New player looking for Arcane Archer build help

[Kurondo]

Basically my character died recently and I would like to try out an arcane archer, pretty much every book is in this campaign, thank you in advance you beautiful people.

[Snowbluff]

Well, how cheesy do you want this to be? The AA's strength is taking advantage of Imbue Arrow. You can take advantage of the range, fixed casting time, or duplicate it with Splitting/Arrow Split (Champions of Ruin).

[Kurondo]

Well, how cheesy do you want this to be? The AA's strength is taking advantage of Imbue Arrow. You can take advantage of the range, fixed casting time, or duplicate it with Splitting/Arrow Split (Champions of Ruin).

I would like to be moderate cheese, not something unbeatable but not something extremely weak either.

[Kurondo]

Well, how cheesy do you want this to be? The AA's strength is taking advantage of Imbue Arrow. You can take advantage of the range, fixed casting time, or duplicate it with Splitting/Arrow Split (Champions of Ruin).

or complete cheese, either or :P

[WeaselGuy]

Wizard 1/Ranger 5 with Sword of the Arcane Order at level 6, then into Arcane Archer to taste, finishing up with more Ranger.

SotAO allows you to stack Wizard with Ranger levels to determine caster levels, lets you pick spells off the wizard/sorcerer list to prepare, and makes your casting stat Intelligence.

You might as well take the Shooting Star Ranger Substitution levels at 3 and 4 as well, and since you'll be using Int instead of Wis, I recommend taking a bunch of different Knowledges and Knowledge Devotion at level 3.

Obviously, take Point Blank Shot at level 1 and Archery as your Combat Style. I suggest Precise Shot at level 9 as well.

[prufock]

Wizard 1/Ranger 5 with Sword of the Arcane Order at level 6, then into Arcane Archer to taste, finishing up with more Ranger.

SotAO allows you to stack Wizard with Ranger levels to determine caster levels, lets you pick spells off the wizard/sorcerer list to prepare, and makes your casting stat Intelligence.

You might as well take the Shooting Star Ranger Substitution levels at 3 and 4 as well, and since you'll be using Int instead of Wis, I recommend taking a bunch of different Knowledges and Knowledge Devotion at level 3.

Obviously, take Point Blank Shot at level 1 and Archery as your Combat Style. I suggest Precise Shot at level 9 as well.

Seconding this as a good entry. It's not what I would call "cheese" - it's still around tier 3 unless you pull off some other tricks. You get free archery feats that will complement the ones you need to take for arcane archer entry. Definitely take Shooting Star, as I recall it gives your caster level an excellent boost.

You want Precise Shot earlier than level 9, though, since it's a requirement of arcane archer. Grab it asap, along with PBS and Weapon Focus.

[Snowbluff]

Yeah, that would be a good low power entry.

I'm going to put together a sort of gold standard gish type build, a la Sorcadin. I'm interested in how soon we can unlock AA's Imbue Arrow.

[DEMON]

Wizard 1 / Ranger 5 does not qualify you for AA, since you need BAB +6. You need 1 more level of Ranger, which is not necessarily bad, as it gives you another archery feat.

You can qualify for AA at level 7, even without flaws and with SotAO, if you trade your Scribe Wizard Scroll bonus feat for a Fighter bonus feat (either WF, PBS, or PrS). Knowledge Devotion will have to wait till level 9.

Definitely take Shooting Star sub level 4, level 3 is optional. With 12 INT and 12 WIS you will then have 3 cantrips and 2 1st level Wizard spells and 3 1st level Ranger spells. Elf Wizard substitution level 1, or (Focused) Specialist would add some more.

[WeaselGuy]

Wizard 1 / Ranger 5 does not qualify you for AA, since you need BAB +6. You need 1 more level of Ranger, which is not necessarily bad, as it gives you another archery feat.

You can qualify for AA at level 7, even without flaws and with SotAO, if you trade your Scribe Wizard Scroll bonus feat for a Fighter bonus feat (either WF, PBS, or PrS). Knowledge Devotion will have to wait till level 9.

Definitely take Shooting Star sub level 4, level 3 is optional. With 12 INT and 12 WIS you will then have 3 cantrips and 2 1st level Wizard spells and 3 1st level Ranger spells. Elf Wizard substitution level 1, or (Focused) Specialist would add some more.

^^^ what they said... I'm AFB and on a government computer, so I didn't have time to look stuff up. If I recall correctly, Weapon Focus requires BAB +1, so you'll have to take Precise Shot at 1 with the Fighter feat substitution, and then take WF at 3. And yeah, push Knowledge Devotion to 9, it's great to have early, but still has good returns later on.

