bjoern
2015-03-22, 01:08 PM
If I attempt to bullrush a guy, I provoke and he gets a chance to hit me before he is bowled over.
Once he is bullrushed, and I'm pushing him across the battlefield, we both provoke from people that we move past. But incur no more AoO from each other due to moving.
Improved bullrush eliminates the AoO the he gets on me when I make the attempt. The AoOs that we provoke from other people as we move across the battlefield remain present and unchanged.
Knock back says:
As seen in the Races of Stone book, Page 142.
Flavor:By putting your bulk behind a blow, you can push your enemy backward.
Benefit (shortened version): If you score a hit while you are using the Power Attack feat, you can make a free bull rush attempt against the foe you hit. Unlike standard bull rush attempts, knockback attempts don’t provoke attacks of opportunity, and you don’t move with the enemy you knock backward.
A few key words here. One is Standard. To me that means not using the improved bullrush feat. So a standard bullrush attempt would provoke as soon as I attempt it.
Second keyword is attempt. A bullrush attempt is the part leading up to the opposed strength checks (the AoO, the opposed checks, etc) the act of me pushing him across the battle field is no longer a bullrush attempt, its a bullrush result.
So my question is:
The part in knock back where it says, a knock back attempt doesn't provoke AoO like a standard bullrush attempt refer to the AoO from the initiation of an untrained bullrush attempt, or does it also include the AoOs provoked from other combabtants as the enemy is sent flying backwards away from me?
We tentatively ruled that it works like Improved bullrush and the AoO that is eliminated is the one that is caused by the initiation and that the other ones remain.
Once he is bullrushed, and I'm pushing him across the battlefield, we both provoke from people that we move past. But incur no more AoO from each other due to moving.
Improved bullrush eliminates the AoO the he gets on me when I make the attempt. The AoOs that we provoke from other people as we move across the battlefield remain present and unchanged.
Knock back says:
As seen in the Races of Stone book, Page 142.
Flavor:By putting your bulk behind a blow, you can push your enemy backward.
Benefit (shortened version): If you score a hit while you are using the Power Attack feat, you can make a free bull rush attempt against the foe you hit. Unlike standard bull rush attempts, knockback attempts don’t provoke attacks of opportunity, and you don’t move with the enemy you knock backward.
A few key words here. One is Standard. To me that means not using the improved bullrush feat. So a standard bullrush attempt would provoke as soon as I attempt it.
Second keyword is attempt. A bullrush attempt is the part leading up to the opposed strength checks (the AoO, the opposed checks, etc) the act of me pushing him across the battle field is no longer a bullrush attempt, its a bullrush result.
So my question is:
The part in knock back where it says, a knock back attempt doesn't provoke AoO like a standard bullrush attempt refer to the AoO from the initiation of an untrained bullrush attempt, or does it also include the AoOs provoked from other combabtants as the enemy is sent flying backwards away from me?
We tentatively ruled that it works like Improved bullrush and the AoO that is eliminated is the one that is caused by the initiation and that the other ones remain.