : Wait. This will stop the gunboats dead in space until you're ready for them.

I used heavy rockets for this, IIRC. Dog fighting TIE Defenders IS possible without missiles by doing the following:

1) Divert all shields to zero, divert lasers and beam energy to maintenance level.

2) Get behind a TD and lock on the beam. You should be faster than he is now, so adjust speed and use your lasers to take down his shields. I think at this point I just disabled him and let the tugs take care of themselves, but if you have the time, hit him with ONLY ONE ion blast. That will bring his SYS down into the yellow and stop him dead in space, but he won't count as "disabled" so the tug won't launch.

3) Once this is done, divert max power to lasers and beam to recharge those banks. Also shift some laser energy to the shields.

4) Start again from step 1.

I remember saving the missiles/rockets for the ATRS. IIRC, the thing to do with missiles is to use just ONE to take down the ATR's shields, then ion cannons to do the rest. You want to be really efficient in your weapon usage because there are 18 ATRs and you have -- what -- eight missiles or rockets? And that's all you're going to get. I forget whether there's a reload ship but even if there is there's no way you can call it with four active TIE defenders in the area. Further, if you take time to defeat the TIE Defenders the ATRs will finish the Adarga and possibly the station as well.

That's how I remember it, but it's been years so I can't guarantee it will work this time -- and it is STILL very, very hard!

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Aotrs Commander

2015-05-20, 04:28 PM

pendell

2015-05-20, 04:41 PM

Aotrs Commander

2015-05-20, 04:48 PM

Oh, yes: If you're comfortable with taking down TIE defenders without a tractor then this is a good mission for the jamming beam, shutting down the ATRs so you can fill them with turbolaser fire unimpeded by their own self defense weapons. Sure, you can dive in and repeatedly strafe them but that takes time, which is at a premium in this mission.

Go get 'em!

Respectfully,

Brian P.

I said I was comfortable taking them down with guns and a tractor, as opposed to without a tractor...! But jamming Beam isn't an available option, though, in any case; naturally in one of the few times it might be really useful! (Actually, training missions aside, I'm not sure it's actually appeared at all yet.)

Crow

2015-05-22, 10:01 PM

How do I get to play the 1995 cd version in the GOG package? They said they added it, but all I can download are the 94 and 98 versions.

factotum

2015-05-23, 01:32 AM

How do I get to play the 1995 cd version in the GOG package? They said they added it, but all I can download are the 94 and 98 versions.

I read a forum thread which suggested that running https://www.gog.com/account/refresh would update it to include the new version, but it didn't work for me, so I've just raised a ticket with GOG asking why it's not showing up.

[EDIT] Got a reply to my ticket saying they've temporarily disabled the account refresh facility in order to conserve server resources, so he'd gone in and manually refreshed my account for me--I can now see the 1995 Collector's Edition CD as a separate game. I can only suggest that you raise a ticket with their support to get your issue resolved similarly.

Aotrs Commander

2015-06-03, 05:09 PM

Right. Back from the mini-hiatus, but only time for one shot at this today...!

(As CSI and Murdoch Mysteries have now finished (the latter for the last time...) my Tuesday evening viewing is now freer, so I might move TIE Fighter evening to Tuesdays starting next week.)

Battle Nine: Mission Two: Hold Platform

Nope.

After.. I don't know how many efforts (most of which were "nope, quit immediately") I saved the Adarga. Twice. The first time, the TIE Defenders got away.

The second time, I broke off at the very end (Adarga was down to 15% hull) and disabled one of them. And immediately ordered the reinforcement GUNs to "wait." "GREAT!" I thought. "[Expletive]ing finally!" And then, as I was getting my reload, I checked the TUGs. Or rather, TUG. I was puzzled at first as to why there was only one of them, and why it had stopped "looking for craft to board." And realised, despite my orders, something blew up the one T/D I did manage to disable.

So it turns out, just for sheer spite, if you don't disable ALL of them, not all the TUGs launch.

That is RIDICULOUS.

Primary Objectives:
100% of all ATRs must be destroyed
100% of E/S group Red Knight must arrive
PLT/3 R+D Lab must survive until other goals complete
Secondary Objectives:
At least one of T/D group Z-Alpha must be boarded
Bonus Objectives:
Imperial Star Dest Adarga must have completed mission
Tug 8F9 must complete mission
Tug 7F9 must complete mission
Tug 6F9 must complete mission
Tug 5F9 must complete mission
Utility Tug 3f1 must have completed mission
100% of Probe group Keyhole 1 must be destroyed
100% of Probe group Keyhole 2 must be destroyed
CRV Uhu 1 must be destroyed
CRV Uhu 2 must be destroyed

Right, well, that's all I have time for this time around, with being short of time, and after umpteen attempts I'm too fuming to manage to be able to concentrate to attempt one more anyway.

So we shall try AGAIN, probably Tuesday.

(I wanted to at least make a bit of an effort today, as I missed last week.)

factotum

2015-06-04, 02:23 AM

(As CSI and Murdoch Mysteries have now finished (the latter for the last time...)

I think you mean "former"--Murdoch Mysteries is still going, it's CSI that's been cancelled. :smallwink:

These TUGs do seem to be very finicky about doing their jobs, it's about time the Emperor showed their pilots what happens to incompetent people round these parts, methinks!

Aotrs Commander

2015-06-04, 03:20 AM

I think you mean "former"--Murdoch Mysteries is still going, it's CSI that's been cancelled. :smallwink:

You're quite right, of course, I was clearly distracted by all the traitors...

These TUGs do seem to be very finicky about doing their jobs, it's about time the Emperor showed their pilots what happens to incompetent people round these parts, methinks!

Oh frack, yes...

pendell

2015-06-04, 07:48 AM

But if he does that, he has to find brand new pilots to replace them. Really good pilots don't just grow on trees -- not until Thrawn starts up the Spaarti cloning tanks, that is.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

mangosta71

2015-06-04, 09:52 AM

Getting rid of incompetents isn't exactly a loss. The bastards aren't doing anything anyway, so you may as well have nobody there doing nothing until you get the replacements up.

