Shredder?

[J-H]

I haven't watched anything TMNT since...oh, I dunno when. The last game I played was Turtles in Time.

So, how would y'all spec out Shredder as a D&D character?

From what I recall, he's formally a ninja, but rarely does anything ninja-like - he favors direct combat, or sending the Foot Clan in. He wears medium armor with lots of blades...but I don't remember him using a sword, just punching people.

From that, I almost think the best way to spec him would be as a Psychic Warrior/Thrallherd. LE, of course. Murdering his master and blaming Splinter is chaotic, but he otherwise seems to be pretty organized and methodical aside from catching the Villian Idiot Ball.

[Kid Jake]

On the subject of the Villain Idiot Ball, I can't help but imagine his build basically being straight Ninja and ignoring literally every one of his class features in favor of using heavy armor and exotic weapons that sound cool but don't really accomplish much. At least the early 90's Shredder that I remember anyway.

[Marlowe]

I'm going to suggest Warblade with lots of Tiger Claw maneuvers and two spiked gauntlets. And spiked armour. And that thing Elan has were he does bonus damage when he makes a bad pun.

Is there some reason why you think he's psionic? I don't recall him having any special powers.
Of course, I'm only familiar with Ye Olde TMNT show.

[Sam K]

Swordsage? Though ironically, wisdom seems like his dump stat. Atleast the old cartoon Shredder seemed to be decently proficient in martial arts, but not really a front line fighter. His armor seems to be mostly for show, so it could probably qualify as light - atleast the old cartoon Shredder. Maybe that big brain made him a mithril breastplate later? :P

NE - being lawful requires more than being able to make plans. He operates outside of all established systems, and seem to have no plans or ambitions to replace them with his own order. He simply acts in the way that he feels favors him the most. He may build organizations and use others loyalty, but he seems to have no real devotion to these things.

[J-H]

Is there some reason why you think he's psionic? I don't recall him having any special powers.
Of course, I'm only familiar with Ye Olde TMNT show.

Thrallherd is the only way I can explain the innumerable Foot Clan, Krang (sp?) and his other named cohorts (I only remember Bebop & Rocksteady). Having a half-BAB class also accounts for the Turtles being able to beat him even though he's presumably higher level (similar in levels to Splinter).

The reason Psywar works is that he's baseline human (until he drinks mutagen), but is still able to keep up...self-buffing through training/practice/inner strength without outside aid. Wis is definitely not one of his strong stats, though.

[Afgncaap5]

Do you think he's got a few levels in Artificer? He *does* seem to have a weird knack for making gadgets. Initially this was with Krang's help, but he was able to make special swords and things. Plus it might explain his giant army of Foot soldiers if they all count as things he could make with the Craft Homunculus feature.

This also changes depending on which Shredder we're dealing with. The old cartoon shredder might just be a Swordsage with a *lot* of resources gathered over time. The new 2003 cartoon shredder is probably a bit more impressive... Haven't seen the newest cartoon, though, so couldn't say about him.

[Marlowe]

Thrallherd is the only way I can explain the innumerable Foot Clan, Krang (sp?) and his other named cohorts (I only remember Bebop & Rocksteady). Having a half-BAB class also accounts for the Turtles being able to beat him even though he's presumably higher level (similar in levels to Splinter).

The reason Psywar works is that he's baseline human (until he drinks mutagen), but is still able to keep up...self-buffing through training/practice/inner strength without outside aid. Wis is definitely not one of his strong stats, though.

Taking me back a loooooong way here; but IIRC the Foot Clan are robots, Krang is a reluctant ally trying to use Shredder to further his own agenda, and Baxter Stockman, Rocksteady and Bebop are really not the sort of people who have a lot of other employment options. It seems kind of odd to assume that somebody HAS to be psionic in order to have allies and cohorts, or that they need such powers to "keep" up with people whose major power is being green and having similar training.

Again, this all refers to the late 80s-early 90s show. I have no idea what's happened since.

