Need help keeping my Warder alive

[Dayaz]

So in my current campaign, my Warder from the PoW book keeps getting the short end of the stick. Every time there's been a BBEG, it's been a huge monster with a single natural attack with a plus, or it can ignore my armor. For example, our first mission was against 3 creatures that used Lightning Bolt as a spell like ability, with jsut a single Horn nat attack. The next mission, was versus a Sand Worm from the Sandstorm book, which proceeded to hit, grapple, do a ton of damage with it's grapple, and then did 7 con damage to me in one round.

So, in hopes of not needing the DM to unhand DM Fiat a cure Poison potion into out loot again, are there any easy ways in Pathfinder to get DR/- and ability damage resistance as a Warder? I'm level 9, with 2 levels in Hellknight Commander for fluff and the Hellknight Armor >.> So I count as a 8th level initiator.

[avr]

Doesn't the Iron Tortoise discipline have defences? I'm sure there's at least one maneuver which gives DR.

Not aware of ability damage resistance anywhere, the usual way of dealing with it is to improve your Fort save or to buy your own potions!

[Elricaltovilla]

Counters. Counters Counters Counters Counters!

You're a Warder, you should have a significant number of your known and readied maneuvers dedicated to counters. If your DM is sending singular monsters who only use one powerful attack per round to fight you he is literally playing right into your hands.

Counters let you negate attacks on yourself and allies. They let you negate or reflect spells. They move you out of position of your enemies' attacks. Your counters give you everything you need to avoid taking damage, and your other warder abilities give you what you need to force enemies to fight you.

As a Warder, you should have the highest HP, AC and Saves among the party. You have Extended Defense to make your counters last all round if you need it. You should use a shield, with Shield Focus, Defensive Expertise and Martial Power to get your Shield AC to touch and Reflex and give yourself temporary hit points each round.

Unfortunately you kind of hamstrung yourself with Hell Knight Commander. It will ever be as good as Warder levels since it doesn't give you more maneuvers and causes your IL to suffer. You can actually get much better AC out of Mithral Full Plate and and your Clad In Steel class feature.

[deuxhero]

Spending two feats on Fading Strike and Formless Dance gives you a miss chance, though without retraining that will take a while to get.

[Dayaz]

Counters. Counters Counters Counters Counters!

You're a Warder, you should have a significant number of your known and readied maneuvers dedicated to counters. If your DM is sending singular monsters who only use one powerful attack per round to fight you he is literally playing right into your hands.

Counters let you negate attacks on yourself and allies. They let you negate or reflect spells. They move you out of position of your enemies' attacks. Your counters give you everything you need to avoid taking damage, and your other warder abilities give you what you need to force enemies to fight you.

As a Warder, you should have the highest HP, AC and Saves among the party. You have Extended Defense to make your counters last all round if you need it. You should use a shield, with Shield Focus, Defensive Expertise and Martial Power to get your Shield AC to touch and Reflex and give yourself temporary hit points each round.

Unfortunately you kind of hamstrung yourself with Hell Knight Commander. It will ever be as good as Warder levels since it doesn't give you more maneuvers and causes your IL to suffer. You can actually get much better AC out of Mithral Full Plate and and your Clad In Steel class feature.

Somehow I don't see loosing out on a single initiator level as "hamstringing" myself. Also, Hellknight armor has +1 ac than full plate, and the Hellknight class lets me move in my full speed in it. +1 Ac and 30 land speed in heavy armor is worth it in my opinion.

Anyways, I'm sure my DM will let me re-pick my maneuvers, so what all counters should I have as a 8th level initiator?

[Elricaltovilla]

Somehow I don't see loosing out on a single initiator level as "hamstringing" myself. Also, Hellknight armor has +1 ac than full plate, and the Hellknight class lets me move in my full speed in it. +1 Ac and 30 land speed in heavy armor is worth it in my opinion.

Anyways, I'm sure my DM will let me re-pick my maneuvers, so what all counters should I have as a 8th level initiator?

It's not just 1 initiator level. You also lose 1 maneuver known and 1 maneuver readied, and you're delaying access to 5th level maneuvers. That's hamstringing yourself.

+1 AC and +10 movement speed are absolutely not worth losing that much, since you can buy Boots of Striding and Springing for 5,500 GP. Besides it's not even +1 AC at all, since Full Plate and Hellknight Plate have the same AC Bonus (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/armor) (+9 AC).

As for which counters you should have? That depends on what disciplines you have available. But to keep things short, basically all of the Iron Tortoise ones (notably Burnished Shell (3rd level) is your go to for negating spell effects), Primal Fury's Blade Breaking Counter (3rd level) and Shrug it Off (4th level, good against Ranged Touch Attacks) and Broken Blade's Counter Step (2nd level) and Flat Iron Riposte (3rd level) are great. Look for ones that negate attacks, move you or move your opponent.

If you don't have the three feats I mentioned before (Shield Focus, Defensive Expertise and Martial Power) get them. Martial Power gives you Temporary HP every round, which is great and Defensive Expertise adds your Shield AC to your Touch AC and Reflex Saves.

[Feint's End]

Honestly I'd ask the dm for retraining those 2 levels because they do almost nothing for you.

Other than that I second picking the defensive counters.

[Andreaz]

Elricaltovilla has the thick of it. Counters of the "attack their attack" sort are extremely useful. Consider BAB scales faster than AC, they work against touch attacks and even flanking can help. Later you'll have access to counters that help even when they fail as well. I second pretty much everything he said.

I'm level 9, with 2 levels in Hellknight Commander for fluff and the Hellknight Armor >.> So I count as a 8th level initiator.Well, this is a classic problem...
1) You don't need the class to use the armor.
2) From the outside perspective, the two classes look the same: A dude hulking around in heavy armor and being awesome.
3) You don't need to take hellknight levels to call yourself a hellknight. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0209.html)

[Fenryr]

Martial Power is a must. If you can work around NOT being in a heavy armor, you may get Bushi template. Swift action for Temporary HP equal to your initiator level for you and allies around 30'. Are you switching stances? Some stances give you reach and others give you CMD. Switching 'round the situation is a huge help.

[Azoth]

Also look into the Martial Traditions. Swapping out a discipline you don't plan on using much for Silver Crane or Vieled Moon can be a life savor. Silver Crane offers healing strikes to keep you standing. Vieled Moon gives you high manueverability with its teleports and abilities to turn yourself or you enemy ethereal.

The Blood Reservoir of Physical Prowess can be a life saver if you charge it up during down time between adventures. 2k to be able to either heal 4 points of ability damage is a steal.

[Ssalarn]

Also look into the Martial Traditions. Swapping out a discipline you don't plan on using much for Silver Crane or Vieled Moon can be a life savor. ***

Indeed, nothing brings out the Warder's rich, meaty flavor quite like a side of Silver Crane :smallbiggrin:

Silver Crane + Iron Tortoise all on their own should make you ridiculously hard to kill. Counters are usually my favorite thing about playing an initiator (although they can backfire from time to time; occasionally it's better to just let the Rogue fall unconcious instead of propping him up just long enough for the next blow to kill him >.> )