Build Idea: Half-Orc Dual Wielder

[Kirion]

I was inspired to make a new character after seeing this picture. (http://thecage.wdfiles.com/local--files/pc:dredok/Dredok01.jpg)

I've never played a character based on my screen name here, so I'll call him Kirion. I want him to be a half-orc and dual wielding. Nothing else is set in stone.

Fluff: Kirion was born from the union between an orc and elf. As a twist, this birth was out of love, and the parents are happy and healthy. Sure, they're outcasts of society and fend for themselves in the wilds where people either leave them alone or don't care, but for the most part it's not a tragic upbringing or anything. Not sure where to go from there.

Build:

This is a mostly level 1-10 build and should be viable at each level instead of saving up for epicness at levels 15+ or something. Maybe we'll get that high someday, but it's never happened yet.

I looked first at what ranger and rogue had to offer but I wasn't impressed. Maybe someone can convince me on that.

Anyway, so the build I'm thinking of is Fighter 5 / Barbarian 2 / X

Half-Orc focusing on STR + CON, with DEX being tertiary.

Fighter 5 should be effective at each level. Two Weapon Fighting, Second Wind, Action Surge. Champion Archetype gets Improved Critical which is made more effective by the half-orc racial Savage Attacks. I can take the Dual Wielder feat to upgrade my light weapons to longswords. Once I pick up Extra Attack it's off to Barbarian.

Barbarian 2 grants Rage 2/day, making me much tankier while adding +2 damage to each swing, very effective with dual wielding. Reckless Attack is on-demand advantage all the time, not only increasing the odds of hitting but also doubling the chances to crit, which benefits the racial.

What do you guys think?

[Garimeth]

I think it works for what you want, but so does ranger. I think Barbarian Half Orc DWer and I'm not imagining your pic, I'm imagining A. a beserker with two axes, or B. a cunning woodsman with 2 axes. So I imagine axes lol.

You're 5/2 build kind of sets it up so your character seems a little more civilized, but occasionally let's his orc heritage show through (with rage). I think its pretty fitting for the picture you linked.

Personally I'd RP him as cool and collected, but occasionally **** hits the fan and he just mercs somebody. Kind of like a somewhat refined mercenary leader or crime boss (as portayed in fiction anyway).

[Easy_Lee]

Looks pretty good. I'd prefer a great axe, but this build will have more consistent damage and better AC. You could swap the offhand for a finesse weapon of choice and pick up defensive duelist somewhere down the line for even more AC, which might work pretty well.

One thing I like about this concept is that it's very open to picking up magic weapons. If a random magic weapon shows up, there's a very good chance it's usable in one hand by a strength-based dual wielder. That lets you keep your options open.

[Kirion]

Personally I'd RP him as cool and collected, but occasionally **** hits the fan and he just mercs somebody. Kind of like a somewhat refined mercenary leader or crime boss (as portayed in fiction anyway).

That's what I'm going for. This dude fights with martial discipline from his elven mother, but when things get desperate he gives into his savage orc emotions and rages. Kind of like Drizz't with his battle trance(?).

[Person_Man]

Looks fine to me.

You might want to take a second look at Assassin Rogue, Rogue/Fighter, Rogue/Ranger. or Rogue/Barbarian. The first seven levels of Rogue are basically pure awesomeness, and works really well with two weapon fighting. In particular, Assassin basically gives you auto-criticals most combats (assuming you take the time to be stealthy), and TWF builds tend to have cruddy Opportunity Attacks (which Sneak Attack fixes, since can be triggered once per turn, and thus can be triggered on an Opportunity Attack).

Monk is also worth looking at, since it does a good job of approximating TWF, and is very mobile, sneaky, and great at imposing status conditions.

You might also want to look at Crossbow Expert + Sharpshooter. Crossbow Expert lets you make an attack with a crossbow as a Bonus Action, basically approximating TWF + Two Weapon Fighting Style, while allowing you to attack with your crossbow while adjacent without penalty. Sharpshooter can +10 damage per attack to this, and ignores most cover. This gives TWF builds some of the best damage potential in the game, though its not technically TWF.

