Paladin fighting style: Dueling = shield too?

[The Shadowdove]

Hey there,

I'm curious as to how the "dueling" fighting style for paladin is supposed to be interpreted.


Do you gain the melee damage bonus while wielding nothing but a one handed weapon, or can you use an offhand defensive item as well?

As in: A sword and buckler, offhand shield, offhand magical focus, etc.

thank you for taking the time to help,

Dove.

[KombatKarl]

Yeah, the way I read it, those are all three valid. As long as your offhand item isn't a weapon, you're aces. I'm pretty sure that was the point of the style, to give sword and board a way to try and compare with two handers.

[sigfile]

So long as the other hand is not holding an explicit weapon the paladin gets a +2 to damage rolls with the main-hand weapon. Shields are kosher. Holy symbols are kosher.

If the paladin ends up using the off-hand item as a weapon (using the shield to make an improvised weapon attack, for example), the bonus is lost until the next round.

[The Shadowdove]

So long as the other hand is not holding an explicit weapon the paladin gets a +2 to damage rolls with the main-hand weapon. Shields are kosher. Holy symbols are kosher.

If the paladin ends up using the off-hand item as a weapon (using the shield to make an improvised weapon attack, for example), the bonus is lost until the next round.

thanks to both of you guys.


Answer well received. My group's paladin is pleased.

[Talyn]

thanks to both of you guys.


Answer well received. My group's paladin is pleased.

That's not how I read it at all. The Dueling fighting style was designed around the musketeer-type of character, who fight with a large, single-handed weapon. Having a shield, at least, in your off-hand does not let you benefit from the Dueling bonus.

If you have it any other way, you end up living in a world of exceptions. For example, let's say you have the Shield Expert feat and the Dueling style. When I use my bonus action to shove an opponent with my shield, do I lose my Dueling bonus? What if I've already rolled and resolved my attack before I declared what I would do with my bonus action? Does that extra damage get retconned away?

[Malifice]

That's not how I read it at all. The Dueling fighting style was designed around the musketeer-type of character, who fight with a large, single-handed weapon. Having a shield, at least, in your off-hand does not let you benefit from the Dueling bonus.

If you have it any other way, you end up living in a world of exceptions. For example, let's say you have the Shield Expert feat and the Dueling style. When I use my bonus action to shove an opponent with my shield, do I lose my Dueling bonus? What if I've already rolled and resolved my attack before I declared what I would do with my bonus action? Does that extra damage get retconned away?

Its your game, but the writers clearly stated in a recent tweet that the intent was for the bonus to be claimed when youre equipped with a shield.

[Easy_Lee]

Really, it has to be valid with a shield in order to be valid at all. Unarmed strike is on the weapons table, and you're considered to always be holding that. But unless you use it in a particular round, it doesn't prevent you from benefiting from dueling. A shield can be used as an improvised weapon, but you don't have to. If you don't use it for an attack in a given round, you gain the benefit of dueling. If you do, then you wouldn't be dueling.

Or think of this scenario:

You're fighting a big bad and disarm him
You pick up his weapon and hold it behind your back so he can't have it back
You are now holding a weapon in offhand but only attacking with main hand

Do you qualify for dueling? I suspect only a jerk DM would say no.

[Hytheter]

For example, let's say you have the Shield Expert feat and the Dueling style. When I use my bonus action to shove an opponent with my shield, do I lose my Dueling bonus?

No you don't.

Just because you use your shield to make a shove attack, doesn't mean it counts as a weapon in game terms.

Using a Shield with dueling is absolutely intended.

[Auramis]

Its your game, but the writers clearly stated in a recent tweet that the intent was for the bonus to be claimed when youre equipped with a shield.

May you provide a link to the tweet?

[Malifice]

May you provide a link to the tweet?

https://thesageadvice.wordpress.com/2014/09/02/dueling-with-shield/

'A character with the Dueling option usually pairs a one-handed weapon with a shield, spellcasting focus, or free hand.'

Jeremy Crawford.

[Auramis]

https://thesageadvice.wordpress.com/2014/09/02/dueling-with-shield/

'A character with the Dueling option usually pairs a one-handed weapon with a shield, spellcasting focus, or free hand.'

Jeremy Crawford.

Thank you very much!