Persistent effects of summoned creatures

[Confused Dad]

If a summoned spider makes a web, does the web remain after the summoning spell expires? I've hear not, but the summons called the spider, which disappears upon the spell ending, the spell didn't create the web itself, why wouldn't it persist?

[Crake]

If a summoned spider makes a web, does the web remain after the summoning spell expires? I've hear not, but the summons called the spider, which disappears upon the spell ending, the spell didn't create the web itself, why wouldn't it persist?

Presumably the web was summoned as a part of the spider, and thus disappears when the spider does. Web doesn't just magically appear out of nowhere (if it did, then it actually wouldn't unsummon funnily enough, as long as it's duration was instantaneous).

[Psyren]

A summoned creature's spells end when they do; while a spider's web is actually Ex, it's probably best not to clutter up the world and treat it the same way.

[JDL]

From the 3.5e SRD:


Summoning
A summoning spell instantly brings a creature or object to a place you designate. When the spell ends or is dispelled, a summoned creature is instantly sent back to where it came from, but a summoned object is not sent back unless the spell description specifically indicates this. A summoned creature also goes away if it is killed or if its hit points drop to 0 or lower. It is not really dead. It takes 24 hours for the creature to reform, during which time it can’t be summoned again.

When the spell that summoned a creature ends and the creature disappears, all the spells it has cast expire. A summoned creature cannot use any innate summoning abilities it may have, and it refuses to cast any spells that would cost it XP, or to use any spell-like abilities that would cost XP if they were spells.

Per the rules, spells expire immediately when a creature disappears. The rules are silent on anything else, and are in fact also silent on the technical definition of "expire" as well. Thus the interpretation is up the DM for effects which are independent of the creature itself, such as a web. If the web is classified as an object instead of a part of the creature, for example, nothing in the spell description for the Summon Monster spell indicates this would be sent back.

[Grek]

"A summoning spell instantly brings a creature or object to a place you designate. When the spell ends or is dispelled, a summoned creature is instantly sent back to where it came from, but a summoned object is not sent back unless the spell description specifically indicates this."

The web stays. It is an object that gets summoned alongside the spider. This, incidentally, means that you can farm short swords and glaives by summoning Lillends and Bearded Devils as pages. If you cared to.

[Crake]

"A summoning spell instantly brings a creature or object to a place you designate. When the spell ends or is dispelled, a summoned creature is instantly sent back to where it came from, but a summoned object is not sent back unless the spell description specifically indicates this."

The web stays. It is an object that gets summoned alongside the spider. This, incidentally, means that you can farm short swords and glaives by summoning Lillends and Bearded Devils as pages. If you cared to.

Technically the web (and for other examples like weapons of creatures) are a part of the creature (as attended objects), and are not the direct effect of the summon monster spell. Those objects, at the time of summoning, were considered a part of the creature, and thus leave with the creature. Note that the rules text you quoted is referring to a summoning spell with the effect "summoned object". Summon monster and summon natures ally spells have the effect "summoned creature".

[Grek]

That's probably the intended reading, but as far as the rules as written go, if the object is not attended by the summoned creature when spell ends, then that object should be treated as a summoned object rather than as part of a summoned creature.

[Bullet06320]

"A summoning spell instantly brings a creature or object to a place you designate. When the spell ends or is dispelled, a summoned creature is instantly sent back to where it came from, but a summoned object is not sent back unless the spell description specifically indicates this."

The web stays. It is an object that gets summoned alongside the spider. This, incidentally, means that you can farm short swords and glaives by summoning Lillends and Bearded Devils as pages. If you cared to.

I like that interpretation, but if it was part of a summoned creature or came with the summoned creature it probly should go poof when the creature does

[JDL]

As per the SRD:


Saving Throws
Nonmagical, unattended items never make saving throws. They are considered to have failed their saving throws, so they always are affected by spells. An item attended by a character (being grasped, touched, or worn) makes saving throws as the character (that is, using the character’s saving throw bonus).

The definition of an attended object is therefore one that is "being grasped, touched or worn." As a web is essentially a net attack, and net attacks are controlled by the trailing rope, the web would count as an attended object if the spider still controls the web via a trailing 'strand,' though there appears to be nothing to confirm or deny if this occurs in the ability description. A weapon dropped by a summoned creature would by definition be an unattended object.

[Coidzor]

Technically the web (and for other examples like weapons of creatures) are a part of the creature (as attended objects), and are not the direct effect of the summon monster spell. Those objects, at the time of summoning, were considered a part of the creature, and thus leave with the creature. Note that the rules text you quoted is referring to a summoning spell with the effect "summoned object". Summon monster and summon natures ally spells have the effect "summoned creature".

So the secondary effect of a summon's poison also doesn't take effect if the spell's duration has expired then?

[SangoProduction]

From the 3.5e SRD:


Summoning
A summoning spell instantly brings a creature or object to a place you designate. When the spell ends or is dispelled, a summoned creature is instantly sent back to where it came from, but a summoned object is not sent back unless the spell description specifically indicates this. A summoned creature also goes away if it is killed or if its hit points drop to 0 or lower. It is not really dead. It takes 24 hours for the creature to reform, during which time it can’t be summoned again.

When the spell that summoned a creature ends and the creature disappears, all the spells it has cast expire. A summoned creature cannot use any innate summoning abilities it may have, and it refuses to cast any spells that would cost it XP, or to use any spell-like abilities that would cost XP if they were spells.
.

May I please have the hyperlink for this?

[Zaq]

May I please have the hyperlink for this?

Enjoy. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicOverview/spellDescriptions.htm#summoning) Also PHB pg. 173.