Requesting help building Sorcerer Kings [and Queens]

[13ones]

What this means is pretty simple. I'm building some NPCs for a setting. The Sorcerer Kings are nine beings that are easily the most Dangerous things in the world. They are magic unrestrained. They are broken, over powered, and cheating. What they are mechanically are epic level characters with multiple classes that don't always synergies [for example the Boreal Queen is a Boreal Bloodline Sorcerer with max levels of Ranger, Fighter, and Arcane Archer] and no negative stats. They are designed not to be fair but to be unstoppable.

I could easily hand wave some of these things and just say "The Dragon King kicks in the door and incinerates you all" but I'd like to have stat blocks on hand to make it at least seem like my players have a chance. The thing is I have three of them being built; The White Queen[Boreal Bloodline], Rodgort the Might the Dragon King of the West[Draconic Bloodline, plus Admixture wizard, Blood rager, and Dragon disciple], and the Astral King [Arcane Bloodline plus Diviner Wizard, Arcanist, Loremaster and Mystic Theurge]. All three are utterly broken. The Astral King can apply any metamagic feats to his spells without impacting casting time or casting level, plus he adds his Cha and Int to AC, Touch, CMB, CMD, and he cannot ever be caught flat footed. He as two spell lists and as a standard he can switch out one to another pre-generated one. Like I said they are just cheating.

So what I'm looking for is more ideas for kings and queens to help me fill my world and scare my players into not trying kingmaker bull****.

[avr]

There's got to be an aquatic one to cover the 3/4 of the world which is underwater. A merfolk with the aquatic bloodline and extra levels in druid, probably. Ranger if you prefer the idea that she stabs people to death personally rather than using a horde of buffed awakened sea creatures.

Similarly someone for the underdark. Deep Earth is the obvious bloodline. Maybe he's also a necromancer (cleric, oracle or wizard) who earth glides up from below with shadows and earth elementals in tow.

The Lord of Deception might be a kitsune fey/rakshasa crossblooded sorcerer. Extra levels in whatever sneaky class you like. For minions, anyone he's tricked or dominated lately.

Perhaps there's one naming itself the Clockwork Prince, with the Impossible bloodline, vivisectionist alchemist levels and constructs armed with alchemy at its beck and call. People whisper tales of the terrible experiments it performs on those it captures.

[Vhaidara]

You don't want to do this. There's an old saying: If you stat it, they will kill it. There's a reason why the only thing that optimizers have yet to beat is the Lady of Pain:: She is unstatted. The only thing we know is that she is stronger than you. Yes, even then. Especially then.

Also, there isn't much difference between just saying "They murder you" and knowing exactly how when you're using dudes with 80+ class levels against what I assume are pre-epic characters

[pwykersotz]

If you're going to do this, I recommend a results-oriented approach. Magic can justify anything, and epic magic doubly so. Grab the stats of a Great Wyrm Prismatic Dragon, put it into human form, throw a few class names in to evoke archetype ideas, then give them some sort of loss condition, like Kryptonite. They won't die, they have far too many contingencies in place. But if someone manages to pierce their defenses, it's not worth sticking around when there are so many less annoying ways to achieve their goals.

It's far less bookwork than manually statting them all out, and it gives the end result you want of having a ready statblock to show what they have to overcome, not to win, but to avoid losing.

[Raven777]

I see the Pathfinder tag, so... Make them Mythic for good measure?

[The Glyphstone]

They are designed not to be fair but to be unstoppable.

I'd like to have stat blocks on hand to make it at least seem like my players have a chance.

These are mutually exclusive. The existence of a statblock doesn't imply a possibility, 'if it has stats they can kill it' aside, it's just lying to yourself/your players.

Just write down "1 hundred gazillion trillion" on a paper napkin, and use that for their hit points, attack bonus, weapon damage, and saving throws. If you're planning from the start to ignore the rules, you might as well save yourself the trouble and not bother to use them in the first place.


Also...talk to your players. Just tell them upfront "please don't try kingmaker bull****." This is a much simpler and easier solution than cheating to win a race where you are the only contestant.

