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View Full Version : D&D 3.x Class The Elementalist (3.5 PrC, P.E.A.C.H.)



gooddragon1
2015-01-03, 05:53 PM
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Extra Anchovies
2015-01-03, 07:11 PM
If a PrC can be entered by only taking levels in a single spellcasting class, and provides more than just a bonus feat every five levels, it needs to lose some casting.

I'd say 8/10 casting for this one, losing levels at 1st and 10th. Full casting is far too much here; compare it to the last 10 levels of Sorcerer, Wizard, and Cleric.

Boosted Elementals + Elemental Mastery = +10 Str/Con for all elementals. They're already fairly good combat summons, I don't think they need that much of a boost. Just the caster level increase alone is pretty strong, but it makes sense.

gooddragon1
2015-01-03, 10:57 PM
If a PrC can be entered by only taking levels in a single spellcasting class, and provides more than just a bonus feat every five levels, it needs to lose some casting.

I'd say 8/10 casting for this one, losing levels at 1st and 10th. Full casting is far too much here; compare it to the last 10 levels of Sorcerer, Wizard, and Cleric.

Boosted Elementals + Elemental Mastery = +10 Str/Con for all elementals. They're already fairly good combat summons, I don't think they need that much of a boost. Just the caster level increase alone is pretty strong, but it makes sense.

Giving up caster levels hurts a lot, but yeah I suppose it does need to. On the same note however, as a result it needs to be very attractive and making the summons that much better makes it that much more attractive.

redwizard007
2015-01-05, 12:50 PM
Compare this to the Malconvoker...

Entry requirements
Elementalist-
-10 ranks in 1 skill (level 7)
-4 languages
-ability to cast 4 spells with specific subtypes (doable by a lvl 1 wiz acording to this website http://www.imarvintpa.com/dndlive/FindSpell.php)

Malconvoler-
-8 ranks spread between 2 skills (level 1)
-2 languages
-ability to cast 1 specific spell (level 5 if cleric, wizard, or sorcerer and level 7 if bard.)
-2 specific feats (one of which is highly beneficial to the class.)

Conclusion: Elementalist is a later entry than Malconvoker by roughly 2 levels and thus justifies being a better class. In addition, its requirements fit from a thematic stand point, yet do not directly lead to its improvement. This constitutes a well thought out "tax," although a particularly light one.


Spell Casting Improvement
Elementalist-
-increases at levels 2-9

Malconvoler-
-increases at 2-10

Conclusion: Elementalist looses an additional level of spell progression at its cap. Not a significantly large drawback to justify more than a slight power bump.



Numeric advantages
Elementalist-
-d8 HD
-2+Int skills
-2 good saves (and neither is Will?)
-medium BAB

Malconvoler-
-d4 HD
-2+Int skills
-1 good save
-worst BAB

Conclusion: Elementalist has twice the HP, better saving throws (and I don't see justification for bumping either Fort or Ref to good save progression OR dropping Will to poor progression,) and it gets cleric BAB... Looks like we used up all the goodies we got by waiting until CL8 to enter.



Specials
Elementalist-
-gives you an elemental pet that has no Int.
-makes your summons stronger.
-makes you a buffed elemental.

Malconvoler-
-makes it possible to summon across your alignment.
-makes it easier to summon across your alignment than your actual alignment.
-doubles your summons across your alignment.
-adds planar binding and associates to your spell list and improves its success rate while removing its dangers.

Conclusion: The Elementalist has more powerful creatures but fewer of them. Malconvoker has more long term options with planar binding, unless the Elementalist starts life as a wizard or sorc.


Over all conclusion: Elementalist is fairly balanced with Malconvoker (the default I use for summoning prestige classes.) His advantages will compete with the parties melee types and that is something I suggest either playing to more strongly (with flavor text) or avoiding (by dropping BAB, HD and saves to wizard standards.) The entry level is probably too high. Consider dropping your skill requirement to 8 ranks and adding a required feat or two. For certain you need to up the Will save and probably drop both the others to poor progression. I'd also encourage you to up the skill points to 4+Int just to increase play-ability.

gooddragon1
2015-01-06, 02:06 PM
Compare this to the Malconvoker...

