Forge World and 40k?

[Brookshw]

I've been away from 40k tabletop since before the Tau and Necrons were a gleam in a developers eye and have recently turned back to it, albeit because I wanted to get back into painting minatures. Now I'm confused though. I see Forge World minatures and GW 40k figures and have to ask, are these actually separate games or does Forge World just create alternative models? If they are the same anyone know how this came about?

[Closet_Skeleton]

Forge World and Citadel both make figures for a variety of games, but 40k is one of them.

Forge World makes stuff out of resin, Citadel makes stuff out of plastic and a different kind of resin and used to make stuff out of metal but stopped 4-5 or so years ago. Some Forge World kits are actually conversion kits for plastic Citadel tanks and figures, just to confuse things. Some Forge World models were later made into plastic citadel kits like the Tyranid Trigon and some of the planes.

Forge World was set up as a specialist company to make terrain for Warhammer 40k and Fantasy along with planes and tanks. Since only the tanks sold that well they stopped making fantasy stuff for years, but started again a few years ago with a subbrand called Warhammer Forge. A year or so later they brought out a Horus Heresy range that's a subtype of 40k. They also made a few figures for some non-supported old GW games like Epic which they may have stopped selling now.

In theory Forge World stuff just isn't balanced as well as the proper 40k rules, but this is Warhammer 40k so balance is a joke anyway.

[Drasius]

Forgeworld makes;

- alternate models for 40k (land raiders, extra armour versions of rhino tanks, alternate Lema Russ Designs, las/plas razorback turret etc)
- big toys for apocolypse (Tyranid Biotitans, Imperial warhound/reaver, Tigersharks etc) though these can now be used in "normal" 40k, many opponents won't take kindly to facing a warhound at 1500 without prior warning.
- models which have their own rules written by forgeworld (usually found in the imperial armour books) which are compatible with 40k, some places will not allow these to be used (Y'Vahra, XV-9, death corps of krieg assault/artillery brigades, lightning, decimator, blood slaughterer etc)
- models intended for use in forgeworlds horus heresy that's often refered to as 30k (Sicaran, typhon, fellblade, solar auxilia, mechanicum etc). Can be used in "normal" 40k, though expect it to be unblanced as 30k is intended to be used against other 30k.

As to why forgeworld is a thing, IIRC they started by making the thunderhawks that were given away as prizes and the nerd envy from everyone who didn't get one made GW realise that much $ could be had by making the super large kits for apoc and charging australian prices for them. Then they figured out how to make horus heresy models a few years ago and have been printing money ever since.

[The Glyphstone]

Forge World is for people who think regular 40K models are too cheap and affordable.

[blacklight101]

Forge World is for people who think regular 40K models are too cheap and affordable.

And that the normal models don't have enough bubbles in the castings that require Green Stuff to fill.

[Wraith]

To add to what has already been said, Forgeworld don't make their own games, but they are currently the only providers of models for Warhammer 30,000, which use the normal 40k rules.

In the last few years, another subsidiary company of Games Workshop (called Black Library) have been publishing novels giving precise details of what happened in the Horus Heresy, and there was a big demand for "old fashioned" models from that era.
So, you can now use Forgeworld models to recreate the Space Marine Legions from the Heresy era, including the old style types of armour, weaponry and tanks using virtually the same rules as Warhammer 40,000 but with different Codices for each Legion, rather than the Chapters that you might familiar with.

[hamishspence]

And recently there's been rumors that GW will do their own "Heresy-era" rules and plastic models.

[GloatingSwine]

As to why forgeworld is a thing, IIRC they started by making the thunderhawks that were given away as prizes and the nerd envy from everyone who didn't get one made GW realise that much $ could be had by making the super large kits for apoc and charging australian prices for them. Then they figured out how to make horus heresy models a few years ago and have been printing money ever since.

