Help finishing a Gesalt Warlock//Ranger

[samduke]

Decided for archery ranger to mesh well with the melee & ranged attacks of the warlock.
Also looking for ideas on a non-humanoid no ECL race.
This is pretty much all decided just the other half of 12 levels that I am looking for suggestions..
Thanks

01:Warlock//Ranger
02:Warlock//Ranger
03:Warlock//Ranger
04:Warlock//Ranger
05:Warlock//Ranger
06:Warlock//Ranger
07:Warlock//Order of the Bow Initiate
08:Binder//Order of the Bow Initiate
09:Uncanny Trickster//
10:Hellfire Warlock//
11:Hellfire Warlock//
12:Hellfire Warlock//
13:Uncanny Trickster (Hellfiire)//
14:Uncanny Trickster (Hellfire)//
15:Legacy Champion //
16:Legacy Champion (Hellfire)//
17:Legacy Champion (Hellfire)//
18:Legacy Champion (Hellfire)//
19:Legacy Champion (Hellfire)//
20:Legacy Champion (Hellfire)//

[Troacctid]

Non-humanoid as in "eligible for Fangshields substitution levels"? How about Warforged or Warforged Scout? Great immunities, no need to eat or sleep, and they're just generally pretty cool. Good race for Warlocks. Another solid option would be Tibbit, from Dragon Compendium. Turn into an itty bitty kitty cat... that can still fire eldritch lasers of doom.

You should ditch Order of the Bow Initiate, it's bad and it doesn't synergize with Warlock. If you're looking for extra damage, go Swift Hunter instead. However, what I'd actually recommend is taking wild shape instead of a combat style (Rapid Shot doesn't work with Eldritch Blast anyway) and going into Master of Many Forms, which is super sweet.

[meemaas]

I second the swift hunter build for your other side. Build for a Glaivelock and use Eldritch chain for your ranged instead of archery.

Obviously take the one level cleric dip for travel devotion and you'll be golden to set off skirmish every round without fail.

Bonus points are awarded if you add on Sword of the Arcane Order for some extra power, but that's not necessary since you'll probably be pulling lots of damage as is.

[Troacctid]

The Binder, Uncanny Trickster, and Legacy Champion levels should also be on the Ranger side of the gestalt. There's no reason to lose caster levels. Caster levels are great.

[meemaas]

In this case though he's only losing caster levels for the level of binder and the first level of uncanny trickster, which while not perfect is still acceptable in practical optimization. Especially for the level of hellfire progression he's getting for it. In addition, most DMs would get antsy at using prestige classes to double advance a classes progression with gestalt.

[Troacctid]

There's no reason to lose caster levels here though. It's gestalt. You can take 2/3 casting prestige classes and still have full progression.

Obviously double progression isn't a thing, you don't take Warlock levels on the levels where you advance your casting.

[samduke]

one level cleric dip for travel devotion - would see a hit to EXP for not within 1 of the other base classes...
yes fangshield ranger and no to wildshape , Sword of the Arcane Order does not work in this case.
warforge race is an option & will look at Tibbit, from Dragon Compendium.

the warlock to hit dark only needs class abilities upto 16th which this is going to 17th with the hellfire levels
as for the swift hunter feat wise the build can make use of it, and certainly could put in 6-7 levels worth of scout for it.

and if it goes 6-7 of scout what would one put in for the other 5-6 levels?

[meemaas]

You've already got a one level dip of binder, so if you're using multiclassing penalties, that's what's gonna hurt you. But ignoring that one, you would probably ideally do four levels of scout, and then the rest into ranger if you can't get the cleric dip.

That said, you can also try the additional favored class feat in unearthed arcana if multiclassing rules are in effect.

[Troacctid]

If you want a Fangshields Swift Hunter while avoiding multiclass penalties, the only non-humanoid races with the appropriate favored class are Lupin (Dragon Compendium) and Neraph (Planar Handbook). They are both pretty lackluster, though. I would try and convince the DM to let me change the Warforged Scout favored class to Scout because, I mean, come on, it's right there in the name.

