Kingsman

[Pex]

Liked the movie a lot.

It's a real riot! So surreal, it'll blow your mind!

[t209]

So anybody also read Mark Millar version?
Did it deviate from its plot or something? The label is a reference on Hit Girl's dad, which turned out that he's just a bored psychopath who tried to make his life "excitable".

[Cheesegear]

Was it intentional, or was it a tricky way to get past ratings certifications and/or censors?

The Final Sequence
When everyone's head explodes in centre-frame, we get pretty firework displays instead of ludicrous gibs.

If it was the movie's way of avoiding an R-rating, then well done.

[Flickerdart]

This movie is a perfect example of "tropes are not bad" - it really doesn't deliver anything new, but it's a very well-executed package.

[Rodin]

First real Bond movie I've seen since Daniel Craig took over. Yes, it was first and foremost a comedy but they got what made the old Bond movies awesome. Smooth and suave secret agents. Megalomaniac villain out to conquer the world. Ludicrous gadgets. It wallowed in nostalgia and I loved all the nods to classic Bond they stuck in there.

[Legato Endless]

Was it intentional, or was it a tricky way to get past ratings certifications and/or censors?

The Final Sequence
When everyone's head explodes in centre-frame, we get pretty firework displays instead of ludicrous gibs.

If it was the movie's way of avoiding an R-rating, then well done.

I think it was also to mollify slightly the film's criticism of the 1% as moral cowards. The shot of Obama dying is as oblique as it can be without leaving any room for doubt what happened.

[sktarq]

Good grief did I enjoy this movie. Plus I think it broke my GF she liked it so much. If a movie still has me in a good mood 24 hours after it is finished in spite of a day that shouldn't support such a mood then it wins. It may not be deep, great story etc but a movie with more fun and more laughs has not come my way for years. Part Snatch, parch Get Smart, and part James Bond classic stirred for 10 seconds while looking at an unopened bottle of vermouth.

[Gnome Alone]

Colin Firth is awesome in it; classy dude. The crazy fight scene with him in the church is marvelous; I didn't notice it cuz me not notice nothing but the director pointed out in an interview that it doesn't cut away; instead of the modern frantic cuts we'd usually get, the camera follows Firth constantly and we can see it play out almost like its own story.

I kinda thought it was trashy, though, and a little mean-spirited--the AV Club's review said something like it has a vision of "the working class being omposed entirely of promiscuous women and the lowlifes who beat them." But I still kept thinking about it for a few days, so that's always good. Definitely something to it.

[Solaris]

I really liked this movie. The action choreography and cinemtaography were excellent. It was extremely well paced. The main characters were likable and interesting. Valentine and Gazelle were very cool villains. Overall it had a real sense of fun and didn't take itself too seriously, but it wasn't cynically smug and ironic either. This is what a good modern action movie should be.

You might even say it had class.

I agree with you on all points. The movie was actually exciting for me, and I don't think that's happened since I was a kid. It actually got my pulse rate up with the climactic scene at the end, even though there was no doubt in my mind the bad guys were going to lose (because when did they ever win?). That's how well done it was.


Colin Firth is awesome in it; classy dude. The crazy fight scene with him in the church is marvelous; I didn't notice it cuz me not notice nothing but the director pointed out in an interview that it doesn't cut away; instead of the modern frantic cuts we'd usually get, the camera follows Firth constantly and we can see it play out almost like its own story.

Yeah, I thought the cinematography on that particular scene was really well done.
I also appreciate that while there was some blood, they didn't revel in it and get obscenely splashy about it.


I kinda thought it was trashy, though, and a little mean-spirited--the AV Club's review said something like it has a vision of "the working class being omposed entirely of promiscuous women and the lowlifes who beat them." But I still kept thinking about it for a few days, so that's always good. Definitely something to it.

I saw it less as 'working class' and more as 'trailer park trash', the low-class rural scum-of-the-earth types.
I admit to a bit of schadenfreude with that scene, as I'm a vet and that church reminded me of a certain church in Alabama that likes to troll funerals.

[Aedilred]

I kinda thought it was trashy, though, and a little mean-spirited--the AV Club's review said something like it has a vision of "the working class being omposed entirely of promiscuous women and the lowlifes who beat them." But I still kept thinking about it for a few days, so that's always good. Definitely something to it.

This was one of the areas where the film made a bit of a misstep, I think. I think in some respects it's quite a Tory film (as opposed to Whig, rather than in the modern political sense): old money good, new money bad; weak and corruptible modern democracy vs patrician noblesse oblige (not just the Kingsmen themselves, but for instance the Swedish royal horror at Valentine's proposal where the PM jumps at it); old-fashioned values (manners, presentation, etc.) promoted; even Eggsy himself, while from a rough background is fundamentally selected for consideration by the Kingsmen because of who his father was. It does take a swipe at overt snobbery, but seems to accept and even encourage implicit snobbery ("deserving vs undeserving poor", etc.)