[Jack_Simth]

Great Wyrm Dragons. Import the "Alternate Form" feat from Dragons of Eberron page 15 as needed. Any Lawful dragon (Blue, Green, Sky, Underworld, Bronze, Gold, Silver, Brine) would be the sort to try it. Really, though, with Pathfinder's version of Polymorph... you don't have to import the feat (the dragons keep most of their ability score bonuses... and pick up some nifty dex bonuses because of the size change). Sky, Bronze, Gold, and Silver would pick up 19th level Sorcerer casting natively as Great Wyrms. Amusingly, these are all LG dragons. Still, they wouldn't be overly averse to ruling a country. Then you add class levels and choice feats on top of the resulting 25-30 d12 hit dice and massive stat boosts.

So, the base would be, say:
Great Wyrm Sky Dragon
Colossal
28 Dragon hit dice (+28 BAB, base saves of +16 across the board so far)
Racial stat modifiers: +28 Str / -4 Dex / +16 Con / +16 Int / +16 Wis / +16 Cha
Comes with Change Shape, 19th level Sorcerer casting

Takes a level of Sorcerer to round out the casting to 20th. Meh. Take all 20 class levels of Sorcerer. This is supposed to be crazy, right? Leaves you with a caster level of 39.
Curse: Forsaken (3rd party - free Resurrections 1d6 hours later)
Takes 20 levels of Oracle for the divine spells and some class features. The Mystery: Occult (for the Final Revelation: Free Astral Projection defence, and if still killed, rise as a ghost)
Adds 10 levels of Arcane Archer (progressing Sorcerer, of course). Now at caster level 46 for Sorcerer spells, and can make the spells happen at the tip of an arrow.
Adds 10 levels of Duelist, mostly for the Int to AC.
Adds 20 levels of Monk. Mostly for the Wis to AC, but also to be silly.
Adds 10 levels of Mystic Theurge. Now casts as a Sorcerer-56/Oracle-30
Takes the Divine Protection feat (for Charisma to saves)
Shadowdancer-10 (Evasion)

Uses Blood Money to make Simulacrums to store of various useful people.
Uses Blood Money to cast Restoration to get rid of the strength damage.
Uses Blood Money to Wish up Inherent bonuses.
Uses Blood Money to cast Restoration to get rid of the strength damage.
Uses Blood Money to cast True Resurrection to get self back into the realm of the living as needed (posesses Simulacrums for this).

Basic tactics: Advanced Preparation:
Blood Money Permanency for a Genesis demiplane.
Get a couple of Simulacrums of high-strength casting-capable types for later. Also a few Solars and things for 'get out of jail cheap' cards (transport Travelers clause of Wish, Commune)
Astral Project from demiplane.
Do whatever.

If killed: Just an Astral Projection. Renew and try again.
If tracked down to the demiplane and killed there: Resurrects 1d6 hours later. Renew astral projection, carry on.
If tracked down to the demiplane and killed there twice in a week: Becomes a ghost. Posess a minion prepared earlier for the purpose, True Resussrect Self. Renew Astral Projection, carry on.

In combat: Act fairly suicidal, as it really doesn't matter. Why bother with equipment? It could just get lost.

[Raven777]

What is, exactly, "kingmaker bull****", anyway?

[JW86]

What kind of Level are we talking here?

How about a Half-Fiend Tiefling Wizard/Swiftblade Gish... perhaps supplement with Abjurant Champion and Warblade. Gear him to be super-fast, agile, death personified.

Kalashtar Psion with Telepathy ACF going into Thrallherd, near unpinnable, have to get through an entire nation of various thralls and underlings to get to.

How about a Black Slaad (Epic Level Handbook) Barbarian, he-who-rips-worlds-apart..

Dark Warforged Warlock/Hellfire Warlock/Legacy Champion/Uncanny Trickster for 37d6 Eldritch Blast. Make him invisible, take a level in Rogue and take Craven for 1d6+level Sneak Attack damage on top.... Literally some Robot Terminator...

How about some kind of insane wizard who summons Farspawn abominations..

[Necromancy]

Don't need to cheat to accomplish this

Make them a cabal of half demons and apply that template at full HD benefit to a regular ole half elf sorcerer. Level it to 20th, the make it mythic 10. Hell, give it a mythic cohort while you're at it

Toss in some unlimited wealth for Magic items galore

Now from here, pick 9 bloodlines/feat sets/spell books to really individualize them

At mythic 10, even if they managed to corner your sorcerer and somehow overcome his power without any escape, he will be back tomorrow