samurai suggestions?

[Thevoidlingcat]

Im thinking fighter dex, str, int/wisdom.
With teifling as race and plate armor with longsword, shortsword, dagger combination

[Rfkannen]

Samurai to me is more of a social standing than a class. You could do it a million ways, including a paladin who swore his oath to his lord guy(cant remember the word) a ranger could work I suppose, But to me a fighter seems to be the best idea. What you suggested sounds like a good way to fit a samurai. What you realyt need to be a samurai is the lord backround, maybe the varient.

[Oscredwin]

Magic Initiate feat to get mage armor to fight unarmored, reflavor a rapier to a katana and go any type of fighter.

[Madfellow]

Im thinking fighter dex, str, int/wisdom.
With teifling as race and plate armor with longsword, shortsword, dagger combination

Hmm, I think Strength should be your primary stat, followed by Charisma perhaps. Noble (Knight) background, Dual-Wielding fighting style, pick up the Dual Wielder feat for a longsword in one hand and a short sword in the other. Take Charisma-based skills if you can.

Just my thoughts.

[MunkeeGamer]

Im thinking fighter dex, str, int/wisdom.
With teifling as race and plate armor with longsword, shortsword, dagger combination

Historical Samurai Bushi? Or Anime themed super human?

[Beleriphon]

Historical Samurai Bushi? Or Anime themed super human?

If historical bushi warrior then it should be a fighter specializing in polearms or mounted archery with a "longsword" as a backup weapon. If anime super warrior just build your own Jedi knight class and given them a lightsaber.

[Thrathgnar]

I'd go for a dexterity battle master build

[RedMage125]

I have to agree with rfkannen. Samurai is an in-game description of status.

That said, I think the Battle Master Fighter was clearly geared towards making a "classic" Samurai Archetype. You can take proficiency in Calligraphy or something like that. Your Fighting style could easily be Niten ("Two Swords Falling From Heaven"), fighting with Katana (Longsword) and Wakizashi (short sword), which sort of requires you take the Dual Wielder feat (so you can have a non-light weapon and also benefit defensively from the offhand weapon). Or you could have two hands on your katana and use Great Weapon style, even perhaps disdaining your katana in favor of a tetsubo (greatclub), or tachi (greatsword). Archery, as has been mentioned, would also be appropriate, perhaps going a mounted combat route and being a mounted archer. The Samurai's position as a leader would work well by taking Maneuvers such as Commander's Strike.

I think Ranger could make an interesting Samurai. If going with a L5R style, Crab, Crane, Mantis and Lion bushi would almost certainly have Rangers among them.

Barbarian works for Crab and Unicorn clan bushi, and they could be Lawful, to boot. I know the Hida family of the Crab clan trained "Dead Eyes" Berserkers, whose rage was a cold-burning fury.

Paladin, especially Devotion works. One's devotion could be to one's daimyo or to the emperor.

Rogues, especially those who take proficiency in Medium armor, could be samurai as well (especially Scorpion Clan).

And let's not forget Bard. Before you laugh, samurai were typically proficient in a musical instrument, or perhaps singing. And Valor Bard gets Medium Armor and Martial Weapons. Bard can easily play up the whole "leader" aspect of a samurai via inspiration. Nothing in the class says that you "must" pull out a lute and sing at people. Your oratory could be inspiring. And your spellcasting could just be one more exotic skill in which your noble upbringing trained you in, much like your calligraphy or your singing/musical talent/whatever.

[Gwendol]

Very solid advice. I too would primarily use the battlemaster fighter, or perhaps ranger. Duelist and / or archery style, primarily. Devotion paladin is an interesting variant, able to smite enemies of the Daimyo?

[Beleriphon]

I have to agree with rfkannen. Samurai is an in-game description of status..

What if it weren't though, just like maybe a knight isn't? That would make Paul McCartney and Elton John fighters with a bard multiclass. Or the first Prime Minister of Canada a Level 12 Drunk.

[RedMage125]

Very solid advice. I too would primarily use the battlemaster fighter, or perhaps ranger. Duelist and / or archery style, primarily. Devotion paladin is an interesting variant, able to smite enemies of the Daimyo?

You could use the Honor System variant in the DMG, with his senses and he could smite those with ow or no Honor

[Easy_Lee]

Samurai means to serve. You have a patron who you serve loyally. The most history-friendly way to play a samurai would be a blade-pact warlock totally devoted to his patron. Call all of your spellcasting and patron features "bushido". After that, it's more of a mentality than anything.