But I also don't hold that against it for the most part (and we probably can't discuss it any more than the above anyway, given forum rules), since it was both pretty unapologetic about that and was also clearly prepared to poke fun at itself. Without getting bogged down in irrelevant characters only there to dispel the "chav scum" image it would be difficult to avoid giving that impression without fundamentally diluting the energy of the film I think.

The fireworks scene was one of two in the film that had my mouth hanging open (the other being the church sene). It's ridiculous. But it's also shocking in its audacity, fit perfectly with the tenor of the film and gave it a great and fully appropriate climax, I think.

More of a problem I think was the tonal dissonance in the final act, with the whiz-bang enjoyable action heroics in Valentine's lair contrasting badly with the played-straight drama of Eggsy's family and the threat to the baby. And much moreso than that, the note on which the film ended, with "woman as reward" played straight and in such a crude and laddish way that it kind of soured the whole experience. Which was a real shame, as they'd done a good job of avoiding that with the Eggsy-Roxy relationship. Cut out that one line, I think, and the final couple of shots, and the film would improve immeasurably.

[Legato Endless]

More of a problem I think was the tonal dissonance in the final act, with the whiz-bang enjoyable action heroics in Valentine's lair contrasting badly with the played-straight drama of Eggsy's family and the threat to the baby.

I think what magnified the dissonance was that it failed to remain strictly inside the lair, but being jarringly inconsistent with the outside apocalypse. The tonal change works decently in a horrified impressive way when it shows the church massacre and then transfers to Galahad's more dramatic shooting outside. At the climax however, the people beating themselves to death gets a peppy accompaniment, while suddenly when Eggsy's family is being affected it's deadly serious. Yes, the shapeless masses aren't a known entity and harder to sympathize with, but it doesn't really work when the film tries to have it both ways.


Yeah, that gag didn't sit right with me either. It was crude but not in a gleeful, bombastic way like much else of the film. It was just kind of sleazy.

Agreed.

[BWR]

Just got back from seeing it. Loved it to bits. Can't really think of anything wrong with it except shaky-cam action, which wasn't nearly as bad as some movies.

[huttj509]

And much moreso than that, the note on which the film ended, with "woman as reward" played straight and in such a crude and laddish way that it kind of soured the whole experience. Which was a real shame, as they'd done a good job of avoiding that with the Eggsy-Roxy relationship. Cut out that one line, I think, and the final couple of shots, and the film would improve immeasurably.

I got what they were going for with that scene, as a reference to the way many bond films ended (Moonraker, for example (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=08Zog1a_WSs)), but compared to the rest of the movie it felt really out of place (as opposed to Bond movies, which often feel eye-rollingly "flirty/racy" throughout).

I think it would have worked better (assuming it wasn't entirely cut) if it had just had Merlin looking at the screen, saying "oh my" and closing it. Or if the princess had just clocked him and made a break for it as soon as he opened the cell, for that matter.

I loved the action scenes though. Normally shaky-cam makes me feel ill, but I was able to follow what was happening, despite it being shaky, and sped up motion. It was really well cut to give the feel of "nobody knows what's going on, except this guy, and you can follow along with him."

[Solaris]

This was one of the areas where the film made a bit of a misstep, I think. I think in some respects it's quite a Tory film (as opposed to Whig, rather than in the modern political sense): old money good, new money bad; weak and corruptible modern democracy vs patrician noblesse oblige (not just the Kingsmen themselves, but for instance the Swedish royal horror at Valentine's proposal where the PM jumps at it); old-fashioned values (manners, presentation, etc.) promoted; even Eggsy himself, while from a rough background is fundamentally selected for consideration by the Kingsmen because of who his father was. It does take a swipe at overt snobbery, but seems to accept and even encourage implicit snobbery ("deserving vs undeserving poor", etc.)

I think that Arthur being a traitor and Eggsy being the hero even after he was rejected for not being an amoral psychopath not being up to their explicitly old-fashioned standards rather averted that message and reinforced the "Manners maketh the man" message Galahad had put out, that it doesn't really matter where you come from nearly so much as what you do with yourself in life.


More of a problem I think was the tonal dissonance in the final act, with the whiz-bang enjoyable action heroics in Valentine's lair contrasting badly with the played-straight drama of Eggsy's family and the threat to the baby. And much moreso than that, the note on which the film ended, with "woman as reward" played straight and in such a crude and laddish way that it kind of soured the whole experience. Which was a real shame, as they'd done a good job of avoiding that with the Eggsy-Roxy relationship. Cut out that one line, I think, and the final couple of shots, and the film would improve immeasurably.

I didn't really see a tonal dissonance between the drama of Eggsy's family and the rest of the ending's fight scenes. I saw it more as helping establish the ending scene as Serious Business after the villain overcame the temporary setback of the good guys 'lighting the fireworks', that while it may be fun for us, it's nonetheless deadly serious for Eggsy and his compatriots.

The ending with the princess, however, I'm afraid I have to agree with you on that completely. When a character is introduced solely for the purpose of, er, the hero's reward, calling it a misstep is charitable at best. It was really crudely done, too, with none of the classic Bond charm. It didn't kill the movie for me, but a tidge more editing could really class it up and end the movie on a better note.

