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View Full Version : D&D 5e/Next Monk Archetype: Way of the Sacred Fist



Ghost Dragon
2015-02-04, 12:29 AM
Here's another one I've done. Still in draft phase, so feedback is most welcome. Not sure about the ki point costs so pay close attetion to those when review this subclass. To be clear, this is an attempt to recreate the same feel and flavour of the original Sacred Fist prestige class from 3.5. I have again like my previous Enlightened Fist Subclass used a little MAD to keep the flavour and balance, as I think giving a class two types of resources to use needs the third ability to not OP it. But that's just my logic, if you think of a way to keep it balanced and not MAD let me know. Here it is:

Way of the Sacred Fist: Monks who follow the Way of The Sacred Fist believe in the purity of the physical form and therefore rarely use weapons. They consider their bodies and minds gifts from their deity, and they believe that not developing those gifts to their fullest potential is a sin. Spellcasting does not dishonour them or their deity. Sacred fists are strong in faith, will, and body.

3rd-Level Spellcasting: When you reach 3rd level, you augment your martial arts with the ability to cast divine spells.

Cantrips: You learn two cantrips at first level from the following list: blade ward, guidance, light, mending, produce flame, resistance, sacred flame, shocking grasp, thaumaturgy, true strike. You learn an additional cantrip from this list of your choice at 10th level.

Spell Slots: The Way of The Sacred Fist Spellcasting table (See Eldritch Knight spellcasting table) shows how many spell slots you have to cast your spells of 1st level and higher. To cast one of these spells, you must expend a slot of the spell’s level or higher. You regain all expended spell slots when you finish a long rest. For example, if you have prepared the 1st-level spell cure wounds and have a 1st-level and a 2nd-level spell slot available, you can cast cure wounds using either slot.

Spells Known of 1st level and higher: You know three 1st-level cleric spells of your choice, from the cleric spell list. The Spells Known column of the Way of The Sacred Fist Spellcasting table shows when you learn more cleric spells of 1st level or higher. Each of these spells must be of a level for which you have spell slots. For instance, when you reach 7th level in this class, you can learn one new spell of 1st or 2nd level. The spells you learn at 8th, 14th, and 20th level can come from the paladin spell list instead. Whenever you gain a level in this class, you can replace one of the clerci spells you know with another spell of your choice from the cleric spell list. The new spell must be of a level for which you have spell slots, and it must be from the cleric spell list, unless you’re replacing the spell you gained at 8th, 14th, or 20th level, which could be from the paladin spell list.

Spellcasting Ability: Wisdom is your spellcasting ability for your cleric and paladin spells, since your power comes from your devotion to your deity. You use your Wisdom whenever a spell refers to your spellcasting ability. In addition, you use your Wisdom modifier when setting the saving throw DC for a cleric or paladin spell you cast and when making an attack roll with one.

Spellcasting Focus: You can use a holy symbol as a spellcasting focus for your Way of The Sacred Fist spells.

3rd level Sacred Flames: At 3rd-level, you may spend 2 ki points to invoke sacred flames around your hands and feet as a bonus action. These flames add to your unarmed damage. The additional damage is equal to 1d4 fire or radiant damage (your choice). The sacred flames have a duration of concentration, up to 1 minute. At 11th-level you can spend 4 ki points to increase the damage to 2d4 fire or radiant damage (your choice) and the duration to concentration, up to 1 hour. At 17th-level you can spend 7 ki points to increase the extra damage to 3d4 fire damage or radiant damage (your choice), with a duration of concentration up to 1 hour.

6th level Channel Divinity: You gain the ability to channel divine energy to fuel magical effects. When you use your Channel Divinity, you choose which option to use. You must finish a long rest to use your Channel Divinity again, or you can choose to spend 3 Ki points at any time as a bonus action to regain the use of your Channel Divinity. Some Channel Divinity effects require saving throws. When you use such an effect from this class, the DC equals your Sacred Fist spell saves. You gain the Life Domain Channel Divinity option “Preserve Life”, and you may choose one other Channel Divinity option from any of the other domains available from the cleric class. You may only choose options that are usable at level 2 from the cleric class. For example, you could choose the Channel Divinity option from the Knowledge domain “Channel Divinity: Knowledge of the Ages” as it is the level 2 option for that domain, but you could not choose “Channel Divinity: Read Thoughts” from the Knowledge domain as it is the level 6 option for that domain.

11th level Divine Sight: Starting at 11th-level, you can spend 2 ki points to cast detect thoughts, locate object, see invisibility or darkvision without providing material components. At 17th-level you can choose to spend 6 ki points as an action to cast the spell true seeing without providing material components.

17th level Inner Armor: At 17th-level, your inner tranquillity protects you from external threats. Using your action, you attain a perfect focus on the divine spark within you, projecting it outwards. For 1 hour, you gain resistance to magic, resistance to all damage and a +2 bonus to your saving throws and AC. Once you use this feature, you can’t use it again until you finish a long rest.

Remember, work in progress :smallwink: Comment away!

BRKNdevil
2015-02-04, 05:53 PM
Ok, first off, I dunno about gaining another set of spell casting points. one of the issues i had while amusing my self with the thought process. Second, mad is bad and i don't think it really even applies here. For every Enlightened fist build i saw, it used kung fu genius or didn't exist. and for every sacred fist, argent fist and the like, they used wisdom as their spellcasting stat through cleric levels and the like, never through paladin or favored soul. So i don't think your MAD design idea really applies nor is it a good idea.