[Easy_Lee]

Regarding what Person_man said, I would add that all damage dice associated with an attack are rolled twice on a critical. As he said, sneak attack works on opportunity attacks, and both fighters and rogues have many opportunities for extra OA feats like sentinel and mage slayer. All together, champion / rogue just might have the highest effective DPR in the game.

[Garimeth]

That's what I'm going for. This dude fights with martial discipline from his elven mother, but when things get desperate he gives into his savage orc emotions and rages. Kind of like Drizz't with his battle trance(?).

Nice! I'd echo what personman said about splashing rogue into your build, plus on a level 10 build that still let's you take three levels to pick up assassin and cunning action. Sounds like a fun character!

[Myzz]

for RP and decent 2 wpn fighting... as Person_Man and Easy said...

Assassin 3/Hunter 3/BattleMaster X

I'd go with Horde Breaker for free extra attack that does not interfere with bonus action, but requires a second target that has to be within 5 ft of the first... Situational but doable in most melee situations (except vs BBEGs after minions die, but you could go after minions while other focus on BBEG)


You'd have to have a 13 min Str and Dex, From stealth in the surprise round, you wreck shop and 2 targets that are within 5 ft of each other.

To utilize sneak attack you would have to use a Finesse weapon (but not necessarily with your dex, can still use it str based). Note Throwing Axes are thrown weapons not ranged or finesse (technically don't get sneak attack dice with em), but daggers are finesse.

Ranger fluff seems to mesh well with the background your giving your guy. Assassin could be more of a hunter stalker of prey fluff...

I think this build works best from range as an wood elf archer with a long bow... BUT it could still work... You'd need decent stats to start with since your not getting any ASI's till L10. BUT you can then quickly pick up any ASI's you want with 2 other classes at 3. Rogue to 5 or 6 isnt terrible after you get to 3/3/5.

[Easy_Lee]

I don't think you necessarily need to aim for highest DPR or anything. A barbarian / champion with longswords works quite well on its own. The Rogue variant works, but may not fit your concept as well.

[jkat718]

Let's switch it up here for a second, and take a look at the fluff. If Kirion grew up in the wilds, then he's probably looking at the Barbadian/Druid/Ranger trifecta, rather than the more civilized, formal-training style of the Fighter. Both Barb and Ranger have good melee, assuming Hunter archetype for the latter, but Barbarian does better overall (although either Colossus Slayer or How Breaker would be nice). Also, spellcasting isn't helpful towards your build, so let's stick with Barbarian for level 1.

Kirion's racial stat boosts suit the Barbie well, and he has good speed, Darkvision as per most races, and a bunch of other cool little things. It's interesting to note that, if you pick Intimidation as one of his class skills, then you can take one free skill of any kind, because of the overlapping race/background/class proficiencies rule.

For backgrounds, the obvious choice is Outlander. One of Kairon's parents (or both of them, if the elf was a wood elf) was definitely raised off of the land, so they would know how to support his family and then pass on their knowledge to him. Probably take "exile or outcast" for the Origin feature, or maybe hunter-gatherer, depending on how angsty you want to be.

Barbarian, as well as suiting your intended playstyle, nets you the largest HD you can get at level 1, when it gets maxed, which is always helpful. You also snag Rage (2/LR, +2), Unarmored Defense, and all of the combat proficiencies. Nice.

For level two, it probably depends on how you end up playing him and where the story takes you. If you want to stick with the 5/2 balance, then you should probably take the 2 Barb, then switch, but the TWF style is really important. Depending on how you want to go, I'd probably say that you could go Fighter for level 2 and maybe for level 3, to reflect the impact his more civilized companions have had on him, then take one more Barbarian to show that he's "going back to his roots." If you want a build that makes more sense, thematically, take both Barbarian first, then all of the Fighter.