That said, see if you can get your DM to let you use a katana. You could refluff a longsword as a katana, or ask for a DEX version. Historically, the katana was the backup weapon. But DEX builds are better, plus you can go armorless with armor of shadows to get your AC to 18. And if you want to feel like an animu samurai you should use a katana. Don't go crazy. 1d8 versatile 1d10 with finesse would be reasonable, and your damage would still be inferior to a strength build. Could also opt for the polearm "naginata" samurai with heavy armor if you want to be historically accurate.

Get yourself a badass longcoat.
http://www.wall321.com/thumbnails/detail/20120318/japan%20samurai%20lonely%20artwork%20sakimichan%20 1496x1200%20wallpaper_www.wallpaperto.com_76.jpg

[silveralen]

Yeah, a lot of it is figuring out what type of samurai we are talking about.

For example, someone mentioned fighting unarmored, which leans heavily towards the pop culture samurai style. In that case... monk. No really, open hand monk.

Your katana can use scimitar/short sword stats, maybe get permission for the damage to eventually start scaling with your unarmed strike damage, and have your martial arts/flurry of blows be represented as striking with the pommel/flat of the blade, or leave it as mixing in unarmed attacks with normal sword strikes, or even asking to change the damage type to fit your sword, as fits your character best. If you picture a samurai as fighting kill bill style, or like you see in an anime like rurouni kenshin, it'd be a solid fit.

For a historical samurai? Fighter, champion or battle master fits. Focus on polearms or bows as you choose. Champion can do both, battle master focus a bit more on the commander or martial artist angle.

Paladin... kinda fits. You'd want to alter your oath somewhat, and it will feel a little odd (just like playing a crusade era knight as a paladin, complete with lay on hands and spells, might feel odd) but a lot of the fluff lines up. A ronin could be an oath breaker, while any of the other oathes could fit depending on the situation. Ronin could even be vengeance if he still follows an oath of loyalty to a dead master who was betrayed. Or for following a lord's son, after his father was killed (disclaimer, I'm pretty sure shoguns could be hereditary during some eras, but I don't think it was the norm).

[RedMage125]

Yeah, a lot of it is figuring out what type of samurai we are talking about.

For example, someone mentioned fighting unarmored, which leans heavily towards the pop culture samurai style. In that case... monk. No really, open hand monk.

Your katana can use scimitar/short sword stats, maybe get permission for the damage to eventually start scaling with your unarmed strike damage, and have your martial arts/flurry of blows be represented as striking with the pommel/flat of the blade, or leave it as mixing in unarmed attacks with normal sword strikes, or even asking to change the damage type to fit your sword, as fits your character best. If you picture a samurai as fighting kill bill style, or like you see in an anime like rurouni kenshin, it'd be a solid fit.

You don't need permission. When a Monk uses a monk weapon (like a shortsword), he may opt to use his unarmed damage instead of the weapon's damage die.

[Mechaviking]

My friend went with a Polearm samurai barbarian.

Renaming rage Battlefocus and he was good to go.

[silveralen]

You don't need permission. When a Monk uses a monk weapon (like a shortsword), he may opt to use his unarmed damage instead of the weapon's damage die.

Wait, really? How did I miss that....

Thanks for pointing that out!

[TheOOB]

A classic samurai is a fighter. That's pretty much it. Barbarian, ranger, paladin, or even rogue are also acceptable. I could even see a bard. Maybe a cleric at the extreme end.

[Human Paragon 3]

I would recommend barbarian with either the Noble or Scholar background. You get unarmored defense for free and the rage bonus to damage doesn't require you to make strength-based attacks. You can fluff the rage as ki focus or something.

[Mechaviking]

I would recommend barbarian with either the Noble or Scholar background. You get unarmored defense for free and the rage bonus to damage doesn't require you to make strength-based attacks. You can fluff the rage as ki focus or something.

Page 48 second heading under rage, requires the use of strength based attacks. Second or last playtest packed you would have been right.

[KiltieMacPipes]

Page 48 second heading under rage, requires the use of strength based attacks. Second or last playtest packed you would have been right.

As a DM, I would have no problem hand-waving that if the player made a good enough argument.

That said, I've houseruled that a katana is effectively a longsword with either finesse or versatile, your choice. IRL kendo and other katana fighting styles are largely two-handed, so not so great for Dex based. A nodachi is a greatsword, plain and simple.

I still think that mechanically you're better off going Str over Dex. Kabuto would be medium armor (I consider it half plate rather than splint), and you get that from Barb so I'd only take enough Dex to still use with half-plate. 15+Dex (up to +2) is likely better than you're gonna get for a while unless you have combined Con and Dex mods of +8 or better. Unless you're gonna play up to 20, that's gonna stay competitive for most of the game.

My two cents.

