A collaborative effort: A class of the beyond of the great beyond.

[Xuldarinar]

I want to make a class. This time, however, I'd like it to begin and end as a calibration. What ever class results will be up to those that contribute, rather than to an individual's decisions. Hopefully, this will get past just one post but if this is doomed to sink then it shall find the bottom soon enough. Just to get things going, I have a single thematic element to start from. What takes shape from this, we shall see.


I have noticed various references scattered about in reference to a beyond for the great beyond. Those that look either find vast expanses of nothingness, do not return, or return changed. One such example of things returning are devourers. Zon-kuthon even ventured out, and returned in the state he is in now. Furthermore, qlippoth may hail from an unknowable realm that is described as the "outside shell" of the outer sphere. So, from what we can extrapolate, lets develop a class that somehow interacts with this beyond. They might be intrinsically be tied to it or have found a means to draw upon it.




MARKED


Alignment: Any.
Hit Dice: d?.

Class Skills
The marked's class skills are- .
Skill Ranks per Level: ? + Int modifier.




Saves


Level Base Attack Bonus Fort Save Ref Save Will Save Special
1st +? +? +? +? Reservoir of the Mark
2nd +? +? +? +?
3rd +? +? +? +?
4th +? +? +? +?
5th +? +? +? +?
6th +? +? +? +? Phantasmal Killer
7th +? +? +? +?
8th +? +? +? +?
9th +? +? +? +?
10th +? +? +? +? Beyond Morality
11th +? +? +? +?
12th +? +? +? +?
13th +? +? +? +?
14th +? +? +? +?
15th +? +? +? +?
16th +? +? +? +? Weird
17th +? +? +? +?
18th +? +? +? +?
19th +? +? +? +?
20th +? +? +? +? Beyond Definition


Class Features
All of the following are class features of the marked class.
-Weapon and Armor Proficiencies:
-Reservoir of the Mark (Su): Marked possess a reservoir of nonexistent energies that he can draw upon to fuel his various powers. This reservoir has a number of points equal to his marked level - his Wisdom modifier, to a minimum of 1.
-Phantasmal Killer (Sp): At 6th level... The save DC for this spell-like ability is 10 + 1/2 the ???'s level - the Marked's Wisdom Modifier.
-Beyond Morality:
-Weird (Sp): At 16th level...
-Beyond Definition (Su): Upon achieving 20th level, a marked loses his creature type. They are no longer effected by abilities dependent upon type.

[Almarck]

I am game though my ability to work on it today aside from one liners is compromised.

I place this post here to reserve a spot. I quite like things from outside reality.

[dragonjek]

Something in the dark spaces between the planes broke Zon-kuthon. It is possible that his obsession with torture comes from his experience with it (rather similarly to a kyton, really), so having pain-based abilities would fit. Fear and forbidden knowledge would also be thematically appropriate.

Horrific physical distortions. If the qlippoth are from these dark spaces, then whatever is out there like shares the same trait of "being utterly dissimilar to humanoids". Devourers are described as having an alien mindset--the ability to switch their thoughts into unnatural patterns could be good.

Because it is so alien and strange, having some abilities letting you ignore or twist some laws of physics would suit the idea. Being so different that they interact with spells strangely would work. And because the gods won't speak about the beyond-beyond at all, perhaps an anti-divine magic feature?

Some people just encounter a great void, so oblivion and nonexistence powers fit.

The ability to influence minds, of course. Force someone to behave differently than normal, change their interests, twist into different personalities, etc.

[Almarck]

How about... total removal from the morality spectrum. I'm essence you are no longer good evil lawful chaotic... or lacking in these traits. You register on any detect good evol or whatever spells, and magic circles fail.Any effect that determined by morale codes or ethics is beyond you and you likewise cannot enter or advance in any classes that involve morale restrictions... or exclusions. So no paladin, monk, druid or barbarian.


In short mechanically representing the blue and orange morality that comes with the notion of being alien and otherworldly. Once you get high enough level, you probably can start writing Not Available as your alignment

oh and I feel the obligatory need to warp physics into spaghetti would be good. Not sure on how to accomplish that late in the game with ought breaking it.

[Xuldarinar]

Great ideas thus far. Later today I'll get to work with applying them, atleast for flavor text, and supplying my own ideas. The more contribution before and even after that point, the better. Im glad there is some interest on this project.