At this point, you'll be level 7, and you said you probably won't be getting much higher than 10, so you only really need to consider the next 3 levels. Again, this part is really up to you and how you want to portray it, but my advice would be to multiclass into something else. Mechanically, the Fighter doesn't give you much past level 6, so you don't really need to take more than one extra level there. If you're still playing at that point, I'd suggest looking into either Rogue or maybe going back to the ol' Bar-Bar.

[Mandragola]

So for maximum half-orc damage you could do well as a fighter/rogue (assassin). The assassin rogue's auto crit ability works seriously well for a half-orc, thanks to the extra damage dice. As a fighter you get the fighting style you want and also either BM dice (doubled on crits) or champion (more crits the rest of the time).

Wouldn't hurt to have a level of barbarian. Not before rogue 3 fighter 5, in my opinion - if you're going fighter that is. Another good thing about fighter is getting the extra ASIs, since you do want the dual wield feat.

[Kirion]

Interesting options. I'm sticking with half-orc melee dual wielder, but any class will do.

I'll do some quick math on these options because I'm bored:

I assume starting with 15 STR/DEX/CON and 8's in the rest is universal for each build.

Assassin 5:
5d8 HP, light armor, Expertise, Cunning Action (overlaps with offhand attack), Uncanny Dodge, +1 STR +1 DEX

Assassinate (requires attacking surprised target or going before target has acted in combat)
3d8+4 (17.5) main hand + 3d6 (10.5) offhand + 6d6 (21) SA = 49 holy moly

Regular SA
1d8+4 (8.5) main hand + 1d6 (3.5) offhand + 3d6 (10.5) SA = 22.5

Powerful secondary melee, big situational burst, good at at skills.


Fighter 5:
5d10 HP, all armor, fighting style, second wind, action surge, improved critical, extra attack, +1 STR +1 DEX

Regular
2d8+8 (17) main hand + 1d6+4 (7.5) off hand= 24.5

Action Surge (once per short rest)
4d8+16 (34) main hand + 1d6+4 (7.5) off hand= 41.5

Unsure how to factor in improved critical.

Less options, tankier, more consistent damage but less burst.

Assassin 3 / Hunter 2:
3d8+2d10 HP, medium armor, fighting style, favored enemy, natural explorer, level 1 spells, primeval awareness, expertise, SA, cunning action, assassinate

No ability bump, needs WIS 13.

Assassinate (requires attacking surprised target or going before target has acted in combat)
3d8+3 (16.5) main hand + 3d6+3 (13.5) offhand + 4d6 (14) SA = 44

Regular SA
1d8+3 (7.5) main hand + 1d6+3 (6.5) offhand + 2d6 (7) SA = 21

Less damage than straight rogue but a little tankier and a little more variety. I wanted to consider the 2 spells of Hunter's Mark but it eats up a bonus action too so I don't see it being that useful.

Assassin 3 / Fighter 2
3d8 + 2d10, medium armor, expertise, SA 2d6, cunning action, assassinate, action surge, second wind, two weapon fighting

Action Surge Assassinate (the best kind of assassination!)
6d8+6 (33) main hand + 3d6+3 (13.5) offhand + 4d6 (14) SA = 60.5 whaaaat

Assassinate
3d8+3 (16.5) main hand + 3d6+3 (13.5) offhand + 4d6 (14) SA = 44

Regular SA
1d8+3 (7.5) main hand + 1d6+3 (6.5) offhand + 2d6 (7) SA = 21

Action Surge Assassinate.. my god.

And a snapshot of level 7:

Assassin 7:
7d8, light armor, expertise x2, SA 4d6, cunning action, assassinate, +1 STR / +1 DEX, uncanny dodge, evasion

Assassinate (requires attacking surprised target or going before target has acted in combat)
3d8+4 (17.5) main hand + 3d6 (10.5) offhand + 8d6 (28) SA = 56

Regular SA
1d8+4 (8.5) main hand + 1d6 (3.5) offhand + 4d6 (14) SA = 26

Continues to be strong secondary melee with good skills.