[Yagyujubei]

personally I think open hand monk/champion fighter has the most "samurai" feel to it. That's of course if were talking no armor dueling for honor style wandering samurai that you see in old movies. If were talking full battle samurai then were looking at med/heavy armor and polearm as a weapon in which case straight battlemaster fighter would be more applicable i think

[Mechaviking]

As a DM, I would have no problem hand-waving that if the player made a good enough argument.

That said, I've houseruled that a katana is effectively a longsword with either finesse or versatile, your choice. IRL kendo and other katana fighting styles are largely two-handed, so not so great for Dex based. A nodachi is a greatsword, plain and simple.

I still think that mechanically you're better off going Str over Dex. Kabuto would be medium armor (I consider it half plate rather than splint), and you get that from Barb so I'd only take enough Dex to still use with half-plate. 15+Dex (up to +2) is likely better than you're gonna get for a while unless you have combined Con and Dex mods of +8 or better. Unless you're gonna play up to 20, that's gonna stay competitive for most of the game.

My two cents.

Handwaving is perfectly fine :D, but I perceived this more as a rule statement with a bit of fluff, if the statement would have included: And allowing him to use dexterity instead of strength or as well as strength when raging I would have had no problem.

But I agree with you medium armor is more than enough to be competitive especially for a barb since he´s partially feat starved as is and a finesse or versatile Katana seems fine(a reskinned long sword or rapier).

[RedMage125]

A Katana could be a re-flavored Longsword or a re-flavored Rapier. I would, however, be hesitant to allow both Finesse and Versatile (1d10) to be found in one weapon. But a Crane Clan-style iajutsu duelist could use a re-flavored rapier, while another character (even one in the same party) could have a more traditional samurai who uses his katana two-handed (reflavored Longsword). And they could be joined by a third party member who uses Dragon Clan style, "Niten", and fights with Katana and Wakizashi (mechanically, two scimitars).

In-game, all 3 characters are all wielding katanas, but they all have different styles, which explains the different damage die. The duelist favors quick, whip-like slashes that strike with precision. The traditional style warrior delivers powerful blows. And the Niten style fighter delivers many, shallower cuts, using his blades for defense as much as for offense.

Works for me.

[silveralen]

Makes sense as well, Katanas weren't as common as swords in other cultures, so they might not have the same degree of standardization. My extremely limited knowledge seems to indicate you had "katanas" which skirted on the edge of becoming a Nodachi/Wakizashi.

You could possibly allow them to benefit from an "invisible" shield, simply to represent the defensive style it encourages. After all, longsword/rapier+shield is perfectly valid, so simply ruling he has a +2 AC with an empty off hand isn't going to break anything. Gives you a reason to stop swinging your sword two handed.

[Kaeso]

Magic Initiate feat to get mage armor to fight unarmored, reflavor a rapier to a katana and go any type of fighter.

No offense, but this is practically the opposite of what a historical samurai would be like. First of all, they rarely went to the field of battle unarmored (nobody except a peasant would do this in a culture that knew how to work iron or bronze). They had armor made of wood, lamellar and once the Portuguese had established contact with Japan, Samurai switched to European cuirasses made of metal. If a Samurai ever fought unarmored, it would most likely be in a duel (just like in Europe: renaissance duels were fought unarmored, but on the field of battle armor was a must).

Secondly, the rapier is a light, onehanded weapon with a thin blade mostly used for thrusting (though it could slash). The katana was balanced to be wielded with two hands and, like most curved blades, was more adapt at slashing than piercing.

It would not be a rapier wielder with high dex and a rapier, it would most likely be a warrior wielding a greatsword (or just a longsword, if you want to say the no-dachi is the equivalent of a greatsword) and wearing at the very least medium armor. And if you want to get really historical, he'd also be using a bow or a spear, preferably from horseback. Just like European knights and their longswords, Samurai generally used their katanas as a back-up weapon.

tl;dr: A Samurai would be almost the same as a knight, it'd just need heavy refluffing of weapons, armor and other equipment. This makes sense considering knights and samurai fulfilled the same roles in highly comparable feudal systems: they were basically the "enforcers" of their lords, sworn to serve and protect him and his rightful heirs.

[Mechaviking]

Also the traditional Katana was a sidearm(to the above mentioned Bows) and wasn´t much bigger than an arming sword(little more than 3 feet) but with a long hilt designed to be wielded in 2 hands(and take advantage of the Curve). The Katana is curved so it is probably heavier than a standard European arming sword.

As a sidenote traditional swords don´t require a lot of strength to use, the edge and or point are designed to pierce flesh rather easily(hence using a spear/sword instead of a club), But the bow should require a lot of strength to use since its range is reliant on your draw.

The Cult version of the Katana is has a blade well over a meter long and is light as a feather and apparently can deflect bullets and slice steel.