Aotrs Commander

2015-06-04, 10:33 AM

Heck, I'll fly back to the base ship, swap into a TRN/TUG/ATR/SHU/CUV and I'll go and capture them PERSONALLY...!

(You could practically do that in XWA...)

Aotrs Commander

2015-06-10, 06:36 PM

Day later than I intend (as yesterday evening was given over to finishing painting my Xyriat Hegemony fleet in the hopes that I can actually put the paints away and the table down for the first time since, like, April...) and despite going walking again this evening (limiting time) I want to make a another stab at this (I wanna get this one DONE), since Friday I won't be around. So...

Today's objective is to complete Battle Nine Mission Two and move on.

My plan of attack is to make two (proper, non-abortive) attempts. The first of which I will be swapping Heavy Rockets for Advanced Torpedoes, the reasoning being that if I can disable one or two ATRs more towards the fringe of their range, hopefully I can keep them from being destroyed until I'm ready for them and maybe give me a chance at disabling those TIE Defenders.

If this fails, I will try the second time until we achieve a "save Adarga" objective, since at no point in any attempt have I successfully completed the secondary goals to board one of the T/Ds; the only time I came close, of course, the TUGs glitched out... (If we get that far at that happens again, it will TRY locking a tractor beam on the TUG - since these improved versions are supposed to pull stuff towards you - in the hopes of "unsticking" it, otherwise we will just write this off as impossible.) So we will attempt to complete the plausible objectives!

Okay slight technical hitch, in that TIE somehow decided to move on, yet I'd swear blind I went in and failed to not progress last week.

Welp, not havin' that.

It's not going to win.

I've been at this for three weeks, I'm going to do this damned mission to the best of my abilities!

So I went out and found a pilot editor and knocked the numbers (score/kills) and mission progression back (the former of which the editor did itself just by clearing the score from the mission, the latter which was easy to work out, since I didn't kill anything other than ATRs in that last mission and we tracked that number at the end of battle 7 and I didn't kill any in Battle 8, so it meant I killed a feeble 5 ATRs (which means tweaking warhead fired/hit count by 4/4 as well) and I'm prepared to live with the shooting stats being slightly out because of one extra not-mission!) Shame I didn't think to do this way back for the battle 1 mission 5, or we could have had the whole game (to this point?) done on Hard.

Battle Nine: Mission Two: Hold Platform

Take three...!

OH YE GODS.

It really did NOT want me to do this mission, not at ALL.

Advanced Protons seemed to maybe make it easier? Since I could fire them from further away and I got more of them...?

I don't even KNOW how many attempts this took.

Early on, I was doing really well. The Adarga was down to about 50% hull and there were, like, two ATRs left, so I broke off to go after the T/Ds. Nope. After I knobbled the first one, the Adarga got destroyed. At this point, I officially gave up on the T/Ds. After several more attempts, wherein I simply quit and reloaded if ATR Sigma fired more than one or two heavy rockets right away and I didn't kill them, and Adarga kept dying (or an ATR would ram me) I threw up my hands and said "you know what, screw this noise, I'mma callin for reinforcements again."

Which brings us to the final attempt, and by the Dark Side, it did NOT want me to have anything...

Okay, the first order of business is call for reinforcements, save Adarga to target slot one, swing round to target ATR Sigma, set cannon recharge to full, pump a bit into shields. The plan is to shoot one or torpedoes at Sigma 2 or 3, hopefully before they can launch their own warheads, and then switch to quad lasers/twin ions. (I honestly fought this bit so many times, I can't even remember what happened this last time, whether I managed to get one or two torpedoes off, or I had to shoot rockets down or what.)
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay451_zpsulvofod9.png

The next few minutes are just mad hectic panic, rushing around, hitting ATRs left, right and centre, trying to disable those with near-zero shields - leaving them for everyone else to mop up, damn the kills - and just forcing them off their attack runs, and trying to leave one in the flight group alone and try and catch any heavy rockets you stop. I did this so often, it all blends into a blur... This time, I did have some luck: ATR Omega got held up by reinforcements GUN Rho, so we didn't get all three of the second waves if the ATRs showing up at once. (As that is usually fatal.)

When the first new wave showed up, I immediately broke off and went after them with my torpedoes and then dived in between them, trying to hit them off their attack course. And then just kept at it and at it.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay452_zpscvcnyvh0.png
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay453_zpskmpbyk9v.png
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay454_zpsxupycy1f.png

Because of ATR Omega being tied up, by the time their second wave came in, I was able to disable the last one some distance out. Adarga, this time, was at an astounding 32% shields, the best it'd ever had! "Huzzah!" I thought, as I went after the T/Ds. I disabled Alpha 2.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay455_zpsdtecsrjk.png

I frantically started to order every fighter to Wait, but Omega was destroyed and the others started to flee. I was, to my utter disgust, not quite fast enough to catch the very last fighter (T/I Gamma) from destroying the disabled ship. Frag. Dammit. By which point, the other Defenders were off.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay456_zpsulk10hpl.png

Welp. Never mind the seconary objectives, then. At least Adarga was safe!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay457_zpsgm9dbvi5.png

Now I took the time to reload, and then ordered the lone TUG that launched and reload CUV to head home (for two more bonus goals). And then it was just a case of waiting for the CRVs to arrive (which I hadn't bothered to do that attempt last week, or I would have just taken the result and not gone to find and editior...) First one showed up, and I think the GUNs were right on top of it or something, since as I hot into range to unload four Advanced Torpedoes at it, it's shield starting going down from lasrer fire. I fired them anyway (and got the kill) and whoever it was mopped up the probes over there too, so, okay, fine. That left me with the second, so I reversed course (screaming along at about 200-something with beam-fully-to-engines and cannon to normal) and dropped the last two on the CRV, then pumped cannon recharge, knocked the last of the shields out, switched to ions, and then swung around and disabled it. Then I could safely kill it.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay458_zpsjwzmonvv.png

Then I just had to nail the probes.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay459_zpsstkxzld1.png

Excellent! Now All I had to do was wait for Adarga to go home, and I had done the best I could. To pass the time, I ordered all the rest of the fighter home, and then switched to target view to watch the Adarga.

