Item balance: Two-handed sword +1att/+3dam or +att/+2dam crit 19+20

[Glarnog]

So while doing some OSR last night we came across a special sword. Now this was a side quest so only 3 characters out of party of 7ish were participating. And of the 3 (theif, life cleric, evoker) none have a dog in this fight.

So I'm just looking for some feed back for my DM so he can better make a decision. I certainly don't have the experience or rule and or game balance knowledge that a lot of you do. Which is stronger or too strong? +3 dam or +2 dam and the increased crit range? The DM wants to pick the weaker of the 2.

Because I know the DM is converting on the fly. I just mentioned that he may want to re think the crit property because besides the Champion's (strongest) core class ability there isn't much or anything to modify crit ranges in this game. So he decided to up the damage plus to 3.

Now besides me and the DM, all the players are fairly new to Dnd and rpgs. As in have just started with the starter set and the first few encounters of HotDQ. None really seem to be optimizers or anything. The rest of the extended party is a BBN, EK, Ranger, and brand brand new Bard.

thanks

[Demonic Spoon]

A greatsword crit, assuming no half-orc, barbarian, or GWF style, does average 7 extra damage.

The value of this depends on the opponent's AC and your attack bonus. If you hit on a 2 for some reason, the extra crit only occurs just over 5.3% of your time, so your actual average damage increase is only .05*7 = .35 damage per hit.

If you only hit on a 19 or 20, on the other hand (target has really high AC), then half of your attacks get an extra 7 damage -> it's worth 3.5 extra damage.

Assuming a vaguely average case where you hit on a 10, you get 7 extra damage on 1/10 of your swings -> 0.7 extra damage per hit, which is lower than the +1 damage/hit in your alternative.

Note that there are a ton of ways that it can be made more powerful. GWF style will disproportionately benefit critical hits, barbarians/half-orcs get extra critical dice. Paladins and rogues get to roll their extra smite/sneak attack dice again on a crit. Advantage will make critical hits disproportionately likely, making the increase crit range better (likewise, disadvantage will make increased crit range relatively worse). Your barbarian could use reckless attack to gain advantage constantly, by the way.

I'd say, on the whole, if you have someone who can really take advantage of it, increased crit range is better. Worst case scenario where you don't really have anyone who can take advantage of it, it's either about the same or very slightly worse.

[Mr.Moron]

It's variable. Depends on how many and how often the character in question can apply bonus dice to their attacks. Overall +1 damage is probably going to get you better average damage per round, but that is an awful metric to go by almost meaningless.

Critical cause damage spikes and greatly raise the maximum damage ceiling of an attack. Big Crits are far more likely to drastically change the fight they occur in and if loaded down with a smite or a sneak attack can possibly change the course of a campaign at the right moment. That's something a +1 to damage isn't going to do, and if it does it won't be immediately obvious from the players seat.

[Tenmujiin]

I would suggest the increased crit range, as others are saying, it's generally a smaller boost than +1 but can be stronger if the player/charcter invests resources. Crit range will also be enjoyed more by most players. I would probably reword it to being double weapon (only) dice on a roll of 19. So no auto hit, no doubling smite damage, maybe allow orcs and barbarians to benifit though and definately add that champions get the effect on a 18 or 17 instead (depending on their crit range).

[Strill]

For a Paladin, increased crit range is a big deal because you can smite after you've seen that a crit has already been rolled.

[Knaight]

The balance stuff has already been mostly covered. With that said, both options are kind of boring. It might help to have an idea of the original context of the sword, so that options with a bit more pizazz can be suggested in lieu of some flat bonuses. For instance, a conditional benefit of some sort can be a lot of fun. A sword where the primary bonus isn't use as a weapon (where it is instead vastly more effective at breaking objects or something) can be fun. Flat attack and damage bonuses are just kind of bland, and in a game with a rich legacy of interesting wondrous items that's a shame.

[mephnick]

Higher crit range is a major point of the champion class, it shouldn't be granted by any item, ever. The other option is fine.

Pluses are really boring. I hate that there are actually + weapons in the DMG.

I refluff them all to have more interesting bonuses. So a +2 sword in the DMG is now a regular magical sword with 2 cool properties.

This doesn't help you at all, I just like to rant when I get reminded that +weapons exist.

[Glarnog]

The champion is the main reason this thread exists. I wanted to warn the Dm. It is an item of some importance to a godlingess of executions, torture and flagellation. I think it's fluff is that of an executioners sword. It was a last minute side quest. An OSR he was kind of converting on the fly. I would probably suggest something like auto 3 death save fail when used against someone restrained. or something like that. Or crit range is only increased vs. prone opponents.

[mephnick]

I would probably suggest something like auto 3 death save fail when used against someone restrained. or something like that.

That's the kind of property I find interesting. Depends on if your DM uses death saves for enemies though.

[Knaight]

A sword of interest to a god of executions, torture, and flagellation? Now we're talking. Something fun could be introducing a strike which doesn't actually damage the target, but just makes them experience severe pain - giving them disadvantage on attacks next round. The death save mechanic listed could also work. If lawful executions are emphasized it could be a weapon that is normally your typical magic sword, but which gets a hefty bonus when used against wanted criminals (something like +1d6 damage). If it's an evil god, you could use a charge system, where the sword can be charged or uncharged, and if charged you can use it once to do a lot of extra damage. If uncharged you can charge it - by killing a helpless opponent.

[Glarnog]

I think... and only think that the godlingess is NE. I know she is very much opposed to Law and fairly certain she's not Chaotic. A reoccurring theme does seem to be that life is pain, death is release. And that no matter your station in life, death makes all equal in the end.

And with the exception of maybe named foes and or bosses, either only under rare circumstances does the DM do the death roll saves for them.

[Knaight]

I think... and only think that the godlingess is NE. I know she is very much opposed to Law and fairly certain she's not Chaotic. A reoccurring theme does seem to be that life is pain, death is release. And that no matter your station in life, death makes all equal in the end.

And with the exception of maybe named foes and or bosses, either only under rare circumstances does the DM do the death roll saves for them.

So I'm getting the sense that the deity in question has death as a major thing, beyond just executions, and that there's some aspect of the mighty falling to their philosophy. It's the "life is pain, death is release, death makes all equal" bit in a nutshell. That's another thing that can be worked with.

An option would be to have a sword which encourages death in general - including to its wielder. Maybe there's a bonus to damage, but also an increase to damage taken. Maybe it's even more tied to that, and the wielder can choose to hurt themselves to also hurt their opponents, with the idea that they can even take them down with them. A death throes effect would also be fun, though if the PCs have already acquired the sword it's not hugely likely to come up.

Another option would be to have the sword impede healing. Maybe it does some amount of damage, and also some amount of pseudodamage that has to be healed before the damage dealt can be. Maybe it also deals the gives the wielder some sort of disadvantage on healing (though the way healing tends to work makes using the actual disadvantage mechanic difficult).