[Blackhawk748]

Well ive only seen a few episodes of the 80s-90s TMNT, i watched the newer one that came out in early 2000s. Shredder there was HORRIFYING. Like he beat the tar out of all four turtles, several times if i recall. It took a crazy supertech sword wielded by Leo to beat him. Then again he was an alien in an android, so he was crazy hard to damage.

Now if we go with the new movie (weather you liked it or not Shredder looked great in it) hes a human in some crazy awesome power armor with a blade machine gun.

So ya we have a lot to work with here. You could make him a Warblade with a Swordsage dip for Setting Sun and he specializes in armblades. Or we can put him in Golem Armor and make him the Shuriken Machine gun with Superior Unarmed Strike as a back up plan.

[(Un)Inspired]

On the subject of the Villain Idiot Ball, I can't help but imagine his build basically being straight Ninja and ignoring literally every one of his class features in favor of using heavy armor and exotic weapons that sound cool but don't really accomplish much. At least the early 90's Shredder that I remember anyway.

This was my immediate though when I read the title of the thread.

He's like a classically poorly built character. Only levels in the terrible ninja class and wear equipment that negate his class features.

That's why he always gets wailed on by a bunch of teenagers.

[KillianHawkeye]

but I don't remember him using a sword, just punching people.

He definitely used a sword in some of the video games FWIW.


two spiked gauntlets. And spiked armour.

Or bladed gauntlets. They're like spiked gauntlets, only slashing. I don't remember where they're from, maybe Dragon Magazine? IIRC there's also bladed armor out there somewhere.


IIRC the Foot Clan are robots

They were turned into robots for the old cartoon to avoid protests about violence in a kids show. Originally, the Foot Clan was just ninjas like in the 90s movies.

Not sure how they've been represented in the various cartoons since the original one, though.


Now if we go with the new movie (weather you liked it or not Shredder looked great in it)

Meh... that's debatable. Personally, I thought he looked ridiculous. But I guess you have to have a dumb looking CGI villain for your dumb looking CGI heroes to fight against, right? :smalltongue:

[J-H]

I haven't seen the new movie (Michael Bay, all the action scenes will be blurry), but the new Turtles look very, very Orcish in some of the promo material.

In Turtles In Time, SuperShredder has the ability to launch various energy rays (damage, shrink turtle, etc). I doubt that's canon - they probably just wanted to give him something better than "punches and kicks."

[Marlowe]

OK. And some quick boning up leads me to believe that we should treat "classic" (80-90s) Shredder and 2003 Shredder as very different characters. Much as Hedge Ledger's Joker isn't the same guy as Cesar Romero's.

[Blackhawk748]

OK. And some quick boning up leads me to believe that we should treat "classic" (80-90s) Shredder and 2003 Shredder as very different characters. Much as Hedge Ledger's Joker isn't the same guy as Cesar Romero's.

They are, 2000s Shredder is quite intelligent actually, while the 80s one is kinda derpy, in a funny way.

[Marlowe]

The name's Obvious. Captain Obvious.

[Flickerdart]

In Turtles In Time, SuperShredder has the ability to launch various energy rays (damage, shrink turtle, etc). I doubt that's canon - they probably just wanted to give him something better than "punches and kicks."
Isn't SuperShredder just that way because of the Hyperstone? I've only played Hyperstone Heist (genesis4lyfe) so I have no idea what goes down in Turtles in Time, though.

[J-H]

As far as I know, he just drinks mutagen. I think there's a beam of light and very little explanation involved, though.

[Nousos]

If you go by the new movie, he would be a bloodstorm blade. All those blades flying around like that and back to him are modeled by the class exactly. Since he is always such a brute anyway you could make him a pseudo King of Pong too. He ignores traditional methods of ninjas in favor of raw power and brute force, so even if you don't like a hail of blades relentlessly bearing down on your heroes, he would be perfect as a warblade using stone dragon and iron heart.

There's no good reason to model the Foot Clan army as a character feature unless you actually want to play as him. He has them for plot reasons.