Opinion on obscure Sword

[Feint's End]

One of my players asked me if he could use a sword he pulled from some 3rd party book. He only plans to fight one handed so I think it might be worthwile but I though I'd ask you guys first.

Martial Weapon (Sword) 1d8 damage 18-20/x3 crit slashing or piercing

I'm generally open to allow it since he is giving up two handed weapons to use it. Thoughts?

[Windrammer]

One of my players asked me if he could use a sword he pulled from some 3rd party book. He only plans to fight one handed so I think it might be worthwile but I though I'd ask you guys first.

Martial Weapon (Sword) 1d8 damage 18-20/x3 crit slashing or piercing

I'm generally open to allow it since he is giving up two handed weapons to use it. Thoughts?

The maximum base damage on that would only be as much as a greatsword's, and while it'll be critting harder/more often it'll also, as you recognize, not be THF, so I think it could be fair. More problematic if he's TWF, though. Is it an exotic weapon?

[Invader]

I'd say it's hardly going to break anything, I'd let him use it.

[Dusk Eclipse]

Pretty tame, sure it is a little more powerful than other weapon, not that that says anything, specially if he is going one handed fighting without a trick to boost his PA damage or maneuvers.

[grarrrg]

Martial Weapon (Sword) 1d8 damage 18-20/x3 crit slashing or piercing

Overpowered? No.
Strictly better than every other equivalent weapon in 1st party? Oh very much yes.

We will jump straight to the Exotics, as none of the Martials are all that close.
Falcata is the closest at 1d8 19-20/x3 Slashing.
The Rhoka gets you 1d8 18-20/x2 Slashing.
As for multiple types, the Butterfly Knife (Light) has 1d4 19-20/x2, which does S/P.

So no, it won't break your game any, but do be aware that it is better than every other 'non-special ability' weapon there is.

[Feint's End]

Yeah I'm aware it is better than anything first party and martial to boot. I do however think it should be fine since he only plans to use it one handed (no offhand, no THF). So in the end still less damage than other styles ... even when critting.

Thanks for the feedback.

[The Grue]

The maximum base damage on that would only be as much as a greatsword's

Eh, what? Greatsword is 2d6, not 1d8.

[Khedrac]

Eh, what? Greatsword is 2d6, not 1d8.

Greatsword max = 12 x 2 = 24

This as a max of 8 x 3 = 24

[Doc_Maynot]

Greatsword max = 12 x 2 = 24

This as a max of 8 x 3 = 24

And is actually achievable more consistently if you do the math.

[The Grue]

Greatsword max = 12 x 2 = 24

This as a max of 8 x 3 = 24

That would be maximum critical damage, not maximum base damage.

[Ashtagon]

Although this is listed as a "one-handed" weapon, there's nothing in there that stops him from two-handing it and gainingthe two-handed multiplier from Power Attack.

And for a crit fisher build, that crit modifier is insanely good.

[Ssalarn]

Although this is listed as a "one-handed" weapon, there's nothing in there that stops him from two-handing it and gainingthe two-handed multiplier from Power Attack.

And for a crit fisher build, that crit modifier is insanely good.

This is a true statement... and as others have noted, the weapon is literally better than any other core option. What class is he playing? Combined with something like the Stalker from DSP or the Magus this weapon is silly good.

[Hiro Protagonest]

Although this is listed as a "one-handed" weapon, there's nothing in there that stops him from two-handing it and gainingthe two-handed multiplier from Power Attack.

And for a crit fisher build, that crit modifier is insanely good.

Power Attack is weaker in Pathfinder even with Furious Blow or whatever the feat is, and the base damage difference from greatsword is still something.

15-20/x3... actually isn't as insane without aptitude weapons and Lightning Maces. Although I don't know any crit fisher pathfinder builds because I just haven't looked into it.

[DarkSonic1337]

If you're worried about the two handed thing, homebrew it into being a finesse weapon like the rapier, or just have it explicitly state that it doesn't get any benefit from wielding it in two hands.

As far as Magus goes it's not much better than a scimitar since spellstrike explicitly uses as x2 multiplier for the spell crit damage. It IS still better, but it's not ridiculous by any stretch. I don't think it's much better for the Stalker either since deadly strike (your source of bonus damage<_<) is extra dice and thus isn't multiplied. A 17-20/x2 base weapon so much stronger for them.

I'm gonna agree with the other posters that it's not overpowered, just better than the current options. And with the one handed style I can only see it being a clear winner for Magus (not by much as noted), or someone invested in Scarlet Throne or Iron Tortoise maneuvers from DPS's Path of War (since they have support for one handed and sword and board styles).

[OldTrees1]

The weapon is a Scimitar(one handed martial weapon with 1d6, 18-20/x2) with 2 upgrades 1d6->1d8 and x2->x3. Make it an exotic weapon and call it a day.

Whether martials deserve a free exotic weapon proficiency depends on your group's optimization.

[Feint's End]

If you're worried about the two handed thing, homebrew it into being a finesse weapon like the rapier, or just have it explicitly state that it doesn't get any benefit from wielding it in two hands.

As far as Magus goes it's not much better than a scimitar since spellstrike explicitly uses as x2 multiplier for the spell crit damage. It IS still better, but it's not ridiculous by any stretch. I don't think it's much better for the Stalker either since deadly strike (your source of bonus damage<_<) is extra dice and thus isn't multiplied. A 17-20/x2 base weapon so much stronger for them.