The Sacred Flames ability is stronger then a Elemental Weapon, which uses a 3rd level slot to start off with, and with your damage amount, its boosted to a 5th level spell slot. Additionally, Elemental Weapon is only found on Paladins so that means that your ability beats it way out of the water. Also, its awkward to work with 2 damage types, or in this case 3 damage types for the different amounts.

Your suggestion for Channel Divinity seems overpowered, And i suggest you look at the paladin's and Cleric's abilities at level 1 to draw up more balanced abilities.

Your Divine Sight, not only appears before the Rogues Blindsight, but is also better in every way.

17 is actually decent if you think about how the monk gets totally gypped for its capstone.

Ghost Dragon
2015-02-04, 06:49 PM
Ok, first off, I dunno about gaining another set of spell casting points. one of the issues i had while amusing my self with the thought process. Second, mad is bad and i don't think it really even applies here. For every Enlightened fist build i saw, it used kung fu genius or didn't exist. and for every sacred fist, argent fist and the like, they used wisdom as their spellcasting stat through cleric levels and the like, never through paladin or favored soul. So i don't think your MAD design idea really applies nor is it a good idea.

The Sacred Flames ability is stronger then a Elemental Weapon, which uses a 3rd level slot to start off with, and with your damage amount, its boosted to a 5th level spell slot. Additionally, Elemental Weapon is only found on Paladins so that means that your ability beats it way out of the water. Also, its awkward to work with 2 damage types, or in this case 3 damage types for the different amounts.

Your suggestion for Channel Divinity seems overpowered, And i suggest you look at the paladin's and Cleric's abilities at level 1 to draw up more balanced abilities.

Your Divine Sight, not only appears before the Rogues Blindsight, but is also better in every way.

17 is actually decent if you think about how the monk gets totally gypped for its capstone.

Thanks for your feedback, very good stuff.

So for MAD, upon reflection you're absolutely right, the only build I ever made for Enlightened Fist always used kung fu genius or carmendine monk, and Sacred fist is the same with you'd only ever use a cleric base. I have changed the spellcasting ability to Wisdom, but changed the spells known back to being a limited list like the Eldritch Knight, allowing for normal spell choice to be from Cleric list (no school restriction), and special choices at 8 14 and 20 from the paladin list (no school restriction).

Sacred Flames, again you're right, I kinda thought it was OP but was trying to differ it from Enlightened fist. Have changed point cost and damage output. I only had two damage types to keep flavour from original, so now made it your choice of fire or radiant. Now that spell list is not as combat orientated sacred flames should be more balanced (compared to divine favour its exactly the same at low levels, and comparable to elemental weapon in progression).

Divine Sight, again I knew it was more powerful than rogue and gets better, but I kinda thought that was ok to make it different (I don't believe that homebrews have to always not get something before a RAW subclass does just for the sake of saying "Now its balanced"). However, to pull it completely away from the rogue equivalent, I have made it more like the Way of Shadow "Shadow Arts" with the bigger ability of True Seeing still in there. It may even be an underpowered feature now as its at 11 and "Shadow Arts" is at 3.

Channel Divinity, these are actually exact copy pastes from the cleric channel divinity options at level 2, which is when the cleric gets them, not level 1. Sacred Healing is direct copy from Life domain "Preserve Life" which is 2nd level option, and Sacred Radiance is direct copy from Light domain "Radiance of the Dawn" which is also 2nd level option, so I think these are balanced. None the less I made a small change to the healing one, instead of 5 times monk level I made it 3 times monk level to keep it in line with Way of the Open Hand "Wholeness of Body", and have changed damage one to + 1/2 monk level, not full monk level. This should definately make them balanced and a little different from cleric (Cause the cleric should always do cleric stuff better lol).

Inner Armor, glad you liked that one, but do you think keeping it Charisma mod is ok now I've changed spell casting ability? Making it Wisdom seems OP as it will essentially double the normal AC bonus.

Righto how does it look now after these changes?

DiBastet
2015-02-04, 07:54 PM
I think you should try to weave some domains in the sacred fist. As it is warrior monks from every god shine and heal. Ditch the shining one and allow the monk to access one channel divinity from a domain of his choosing, that could keep the "half-cleric" feel. Maybe even add turn undead. The other things i would comment were the casting stat and spell list, but you already changed that so everything's cool.

Ghost Dragon
2015-02-04, 08:45 PM
I think you should try to weave some domains in the sacred fist. As it is warrior monks from every god shine and heal. Ditch the shining one and allow the monk to access one channel divinity from a domain of his choosing, that could keep the "half-cleric" feel. Maybe even add turn undead. The other things i would comment were the casting stat and spell list, but you already changed that so everything's cool.

That's a great idea, I will make that change for sure. Thanks for that, adds more flavour for followers of different gods. Nice work :)

JohamR
2018-02-05, 10:10 AM
NECRO because I've been looking for a subclass like this for a while. I wanna take this subclass and input it into Homebrewery to make it look official. Mind if I post it in this thread for you to see, Ghost Dragon? If so, have you made any big personal changes to it?