As I watched, to my disbelief, all FOUR of Escort Shuttle Red Knight rammed into the Adarga and died. Oh for the love of...

...

Wait, why was Adarga "following flight plan" to waypoint 2? Shouldn't it have gone home by now? Okay, we'll sit and wait for it to finish Waypoint 2.

And Waypoint 3.

And Waypoint 4.

And the it stopped. "Awaiting return of craft."
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay460_zps7k25v99o.png

No.

No no no no no.

[Expletive] no.

We're gonna do this, are we?

We're really gonna do this?

Right.

Fine.

We're doing this!

We're [expletive]ing doing this!

So I went. And I STRAFED THE CRAP out the Adarga, ignoring the advanced missiles I threw at me, until it's shields went down, and the FRACKING SHIP took the HINT.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay461_zpsjhx3zdax.png
GO HOME, Adarga!

*skulldesk*

*skulldesk*

*skulldesk*

You see what I mean? YE GODS this mission did not want me to have anything.

But damn it, after three weeks worth of effort, I was going to get my pound of its damn flesh!

Primary Objectives:
100% of all ATRs must be destroyed
100% of E/S group Red Knight must arrive
PLT/3 R+D Lab must survive until other goals complete
Secondary Objectives:
At least one of T/D group Z-Alpha must be boarded
Bonus Objectives:
Imperial Star Dest Adarga must have completed mission
Tug 8F9 must complete mission
Tug 7F9 must complete mission
Tug 6F9 must complete mission
Tug 5F9 must complete mission
Utility Tug 3f1 must have completed mission
100% of Probe group Keyhole 1 must be destroyed
100% of Probe group Keyhole 2 must be destroyed
CRV Uhu 1 must be destroyed
CRV Uhu 2 must be destroyed

THREE KILLS. One ATR, two CRV.

*sigh*

But I got 7/10 bonus goals (including the Adarga). Totally failed the secondaries, but in all my attempts, I only got even close twice (and only AFTER the Adarga is destroyed) only to be beaten out by glitches.

I think we have a new "Worst. Mission. Ever."

But damn it, I ground the bastard out for everything I could on Hard mode, so it can suck it!

(16K points, though, which is a 60% improvement over what I got before resetting, so I'mma call that a positive.)

So maybe NEXT week, we can finally move on to Mission Three.

It CAN'T be as bad as this one, right, guys?

Right?

Right?!

*sobs quietly*

pendell

2015-06-10, 08:03 PM

*Claps*

Well, at least the mission is over. Good grief.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Eldariel

2015-06-10, 08:12 PM

I just let the Adarga burn and blasted the Tie Defenders. I think this was the point in the game where I officially stopped caring about bonus goals.

factotum

2015-06-11, 02:46 AM

I had the advantage of not caring about bonus goals from the beginning when I did my playthrough! :smallsmile:

Pretty sure I had the thing with the Escort Shuttles all ramming the ISD and dying as they tried to dock when I did this mission, too--they really didn't design this one very well...

Aotrs Commander

2015-06-16, 05:04 PM

Okay, new week new mission! Finally!

Let's hope this one isn't as bad...!

Battle Eight: Mission Three: Protect Evacuation

Protect mission.

Bugger.

Okay, so I have to protect a bulk freighter (great) and two shuttles, with only a miraculously not dead Escort Shuttle Red Knight for backup. Suspected opposition is a Nebulon B Frogate plus fighters. I'm torn. On the one hand, Heavy Rockets would allow me to attack the FRG directly, and I could maybe disable it... But as likely as not the enemy fighters will prove resistant to being disabled again, so I'm pretty sure, unless I can get reloads, I'd still have to face the fighters - and apparently TIE Defenders, from the bonus goals - with no warheads.

Well, I think we'll try with Heavy Rockets the first time and see how far we get.

Fragnuggets.

"Nebulon B" my boney arese. It's ISD Glory! I threw the rockets at the Shield Generators, but I have no idea if they hit, and all it seemed to do was get me shot at by missiles until I died.

Okay, New plan. Kill enemy TRNs, THEN try attacking Glory...

Okay, the priority HAS to be the Glory's warhead launcher. Lats time I took it out with lasers - and shortly thereafter was killed by something ramming me and causing me to hit the Glory. FRAGDAMMIT!

Gonna try with Advanced Torpedoes, since with an ISD, taking the shields down is as easy as taking the Generators out. (I think.) At that leaves me a torpedo or two to deal with some other things. Maybe...

Killed by enemy with a bizillon missiles. Next time, calling reinforcements...

And then TIE crashed out. *sigh* and now I have to recalibrate the joystick again...

Killed by something outright, despite being at full shields, possible multiple instanteeous missile hits.

Dead by magic Glory turbolaser hits.

And again, because magic Glory "automatically kills all your torpedoes, even at point-blank range."

FRACKING HELL.

I FINALLY managed to kill all the TRNs (using 5/6 Adv torpedoes) and FINALLY managed to take out the ISD'd shield generators; but no dice, no change to shields. DAMMIT. I'm sure that was a thing - maybe it was only in X-Wing, then. Or XWA, I'm SURE I used to do skirmish where I'd attack the SSD's shield generators... (But WHY leave the damn shield generators as a targetable component...?) Great.

And then SOMETHING killed the bloody shuttle.

Right, well, chaps, that's it.

After about ten attempts, we are out of time and my annoyance is affecting my concentration.

What's frustrating is there is very little I can do differently, it's down to luck. (I knew there was a reason I didn't like this battle in particular much.) TIE desperately needed the missile counter-measures in these missions, since there's nothing to stop the enemy just spamming missiles at you which you can do NOTHING about, since if you dodge or stop to fight them, you fail your objectives - and if you don't, you get slaughtered by multiple missile hits.

And THIS time, it's not the bonus or secondary goals that I can't complete, it's the primaries.

