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Lord Lemming
2015-01-02, 01:43 PM
1) Assumed off-screen retraining to max hit-points?

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/basics-ability-scores/more-character-options/retraining

Down a ways, you'll find there's a section on spending time training yourself to increase your max hit-point total, up to the maximum of your character's theoretical max hit-point limit (which is what you'd get if you rolled max HP on each HD roll.) This training takes 3 days, or 6 if you don't have someone higher level to train you, and costs (10) x (your level) x (the number of days needed to train) gp. So, 60 gp at lvl 2, 90 gp at lvl 3, 120 gp at level 4, and so on. Each time you do this, your max hit-points increase by 1.

While the cost of continuously using this tactic may be slightly prohibitive, I think it may be a very worthwhile investment; since while limited-use means of restoring HP, such as potions, cost far less per hit-point restored, trained hit points will stick with you forever and be reused indefinitely until your character dies or retires. My question is: If you were the DM, and I were making a new, say, 8th level character, would you allow me to say that my character spent time and money prior to meeting the party training in this way? If you said yes, I would probably assume that my character did this at earlier levels, when the cost of training was lower, and maxed out those HD so as to gain the largest boost in HP for the least cost. So what do you think? Allowable or not?

2) Assumed off-screen creation of mundane/magical items.

One house rule I've implemented in our games is to say that if a new character has points in a craft skill, or the ability to craft magical items, then they are assumed to have made any gear of that type they have themselves, and therefore can start with it for half the cost. For a first level party, all this means is that a fighter with a point in Craft: Armor can shave 50 gp off the price tag for a chain shirt, which is nice but hardly game-breaking. Bring that same fighter in at lvl 2 with a WBL of 1000 gp however, and they could use that perk to get themselves a suit of plate mail by shaving 500 gp off the list price! It gets even worse with magic users, who at levels 7+ can start getting many more magic items than usual because they've cut thousands of gp off the list prices. Would you allow this?

Vhaidara
2015-01-02, 01:54 PM
Yes to both. I've had the party's fighters end up with fewer HP than my Bard because, by level 11, I had only roller 3 points below max and they had rolled pretty badly (plus, as a gnome, I had a 16 Con).

As far as the crafting, if you invest skills and feats into it, then you deserve to benefit from it. In fact, if there's a caster in the party and they link backstories with someone else, I let them craft for other members of the party.

Honest Tiefling
2015-01-02, 02:00 PM
As for the first no. I do either fixed amounts per HD (Average roll rounded up) or full HD, usually the latter. Even if it were the former, I'd probably disallow it.

As for the latter...Depends. Starting gear I'd likely say no, because crafting favors mages and I don't want everyone to start crafting. In-game, I'd force them to get the time, materials and the space to work in, but be willing to handwave some things. NPCs, if they have the skills and know about the PC and like them enough might chip in with materials as a quest reward. I'd be waaaaay more lenient on a person crafting for the party, however.

Grollub
2015-01-02, 02:21 PM
I would allow both, as long as the player isn't going too crazy with making anything. ( ie I okay'd it all prior to character entry )

TheIronGolem
2015-01-02, 02:48 PM
For #1, I always give max HP anyway, because randomness can stay in combat and skill resolution where it belongs and stay the hell out of my character creation/advancement. If I took over a campaign where that wasn't already the case, I'd bump everyone up to max HP right away. That's only fair since I always give monsters max HP too.

For #2, I agree with Keledrath's reasoning - if you spent the feat slot you should get the benefit of the feat. However, I think I would count crafted items at their full price for the purposes of "can't start with items costing more than X% of your starting money" rules.

BWR
2015-01-02, 02:55 PM
1. No
I don't allow retraining. What you've rolled and what you've learned sticks with you.
I have on occasion (twice) allowed someone to switch one feat for another when the PC had leveled several times and never used the feat.

2. No.
As you see, it really messes up starting power level. Add Craft: armor to Wealth Parents and you can have someone starting with a mwk fullplate (if they're willing to skimp on other gear), which is a bit powerful.

atemu1234
2015-01-02, 03:02 PM
1. No
I don't allow retraining. What you've rolled and what you've learned sticks with you.
I have on occasion (twice) allowed someone to switch one feat for another when the PC had leveled several times and never used the feat.

2. No.
As you see, it really messes up starting power level. Add Craft: armor to Wealth Parents and you can have someone starting with a mwk fullplate (if they're willing to skimp on other gear), which is a bit powerful.

I personally allow retraining, though I play 3.5. I don't know if my opinion is really valid here.

In most cases, I have a relatively new player who wants to try and become better or at least equal to other players who come along and are better than his.