Entry requirements
Elementalist-
-10 ranks in 1 skill (level 7)
-4 languages
-ability to cast 4 spells with specific subtypes (doable by a lvl 1 wiz acording to this website http://www.imarvintpa.com/dndlive/FindSpell.php)

Malconvoler-
-8 ranks spread between 2 skills (level 1)
-2 languages
-ability to cast 1 specific spell (level 5 if cleric, wizard, or sorcerer and level 7 if bard.)
-2 specific feats (one of which is highly beneficial to the class.)

Conclusion: Elementalist is a later entry than Malconvoker by roughly 2 levels and thus justifies being a better class. In addition, its requirements fit from a thematic stand point, yet do not directly lead to its improvement. This constitutes a well thought out "tax," although a particularly light one.


Spell Casting Improvement
Elementalist-
-increases at levels 2-9

Malconvoler-
-increases at 2-10

Conclusion: Elementalist looses an additional level of spell progression at its cap. Not a significantly large drawback to justify more than a slight power bump.



Numeric advantages
Elementalist-
-d8 HD
-2+Int skills
-2 good saves (and neither is Will?)
-medium BAB

Malconvoler-
-d4 HD
-2+Int skills
-1 good save
-worst BAB

Conclusion: Elementalist has twice the HP, better saving throws (and I don't see justification for bumping either Fort or Ref to good save progression OR dropping Will to poor progression,) and it gets cleric BAB... Looks like we used up all the goodies we got by waiting until CL8 to enter.



Specials
Elementalist-
-gives you an elemental pet that has no Int.
-makes your summons stronger.
-makes you a buffed elemental.

Malconvoler-
-makes it possible to summon across your alignment.
-makes it easier to summon across your alignment than your actual alignment.
-doubles your summons across your alignment.
-adds planar binding and associates to your spell list and improves its success rate while removing its dangers.

Conclusion: The Elementalist has more powerful creatures but fewer of them. Malconvoker has more long term options with planar binding, unless the Elementalist starts life as a wizard or sorc.


Over all conclusion: Elementalist is fairly balanced with Malconvoker (the default I use for summoning prestige classes.) His advantages will compete with the parties melee types and that is something I suggest either playing to more strongly (with flavor text) or avoiding (by dropping BAB, HD and saves to wizard standards.) The entry level is probably too high. Consider dropping your skill requirement to 8 ranks and adding a required feat or two. For certain you need to up the Will save and probably drop both the others to poor progression. I'd also encourage you to up the skill points to 4+Int just to increase play-ability.

Reason for the saves, BAB, HD, and skill points as they currently are is that elementals get good Fort or Ref saves, 3/4 BAB, d8 hd, and 2+Int Skill Points. I'll change the skill points to 4, drop the requirement to 9, and add the skill focus (knowledge: the planes) for now, but I'll need additional input on whether or not to keep it mostly like an elemental HD in those regards (also whether or not to have them choose between good fort or reflex rather than giving both).

redwizard007
2015-01-06, 03:12 PM
Reason for the saves, BAB, HD, and skill points as they currently are is that elementals get good Fort or Ref saves, 3/4 BAB, d8 hd, and 2+Int Skill Points. I'll change the skill points to 4, drop the requirement to 9, and add the skill focus (knowledge: the planes) for now, but I'll need additional input on whether or not to keep it mostly like an elemental HD in those regards (also whether or not to have them choose between good fort or reflex rather than giving both).

Ahhhhh. So you were actually going for more of an "I AM the elemental." That explains the stats pretty clearly.

As it reads right now, things look more like "I'm a sick ass conjurer who likes to have the option to tank with his summons." And I'm not saying that's wrong...

What I am saying is be clear how you write this up. Properly fluffed, this guy could easily fill several niches in a party.

The only other thing I'd suggest, and this is not absolutely necessary, would be changing caster progression to every other level and toss in a few class abilities to enhance tanking before level 10. Baring that, I still think you want to drop to wizard BAB, saves, and HP.

In the end though, if your DM likes it then have a ball.

Xaotiq1
2015-01-07, 11:44 PM
Instead of just 4 spells, one of each descriptor, would requiring the "Heart of X" line from Complete Mage be flavorful and fitting?

gooddragon1
2015-01-08, 12:34 AM
Instead of just 4 spells, one of each descriptor, would requiring the "Heart of X" line from Complete Mage be flavorful and fitting?

Clerics couldn't pick it up then. This is meant for any class that can pick up one from each descriptor.