If multiclass penalties are in play, then the Binder dip has to go.

[samduke]

You've already got a one level dip of binder, so if you're using multiclassing penalties, that's what's gonna hurt you. But ignoring that one, you would probably ideally do four levels of scout, and then the rest into ranger if you can't get the cleric dip.

That said, you can also try the additional favored class feat in unearthed arcana if multiclassing rules are in effect.

already using the additional favored class feat in unearthed arcana - to get that binder class in...


If you want a Fangshields Swift Hunter while avoiding multiclass penalties, the only non-humanoid races with the appropriate favored class are Lupin (Dragon Compendium) and Neraph (Planar Handbook). They are both pretty lackluster, though. I would try and convince the DM to let me change the Warforged Scout favored class to Scout because, I mean, come on, it's right there in the name.

If multiclass penalties are in play, then the Binder dip has to go.

I will have a look at lupin and neraph - dm may allow warforge scout option..
which still leaves 5-7 levels of something pending removal of the Order of the Bow Initiate PRC

any sugestions?

[Troacctid]

I will have a look at lupin and neraph - dm may allow warforge scout option..
which still leaves 5-7 levels of something pending removal of the Order of the Bow Initiate PRC

any sugestions?

On a Swift Hunter, you usually just go straight Ranger/Scout. Usually with only 4 levels of Scout and the rest in Ranger, since Scout 4 is a natural break point. Also, you would want to not take the 5th level Fangshields Ranger substitution, as your Favored Enemies are very important to you--they allow your skirmish damage to bypass precision damage immunity.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Any time you consider a gestalt Warlock, you should consider taking ten levels of Warlock//Enlightened Spirit at your 6th-15th levels. Enlightened Spirit doesn't advance your Warlock Eldritch Blast, it gives a damage bonus to it that doesn't increase your caster level or provide any other benefits that advancing it as a class feature would do, so gestalt levels combining those classes will stack the increases to Eldritch Blast damage. Enlightened Spirit doesn't advance your Warlock invocations, it provides specific invocations as independent class features, again without increasing the caster level you use for all invocations, so gestalt levels combining those classes will get both the Warlock invocations and the Enlightened Spirit invocations. Furthermore, when you gain your 10th Warlock level you'll gain your 5th Enlightened Spirit level, Enlightened Spirit gives you a greater blast shape invocation, so at this level your Warlock invocation gained can be a greater invocation because that's what you now have access to. You'll have one fewer lesser invocation, but you didn't have to spend one on Fell Flight thanks to Celestial Flight so it's basically a net gain.

As for what other class levels you take with this, I would go with Wild Shape Mystic Ranger 5/ Enlightened Spirit 10/ Wild Shape Mystic Ranger 5// Warlock 20. Mystic Ranger is from Dragon 336 p105, it gets 0-level spells at 1st level, 1st level spells at its 2nd level, 2nd level spells at its 4th level, 3rd level spells at its 6th level, 4th level spells at its 8th level, and 5th level spells at its 10th level, plus a few other benefits, in exchange for losing the animal companion and delaying the combat styles and Track and Endurance to one level later, and putting the favored enemy class features at 2nd, 8th, 14th, and 20th. Wildshape Ranger (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#ranger) trades out the combat styles for Wild Shape as a Druid, but only improves the number of uses/day, not the sizes or types of forms you can take.

