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DurionArcanis
2015-03-11, 11:01 PM
Or maybe not.

I could use some help brainstorming a broken character. But before I explain the rules for the character, some context details, read if you wish.

This campaign started with two ideas... the Fearless Zeal feat in Pathfinder, and turning the tables on the Player vs GM roles. Typically, the GM throws challenges at the players to overcome, with some having a high risk of death. This is often seen as the GM trying to kill the Players1. One Player had the idea for a game where the Players are trying to die, and the GM has to keep them alive, and one of our group volunteered to GM it. Thus, our Lemmings2 campaign was born. Gestalt Pathfinder game, ALL 3.x/PF material3 allowed. Some homebrewed up rules regarding this campaign, PF Custom Races, and lots of black magic f---ery. The game hasn't even started and we broke the GM repeatedly with just our planning. But this thread isn't for the Zealous Lemmings...

On to the meat and potatoes of this thread. After all the f---ery is said and done, we decided that on the 21st iterative character we will play seriously. Before this was decided, the GM ruled that the bonuses from Fearless Zeal stack. This means, by the 21st character, we'll be playing Gestalt characters with a flexible +40 (in +2 increments) after point buy to their stats but due to the Fearless Zeal description it cannot be added to any stat that has a racial bonus to it already. Since we're using custom race rules, I have multiple custom races planned out for this game, all based on Nimbats4. The final character by the way will be restricted to 10 RP custom race design and 15 point buy (due to some house rules we have set up currently) plus the flexible +40 of course.

I was thinking for one half of the class setup I'd go with the 3.5 Warlock, possibly mixed with 3.5 Scout or PF Slayer. Any suggestions to combine with this or other ideas? Any unusual combinations of classes you think might make for a fun overpowered Gestalt game? Any races you might suggest if I decide I'm tired off Nimbat variations?5


1: I know that's not usually the case. And I agree the GM plays with the Players. This is a tropey/silly game so ignore that.
2: Referencing the video game not the documentary.
3: Material subject to approval, but it's generally allowed.
4: Nimbats are from Dust: An Elysian Tail and other pending Elysian Tail stuff. All custom races based on Nimbats will be Tiny and will probably have wings (though how they get them may be varied).
5: Special note, Racial HD aren't counted in level requirements but may count towards Caster Level with the right feats. Level Adjustments will still probably count though.

Tarmikos11
2015-03-11, 11:06 PM
GM sounding off, here. I'm not gunna put the Kaibosh on any builds here with rulings out of spite or anything like that. I just want to be appraised of what's going on with this.

Biffoniacus_Furiou
2015-03-12, 12:00 AM
1. X stat to Y bonus (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?125732-3-x-X-stat-to-Y-bonus)
2. Pick a stat to focus on, add that ability bonus to all of your rolls and game statistics as many times as possible.
2a. Example: This build (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?342828-Damnable-PC-s-need-a-Blackguard-built-that-ll-teach-them-a-lesson!#6) is ECL 20 non-gestalt, and adds its Cha bonus to its AC four times, to its saves twice, and to damage rolls once.
3. Have a way to apply Persistent Spell to your buffs every day without paying the normal metamagic cost.
4. ???
5. Profit.

DurionArcanis
2015-03-12, 12:24 AM
1. X stat to Y bonus (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?125732-3-x-X-stat-to-Y-bonus)
2. Pick a stat to focus on, add that ability bonus to all of your rolls and game statistics as many times as possible.
2a. Example: This build (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?342828-Damnable-PC-s-need-a-Blackguard-built-that-ll-teach-them-a-lesson!#6) is ECL 20 non-gestalt, and adds its Cha bonus to its AC four times, to its saves twice, and to damage rolls once.
3. Have a way to apply Persistent Spell to your buffs every day without paying the normal metamagic cost.
4. ???
5. Profit.

While the epic potential of that (particularly for Charisma lol) is there, I'm looking for something serious and heavy on theme. I haven't decided on the theme yet however, and I have plenty of time to figure it out (though I highly doubt 20 dead characters will happen quickly, it sure as hell won't be as slow as the normal life expectancy unless we're going by Tomb of Horrors standards lol).