Fighter 5 / Barbarian 2:
5d10+2d12 HP, all armor, fighting style, second wind, action surge, improved critical, extra attack, +1 STR +1 DEX, rage, unarmored defense, reckless attack, danger sense

Raging Reckless Action Surge (once per short rest)
4d8+24 (42) main hand + 1d6+6 (9.5) off hand= 51.5

Raging Reckless (2/long rest)
2d8+12 (21) main hand + 1d6+6 (9.5.) off hand= 30.5

Regular Reckless
2d8+8 (17) main hand + 1d6+4 (7.5) off hand= 24.5

Unsure how to factor in improved critical or on-demand combat advantage (double critical chance, higher chance to hit).

Tanky, high burst but limited, front lines.

Assassin 3 / Champion 4:
3d8 + 4d10, medium armor, expertise, SA 2d6, cunning action, assassinate, action surge, second wind, two weapon fighting, improved critical, +1 STR / +1 DEX

Action Surge Assassinate
6d8+8 (35) main hand + 3d6+4 (14.5) offhand + 4d6 (14) SA = 63.5

Assassinate
3d8+4 (17.5) main hand + 3d6+4 (14.5) offhand + 4d6 (14) SA = 46

Regular SA
1d8+4 (8.5) main hand + 1d6+3 (7.5) offhand + 2d6 (7) SA = 23

Tanky but with big burst.


And level 11 for fun:

Assassin 11
11d8, light armor, expertise x2, SA 6d6, cunning action, assassinate, +3 STR / +1 DEX, Alert feat (or Dual Wielder feat, or another +2 DEX), uncanny dodge, evasion, reliable talent (min 23 initiative!)

Assassinate (very reliable at this point)
3d8+5 (18.5) main hand + 3d6 (10.5) offhand + 12d6 (42) SA = 71

Regular SA
1d8+5 (9.5) main hand + 1d6 (3.5) offhand + 6d6 (21) SA = 34

Assassinate is going to consistently deal massive damage in the first round. Gets even better at skills / support.

Fighter 11
11d10 HP, full plate armor, fighting style, second wind, action surge, improved critical, extra attack x2, +3 STR +3 CON, indomitable will, remarkable athlete, defense

Action Surge (once per short rest)
6d8+30 (57) main hand + 1d6+5 (8.5) off hand= 65.5

Regular
3d8+15 (28.5) main hand + 1d6+5 (8.5) off hand= 37

Very tanky, consistent.

Assassin 3 / Champion 6 / Barbarian 2
3d8 + 6d10 +2d12, medium armor, expertise, SA 2d6, cunning action, assassinate, action surge, second wind, two weapon fighting, improved critical, +3 STR / +1 DEX, rage 2/day, unarmored defense, reckless attack, danger sense

Action Surge Assassinate
12d8+20 (74) main hand + 3d6+5 (15.5) offhand + 4d6 (14) SA = 103.5 uhhhh

Assassinate
6d8+10 (37) main hand + 3d6+5 (15.5) offhand + 4d6 (14) SA = 66.5

Reckless Raging SA
2d8+14 (23) main hand + 3d6+7 (17.5) offhand + 4d6 (14) SA = 54.5

Reckless SA
2d8+10 (19) main hand + 1d6+5 (8.5) offhand + 2d6 (7) SA = 34.5

Tanky, reckless attack offers on-demand SA and higher crit chance. Huge burst, interesting resource management, varied fighting. Lower consistent damage.

[Garimeth]

Let's switch it up here for a second, and take a look at the fluff. If Kirion grew up in the wilds, then he's probably looking at the Barbadian/Druid/Ranger trifecta, rather than the more civilized, formal-training style of the Fighter. Both Barb and Ranger have good melee, assuming Hunter archetype for the latter, but Barbarian does better overall (although either Colossus Slayer or How Breaker would be nice). Also, spellcasting isn't helpful towards your build, so let's stick with Barbarian for level 1.