This way you get 0th-2nd level Ranger spells and Wild Shape 1/day before entering Enlightened Spirit, and at 20th you've got 5th level Ranger spells and Wild Shape 4/day for 10 hours at a time with better-than-full Warlock abilities. On top of that you can pick up Sword of the Arcane Order to be able to prepare and cast Wizard spells with your Ranger spell slots; a Frostblood Half-Orc in Dragon Magic can actually get Sword of the Arcane Order for free at 4th level, due to the wording of their Endurance racial bonus feat and Mystic Ranger delaying the Endurance feat class feature to 4th level. Make it a Frostblood Desert Half-Orc (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/races/environmentalRacialVariants.htm#desertHalfOrcs) (tundras are technically deserts) for more favorable ability scores. Use the Half-Humans and Humanlike Races variant in Races of Destiny p150 and you can take the Magical Training regional feat for a spellbook that you can add more spells to (per Rules Compendium), so you have a reliable source to prepare spells from with Sword of the Arcane Order. So you end up getting 0th-5th level spell slots that you can prepare Ranger and Wizard spells in, along with 1.5x full Warlock progression.

[Troacctid]

the warlock to hit dark only needs class abilities upto 16th which this is going to 17th with the hellfire levels

Also, about this, while it's technically true that you could miss a couple extra Warlock levels, you actually really want to hit Dark invocations by 18th level, not 20th level, so that you can get an extra Greater invocation from the Extra Invocation feat. Plus, getting them sooner is still a really big deal, since by 20th level the campaign is going to be over and you'll never actually end up getting to use your Dark invocations. And if you don't get a Dark invocation until 20th, it means you are locked in at only one of them ever.

[samduke]

Warforged Scout
WARFORGED RACIAL TRAITS Construct (Living Construct Subtype)
will take if allowed

Neraph (Planar Handbook)
NERAPH RACIAL TRAITS Outsider (extraplanar subtype)
this works

TIBBIT RACIAL TRAITS Monstrous Humanoid (shapeshifter) -out its humanoid
LUPIN RACIAL TRAITS Monstrous Humanoid - out its humanoid

7 levels of scout also is a decent break point
the build is not wild shaping or using spells so no to the mystic ranger.

as for Enlightened Spirit I could see maybe 2 levels over the 2 levels of Order of the Bow Initiate PRC

[Troacctid]

Monstrous Humanoid is different from Humanoid.

[samduke]

Fangshields requirements (CoV p80) good alignment, nonhumanoid while I know that Humanoids are similar in form to monstrous humanoids, but are treated as a different type of creature.. its the word humanoid that could cause issue.

given that - TIBBIT still does not work due to being small
warforged +2con -2wis -2cha
lupin no stat modification
Neraphim no stat modification
*Edit

decided on Neraph with Half-Nymph template ( going to use level buyback for the 2 adjust) - and the build below any thoughts?
CG
01:Warlock//Ranger
02:Warlock//Ranger
03:Warlock//Ranger
04:Warlock//Ranger
05:Warlock//Ranger
06:Warlock//Ranger
07:Warlock//Scout
08:Binder//Scout
09:Scout//Uncanny Trickster
10:Scout//Hellfire Warlock
11:Scout//Hellfire Warlock
12:Scout//Hellfire Warlock
13:Scout//Uncanny Trickster (Hellfire)
14:Scout//Uncanny Trickster (Hellfire)
15:Scout//Legacy Champion
16:ranger //Legacy Champion (Hellfire)
17:ranger //Legacy Champion (Hellfire)
18:ranger //Legacy Champion (Hellfire)
19:warlock //Legacy Champion (Hellfire)
20:warlock //Legacy Champion (Hellfire)

I am only listing this Invocation
ELDRITCH GLAIVE (Dragon Magic p82) Least; 2nd; Blast Shape

Feats
ff:Point Blank Shot
ff:Additional Favored Class (Binder)
cf:mortalbane
03:Weapon Focus (rays)
06:Ability Focus (Eldritch Blast)
09:Least Legacy
12:Empower SLA-EB
15:Maximize SLA-EB
18:Extra Invocation
Class Bonus Feats:
RBF:Two-Weapon Fighting
RBF:Endurance
RBF:Improved Two-Weapon Fighting
RBF:Eyes in the Back of Your Head
SBF:swifthunter
SBF:Precise Shot
BBF:Armor Proficiency (medium)
LBF:Lesser Legacy

Items
Warlock's Scepter
Greater Chasuble of fell power
Gloves of Eldritch Admixture