[Xerlith]

Wouldn't Mystic SotAO Ranger be a better choice? You can grab a spellbook from the Magical Training feat and be a functional gishy character by going Mystic Ranger10/Arcane Archer10 or any combination of Mystic Ranger, Arcane Archer and Abjurant Champion (strongly recommend it).

[Snowbluff]

Wouldn't Mystic SotAO Ranger be a better choice? You can grab a spellbook from the Magical Training feat and be a functional gishy character by going Mystic Ranger10/Arcane Archer10 or any combination of Mystic Ranger, Arcane Archer and Abjurant Champion (strongly recommend it).

Well, that's dragon material, and really strong dragon at that. I think some would argue that Mystic Ranger doesn't qualify for SotAO stuff. The class features are in the wrong places.

[DEMON]

If I recall correctly, Weapon Focus requires BAB +1, so you'll have to take Precise Shot at 1 with the Fighter feat substitution, and then take WF at 3.

Only an issue if you start your career as a Wizard, but I strongly recommend starting as a Ranger. With Elf Ranger sub level 1, you'll get 24 more skill points.


Wouldn't Mystic SotAO Ranger be a better choice? You can grab a spellbook from the Magical Training feat and be a functional gishy character by going Mystic Ranger10/Arcane Archer10 or any combination of Mystic Ranger, Arcane Archer and Abjurant Champion (strongly recommend it).

It's questionable whether SotAO Ranger casts Wizard spells from his spell slots as arcane spells (personally, I don't think so), so you might not qualify for Arcane Archer at all. Magical Trainig only gives you cantrips. Though I am fairly sure there is a workaround that does not come to mind at this moment.

Other than that, Mystic Ranger / AA / Abjurant Champion is indeed a better option than regular Ranger / Wizard combination.

[DEMON]

I think some would argue that Mystic Ranger doesn't qualify for SotAO stuff. The class features are in the wrong places.

SotAO is just a feat that requires Ranger level 4 and membership in Mystra's order. I don't see any issues with qualifying if we accept that Mystic Ranger is still a Ranger.

Shooting Star substitution levels are a different animal, though.

[WeaselGuy]

It's questionable whether SotAO Ranger casts Wizard spells from his spell slots as arcane spells (personally, I don't think so), so you might not qualify for Arcane Archer at all. Magical Trainig only gives you cantrips. Though I am fairly sure there is a workaround that does not come to mind at this moment.



Members of your military order have a special connection with arcane magic.
Prerequisite
Paladin 4th of Azuth or Mystra, or ranger 4th of Mystra; member of the Knights of the Mystic Fire (see page 102), the Order of the Shooting Star (see Knights of the Mystic Fire, page 102), or the Swords of the High One (see page 104).
Benefit
You can use your paladin and ranger spell slots to prepare wizard spells. You must have a minimum Intelligence score of 10 + the spell's level to prepare it, and the save DC of the spell is equal to 10 + your Int modifier (as if you were a wizard). These wizard spells can be taken either from your spellbook (if you have one) or from another character's spellbook (though in the latter case you must decipher the writing in the book and succeed on a Spellcraft check to prepare the spell, just as a wizard using a borrowed spellbook; see Wizard Spells and Borrowed Spellbooks, page 178 of the Player's Handbook, for details). If you also have levels in wizard, your wizard caster level is treated as the sum of your wizard, paladin, and ranger class levels.
Special
Azuth has a paladin order called the Swords of the High One. Mystra has a paladin order called the Knights of the Mystic Fire and a closely allied group of rangers called the Order of the Shooting Star. Members of all three of these groups can select this feat as long as they are at least 4th level in their respective order's primary class.

The way it reads to me, it says you prepare wizard spells, and if you have wizard levels, your caster level is the sum of your wizard, paladin an ranger levels. I'm pretty sure that in this case, they are arcane spells. If you look at the Southern Magician Feat, it says:



Your magical studies in Mulan lands have taught you spellcasting techniques unknown in the north that blur the line between arcane and divine magic.
Prerequisite
ability to cast 2nd-level spells, Mulan human,
Benefit
Once per day per two spellcaster levels, you can cast a divine spell as an arcane spell, or vice versa. This enables you to bypass arcane spell failure due to armor, or gain additional benefit from spell that functions differently for a divine caster instead of an arcane caster, such as true seeing or magic weapon. Spells changed with this feat are often confusing to whose who haven't studied Mulan magic. Spellcasters who don't have this feat suffer a -4 penalty on attempts to counterspell or dispel this spell, and they must succeed at a caster level check (DC 11 + spell level) to detect the spell with detect magic. The actual source of the spell's power doesn't change, nor does its means of preparation. You are merely weaving the strands of magic together in an unconventional way that makes the spell behave somewhat differently.