I remember a tale of the first Thunderhawk model. When it had been made it turned out to be so heavy that it literally would not stay together, the wings would perpetually fall off on their own so when the studio guys went up to Forge World to photograph it they were there for hours supporting, gluing, waiting for it to set, and then having the wings fall off before they could actually get a picture.

In the end they managed to get it to stay in one piece for just long enough, but literally as soon as they'd taken the picture the model displayed arch comic timing by the wings falling off within seconds of the photo flash.

Forge World is a thing because GW wanted a subsidiary to handle the short run stuff that isn't economical to turn out at their main factory site which is set up for the large runs or to stock in their store chain.

[Eldan]

Forge World is for people who think regular 40K models are too cheap and affordable.

The way prices are going... there's now Forge World models that are cheaper than the normal GW plastic ones by quite a bit. I mean, there's monsters on Forgeworld, quite big ones, that I can get for 70-80 CHF with shipping and taxes. At the normal store, I play 90-100 for a plastic monster.

[Brookshw]

Huh, well will wonders never cease. Thanks for the explanations all.


Forge World is for people who think regular 40K models are too cheap and affordable.
That sounds like heresy brother. Speaking of which I guess they've decided blister packs are now heresy :smallconfused:

@Eldan, thanks for mentioning that, I'll bear in mind to cross check prices. I am noting that Amazon seems to be generally 20% cheaper than my local shop.

Actually that makes me wonder, are they doing completely new model lines now that they're doing this dark vengeance 7th edition thing?

[Squark]

Huh, well will wonders never cease. Thanks for the explanations all.


That sounds like heresy brother. Speaking of which I guess they've decided blister packs are now heresy :smallconfused:

@Eldan, thanks for mentioning that, I'll bear in mind to cross check prices. I am noting that Amazon seems to be generally 20% cheaper than my local shop.

Actually that makes me wonder, are they doing completely new model lines now that they're doing this dark vengeance 7th edition thing?

I'm not sure I understand the question. A lot of old kits have been retired and replaced to keep up with the details and quality of newer kits (The old tactical squad box had a lot more static poses and less wargear than the new kit), but you can still use old models (You might need to re-base terminators if they're on normal infantry-sized bases, though).

If you're referring to the snap-fit assembly of Dark Vengeance, that's mostly a starter set thing, although they seem to have begun releasing similar assemblies for independent characters due to the negative response "Finecast" resin got.

[Brookshw]

I'm not sure I understand the question. A lot of old kits have been retired and replaced to keep up with the details and quality of newer kits (The old tactical squad box had a lot more static poses and less wargear than the new kit), but you can still use old models (You might need to re-base terminators if they're on normal infantry-sized bases, though).

If you're referring to the snap-fit assembly of Dark Vengeance, that's mostly a starter set thing, although they seem to have begun releasing similar assemblies for independent characters due to the negative response "Finecast" resin got.


Ah, hopefully I can clarify. Do you know if we'll be seeing new higher quality lines released by GW in the near-ish future? Basically, what I'm seeing is that the quality of a base set now is much higher than it used to be and I'm unsure if its worth investing in models to paint now, or if even more improved versions are expected which would surpass the current? Or something like that.

[Squark]

Ah, hopefully I can clarify. Do you know if we'll be seeing new higher quality lines released by GW in the near-ish future? Basically, what I'm seeing is that the quality of a base set now is much higher than it used to be and I'm unsure if its worth investing in models to paint now, or if even more improved versions are expected which would surpass the current? Or something like that.

Oh, I see. Depends a lot on what you play. Armies that have seen recent releases are probably not going to be getting updated models any time soon. But even if the kit gets updated, the old version is still legal.

Off the top of my head, the kits that are really showing their age are the guardsman infantry, Chaos Space Marines infantry, and maybe some of the eldar stuff. Vehicles are in a pretty good place, as are loyalist marines, demons, tyranids, and for the most part Tau and Dark Eldar.

