How Useful Is Heroes' Feast?

[JNAProductions]

In this thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?402513-Paladin-Full-Spellcaster-multiclass-build), the Paladin's fearless aura versus Heroes' Feast came up as a point of (off-topic) debate.

So my question is this: To those with experience playing at higher levels, how valuable is Heroes' Feast? Do you have enough warning to use it when it's needed? Does it come in handy? Is it worth the 1000 gp and the spell slot?

[Giant2005]

I wouldn't even consider it if I had less than 12 people to feed but it is probably a touch expensive even with 12 people. 1000g /12 people is 83.333 gold each. That is almost 417 days wages for the average person and I'd have to be really, really hungry before I spent 417 days worth of wages on a feed, even a really good feed.

[JNAProductions]

Obviously you aren't from ancient Rome.

I guess the question is when is the 83-1000 gp per person worth it for a feast that good?

[Giant2005]

I guess the question is when is the 83-1000 gp per person worth it for a feast that good?

It would be worth it if it delayed the aging process.

[Grand Warchief]

Don't forget that unless you have a non multiclassed Paladin of level 18, that fear aura is only 10 feat. While hero's feast is dispelable, it isn't limited by range.

[pwykersotz]

Obviously you aren't from ancient Rome.

I guess the question is when is the 83-1000 gp per person worth it for a feast that good?

I suppose it depends. Using modern economy, I placed 1gp at $50. Keep in mind that while this is adjusted for 5e, I really should calculate it out from the ground up (which I have not yet done). In 3.5 I placed 1gp at about $62.50. Using the lower number, this turns 83gp into a four thousand dollar meal. Ordinarily this would be crazypants, but you're also getting some insane magical benefits. Cured of disease and poison. Tougher, more courageous, and wiser for a full day.

I'd pay for that, personally. Maybe once every five years. Keeping disease and sickness at bay and clearing lingering problems is enough, and it's better if you have an actual serious disease. That you get to do it with an hour of luxurious feasting is icing on the cake.

So yes, I'd say it's worth it. Expensive, only for the middle class and up if they save for it, but worth it.

Now from a mechanical perspective within game, maybe a little less so. Maybe most useful for a bard who only wanted to dip in certain buffs. A cleric certainly has lower level spells to provide the same exact benefits to single sources, and parties of 12 are not common. So situational at best from what I see.

[Grand Warchief]

I think it's invaluable if you know you're about to go into combat against an enemy with a fear aura. Certainly not for every day, but definitely worth it.

[Giant2005]

I placed 1gp at $50.
Where do you get that figure? That'd mean a laborer would be working for the equivalent of $10 a day - I doubt you could even convince an illegal immigrant to work for that.

[pwykersotz]

Where do you get that figure? That'd mean a laborer would be working for the equivalent of $10 a day - I doubt you could even convince an illegal immigrant to work for that.

From here (http://www.d20source.com/post/79192740102/what-is-one-gold-piece-worth#_=_) and here (http://www.d20source.com/post/79263011549/how-much-is-a-gold-piece-worth) initially. Then there were a few threads in the 3.5 forums about it. Much discussion was had. In the end, the majority of the thread ballparked it between $50-$100.

[JNAProductions]

To get back on topic and clarify a bit, I actually meant valuable as in useful to an adventuring party. Not cash value, though that is interesting.

[SharkForce]

immunity to poison is a game-changer in the right fight. not something to use randomly, but if you know you're going up against a green dragon and that it has many poison-themed minions to help, you'd want the spell. fear immunity alone isn't that awesome, but all the effects together make it a very very powerful buff.

(also, with the right caster selections, making money may not be that hard).

[Giant2005]

From here (http://www.d20source.com/post/79192740102/what-is-one-gold-piece-worth#_=_) and here (http://www.d20source.com/post/79263011549/how-much-is-a-gold-piece-worth) initially. Then there were a few threads in the 3.5 forums about it. Much discussion was had. In the end, the majority of the thread ballparked it between $50-$100.

The price of beer isn't a very good metric to use - not as good as the price of labor at least. Supply and demand influence the price of beer far too much whereas the price of labor has a minimum threshold of what is needed to survive.
Obviously the demand for beer is far lower in DnD considering a gallon costs an entire day's wages. People simply can't afford to binge drink like we can in modern society.

[pwykersotz]

The price of beer isn't a very good metric to use - not as good as the price of labor at least. Supply and demand influence the price of beer far too much whereas the price of labor has a minimum threshold of what is needed to survive.
Obviously the demand for beer is far lower in DnD considering a gallon costs an entire day's wages. People simply can't afford to binge drink like we can in modern society.

Then I welcome a thread with your calculations so we can discuss them. But my post was apparently off topic, so I'll end here.

[Chronos]

The figures I've seen put it at more like $100-$200 per GP, but yeah, that's the right order of magnitude. Also keep in mind that there's no exact conversion possible: A figure based on the price of a loaf of bread will only agree with a figure based on an hour of unskilled labor if unskilled laborers always earn the same number of loaves of bread per hour, and historically, that's been far from true. Likewise, for any other metric you might choose to use. At the end of the day, the best you can do is to put together a big basket of goods and services and average them all, and even then, someone can complain that you chose the wrong basket.

[hymer]

Do you have enough warning to use it when it's needed? Does it come in handy? Is it worth the 1000 gp and the spell slot?

My actual high level play experience is quite limited, I'll say that much. As for it being worth the spell slot, definitely - at least when you can cast it a day in advance, which makes it a free slot to spend. And it can well be worth it even without that. It's a multi-buff for 12 people sans concentration with powerful effects for 24 hours. Is it worth the gold? Well, what else are you spending gold on? Unless the players go out of their way to spend their money, it is my experience that it tends to build up - but that's for campaigns with no Magic Marts.

[jazzymantis]

immunity to poison is a game-changer in the right fight. not something to use randomly, but if you know you're going up against a green dragon and that it has many poison-themed minions to help, you'd want the spell. fear immunity alone isn't that awesome, but all the effects together make it a very very powerful buff.

(also, with the right caster selections, making money may not be that hard).

This is the right answer, pit fiends also are a perfect thing to use this for. They have a poisonous bite, fear aura, and know hold person-which has a wisdom saving throw.

It would also likely be useful in any fight with a Lich or other high level spellcaster. Wisdom saving throws are fairly prevalent.