Kirion's racial stat boosts suit the Barbie well, and he has good speed, Darkvision as per most races, and a bunch of other cool little things. It's interesting to note that, if you pick Intimidation as one of his class skills, then you can take one free skill of any kind, because of the overlapping race/background/class proficiencies rule.

For backgrounds, the obvious choice is Outlander. One of Kairon's parents (or both of them, if the elf was a wood elf) was definitely raised off of the land, so they would know how to support his family and then pass on their knowledge to him. Probably take "exile or outcast" for the Origin feature, or maybe hunter-gatherer, depending on how angsty you want to be.

Barbarian, as well as suiting your intended playstyle, nets you the largest HD you can get at level 1, when it gets maxed, which is always helpful. You also snag Rage (2/LR, +2), Unarmored Defense, and all of the combat proficiencies. Nice.

For level two, it probably depends on how you end up playing him and where the story takes you. If you want to stick with the 5/2 balance, then you should probably take the 2 Barb, then switch, but the TWF style is really important. Depending on how you want to go, I'd probably say that you could go Fighter for level 2 and maybe for level 3, to reflect the impact his more civilized companions have had on him, then take one more Barbarian to show that he's "going back to his roots." If you want a build that makes more sense, thematically, take both Barbarian first, then all of the Fighter.

At this point, you'll be level 7, and you said you probably won't be getting much higher than 10, so you only really need to consider the next 3 levels. Again, this part is really up to you and how you want to portray it, but my advice would be to multiclass into something else. Mechanically, the Fighter doesn't give you much past level 6, so you don't really need to take more than one extra level there. If you're still playing at that point, I'd suggest looking into either Rogue or maybe going back to the ol' Bar-Bar.

I'd agree with this actually. Fluff-wise if you want to start with fighter, make his background that he left home young, learned to fight (in the city/on campaign/mercenary work/whatever.)

I think for level 10 I'd end up 5 ftr/2 barb/ 3 assassin. Alternatively if there is a rogue in your party then just take your other levels in barbarian.

[Kirion]

I think I'll go some mix of Assassin / Fighter with a dash of Barbarian for the orc rage. I love the fluff and I think managing finite resources will keep things interesting.

How I start the build will depend on party makeup. I'd prefer starting Rogue, but if I'm the only melee I could start Barbarian 2 since Reckless Attacks gives me access to Sneak Attack always, but then I miss out on Dexterity proficiency which makes Assassinate worse. I'll edit the background so whatever starting class makes sense (wilderness = barbarian, adventurer = fighter, repentant criminal = assassin).

[Person_Man]

I think I'll go some mix of Assassin / Fighter with a dash of Barbarian for the orc rage. I love the fluff and I think managing finite resources will keep things interesting.

How I start the build will depend on party makeup. I'd prefer starting Rogue, but if I'm the only melee I could start Barbarian 2 since Reckless Attacks gives me access to Sneak Attack always, but then I miss out on Dexterity proficiency which makes Assassinate worse. I'll edit the background so whatever starting class makes sense (wilderness = barbarian, adventurer = fighter, repentant criminal = assassin).

Sounds fine. Just note that Sneak Attack is ridiculously easy to trigger in 5E. Even if you're the only melee oriented character, you're likely to get Advantage on the first round of combat (if you're surprising/ambushing enemies or just acting first), and every round some enemy is likely to be within 5 feet of one of your allies, even if its just a Familiar or Mount or whatever. Even if your allies are avoiding melee, the enemies themselves are likely to move close to your allies, because battlefield control barely exists in 5E, and you're not a tank/controller build.

Though if you are the only melee oriented player, you might want to consider a tank/controller build. Maybe consider Sentinel or Polearm Master. Or in an ideal world, you could convince another player to be a Druid that acts as your mount, and then you take Mounted Combat and they take Sentinel.