Primary Objectives:
T/D Proto 11 must complete mission
T/D Proto 12 must complete mission
FRT Mharsup must complete mission
SHU G'nabgib must complete mission
Seconary Objectives:
None
Bonus Objectives:
100% of GUN group Z-Mu must be destroyed
At least one of T/A group Z-Alpha must be destroyed
At least one of T/B group Z-Beta must be destroyed
At least one of T/A group Z-Gamma must be destroyed
At least one of T/B group Z-Eta must be destroyed
At least one of T/A group Z-Theta must be destroyed
At least one of T/D group Z-Zeta must be destroyed
At least one of T/D group Z-Iota must be destroyed
100% of all TRNs must be destroyed
100% of Tug group 20F16 must be destroyed

If we don't get this one next week, we will admit defeat and drop down to Medium, else we shall be here forever... And while I don't mind doing this Let's Play for an extended period, I'd like to sort of try and keep it under a year...

DigoDragon

2015-06-16, 05:37 PM

Huh, so bad not one screen pic?

factotum

2015-06-17, 02:32 AM

I'm pretty sure the Glory is indestructible in this mission because it needs to play a part in later ones, so you should probably not even bother trying to take it out...

Aotrs Commander

2015-06-17, 04:16 AM

Huh, so bad not one screen pic?

I have limited screenshots to the actually successful attempts, basically since while despite being small, 461 (so far) screenshots takes up a lot of space.

Until these last two missions, it wasn't a problem, because I was at least getting one mission done per week...

I'm pretty sure the Glory is indestructible in this mission because it needs to play a part in later ones, so you should probably not even bother trying to take it out...

Preportedly, it is (it just doesn't matter to the storyline). However, I think it is also clear that aside from the absolute necessity of taking out that warhead launcher, I should indeed ignore it, and concentrate on killing the TRNs and maybe the TIE Bombers (the most likely ones who killed the shuttle).

That said, I'm beginning to wonder if the gentlemen that wrote the FAQ actually managed to play through on Hard himself, since towards this level, both the bonus goals and the mission strategy (which I check after the first time or two I die) have not been massively helpful and don't quite match-up with what I've encountered.

pendell

2015-06-17, 07:24 AM

shield generators is a thing only in X-wing and X-wing alliance. In TIE fighter the shields have to be reduced the old fashioned way -- by battering them down.

That's why, to take down a capital ship in TIE fighter, you've got to first knock out the warhead launchers, then the weapons emplacements, then sit off somewhere and blaze away with turbolasers until first the shields then the hull fail.

What, do you think they gave you space bombs and heavy rockets just for fun? It's because you need them. If this game was as easy as killing one component, you could get by with torpedoes.

So far as I know, there are no indestructible ships in game, it's just that if you kill a plot-critical ship the kill will not be acknowledged.

At any rate, in this mission, the objective is to ignore the glory and protect the evacuation. NOTHING ELSE MATTERS.

For this mission, I used the 'kill all but one transport in a wave and disable that one' to buy more time. Also, if I recall correctly, there will be later waves of tie bombers which are vulnerable to the hit-it-once-with-an-ion-cannon trick, putting it's SYS in the yellow. It will stop moving but won't actually explode as it normally does when SYS is taken all the way down to zero.

Also, I recommend ignoring the GLORY completely. IIRC, it won't shoot at you at all if you don't shoot at it. This mission is a lot easier when you're not having to evade its turbolaser fire and infinite advanced missiles.

This is one of the toughest missions in the game but it CAN be done! Good hunting!

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Aotrs Commander

2015-06-23, 04:26 PM

So far as I know, there are no indestructible ships in game, it's just that if you kill a plot-critical ship the kill will not be acknowledged.

Lulsa was definitely invulnerable in B1M5; even with the cheats on, you couldn't kill it.

Anyways, to busines.

Battle Eight: Mission Three: Protect Evacuation

Okay. The plan this time is to hang back near the platform, and take out the TRNs using Advanced Torpedoes and then try and stay on the T/Bs.

We will have a couple of shots at this, but if it starts to come towards close to time, difficulty will be set back to Medium (or Easy, if that's what it takes); being stuck on the least fun missions of TIE is counter-productive, so I want to get past at least this mission today.

AAAAAARGH.

FRACKING T/A. I was doing fine until I got jumped by three of them again, which of course meant I HAD to dogfight with them (since otherwise DEAD by advanced missiles), so the ONE, FRAKING ONE, T/B that got passed me went after the bloody shuttle WAY to far out to be able to do anything about, despite EVERY TIME I checked up on it, nothing was attacking it.

After several (fairly rapid) restarts, and switching to advanced missiles (need more reloads):

Nope. Disabled the first 5 TRNs, killed by apparently magic multiple advanced missile hits by T/A Z-Gamma from the middle distance, despite there being way more targets to attack closer than me.

Nope. Pendell is wrong - Glory started shooting an endless stream of Advanced Missiles at me when I got even slightly near it (while chasing the fracking TIE bombers), and T/A Z-Gamma were attacking me as well, so all I could do was fly in a circle until they destoryed the shuttle.

Right. One more attempt, then the difficulty is going to medium. Five more attempts after that, and it's going to Easy. More then five failed attempts at easy, sod it, the cheats are going on, because this is is now not fun and FAR too repetative.

Okay, that was THREE more attempts. Basically, if you EVER get attacked by even one TIE Advanced, you will FAIL the mission, because if you don't kill TIE Eta they will kill the shuttle and if you ignore the T/A you get killed.

That's it. Normal mode.

Still took four tries: two abortive attempts to even get pat the first GUNs without losing too many E/S (the second time, I'd managed to get three out and the Red Knight for rammed the Mharsup.