The above post was pretty much on the money

[KiltieMacPipes]

A Katana could be a re-flavored Longsword or a re-flavored Rapier. I would, however, be hesitant to allow both Finesse and Versatile (1d10) to be found in one weapon.

To clarify, my houserule is either/or, not both.

[RedMage125]

No offense, but this is practically the opposite of what a historical samurai would be like. First of all, they rarely went to the field of battle unarmored (nobody except a peasant would do this in a culture that knew how to work iron or bronze). They had armor made of wood, lamellar and once the Portuguese had established contact with Japan, Samurai switched to European cuirasses made of metal. If a Samurai ever fought unarmored, it would most likely be in a duel (just like in Europe: renaissance duels were fought unarmored, but on the field of battle armor was a must).

Secondly, the rapier is a light, onehanded weapon with a thin blade mostly used for thrusting (though it could slash). The katana was balanced to be wielded with two hands and, like most curved blades, was more adapt at slashing than piercing.

It would not be a rapier wielder with high dex and a rapier, it would most likely be a warrior wielding a greatsword (or just a longsword, if you want to say the no-dachi is the equivalent of a greatsword) and wearing at the very least medium armor. And if you want to get really historical, he'd also be using a bow or a spear, preferably from horseback. Just like European knights and their longswords, Samurai generally used their katanas as a back-up weapon.

tl;dr: A Samurai would be almost the same as a knight, it'd just need heavy refluffing of weapons, armor and other equipment. This makes sense considering knights and samurai fulfilled the same roles in highly comparable feudal systems: they were basically the "enforcers" of their lords, sworn to serve and protect him and his rightful heirs.

I agree completely on armor. As well as the archery note. The Way of the Samurai is less "Way of the Sword" and more "Way of the Horse and Bow" A Historically accurate Samurai would be mounted cavalry more than a swordfighter, but he'd still be expected to be above average in his kendo/kenjitsu style, even if he did not consider it a primary method of combat. It's important to note that a great many "wandering swordsmen" of legend were NOT Samurai, because a proper Samurai had obligations and responsibilities far more important and honorable than wandering around Japan making a name for himself in the bodies of his fallen foes.

However, I think flavoring a katana as different weapons based on fighting style is appropriate.

Perhaps when I suggested a rapier I should have clarified that you would change the damage to slashing instead of piercing. I think a 1d8 Finesse weapon represents an iajutsu style quite well. The Crane Clan in L5R use it, and they rarely wear armor heavier than light. So a character who wears Light armor and uses weapon finesse could be a samurai. He could take the Duelist fighting style, and it would make sense. Or could be a member of the Rogue class.

The Niten style was very uncommon, but since it only used one hand on each weapon, they do less damage. So use 2 scimitars for the weapons and call it katana and wakizashi. 2 1d6 Light weapons fits the style. And if he takes the Dual Wielder feat, he can mechanically use different swords, while flavor-wise he has just improved his technique and is able to do more damage with his existing weapons (as well as use his wakizashi for defense, hence the +1 to AC from the feat).

But I think for the "standard" a longsword fits best. It is a weapon that is balanced and light enough to be wielded one-handed, but is usually used 2-handed. The samurai who uses this style could take the Great Weapon Fighting Style and still benefit.

On the note of armor, I think heavy armor, specifically the o-yori, would be less common than a Medium armored Samurai. Which just backs up what I was saying about how many classes could make a good Samurai, since a lot are proficient in Medium Armor, and even some that only use Light armor could benefit from some of the DEX-based styles, and flavor the weapon as a katana. As long as your DM is on board and you're not really trying to squeeze any kind of extra mechanical advantage (with these suggestions, i don't think you would be), you should be all set to play your samurai the way you want.

[Knaight]

No offense, but this is practically the opposite of what a historical samurai would be like. First of all, they rarely went to the field of battle unarmored (nobody except a peasant would do this in a culture that knew how to work iron or bronze). They had armor made of wood, lamellar and once the Portuguese had established contact with Japan, Samurai switched to European cuirasses made of metal. If a Samurai ever fought unarmored, it would most likely be in a duel (just like in Europe: renaissance duels were fought unarmored, but on the field of battle armor was a must).

Metal armor predates the Portuguese contact by over a thousand years, and even peasant levies frequently had metal armor, even in iron-poor japan. It didn't show up in armies as much in other places - for instance, some shields had metal parts (and some earlier shields such as the aspis were mostly metal), and those never really caught on in Japan, crossbows frequently involved a fair amount of metal and never really caught on, so on and so forth.

To some extent I'm nitpicking here, as the unarmored swordsman is still not a particularly historical trope, but if the history is going to be corrected the details should be right.