Wild Soul optimization help.

[Bad Wolf]

Need help optimizing a Sorcerer 5/Wild Soul 10/Something 5 to tier 1 status.

CN Magic-Blooded Half-Fey Shee (third party Fey)
Feats:
1: Apprentice (philosopher)
Flaw: Nymph's Kiss (houseruled non-exalted)
Flaw: Spellfire Wielder
3: Item Familiar
6: Otherworldly Countenance

Starting at level 8, going to around twenty or so, maybe higher. Going for a Summoner/Enchanter/Illusionist build.

Thanks in advance. I will turn everyone into my playthings for eternity if anyone suggests wizard.

[Bad Wolf]

Hmm...Bump?

[Bad Wolf]

Okay, second bump?

[Mr.Kraken]

I'm working on a fey-themed character myself. So far he's bard 14//cleric 4/geomancer 10, has the unseelie fey template. If you have that template and focus on the Fey Heritage feats from Complete Mage, you'll eventually end up with DR 20/cold iron by level 12. Also, unseelie fey is awesome (Winter's Chill FTW).

[prufock]

Spend 300 gp to get Iron Will from an Otyugh Hole, grab a metamagic feat and the right skills, and enter Incantatrix (PGtF) for all 5 levels. Add metamagic for free by making concentration checks.

While you said no wizards, taking level 1 and progressing it twice can get you into Ultimate Magus, for a different kind of metamagic shenanigans.

Not sure if any of this actually improves you to tier 1 or just more powerful tier 2. You don't get any extra tricks, just more powerful tricks.

[Rebel7284]

5 levels of Shadowcraft Mage (Shadow Cabal adaptation) would also make you tier 1.

[prufock]

5 levels of Shadowcraft Mage (Shadow Cabal adaptation) would also make you tier 1.
Also thematically appropriate, particularly unseelie, with the focus on illusion. However, the racial requirement disqualifies it unless you get DM approval or take three levels of Stoneblessed, which means you won't get Shadow Illusion (you need 3 levels of Shadowcraft Mage).

[Rebel7284]

Also thematically appropriate, particularly unseelie, with the focus on illusion. However, the racial requirement disqualifies it unless you get DM approval or take three levels of Stoneblessed, which means you won't get Shadow Illusion (you need 3 levels of Shadowcraft Mage).


5 levels of Shadowcraft Mage (Shadow Cabal adaptation) would also make you tier 1.

Bolded for emphasis. As per adaptation section in Races of Stone, with DM approval, any race can take Shadowcraft Mage if they are part of a cabal that focuses on illusion.

[Bad Wolf]

I'm working on a fey-themed character myself. So far he's bard 14//cleric 4/geomancer 10, has the unseelie fey template. If you have that template and focus on the Fey Heritage feats from Complete Mage, you'll eventually end up with RD 20/cold iron by level 12. Also, unseelie fey is awesome (Winter's Chill FTW).


Bolded for emphasis. As per adaptation section in Races of Stone, with DM approval, any race can take Shadowcraft Mage if they are part of a cabal that focuses on illusion.

Asked him, he said no.

[prufock]

Honestly, as long as you take (Greater) Shadow Evocation, (Greater) Shadow Conjuration, Shades, Limited Wish, and Wish as spells known (and maybe Arcane Disciple: Luck domain to nab Miracle), you're pushing tier 1 anyway. Enhanced Shadow Reality feat and 3 levels of Shadowcrafter (requires Spell Focus and Greater Spell Focus).

[Bad Wolf]

Honestly, as long as you take (Greater) Shadow Evocation, (Greater) Shadow Conjuration, Shades, Limited Wish, and Wish as spells known (and maybe Arcane Disciple: Luck domain to nab Miracle), you're pushing tier 1 anyway. Enhanced Shadow Reality feat and 3 levels of Shadowcrafter (requires Spell Focus and Greater Spell Focus).

Hmm..that'll be a little feat-intensive. And ESR requires me to be a illusionist, which means I have to take a level of wizard?

Goddamit.

[prufock]

Hmm..that'll be a little feat-intensive. And ESR requires me to be a illusionist, which means I have to take a level of wizard?
Yeah, I forgot about that bit of ESR, sorry.

Shadowcrafter isn't mandatory, it just gives your shadow spells a nice bump. Spell selection IS mandatory if you're reaching for tier 1 with a sorcerer. What separates tier 1 from tier 2 is versatility, not power. Shadow conjuration/evocation, their Greater counterparts, Shades, Limited Wish, Wish, and Miracle (a feat just for Miracle IS worth it, IMO) give you an amazing amount of versatility. Add in polymorph and shapechange and you're good to go. You will still be 2 caster levels behind a wizard, though, which hurts.

[Bad Wolf]

Yeah, I forgot about that bit of ESR, sorry.

Shadowcrafter isn't mandatory, it just gives your shadow spells a nice bump. Spell selection IS mandatory if you're reaching for tier 1 with a sorcerer. What separates tier 1 from tier 2 is versatility, not power. Shadow conjuration/evocation, their Greater counterparts, Shades, Limited Wish, Wish, and Miracle (a feat just for Miracle IS worth it, IMO) give you an amazing amount of versatility. Add in polymorph and shapechange and you're good to go. You will still be 2 caster levels behind a wizard, though, which hurts.

Is miracle really that good? I don't see what's so good...

And I'm also going for enchanting and summoning. Can't focus all my spells on illusions....

[Rebel7284]

Is miracle really that good? I don't see what's so good...

And I'm also going for enchanting and summoning. Can't focus all my spells on illusions....

Miracle doesn't cost XP, unlike Wish.
+
It gives you access to almost every spell in the game.

[Bad Wolf]

Miracle doesn't cost XP, unlike Wish.
+
It gives you access to almost every spell in the game.

...that is really overpowered. But I guess it makes sense. Deities can deny it if they fell the cleric's getting too needy.

Okay so Miracle, Shadow Evocation & Shadow Conjuration. Any enchantment and conjuration spells that stick out?

[prufock]

...that is really overpowered. But I guess it makes sense. Deities can deny it if they fell the cleric's getting too needy.

Okay so Miracle, Shadow Evocation & Shadow Conjuration. Any enchantment and conjuration spells that stick out?
See posts 10 and 16 of the SCM Handbook (http://community.wizards.com/forum/previous-editions-character-optimization/threads/1065756).

Miracle is powerful, but hey, you're going for tier 1 (or as close as you can get) here.

[Bad Wolf]

See posts 10 and 16 of the SCM Handbook (http://community.wizards.com/forum/previous-editions-character-optimization/threads/1065756).

Miracle is powerful, but hey, you're going for tier 1 (or as close as you can get) here.

Thanks, it its just a list of spells to imitate with SC and SE. Are you saying I should take those spells? I kinda have limited spells known here...

[prufock]

Thanks, it its just a list of spells to imitate with SC and SE. Are you saying I should take those spells? I kinda have limited spells known here...
Yeah, those are conjuration and evocation spells to emulate. No need to take them as spells known (that's the great thing about the shadow spells).

As for what to take for spells known, shadow conjuration can only mimic summoning and creation spells. Take at least one Teleportation spell - Dimension Door, Teleport, Greater Teleport eventually. Planar Binding (and greater and lesser PB) as well as Gate are standards for hitting tier 1, since they can be used to call creatures with whatever ability is applicable to your needs.

As for enchantment, you want spells that offer at least one, all if possible, of the following.
- Not mind-affecting
- No save
- No SR

Ray of Stupidity, Ray of Dizziness, Heroism, Power Word Pain (though it might be less useful at your starting level), Otto's Irresistible Dance are all good choices.

You will definitely want at least some method of controlling others, be it charm person/monster, dominate person/monster (better), or geas.

[Bad Wolf]

Yeah, those are conjuration and evocation spells to emulate. No need to take them as spells known (that's the great thing about the shadow spells).

As for what to take for spells known, shadow conjuration can only mimic summoning and creation spells. Take at least one Teleportation spell - Dimension Door, Teleport, Greater Teleport eventually. Planar Binding (and greater and lesser PB) as well as Gate are standards for hitting tier 1, since they can be used to call creatures with whatever ability is applicable to your needs.

As for enchantment, you want spells that offer at least one, all if possible, of the following.
- Not mind-affecting
- No save
- No SR

Ray of Stupidity, Ray of Dizziness, Heroism, Power Word Pain (though it might be less useful at your starting level), Otto's Irresistible Dance are all good choices.

You will definitely want at least some method of controlling others, be it charm person/monster, dominate person/monster (better), or geas.

Okay, thanks. I have the Half-Fey template, so that cuts down on a few enchantment spells. Any advice on feats?

[prufock]

Okay, thanks. I have the Half-Fey template, so that cuts down on a few enchantment spells. Any advice on feats?
Not much outside the general spellcaster feats. Rapid Metamagic at level 9 is a good one, unless you're taking the Metamagic Specialist ACF in place of your familiar. Then, of course, some metamagic feats to go with it.

Another suggestion for the last 5 levels of your build - the adaptation for Nightmare Spinner. The capstone of this 5-level prestige class grants you the ability to overcome immunity to mind-affecting abilities.