Final attempt:

Right, straight out of the gate, conduct drill: summon reinforcements, full throttle, set cannon rehcarge to max, sink all cannon energy into shields, place PLT/3 R+D Lab, FRT Mharsup and SHU G'nabgib into target memory. Do not forget to do any of those things immediately, since this mission has NO margin for error, not even a little. GUN Rho arrive promptly, shortly after the Mharsup and its attendant Escort Shuttle Dragonfly to assist the four E/S of Red Knight group.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay462_zpsjnkqqo6u.png

First attack wave: six Assault Gunboats from Z-Mu group.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay463_zps2gxgaylk.png

As Red Knight says, the best way of dealing with these guys is to ion the crap out of them and leave the disabled hulks for the E/S to finish off: speed is the name of the game here, for not only do you want to kill them before they do too much damage to the E/S...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay464_zpssjbu18xb.png

...But to give you a few seconds breather before Imperial Star Destroyer Glory arrives. After getting slaughtered by Glory that last time and seeing it attack the other craft the previous attempt, I went back to my initial tactics, instead of hanging back near the station like I had been doing since the start of today. I went to full throttle, closed in and killed that damned warhead launcher before it could do any damage to me or my allies.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay465_zpsryui3qyv.png

Next job is to take out the Transports. It's actually not quite as critical as you are told, since your allies go after them too. I used one missile, and concentrated again on flying passes to disable them. This time, I took a few precious seconds out to tractor beam, missile and ion three of the T/As and - happily - disable a couple of them. One thing is, at least a single missile hit will send them running for home, as well as making it easy for the E/S to polish them off. And equally happily, my allies left the disabled targets alone this time... Then I finished the last couple of transports.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay466_zpsxvuttlgk.png

I then went after the first wave of T/Bs and threw a couple of missiles in their direction to help the platform take them down - as Zaarin's T/B have shields, the bastards... (I REALLY did not want the PLT going down and them being able to attack the Mharshup.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay467_zpsupwuvkw9.png

With the last one of T/A Z-Gamma running for home and two of T/A Z-Alpha disabled, I was in the clear for the moment. Not a moment to soon as T/B Z-Eta made their unwelcome presence known. I rushed at them using my last two missiles on Z-Eta 1 and 2 to weaken them and break their attack run, killed Eta 3 with guns and finished off the last pair (one of them by accidental ramming, which is why it didn't count my kill score...), just as SHU G'nabgib got hit and decided to go home. (Notably, you can't just tell it to bugger off, as I tried that...)
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay468_zps1ammk6ab.png
Not this time, you bastards, not THIS. TIME.

A quick assess in the lull - igonoring the TUGs completely, you just can't afford the time or effort - I saw Z-Eta's second wave launching. No missiles to help this time, so I went in, forced them off their attack run and tractor beam/laser/ion'd them to death. (I cranked up my beam recharge a notch, the extra speed was not helpful). And then SHU G'nabgib was off home.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay469_zpshb97cmss.png

Before I could go help with T/B, T/A Z-Gamma 2 made it home...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay470_zps4kimz4oz.png

...and the next wave launched. Not really having an option here, I moved to engage. I managed - JUST - to survive the initial pass. As I was fighting and disabling them, finally, FRT Mharshup left and mission accomplished.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay471_zpsd608wjdp.png

I destroyed the nearest couple of disabled T/As (no sense in not getting those kills, right), but then T/D Z-Zeta showed up and, knowing, from FAR too much experience this mission, that getting blown up here invariably results in your being carted off to prison and restored, so I didn't even bother with hitting hyperspace, I just Control-Q'd the heck out of there, taking no chances whatsoever...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay472_zpsrmzqa716.png

Primary Objectives:
T/D Proto 11 must complete mission
T/D Proto 12 must complete mission
FRT Mharsup must complete mission
SHU G'nabgib must complete mission
Seconary Objectives:
None
Bonus Objectives:
100% of GUN group Z-Mu must be destroyed
At least one of T/A group Z-Alpha must be destroyed
At least one of T/B group Z-Beta must be destroyed
At least one of T/A group Z-Gamma must be destroyed
At least one of T/B group Z-Eta must be destroyed
At least one of T/A group Z-Theta must be destroyed
At least one of T/D group Z-Zeta must be destroyed
At least one of T/D group Z-Iota must be destroyed
100% of all TRNs must be destroyed
100% of Tug group 20F16 must be destroyed

10/35 kills: 5 T/B, 4 T/A, 1 GUN. A rather paffy 12k-ish score, but that damned job is done... Moving on, then...

Back to Hard.

Battle Eight: Mission Four: Escort to Rendezvous

FRAGDAMMIT ESCORT MISSION AGAIN.

Okay. We have to fly our sole TIE Defender and escort the delivery of T/D Protoytpes 11 and 12 fron FRT Mharshup to Modifed Corvette Hashiem (as immortalised in my tabletop fleet...) and cover SHU G'nabgib. Wonderful.

Plus... side? It's only rebels this time.

*sigh* Well, we'll take Advanced Missiles first time out, since the FRT is vulnerable. Any rebel capital ships (as the bonus goals suggest there will be) might have to be taken out with guns the hard way.

No, of COURSE we can't have a mission that can be completed can we?

It might be a trigger, but when the FRT was disabled, four TIE Advanced showed up and killed it.

Right. No fracking about, calling for reinforcements immediately again.

Also, screw the A-Wings, I'mma loading Advanced Torpedoes for the B-Wings and TRNs.

Right call.

When you arrive, six A-Wings show up, one at a time, form six different vectors. Having called for GUN Rho, this time, I left Blue 1 to them and locked on to Blue 2.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay473_zpsoi09z65s.png

One dead A-Wing later, I started toward the second one when the B-Wings showed up. "Right," says I. Cannon energy to normal, redirected all beam to engines, off to intercept at speed 192... The other four A-Wings (Blue 1 still being tied up with Rho) took shots at me, but all missed, even with their missiles, dspite me not doging about. So I waded right into B-Wing Red and made short work of them, with an Advanced Torpedo and some lasers apiece. It was during this point, when the A-Wings caught up to me, I realsied they were shooting magpulse weapons at me, not missile! So, they hadn't actually missed me - I'd registed a couple of shield hits on the way through, but a glance at my shields showed I was fine, so I'd assumed it was a single cannon hit and thought no more of it. So, virtually no threat at all, then! The only time Mag Pulse warheads are anything other than a very minor nuisence is if your shields are low, and with no missiles - I really wasn't concerned.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay474_zps9rrm3pbc.png