[Brookshw]

Oh, I see. Depends a lot on what you play. Armies that have seen recent releases are probably not going to be getting updated models any time soon. But even if the kit gets updated, the old version is still legal.

Off the top of my head, the kits that are really showing their age are the guardsman infantry, Chaos Space Marines infantry, and maybe some of the eldar stuff. Vehicles are in a pretty good place, as are loyalist marines, demons, tyranids, and for the most part Tau and Dark Eldar.

I see, thanks! That's pretty helpful.

The Eldar haven't really changed much huh, they're still, well, giant bananas.

[Eldan]

@Eldan, thanks for mentioning that, I'll bear in mind to cross check prices. I am noting that Amazon seems to be generally 20% cheaper than my local shop.

Actually that makes me wonder, are they doing completely new model lines now that they're doing this dark vengeance 7th edition thing?

Dark Vengeance thing? That was just a starter box. Nah, the new thing is supplements. You get small mini-codexes, basically, with just a handful of units inside. Harlequins is the newest, then we have Crimson Slaughter and various marines and probably a few more.

Cross-checking isn't necessarily that useful, because FW does entirely different models form the one in the core range. They do a few tank variants, but mostly, they do big stuff that isn't really used in normal games and doesn't have rules in the normal codices, only in their own forgeworld books.

Eldar have the problem that their basic infantry hasn't been updated in ages. They got plastic wraithguard, which was a godsend, though. Few new tanks, a flier, a sort of mini-titan in plastic, a few heroes and now harlequin. But a lot of the basic infantry like aspect warriors still looks pretty stiff, even if they were updated. New rangers are nice.

[Drasius]

Oh, I see. Depends a lot on what you play. Armies that have seen recent releases are probably not going to be getting updated models any time soon. But even if the kit gets updated, the old version is still legal.

Off the top of my head, the kits that are really showing their age are the guardsman infantry, Chaos Space Marines infantry, and maybe some of the eldar stuff. Vehicles are in a pretty good place, as are loyalist marines, demons, tyranids, and for the most part Tau and Dark Eldar.

Lots of rumours about all 4 greater daemons getting a new plastic release this year, and with the new plastic bloodthirster released today, for once in the last decade of rumours, it might actually happen.

[hamishspence]

I'm puzzled that they didn't bother to take the opportunity to include "Skarbrand bits" in that plastic bloodthirster kit.

[Killer Angel]

Forge World is for people who think regular 40K models are too cheap and affordable.

And it works also for WHF! :smalltongue:

[blacklight101]

I'm puzzled that they didn't bother to take the opportunity to include "Skarbrand bits" in that plastic bloodthirster kit.

Yeah, it is kind of odd. My friend was looking at expanding his chaos stuff and couldnt find any.

[hamishspence]

Yeah, it is kind of odd. My friend was looking at expanding his chaos stuff and couldnt find any.

I could see the plastic model being easier than the Finecast/Metal one to convert into him though.

[Grim Portent]

I could see the plastic model being easier than the Finecast/Metal one to convert into him though.

The plastic model is also 300% more badass than the old one. :smallbiggrin:

I definitely need to get one for my 40k daemons army.

I does seem to only have a one handed axe for it's left hand though, so Skarbrand conversions will need to scrounge/build a right arm with an axe for it.

[hamishspence]

Carefully removing the whip or bloodflail, and scratchbuilding an axe rather than a whole arm, would probably be best bet - especially if there's enough spare parts to cobble one together.

Leaving just the wings.

[Grim Portent]

Carefully removing the whip or bloodflail, and scratchbuilding an axe rather than a whole arm, would probably be best bet - especially if there's enough spare parts to cobble one together.

Leaving just the wings.

Hacking out the webbing from between the wings ribbing and patching it up with a bit of greenstuff could get the tattered wing look Skarbrand's supposed to have.

[hamishspence]

Sounds like it would be better than trying to build or add new wings, at least.