[Pex]

As a personal disappointment, we don't see the aftermath. How does the world react when they learn the environmentalists, celebrities, wealthy snobs, and world leaders wanted to kill them all but now have their heads blown off? Some reaction scenes of the riots ending more than just the respite when Valentine was momentarily stopped would have been nice as well. It needn't be known the Kingsmen saved the world, but it would have been better use of the Princess to have broadcast the truth instead of what she actually did. For humor they could even have shown a real riot as people tore down the Hollywood sign or destroy a movie studio. A newspaper headline reads Congress impeaches the President in abstentia. The United Kingdom disbands the Monarchy.

[Cheesegear]

I also appreciate that the movie didn't insult it's audience by directly spelling out the fact that 'Eggsy' probably has something to do with 'Excalibur', as Eggsy's real name is Gary Unwin, which doesn't even remotely lend itself to the nickname.

[Solaris]

As a personal disappointment, we don't see the aftermath. How does the world react when they learn the environmentalists, celebrities, wealthy snobs, and world leaders wanted to kill them all but now have their heads blown off? Some reaction scenes of the riots ending more than just the respite when Valentine was momentarily stopped would have been nice as well. It needn't be known the Kingsmen saved the world, but it would have been better use of the Princess to have broadcast the truth instead of what she actually did. For humor they could even have shown a real riot as people tore down the Hollywood sign or destroy a movie studio. A newspaper headline reads Congress impeaches the President in abstentia. The United Kingdom disbands the Monarchy.

It didn't even occur to me, but you're right; they could've definitely shown the aftermath with shots interspersed with the credits.

[huttj509]

I also appreciate that the movie didn't insult it's audience by directly spelling out the fact that 'Eggsy' probably has something to do with 'Excalibur', as Eggsy's real name is Gary Unwin, which doesn't even remotely lend itself to the nickname.

I assumed the nickname was based on the actor Taron Egerton. Though now that I type it out that sounds like a silly explanation.

[Flickerdart]

I also appreciate that the movie didn't insult it's audience by directly spelling out the fact that 'Eggsy' probably has something to do with 'Excalibur', as Eggsy's real name is Gary Unwin, which doesn't even remotely lend itself to the nickname.
I thought it was some of that rhyming slang nonsense the Brits are so fond of.

[BWR]

I thought it was some of that rhyming slang nonsense the Brits are so fond of.

I can't think what that would be. They do sometimes give eachother odd nicknames though. My sister once met a chap who went by Cuddles. She never found out why.

[thorgrim29]

Yeah, but his mother called him Eggsy when he was like 3 at the beginning

[Cheesegear]

I assumed the nickname was based on the actor Taron Egerton. Though now that I type it out that sounds like a silly explanation.


I thought it was some of that rhyming slang nonsense the Brits are so fond of.

So, in a movie which heavily references Arthurian myth, I'm the only one who connected 'Eggsy' to 'Excalibur'? :smallconfused:

[Flickerdart]

So, in a movie which heavily references Arthurian myth, I'm the only one who connected 'Eggsy' to 'Excalibur'? :smallconfused:
If by "heavily references" you mean "the Kingsmen agents are themed after Arthur's knights and also Merlin" then yes.

[Solaris]

So, in a movie which heavily references Arthurian myth, I'm the only one who connected 'Eggsy' to 'Excalibur'? :smallconfused:

Yeah, pretty much.
... Remember what you said about the intelligence of the audience?

[Anonymouswizard]

I can't think what that would be. They do sometimes give eachother odd nicknames though. My sister once met a chap who went by Cuddles. She never found out why.

My sister had a friend called toast, where nobody except for him could remember why the had the nickname because the story was so boring.

My brother had a friend called shoes who refused to reveal how he got the nickname for years.

But although we have a tendency to use someone's family name as a nickname, you'll get a more random one if it's already taken (one of my friends was called Boosh because many people knew his older brother, who was referred to with a derivative of their family name), so maybe Winny was already taken at school, or there was some egg related incident that stuck.

[Ceiling_Squid]

Was it intentional, or was it a tricky way to get past ratings certifications and/or censors?

The Final Sequence
When everyone's head explodes in centre-frame, we get pretty firework displays instead of ludicrous gibs.

If it was the movie's way of avoiding an R-rating, then well done.

It was definitely a stylistic choice, and to soften the blow of murdering world leaders.

I say this because, last I checked, it was still R-rated. Unless I imagined that.

Edit: Just double-checked. Definitely rated R, for various reasons.The marketing seemed almost PG-13, which made we want to avoid it. I'm glad I actually went to see it, because the trailer does the film no justice. Loved it.

[Pex]

With all the cussing Valentine does plus the Princess' derriere, an R rating should have been apparent. The fireworks I think were for a humorous effect, granted it's a plausible solution to avoid having to show gore.

[Cheesegear]

With all the cussing Valentine does plus the Princess' derriere, an R rating should have been apparent.

In Australia it's MA.