Off to the newly arrived Transports, then... One advanced torpedo each for the first two...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay475_zpsetwxym7t.png

...last one with guns - or would have been if SHU G'nabgib, of all vessels, hadn't killed it first. As I dealt with the three X-wings that were around, G'nabgib reported being hit, but a quick check showed no-one was going after it, and it broke off to go home.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay476_zpstoeoxini.png

M/CRV Hasheim arrived at this point, along with Rebel reinforcements in the form of Nebulon B Frigate Hulu, which started disgorging Z-95s. I started clearing the nearly A-Wings, but six Y-Wings arrived. I should have broken off immediately, but I chased down the last A-wing. I gave the M/CRVs far too much credit - the Y-wings killed all three, even as I shot them all down one after the other. I was about to scream when I realised that, wait, they had to ARRIVE, nothing said anything about them surviving... and T/D Prototype 11 and 12 Completed Mission via Hyperspace, so that was job done anyway. So *shrug.*
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay477_zpsn7cpvon8.png

I turned my attention to the Headhunters, which the GUNs - Rho and and newly arrived GUN Nu were tearing through. To my utter disgust the little bleeders turned around and ran back to the FRG faster than I could get to them and one of them made it into the hanger (it had turned around almost as soon as it had launched). So bye-bye bonus goals. That just left the Hulu itself - until (on checking the map, which I realised sometime in the last two missions does pause the game and you can change targets saftely in, so have been using much more!) I realised Zaarin had sneaked in four T/A from Z-Beta group. So, I lead them away from the Hulu (didn't want to tackle both at once), and dispatched three (the other ran off) with the GUN's help. The GUNs now sat on their arses.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay478_zpsvgr8m6at.png

Which left me to deal with the Hulu singled-handed with only guns. For some reason, I was REALLY having problems aiming - despite firing all my shots at the turrets, I don't think I took a single one out before I knocked the shields down, a long and laborious process, followed by ions to finish.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay479_zpsorwspeoe.png

And then because the programmers were just being plain spiteful by this point, THEN the GUNs came to help finish it off and steal my kill. I ordered Rho home, but Nu wouldn't respond, and guess what, NATURALLY they got the credit as they came in JUST as it hit about 12% or something, where I could't either stop or let them have a pass and finish it myself.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay480_zpsn1lw9lxn.png
[EXPLETIVING] BASTARDS.

Primary Objectives:
100% of M/CRV Hasheem must arrive
T/D Proto 11 must complete mission
T/D Proto 12 must complete mission
FRT Mharsup must survive until other goals complete
SHU G'nabgib must complete mission
Secondary Objectives:
None
Bonus Objectives:
FRT Mharsup must complete mission
FRG Hunu must be destroyed
100% of all Rebel craft must be destroyed

18/30 kills. 2 X-W, 4 Y-W, 3 A-W, 4 B-W, 2 TRN, 2 T/A. Thankls to bloody kill-stealing Nu, no credit for the Hunu, despite me doing ALL the work. Fracking bastards.

Right, since I'm not doing all that AGAIN - especially the Hulu - just because the game doesn't want to let have any time to kill cowardly Headhunters or even have an kill credit, we're going to move on anyway, because SCREW this battle and the traitor TIE Defender it flew in on.

So, we have at least made progress. Only one or two more battles to go and we can get out of TIE's lowest point and back to the more fun missions, where TIE is back to it's normal high standard (as even the plot in this battle isn't all that good). Of my memories of TIE, I clearly recall these missions were the one I hated most (and I absolutely cheated the hell out of them during my only other full-playthrough!)

factotum

2015-06-24, 01:54 AM

Aotrs Commander

2015-06-24, 04:23 AM

I can't remember: which mission is it where a corvette shows up, and *has* to survive to a certain point in the mission (so you fail the mission if it dies), yet it turns out to be a fake and the real one turns up later? Is it the one just coming up? Because I always thought that was the worst mission in the entire game...

That's coming up. I remember having to fly that one a few times and it was a bit of a pain, but not to the level of Battle Nine or Battle One Mission Five. (I have a feeling it's you in a GUN verses TIE Defenders or something though.)

factotum

2015-06-24, 06:26 AM

I didn't think that mission was bad because it was difficult, I thought it was bad because the failure condition is the corvette gets destroyed--which makes no sense at all; if that corvette gets destroyed and then the real ones turn up, that's a net gain for the Empire! Messes up the game storyline, maybe, but in that case, don't design a mission where the enemy *attack their own corvette* and can potentially destroy it...I'm sure it wouldn't have been beyond the bounds of human ingenuity to have them stop attacking the corvette once its shields went down or something like that, so it looks like it's in danger but it never actually dies.

Aotrs Commander

2015-06-24, 06:50 AM

Oh the other hand, Zaarin is kind of an arse, so maybe he planned it that if you failed to kill his dudes and thus stop him from stealing the whatever-it-was-es, his force jumped the real one and toasted it off screen... Maybe?

DigoDragon

2015-06-24, 06:53 AM

Darn kill-stealers.

This is a pretty long game.

Aotrs Commander

2015-06-24, 08:29 AM

Well, to be fair, I'm only playing 2-3 hours a week (and it takes a fair bit of that time to do the write-ups.) All in all, there are 13 battles of 4-6 missions each (76 in total), plus 28 training missions (plus seven obstacle courses, which I'm not bothering with), and the missions are usually around up to half-an-hour, not including failing! As a VERY rough estimate,then there's about 50-odd hours of play time just to play straight through without any repeating and succeeding every time! (And I'll bet I'll have nearly doubled that - we're about two-thirds of the way through at I've been at it since December, which seems about right!

There is a reason I still qualify TIE Fighter as probably the best fiver I ever spent, in terms of play-time I've gotten out of it over the years! (Battle Nine notwithstanding...)

You can perhaps see when stuff like Jedi Starfighter came out (at the fall of the space flight sims, post X-Wing Alliance) with a campaign of twelve missions I snorted derisively and said "yeah, okay, call me when there's actually a game worth playing, chaps."