I'm gonna agree with the other posters that it's not overpowered, just better than the current options. And with the one handed style I can only see it being a clear winner for Magus (not by much as noted), or someone invested in Scarlet Throne or Iron Tortoise maneuvers from DPS's Path of War (since they have support for one handed and sword and board styles).

Actually the weapon can only be one handed according to him (haven't seen the book myself). Something in the flavourtext suggests that the other hand is used for balance while fighting with this weapon.

He is a Psychic Warrior

[Ssalarn]

As far as Magus goes it's not much better than a scimitar since spellstrike explicitly uses as x2 multiplier for the spell crit damage. It IS still better, but it's not ridiculous by any stretch. I don't think it's much better for the Stalker either since deadly strike (your source of bonus damage<_<) is extra dice and thus isn't multiplied. A 17-20/x2 base weapon so much stronger for them.

I'm gonna agree with the other posters that it's not overpowered, just better than the current options. And with the one handed style I can only see it being a clear winner for Magus (not by much as noted), or someone invested in Scarlet Throne or Iron Tortoise maneuvers from DPS's Path of War (since they have support for one handed and sword and board styles).

The Stalker has larger damage die for Deadly Strike on weapons that have higher crit multipliers, letting them double-dip benefits with this weapon. They get the free triggers from it being a high crit range weapon and the boosted die for a high multiplier weapon. It's easily the best weapon they could ask for.

Similarly, the Magus is simultaneously gaining the best crit range for his Spellstrike, and a boosted multiplier to increase the benefits of his base damage die and any static mods to damage he may have. Again, this is easily the best weapon he could be using.

Is it overpowered compared to casting wish or simulacrum? No. Is it overpowered in the sense that it is better than every comparable option in the game? Yes.

[Hiro Protagonest]

Actually the weapon can only be one handed according to him (haven't seen the book myself). Something in the flavourtext suggests that the other hand is used for balance while fighting with this weapon.

Oh, so it's specifically a weapon for einhanders.

...

That makes no sense, but whatever.

[Agent 451]

[P]ulled from some 3rd party book.

Might I ask which book it's from?

[Mehangel]

The way I see it, if the weapon can only be used 1 handed, I would see no problem allowing the weapon into the game as an exotic weapon. (Not just because it is strictly better, but because there are feats that could make such a weapon). (i.e. You take the Weapon Falcata with 1d8 19-20/x3 Slashing. and take Weapon Focus + Swordplay (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/3rd-party-feats/necromancers-of-the-northwest/combat-feats---3rd-party---necromancers-of-the-northwest/swordplay-combat)) This could effectively give you the said weapon. For this reason I would make the weapon exotic in the game.

[Greenish]

(i.e. You take the Weapon Falcata with 1d8 19-20/x3 Slashing. and take Weapon Focus + Swordplay (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/3rd-party-feats/necromancers-of-the-northwest/combat-feats---3rd-party---necromancers-of-the-northwest/swordplay-combat)) This could effectively give you the said weapon.Except that no, it couldn't. Read the description of Swordplay again.

Not to mention that combo costing three feats.

[Mehangel]

Except that no, it couldn't. Read the description of Swordplay again.

Not to mention that combo costing three feats.

Apologies, I did not mean to say it would be an exact duplicate, but it would be close (i.e. spend a standard action and have a weapon with +1 crit-threat range after all other modifiers). Which was another reason to make the weapon exotic.

[Greenish]

Apologies, I did not mean to say it would be an exact duplicate, but it would be close (i.e. spend a standard action and have a weapon with +1 crit-threat range after all other modifiers). Which was another reason to make the weapon exotic.Except it wouldn't even be close, because Swordplay is a standard action (no full attack, no AoO, no charge, no Vital Strike, no TWF, no nothing) and the increase to threaten range is applied after things like Imp. Critical or Keen.

[OldTrees1]

Except it wouldn't even be close, because Swordplay is a standard action (no full attack, no AoO, no charge, no Vital Strike, no TWF, no nothing) and the increase to threaten range is applied after things like Imp. Critical or Keen.

Nitpicking does not get much accomplished. He listed the ability to get close (and it is close even if it has significant differences) with existing martial weapons + feats as a reason to have this be an exotic weapon.

[Greenish]

I'm not nitpicking, I'm pointing out that the offered combo is not at all like the weapon discussed, and the entire comparison would be pointless even if it didn't involve obscure 3rd party stuff.

[OldTrees1]

I'm not nitpicking, I'm pointing out that the offered combo is not at all like the weapon discussed, and the entire comparison would be pointless even if it didn't involve obscure 3rd party stuff.

If a criticism of the argument strengthens the conclusion of the same argument, ...

[Greenish]

If a criticism of the argument strengthens the conclusion of the same argument, ...It's not like the conclusion of the argument ("this would be ok exotic weapon") even follows from the argument ("if you take these three feats, you can get something that approximates this weapon in very narrow circumstances"), and I certainly don't see how my criticism strengthens the conclusion.

[OldTrees1]

It's not like the conclusion of the argument ("this would be ok exotic weapon") even follows from the argument ("if you take these three feats, you can get something that approximates this weapon in very narrow circumstances"), and I certainly don't see how my criticism strengthens the conclusion.

Was the conclusion "this would be ok as an exotic weapon" or "this is at least an exotic weapon rather than a martial weapon"?

[Greenish]

Was the conclusion "this would be ok as an exotic weapon" or "this is at least an exotic weapon rather than a martial weapon"?
The former:

The way I see it, if the weapon can only be used 1 handed, I would see no problem allowing the weapon into the game as an exotic weapon.