[IZ42]

You might also want to include some immunities from the aberration and outsider types, such as precision damage immunity, some energy immunity, poison/disease immunity, eventually displacement. These should be gained over the course of the levels. You might also consider frightful presence as a thing, as well as getting SLAs of Phantasmal Killer and Weird, etc.

[Xuldarinar]

Alright. So thus far we have suggested:

Various Immunities.
Two established spell-like abilities (Phantasmal Killer and Weird)
An at present non-specific ability or set of abilities that augment reality.
Exclusion from the alignment system.



Things to address:

When do they acquire their SLAs? How frequently can they use them?

Should their immunities start as resistances? At what rate should they build? What should the full range of immunities be? Should there be any choice on the part of the character?

What should the class be named? Save progressions? BaB progression?


Idea:
Work out a system under which Wisdom Penalty work as an increasing bonus for their abilities. This is unconventional, but the class and the source of its power is also unconventional. Given that "Wisdom describes a character's willpower, common sense, awareness, and intuition.", it makes sense to me that the less one of this possesses the more easily they may be able to wield powers from "beyond the great beyond".

[Almarck]

Well there's a class that runs entirely by dealing Con burn to itself so it's not unprecedented.

[IZ42]

I usually give SLAs to classes one level before a wizard would gain them. Since Phantasmal Killer is a 4th level spell, and Weird a 9th, they maybe should gain them at 6th and 16th level respectively? Also, have the Phantasmal Killer transform into Weird at the specified level.

[Xuldarinar]

Though among the least important things, I think a name would do well at this step.

What to call a class that deals in that which is beyond? Separates themselves from reality as their powers grow, becoming more and less than they were before with each step.


There is, of course, a lot to add beyond that and we should come up with things for that, but a name would help in discussion, in filling things out for the class itself, and possibly giving an additional vector to work from.

[Almarck]

How about.... Herald?

[IZ42]

Herald sounds like a bard:smalltongue:. Disciple of the Void maybe?

[Xuldarinar]

How about.... Herald?


Herald sounds like a bard:smalltongue:. Disciple of the Void maybe?




Both are decent suggestions.


Herald... I feel something needs tacked on for it.
Disciple of the Void is a good name, but given the void has already been ascribed to other things within pathfinder, perhaps a different thing at the end of it would do.


A name that implies or references nothingness, beyond, or the betrayal/renouncement of reality would be good.

Planar Apostate?

[Almarck]

Apostate sounds okay but I keep thinking mage whenever I hear it. Is what we're going to do be magic? I also do not quite feel specifying Planar as part of the name. It's too setting specific, not all games have planes.

Hm I feel disciple and Herald probably hint at a higher power controlling things. Let's ditch that for a moment, go with what a lone mad man who had glimpsed the darkness would be.

....Marked? Wanderer? Empty? Outsider

[Xuldarinar]

Apostate sounds okay but I keep thinking mage whenever I hear it. Is what we're going to do be magic? I also do not quite feel specifying Planar as part of the name. It's too setting specific, not all games have planes.

Hm I feel disciple and Herald probably hint at a higher power controlling things. Let's ditch that for a moment, go with what a lone mad man who had glimpsed the darkness would be.

....Marked? Wanderer? Empty? Outsider


I favor marked of those. It presents something to center things around, perhaps a physical mark. Perhaps this class is an affliction typically, whether by birth or their own actions, its practitioners delving deeper into things.


As far as magic, I don't know. I wouldn't say arcane, nor divine. Not shadow magic either, as much as I enjoy it. Psionics maybe but... still that doesn't seem entirely right. Perhaps we could make a non-vancian "spellcasting" system for this class, their effects being either uniquely tailored or use existing spells but their 'spell's have a set of rules for interaction.



Edit:

Idea for a concept to work from.


Whether that place beyond the great beyond reached out and touched them, are they are one who looked and were fortunate to survive but saw something beyond imagining, marked are individuals that are forever tied to this non-place. Their name coming from a strange marking that is found somewhere on their body, a strange shape filled with absence, like a tear in the very fabric of reality. As they advance the mark grows, their abilities becoming stronger and they themselves becoming more and more detached from all that is known. In time they grow beyond morality itself (Alignment: NA), and towards the height of their power they become beyond definition (Type: NA). Abilities that would easily fell most mortals are in time ignored as they are used against these beings, and in return they can call upon powers that, while they may not be more powerful than what can be called by spellcasters, are indeed beyond comprehension. Twisting the fabric of reality, and drawing in things that do not exist. It is believed, in time, such beings will be consumed by their mark, parting from reality. Whether this means their influence remains though is as of yet unknown.