I suspect that sort of attitude was ultimately what killed the space flight sims for a long while; full game cost for next to no content. (Freespace 2 in 2000 was pretty much the last serious gasp of the genera of military sci-fi flight sims - until the emergance of Star Citizen. Which notably, in attempting to cover both the military end and the Elite open-world end, has generated a truly RIDICULOUS crowd sourcing: $84 MILLION dollars (since the kickstarter in 2012) as of the current time. Which just goes to show.

Eldariel

2015-06-24, 09:02 AM

The death of Larry Hollands-style space flight sims and space flight sims in general was baffling. As far as I remember, the X-Wing line aside from the multiplayer-with-unplayable-multiplayer X-Wing vs. Tie Fighter was among the best sellers for Lucas Arts and certainly still draws interest today - I can't imagine it being a good market decision to drive it down. Then again, considering the implosion and death of Lucas Arts, I suppose I shouldn't rate their business expertise too highly.

But yeah, Freespace 2, I-War & X-Wing Alliance are the latest released proper space sims (out of which you could only really call I-War an actual "sim"; both XWA and Freespace 2 still operate without much regard for physics) and while each of those has given me countless of hours of enjoyment - Freespace 2 campaign, particularly the secret service missions, are still some of my most memorable gaming moments - all of those are from the last millennium! I haven't even gotten a proper joystick to replace my analog 2-button joystick thingy from the 80's since there has been nothing to play with one...

factotum

2015-06-24, 10:26 AM

There have been a few space sims worth having a joystick for (e.g. the X series, if we quietly sweep Rebirth under the carpet) since 2000, but they tend not to concentrate on the purely military aspect of things--they tend to be more Elite-style trading/combat mashups.

pendell

2015-06-24, 10:47 AM

So, you finally made it out of that . Congratulations! But you're not done yet! Ready for the ion cannon minefield next mission?

IIRC, the imposter corvette is in -- battle 11, I believe. You'll be in an assault gunboat facing off with 12 TIE defenders plus a strike cruiser with TIE advanced. Fun times.

Now that you mention it -- yeah, that's a good strategy for the mission you just completed. Damage the TIEs without destroying them so they'll motor back to the hanger , buying additional time before the next wing launches.

...

I get the impression that the reason the space sim died was 1) the rising cost of producing games 2) The weakness of multiplayer in these games 3) Better/more likely profits from a Warcraft clone.

Rightly or wrong, I believe space-shooters are believed to appeal to a more niche, wargaming kind of market than, say, world of warcraft or what not.

For about five or six years there, the video game industry relied heavily on the hollywood model: Find a proven game or style, then sink hundreds of millions of dollars into it. GTA V is an example of this approach. The drawback is, you can't make very many hundred-million dollar games, and you have to be absolutely sure it's going to be a smash hit. That's a tricky thing to predict -- even the Final Fantasy series has produced its share of duds. As for the space combat genre -- WE may like it, but the suits who have to pay for this saw the sales figures for games like WC Prophecy and more or less ran, not walked, from them.

Happily, the advent of minecraft and tablet gaming has demonstrated that you do not need to shell out hundreds of millions of dollars to make profit on a game. So here's hoping we see a new generation of cheaper, lighter, but more innovative, video games, a sub-tier below the hundred-million orchestral-scored graphics fiestas, which probably won't go away any time soon.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

Aotrs Commander

2015-06-30, 05:11 PM

Off we go, then, with the naive hope we can put Battle Nine behind us today!

Battle Nine: Mission Five: Trapped by Pirates!

FRAGDAMMIT!

Okay. Once again, I am on my own in a TIE Defender... This time, though it's "only" verses pirates with a captial ship, R-41 Starchasers and some transports. And a field of Ion mines. And I have to stop those M/CRV Hasheem from being captured. Great.

Okay. Hard choice... Missile, Torpedoes or Heavy Rockets? The Starchaser will laughably die froma signle misisle hit, but they are so hopelessly outclassed it's not funny.

I think Rockets this first time, then, with the intention of tackling that capital ship and see how we go from there...

Right. Okay, first try was a failure, not unexpectedly. One of the transports got away. I think we're definitely looking at using Advanced Torpedoes this time, to take them out faster - also, I absolutely need to do as the briefing officer suggests and targeting them through the map, it's impossible to find them fast enough with all the mines around.

Okay, second try easily cleared all the transports, but the R-41s broke off before I could kill them all. Try again. At least this one should be fairly easy to complete the primaries.)

Took a couple more false starts when the Strike Crusier shot my torpedos down when I shot tham at the TRNs as it tried to kill me, and one when in my haste to get the R-41's, I slowed right down right next to them as rthe were about to enetr the hangar and it shredded me with lasers, but the next attempt was the successful one.

First off, you're in trouble. In a massive minefield, under attack. The good news is that apart from sometimes Strike Cruiser Intombe (har-de-har Lucasarts...), everything else - Stormtrooper Transports and R-41 Starchasers - is attacking to disable the M/CRVs, giving you chance to pump your shields.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay481_zpsu7je7ien.png

First job is kill the five transports. TRN Ibutho 1 - who has already boarded SHU G'nabgib - FRACKDAMMIT, G'nabgib - jumps to hyperspace almost immediately, taking the TIE Defender scientist with it. Fortunately, it isn't a mission objective. This leaves you with TRNs Ibutho 2 through 6 to deal with. I started out, then, by taking out the first four with a single Advanced Torpedo apiece.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay482_zpsygr4qykk.png

I headed after and splashed one R-41, just as they finished disabling the M/CRVs, while waiting for the last TRN to arrive. You get fairly well pummeled with warheads again, but once more, it's only Mag Pulse, so provided you got your shields charged at the start, you're in no particualr danger. Mindful of the R-41s running away, I disabled Ibutho 6.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay483_zps5uzf5zgp.png

I then switched targets to the R-41s. R-41s are only very slightly dangerous, being little better than Z-95s with ion cannons. Their speed meant that my tractor beam was completely superfluous. I could have shunted the energy into shield recharge, but it wasn't even worth that effort. The first of the Assault Gunboats arrived. To my annoyance (but lack of surprise), the first thing they did was attack the disabled Transport. Fortunately, they also helped me with the R-41s and I managed to wipe out the last of the first wave of fleeing R-41s before they could get away. The second wave came out to die, and they, too, went down in short order, completing my bonus goals.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay484_zpsofcu9tjr.png

I turned my attention to Strike Cruiser Intombe, dropping both remaining torpedoes on it.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay485_zpscfj91bq4.png

However, it was already cutting and running away, which is probably why it's not a bonus goal.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay486_zpslc6axbzn.png

All that remained was the trivial task (especially with help, for once) of clearing the minefield...
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay487_zpsbzvtexiz.png

...And then heading home. Why can't more mission be like this one!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay488_zpskavhjl1y.png

Primary Objectives:
100% of all capturing craft must be destroyed
100% of all Mines must be destroyed
M/CRV Hasheem 1 must survive until other goals complete
M/CRV Hasheem 2 must survive until other goals complete
M/CRV Hasheem 3 must survive until other goals complete
100% of GUN group Nu must arrive
100% of GUN group Tau must arrive
Secondary Objectives:
None
Bonus Objectives:
100% of all R-41s must be destroyed

14/17 kills: 10 R-41s, four TRNs.

Battle Nine: Mission Six: Transfer Prototypes

Okay, last mission of Battle Nine. Looks like this could be another bugger...

Now I have to fly out again and protect CARG Mssan whjile they dock with the diabled M/CRVs. The first ask is stopping an attack on them from a distance too far out for the escorting GUN Nu to reach. Secondary goals include enemy TIE Defenders, to there's no question of Advanced Missiles, and further, they'll have to be saved for the Defenders...

Crapbaskets. Okay, no, that does NOT work. Without skimping on cannon energy, you can't reach the B-Wings fast enough before they start firing. Looks like I'll have to use the missiles on the rebels. I think calling for reinforcements might be a good idea..!

Actually, that mission also wasn't nearly so bad. In the end, I failed one bonus goal because my alies couldn't take all the X-Wins out, but I decided while I might be able to go this mission completely, screw it, let's get Battle Nine over with!

On arrival, the B-Wings are a long way out, so as soon as I got my shields charged, I switched to normal recharge, calling for GUN Rho meanwhile. The beam energy went striaght into engines. As I swept past them I killed one X-wing with a missole and quick blast of cannon fire.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay489_zps1ipop8tc.png

I then took a bead on the lead B-Wing and swtiched to dual missiles and let it have both as soon as I hit range, then quickly killed it with laser before going after the other one. While this is going on, those damned Nami pirates disable and capture M/CRV Hasheem 1 and there's nothing you can do about it. At least it took one of the out while it was fighting, thus getting that bonus goal.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay490_zpscqhkrrl7.png

I chased down the second B-Wing, and wiped that out, too.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay491_zpszpvamgqm.png

The biggest threat out of the way, I could then splash the two A-Wings doggedly chasing me.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay492_zpsgw8xgzyw.png

Annoyingly, I was too far out to stop the very last rebel fighter from getting into hyperspace and thus failing that goal. But then the first wave of three TIE Defenders arrived. Actually, all things considered... it wsn't too bad! With the various GUNs running some interferance, and the first three waves apaprently having no missiles, I was able to sparingly use my own missiles and my guns and we mopped them up quite well. TIE Defender Z-Delta did have advanced missiles, so I used my last two on the first pass, but they got shot down. Fortunately, even this wasn't that much of a problem, and pretty soon I and the GUNs were in the clear.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay493_zpsoevyelma.png

All that was left to do was wait for the CARGs to dock and go home!
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay494_zpsg1gxxnxu.png

Except it wasn't, as the Reenki pirates showed up with a Mon Cal Light Cruiser. And a squadron of Z-95 Headhunters. I had noticed, though, during the lull, there was a CUV for my reloads. I hurried over there and reloaded, given as the Z-95s were still kilks out. I wanted the particularly for dealing with the CRL's warhead launchers.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay495_zpsdpmyomac.png

I hit the Headhunters, more-or-less in passing. You can imagine how that exchange went.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay496_zpswlnn23ny.png
Pirate.. you have chosen... poorly.

A few of the Z-95s were going after the GUNs so I left them to it and headed straight on to CRL Sumpntodo. (I think that is just the BEST name...) I had to use three pairs of missiles, but I took the warhead launchers out in the first pass. Then it was just a case of whittling away at it.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay497_zps6yu7vijw.png

I paused once to obliterate in one pass a daft Z-95 who had turned back to get me. The GUNs finally got the last one, and Sumpntodo started to flee.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay498_zpsbbrj44jd.png
I'll be honest, mate, I don't think you're going to make it.

It did not.
http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u172/AotrsCommander/TIEplay/TIEPlay499_zps8gmmofbb.png
This time, I could order GUN Rho to bugger off and not nick my kill...

Primary Objectives:
CARG Mssan 1 must complete mission
CARG Mssan 2 must complete mission
CARG Mssan 3 must survive until other goals complete
100% of B-Wing group Blue must be destroyed
Secondary Objectives:
100% of T/D group Z-Alpha must be destroyed
100% of T/D group Z-Beta must be destroyed
100% of T/D group Z-Gamma must be destroyed
100% of T/D group Z-Delta must be destroyed
Bonus Objectives:
100% of X-Wing group Red must be destroyed
100% of X-Wing group Gold must be destroyed
100% of A-Wing group Azul must be destroyed
At least one of all Nami craft must be destroyed
At least one of all Rneeki craft must be destroyed

And that it is for Battle 9, and I think for the TIE Defender, unfortunately.

22/33 kills! 1 X-W, 2 B-W, 2 A-W, 8 T/D, 8 Z-95, 1 CRL

Next time, the only other mission (apart from the last ones) that I remember being a bit of a pain: in an Assault Gunboat and the ransom mission. Full speed to Killimaar!