One current idea is a Dex beast of a Clawlock//Scout, or maybe Clawlock and some martial class... I'd be interested to see some weird combos with 3.x and PF material in the same build as well.

Hmm maybe I can somehow make someone that alternates between dual-sickles, a scythe, and eldritch claws... because Death of Darksiders lol. That sounds a bit hard to balance without too much cheese though so I may use that idea as one of the 20 dead ones.

Biffoniacus_Furiou
2015-03-12, 09:40 AM
You could go with a Soulbow (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20060403a&page=2) with either Monk or (Unarmed) Swordsage and for gestalt maybe use Ardent for a Wis-SAD build. You can TWF with Mind Arrows, or a Thri-Kreen or similar can use Multiweapon Fighting with them, since it only takes a single hand to fire one. If you use Ardent be sure to get Substitute Powers (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20070629a).

For a Dex-based build, be sure to get Darkstalker and probably even the Dark Creature template (or the Collar of Umbral Metamorphosis). For this type of character I'd be inclined to use one of the classes that gets Shadow Pounce, and probably get Psychic Assassin (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20040723d) for Mind Cripple.

daremetoidareyo
2015-03-12, 02:04 PM
two weapon fighting shield fighter with a shield on each arm. ill post a write up in a few.

2WF Vow of poverty soulknife ninja elemental warrior




level

class

feat





1
soulknife

sacred vow, vow of poverty, nymphs kiss





2
soulknife

Favored of the companions





3
ninja

psionic weapon





4
soulknife

Intuitive attack(wis bonus to hit)





5
soulknife








6
ninja

Power attack





7
soulknife








8
samurai

exotic weapon pro(bastard sword)





9
samurai

aligned attack good, 2WF,





10
soulknife

Sanctified weapon





11
soulknife








12
elemental warrior








13
elemental warrior








14
soulknife








15
elemental warrior








16
elemental warrior








17
elemental warrior








18
soulknife








19
soulknife








20
soulknife

DurionArcanis
2015-03-12, 07:27 PM
For a Dex-based build, be sure to get Darkstalker and probably even the Dark Creature template (or the Collar of Umbral Metamorphosis). For this type of character I'd be inclined to use one of the classes that gets Shadow Pounce, and probably get Psychic Assassin (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20040723d) for Mind Cripple.

By the Gods... this build. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?147731-3-5-Shadowpounce-Pounce-Battle-Jump-Win)

As for that TWF build... though I like Vow of Poverty as a concept, in practice it isn't that great considering the game pretty much forces gear reliance.

ben-zayb
2015-03-12, 07:57 PM
Since you seem to want a "martial" type of character and Shadow Pounce + TWF is already suggested, I suggest taking it to its logical extreme by gestalting that with sorcerer. Ergo, the Shadow Mailman (use Dimension Hop/Slide or Stand in place of Orb of Force to make 20+ full attacks per extremely metamagicd Greater Arcane Fusion.

Biffoniacus_Furiou
2015-03-12, 08:23 PM
Since you seem to want a "martial" type of character and Shadow Pounce + TWF is already suggested, I suggest taking it to its logical extreme by gestalting that with sorcerer. Ergo, the Shadow Mailman (use Dimension Hop/Slide or Stand in place of Orb of Force to make 20+ full attacks per extremely metamagicd Greater Arcane Fusion.

Repeat Twinned Benign Transposition to swap yourself spots with your familiar, and use share spells with your familiar to make it swap your familiar spots with yourself. That's four teleports for four full attacks when you cast it, and then four more the next round plus another four if you cast that again. Max UMD so your familiar has as many ranks, and give it a Wand of Benign Transposition which it uses on you for one more full attack every round. Stack up on Easy Metamagic, Practical Metamagic, and Arcane Thesis to make your Benign Transposition take a lower spell slot, and note that Easy Metamagic is a metamagic feat itself and counts toward Arcane Thesis.

DurionArcanis
2015-03-12, 08:32 PM
While I'm loving this idea (so far the rapid attack setup is bloody amazing) I'm starting to wonder if it's getting a bit too cheesed up or overpowered.

Though taking ideas, tweaking them, and putting them into the game might just translate very differently.