SM clearly states that you cast divine spells as arcane, and vice versa.

[Xerlith]

It's questionable whether SotAO Ranger casts Wizard spells from his spell slots as arcane spells (personally, I don't think so), so you might not qualify for Arcane Archer at all. Magical Trainig only gives you cantrips. Though I am fairly sure there is a workaround that does not come to mind at this moment.

Other than that, Mystic Ranger / AA / Abjurant Champion is indeed a better option than regular Ranger / Wizard combination.

Well, Precocious apprentice works without problems.

As for the arcane/divine question pertaining spells prepared via Sword of the Arcane Order the only answer is: Ask the DM. The RAW wording is as murky as it gets in this case, so any ruling we come up with may be rendered moot by the DM's bit different reading.

[Vhaidara]

Surprised this hasn't come up: Pathfinder (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/prestige-classes/core-rulebook/arcane-archer) or 3.5 (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/prestigeClasses/arcaneArcher.htm) Arcane Archer? If you're using the 3.5 version, I highly recommend not. Use the Pathfinder version. It gives you 7/10 casting progression, so you'll actually have spells to put in your arrows.

[lytokk]

I'd always thought duskblade could make a decent entry into Arcane Archer, the only caveat being duskblades don't get much in the realm of area spells. I've never really played with the build or even made one, but food for thought.

[gorfnab]

I'd always thought duskblade could make a decent entry into Arcane Archer, the only caveat being duskblades don't get much in the realm of area spells. I've never really played with the build or even made one, but food for thought.
Here's one: Susan the Duskblade Arcane Archer (3rd post down by carnivore) (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=525.20)

One build I like for Arcane Archers is:
Bard 8/ Arcane Archer 2/ Sublime Chord 2/ Abjurant Champion 5/ Ruathar 3

[Snowbluff]

Surprised this hasn't come up: Pathfinder (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/prestige-classes/core-rulebook/arcane-archer) or 3.5 (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/prestigeClasses/arcaneArcher.htm) Arcane Archer? If you're using the 3.5 version, I highly recommend not. Use the Pathfinder version. It gives you 7/10 casting progression, so you'll actually have spells to put in your arrows.
AA from PF is only a 1 CL improvement. Imbue Arrow is the only reason to stick around in either edition. You can't take advantage of the casting time change that way. If you're playing PF, quickened (sacred geometry) detect poison will get you can net you an extra attack, but it's not as good as 2d4+2 MMed Wings of Flurry (Hail of Stone, Acid Storm, Maw of Chaos, Iceberg) Standard Action Fimbulwinter.

[Bruenin]

Get the smiting spell metamagic, it allows you to place a spell in a projectile or melee weapon and it lasts for up to a minute, I don't know if there's a way to increase the time but it's basically imbue arrow in feat form but instead of spells with area's it effects spells with a range of touch, so you can deliver things like shocking grasp or shivering touch from far away.

It's at a +1 increase to spell level which isn't too terrible and there's two options to change the appearance of your spells to fit more inline with an arcane archer and I recommend it for flavor options. There's spell thematics which allows you to dictate the appearance of the spells and choose a theme, like you could choose arrow and if you cast magic missile each of the missiles would look like an arrow made of force flying from your hand, or burning hands would look like a stream of flaming arrows in a cone in front of you, etc. OR you can do the same exact thing without any kind of feat according to the DMG.

The key difference between the DMG version and spell thematics is that spell thematics makes your opponents need a higher spellcraft check to tell what spell you're casting but aside from that they should be the same, it'd be a nice way to visualize your character and just be a fun little addition. I think there might also be a way to change your focus so you can use a longbow (or any bow) as a focus, so basically if you casted magic missile, you can RP your character as drawing back the bow and using it to 'launch' the spell to send out a bunch of arrow themed effects.

A two level dip into the base arcane archer class also allows you to get imbue arrow which can help cut down the casting time on some longer area spells and can be kind of fun as well, but going with core edition than it's a loss of 2 caster levels which leaves you a whole spell level behind, or with pathfinder it's just a loss of one level. Between RP and smite spell you could go with abjuration champion and get some pretty nice AC from abjuration spells and still maintain full caster progression and even get to use your caster level as BAB and that may end up working out better for you instead of ever bothering with the arcane archer prestige.

[Snowbluff]

A few things:

1) Smiting Spell takes as long as Imbue Arrow... and them the casting time of the spell... stepped up by one if you're a spontaneous caster.

2) It does stack with Imbue Arrow, so you should get Imbue Arrow.

3) Area spell don't need to hit their target. You can just aim at a nearby object with your Arrowsplit Splitting Imbue Arrow for a bunch of hits. Take that, "touch spells." :smalltongue: