Rope Dart vs. Spiked Chain

[Mr.Kraken]

Rope Dart/Meteor Hammer (Dragon #319)
Exotic Weapon; two-handed, piercing (Meteor Hammer is bludgeoning) 1d4, x2, 15ft reach, 3gp, 4lb, can hit adjacent foes, can trip, can disarm with +2 bonus, eligible for Weapon Finesse, monks with EWP can use it as a monk weapon to flurry

Spiked Chain (Player's Handbook)
Extotic Weapon; two-handed, piercing, 2d4, x2, 10ft reach, 25gp, 10lb, can hit adjacente foes, can trip, can disarm with +2 bonus, eligible for Weapon Finesse, can be used with Exotic Weapon Master's flurry ability

Both weapons are very similar, with the only major difference being that the rope dart causes less damage, but has higher reach than the spiked chain. So, which of these two awesome weapons do you consider the better one?

[Greenish]

If rope dart has 15' range, and can also hit adjacent foes, what about enemies that are 10 feet away?

Regardless, if you can get it, the rope dart is better because reach.

[Chronos]

Unless you're using extreme size increases, weapon damage dice hardly matter at all in D&D, and usable 15' reach is extremely rare for weapons. The only real drawback to the meteor hammer (and it's a big one) is that many DMs won't allow Dragon material, especially material that's so obviously better than what's already the best weapon in the game.

[Zaq]

Yeah, that. If the rope dart is on the table, it's almost strictly superior to the spiked chain. (I guess the spiked chain is easier to use Knockdown with at the early levels, but beyond the early levels, the weapon dice just don't matter.) But like the others here said, the rope dart isn't likely to be on the table in most games, because the majority of GMs don't allow much Dragon material, while the spiked chain is Core.

But yeah. If you CAN use the rope dart, I don't know any spiked chain users who wouldn't swap out for it in a heartbeat.

[Mr.Kraken]

If rope dart has 15' range, and can also hit adjacent foes, what about enemies that are 10 feet away?

Regardless, if you can get it, the rope dart is better because reach.

I think it works like the whip. If you can strike enemies that are 10ft away with the whip, then you can do it with the rope dart.

EDIT: I don't get it. What's with the hate for Dragon material?

[Coidzor]

Rope Dart/Meteor Hammer (Dragon #319)
Exotic Weapon; two-handed, piercing (Meteor Hammer is bludgeoning) 1d4, x2, 15ft reach, 3gp, 4lb, can hit adjacent foes, can trip, can disarm with +2 bonus, eligible for Weapon Finesse, monks with EWP can use it as a monk weapon to flurry

Spiked Chain (Player's Handbook)
Extotic Weapon; two-handed, piercing, 2d4, x2, 10ft reach, 25gp, 10lb, can hit adjacente foes, can trip, can disarm with +2 bonus, eligible for Weapon Finesse, can be used with Exotic Weapon Master's flurry ability

Both weapons are very similar, with the only major difference being that the rope dart causes less damage, but has higher reach than the spiked chain. So, which of these two awesome weapons do you consider the better one?

Rope Dart is superior for area denial, though having less damage on the weapon makes Stand Still slightly less likely to work due to having 2.5 less damage on average, but the way damage scales means that this won't be a concern for long.

The main concern is availability due to being Dragon Magazine content. And possibly that a rope is much easier to sunder than a chain.

[squiggit]

I don't get it. What's with the hate for Dragon material?

Two big things

1)There's a perception that Dragon Magazine content is particularly cheesy, poorly edited and/or ridiculous.


2) Dragon Magazine material is scattered across hundreds of issues in relatively hard to find sources with no real repository.

[Mr.Kraken]

...And possibly that a rope is much easier to sunder than a chain.

Unless you have Gogo Yubari's version (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x9iIKn1Bl6c).

EDIT:


Two big things

1)There's a perception that Dragon Magazine content is particularly cheesy, poorly edited and/or ridiculous.


2) Dragon Magazine material is scattered across hundreds of issues in relatively hard to find sources with no real repository.

But, couldn't that be said about most 3rd party material? And yet, I've seen lots of people using them. I think that the DM should check the content before coming to a conclusion, not just banning it just because its "Dragon material". If it's fun, there's no need for double standards, IMO.

[Greenish]

But, couldn't that be said about most 3rd party material?Yes, and that's why people are leery of using 3rd party material. Dragon Magazine's probably more likely to get approved than any other 3rd party stuff.

[Coidzor]

I think it works like the whip. If you can strike enemies that are 10ft away with the whip, then you can do it with the rope dart.

EDIT: I don't get it. What's with the hate for Dragon material?

It's scattered in several magazines rather than a smaller number of books, the reputation is for wildly varying balance points for content, and less people are as aware of it due to it being discussed less for the first two reasons and some others.


Yes, and that's why people are leery of using 3rd party material. Dragon Magazine's probably more likely to get approved than any other 3rd party stuff.

Yorp.

[Mr.Kraken]

I see. Then, would you allow the meteor hammer as a DM?

[Zanos]

I see. Then, would you allow the meteor hammer as a DM?
As long as you have the issue in some format that I can actually look at, sure.

[shaikujin]

I feel that the Rope Dart is better too.
Or more accurately, have better potential.



The low base damage is something that can be fixed/optimized by using a Scorpion Kama (with morphing + sizing WSA to morph into a rope dart) to replace base damage with unarmed strike damage.

Unarmed damage can be optimized using unarmed strike progression, greater mighty wallop, real/effective size increase.



If the above are used, a weapon's base damage of weapons becomes irrelevant since all will be doing like 12d8 damage.

But having a base 15 ft threathening reach is something that no other weapon offers.

[Angelalex242]

Best of all, when you use the rope dart, every time you hit someone with it, you can yell, "GET OVER HERE!"

For best effect, drink a potion of fire breathing first and have a mask of the skull.

[Zaq]

In addition to the reasons already stated (that Dragon has a reputation for being poorly balanced and that its material is scattered all over the damn place), there's also the fact that it's a major pain to look up anything from Dragon. It's hard to remember which Dragon has which material, while the regular books tend to have things that are at least kind of thematically appropriate. Dragon, though, is all over the map, which makes it really hard to look stuff up even if you have the magazines.

[Twurps]

Best of all, when you use the rope dart, every time you hit someone with it, you can yell, "GET OVER HERE!"

For best effect, drink a potion of fire breathing first and have a mask of the skull.

I SO want to build/play this character now! :P
right after I 'Finish him!!' on my emulator.